ToffeeWeb - Season 2008-09

The Mail Bag

Mr Alan Wiley

It seems as though this referee has had a vendetta against Everton FC for 8 or so years because our then manager, Walter Smith, made an official complaint against him after Mr Wiley singled out Duncan Ferguson to his assistant when Everton played Arsenal at Highbury. He allegedly told his assisant to ?watch out for this player, he can be dirty so watch out for him?. Also he and his assistant disallowed, what turned out to be a perfectly good Andy Johnson Everton goal against Blackburn last season and declined to explain his decision to the media afterwards.

Today, against Stoke City, he gave a free kick when replays showed Everton should have had a penalty ? and he booked Mikel Arteta for standing on the touchline during a Stoke City throw in, even though that in the official rule book it is not an offence to do such a thing.

I really hope that referees don?t hold ?vendettas? but after some of Mr Wiley?s refereeing performances at Everton games since the Duncan Ferguson incident, unfortunately (really unfortunately) I have begun to wonder just what on earth this man is playing at. Or am I just being paranoid???
Adam Bennett, Liverpool Posted 14/09/2008 at 18:53:36

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Tony Marsh
1 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:32:43

Yep the rotten sod Willey even dis-allowed a perfectly good goal scored by Fuller which would of made it 2-2 when he was the only man in the ground who saw a push on Yobo. I think Willey is a crap Ref but come on, he let us off the hook with that fuck up so all square today I think.

Danny Lizars
2 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:38:06

Yeah it maybe all square but this sort of thing shouldnt happen. For Wiley to point to the spot and then decide to change his mind after speaking to the linesman and awarding a free kick outside the area is a joke! Good on Davy Moyes for protesting and his commments after the game. I think the refs should start admitting after the match that they have fucked up and made the wrong decision but hey that's never gona happen. If Moyes does go up in front of those muppets at the FA I hope they do see sense and not give him a ban or fine

Ian Edwards
3 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:38:32

I think it was a foul. Yobo had his ankle tapped.

Wiley is from Staffordshire which is where Stoke are. Hackett should explain how Wiley was allowed to ref. Also, Halsey is from Greater Manchester and refffed City yesterday and gave Chelsea nothing.

The game clearly isnt straight. I remember when Liverpool played Chelsea in the League Cup Final and the 4th official complained about Mourinho hushing the fans and had him sent off. The 4th official was a Liverpool fan.

Brian Waring
4 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:40:57

Adam, the ref actually pointed to the spot for a pen. It was only after being called over by the linesman, that he changed his mind. Maybe, because the linesman was in a better position to see it, he then changed his mind. If anyone was to blame, it was the linesman. Also, it evened out, because as Tony said, Fullers goal should have stood, because after seeing several replays of it, he doesn’t trip or push Yobo, Yobo actually stumbles. Also agree though, that he is a shite ref.

Ray Robinson
5 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:45:29

Ian, the fact that Wiley is from Staffordshire doesn’t necessarily make him a Stoke supporter! All referees have to declare their allegiances and are prevented from officiating in games affecting those teams - at least that is my understanding.

I think that Wiley has moments of incompetence but I wouldn’t have him down as an anti-Blue. I know I was at the opposite end when Yobo looked to be tripped by a Stoke player, but if he’d wanted us to lose, he could have awarded the goal!

Neil Truby
6 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:47:34

The ref got it wrong. He was in the better position to see if the offence was in the area but allowed himself to be talked out of his original decision by the linesman, who couldn’t really judge as he was square-on.

BUT:
a. Moyes should be experienced enough take it on the chin and more importantly ..
b. WTF can the 4th official do about the decision, right or wrong? So what’s the point of unloading on him and getting sent to the stand. Imbecillic!

Tony Williams
7 Posted 14/09/2008 at 19:53:40

The ref got the Fuller foul spot on, watch the replays carefully, Fuller puts his foot forward towards the ball and clibs Yobo?s right ankle which is pushed onto his left foot and causes him to go over, straight forward foul, goal disallowed but there is no possible reason why he gave a free kick, the lino was in a worse position than the ref to see exactly where the Stoke player was. I thought Wiley was going over to see if there was a foul on the player.

I mean for even Andy Gray to admit it was a pen is something in itself.

He cheated us at Blackburn last year with the legitimate goal and the, as Hansen said, assault on Johnson when he was booted up in the air by Oojer.

He should not be allowed to ref our games anymore and I bet nothing at all gets said to him by the FA but they will probably fine Moyes.

Bunch of arse.

Tony Williams
8 Posted 14/09/2008 at 20:25:47

Nah Paul, he doesn’t support the redshite but he doesn’t support Moyes either.

He is stuck in the 80’s and lost whatever credibility he had when he said last week that he would prefer a relegation battle to what we are doing now.

John Martin
9 Posted 14/09/2008 at 20:30:11

There was contact by Fuller on Yobo, therefore its a foul. If that had been the other way around Yobo would have been sent off for stopping a goalscoring chance. Wiley is a terrible ref when he ref’s us as the evidence shows. Watch him get the Man utd v Chelsea game next week

Karl Jones
10 Posted 14/09/2008 at 20:27:51

He also misses a push on Jagielka for their second goal (he was standing right next to it and had just warned the player involved who was constantly blocking Howard at throw-ins)..Watch out for a completely different refereeing approach when they play one of the Sky four.

Notice how he waited until the Stoke corner was cleared, even though it was well after the allotted five minutes injury time. The guy is just a typical egotist ref in a long line of them. They’re all as bad as each other.

Tony Williams
11 Posted 14/09/2008 at 20:44:34

Karl, that is the one thing that pisses me off so much about refs these days, they have to wait for something to happen, either for a shot/goal or for the other team to clear before they blow up (let’s not get into Clive Thomas territory here)

The time was up, just like Man Citteh two seasons ago when the scored in the 95th minute, why play on when time is up, yes it’s all good saying they want to let the move finish/break down, why? the alloted time is over blow the whistle whether a team is attacking or hoofing the ball away from goal.

Dave Ush
12 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:00:42

Fuller’s goal was an obvious foul but the ref had a pretty poor game. Incidently Tom G don’t have a go at Tony Marsh he’s just gutted we won so he has to find something else to moan about this week. I’m suprised he hasn’t blamed DM and BK for conceeding the throw in’s that led to Stokes goals.

Karl also dead on when they play the RS next week watch as every time a ball is launched into the box the whistle goes for a ’foul on the keeper.

Karl Jones
13 Posted 14/09/2008 at 20:59:08

Todays refs who as soon as you see their name, you know you?re in for a controversial game..In order of trepidation!...

1 Mark Clattenberg
2 Mike Riley
3 Alan Wiley
4 Rob Styles
5 Mark Halsey
6 Uriah Rennie

The sad fact is the rest of them are not much better! Maybe European refs are the answer.

Tony Williams
14 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:16:07

Uriah Rennie, or as I call him, Tablet, was actually quite good for us. Our win rate when he reffed our games was quite high. terrible attention seeking ref but he seemed to be lucky for us.

Karl Jones
15 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:19:24

Tony, Substitute Steve Bennett for Uriah Rennie then ? I forgot about him!

Steve Sweeney
16 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:22:14

It was definately a penalty, but why is it that when we concede a free kick around the box that the ref marches our wall back 10 yards, I don?t see the refs doing this for any other club. Are the FA afraid that Everton are the best bet to break up the Sky 4 and so have instructed the officials to make sure we don?t get anything?

Last season we never got a penalty untill the last game and we could not go above the shite, also the games vs Shite and Blackburn plus other dodgy decisions against Chelsea and Arsenal.

The whole PL stinks.

Mark Griffiths
17 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:28:30

Can?t go the game againsgt SL, are we on tv???

Tony Williams
18 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:30:23

Channel 5 Mark

Mark Griffiths
19 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:37:00

Cheers Tony, ahh, back to Nevin and Ratters.

Tony Marsh
20 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:43:32

Dave Ush why are there so many little girls like you supporting Everton these days? Can't you have a serious debate about football without acting like a Tart? I mean let's face i,t WHY would I want us to lose you? Are you that simple?

I call it like I see it and today I think the ref was absolute Shite but he did bail us out at a very tricky period of the game. It was never a foul on Yobo and those claiming it was are the same lot who where screaming at the Hibbert - Gerrard incident in last season's Derby game.

Fuller scored a cracker today and it was chalked off by Wiley. End of.

Tony Williams
21 Posted 14/09/2008 at 21:57:21

Not "End of" Tony at all, I would suggest you watch Match of The Day 2, if they show it and you will see Fuller?s leg come across and knock Yobo's right leg into his left.... ergo a foul. He didn?t bail us out, he simply did his job correctly for once.

And I would rather have these "girls" supporting us than a person who wants us to be fighting relegation so it is more "exciting".

Andrew Bulmer
22 Posted 14/09/2008 at 22:01:12

Well done, Blues. Best team won the game despite penalty, five minutes extra time and Stoke free kick festival after we went 2-0 up. Shame some of our own "fans" haven?t the good grace to acknowledge the better team won, as the other Tony, the opposition manager was able to describe.

Dave Ush
23 Posted 14/09/2008 at 23:12:30

Tony Marsh, I don?t doubt that you call things as you see them but why always see the negative when you could just support the team rather than bitching constantly about anything and everything you can.

Incidentally it was hardly a cracker by any stretch of the imagination or is any goal against a cracker when it gives you a little ammo to moan?

David Barks
24 Posted 15/09/2008 at 00:16:29

Tony Marsh, you need to watch the replay on the TV before you come on here saying what a brilliant goal it was. It was a clear kick on Yobo?s ankle that caused him to go down, the replays clearly showed it and Wiley got that one 100% correct. It was a clear foul that would have been given no matter where it had occurred on the pitch. For God?s sake just admit what is clear to see on the replays.

Tommy Davis
25 Posted 15/09/2008 at 04:18:01

Reflecting on Alan Wiley’s performance last season at the Blackburn (away) game, didn’t he also choose not to give David Dunn another yellow card for deliberate hand ball in the first half, just moments after he (Dunn) scythed down one of our lads (McFadden maybe?) and then waived away several Everton players who appeared to question his none call.

I think it was the same refs assistant who disallowed AJ’s ’goal’ at Blackburn(Turner?) who called the ref over for the pen to be a freekick today, was it not?

Yobo certainly was fouled by Fuller today, leading up to the disallowed goal, albeit rather innocuous looking.

Re: Tony Marsh: If you look at most of Steven Gerrard’s penalty claims, as in last seasons Derby match at Goodison with Hibbert for instance, he has become very astute at pushing his leg in front of the opponent, just as the tackle is imminent, then sprawling headlong whilst turning around looking for the refs call, it is an art for sure. Not better than making a yellow card change to a red one though, eh Stevie G The Magician?

Good win today boys, methinks Stoke will undo several teams at home this season!

Paul Gladwell
26 Posted 15/09/2008 at 06:48:42

Sorry Tony your wording in this thread and another thread comes across like you were gutted yesterday, I have been a big critic these past few months but even I took some great comfort yesterday, not many teams would of withstood that type of football we witnessed yesterday, it was like being at Plough Lane in the 80s again but with a wild hillbilly crowd on top, we where the best in Europe then and still struggled and got turned over a few times,

We could not have picked a worse time to play the promoted teams away from home and we have won 2 out of 2 so far where teams like Villa and West ham have failed big time, a bit of credit when due would gain yourself some too, instead of trying to be controversial all the time.

Michael Brien
27 Posted 15/09/2008 at 07:53:52

The Referee?s performance at yesterday?s game was very poor. I lost count of the number of times he gave free kicks against us for what were good challenges ? at one point during the first half I thought that every time one of our guys was going in for and winning a 50-50 ball they would get penalised.

As well as the penalty incident ? which was clearly inside the area, the Referee totally ignored Lawrence?s kick at Anichebe, his actions were no different to those of Guthrie who kicked out at the Hull City player at St James? Park on Saturday. Lawrence couldn?t get to the ball and had a kick at Anichebe.

Victor is a not the kind of bloke to moan at the slightest thing, he seems to accept that the defenders will give him a hard time and he is well up for the typical physical battle from the opposing defenders. So for him to complain it says a lot - I saw the incident when it was replayed and Lawrence clearly kicks him - result no booking or even a word from the Ref to Lawrence.

The booking of Arteta was an absolute joke.Oh and Tony Marsh I think that the Referee didn?t bail us out re the Fuller incident. Watching the replay again you will clearly see that he blew the whistle for a foul on Yobo straight away as clearly he was bundled over.

I would be interested to see if Stoke will try the same tactics on their travels ?

Alex Burrell
28 Posted 15/09/2008 at 09:19:37

You mentioned Arteta getting a yellow card for standing "on the touchline" during a Stoke City throw in.

The laws of the game say that all opposing players must be 2m or more from the throw in. If Arteta wasn’t that (I didn’t see it), then, unfortunately, he deserved a yellow. Players should know better.

What’s also amusing is that for Stoke’s first goal, Howard should have just let it go into the net. Since it was from a throw, and no one else had touched it, it wouldn’t have counted. Instead, he tried to "save" something he didn’t need to.

Anthony Millington
29 Posted 15/09/2008 at 10:00:58

The thing is though he blew for a foul on Yobo immediately and Fuller played on regardless and didn?t actually put the ball into the net until about 20 seconds later, so they can?t complain. If he would have stopped when the referre blew his whistle no-one would be talking about it. There was definetly some contact on Yobo which ended up in him falling to the ground and although on that incident Stoke were unlucky it was a fair decision, unlike the referee changing his mind down the other end.

After the equaliser (a push on Jagielka) the referee and his assistants started to give everything to Stoke, when on at least a couple of occasions Everton players were the ones being fouled themselves.

What a horrible team Stoke are by the way, they have crappy Bolton-like tactics to try and win a throw-in, they kick the opposition e.g. those disgraceful swipes at Anichebe, where two Stoke players knew they couldn?t catch him, so one took a swipe at him and missed and then the other took him out and that defender who handballed it dived to the ground and could have conned the referee on another day not to give the handball and instead a free kick the other way.

Well done to the boys, they didn?t dwell on that poor decision by the referee and came back to win it. Great credit to the new boys who can?t even speak English but started together in centre mid in a difficult encounter.

Aodhan O'Faolain
30 Posted 15/09/2008 at 10:19:43

While yesterday's non-penalty was an awful decision, nothing beats Clattenburg. Hope the investigation into his company?s dealing are fully published by the ref?s association.

As for criminal ref calls, who remembers a certain bald italian git away to Villarreal? Still can?t figure that one out, and on the night in question Collina gave us nothing.

And to think when he packed it in he was called the best ref in the world.

Tony Burke
31 Posted 15/09/2008 at 11:20:45

Err... can?t see what all the fuss is about. We?ve had our penalty this season. Get over it.

Patty Beesley
32 Posted 15/09/2008 at 12:11:47

Can they do that to us again ...one penalty for the season!!! Well if that?s it then the blow is that the Yak missed it!! Wish he would let Arteta take them - was even tusselling for the ball off Mickey yesterday when we thought we had been given the one that was withdrawn. Guess Wiley must have suddenly realised we are only allowed one per season and that?s why he changed his mind!!

Denis Byrne
33 Posted 15/09/2008 at 12:18:22

Wiley's perfomance was appalling, and both teams suffered, with the prat being jeered by both sets of supporters at the end, which speaks volumes. Wouldn?t be surprised if he was demoted or doesn?t get a game next week.

I was going apopleptic by his decisions at the time but I could swear he pulled out the red card for Arteta (when cautioned for standing on the line - someone says a rule change indicates they have to be 2 yards away from the line now) but quickly recognised the error and told him it was a yellow? Anyone else spot this or was my daughters concen that my head was about to explode, justified?

Danny Broderick
34 Posted 15/09/2008 at 14:33:43

More Evertonian paranoia! He made a bad decision for the penalty, but Yobo got out of jail when he disallowed their goal. It didn’t cost us anything cos we won the game, so get over it...

Tony Williams
35 Posted 15/09/2008 at 17:33:03

Danny try reading the thread and the numerous times the foul has been discussed before posting mate. There was a foul so Joey did not get "out of jail" at all, it was a foul.

It’s not rocket science.

Keith Glazzard
36 Posted 15/09/2008 at 18:22:10

Why were five minutes added on to the second half?

Tony Williams
37 Posted 15/09/2008 at 21:42:23

Keith, I would assume the majority of the 5 mins came from the subs being made and the conflab with the lino to refuse us yet another stonewall penalty. Took some time to devise their evil plan...

Dominic Pitt
38 Posted 15/09/2008 at 15:43:09

How is it that a buffoon can be allowed to referee a game in the top eschelon and he only lives say ten miles away from the home team's ground? I may be wrong but Burntwood looks pretty close enough to Stoke on Google.