The Mail Bag
Europa - do we want it?
Comments (25)
I just wanted to ask people's opinions on whether they think it's a good thing to qualify for the Europa League?
I'm not arsed this year. We always underperform in it. We have a small squad that can't cope with the extra games and if you look at all the teams challenging Liverpool for 4th they're all only involved in domestic competition. Last year we got knocked out early and reached the cup final. The same has happened with Villa this year.
Jagielka's recent comments sound like the team don't really want it. For me there's no glamour in playing BATE Borisov away on a Thursday night so I can't imagine it has a massive effect on player recruitment or retention and less than 30,000 turned up to watch the Sporting Lisbon game at Goodison. Are we really arsed about the Europa? I'd sooner we didn't qualify and try and have a proper crack at the top 4 next season. I'll also be pissed off if we've spent all season moaning about injuries to then place the extra demand on the players again next year.
Alan Clarke, Posted 16/03/2010 at 21:47:46
Comments
Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer
Pat,
It;s always good to be a club competing in Europe, even in a lesser competition like the Europa, especially when it comes to trying to sign quality players in the summer. Remember, they all want to be playing in European competition, one way or another.
On the filp side, it will also help us to pursuade the likes of Pienaar, Fellaini et al that we are a progressive club with a bright future.
Also, having played in Europe regularly for the past few years, you can definitely seem the improvement in our standard of football. The more we try to measure ourselves against Europe’s better sides like the Sportings and Juventus’, the better we will be in the long run.
So yeah, we should really be aiming to get into next year’s competition by hook or by crook.
By the way, does anyone know if the Inter Toto Cup still exists and could that be a way in for us if we don’t finish in seventh position or higher?
It;s always good to be a club competing in Europe, even in a lesser competition like the Europa, especially when it comes to trying to sign quality players in the summer. Remember, they all want to be playing in European competition, one way or another.
On the filp side, it will also help us to pursuade the likes of Pienaar, Fellaini et al that we are a progressive club with a bright future.
Also, having played in Europe regularly for the past few years, you can definitely seem the improvement in our standard of football. The more we try to measure ourselves against Europe’s better sides like the Sportings and Juventus’, the better we will be in the long run.
So yeah, we should really be aiming to get into next year’s competition by hook or by crook.
By the way, does anyone know if the Inter Toto Cup still exists and could that be a way in for us if we don’t finish in seventh position or higher?
Sorry for the typos people.
Second para, that’ should be "persuade" and not "pursuade".
third para second lione should read " see the improvement"
cheers!!
Second para, that’ should be "persuade" and not "pursuade".
third para second lione should read " see the improvement"
cheers!!
Sorry to go off thread by since i was posting... i see that prick Gerrard that has managed to get away with that little bout of GBH he performed on Michael Brown on Monday night.
How predictable. I mean, what does that overrated, diving twat have to do to get a suspension? Kill somebody.?Even the, they’’d probably find an excuse for him., like he was terribly upset at the time or something.
The FA and refs really have to take stock of this because it is getting beyond ridiculous. This happens ALL THE TIME!!!!
Ok, rant over!!! Back to the thread.
How predictable. I mean, what does that overrated, diving twat have to do to get a suspension? Kill somebody.?Even the, they’’d probably find an excuse for him., like he was terribly upset at the time or something.
The FA and refs really have to take stock of this because it is getting beyond ridiculous. This happens ALL THE TIME!!!!
Ok, rant over!!! Back to the thread.
Sorry to go off thread but since i was posting... i see that prick Gerrard that has managed to get away with his little bout of GBH on Michael Brown on Monday night.
How predictable. I mean, what does that overrated, diving twat have to do to get a suspension? Kill somebody.?Even then, they’d probably find an excuse for him., like he was terribly upset at the time or something.
The FA and refs really have to take stock of this because it is getting beyond ridiculous. This happens ALL THE TIME!!!!
Ok, rant over!!! Back to the thread.
How predictable. I mean, what does that overrated, diving twat have to do to get a suspension? Kill somebody.?Even then, they’d probably find an excuse for him., like he was terribly upset at the time or something.
The FA and refs really have to take stock of this because it is getting beyond ridiculous. This happens ALL THE TIME!!!!
Ok, rant over!!! Back to the thread.
I’d agree with this post two years back, but the squad size is now capable. And I’d think coming out of the Summer we’d have the squad increased by 1-3 players.
If we beat Lisbon, I can’t see that the Euro fixures would have hinderd our run in.
Then again, the Europa... fun while it lasts but...meh. Can’t even remember who won it last year...
If we beat Lisbon, I can’t see that the Euro fixures would have hinderd our run in.
Then again, the Europa... fun while it lasts but...meh. Can’t even remember who won it last year...
Cant decide if I’ll be bothered or not if we miss out on the Europa to be honest. By all accounts it’s not a money spinner at all. Would be nice to win it regardless though, any silverware is better than none.If the redshite win it however I’ll be calling it a mickey mouse cup.
As Moyes has said in the past it’s a good learning process for the players to be in europe, but he hasn’t exactly blooded the youngsters over the past couple of years in this comp.
As Moyes has said in the past it’s a good learning process for the players to be in europe, but he hasn’t exactly blooded the youngsters over the past couple of years in this comp.
In a word - Yes
In a longer way, we need European games to increase our co-efficeint to stop us getting raped in dodgy draws and it will retain and entice players to come and play for us. The money is gash but I would rather be playing Bate on a Thurday then Hull on a Wednesday.
Less than 30,000 of us went to the Lisbon game because it was played at a fucken ridiculous time, I know many people who didn’t go because they couldn’t leave work early or couldn’t travel up/down in time to get there. Bad example to use. The other games we pretty much sold out our allocation but the away fans brought about 10 fans so once again the figures don’t reflect the true picture of the fans who went.
In a longer way, we need European games to increase our co-efficeint to stop us getting raped in dodgy draws and it will retain and entice players to come and play for us. The money is gash but I would rather be playing Bate on a Thurday then Hull on a Wednesday.
Less than 30,000 of us went to the Lisbon game because it was played at a fucken ridiculous time, I know many people who didn’t go because they couldn’t leave work early or couldn’t travel up/down in time to get there. Bad example to use. The other games we pretty much sold out our allocation but the away fans brought about 10 fans so once again the figures don’t reflect the true picture of the fans who went.
As I posted on another thread I’m not bothered if we don’t qualify for the Europa competition and after seeing last night’s refereeing fiasco at Stamford Bridge I’m even less bothered. Inter may have been the best team but how Chelsea were’nt awarded at least 2 penalties beggars belief. The manhandling in the penalty area was disgraceful and yet was completely ignored by the ref. What’s the point of competing when you come up against that ? I’d far sooner have a crack at the Premier League....yes I know that would get us into Europe but what the hell !
I think that we’d benefit from missing out this year in terms of improving our chances of a higher league position next year but it’s a dangerous road to go down - after all if we finish 5th next year, we’re back in the Europa League! Besides the prestige, ambition that it shows potential signings and the effect on the coefficient do probably make it worthwhile - not to mention, another opportunity to win some silverware.
It’s catch 22 - you need a big squad to compete on all fronts but the Europa League doesn’t make you enough to afford a big squad.
So as a one off next season, I wouldn’t be too gutted.
It’s catch 22 - you need a big squad to compete on all fronts but the Europa League doesn’t make you enough to afford a big squad.
So as a one off next season, I wouldn’t be too gutted.
Is it a coincidence that City, Spurs and Villa aren’t in Europe and are challenging for a top 4 place and latter rounds of domestic cups?
Does the extra games put pressure on a smaller squad and increase the likelihood of serious injury?
How much did we make for getting to the last 16? Qualification for the champions league group stage would probably earn more money for the club than winning the Europa League. Unless there is more money pumped into it or the format is changed (again) the Europa League is an average competition and this years Carling Cup was arguably more exciting.
I think the current squad/manager have the belief they can crack the top 4, if they have a bit of luck with injuries. This will influence the key players staying with the club, even if they miss out on Europe next season, as opposed to "well if were not in Europe I’m off" attitude other clubs seem to be facing from key players.
Does the extra games put pressure on a smaller squad and increase the likelihood of serious injury?
How much did we make for getting to the last 16? Qualification for the champions league group stage would probably earn more money for the club than winning the Europa League. Unless there is more money pumped into it or the format is changed (again) the Europa League is an average competition and this years Carling Cup was arguably more exciting.
I think the current squad/manager have the belief they can crack the top 4, if they have a bit of luck with injuries. This will influence the key players staying with the club, even if they miss out on Europe next season, as opposed to "well if were not in Europe I’m off" attitude other clubs seem to be facing from key players.
I’d rather the team got in a good pre-season, get the squad fit and ready to kick off next season and push for 4th. I’d rather we played the extra games towards another cup run and final perhaps. 7 points behind 7th place already so realistically it’s a goodbye to Europa league for next season.
As a fan yes I would like us to be in it purely from the point of it being another chance to win something. Its also quite nice having evening games at goodison!
Having said that if we could be assured of having this same squad to start next season without it for one year, then I would take that, as I genuinely believe we could challenge the 4th spot with this squad.
My fear is that the likes of Pienaar in particular might not stay around if we don’t qualify.
Having said that if we could be assured of having this same squad to start next season without it for one year, then I would take that, as I genuinely believe we could challenge the 4th spot with this squad.
My fear is that the likes of Pienaar in particular might not stay around if we don’t qualify.
Ask Liverpool if they want to be in Europe next season, they know they will be guaranteed a lot of money from their sponsors, sell out crowds for every home game and lucrative TV money, firstly because they are in European competition, but mainly because they are Liverpool.
If we, Everton, want to achieve anything near the European and world fame Liverpool have then we need to be in and compete in, European competition every year.
The reasons behind our failures in Europe are many, injuries, cowardly tactics, bad luck, you name it, but the current squad is more than capable of being successful domestically and internationally, we just need to plan our pre season better, get new players in early (who wont come at all if we are not in Euro comps) and have some luck with the injury situation.
Success breeds success, failure to qualify for Europe for a season means we have failed miserablly this season and guarantees nothing domestically next season.
I will take the bait on the Gerrard incidents.
The referee said he seen the incident and he had a word with Mr Gerrard.
In my opinion the referee should now be suspended, he has clearly applied the wrong decision here and the FA should act, what do you think would have happened if it had been Michael Brown commiting the same offence, Mr Gerrard would still be writhing on the floor, Brown suspended for a minimum 3 games.
Gerrard has behaved despicably over the last few weeks, the assault on Peinaar then a dive to get him dismissed, the V sign and fuck off and then the attack on Brown,no action taken, add to this his blatant diving and clearly the rules do not apply to him, also his novel way of getting a song changed if he doesnt like it.
If we, Everton, want to achieve anything near the European and world fame Liverpool have then we need to be in and compete in, European competition every year.
The reasons behind our failures in Europe are many, injuries, cowardly tactics, bad luck, you name it, but the current squad is more than capable of being successful domestically and internationally, we just need to plan our pre season better, get new players in early (who wont come at all if we are not in Euro comps) and have some luck with the injury situation.
Success breeds success, failure to qualify for Europe for a season means we have failed miserablly this season and guarantees nothing domestically next season.
I will take the bait on the Gerrard incidents.
The referee said he seen the incident and he had a word with Mr Gerrard.
In my opinion the referee should now be suspended, he has clearly applied the wrong decision here and the FA should act, what do you think would have happened if it had been Michael Brown commiting the same offence, Mr Gerrard would still be writhing on the floor, Brown suspended for a minimum 3 games.
Gerrard has behaved despicably over the last few weeks, the assault on Peinaar then a dive to get him dismissed, the V sign and fuck off and then the attack on Brown,no action taken, add to this his blatant diving and clearly the rules do not apply to him, also his novel way of getting a song changed if he doesnt like it.
We are 100% not going to qualify so it is a dead issue really. And no, it’s not good. It might have benefits for us next season but how can failure ever be looked upon as good? It has been an awful season, the main reason for which was all the points we threw away against awful opposition earlier in the season whilst Moyes was still crying about his injuries and letting the players on the pitch get away with half-arsed performances.
Larry, ask Liverpool if they want to be in the Europa League next season?
Completely agree with your views about failure Neil but Moyes very rarely mentioned the fact that we had almost a full team out with injuries, it was the Match of the Day panel and Soccer Saturday plebs that eventually started to talk about it when we started to string some wins together and get their biased attention.
We had a terrible amount of injuries at the start of the season, coupled with diabolical performances from some of our more senior players but I actually think Moyes should have bemoaned the lack of resources even more to make Bill listen. I mean look at the Fat waiter across the park moaning about injuries because they had two or three players missing.
We had a terrible amount of injuries at the start of the season, coupled with diabolical performances from some of our more senior players but I actually think Moyes should have bemoaned the lack of resources even more to make Bill listen. I mean look at the Fat waiter across the park moaning about injuries because they had two or three players missing.
Ray Robinson (Sugar ?).
Yes, I think Liverpool will be happy to at least be in the Europa League next season, clearly their priority will be to achieve CL qualification, but if you asked the club Europa or nothing they would bite your hand off.
There are a lot of big clubs in the Europa comp -Benfica, Marseille, Juve, Liverpool - so the standing of this comp isgrowing.
Hopefully Liverpool wont qualify at all next year for europe, but if they are in the Europa with a couple of other ex G14 teams then watch the importance of this comp improve in leaps and bounds, just as they changed the European Cup all those years ago, so more of the G14 gang could benefit from it.
There are too many teams now who have the capability to qualify for the CL in this country -Spurs, Villa, Man City, Liverpool, hopefully ourselves - apart from the current top 3. Germany, France, Italy, other sides are coming to the fore and even when the so called big sides play in the CL group stages they are not having it all their own way, Liverpool, Real a prime example, so expect some big change to the European framework, maybe even a hastening of a European league.
We dont want Everton to be left out in the cold again as in the 80s, we need to beat the top table EVERY season so we can have our share when they dish out the titbits.
Yes, I think Liverpool will be happy to at least be in the Europa League next season, clearly their priority will be to achieve CL qualification, but if you asked the club Europa or nothing they would bite your hand off.
There are a lot of big clubs in the Europa comp -Benfica, Marseille, Juve, Liverpool - so the standing of this comp isgrowing.
Hopefully Liverpool wont qualify at all next year for europe, but if they are in the Europa with a couple of other ex G14 teams then watch the importance of this comp improve in leaps and bounds, just as they changed the European Cup all those years ago, so more of the G14 gang could benefit from it.
There are too many teams now who have the capability to qualify for the CL in this country -Spurs, Villa, Man City, Liverpool, hopefully ourselves - apart from the current top 3. Germany, France, Italy, other sides are coming to the fore and even when the so called big sides play in the CL group stages they are not having it all their own way, Liverpool, Real a prime example, so expect some big change to the European framework, maybe even a hastening of a European league.
We dont want Everton to be left out in the cold again as in the 80s, we need to beat the top table EVERY season so we can have our share when they dish out the titbits.
I’m not sure us not being in the Europa league will affect Pienaar’s decision to stay. Surely he would be thankful he doesn’t have to travel to the Ukraine on a Wednesday, play on a shit energy sapping pitch on the Thursday against some no mark team watched by a TV audience of 50,000 and then travel home in the early hours to then play away in the north east on the Sunday.
I know there’s travelling involved if we were in the CL but the extra money and glamour involved would counter the effects of it. The viewing figures and lack of money involved in the Europa make it a worthless competition. I’d sooner have a real go at some domestic silverware next year.
I know there’s travelling involved if we were in the CL but the extra money and glamour involved would counter the effects of it. The viewing figures and lack of money involved in the Europa make it a worthless competition. I’d sooner have a real go at some domestic silverware next year.
Well it probably doesn’t matter what we think as it is beyond us this year. I very much doubt we can catch Liverpool and Villa now.
I would say there is only a benefit to being in the Europa if you can actually compete and at least make the semi finals. That wasn’t the case this year. We were soundly beaten by Benfica and Sporting.
I would also question the logic of chasing forth next season. How do people seriously feel we would do in the champions league?! I think it would turn out very embarrassing. Europa is actually very good place to practice against European opposition. We have clearly still not become used to playing times likes Villareal, Benfica, Sporting etc. I would rather we had another stab at Europa before CL.
I would say there is only a benefit to being in the Europa if you can actually compete and at least make the semi finals. That wasn’t the case this year. We were soundly beaten by Benfica and Sporting.
I would also question the logic of chasing forth next season. How do people seriously feel we would do in the champions league?! I think it would turn out very embarrassing. Europa is actually very good place to practice against European opposition. We have clearly still not become used to playing times likes Villareal, Benfica, Sporting etc. I would rather we had another stab at Europa before CL.
Fulham have a smaller squad than we have but they are still in Europe. We have to be in Europe next season to keep us noticed. We had six players injured at the begining of the start of the Europa League. As far as i am concerned any of the Trophies we go in for i would like to win. Everton missed out of Europe most of the 70s and 80s lets not miss out again.
Alan,Everton should give 100% to every competition.If the Europa league is a chore then why bother going to a game?We are not Wolves,we aspire to be the best and to be in the Europa league makes us better than most.Also,our squad is obviously big enough,unfortunately,it is obviously not strong enough.If the Europa league is not worth the effort then our season was dead when Birmingham put us out of the cup.We are not a big enough club to spurn anything.
" after seeing last night’s refereeing fiasco at Stamford Bridge I’m even less bothered. Inter may have been the best team but how Chelsea were’nt awarded at least 2 penalties beggars belief. The manhandling in the penalty area was disgraceful and yet was completely ignored by the ref. What’s the point of competing when you come up against that ? "
Call me a conspiracy theorist, but this isn’t the first time an English club has suffed like this in the Champions League. I wonder if it’s UEFA’s way of making sure theirs not an all English Champions League final.
Platini and the rest of Europe wouldn’t like that. Don’t remember many complaints when both the Milan clubs made to the final a couple years back...
FIFA and UEFA’s continuing dis-intrest for the good of the English game has concerned me for some time now, and i wonder if it has anything to do with the FA’s refusal to get on board with FIFA over 100 years ago. Very bitter if thats the case.
Call me a conspiracy theorist, but this isn’t the first time an English club has suffed like this in the Champions League. I wonder if it’s UEFA’s way of making sure theirs not an all English Champions League final.
Platini and the rest of Europe wouldn’t like that. Don’t remember many complaints when both the Milan clubs made to the final a couple years back...
FIFA and UEFA’s continuing dis-intrest for the good of the English game has concerned me for some time now, and i wonder if it has anything to do with the FA’s refusal to get on board with FIFA over 100 years ago. Very bitter if thats the case.
I am suprised this debate has not come up before. I actually cant believe anyone would seriously wish we did not qualify for the Europa Cup! What is going on?? Football is all about winning things not just finishing fourth or third etc, who remembers that in the years ahead? Everton are not going to win the premiership next year, and as u all know we have not won anything since the FA Cup of 1995 and there are people here advocating us giving up on a competition we have a chance of winning !! I just dont get it...
Thats the problem with the premiership these days all cup competitions are all downgraded just to chase for those coveted 4 spots. Me give me a cup in the cabinet anyday....
I dont want to finish 4th every season and win nothing,
Thats the problem with the premiership these days all cup competitions are all downgraded just to chase for those coveted 4 spots. Me give me a cup in the cabinet anyday....
I dont want to finish 4th every season and win nothing,
On balance, just I think, NO we don’t need it.
1) CL style cash cow it is not.
2) too many games for the likes of us with a smallish squad. More player burn out, injuries, who needs it.
3) As for being a ’ shop window ’ for the Club, what benefits has it brought??? I’ve seen you in the UEFA / Europa and by God I like the cut of your Jib??? no, we’ve only heard two sounds, the sound of silence and the sound of hamstrings popping in the rain.
On the positive side it gives the no hopers something to aim at.
There will be glory at the end but only for one team.
There are chances for days away to foriegn parts. Well you can if you’ve a mind orginise this your selves and to better places and times of the year than some of the destinations we drew out of the hat.
So on balance include me out.
Another bad thing is that if the rs are still in it ( and I neither know nor care ) the devils pact they signed will allow them to salvage their season and give the FSW a life line....
But on reflection, not all bad then, the longer he is there the nearer to going belly up they are
1) CL style cash cow it is not.
2) too many games for the likes of us with a smallish squad. More player burn out, injuries, who needs it.
3) As for being a ’ shop window ’ for the Club, what benefits has it brought??? I’ve seen you in the UEFA / Europa and by God I like the cut of your Jib??? no, we’ve only heard two sounds, the sound of silence and the sound of hamstrings popping in the rain.
On the positive side it gives the no hopers something to aim at.
There will be glory at the end but only for one team.
There are chances for days away to foriegn parts. Well you can if you’ve a mind orginise this your selves and to better places and times of the year than some of the destinations we drew out of the hat.
So on balance include me out.
Another bad thing is that if the rs are still in it ( and I neither know nor care ) the devils pact they signed will allow them to salvage their season and give the FSW a life line....
But on reflection, not all bad then, the longer he is there the nearer to going belly up they are
Add Your Comments
In order to post a comment to the MailBag, you need to be logged in as a registered user of the site.
Or Sign up as a ToffeeWeb Member — it's free, takes just a few minutes and will allow you to post your comments on articles and MailBag submissions across the site.
© ToffeeWeb
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
1 Posted 17/03/2010 at 02:16:29
Report abuse
We all know that football is a business. Missing Europa for a shot at the Champions league is somewhat of a gamble, or perhaps more of an investment. We would be sacrificing our earnings in Europa next year for the chance at making more money in the Champions League the year after that. But what if we don’t make the Champions league. In that case all we will have done is miss out on a year’s worth of Europa league earnings.
Would I trade a year of Europa League for a chance at the top 4? Absolutely, but unfortunately, money is the issue.