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We Can't Afford Moyes

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After yet another awful performance in a game that we should have won, it seems to me more and more Blues are joining the Moyes Out brigade. The ridiculous decisions that DM makes are becoming even more laughable each week.

We were very lucky to get a draw at Chelsea, never mind what anyone else tells you. If Chelsea were on top form, they would have walked all over us. Every time I go to a game involving Everton, I don?t expect anything from the game. All I expect is that the team run around like headless chickens, but ultimately eventually collapse.

Anyway, personally after going to the Wigan match on Saturday, I know that Everton can?t continue to play like this. There were large amounts of empty seats and customer satisfaction is at an all time low. Our football is absolutely terrible, yes even worse than the likes of Stoke and Blackburn, at least their direct. We spend our whole time just passing the ball sideways and hoping for a defender to slip over, or a lucky bounce.

I believe one problem David Moyes needs to sort out is the Cahill situation; in my eyes, he?s a hindrance to our midfield, as he can only play in a 4-5-1 formation and is probably the only decent goalscorer in our team. It?s ridiculous that we have 2 defensive midfielders play at GP against Wigan; surely no sane-minded person would say this sends a good message to the opposition?

Anyway, getting back to the main point, Everton cannot afford to be managed by an idiot. There are various issues that are affecting Everton at the moment, the stadium, transfers, and financial problems. All these problems will be made worse of DM stays at the club.

For the last two seasons, Everton seem to always be last on MotD, our atmosphere is becoming awful, and our stadium is looking even worse. Everton need to display a positive image to the outside world rather than a negative one.

Who wants to invest in a club whose manager is losing the plot and is only going backwards? Yet he is getting paid ridiculous fees to mess up the club. He has failed to notice blatantly an obvious thing like Arteta is useless in central midfield and that Heitenga is a great centre back.

He fails to change things during matches and often when he makes changes they are far too late in the game. Against Wigan we should've taken off Fellaini and Rodwell and brought Cahill back and put Yakubu and Beckford up front. I think that far too often we were left with nobody to aim at.

If I was manager, in January, my priority would be to find an attacking midfielder comfortable on the ball. If we have to sell a few players to get that person I think it would be worth it. I would personally sell Rodwell, I don?t think he?s that good, and I believe we have significant cover for him. I?d also get rid of Pienaar and put Baines as our left winger, and try and get Lescott on loan to play at left back.

I would also get rid of Victor Anichebe and Louis Saha both of whom show appalling attitudes towards the club. Try and buy a half-decent striker to get on the end of Donavan's crosses, hopefully.

But anyway, I don?t expect any changes, and feel that Moyes with continue to destroy Everton, and keep useless players that are on huge wages yet contribute nothing. The fans need to let David Moyes know that his tactics aren?t acceptable, and that we won?t just watch our club decline while he waits for a phone call from Manchester United.

Nelaj Behajiha, Liverpool     Posted 13/12/2010 at 15:28:04

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Ciarán McGlone
1   Posted 13/12/2010 at 17:26:41

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We can't afford Moyes?

Unfortunately he's the only thing we can afford - because his contracts signed, sealed and delivered.

In all seriously, the failings of Moyes have been quite apparent since the beginning of his tenure here...and those who chose not to stick their head in the effusive sand have realised his shortcomings. However, I was of the opinion that Moyes would learn to rectify his mistakes - such tempering of my opinion on Moyes is proving to be pie in the sky - A manager who cannot learn from his mistakes is a manager doomed to repeat them over and over again...we are in an infinite loop with Moyes.

But he's not the only problem. What would be the point in getting rid of Moyes while having Kenwright in charge - In fact there is absolutely no chance of Kenwright sacking him...In Moyes Kenwright has a lap-dog who has never criticised him for his failings - And Kenwrights failings are massive...

I know us electronic fans have been given a right going over by the media lately...we even had one idiotic hack in the News of the World on Sunday telling us that success is a top ten finish, or an FA cup final, or a champions league qualification match - apparently he thinks we should be thankful for such endeavour under Mr Moyes.

This pandering moron even has the cheek to tell us that we should remember Walter smith and the worst of times. I'm sorry Mr Media chimp, but I'd ratehr remember the best of times. I am not happy with mediocrity, i'm not happy with being an also ran - and who the fuck are you to tell me I should be.

Thank you and goodnight Mr Moyes, you have reached your ceiling.
Andrew Conroy
2   Posted 13/12/2010 at 17:40:46

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So you'd sell Rodwell, play Baines on the wing, play Cahill in midfield ahead of Fellaini and have Lescott at left back?

What was that you said about Everton can't afford to be managed by an idiot?
Lee Courtliff
3   Posted 13/12/2010 at 17:51:35

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I don't agree that we should sell Rodwell but it's nice to know that I am not the only one who thinks he is overated.
Stephen Kenny
4   Posted 13/12/2010 at 17:15:34

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I agree with the title, I also agree about HEITINGA, the rest is pie in the sky.

Chelsea on top form may well beat us but Everton on top form have given them a hard time these last few seasons and beaten them, cup final excepted.

Baines left mid? We have a perfectly good one who was last years player of the season. All season I have seen people rightly moan about people being played out of position, yourself included. Why is this different for Baines? Lescott left because we couldn't afford to pay him the type of money he wanted. What's changed? Add in the other players you suggest and were halfway to bankrupt. Breaking the Baines/Pienaar combo has been one of Moyes biggest errors this season IMO.

Also I know which side I'd rather watch out of Stoke, Blackburn and Everton. At least we are trying to play proper football, failing but trying.

If you think Cahill is the only decent goalscorer in our side why do you want him dropped? I agree that his strengths arent those of a typical no.10 however the Juan Roman Riquelme's of this world are hard to come by and their not cheap! Yakubu and Cahill have when played together regularly, looked a good forward line and is while Tim is still with us, our most potent strike force IMO.

It will be interesting to see what happens when the Asia cup kick's off as I think Beckford deserves time on the pitch for a sustained run at some point this season.

The stadium, transfers and financial issues are real but I think there is someone at the club who should shoulder the blame for these and it isn't David Moyes. His consistent acceptance of no transfer budget is undoubtedly the reason we are still afloat. It's probably also the reason he's still in a job. I think the days of him waiting for the phone call from Old Trafford are long gone!

Seeing as I've criticised most of your opinions I think it's fair I share my own. I'll post later.
David Thomas
5   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:04:54

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I'm sorry but in my opinion there are massive holes in your argument. Namely, you state about Cahill, "he?s a hindrance to our midfield" and then you say "Against Wigan we should've taken off Fellaini and Rodwell and brought Cahill back".
Simon Jenkins
6   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:09:07

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The root cause of our problems this season is not David Moyes.

Yes, he makes the decisions on a match day, and yes, he has made mistakes (which he himself has admitted to - not many managers show as much honesty). But the lack of squad depth and lack of signings is not Moyes' fault.

I've always hated the word 'overachieved' when used by the media in relation to Moyes' work - I felt it was patronising and disrespectful to the historical status of the club and support - but Moyes has done a terrific job in the wider context of the past 8 years, and in light of the financial constraints he works under.

When Carlos Tevez is reportedly on £286k a week, and our top earner, Arteta, is on £70k a week, that simply illustrates what the club is up against in terms of the financial gap thatb we have to try and bridge. And Moyes can't do this alone, as this season is showing.
Nelaj Behajiha
7   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:31:30

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Well Andrew we're doing great now aren't we mate under the wonderful stewardship of King Moyes. At the end of the day who is good enough to replace Pienaar in our side and with our finanancial situation, I can only think Baines, unless Bale fancies coming to Goodsion. Who else is good enough to replace Baines and was reasonbly decent while playing for Everton I can only think Lescott.
Andy Crooks
8   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:45:26

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Andrew Conroy
9   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:38:25

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In our financial situation we shouldn't be spending £9m on players who at least notionally should be replacing Pienaar with ease. Moyes bought Bily, Moyes coaches him everyday, so people complaining that Moyes has got his hands tied financially are simply building cases to suit their own agendas. Lest we forget, it was also Moyes that gave a bumper contract extension to the worst striker we've had in years. At least Jo bagged a couple now and then; Hibbert seems more likely to score than Saha at the moment.

We should also be playing Gueye. How he's not getting a sniff seems to typify the corner that Moyes has painted himself into. But Moyes won't play him, not before he's tried Baines on the wing and put Distin in at left back.
Dean Adams
10   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:48:43

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How about Etherington as a left midfielder?
Andy Crooks
11   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:46:38

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Sorry, Cairan, I have no idea what happened there. What I intended to say was I am pretty much in agreement with you. In fact I believe your post is a benchmark. I have seen you and Dave Wilson as pretty much balanced in the middle ground. Dave Wilson now has the deciding vote. Dave, time for change?
Andy Crooks
12   Posted 13/12/2010 at 18:51:25

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Stephen Kenny, I disagree with you, but frankly, you put up a decent defence of Moyes that tries to engage in debate. I will be interested in your post later.
Ray Robinson
13   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:04:48

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Nelaj, " If Chelsea had been on top form, they would have walked all over us". They weren't, we deservedly drew.

If Everton had been on top form, they'd have beaten Wigan 4 or 5-0. We weren't, we didn't. Don't get the point you are making .... sorry.
Joe McMahon
14   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:33:01

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FFS Blackburn better not appoint Martin's O?Neill or Jol. Both are odds on, sadly for us thats means they want to go places.
Alan Clarke
15   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:41:53

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I would accept the lack of resources argument if the likes of Blackpool and West Brom were below us. I would also accept it if Moyes was trying something different.

The fact is that squad is capable of more than its current position. The manager isn't.
Paul Olsen
16   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:43:06

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I am as disappointed as anyone with our current situation, this is a poor post nevertheless.
David Holroyd
17   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:30:48

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Heitinger and Anichibe must be sold to generate some funds, that might help in the short term. But there seems to be deeper things wrong at the club. Next season there will be no Yobo Pienaar Anichibe Saha or Yakubu must go aslo. We dont have funds to buy unless we sell that leave sthe squad short of numbers. While Anichibe might not be the greatest of players, him and Gosling will have left for next to nothing.Season tickets sales will be the next thing on the agenda and who wants to see more of the same next season.
Ryan Holroyd
18   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:43:58

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We're clearly having a bad season and Moyes has made errors of judgement. However, Know one in the Premier League has got more points than Everton since Moyes has been the manager apart from Arsenal, United, Chelsea and Liverpool.

So who would do a better job?
Neil Steele
19   Posted 13/12/2010 at 19:47:42

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Nelaj, I agree with your assessment of Moyes, and you make some very astute points that I agree with wholeheartedly. Unfortunately, you also have a few odd views that I really cannot understand. I agree that Cahill his a hindrance, he lacks footballing why on earth would we drop him back into midfield proper? The criticism of Arteta is bizarre..where where you last season man? The lad has had a handful of bad games, and I believe he has been playing with an injury. He is far and away the best player at the club though, pure quality, to say he can't play central midfield is absolutely were his performances there last season that earned him his £75k a week!!
Moyes needs to go, that's the bottom line.
Spragg Johnson
20   Posted 13/12/2010 at 20:14:21

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We have no money... pure and simple.

Do you not think that Moyes would like to buy a decent striker and a couple of midfielders? (Our defence is fine when you think Heitinga can't get a game).

Moyes finds good talent at great prices but as soon as we're linked with a player a team like Spurs (remember Kyle Naughton) pounces and the money grabbing players would rather earn more in their reserves.

Who would replace Moyes?

Who should we sign... and remember... we apparently don't have the £3 million to sign Kranjcar!!

We have to make the best of a bad situation as fans... as that's what Moyes is doing with his budget.

We were superb in the 2nd half against Chelsea and of course we should've beaten Wigan ... and would've if the linseman had called beckford on.

Lighten up people... with a club as cash strapped as ours we're bound to have some poor seasons.

Only new investment will save us...
Ryan Holroyd
21   Posted 13/12/2010 at 20:16:42

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Kenwright needs to go and we need a new stadium to generate more funds. We are a small club now. That's the bottom line.
Jamie Tulacz
22   Posted 13/12/2010 at 20:13:15

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Ryan (18) exactly my point! Seem to be far too many that are unable to remember outside of this season.

I've yet to see any tactical solutions on here that improve on what we have now (which seem to work pretty well last season and the previous few as well). Most seem to revolve around dropping our top goalscorer and basically player of the season so far, and playing 2 out of form strikers!

Having said that if the club do get in serious danger of relegation I would look at Moyes' position at that point. Martin Jol would be a great replacement for me.
Alan Clarke
23   Posted 13/12/2010 at 20:25:50

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Ryan, we've never attracted a top manager. We've either promoted from within or taken a punt on an up-and-coming manager. We should look to take a punt again but on someone with a better philosophy than Moyes.
Neil Steele
24   Posted 13/12/2010 at 20:52:51

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Spot on, Alan.
Stephen Kenny
25   Posted 13/12/2010 at 21:04:36

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I'm not defending Moyes, felt there were some odd contradictory points in this piece. The article is probably same old stuff we've talked about for ages TBH.
James Carroll
26   Posted 13/12/2010 at 21:21:59

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Would we want Big Sam?
He's available now...
Or maybe Blackburn will go for Moyes...?
Andrew James
27   Posted 13/12/2010 at 21:08:29

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For me the seeds were sown just over 2 seasons ago. Late summer/early Autumn 2008. We had an absolutely awful transfer window, bringing in the likes of Lars Jacobsen and Segundo Castillo (not bad players but not the types we, as a team who had just finished 5th, had a spirited European campaign and a run in the League Cup should have been recruiting) A cheeky deal was done to bring in Saha but that was hardly a progressive long term signing given his age and injury record and then there was Fellaini. Moyes / the board seemed to but all their eggs in one basket by breaking our transfer record to bring him in. This was one very expensive "one for the future" for a club with our balance sheet.

Around the same time, three very crucial things happened. We were unfortunately drawn to Standard Liege and our European campaign was over. They were one of the Champions League "leftover" sides, so to get them as the highest placed Europa qualified side in the best league in Europe did seem rather unlucky. Another revenue stream not available to us. Around the same time Man City are bought out by the Arabs and, soon after, Spurs brought in Redknapp.

Spurs and City both took a year to get going and our 2008/09 campaign was a good one as we trounced several teams despite horrendous injury problems to our top goalscorer, our most creative midfielder and our best centre back. When we finally reached the FA Cup final this was a shell of a side, exhausted and battered. Going into battle shorn of three key players meant that the physically intimidating Chelsea were always likely to beat us. And they did, but not in the humiliating way some might have you believe.

That Summer, if we'd won the cup, I suspect Lescott might just have stayed. But we all know what happened and that badly hindered our next campaign so we ended up finishing 8th behind, yes you guessed it, Spurs and City. It now looks like this will be happening on a regular basis.

My point? The complete lack of backing from BK in the Summer of '08. Yes, we point to Fellaini's sizeable price but that was the equivalent of the money gained from the Johnson and McFadden sales. Effectively transfer funds made available outside selling players were minimal. Same happened in 09 and 10.

Therefore I think all the people having a go at DM are doing so because he has consistently raised our expectations and now we think he should always be able to finish above at least half a dozen sides who spend more money than him. That's what he's done for roughly 6 of his 8 seasons.

Yes I am disappointed that DM doesn't shuffle his deck enough thus giving more game time to Bily or Gueye or Beckford. But to be so critical of him and lay all the blame at his door is unacceptable. The club has been mismanaged at board level. I would guess they are praying that DM gets them out of yet another hole with a top half finish.

Nelaj Behajiha
28   Posted 13/12/2010 at 22:19:09

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Neil, Arteta has been useless since his injury. The days of him running down the wing and crossing to our strikers are a distant memory. Yes I did make a slight contradiction on the Cahill issue but I was only referring to the Wigan game. Just a point when I made the title I wasn't talking about his wages more the effect he's having on our club. We already struggle to compete with other clubs never mind if our attendances drop and Sky don't want to televise games involving us.
Jay Harris
29   Posted 13/12/2010 at 22:26:36

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Time waits for no man.

Unfortunately Billy Bullshit's lack of any sort of plan and getting a buyer are now coming home to roost.

As Andrew says we have been papering over the cracks for the last 2 years and even a manager that was destined to usher in our great new era looks a shadow of the man that got us European places consistently and a cup final and all on beer money.

His energy has been drained and his judgement clouded because you can only empty the cupboard once.

I am afraid it's back to journeymen and mercenaries.
Neil Steele
30   Posted 13/12/2010 at 22:54:37

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Nelaj, you are talking complete rubbish about Arteta. He was magnificent last season, I find your attitude and short memory towards the player - and you are not alone in behaving that way - disgusting to be honest. Here is a lad who is pure quality, 'School of Science' embodied, everything we should be harnessing and cherishing at our club...and people can't wait to slag him off after a handful of bad games. Pathetic.

I'm glad the days of him going down the wing and putting crosses in are gone..because he isn't a bleeding winger you gonk...he is a top class central midfielder, and thankfully he will be gracing Goodison for several years to come thanks to his character matching his footballing ability.
John Ford
31   Posted 13/12/2010 at 23:22:41

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Simon 6 and Andrew 27, great posts. BK is the real problem, but just seems untouchable.
Richard Harris
32   Posted 14/12/2010 at 00:09:57

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To be honest I really don't care any more until Moyes, Round and Kenwright have gone. I'm tired of wasting my time and money to be served up dross on the pitch, lame excuses off the pitch and the outpourings of our luvvie friend who is only good for a misty eyed soundbite....
Roy Coyne
33   Posted 14/12/2010 at 02:43:04

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I cant see us doing anything until bill goes sadly that will not happen any ime soon.Moyes is not a great manager but who is better that would come here and work under Bill, so we wont protest like the kopites we will all come on here and complain but at the next home game we will be there as its our team.
Ernie McAllister
34   Posted 14/12/2010 at 09:13:03

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Ryan Holroyd - You always ask who would replace him argument. Right now anyone could replace him and his dour negative shite on the pitch..added to his tactical naivety.

If he was shown the door tomorrow, you can bet there'd be a queue a mile long to manage us.

We have a decent squad, and a new manager would and should be able to get better out of them. Your pointless question of "who would replace him" needs to stop being asked.
Richard Dodd
35   Posted 14/12/2010 at 09:21:53

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Let`s face it-success for Everton IS being in the top half of the Prem on a consistent basis.Davey HAS tried to change our style of play and the players just aren`t up to it. We`ve had eight years of relative success by `keeping it tight and hoping to nick one` so why change now.Back to basics is the answer to the present drop in our success ratio.Sooner the better.
Sam Morrison
36   Posted 14/12/2010 at 10:04:57

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Richard, you read TW so you must know it's exactly that approach that drives everyone up the wall. Even DM has been trying to move away from that.
Chris Fisher
37   Posted 14/12/2010 at 10:34:03

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Be very careful what you wish for, Moyes is having a bad time at the moment and we are under performing... I am as pissed off as anyone else but don't get it twisted ? we have been over-achieving for a while now, we were way ahead of Spurs a few years back and all of a sudden they got a chairman with money and left us behind.

Moyes has kept us in and about the top of the table when really mid-table would've been acceptable with what he's had to work on. We need investment if we are to improve but, until then, staying in the Premier League and finishing as high up as Moyes can possibly manage is what is important. If we were to get rid of Moyes, I could see us sliding out of the Premier League and being like a Southampton.

We are all looking to place our anger somewhere and I'm doing the same but I'm looking towards the moneymen at the club more than Moyes. We are a massive club but with smalltime moneymen basically; the fact is a team like Man City, who are tiny compared to us in history and tradition, are now way out of our league... it's hard to accept but it's true.

Moyes has worked wonders for us and actually increased what we expect of our great club to a lot higher than it should really be at this present time. We think we should be up with the likes of Man United, Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal but if we are honest we are more among the Sunderlands, Blackburns and Aston Villas of this world.

Thor Sørensen
38   Posted 14/12/2010 at 11:19:14

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We can't afford Moyes?

Well, whhat would it take in compensation for Everton to get rid of Moyes? £3m? £4m? Even £5m?

What is each place in the league standing worth come the end of the season? £1-1,5m?

So, the difference in finishing 8th or 15th in the league would amount to around £7-10m in prize money?

My point? Maybe replacing Moyes wouldn't hit the club as hard financially as we might think. Pherhaps there's even a chance Everton may save a few quid or breake even, and improve team performances, by replacing David Moyes.
Ryan Holroyd
39   Posted 14/12/2010 at 12:36:01

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The point I'm trying to make is no manager has done what he has done (consistently) on the budget he has been given.

No team has got more points than Everton other than the 'big 4' since Moyes has been manager. That is fact. Not opinion BUT FACT.

You can not expect a manager to be given less and less each season and to perrform better than teams who spend millions upon millions improving their squads.

So why is it a silly thing to ask who would do a better job because pound for pound Moyes has done better than practically all others?
Nelaj Behajiha
40   Posted 14/12/2010 at 13:20:15

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Neil Steele what a load of shite. Arteta's best seasons and ours were when he was playing on the wing. I don't know hw often you go to matches but last season when I went to matches Arteta was awful. In seasons previous Arteta was wonderful on the wing, if you think that he has performed well in central midfield then you obviously don't watch us enough. The problems we face now are mostly to do with Arteta. He can't pass, he's can't beat players anymore and he can't tackle. He only plays well against teams that are awful.
Ryan Holroyd
41   Posted 14/12/2010 at 14:08:51

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Nelaj Behajiha

'when I went to matches Arteta was awful'.

'The problems we face now are mostly to do with Arteta. He can't pass,'.

You need to take a step back from the keyboard, open your eyes and think about what you write.
David Thomas
42   Posted 14/12/2010 at 15:03:06

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I'm sorry but you are talking rubbish about Arteta. I go home and away and without doubt the best period Arteta has ever had at the club was the period of time he played in central midfield before his injury up at Newcastle. Arteta has even said this himself.

I'm not sure which games you went to last season, but Arteta was not awful by any strech of the imagination.

I think you should follow what Ryan said in his last sentence of post 40.
Nelaj Behajiha
43   Posted 14/12/2010 at 16:07:24

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David, as I will admit, until his injury, I was his biggest fan. You can spend your whole time reminiscing his better days ? the reality is it's nonsense.

He was an excellent winger, look at his goals agaisnt Fiorentina and Bolton. In the start of 2009 he performed reasonably well i central midfield before his injury. I think he's a hinderance to our side he hasn't justified his ridiculous wages and doesn't look like doing so anytime soon.

Yes, he was excellent in the derby game this year but overall I think he's been poor since his injury. If people were honest about him, they'd say the same thing.

Yes, he "was" a great player... but I haven't seen any evidence he's getting any better. Most match-going Evertonians will tell you he's been quite poor this season. We can't afford to pay someone like him and get such a poor return.

Norman Merrill
44   Posted 14/12/2010 at 12:22:16

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Some very good points for and against Moyes.

The financial problem is never going away until new investment (if ever) comes in. But my concern is that some of the players do not look as if they want to be here, and that's as real worry... Also has Moyes lost the dressing room?

Monday's game against City will bring some answers, hopefully, in as much as we usually do well against them, and surely we have to find the net sometime.

It's all down to the formation for me, we have to have a go at them, as sitting back would be crazy, but I am talking Everton.

David Thomas
45   Posted 14/12/2010 at 17:03:52

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Yes, he did do very well on the wing for us. He was also excellent for us in central midfield before his injury. This is because he is an excellent footballer.

The point i disagree with you is that he has been awful since his injury. That is simply not true ? he was pivotal to the team for the 2nd half of last season ? after he came back from that injury.

I agree he has been poor this season, no-one could argue with that. However, i know his form will return very soon because form is temporary whilst class is permanent.

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