Third Team Lucky?

Fast forward 12 months, out goes Coleman, Rodwell, Bily & Cahill from that starting eleven... in comes Naismith, Gibson, Pienaar & Jelvic. We tear Villa apart in their own back yard. We look so much more balanced, so much more threatening going forward, so much more entertaining to watch!

I was one of Moyes' biggest critics this time last year, but credit where it is due, he has done some fantastic transfer activity recently. Replaced low impact players such as Bily / Rodwell / post 2010 Cahill with high impact players like Pienaar Gibson and Jelavic.

Even his harshest critics would struggle to argue against the fact that we have made huge strides forward since January (see recent article from Tony Marsh as a great example of the tide turning).

This "Third Team" certainly looks better than anything else we've seen in the last decade!

I am not sure we have the same squad depth as the Second Team. A couple more experienced lads in a defensive midfield role would make me happy on this score.

I would contest only one of your points -- Coleman will never be a prominent part of this team. He lacks the quality and will be quickly bypassed by someone like Mirellas.

And I would point out a massive oversight -- the one player who provided constancy through all three of your Moyes teams, Tim Howard. In my book, his ability to pull off the miracle save at the key moment was the difference in many of the Second Team's wins over superior sides in those transitional periods. When all else failed, Howard and Cahill were consistently heroic.

Finally, much as I hope that Jelavic remains an Everton mainstay, I must point out that at age 27 he is already playing for his fifth club. It's hard for me to imagine that he will settle down in Goodison until retirement with so many Champions League teams craving proven goalscorers.

We had a lot of hope for that 2nd team in its prime... but it just never happened, often probably because of timing of injuries breaking any momentum. I really hope we have some luck in this regard.

I don't buy into this 10 years in the making thing (I saw it on a villa forum the other day) - because it undermines how good some of those other teams were.. or rather should have been. This really is 3rd team lucky for Moyes. yeah... good name for your article too!

Like Mike (932) I doubt Coleman will be a central figure in "the third team" and I'm hoping that Barkely has a big role to play in the next few years. I'm neither IMWT or one of the MOB, but credit where it's due here. Moyes has done damn well in managing the transition from one team to another, remaining competitive most of the time. It's a skill in itself, keeping the squad fresh while maintaining stability, allowing the kind of understanding that comes with playing regularly together but not letting it get terminally stale and predictable.

the 2nd team was already being shaped in 2005...

Lescotts cash didnt play a major role in shaping our side... it really only brought in Distin as a like for like swap and Johnny who has been given one season in his rightful position with 10m wasted.. but the sale of Bily has help fund this 3rd instalment. Lescott was an integral part of the 2nd team.. so he didnt shape it. I would say the time between his departure and now is the time of flux in the side where it was "preparing" for the transition that has now happened in personnel.

Andre refers to this as no coherent squad policy... spot on.

Martyn (1st), Hibbert (3rd), Jagielka (2nd), Lescott (2nd), Baines (3rd), Arteta (2nd), Gibson (3rd), Cahill (1st) Fellaini (3rd), Pienaar (3rd), Jelavic (3rd)

6 from the 3rd tem, 3 from the 2nd and 2 from the 1st.

I thought he was bought as a centre half and put in the middle because our centre halves were doing alright and we know Moyes doesn't like changing a winning team. To be fair, Lescott earned an England call up playing left back and was scoring goals, so it is easy to see why he didn't put Baines in.

Maybe the intelligent Weir has got into Moyes's head... maybe it's the players, perhaps the Spurs snub has been a wake-up call.

But I know this: the fabled "best squad" was equal to this one, maybe better, but long term the eternal "nicking it" game erodes the spirit of players and fans alike.

We may do no better than previous seasons but give me post Swansea of last season with real football, Goodison roaring and hope every time.

Though the change from the "second team" to the third has been almost revolutionary in speed; when you think of the first team squad that we had say, two years ago. The Yak, Saha, Cahill, Arteta, Billy, Beckford, Yobo, Vaughan, Rodwell all gone, with only our back four and GK being stable in terms of playing personnel. Credit has to go to Moyes though – of those nine names, the only sale that I was sad to see was Arteta – the sale of Cahill was sad more for sentimental reasons; but his time was due. The others were shipped out, for the most part due to form/injury.

And yet our first team now is as strong as it probably ever has been in the Moyes era. As Andre has pointed out, for the first time in a long while it feels like we can go toe to toe with the so-called big boys. If we can avoid the slip-ups against the Wigans, QPRs, and Burnleys of this world who have embarrassed us in the past couple of years; there isn't really any reason why 4th or 5th in the league shouldn't be realistic, a bit of luck on the injury front permitting.

Too many people have a go at Hibbert because he is not great going forward, but for a fullback the most important thing is the defensive side – if you are not good defensively you won't get in the team at fullback!

I know he has some detractors claiming him to be too negative at times, and to be fair there have been periods were this has been true. But I think in the main he has played attractive football for the majority of his tenure. Lets not forget when Pienaar returned other than the Semi-Final were Pienaar couldnt play those last 10/12 games Everton played some excellent football. So its not just this season that Moyes has played open attacking football, but lets not forget you need to have the players to play that way.

I dread the day when Moyes leaves Everton because he will be a hard act to follow, I don't think I am putting to strongly to say his boots will be as hard to fill as Fergusons will be at Utd when he finishes.

Ha-ha! No need for that kind of sucking up, Niki lad - you're a dead cert for the starting XI anyway!

We have the players now for a damn good first XI after a long-overdue clear-out of a lot of deadwood and wise reinvestment of the the money, so injuries aside, it will be interesting (and hopefully enjoyable) to see what they can achieve over the next 10 league games or so, when we don't play any of the top sides – and more importantly will be made favourites. A certain side come to GP in October and if we're all fit and suspension free, am guessing the Blues masses will be chomping at the bit to stuck in.

On paper, I would argue that this is the best, if not equal best of any first XI that Moyes has put together in his 10 years (on paper). There is a nice balance to the side which we have not had for a long time, with a lot fewer square pegs in round holes – a huge criticism of the manager over the years.

I am enjoying it at the moment but trying not to get carried away as it's only been 2 games and we've seen plenty of false dawns before. There are also still 3 days left in the transfer window and we will not be able to resist a last-minute massive (panic) bid from e.g. Citeh. As a club, we're still in a poor financial position so medium to long term, we're still swimming up a certain creek).

Still, let's kick on with a comfortable with against the Orient and result against West Brom to ease us nicely into the international break. (Moyes: take note of the Stoke and Fulham results – don't play the kids/reserves.)

COYB

A continued decent run where we retain the lead when we get it (and not let teams back in as we did last season turning wins into draws) should see us contending for 6th.

If we are still well placed at Christmas we can hopefully push on.

I also worry about the centre of midfield - with Fellaini pushed on – an axis of Neville and Gibson looks far to technically limited to me. My hope for this season is that Barkely emerges as a genuine contender for a centre mid slot and he becomes the playmaker we really need to push us further towards the next level.

But credit to Moyes for moving us on so far from the dark days of the New Year, a remarkable turn around.

I'd probably put a sub-text to it which you could call “A Tale of Three Midfielders”…..

If you look over Moyes tenure and judge 2004-2005 as his best season, that was the year that Graveson and Carsley were playing out of their skins in the middle of the park. Graveson went on to Real Madrid in Jan 2005 and Carsley remained a rock between the midfield and defence to help carry us up to 4th. Carsley missed two league games that season, one we lost, the other we drew and he also chipped in with 4 goals.

Carsley then suffered injury and was sold and we’ve never really replaced him. The three players who have arguably could fit into that role are Neville, Fellaini and Heitinger but for various reasons haven’t managed it and it could be argued the team have floundered a bit as a result and not kicked on.

Step up Darren Gibson. Gibson has now played 13 league games for us and never been on the losing side, you can add another 16 to that with the same outcome in his final games for Man United. That’s 29 consecutive league games now when he’s not been on the losing side.

Gibson has helped shield the defence and allowed Fellaini and Pienaar the freedom to show what they’re really best at - and all of a sudden everyone is raising their game. I also think he’s a bit of a mix of Carsley and Tommy so Moyes could've bought the best of the lot to date - for the princely sum of £500k.

It's a funny old game....

Good stuff - though you would think we were all getting carried away with things, I mean we've only had two straight wins.

However, if you went to Villa park you would of seen a total first half destruction of an extremely poor Villa side. It was beautiful football being played by Everton with Villa running around trying to get the ball back. Whether this is Moyes second, third or fourth team - you are left wondering what is this team capable of.

If we can hang onto the prime players it looks like we will soon find out - for me though, Moyes has definately made some changes to his game plan. Maybe it's the last year of his contract, maybe he wants to have a go, take a bow and prove you don't need millions to win something.

Best manager and supporters, great team and city, these are all subjective and emotional reasons and good investors don't invest emotionally. They judge by facts, such as; the club makes no money; is in debt to the tune of £40m+; is on 'cash terms only' with every financial institute in the country; and has had to sell off (a rapidly diminishing supply of) assets to balance the books each year. The board's only exit strategy seems to revolve around selling up to some chump who'd be keen to inherit all of that mess. If they have any plan whatsoever on how to turn this club around, I've not heard it. Any investor should be frightened to death of leaving their money with them unless they never care about seeing it again.

With the lack of commercial direction evident from the boardroom, it would seem the only way forward then is on the pitch. I think it would take a few seasons of getting to the later stages of the CL to generate enough revenue to make this club attractive to investors/buyers. Qualifying one season then failing to get out the blocks (bent refs or not) adds nothing to the club's bottom line. But regular CL qualification also has its cost. Even £300m is no guarantee of getting a club back in CL contention, as our loveable neighbours have demonstrated. One difference though, as Andre's article highlights, David Moyes can build a worthy team from five loaves and two fish. How will this 3rd gen team fare? Will they be the ones to finally bring in the Sky TV riches from regular Euro exposure? Too early to tell. Last December I thought we were headed for a Mike Walker-esque finish but we ended up 7th, ahead of the noisy neighbours. So for now I'll just say that I think we won't qualify anywhere near the CL spots and hope the uncanny Scot proves me wrong yet again!

Don't agree with ya.

City and Chelsea have had millions spent on them and I seriously don't think their investors are looking at what they will get back.

These guys are so rich it's like
me or you losing a tennor in the bookies.

I would love a decent midfield partner for Gibson (Huddlestone on loan, if he's fit?), plus potentially another pacy understudy for Jelavic, but otherwise I will be very happy with what we've got going into September.

Be interesting to see where Barkley fits in in the future, I get the impression that whenever he's come on he's almost tried too hard to impress. Maybe a loan at a Championship club will sort out that.

Roll on Saturday!!

The first team was built on the sale of Rooney, the 2nd on the sudden apparition of Planet Hollywood investment, the 3rd is being built on the sale of Jack. Underpinning it all though is a manager who makes the pound go so much further.