ToffeeWeb - Season 2009-10

The Mail Bag

The Man's Club

Everton are dropping their People's Club tag line and have already reverted to 'Nil Satis Nisi Optimum' after, I quote, Robert Elstone: “We did market research with fans and this was something that came up'.

Where? Anfield?? Kirkby??? Or perhaps it really is just sour grapes after losing a court case to 'lifelong fan' Brian Gould, over who used the slogan first. Brian states that he doesn't wish for EFC not to be able to use the term, but is simply implementing his right... I wonder though if the club in turn will start making life harder for those who wish to sell anything that has any bearing to Everton?

Personally I hope they do sort it out and keep the strap line. What think you, People?
Chad Schofield, Stroud, Glos Posted 01/08/2009 at 01:53:54

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Tony Williams
1 Posted 01/08/2009 at 18:40:25

I think we have outgrown the "Peoples Club" tag, it was ok at the start but got a little embarrassing near the end.

What makes me laugh is that you have some fella flogging Everton gear, which I doubt he has a licence to do, on the market suggesting that he was first in.

Surely as Moyes coined the phrase that he should have some royalties to it?

He is a "life long fan" who is after a big payout but it’s back fired as Everton has simply dropped it. Next you will get someone trying to copyright Nil Satis Nisi Optimum, if it already has not been done.

The fella stated that he wanted nothing detrimental to come of this but he is obviously looking for a few bob from Everton.

A little lesson, Loss of money = Detriment, it’s not rocket science.

Tony Williams
2 Posted 01/08/2009 at 18:45:30

Also, why has it taken him 7 years to bring this to the club's attention?

As Lord Glentoran did when he described the "London 2012" committee bid to restrict the use of certain phrases as a "draconian constraint" and this pressure made the Government change sections of the London Olympic Games and Paralympic Games Act 2006, so the same reasoning should apply here.

Tony Williams
3 Posted 01/08/2009 at 18:55:33

One more thing, we did not lose a court case, the geezer just sent a solicitor’s leter to Everton confirming he had the rights and that’s when Elistone said the club were going to move away from the phrase.

They mention research but I have yet to meet a Blue who was questioned on this matter; however I for one am glad we are not using it anymore.

Brian Waring
4 Posted 01/08/2009 at 19:12:39

It was okay for a bit, just to wind the redshite up, but as you mention Tony, it got so embarrassing.

Mark Jardell
5 Posted 01/08/2009 at 19:18:57

On a plus side, some billionaire investor might show some interest in us now that we don’t sound like some kind of bunch of communists!

John Martin
6 Posted 01/08/2009 at 19:48:51

I am delighted we are not going to be using it anymore if only to stop a sneaky little market trader who who thought he’d pulled a fast one on our club.

Andy Morden
7 Posted 01/08/2009 at 20:38:48

Haha, well it certainly isn’t the people’s slogan if it is being contested for the rights to use it!

Um, perhaps the club have just let it ride, it would be unseemly to scrap with one of the people over the people’s slogan!

More like they want sole revenue from any trademarks they utilise. If we used the "People’s Club" phrase then they would have to share the proceeds with one of the people. Shocking!

Keith Glazzard
8 Posted 01/08/2009 at 20:47:20

Let it go. It's part of history — ours. No other club will ever use it.

Nil Satis Nisi Optimum — timeless. Touch of class. We need more, not less. Let the barrow boy have it.

Gavin Ramejkis
9 Posted 01/08/2009 at 22:26:42

Tony W — unlike you to make "assumptions" without the full facts. How long do you know this has been ongoing? What if the guy wanted to make a few bob or not? As an example do you realise how long the World Wide Fund for Nature formerly the World Wildlife Fund fought against the WWF wrestling organisation to prove that it had the rights to the tag WWF? Not exactly headline news and most people unaware but that went on for a long time.

From my own perspective, the way the club is run at the moment makes the tag laughable now either way.

Dave Ryan
10 Posted 01/08/2009 at 22:54:32

I've never posted on here before but this is crazy — we are being held to ransom by 1. someone that makes money from EFC & 2. A FAN! Surely if he was a real fan, this would not be an issue...

Tony Williams
11 Posted 02/08/2009 at 00:03:16

Gavin, "Mr Gould claims he first sold flags bearing the motif at the Scottish manager’s first away game at Derby. The trader, also treasurer of campaign group Keep Everton In Our City, now wants Everton to sit down and discuss terms over his rights"

Therefore it goes back seven years and that second sentence is another way of saying, "How much will you pay me for having "The People’s Club" on your merchandise"

Tony Williams
12 Posted 02/08/2009 at 00:17:58

Sorry Gavin, misinterpreted your question. I don’t know how long it was going on but he got the legal nod last year: "Brian Gould, 58, a market stall trader from Walton and lifelong Everton fan, was granted the rights to the phrase last year to sell his scarves and hats" but only decided to send a letter this year. "Mr Gould’s barrister Francis McEntegart, of Chime Legal Services, wrote to Blues management in May informing them of his client’s rights".

Why? He is simply after a payout from Everton after having a clever/sneaky idea. I think the first time "The People’s Club" was used was by Shankly. I wish the club had never latched onto it so hard and am glad they are "moving away" from it now.

Christine Foster
13 Posted 02/08/2009 at 00:23:24

In truth, we lost the credibility of the tag line for the "People's Club" some two years ago when it was clearly evident that the marketing spin was just that, spin.

Not saying it didn’t work — it did, brilliantly!

However, it gave the impression that it was a club for the people, but not by the people. They (the club) themselves tarnished that tag line with their subsequent actions which can only be seen as not acting in the best interests of shareholders and fans alike. Gagging and ridiculing fans and shareholders hardly befits the People's Club any more.

But as my boss said to me the other day "This is not a fucking democracy.." EFC saw an opportunity to capitalise on the "People's Club" image and marketed it to the hilt. It brought the fans together and united them with a strong sense of family. Stupidly they forgot to mention to the fans that's all it was. Spin.

Fans needed something to unite them and bond them after difficult years and in many ways The Peoples Club did that.

The fact that the hype nor the truth ever lived up to the responsibility perceived or not, of such a slogan seems lost on the club and has become an embarrassment of kinds as it's been used to sharply point out the lack of People being considered in the People's Club.

The Mr Elstone / Mr Ross has already (so readily?) decided to drop the slogan in favour of the our traditional latin one. IF the club had actually become more of a sounding board for the fans and supporters and used an inclusive style of management, then the tag line would have been better served and possibly utilised for years to come. Instead it was just a tool, a means of getting use to walk down the garden path, to Kirkby and beyond.

There is almost an unhealthy haste in letting it go so quickly and without a fight or even an attempted negotiation. I guess it really shows what it means to the people who run the club. Not much. If anything.

It's ironic that a market stall holder, an opportunist at best, has outplayed the club on this one. He is welcome to the banner. I just hope he hasn’t ordered too far ahead.

Keith Glazzard
14 Posted 02/08/2009 at 00:44:31

Tony -

being an out of towner, this is the first time I’ve heard of this. You say "Mr Gould ... also treasurer of campaign group Keep Everton In Our City, now wants Everton to sit down and discuss terms over his rights".

Is he really a KEIOC committee member?

Mercenaries?

Paul Walsh
15 Posted 02/08/2009 at 03:19:55

t was a soundbite that galvanised us and endeared us to Moyes from the start. Many a disillusioned and weary Evertonian were stirred by reading it or hearing it at the time. I think it has run its course as a promotional strap-line. Let it go. It’s not really appropriate for the club to be promoting themselves as such when patently we’re not.

I’m failing to see how the club motto NSN0 should be mentioned here at all. However I think they Elstone et al. would do well not to push NSNO right now. This mob haven’t a hell’s chance of backing that up right now.

Two consecutive fifth place finishes. Still no adequate funding to improve the side. Moyes has left them behind and probably the rest of us once this season is over. Cheers Bill you’re doing your best though aren’t you? zzzzzz!

Matt Traynor
16 Posted 02/08/2009 at 04:10:25

The market research was a ballot of some fans. Some got 3 votes, some none at all.

Anyway, of those that voted, 59% were in favour of the switch, as the new branding will be iconic, and virtually free. Watch this space.

Joking aside, it was becoming a joke, and as Christine says, recent events with the Club’s relationship with some sections of fans suggests it had had its day.

Read it in the Echo on-line, and there’s no way this market trader wasn’t going to try to make money out of the club for licensing. And as others have suggested, surely the Everton name and crest is trademarked? Get the Copyright Cops down to his stall I think...

(I hope they’ve trademarked our name and crest, I mean, they couldn’t, could they??)

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