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Having watched the Manchester United – Bayern Munich game last night, I would be interested to know what other Everton supporters' opinions are to the following question:
Would you swap any of the Man U midfield players — ie Park, Scholes, Carrick or Fletcher — for either Pienaar, Arteta, Cahill or Rodwell?
Ron Haslam, Posted 31/03/2010 at 11:16:28
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I'd be tempted to take Park as a squad player. He always seems to do well (in an unobtrusive sort of way) in the big games. Fergie clearly trusts him. He also comes across as a Moyes type player.
Whether I'd put him in the team in place of one of those guys, I'm not so sure.
Whether I'd put him in the team in place of one of those guys, I'm not so sure.
Agree with Fletcher for Cahill but only because of Cahill's age; however, extend it a little and I would definitely take back Rooney for either Saha or Yak!
I'd certainly take Carrick... and wouldn't be overly concerned about losing either Cahill of Pienaar...
100% no thanks for me, wouldn't swap any of ours for theirs. Unfortunatly, I think old red nose up the road would.
I'd like Rooney and Vidic but could leave the rest of the team. I think that individually these two are the only exceptional players they have. It's the way the squad/team performs together and are managed that makes them as good as they are.
Having watched Match Of The Day all my life, I would like to know your opinions.
Would you swap any of the current cast (NOW) for any of our players?
I was thinking:
Hansen or Jagielka
Schmeichal or Howard
Lee Dixon or Baines
Linekar or Anichebe
Alan Shearer or David Moyes?
Would you swap any of the current cast (NOW) for any of our players?
I was thinking:
Hansen or Jagielka
Schmeichal or Howard
Lee Dixon or Baines
Linekar or Anichebe
Alan Shearer or David Moyes?
ps: You really hope you can make a difference to the world when there is panic and mayhem over the fact Wayne Rooney has a little ankle injury. SO WHAT?!!
No
none of em!
Murf
none of em!
Murf
While we are at it, what about Sir Alex for Davy Moyes?? or even more interesting, The Glazers for Bill.
So you wouldn't swop any of them and I am sure you wouldnt take their full backs. Their keeper isn't as good as Howard and then Valencia is very average and Berbatov is lazy. But hang on they are top of the league and may well win the Champions League but we do have better players than them! That's a relief.
IMO our star is rising while theirs is waning.
I believe MF with Fellaini back is now one of our strong points however we're still weak at the back (but so were they last night) and we need a better striker.
Would take Vidic or Rooney but the rest are not much better than what we've got despite the cost and fancy wages.
I believe MF with Fellaini back is now one of our strong points however we're still weak at the back (but so were they last night) and we need a better striker.
Would take Vidic or Rooney but the rest are not much better than what we've got despite the cost and fancy wages.
I would take Fletcher for Cahill. But I would definitely take off them Valencia or Nani, they would most certainly fix our right hand side.
Vidic is also awesome, and Evra is better than Baines.
Berbatov would be a fantasic player, despite his laziness and Rooney would waltz into our team (obvioulsy)
Vidic is also awesome, and Evra is better than Baines.
Berbatov would be a fantasic player, despite his laziness and Rooney would waltz into our team (obvioulsy)
Arteta vs. Carrick. I would certainly keep Arteta over any of them, as would anyone I expect. So let's say I would keep Arteta over Carrick.
Rodwell vs. Fletcher: Fletcher is pretty much the finished article, Rodwell is still a work in progress. Would I swap - no. Is Fletcher better right now - yes. So if I am trying to win today, I would rather have Fletcher.
Cahill vs. Scholes. Well age is the main factor here, but if they were the same age I would take Scholes every time; he was IMHO the most effective midfield player in the world in his prime.
Park vs. Pienaar: The last one is the main most difficult, but I have always thought Park underrated, in the Kevin Richardson mould, and I think he's a great team player and has recently matured to become more visible as well. I might be tempted to take Park as he seems loyal, committed, reliable, would be a good foil for Arteta, and adds a nice marketing twist in Asia ..
In response to Mick, I think the point of the article is that we have a very effective midfield (and also I think a fairly decent defence) and the real differences between us and Man U are a) squad depth and b) the strike force.
Both of which come down to money and influence and the brand visibility. As a player, you want to play for the highest paying / most visible club on the planet; but players are willing to compromise on both fronts, in order to get playing time.
I think it's a fair question in spirit but ignores Valencia, Giggs, Nani etc ....
Rodwell vs. Fletcher: Fletcher is pretty much the finished article, Rodwell is still a work in progress. Would I swap - no. Is Fletcher better right now - yes. So if I am trying to win today, I would rather have Fletcher.
Cahill vs. Scholes. Well age is the main factor here, but if they were the same age I would take Scholes every time; he was IMHO the most effective midfield player in the world in his prime.
Park vs. Pienaar: The last one is the main most difficult, but I have always thought Park underrated, in the Kevin Richardson mould, and I think he's a great team player and has recently matured to become more visible as well. I might be tempted to take Park as he seems loyal, committed, reliable, would be a good foil for Arteta, and adds a nice marketing twist in Asia ..
In response to Mick, I think the point of the article is that we have a very effective midfield (and also I think a fairly decent defence) and the real differences between us and Man U are a) squad depth and b) the strike force.
Both of which come down to money and influence and the brand visibility. As a player, you want to play for the highest paying / most visible club on the planet; but players are willing to compromise on both fronts, in order to get playing time.
I think it's a fair question in spirit but ignores Valencia, Giggs, Nani etc ....
Fletcher has come on leaps & bounds in the last 18 months. Great engine, works really hard, good vision, and awareness - still young too. Quality player. I'd have him over most of our midfielders. Carrick is also better than most of ours.
Its a bit of a weird question really — you could ask the same thing about any top European side so on that basis ill take Messi, Xavi, Iniesta and Sergio Busquets... and you can have Everton's midfield for reserve games!
Its a bit of a weird question really — you could ask the same thing about any top European side so on that basis ill take Messi, Xavi, Iniesta and Sergio Busquets... and you can have Everton's midfield for reserve games!
Interesting how many peole would swap Cahill for Fletcher. Cahill attacking midfielder, Fletcher defensive. Yet the amount of moaning that goes on (or certainly before this season) that we are to defensive minded in midfield.
Mick,
he didnt say any of them, he said "Park, Scholes, Carrick or Fletcher "
I dont think Howard is better than their keeper (or too many others for my liking) and I would find space for Vidic before Yobo or Distin. Evra would also keep Baines out and Valencia and Rooney would be in as well.
But thats not what he asked!
he didnt say any of them, he said "Park, Scholes, Carrick or Fletcher "
I dont think Howard is better than their keeper (or too many others for my liking) and I would find space for Vidic before Yobo or Distin. Evra would also keep Baines out and Valencia and Rooney would be in as well.
But thats not what he asked!
It's not really a fair question because at Everton, because the players don't have the same level of expectation or media scrutiny, players are allowed alot of time to settle in and/or are excused inconsistent performances. At Man U or Chelsea or even the Shite, this isn't the case.
Accordingly, when Fellaini or Bily take a while to settle in, Everton simply has to accept this and hope they come good. In the United midfield, you don't have this luxury. They have to deliver every week, sometimes twice, or they'll be out on their arse (and, occasionally signed by us!).
Accordingly, when Fellaini or Bily take a while to settle in, Everton simply has to accept this and hope they come good. In the United midfield, you don't have this luxury. They have to deliver every week, sometimes twice, or they'll be out on their arse (and, occasionally signed by us!).
Arguably, only carrick would get a game if they put out their first choice midfield?
I dont think thier 1st 11 is that much better than ours when both teams are fully fit, what they have got is pace right through the side and wingers who get past thier markers on both sides, something we sorely lack.
They also have something which money cant buy, BELIEF and until our manager finds some and injects it right through the squad we will never get anywhere near them.
As for the original question scholes would have walked into any team in the world at his prime and is the only one of the players mentioned I would swap for ours.
I dont think thier 1st 11 is that much better than ours when both teams are fully fit, what they have got is pace right through the side and wingers who get past thier markers on both sides, something we sorely lack.
They also have something which money cant buy, BELIEF and until our manager finds some and injects it right through the squad we will never get anywhere near them.
As for the original question scholes would have walked into any team in the world at his prime and is the only one of the players mentioned I would swap for ours.
I'd take Park what with Gosling now out for NINE MONTHS!
Re: Gosling - I'm sure leaving him on to limp around for the last 5minutes didn't help.
Totally pointless, he wasn't going to have a player mark him, everyone could see he couldn't move. Should have told Moyes to go .... himself.
It's quite odd but usually in games we are expected to win and don't we end up with an injury as an extra slap in the face. Having so many players injured this season has been nothing short of catastrophic but all credit to Moyes for keeping the ship afloat and maintaining such a high position.
I would jump at the chance to get Fletcher but would only trade Osman, none of the others.
I like Park for his pace, something that Donovan brought and it gave the team a different dimension. But as we all play swap the player, six seasons ago it would have been just about all of them, now it's getting less and less. Another interesting swap deal would be Rodwell & Gosling (pre-injury) plus cash for Rooney, I wonder who would go for that?
I think - his limitations aside - we at least have the right Neville at right back!
Your OP failed to mention the outstanding MOTM in our recent 3-1 murdering of the Mancs... One Leon Osman.
I'm sure it was just an oversight on your part, Ron.
I'm sure it was just an oversight on your part, Ron.
I don't know who I'd swap... but, considering the arrangement we seem to have with Man U, I suspect we could have any of them when Sir Alex, which he is brilliant at, realizes that they are slightly past their best. How about Scholes free in the summer?
At present, Fletcher is the pick of the bunch, but really it's a daft question, how people perform is down to the players around them and the way they are asked to play.
Our midfield is looking good; Man Utd's is not what is was, Scholes is now past it but was, at one time one of the best in the world and would easily be better than anything we've had since Bally.
I would swap Arteta for Xavi, Pienaar for Ribery, Cahill for Gerrard (even though he's a cunt), and Rodwell for £50mill.
Fletcher would be good but we are strong in his area. If he were younger, Scholes would waltz into the Everton side as a attacking wing half (like that?).
Evra definitely, Vidic maybe but he can absolutely lose it like against the RS at Old Trafford last season. Gary Neville is better than any of our RB's.
Rooney would waltz in but if we sold GP we still couldn't afford him; Carrick, yes but he's defensive and we are strong there. Park JS definitely, he has improved out of all recognition. Hargreaves if fit would get into our side too.
Well, that's just about every position except defensive midfield that they are better and even that is close. I'd say that only with Arteta do we clearly win out.
Fletcher on the right, and obviously Rooney up front.
Would also take Van der Sar as no-one knows how to command our box.
Would also take Van der Sar as no-one knows how to command our box.
Loaded question. Ron, you're not asking about talent are you? You well know ManU's mid-field talent is not better than ours.
You picked the guys with the "Grit" to ask about, didn't you? Well, talent aside, why wouldn't we want them? SAF revolves everything around his mid-field. Why else can he replace his Predators (Van Nistelroy, Ronaldo, etc) with impunity? Because he keeps the guys who get the ball to them.
The fellows Ron mentions are the reason. He didn't even mention Giggs. A guy who played for ManU when Madonna's first records came out, for God's sake!
SAF has kept Giggs and the rest of his Over-The-Hill gang because they still know how to control the mid-field.
So Ron, aren't you really asking if our talented (no question) mid-fielders are up to producing as ManU's do? That's going to be the difference next season.
Moyes has built a team where "Gee whiz, maybe we can get 4th place" is unacceptable. We're no more or less talented then the so-called Top 4. They stay up there with determination, not money.
You picked the guys with the "Grit" to ask about, didn't you? Well, talent aside, why wouldn't we want them? SAF revolves everything around his mid-field. Why else can he replace his Predators (Van Nistelroy, Ronaldo, etc) with impunity? Because he keeps the guys who get the ball to them.
The fellows Ron mentions are the reason. He didn't even mention Giggs. A guy who played for ManU when Madonna's first records came out, for God's sake!
SAF has kept Giggs and the rest of his Over-The-Hill gang because they still know how to control the mid-field.
So Ron, aren't you really asking if our talented (no question) mid-fielders are up to producing as ManU's do? That's going to be the difference next season.
Moyes has built a team where "Gee whiz, maybe we can get 4th place" is unacceptable. We're no more or less talented then the so-called Top 4. They stay up there with determination, not money.
I'd have Fletcher and Scholes, 'n' get shut of Rodwell and Osman any day of the week.
In fact I'd do the driving myself.......
In fact I'd do the driving myself.......
Fletcher is a must but Scoles is past his sell-by date. Coleman looks to be a great prospect for right back next season so forget either of the Neville's.
Park is a tireless worker but needs to think more... otherwise he would be in the team starting every week. Valencia is a great right-sided midfielder who I would like.
@ Andy Callan
What? Why get rid of Rodwell for any of the aforementioned Utd players? He has far too much potential to be got rid of...
What? Why get rid of Rodwell for any of the aforementioned Utd players? He has far too much potential to be got rid of...
How come Man U are top if our players are better? In fact, looking at the league there are 7 teams who are better than us. In theory, we should swap all of our team and manager for any of those above because they're all better than us! (Obviously we shouldn't).
It's often aimed at Liverpool fans that they're delusional but some Everton fans have really got carried away this season about how good we actually are. This has been a very disappointing season after last year's top 5 finish and cup final appearance. It's another potless season for Moyes, another embarrassing European campaign and we've still only avoided playing hoofball in about 7 or 8 games. But some supporters believe this is our best team since the 1980s. I don't understand the logic.
It's often aimed at Liverpool fans that they're delusional but some Everton fans have really got carried away this season about how good we actually are. This has been a very disappointing season after last year's top 5 finish and cup final appearance. It's another potless season for Moyes, another embarrassing European campaign and we've still only avoided playing hoofball in about 7 or 8 games. But some supporters believe this is our best team since the 1980s. I don't understand the logic.
I think the big question is, how many of our midfield would get a regular game in the current United squad?
I wouldn't swap Fellaini or Rodwell for anyone except Messi, but I don't think either of them would get a regular game in United's midfield.... maybe Fellaini could have a shout at defensive mid. Arteta and Pienaar would just about make the bench, Cahill and Rodwell would be squad players.
I wouldn't swap Fellaini or Rodwell for anyone except Messi, but I don't think either of them would get a regular game in United's midfield.... maybe Fellaini could have a shout at defensive mid. Arteta and Pienaar would just about make the bench, Cahill and Rodwell would be squad players.
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1 Posted 31/03/2010 at 12:45:34
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Don't get me wrong though — I love Tim Cahill for his dedication and his love of our club but he ain't the best of players in midfield.