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M62-Gate and The Wizard of Oz

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Don't know about you, but I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of important meetings that I have been late for. Watching Beckford smirking in the stand as he arrived late and probably thinking, "No worries, we'll still kill off this lower league rubbish", made my blood boil. Shall we call it "unprofessional."? The fact that we were forced to start with that twat Bily rendered us, as usual with him, a ten-man team and proved fatal.

How is it possible that one of your main players turns up late for the most important match of the season? And it was just that as it represented our last chance of winning anything. I'm 52 so I have seen us win loads but lots of people haven't and to them, we are probably just one of those crap teams that make up the numbers, year-in and year-out.

As for our beloved Chairman, well it spoke volumes by the fact he chose to watch the Wizard of Oz rather than Everton. With plays, isn't it like the same thing every night Bill? Er actually, come to think of it, maybe he made the right choice. If Everton were a musical, we would definitely be (and have been for a number of years) Les Fucking Miserables.


Jonathan Tasker, London     Posted 02/03/2011 at 08:28:37

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Andrew Lawrenson
1   Posted 02/03/2011 at 14:31:02

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Just as I was begginning to warm slightly to Beckford because of his never give up trying attitude, yesterday disgusted me.

How can a player turn up late for a FA Cup match? Never mind the bollocks about the M62 being shut, he should've been at the ground early, having a pre-match meal, getting massaged, stretching... all the things a professional should do...

And then to actually give the fans the thumbs up,as if to say, "Its ok... I am here now safe!"....

And for fuck's sake don't get me started on that lump Victor...

Dave Wilson
2   Posted 02/03/2011 at 14:37:32

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Nothing to do with his lateness mate, we played 4-5-1 because of Moyes's "negative attitude".
Aidy Dews
3   Posted 02/03/2011 at 14:49:58

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Wasn't Moyes going to bench Beckford anyway cos he picked up a bit of a groin injury Saturday, so really him being late was irrelevant.

And we can all make up the excuses in the world but at the end of the day we was knocked out cos we was shit once again, everyone of those players are to blame!
Alan McGuffog
4   Posted 02/03/2011 at 15:00:29

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Andrew I couldn't agree with you more. It just beggars belief. Surely he should have been over here all bloody day, eating, training, preparing, resting.

Are we Premier League or Sunday League....maybe next season will see our lads meeting up at the Jolly Miller, at 2 o'clock, a quick Stella and then Moyesie or Bill will pick 'em up in a Transit.

Nil Satis.... my arse !

Shaun Brennan
5   Posted 02/03/2011 at 15:12:30

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"Wasn't Moyes going to bench Beckford anyway cos he picked up a bit of a groin injury Saturday, so really him being late was irrelevant."

That's rubbish!!
Aidy Dews
6   Posted 02/03/2011 at 16:38:02

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Why's it rubbish, Shaun? I'm not saying him being late is right but, from what I'd heard and read, it wouldn't've mattered wether he was on time or not cos Moyes was resting him on the bench cos he was carrying a groin strain from Saturday.

By irrelevant, I mean Moyes was going to play 4-5-1 anyway with Beckford on the bench, wether Beckford was there on time or not. Moyes wasn't going to go 4-4-2 and risk worsening his injury by playing him from the start.

I mean people are making out that we'd've gone 4-4-2 like the weekend if Beckford was there on time but he was a bit of a doubt for the game building up to it and then I heard he was going to be on the bench cos he wasn't fully fit, he wasn't on the bench cos he was late, he was going to start there anyway regardless.
Col Hughes
7   Posted 02/03/2011 at 16:44:39

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Beckford should be docked wages for turning up late. If we have a mid-week game, the players and staff should be meeting up hours before the game to discuss it, and they should be dining together, and arriving together on the team coach, not turning up whenever ? it lacks professionalism.

And as for sticking him on the bench, if he's fit enough to be there, then he's fit enough to start.

Dave Wilson
8   Posted 02/03/2011 at 16:54:26

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Aidy

Beckford was deemed fit and selected mate, the team had to be changed when he didn't show.
Howard Don
9   Posted 02/03/2011 at 16:55:36

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Aidy is not talking rubbish, Shaun (5). Everything I read pre-match was Beckford had played Saturday with a groin strain, was going to be benched last night, and only used if necessary. Doesn't excuse being late of course (although people around me arriving at half time said the M62 was a nightmare).
Aidy Dews
10   Posted 02/03/2011 at 17:16:03

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Cheers, Howard. That's what I heard on another forum from an ITK: Beckford came off on Saturday with a groin strain and was doubtful building up to the game and then apparently he was fit enough to make the bench.

Apparently as well, there was doubts with Saha too and young Vellios was in the squad just incase one or neither made it.

By all accounts, Moyes was going to go 4-5-1 with Beckford on the bench anyway, him being late is not why we didn't play him in a 4-4-2.

I'm not saying him being late is ok, but he had his reasons, apparently there was a crash on his route and that held him up but he should've been at Goodison in good time.
Alan Clarke
11   Posted 02/03/2011 at 17:42:16

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Dave Wilson, perhaps you'd like to run us through Moyes's tactical masterclass from last night? Reading's keeper had one save to make all night, hardly attacking football we played, was it?

As long as the likes of you keep defending Moyes, we're well and truly stuck. This clueless set of fans that keep accepting Moyes and Kenwright's excuses are ruining our club as much as Kenwright himself.

Charles King
12   Posted 02/03/2011 at 17:27:36

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Well put, Jonathan, it doesn't get any more fundamental than ensuring you get all your players to the gig on time. If Moyes can't manage that how can he manage a professional football team?

It's a ludicrous situation which sheds more light on the Billy Smart's team selection and tactics that dog this Moyes Everton.

Gavin Ramejkis
13   Posted 02/03/2011 at 17:43:23

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Does anyone honestly believe that after 133 years this is the first time Everton has had a player who doesn't live locally yet we don't have a policy on match days of having players at the stadium by a certain time and not when they deem fit to arrive?

Saying that under Kenshite's la la land regime anything is possible.
John Audsley
14   Posted 02/03/2011 at 18:17:27

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A strange one as John Champion on commentary said Beckford WAS going to play and the team had to be changed last minute BUT everything I'd read pre-match said he wasn't playing!!!

He should have been with the squad all day for me.
Jimmy Hacking
15   Posted 02/03/2011 at 18:56:13

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If I was a manager or chairman interested in signing a player and he said "I'll happily take a squillion pounds a year off you, plus a huge signing-on fee, but sorry I refuse to live anywhere near the home ground," I'd tell him to fuck right off.

Travelling in from Leeds before every sodding match... FFS. Can't the lad rent a flat in Merseyside so he can at least be in the city the night before a match?!

Mind-boggling.
Andy Crooks
16   Posted 02/03/2011 at 19:03:37

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Dave Wilson, you seem to be quite down on Jermaine Beckford. If his lateness is why we went 4-5-1 then he really must be a vital player. We lost last night because the side seemed to lack any motivation. Things have gone stale. What can be done about that? What's your view?
Jimmy Hacking
17   Posted 02/03/2011 at 19:17:33

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Another point: I'm not saying this excuses Beckford's tardiness but why on EARTH did we kick-off at half-seven, anyway?
David Price
18   Posted 02/03/2011 at 19:32:35

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Jimmy, TV pulls the strings and lines the pockets.

Anyway let's get behind Beckford for Saturday with some helpful support, how's about,
M62, M1, A19, set off 11:00am Saturday, should be at St James's no problem for 2:50pm.

Dave Wilson
19   Posted 02/03/2011 at 20:17:56

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Alan Clarke, you`ve done so many U-turns in such a short spce of time I can't keep track. Not long back, you were fawning all over Kenwright and advocating moving to Kirkby, you were attacking fellow Evertonians for not seeing the good sense in it. Maybe it's because you feel Kenwright made you look foolish that you have recently swung the other way and started attacking the people you once supported, but I notice you are still attacking fellow blues only from the opposite direction... One minute your arguing with Marshy and the next you want to storm the Goodison walls ? only you actually have to be there to do that.

I once wrote we should cash in on Jags and buy a forward and you called me a madman, but you were on here screaming to sell Jags a few weeks later... what gives?

Andy Crooks

Moyes pencilled Beckford in, that's a fact; when Beckford disgracefully strolled up late, Moyes was faced with two choices: 4-5-1 or 4-4-2 with Vic ? either way you critics were laughing, you were going to slaughter him whichever. He gave every available attacker every chance last night, we played three up in front for the entire second half and you still call that negative? Everton were shit not negative.

We are on the bones of our arses player wise, they are all important, even the less talented.

Dave Wilson
20   Posted 02/03/2011 at 20:45:52

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Let me ask you a question Andy, and this applies to, Colin, Gavin, Michael (ed), Brian ? anybody logged on who isn't happy with Moyes.
I wont wind you up by asking who could do better ? that even gets on my nerves ? but I am curious to know:

If you had your way and Moyes was sacked / walked, what would be your expectations of the new guy, top four? A cup? Given that he would have the same amount of funds to spend on players ? fuck all ? and other clubs like City and Spurs have an ever increasing war chest, what would your minimum requirements/demands be?
Dave Wilson
21   Posted 02/03/2011 at 21:05:28

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oops, actually, its probably the most sensible thing I`ve said all day Peter
Gavin Ramejkis
22   Posted 02/03/2011 at 20:57:52

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Dave, I'll bite as you seem to be a bit rabid over the last week at anyone that dares question DM's ability. Whilst DM has his head firmly inserted up BK's arse and not willing to say it as it really fucking is then yeah a new manager would have literally fuck all.

I posted a short article asking what would be the straw that broke people's backs and made them ready to oust BK and his board and added that an insider revolting against the regime holds great credibility and could easily sway fence sitters. Trouble is DM came out with the bullshit about true fans sticking with the club even if and when they get relegated, that's not just negative Dave its fucking defeatist, if that's what you want to worship then I genuinely pity you.

Brentford, Reading and any other number of clubs we have been defeated by even this season have they all had managers on over £65k a week with cumulative squads that cost more than ours? Have other managers made the same mistakes week-in, week-out? Are you saying, and I've asked plenty of times on this one to other posters, that what the players do on the park or how they are trained and sent out to play, formations and strategy during the game and substitutions have nothing whatsoever to do with DM, if not what do he earn his salary for exactly?

Minimum requirements would be a manager that can send out teams setup for each game with a gameplay to suit that game not stick with the same Plan A, no Plan B and no fucking clue whatsoever about where to play players to suit their capabilities and not where he thinks they should be playing despite not being a winger/midfielder (delete as appropriate).

I also want a manager that won't spit his fucking dummy out if he falls out with a player we can ill afford to disappear (Gueye) or catch splinters (Bily and Heitinga). If they aren't good enough get fucking shut and replace with players he will play and in good time to form a relationship with the team ? lastminute.com purchases at the end of a transfer window not good enough.

Dave Wilson
23   Posted 02/03/2011 at 21:09:58

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Gavin, if you want a debate don't start getting all Alan Clarke with the insults.

I`m in a minority on this site and if you think you have a stronger argument let's hear it. if you can't manage that, fair enough I`ll move on.

Nobody worships Moyes, don't talk shite and you haven't given me an answer, what league position would meet your requirements and would only a trophy be seen as a success?

Karl Meighan
24   Posted 03/03/2011 at 08:40:50

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Dave, it's not a matter of what position is acceptable, it's about improving and moving forward. Football does not stand still and, until we have the best eleven players in the world, we can always get better and improve.

I have to agree with Gavin that last night there was no game plan, we played five across midfield with two supposed widemen yet maybe two crosses were put in from close to the byeline all night. Moyes tells us that they knew Reading would put men behind the ball in his wisdom he forgets that the only certainty regarding last night's game was that, when defending corners, we would have our whole team inside the penalty area.

Regarding what I consider success, well, for a start, getting further than the 5th Round more than twice in 13 years; even in our darkest days, cup runs have come about, the Chelsea Final apart, not under Moyes.

Signing players who do the basics well, a good first touch, close control and vision in midfielders, in defenders players who either have bags of pace to cover mistakes or who read the game and command or even a hard 'arl arse who lets nothing past...

And strikers granted goalscorers are a rare breed but somebody who can hold the ball up and bring others in should not be that hard to find. Anybody who attended the Bate game a season or two back saw that Duffy apart maybe, the rest (maybe a bit unfair based on one game) have no chance of a future at Goodison. With no money, it's vital to produce but does anybody here believe a couple of gems are about to be unearthed?

John Smith
25   Posted 03/03/2011 at 11:59:15

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Dave,

How about this for the requirements from a new manager:
If you give someone 9 years I would expect more than 1 cup final, 1 semi and still fighting relegation battles. Despite the resources of the Sky 4 or however many they are today, managers like Martin O? Neill and now even Alex McLeish can win trophies. In getting to 1 FA Cup Final Moyes has managed to equal the performance during his tenure of such outstanding clubs as Cardiff City, Millwall, Southampton and West Ham ? although not being able to match the mighty Portsmouth. Sadly in the league cup Moyes hasn?t managed to win it or even get to the final, so he?s struggling to catch up with the performances of Blackburn, Boro, Bolton, Wigan, Villa and Birmingham.

FFS Nil Satis Nisi Optimum?
Shaun Brennan
26   Posted 03/03/2011 at 12:06:42

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Why is it rubbish? He is part of the team and also part of the match preperations. Or am I missing something here?
Michael Kenrick
27   Posted 04/03/2011 at 06:33:55

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Dave, it's very simple: all the obvious negative (yes.... NEGATIVE) things Moyes is doing wrong (see ToffeeWeb, circa 2010-11) ? just do them right, and we'll see how we go. Simples.
Andy Callan
28   Posted 04/03/2011 at 07:39:16

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It's more like The Day After Tomorrow at the moment mate ? a right old fuckin' disaster......

We'd been better off goin' to watch Buttman's Big Butt Babes Part VI in Amsterdam. At least them we'd have all been smashed, one way or another.
Russ Quinlan
29   Posted 06/03/2011 at 22:14:54

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I have read all the post since last night's debacle, the latest in a series this season, and agree with everything thats being said. The sad thing me me though is I now know this is all we can look forward to... just the occasional win against the 'big boys' when, once upon a time, it was us who were in that elite group and the 'lesser' teams thought they had won a Cup Final if they beat us; now that's us.

10 years of Mr Moyes and Mr Kenwright and we are no further forward than we were when they took over, just the occasional high point, like CL qualification and Cup Finals, but silverware has been nowhere near and never likely now either. We are a stagnating, selling club going nowhere and those in charge of the Club have let it happen.

To be honest I think that lethagy from above is filtering down to the players, judging by last night's pathetic capitulation, they looked as disinterested as most of us are.

The scary thing is, if that's how they are feeling then we are definately worse off than 10 years ago and relegation is a serious threat, especially if Fellaini is now out for the season. I honestly can't see him playing for us again now. He would easily fit into any of the big teams abroad, so why stay in this mess?

We are stuck with it becasue it's in our blood but my god, how do the clowns that run 'our' Club get away with it?!

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