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Diamond Formation

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I would just maybe like to add another insight into the various discussions on Toffeeweb, whether it is 4-4-2, 4-4-1-1, 4-3-3 formation, etc.

It is clear that the middle of the park is the strongest area of the team. Our wings look very weak at the moment and people like Pienaar and Bilyaletdinov are more natural central attacking midfield players playing on the wing.

I would like to see Everton play a 4-1-2-1-2 or a diamond formation, just as Chelsea did at the start of last season. In my opinion, it would work because of the amount of good midfielders we have.

Defensive Mid: Heitinga or Fellaini could easily play here, maybe Rodwell or Neville if we're desperate.

Two Central Mids: A number of players could play here: My first choice would be Arteta and Rodwell, but we still have Fellaini, Bily, Pienaar and Osman just to name a few.

Attacking Mid: My favourite would be Pienaar, but again Cahill or Bily could play there.

This formation would then sort out people's persistence to play two strikers: Saha and Beckford, I can see this pair perhaps working quite well together, with Yakubu and Gueye as back up. Yes ideally, I would rather see another top class forward but we do not have the luxury.

The only problem is the lack of width, which the full backs would be trying to provide. But we do not have a good right back to do this. Baines is sorted on the left. Coleman is great going forward and would potentially fill in this position but isn't good enough defensively. Neville and Hibbert might, but probably would not work.

Even so, this would be the only problem. I can see Everton having more success than not with this formation.
Ben Jones, Anglesey     Posted 25/08/2010 at 10:39:59

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Dennis Stevens
1   Posted 25/08/2010 at 14:11:30

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Interesting idea; perhaps for Everton it would work better with 1 up front & 3 at the back, allowing the wing-backs to provide the extra width more comfortably. If so, I'd have Fellaini as DM, Arteta and Pienaar as the central pair, and Cahill as the attacking point of the diamond. However, I don't think the actual line-up & formation is as important as the manager's preparation of his players for the contest.
Andrew Ellams
2   Posted 25/08/2010 at 14:54:00

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Why don't we just play 4-0-6, that way we don't have to waste players in midfield that are bypassed by the constant aerial balls from the back, and gives us more players to aim for with the 70-yard hoofs.
Chris Keightley
3   Posted 25/08/2010 at 15:01:18

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Another contributor mentioning Coleman not being defensive enough ? how the fuck do you know this from two sub appearances??? I have a mate in Blackpool who said that defensively he was very rarely found wanting, it's also the reason you have a defensive mid to cover the runs forward; he is in my opinion the best option at right back, end of!!

As for your formation, yes I see that working well... trouble is, as you have pointed out, the forward line: the Yak and Beckford for me would be the best option.
Ciarán McGlone
4   Posted 25/08/2010 at 15:16:56

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Why are people so insistent on including Beckford in their fantasy teams ? the Yak is a 20-goal-a-season striker...

The choice of Beckford reeks of pure desperation to me...
Dennis Stevens
5   Posted 25/08/2010 at 15:37:56

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Indeed, Andrew, it doesn't much matter which formation or personnel is selected if they don't have the self-belief & commitment required to actually get the ball down & play football - something we all know this squad is well capable of.
Nick Entwistle
6   Posted 25/08/2010 at 15:48:20

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I don't know why people have this thinking that Coleman is good at going forward so therefor is a bit suspect in defence... truth is, we don't really know much at all other than a cracking Spurs performance and some Championship ability.

I'd put him in though for this. But is a change of formation really the answer to the start of season performances?

Robert Pierpoint
7   Posted 25/08/2010 at 16:04:36

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A new rumour for people to consider.

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12876_6335229,00.html
Chris Keightley
8   Posted 25/08/2010 at 16:15:49

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I'm not even going to comment on Camorenesi, Moyes does not buy 34-year-olds, full stop. Another crappy end of transfer window link!!!
Ben Howard
9   Posted 25/08/2010 at 16:19:34

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I can never see that happening in a million years Robert. He's 33 so would only be a short term solution and he's surely looking for one last big pay-day. Something he's not going to get here (or at Rangers to be fair).
Michael Evans
10   Posted 25/08/2010 at 16:49:30

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A diamond formation would be too expensive.
Joe Carroll
11   Posted 25/08/2010 at 16:53:02

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I have often thought a diamond type of formation could work well. If not with 2 up top, just 1 and then having a kind of 'roaming 3' in the attacking mid position.

My own personal candidates for this trio would be Pienaar, Bily and Arteta. Like you said Ben, these are players that prefer a central role yet have been forced out wide under Moyes.

The idea would be that they play in this advanced position, roaming form left to centre to right, confusing opposition defenders/midfielders, and playing predominantly between each other (they all have the skill and passing ability to play intricately here).

You would then have 2 defensive mids sitting behind these 3 protecting the back 4 when we don't have the ball. My choices would be Fellaini and Rodwell, allowing the youngster to get forward when we do have the ball.
Michael Kenrick
12   Posted 25/08/2010 at 17:48:46

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Well, for one thing, Cairan, The Yak is currently injured. And playing a new signing from the lower leagues, who is hardly a yoof anymore, against lower league opposition in the hope that he might get off the mark and develop a bit of confidence playing for his new team hardly reeks of desperation. Behave!

I'll grant you, what did reek of despearation was Everton's unseemly haste to sign the guy in the first place after his Old Trafford cameo. But he was on a free... and we were desperate.. so yes, I'll give you that ? his signing reeks of desperation. Using him now he's here is far more about hope than desperation.
Danny Burke
13   Posted 25/08/2010 at 17:51:13

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I'm not sure about this system, it could work but I've never been a fan.

Coleman seems to have become some kind of iconic figure to some blues, dont get me wrong, I've been impressed with what Ive seen but we have seen very little. I worry the expectation level for him when he does come through is sky high.

Pienaar plays centrally for SA but he is also far and away their best player. He is far more effective for us on the left and this perception that he is a centre mid forced wide is IMO not true. He won our player of the season playing from the left and that is proof enough that he should play there.
Jon Cox
14   Posted 25/08/2010 at 18:20:54

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Danny, it's not a case of "iconic" it's a more a case of trying something different.

The question for us and DM has got to be, would Coleman starting right mid be more of a threat when attacking than say Leon Osman.

For me, the answer has to be yes. He's the only one with a bit of pace and more importantly, makes good decisions in the final third of the pitch.

I can't understand why people can't give him a chance. At 22 if you're good enough you're old enough.

4-0 score tonight

COYB
Chris Jones
15   Posted 25/08/2010 at 18:26:06

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Our current squad is crying out for using the 4-2-3-1 formation as used with so much success over the last year or so by various teams including Barca, Spain, The Netherlands, Germany and Brazil.

This means that both Fellaini and Rodwell can play together as the deeper lying 2 with Arteta, Cahill and Pienaar as the 3 further up the pitch supporting the lone striker.

For me it's a no-brainer, I just hope Moyes defies his previous form and catches on sooner rather than later.
Stephen Kenny
16   Posted 25/08/2010 at 18:38:43

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For some reason people think that changing the formation we play is going to drastically improve our fortunes.

Sorry to burst that particular bubble but until the player's either decide or are coached to start to run off the ball, move the ball quickly, play through teams instead of in front of them and start looking like they give a shite about winning then nothing will change.

This talk about formations is getting very tedious. In any given match the formation a team uses will change 3-6 times. Rigid formation's are outdated, especially at the level we aspire to play at.
Robert Daniels
17   Posted 25/08/2010 at 18:38:39

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Coleman and Beckford should start, there both old enough, and have it all to prove, so they should be fired up.

I watched all the pre-season friendlies and they both look terrific prospects, along with Gueye, also watched the Reserves on monday and it looks like the next batch of young players isn't far away either.

So, if Moyes doesn't give them a go soon, they will be overtaken by the next lot.
Jay Harris
18   Posted 25/08/2010 at 19:36:06

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Totally agree with you, Stephen.

We used to boast that we were the fittest team in the league and would cover acres of ground in every game but since we decided we are a "footballing side" the running off the ball and closing the opposing team down just isn't happening.
Andy Crooks
19   Posted 25/08/2010 at 19:58:44

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Ciaran, the Yak was a 20-goal-a-season striker, can you ever see him being a ten-goal-a-season striker again? Beckford has not had long enough yet but he has shown that he can look good against decent opposition. Can he sustain it? We'll see.
Chris Jones
20   Posted 25/08/2010 at 20:23:16

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Tactics are ever more important in football. Every team is full of super-fit athletes. Mourinho, Wenger, Ferguson know how to set up a side with balance to get the best (and then some) out of every player in their teams and this is where the likes of Moyes, O'Neill and Hughes are found lacking.

Moyes hit on something when he discovered 4-5-1 a year ahead of the competition and qualified for the champions league. We've played 2 teams so far who chase, close down and cover the pitch, not to mention foul and there's plenty more where they come from. We have the quality personnel the next step is to get the best out of them by selecting the right formation, only by doing this can we imrpove.
Peter Warren
21   Posted 25/08/2010 at 21:06:49

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It seems strange to me when lining up at home against teams who will try and shut up shop that Yak does not play. I still think he's the most likely player to get us a goal.

I think it's a bit much saying Beckford is an act of desperation, Ciaran. Like Heitinga last year, give the guy a chance before writing him off please.
Gary Willock
22   Posted 26/08/2010 at 08:02:27

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How about the 'el-tel' xmas tree...4-3-2-1?

Howard;
Coleman-Jags-Johnny-Baines;
Rodwell-Fella-Arteta;
Cahill-Pienaar or Bily;
Beckford or Saha or Yak.....

Playing 3 slightly defensive midfielders (who can pass!) would really allow the full backs to bomb on and provide the width. Gets all the best midfielders on the pitch, and in more natural locations. Allows Rodwell and Felli to play together (our future), could be very fluid with Mikkey and Pienaar swopping roles now and again and the same on the other side with Rodwell and Cahill... Gets 2 players offering genuine support to striker (instead of just Tim in current system)...? Sounds too good to be true?
Ben Jones
23   Posted 26/08/2010 at 10:26:37

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Many people criticise Coleman because he isn't disciplined enough. He's a decent tackler but when he bombs forward, there is a lot of space and better teams would exploit that. Of course Coleman would learn this with experience and will turn an excellent player with experience.

But will all you Coleman lovers really wanna play Coleman on Sunday against Ashley Young? Cmon!

Looking at the match, the Saha and Beckford partnership looked promising when Beckford set up Saha's goal.

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