So it appears Pienaar has finally decided to leave.
Personally I think it's the correct decision to not offer the £70k per week he will be getting at Spurs. Skillful player but final ball and shot usually always lets him down. Can easily be replaced as he flatters to deceive most of the time. Fondest memory was the goal against Arsenal.
James Stewart, Posted 11/01/2011 at 20:50:42
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1 Posted 11/01/2011 at 21:47:18
Bily the replacement on the left? Gueye?
2 Posted 11/01/2011 at 21:47:26
3 Posted 11/01/2011 at 21:59:17
4 Posted 11/01/2011 at 21:58:27
5 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:02:16
6 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:04:52
7 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:14:21
8 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:15:02
Only wish those doing the finances had the acumen to have him tied to a contract where we were rewarded for his worth (bearing in mind Spurs paid £17mill for Bentley) he's a far better player than the one we bought from Dortmund for £2m but we're not going to see any of it; no wonder we are perennial skint.
9 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:29:26
Now if we lose big Fella for free in 3 years time then I would be gutted!
Be interesting to see who gets the left wing role. Not sure it's where Bily will prosper. Maybe time to unleash the secret 'guy'.
10 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:19:26
I just hope that Moyes can find a decent replacement. I'm not sure Bily is the answer, and I really hope that Moyes doesn't see this as a way to squeeze Osman back into a regular starting slot. Having said that, he looked pretty useful there against Birmingham!
See you, Peanuts, hope to see you doing a fair amount of bench-warming, thus adding to the picture Lescott helps paint that leaving Goodison isn't always the best thing for your career... even if it is bloody good for your bank balance!
11 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:31:21
12 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:31:24
At this moment in time, we can't replace him.
13 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:36:32
I think we should sell now, however. I just don't think his contribution in this particular half of the season is worth £2 million. We need money to secure some kind of scorer. And as people pointed, Pienaar just isn't a prolific goalscorer.
14 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:40:30
15 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:33:43
I think he will fade away at Spurs. I agree that Harry" and his loathsome posing family should be done for poaching...
Bye, Pienaar... but like many before you we had the best and the grass is not usually greener over there....
16 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:35:20
17 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:32:32
a) sanctioned by Moyes;
b) in breach of UEFA regulations; or
c) the usual newspaper nonsense.
18 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:45:12
I don't bear him any ill-will though, don't believe his conduct has been poor. As a farewell gift we should all chip in and buy him a nice comfy cushion to sit on while watching Spurs play.
19 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:42:39
Didn't score enough goals, and physically found it difficult, I think Pienaar might be one of the frailest players in the Premier League. (Maybe it was growing up during apartheid South Africa.) But we'll miss his creativity, definitely. He and Baines often look as though they're the only ones who really get it (in a footballing sense.)
What's more frustrating, though, is that Tottenham don't need him. I mean, they really don't need him: Modric, vDv, Bale, Lennon, Palacios, Sandro, Huddlestone, Jenas, Giovani, Kranjcar, O'Hara, Townsend. Where does he fit in? It's just a display of dick swinging from 'Arry: we'll have Pienaar, and pay him £70k a week, just because we can. Money talks, eh?
20 Posted 11/01/2011 at 22:36:39
21 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:02:07
For me, maybe Arteta on the left if/when Pienaar goes, maybe even Osman who's done a decent job there in a couple of games.
22 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:10:47
23 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:13:46
Can no-one else see the club strategy here?
Release propaganda on the brave refusal to sell Phil Neville. "Harry, spout some shite all over SkySports to cushion the blow. Would ya? Good man!"
24 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:35:08
Otherwise, is it just me that's a bit concerned on how today's events might impact on the derby? I mean it's not ideal preperation losing Pienaar, Neville being tapped up, Yakubu going out on loan and Cahill not being around...and it's only Tuesday!
I hope Moyes has them focused.
25 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:39:16
Certainly doesn't go into the Lescott category for me. Good luck to him, though I think he's made a bad decision for us and for him.
26 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:22:44
I get the impression he thinks he is better than he is.
As I said before skillful player yes but he is not anywhere near as dangerous enough as he should be. Osman has played very well against City and you never know Gueye might see more action now. Bily is not the answer however and needs to be played centrally.
27 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:39:58
28 Posted 11/01/2011 at 23:37:02
I don't think it's any coincidence that it took him to arrive at Goodison before his career appeared to be resurrected. As fans starved of seeing much in the realm of technical skill we worshiped his ethereal ability to run with the ball at his feet, despite the fact that he rarely does it where it matters: within 30 feet of the opposition goal.
So slightly gutted to lose his work-rate and his partnership with Baines, but not too concerned that Moyes can't find both attributes in a player who'll take considerably less than £70k a week.
And we are laughing if we get £2million (ie what we paid for him) for a guy that can leave for free in the summer. All we need now is for the media to convince someone else with more money than sense that Rodwell is a £30million player...
29 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:24:14
I was under the impression he could talk to European clubs but no-one from the Premier League.
30 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:23:03
31 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:38:19
I am sad he is leaving as I loved the energy he put in, the Baines partnership, etc. He does have many limitations though... Confidence not being something he lacks. He'll need plenty of it to shoehorn his way into Spurs starting XI though, but I wish him luck.
32 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:39:31
Like some others here I don´t really see why Tottenham need him (unless they plan on playing him in central mid)
He´s been a good player for us, but for me he tended to infuriate me just as much as he did impress.
33 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:45:35
Great for link up play but can anyone recall the last killer pass he put through to one of our players?
Will he be changing his singlet underneath his shirt from 'God is Great' to 'Greed is Great' I wonder?
34 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:46:23
I agree that we shouldn't be held captive to the wage demands of players but I think he deserved at least what Arteta is getting. To lose him for either £2M or nothing really breaks my heart, especially when you see the absurd money that is being thrown around by City, Spurs and others for players like Bentley, SWP,etc. I hate greedy Harry and his overflowing midfield.
35 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:49:45
In a team that is struggling for goals, he isn't exactly helping us out in that department!
Bainsey on the other hand has 7 assists. I would argue that his attacking play down that left side often makes Pienaar look good.
At least this is all what I'm telling myself now I'm resigned to him leaving!
36 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:25:48
He's out of one those terrible S. Africa slums. So God knows how many mouths he's feeding back home. He's one I can't blame for taking the money.
And I'll always believe he preferred staying. Here's hoping he gets a nice round of applause first time back to Goodison.
37 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:02:08
In any case, while I wish him the best, I don't want to see him in this weekend's Derby. He looked like he was trying too hard to impress his new boss last weekend, and had a poor game because of it. Goodness knows how he'd perform with those pound-signs and Champions League stars floating in front of his eyes...
38 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:09:43
While he put in a shift for us, he hasn't really made the difference in the final third this year; I think he'll struggle at Spurs because of his lack of pace, he'll be a stand-in for Bale at best, he would've been better suited to Italian or German leagues. I reckon we should make Spurs wait until after the Derby though and get £2-3M if possible.
As already mentioned on here, I think any agreement he's got with Spurs should be reported to the FA/Fifa as he can only negotiate with clubs from a different country at this point in time.
39 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:20:37
Greedy little fucker.
40 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:22:35
41 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:15:15
42 Posted 12/01/2011 at 00:52:04
43 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:23:53
Will we miss him? ? perhaps initially... but I think he is replaceable. Not enough goals, pace or stature ? he never quite reached the potential I thought he had at the start. Let's move on with players who want to wear the Royal Blue!
44 Posted 12/01/2011 at 01:51:01
45 Posted 12/01/2011 at 02:25:07
46 Posted 12/01/2011 at 02:29:56
I'll like a stronger player in left mid that can cover and provide outlet for Baines' runs and crosses. Can track back and tackle at leftback position if Baines becomes exposed.
Baines is why we prosper on the left.
47 Posted 12/01/2011 at 02:40:49
Basically, he wanted x amount, we weren't prepared to offer x amount so he's going. He hasn't mouthed off to the press, never went missing on the pitch... so, for me, it's a big "Good luck for the future, Steven; thanks for the memories. Just don't ever score or play well against us!!"
Would be great if we could get the £2M now though. A new pacy young winger would be nice...
48 Posted 12/01/2011 at 03:42:05
49 Posted 12/01/2011 at 05:41:54
He isn't allowed to speak to any english domestic club while still in contract. He and Everton would be in significant break of UEFA rules. The only clubs he can speak to in-contract are foreign ones.
So this babble in the papers of 'potential' offer cannot be remotely true and is just tabloid trash. If it's not Daily Mail its the Guardian making shite up.
Not to say he won't go in the summer... but let's wait to see what he has to say to this speculation before we tell him to do one down the M1 to Spurs.
Neville as a smoke screen? I just think the media are as usual doing their transfer window fantasy posts because it's quiet on the Everton front.
The Yak going on loan might be a good thing... maybe the fat bastard can learn to get his form back along with the goals.
50 Posted 12/01/2011 at 05:48:45
51 Posted 12/01/2011 at 06:19:15
52 Posted 12/01/2011 at 06:27:38
The problem is if he doesn't go now, I can't see the Goodison crowd being too welcoming next time he plays. I think this Guardian article has been put out by Spurs to make us sell Pienaar now.
53 Posted 12/01/2011 at 06:37:47
Before you say "Good riddance" ask yourself what quality of player we will get with the difference between the £70k a week he's being offered to whatever (£60k?) Everton were offering.
Pienaar can be replaced, but it'll cost millions in wages alone and there will be no guarantees.
We will bargain hunt, sure we may save a few hundred grand, but we will be losing one of the best footballers we've had in 20 years... and some people are glad.
Some Evertonians are rejoicing at keeping Pip, advocating a starting place for Beckford and won't hear of Jagielka being sold, but the lovers of good on-the-ground football will be feeling pig sick.
54 Posted 12/01/2011 at 07:03:38
55 Posted 12/01/2011 at 07:16:46
56 Posted 12/01/2011 at 07:46:26
57 Posted 12/01/2011 at 07:43:45
58 Posted 12/01/2011 at 03:42:05
59 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:06:44
He's coming up to 29 and he will be past peak soon enough so if we get in a younger replacement like Hammill from Barnsley then it may even be a good thing. Of course there's no guarentees someone like Hammill will do the business but Moyes has shown he works better with hungry players with something to prove rather than more established stars.
60 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:12:08
Pienaar is worth every penny Arteta gets and just who do you all think we are going to replace him with, a rookie french kid who Moyes seems to not rate, or that waste Bily? ? who yet again proved to be the only one on Saturday not arsed.
This is a bad loss and if we are prepared to offer Arteta that wage or Anichebe £20k rising to £30, then Pienaar should have been offered the extra to stay.
It takes how long to find something that works well and we have that down the left hand side. Remember what we had before him? We have suffered with playing Osman enough out wide and you can bet your life he will be the one who shall fit in there.
61 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:47:05
Now I might be giving our Manager a little more foresight than others might like, but maybe this is where our "Secret Weapon" comes in.
Maybe Moyes was keeping Gueye fit and rested for most of the season, playing him in the reserves and cup games for him to get a taste and experience of what was needed come the second half of the season and the run in for European places?
Was not playing Gueye a ploy to keep him fit and underwraps so come January when Pienaar did eventually go, he could unleash him on unsuspecting full backs?
62 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:52:25
63 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:51:34
For me, Pienaar has done a consistently good job whilst Arteta has only ever been a flat track bully, incapable of putting on a performance against the big teams.
Let's not go overboard on Pienaar; he has done brilliantly for us and was an astute buy. But footballers are very much mercenaries now. The days of Brian Labone and Gordon West are long gone.
64 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:46:40
65 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:43:05
'Arry has said that Bale will revert to LB eventually and I can see it happening if/when Pienaar goes there. Certainly wouldn't look forward to playing against that combo ? considerably stronger than Ekotto and Bale.
66 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:59:48
67 Posted 12/01/2011 at 09:02:48
I'd have preferred it If he stayed but I really don't believe its a big loss. Look at his goals and assists return since he's been here it is far from impressive.
68 Posted 12/01/2011 at 08:29:19
He won't get a look in at Tottenham...
Everton will be the highlight of his career...
Take any money and file under 'enigma'.
69 Posted 12/01/2011 at 09:28:02
Seriously though I believe the success of the left side is purely down to how bloody good Baines is. It is him that has the final ball, the goals and the assists. Pienaar just helps it link up a bit.
Personally I would love Chelsea to pay £3M now and fuck saggy faced Harry right off!
70 Posted 12/01/2011 at 09:43:25
Maybe because Arteta when on form is actually capable of scoring AND creating goals?
71 Posted 12/01/2011 at 09:56:19
72 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:05:15
Certainly doesn't go into the Lescott category for me. Good luck to him, though I think he's made a bad decision for us and for him.
Ernie, I couldn't agree more with that!
73 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:09:01
74 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:07:53
Despite all the limitations mentioned, he has been a revelation for me. I wish the guy well but he may find Spurs is ultimately the wrong choice.
If we ever got into the CL (choke laughing!), we would need a few more players of Pienaar's ability.
Let's hope Baines can be as effective without him.
75 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:25:54
76 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:09:14
To put Ossie there actually scares me a bit.
Billy? No chance. Doesnt have the pace to play wide in this league. All his better work is when he's been more central, he wont get a look in there though.
Gueye? Has anyone really seen him play? I've seen him put in the best cross Goodison has seen this year onto Felli's head against Huddersfield. But that's it.
The fact Pienaar has not been an out an out wide player, just a link for Baines, is what has allowed Baines to emerge as a great fullback.
We will cope.
77 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:24:19
James (49) - What, you mean like last January with the 'rumours' regarding us and Beckford? I always thought that a player in this situation can reach agreement in principle but he isn't allowed to actually sign a pre-contract with an English club.
There are a lot of things I like about Pienaar, his workrate, his partnership with Bainesy, his constant movement, I've always questioned however the lack of real end product, his final ball and goal contribution is pretty poor for me. I'd also question just how committed he is likely to be for the remainder of the season, if this story is true and he has reached agreement on a deal with that underhanded gobshite Redknapp then I may be inclined to take whatever we can get for him now.
78 Posted 12/01/2011 at 10:39:40
At the end of the day, his contract was up, and he was trying to get a better deal, don't see the problem with that.
Agree with you Alan (#52) didn't we unsettle Beckford at Leeds, and they were far from happy with us. Also, I may be wrong, but didn't we poach a young lad from Leeds, that caused a bit of grief?
79 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:02:28
A small thing, I know, but slightly irksome to me.
80 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:05:49
81 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:03:28
I like Pienaar's footballing ability, but he doesn't score enough goals for me. That said, we'll not replace him with £2M now, or nought in the Summer.
Still can't see where he will fit in that Tottenham side.
82 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:13:11
Great progress in the squad, Ossie played on the left about 5-6 years ago and we haven't moved on.
83 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:20:30
84 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:14:58
Perhaps Steven's aspirations are set a little higher than Everton's!
The club is skint. No chance of European football. Old stadium. No new investment. Blah, blah, blah!
The even bigger picture is who is next to want out? That's the really scary thing.
85 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:22:44
86 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:26:43
87 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:26:10
88 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:34:34
89 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:03:43
Pienaar helps to make our left side effective. Bainesy is a class act and a real top drawer left back but his marauding runs and cracking crosses are only able to happen because Pienaar and his nonstop running are also there. Baines would not be able to get forward or cross so much if the link up between him and Pienaar was not so good.
Can you see Leon or anyone else in the squad having that understanding straight away? (not seen enough of Gueye to say but fingers crossed). The understanding of Baines and Pienaar almost reminds me of Cole and Yorke for Manure a few years back.
Billy is NOT the answer: he is not a left winger and playing him there will not get the best out of him, he plays in the hole behind the forwards or slightly left of centre mid (where I think he will eventually excel). Ozzy... well don?t get me started! Arteta can't play on the wings. (To be fair he can't play in the middle at the moment either but hey!)
I just think we will miss Stevie more than a lot think as his energy allows Bainesy to do what he does so well. Ah well, ramble over!
90 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:50:30
91 Posted 12/01/2011 at 11:45:54
We must take the money now and get him off our wage bill. Add that to the Yak's wage bill and we can't be far away from having £100k to utilise for wages on someone who will a) want to play for us b) be fit enough to play for us, and c) stay around for a while.
Moyes needs to earn his money now and either go with Gueye and let him gain the experience he needs or motivate Bily into the world class player he shows glimpses of. As for playing him again this is not an option as one poor performance will impact on the morale of the team a la Joleon Lescott.
I don't think this will affect Baines as he is a great player because of his willingness to get forward at every opportunity, not because of Pienaar.
92 Posted 12/01/2011 at 12:07:34
93 Posted 12/01/2011 at 12:03:39
94 Posted 12/01/2011 at 12:13:08
Hes the type of player our midfield needs, he can play in a variety of positions and seems to fit into Moyes hardworking type of football.
Baines has shone because of the work Pienaar puts in infront of him, dragging away the fullbacks etc.
As our Squad is threadbare with quality to lose a player of his calibre for nothing is totally frustrating.
But its the Everton way......
95 Posted 12/01/2011 at 12:04:14
96 Posted 12/01/2011 at 12:35:08
The best attribute Peinaar has, apart from his skill, work rate and team spirit is he never hides, never gives up, he can run the whole length of the pitch constantly, switching positions with Baines, covering his runs.
There are no other wide players that I can think of in the PL that have these attributes and when you allay them with someone like Baines, then you have an unstoppable pairing, witness the amount of assists coming down the LH side, Baines almost always played in by Pienaar.
I think Redknapp may be thinking of setting up his own Everton type left side with Bale dropping to left back with Pienaar ahead, with the forwards Spurs have then expect a lot of chances created down that side.
My opinion is, he will leave after the Derby, in time for the next round of the FA Cup. With Yakubu going with Pienaar, then surely Mr Moyes is clearing out players to be able to pay for wages of someone coming in. My choice would be Matty Jarvis or Nzogbia, but don't hold your breath.
Next season will be a watershed for Everton, clearly skint now, with gate and season ticket revenue almost certain to plummet due to the cuts biting. Tough times ahead, no doubt.
97 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:07:17
He's moving from a team with a stubborn, defensive focused manager, no chance of Champions League football and a stadium that's 30 years out of date to a team that can offer CL games and has plans for a brand new stadium on the go that puts even that BK fantasy version of Kirby to shame.
He's not an Everton supporter, he's just making a sensible career move. We should probably get used to it as Fellaini will probably do exactly the same.
98 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:21:31
Which brings me to the accounts for last year, usually out in November, have not been published and no announcement made. All companies have to publish accounts every 18 months at the very most so they have gotten away with it, but what are Everton hiding? There is no money for loan signings apparently ? how can this be given last year probably gave us our highest turnover ever? Let go of your toy, Bill, we need someone with business sense to run the club.
99 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:32:32
100 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:24:43
My gripe over this is with Moyes. As a club, it never ceases to amaze me how little foresight we have ? remember the Gosling oversight also? Someone (Moyes) should have made a decision 6 months ago to put him on the transfer list if he hadn't signed a new contract. We are skint, and can't afford to allow our players to leave for nothing. We could have maybe got £8 million for him in the summer. Now we are only talking about £2 million. In reality he will probably go for nothing.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but foresight is better. The same thing is happening with Yobo & the Yak. If a player isn't doing it, put him on the transfer list, don't loan them out to other clubs. Their value is diminishing the longer we keep them...
101 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:39:57
102 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:43:39
103 Posted 12/01/2011 at 13:42:47
Can't really blame him. Yes, we rescued his career, but there's no sentiment in football now. However, Everton's financial tactics have looked naive in the extreme. Like one of the posters above, I am getting seriously worried about our financial position.
104 Posted 12/01/2011 at 14:03:39
Why don't we let Neville go to Spurs and let the little transfer fee and reduction from his wage bill pay to give Pienaar the deal he wants?
It's going to cost Everton the same amount of money so it depends on who you'd rather have over the next 4-5 years.
I'd know who I'd rather keep.
105 Posted 12/01/2011 at 14:46:05
106 Posted 12/01/2011 at 17:18:27
Rodders will be next along with Fellaini and as above I wouldn't blame them one jot
107 Posted 12/01/2011 at 17:26:47
108 Posted 12/01/2011 at 20:14:52
Works hard, links up play very well, has a brain.
Many don't do well when they leave us, I think he will be an exception.
He's now set for life financially and as we've seen, when he's only got football on his mind, he can be a very effective player.
Whether he's worth £70,000 a week we can argue all day, but for me he's going because not because we don't want to pay him but because we CAN'T.
Personally I'm not a huge fan of Yakubu so would not actually be too arsed if he goes, but I believe if he does, it will be a financial, not a football move.
That to me is the crime.
On here we (myself included) waste a lot of time discussing players and possible formations, who should come who should go etc, but the fact is for the most part we're pissing in the wind as who plays for Everton right now is basically dictated by how little we can pay them compared to other clubs.
When I think of Moyes, Kenwright and Elstone and transfer window time, I'm reminded of those juggling troupes who used to appear on the Royal Command performance when we were kids ('The Amazing Mingebags').
Moyes flings a large Yak up in the air and catches a Beckford, behind him, Kenwright and Elstone fling a small Pienaar up in the air and he... simply vanishes.
The audience, oddly, applaud furiously.
109 Posted 12/01/2011 at 20:50:24
Tony above - in regards to Drenthe, he joined Hercules at the beginning of the season and has been getting good reviews. I believe they had an option to sign him at the season's end for around £3-4 million. Apparantly though he has only been paid once in 6 months and is about to return to Real. I was suggesting we offer a similar deal, though there are many interesting looking loan deals around at the moment. Shame we don't have the finances to take advantage.
110 Posted 12/01/2011 at 23:16:01
111 Posted 12/01/2011 at 23:24:28
112 Posted 14/01/2011 at 15:25:49
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