A tough and dogged fight for a point

I'd get Naismith off. Again he's been a none entity. I'd go for Oveido as his replacement moving Peinaar across to the right. We are trying to go down the left but they're marking us out. Moving Peinaar to the right might give him more space and time to link up with Coleman.

I'd also bring Hitz on for Neville based on his ability to pass forwards which Phil hasn't so far this game. Also Hitz can hit it from anywhere, useful in a tight game like this.

I'd obviously love to see Mirallas on but wouldn't Wang to rush him.

If it's nil nil with 5 mins to go, I'd bring on Anichebe. Despite his recent improvement I don't rate him, but in a scrappy game he might be useful bulldozing through their defence.

Pienaar again having a stinker, daft flicks that are not coming off and Fellaini unable to get into the game.

Pienaar continuing to do nothing too.

Not a great performance, first half particularly. Attitude at least was better in the second half, and substitutions were positive. So many potential counter attacks foundering on just a basic inability to quickly control a loose ball.

Will take a point in the circumstance. Saints did to us what they did to Arsenal...but if we want fourth, we have to be winning in matches like these.

The midfield hardly covered itself in glory tonight...Naismith was poor, but then he is limited, but I was most disappointed with Pienaar's performance.

On the plus side, we are three points off fourth, and Mirallas is back. Really need to add in January though...will be criminal not to. We also have to win our next two against WBA and Villa.

Neville and Jags with long ball after long ball...completely aimless.

Naismith was crap first half and yet probably our best player. Barkley, Oviedo, Kennedy...surely these guys deserve a chance.

What a horrific game of football.

Its so frustrating being an Evertonian

Away from home you have to have all guns blazing and we were extremely fortunate to go home with a point. Playing Neville in Midfield is also a no no, whilst Felliani should be put back into the middle of the park with Anichebe and or Jelavic up front.

Teams have managed to suss out that we can be bullied in the middle of the pitch and we only threaten down one side of the pitch, hopefully, the return of Mirallas might make a difference, but I fear that by the time he gets his match fitness back we will be out of the running for a European spot, never mind the elusive CL.

In fact if I were Moyes I would ask Jelavic if he really wants to stay at the club, because something is bothering the lad and he needs to ship him out if his heart isn't in it.

Why didn't Jele actually look at the ball when Vic passed it to him? His head was up like he was at Meerkat Manor!!!!

Ozzie and Nuts were useless and Felly was rampaging around trying to get himself booked but not actually doding much.

Naismith is rubbish and always will be. At least the others can get their form back, but alas no matter how many chances Moyes gives him, he will never be good enough for a challenge to be anywhere near the top 4.

Nice to see Kev back, but he's clearly nowhere near match fit.

Good job Howard made a few saves.

However, I thought Anichebe did well when he come on, and good to see Mirallas back, so not all doom and gloom.

I suppose.....

Totally thrilled that we got a point away from,home from the mighty Southampton - says it all really!!!!

If we have first-half attitude at Bolton on Saturday our season might be over before the transfer window closes.

I was always surprised Baines and Pienaar were not shut down before these last two games, as 90% of our chances are created through these two down the left.

We had a full 8 days off, while they played a tough game on Wednesday. I fear for the second half of the season, we have some very tough games away from home.

No excuses about a small squad please, we are not in Europe and only in one cup.

Pienaar did not seem interested in getting forward, wanting to move into the centre instead of playing to his strengths.

Osman was not much better as Pienaar kept getting in his way

Naismith I hope can do much better, does not run with the ball, if he did we would do better.

Howard had a really good game

Best player on the pitch..... Luke Shaw, played really well. Shame he wasn't on our side

Overall, could do better, a lot better

Saying that, on match day, of course, I love to beat them, and hate to lose to them more than what I am for most other teams. You may be right that, as things look we may soon need to concern ourselves with Liverpool, but for now, it's Arsenal and Spurs who we keep our eyes on.

Naismith and Osman should have been hauled off at half-time, Naismith for being utterly crap as per usual and Osman for having a nightmare, dilly-dallying on the ball and losing possession too many times.

Anichebe looked sharp. What is going on with Moyes –how can he continue to pick Naismith over others in the squad? It's infuriating and it is holding us back.

Moyes Out!!!!

The main problem for me was that we went high ball far too often against a physical team and just gave it straight back to them.. Same as last week.

Changes were made on the 65-minute mark as per usual, Oviedo is bright and quick and quick thinking, Naismith is not. Drawing too many games, need to start making draws into wins.

I thought Kev and Vic looked a step above when they came on, Marouane and Leighton did the best they could with the woeful support they had, and the defense and Tim should be commended at least for keeping a clean sheet when their colleagues did not give them the cushion needed in midfield and the outlets to play some football.

One moment summed up the performance for me; Coleman forayed forward at one point in the 2nd half and had 3 red shirts around him quickly with NO support from a blue shirt. To me that said Moyes went for a point.

Does this man actually want CL football next season, I mean does he really? Is he thinking that we would never have the squad to make it work, and our league form would plummet à la Newcastle? I wonder.

I thought we really missed Gibson in the middle, and were really weak on the right hand side where I believe our number 14 played (debatable). The ball didn't stick up front, and we were poor on the left with Baines and Pienaar. Harold – Jelavic missed a sitter from the left, so perhaps you are right.

You can usually get away with one or two average performers, but we had an entire team. Victor did well when he came on, and Howard kept us in the match. I thought Fellaini was poor, particularly in midfield. Whilst the rest were pretty much dreadful. I don't really understand what Naismith was offering and why Oviedo didn't come on for at least the last ten. It was a great advert for the need to strengthen, up top, centre midfield wide right and reserve right back.

Southampton deserved more. A great advert to get us on the telly more, not, as the sky curse strikes again.

The good news is that Mirallas is back and... nope, that's it.

Drew

Naismith certainly wasn't the worst player on the pitch tonight. What he has had though is an awful lot of game time and not shown an ounce of ability in all that time. I've slagged his form from the start but its now obvious that it wasn't form, he really is that bad. If I was Oviedo I would be straight into Moyes office in the morning to ask for a transfer before the window shuts. How he must feel watching other players play utter shite and never get his chance.

One question? Why do all our players who get injured come back from injury then get injured almost straight away what is going on there?

On another point the reason people go on about Liverpool is because they are our rivals and we've had to suffer in their shadow for so long it's boss being on top of them and being the top team in the city and the thought them going on a run and snatching that fourth spot (what we dream of getting) makes me sick! If Luis Suarez crossed a zebra crossing in front of me!! "My foot slipped officer".

Southampton were made to look much better than they are especially first half. It's no good blaming DM because he has no alternatives to what's on the pitch.

Some players look jaded especially Osman who lost the ball in dangerous places through dwelling on it. We badly need reinforcements!!

There was no cohesion, no link up, and as previously stated we were second best to every ball especially in midfield. But on the plus side, as teams now seem to double up against Pienaar and Baines, with Mirallas coming back and hopefully Seamus not being seriously injured, then that may open some space for a promising right side,

Hopefully KM stays fit, and allows us to take advantage of people putting two men on MF.

The more I reflect on tonight's game the more I am convinced we went for a point. OK we should have scored and we were on top for 15 mins, but our lines were deep all game and Soton were able to run into gaps and spaces all night. Fortunately they lacked any guile up front, and were as shite as us in front of goal.

Neville will still be there with a zimmer frame. Osman's form has taken a massive dip. He just can't cut it in midfield.

Embarrassing performance. Has Moyes lost the plot, or does he just know he's going?

I thought Fellaini was poor by his own standards, Osman was poor and the defenders, while they defended quite well, gave the ball away far too often.

I'm fed up with seeing the ball needlessly cleared when we are under no pressure (Neville tonight) and Jag's going high over the top because he thinks he's Beckham.

I thought Moyes's tactics were positive and he made the correct moves but he needs to know when to play through midfield instead of bypassing it... It may work against the better teams but against Southampton it just brings us down to their level.

We could have brought in 2-3 decent players for that money, don't tell me there is one Swansea player on more than £30k per week. We could have bigger squad, but these are the choices Moyes has made, no-one else.

Fellaini should have buried those chances but he's a fans favourite so we can't say anything against him now can we? Well said, Phil Sammon, Baines and Pienaar not up to it today but not getting the stick Naismith is getting.

What, no Howard is a dodgy shaky keeper who's gonna cost us this season. Oh yes, I forgot, he kept us in it in the first half! Osman ? Neville ? Vic? their time will come i'm sure with some of the idiots on these pages.

Just back to Naismith, who else remembers Peter Reids first few games for us 82-83? He stunk the place out! Dave Watsons season in 87? "Sort it out, Kendall... get Mountfield back instead of this imposter!!!"; Martin Keown being laughed off the park against Woking (playing as a forward!); Lee Carsley took three... yes THREE seasons to fit in before becoming "Super Lee" (how are we going to replace him?). Everton heroes months and years later!

Some players take time to settle but still put a shift in while the "Superstars" get away with going missing when it matters. Naismith wasn't so "Shit" when he scored against the Shite was he?? It's not like he's had a career threatening injury or anything? Just think what we could've done with the millions we spent on his transfer fee....

Three defeats in 32 league games... its just like the Mike Walker/ Walter Smith days!

Give the team a break, best season for years. Here's hoping Jelly and Naismith find form soon. We dodged a bullet today but still came away from home with a point. 7 points from the last 3 away games... where did it all go wrong?

I thought Fellaini was poor, and if someone watched that and wanted him for their midfield they would be put off. Yes he can tackle, shoot and pass. But it was back to the old days, with a really weak passing range in the middle, supported by a below par Osman and frankly shocking Neville. Before we go on about that young belgian lad, he isn't the answer. We need someone else to move the ball quicker, as we have a distinct lack of pace in our side. Gibson makes us look quicker with his passing range.

Apart from Howard, Jags, Distin & Coleman, everyone was crap 1st half.

Jelavic had no service whatsoever. It's a double edged sword though, as he doesn't get involved with the build-up play. I still can't believe he missed that chance though, he needs taking out of the firing line. His confidence is shot.

If Pienaar doesn't play well, we don't play well.

We are going to struggle to finish 4th. I can't see where the goals are going to come from. And we draw too many games.

Staying positive, we got a clean sheet, only our 4th of the season I believe.

Anichebe is an asset for us. He has really come on in the last year or so.

Also, Mirallas is back. If we can get a run out of him and Gibson, the team is improved massively.

Anichebe 7
Mirallas 6

Moyes's problem all through his reign is that he's too loyal to under-achieving players, Surely now Jelavic has to be benched – that miss tonight summed his season up. Anichebe has got to be given a run, he was the only bright spark on a poor night.

And how the fuck anyone can call Howard is beyond me – he kept us in it in the first half. Teams are starting to suss us out, box Baines and the disappointing Pienaar off and you nullify the threat. Thank god Mirallas is back because he'll give us a different option.

Moyes is obsessed with getting the awful Naismith involved, he's gone from bad to worse and it's now getting embarrassing seeing him on the pitch One things for sure: we need players because our squad is just not good enough – whether we get them is a different matter. I won't hold my breath...

We haven't, it has been creeping in over the last month or so, with decent results and the odd nice bit of play in attack apparently masking the receding effectiveness of our central midfield. People ask why should our players be tired, but I ask why people expect the severely under-paced, under-powered and aging duo of Osman and Neville to be able to dominate the opposition midfield week-in and week-out. Against teams that haven't pressed or have preferred to go down the flanks we are okay, but teams that go through the middle in numbers will show our limitations for the rest of the season unless some reinforcements are found and used.

Colin (#510) - agree with that totally. We need a right-side threat and an athletic enforcer operating in central midfield with (or alongside someone with) vision and a good range of passing. It is not as if our left-hand threat has been a secret for the first part of the season, just that we have been better able to liberate them by providing suitable distractions for the opposition to worry about in other parts of the pitch.

Steven (#514) - he could watch our last few games and talk to a few people at Southampton, I would think.

Moyes is doing what he always does but now it's his time for a sticky period. We've all seen this before over the past 10 years of the Moyes reign and you will no doubt see it again.

Knock, knock...
Who's there?
Abramovich....
Ha ha ha

Hopefully Mirallas coming back will give us more options as the Baines-Pineaar axis has been sussed-out now.

Harold (#539) - Jelavic's particular weakness appears to be when he is stationary, waiting for a ball coming in at ninety degrees to the goal. Twice now those types of crosses have ended up hitting his standing leg. Gave you a mention on the live forum when it happened tonight.

The left hand side was crying out for something different. I watched the game with a friend who's a Saints fan and he said the same thing. Every time I've seen him Oviedo has looked sparky, tenacious, quick and with a good eye for a cross. If you're struggling to break a side down, use the three subs available to you for heaven's sake!! Oviedo should have been brought on to add some impetus to the left hand side and Pienaar hauled off and told to get his head in the right place - he looked like he was mentally at the AFCON tonight.

Overall, after that first half a point is ok, but worrying that the goals could be drying up. Anichebe and Mirallas up front for a couple of games now, although sadly I guess that means Naismith continuing wide right.

I wish they'd just close the transfer window now so we could stop dreaming and resign ourselves to battling for Europe till the end of the season with what we have...

Jim Knightly (432) — "Will take a point in the circumstance. Saints did to us what they did to Arsenal... On the plus side, we are three points off fourth"

Steven Telford (523) — "Well, every team has their off-days"

How many more times am I gonna read someone saying well we will take a point after that; they parked the bus; they beat Chelsea the other day; they physically intimidated us; we're only so many points off 4th; how many games we lost this calendar year, eh? – going all the way back to Stoke and before? This is all so weak and pure pieces of avoidance and in some cases, not all, an almost pathological inability to rap the gaffer over his knuckles. How much longer will this apologetic chorus drag on?

Erm, "every team has their off-days". Well, for starters, you put it in the plural not singular and that sort of gets to my point. 23 games/11 draws. How many more draws will you put up with. A draw is fuzzy coz one shower can say "Calm down, stop knee-jerking jerk we got a point soft lad", and another shower can say "More points dropped etc. etc ".

23 games/11 draws: that's some inspired and motivated gaffer and skipper. We are hanging around the Euro berths not necessarily because of our own efforts; but because others around us are so inconsistent, most notably Arse. If we do not step up our act – and, to be fair to Jim (Knightly) he writes "if we want fourth, we have to be winning in matches like these" – we will sooner or later start to slip down the table, that surely is inevitable if we continue with displays like this. Draws need to be converted into wins. At some point this "Well we got a draw and we're only 5... hang on, 6.... hang on, 7... oh, now it's 8 points off" will start to sound weary and with each passing draw a little eye rolling or "why are you accepting this in that limp and lame manner?

We are singling out players and that's fair enough: for what it's worth: Howard (8), Coleman (7), Jagielka (4), Distin (4), Osman (2), Naismith (2), Pienaar (2), Neville (1), Felli (5), Jelavic (2), Mirallas (5), Anichebe (8).

Moyes picked that team from what he had: he picked Naysmith; he set the formation up; drew up tactics; reacted or did not react to the game as it unfolded; made for him to be fair an early though forced sub. He also takes a share of the blame for tonight's horror show. Praise when due; criticism when due... But Moyes deserves to be closely examined after that display along with the mainly mediocrities he selected to play.

I for one cannot pass off tonight as oh (another) off-day or nice one an away draw or home draw in difficult circumstances. When one or more teams around us go on a run, we will be found wanting, though I'm crossing all fingers that it's us who does it (where has our famed second half of the season rush gone?).

I don't feel particularly cheers and upbeat and bright but I'm not in the doom and gloom basement by any means. A new face or two would bring a little ray of sunshine; keeping key players would bring more sun. But after that total shite, skies are more grey than blue.

Mirallas will hopefully change that, but as you said this has not just happened over-night it has been coming on for a while. We are shown to be ordinary when we need to be stepping up a gear, admittedly the second half was a better showing but the first half was very poor. I love Peanuts to bits but I do wonder what he'd do if Baines wasn't in the team.

We now seem to have reverted back to our bad old ways of being hard to beat but not looking like we will win the game either, a recipe for draws if ever there was one.

I've seen it all season. When teams up the tempo and pressure us we just cannot go with them. It's why we've squandered so many fucken leads this season. When teams press us and chase the game we go to fucken bits, across the board. From Chelsea to Reading it's the same story.
We cannot play with a lead, and look much better when we're chasing the game. When teams sit deep, and give us time on the ball, we look good and actually have enough creativity to break down defences.

With teams in the lower half fighting for their lives, their really wont be any bankers to come. Plus we've got to visit Old Trafford, the Emirates, White Hart Lane, the tinmine and the Bridge....fuck, CL is a tall order.

You say: "It's Moyes and his tactics that cause these results — nothing else."

Well, ok........ but by the same logic, don't forget to give him all the credit when things go well.

Neville awful, Naismith rubbish and Jelavic was his normal ineffective self. But Osman had a nightmare – should have been taken off at half-time. Coleman gets injured start of second half and Anichebe came on. He was better than the rest. He put over a perfect cross to Jelavic – all he had to do was tap it in – but true to form, completely mis-kicked it and the chance went begging. The penny finally dropped with Moyes. HE SUBBED JELAVIC on 66 mins. 15 games too late! Had many chances does he give that player? Get shut of him!
Mirallas came on for him - and added some badly needed action.
Overall one to forget.

At best, mid-table beckons, with the RS overtaking us soon. I blame Moyes for his team selection and pathetic use of the bench. He's had ample opportunity to use Vellios, Oviendo, Hitzelburger but no - 5 minutes between the lot of them. Vellios doesn't even make the bench. Moyes is afraid to drop his favourites. Then he sends Barkley to Leeds! I cannot understand his thinking or his tactics.

He's lost the plot. Why does he sign players and then doesn't use them??? I'm afraid we're going nowhere with Moyes. We had a squad that could have finished in the top 4 - but drawing 11 games! We have to go away to Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs and RS.

Bye Bye Blues

I dare say, there seemed even to be a motivational issue with us today.

Just a small thing you left out: 'And one key player comes back... And one key player promptly takes his place on the treatment table.'

Everton's guardian angel must be Hal Roach.

The team tonite displayed all the old flaws of many a Moyes side from the past. Our best XI for years play no better than the nightmare relegation outfits from the Moyes era.

Aye, and it’s also Moyes’s FAULT that we are 5th.
And it’s his FAULT that we took 3 points of Spurs and Man Utd.
And it’s his FAULT that we took points off Man City and Arsenal.

Indeed he has a lot to answer for, I don’t know how we stick him.

We give Moyes credit for keeping us in the Premier League – but we want trophies, we want CL – or we'll never progress. Moyes can only take us so far. He's had over 10 years and we've won nothing.

Yes, just like last time, he was stationary and this was due to the ball being played straight at him instead of a few feet further forward where he allows it to run across his body before stabbing it home with his right foot. Something we have seen him do on numerous occasions.

Even so, the lad is a shadow of his former self. His legs look heavy and his once effervescent spirit has completely drained away. A sorry sight indeed.

Yes Patrick. One right wing cross all night.It's not good enough. Our entire right wing nullified by a 17-year-old fullback who would not even get on our bench. It difficult to imagine DM coming up with a radical solution but if Coleman is injured he may have to.

That post of yours was a pitch perfect example of the crap we have to put up with from peeps who can't see beyond their Moyes lens and, sadly, slump into by now hollow platitudes of why we ought to be singing psalms and rattling tambourines rather than having the absolute audacity and breathtaking arrogance and high horsemanship to actually question Moyes and his tactics from time to time, when it is necessary, deserved and realisitic to do so.

I mean Moyes has a history with useless Jock players – look at McFadden coming back last season and Davey Weir back on the books again too. Both of them absolutely no use at all to Everton and both drains on the finances which we are being constantly told are tight – and both Jocks.

David Moyes: Everton's manager for all seasons – well for HALF a season anyway.

Fellaini was, again, our best player.

Midfield was poor, Piennar had a bad game (he's had a few lately) Osman was his usual self, caught in possession time and ime again, and blondie Naismith at times couldn't even get a kick.

Mirallas is bound to be off the pace at first, but he looks like he can play, and big Vic looked pretty dangerous to me also.

Which brings me nicely to my pet subject. I never played centre half in my old footy days, but I reckon I could play centre half NOW as long as I could play every week against Jelavic. I'm poor in the air, so is he, I'm a bit slow, so is he, and he can't control the ball .... but I can. I got in trouble on TW a while back calling Jelly a carthorse.

Haven't see anything this season to change my mind. Gawd I hope I'm wrong.

Anyway with no midfield (Felli excluded) and no CF, we have to be happy with a point.

I have read some reactionary nonsense in these comments but this is the most absurd of the lot. Osman didn't have a great game last night but otherwise he's been superb for us this season. A view held by not just the vast majority of Evertonians but many informed observers outside of the club too. For shame.

Osman splits Blues more than most of our squad. He was a pile of shit today and his form has dipped worryingly over the last month or so with one exception. Over the last decade he has blown hot and cold.

I love him for his loyalty and professionalism but he all too often drives me crazy on the pitch. But it's nice that you speak up on behalf of all of us. Osman for me is an enigma but I believe deep down that he is not a top notch player wide, inside, or behind #9.

For me, Osman and Neville sum up why we will be for a little while to come and for a while now the nearly men, perennial close also-rans, the good old non Sky-four/five/six Best of the Rest.

Quick question: does anyone think that Moyes watched replays of our games, or just make his judgments based on what he sees from ground level? I guarantee that the starting line-up for the next game or two will be the same as last nights, unless he has now dropped Jelavic. Neville and Naismith are there to stay.

What I don't understand is why Moyes signs players he has no intention of using? He didn't have to extend Hitzlsperger's contract, but he did. Now, we have Neville in the middle absolutely dragging everyone down to his level while he could have a youngster on the bench instead of a 30-year-old who could actually contribute.

Reactionary calls for Vic to start are just that. He only performs to his best when he's brought on - a starting spot doesn't seem to agree with him, and coming from a rugby background I appreciate that.

Back to Neville: he must know how bad he has become. What self-respecting person would continue past the general age of retirement when they quite obviously can't keep up with the game?

Firstly, I thought the Saints players were great on the night especially first half. They were ultra-professional and didn't fold, mope or cave as some, myself included, had hoped.

However, we were so flat it was untrue. That’s the worrying thing for me. I can handle a bad performance, it does happen. But the players look physically and mentally very flat and this is worrying. The same group of players are going to have to raise themselves for the cup and they are going to have to find some reserves of inspiration from somewhere.

With limited options and no cash to lay out on a quick fix, how do we freshen it?

The return of Mirallas is well timed as we need some variation to the play and opens up the possibility of playing him wide or off the striker and dropping Fella back in mid.

Anichibe has been knocking on the door for a while now and maybe he should get the gig against Bolton. Jelavic has needed a break for a while. He is definitely suffering for confidence, but playing lone striker week in week out takes its toll and it’s not like he doesn’t graft. Moyes does ask a lot and it’s impossible to keep your sharpness and play that role week in week out and not dip without rotation. Its massively demanding physically and, as we are seeing, mentally.

Anichibe has been back a whole now. He's started some games, had others off the bench and has, I presume, been training regularly. He looks lean and in great nick and maybe for the first time in years after a plague of injuries he is ready for a run of games.

Oviedo has had an opportunity to get his head around things. He looks to have a bit about him, give him a bit more game time, even off the bench, left or right. It’s an option we are going to have to consider using; some players like Piennar are looking very flat indeed and could do with a little break.

We don’t have many options and I can fully understand Moyes sticking with his big players. But we need some rotation, variation and a bit of flexibility in the next few weeks as some players appear to be hitting the wall mentally and physically.

I can sort of understand Naismith's inclusion, as he constantly wins headers from Howard's punts upfield.....it's just on the floor where he has problems; however we know that once Mirallas is fully fit, Naismith will be back on the bench again.

It will be interesting to see what Moyes does when both Coleman and Gibson are fit together....if it ever happens.... will he bench Neville?

We need to offer an alternative. Problem is we have no money for even a loan signing.

Time to sell Fellaini? I would if Moyes was given the money to sign a wide right attack-minded quick player, box-to-box midfielder and a right back.

But a few new faces in the team might help plus... why play Naismith over Vellios?

Absolutely gutted for Jelly. He looked completely out of it. No off the ball running, couldn't control the ball and didn't get anywhere a shot off on goal. The glimmer was that for his fluffed chance he showed a glimpse of quality - held his run then broke the offside trap. This boy is a more than capable goal getter but Moyes must show top notch man management skills and give him a huge dose of self belief and soon.

There is an unsettling trend developing. Teams are finding it easier to defend against us. Drop deep, let us have the ball, and Jags and Distin will punt it long, and with Jelly's confidence shot, we won't hold up the ball, especially if Felli is man marked. Vic has been in better this season, but isn't consistent. Or, they can press us high up, and if the ref is lenient, Peanuts, Nais and Ossie will get bullied and we won't be able to keep the ball.

Either way we will be in for a shit run of draws or defeats unless we bring something different. Other than Mirallas and his dodgy hammies, can't see where that will come from in this squad. We need a player or two on loan. Perhaps a pacy striker and a battling centre mid.

It does not take a genius to see that Neville is a complete waste of space in midfield, as is Naismith, it was like playing with 9 men! Then take out the shambolic Osman and poor Coleman and you can see why Southampton took the piss out of us.

Southampton: strong in the tackle, fast to move the ball, first to the second ball.

Everton: weak in the tackle, slow to break, lack of imagination, never in the midfield battle.

Ratings as seen by a frozen, bored, humiliated Everton supporter in seat 1153, row E block 44.

Howard 7 Good saves, not too much in second half
Coleman 4 Headless, clueless Chicken
Distin 6 Tried, but out muscled too easily
Jagielka 6 Tried, but out muscled too easily
Baines 6 Not really given too many opportunaties to get forward
Piennar 4 Flicks etc just not working
Osman 3 Too lightweight, wants far too long on the ball
Naismith 3 Joke
Fellaini 6 Tried but on his own as usual
Neville 2 Worst player on the pitch by a mile
Jelavic 5 Not being allowed to be the striker he is.

Back to the Everton of Old Again.

Howard did well
We got a point
Mirallas came back
We kept a clean sheet
Jags defended quite well but his ball distribution was shocking
Anichebe had a good game I thought and was a threat

Negatives:-
Naismith
Hoofball
Pienaar keeps stopping and letting defenders get back

Osman got over ran in midfield numerous times
Jelavic had one chance and fluffed it. Spent time on the wings and chasing to the corners
Fellaini was awful
Neville will never be a centre midfield player despite what their Gary says in the build up
We should have lost

As for "It will be interesting to see what Moyes does when both Coleman and Gibson are fit together....if it ever happens.... will he bench Neville?"
Sadly, I think you and I both know the answer to that question, and it doesn't paint a pretty picture.

Oh, and the hoofball. I reckon Jags, Distin and Neville had a comp to see who could hit it longest and highest.

I know Naismith is having a mare but it would probably help him a little bit if he would buy some football boots instead of playing in fuckin slippers. Ive never seen anyone slip as much as him. His balance is awful and he turns like a 10 ton truck.

Also, yes, Jelavic missed a great opportunity but, in all honesty, he's doing far too much team work, chasing back, defending etc etc, then to take him off and replace him with an attacking exciting winger – he must have been sick as a parrot!! Mirallas is probably the only one at the moment who could find the killer pass or cross for Jelavic to put away!!

Baines and Pienaar, as much as I love them both, are being snuffed out at the moment and we look to obvious in our play, when that fails we hoof it up field BIG DUNC STYLE to Fellaini.

THAT FUCKING OSMAN should've been dragged off – he gave the ball away all night, no pace, cant get stuck in!! Naismith sadly also doesn't look the part.

Ahh well... roll on Bolton.

There's a Spanish lad at Arsenal who does it quite often.

All the sums and bonuses are based on finishing tenth and anything better means bonus time for Moyes et al! That's why Everton are always said to overachieve when finishing in 6/7/8th.

So get real — WE may WANT for more but we're the only ones who EXPECT it!

The reasons why this has happened are two fold, our defence when we were playing in an attacking style couldn't get a clean sheet to save their lives and now that the defence is sorted, although under more pressure, we can't seem to create and convert the chances.

I also agree that Kenwright – if we achieved CL football – would be under tremendous pressure to bolster the squad without selling our main assets. But if we miss out on Europe, he will be able to carry on as before, by using Baines and Fellaini to raise money and for the Manager to try to replace them with cheaper versions and maybe a couple of additions.

If UEFA and the FA want the game to be more competitive, they should limit first team squads to a maximum of 25-30 players and call a halt to the loan system, which in my opinion would enable clubs without mega bucks to improve the quality of their squads.

My worry for Everton is that we will be in the same boat as Newcastle this time next season.

Do the people who defend Jelavic actually watch the games? He would struggle to get into a Championship side. Remember his mis-kicks (sorry, he never even made contact with most of them): Stoke, Chelsea, and last night. He's slow, laborious, and has no ball control.

Enough has been said about Neville, Naismith and Osman. None of them should be in the team. But here's a question I can't work out: Moyes pulls Neville off at HT against Swansea. So between then and last night, Neville has done something miraculous to convince Moyes to select him against Southampton. And you can guarantee that for the next league game he'll field the usual suspects: Jelavic, Naismith, Neville and Osman.

And now the "Bench". Have you noticed when the likes of Barkley, Oviedo or Vellios play well when they come off the bench, he invariably punishes them by not playing them in future games? Vellios has always played well – he's fast, good ball control, and great in the air. For the miserly few minutes he's allowed to play he always makes an impact. He does his job in the reserves and bangs in the goals – yet Moyes won't give him a chance. The same thing is happening to Oviedo.

But the big mystery for me is the treatment of Barkley. We have all seen him play – a stunning game against Villarreal in a pre-season, great coming off the bench. Moyes recalls him from Sheffield Wednesday – presumably for cover as we had long-term injuries to Gibson, Neville and Mirallas...

We have a small squad as it is, so the next thing is he's put out on loan to Leeds. Can anyone see the logic in that??? Are there brown envelopes being exchanged??

I am unsure as to the logistics and payments regarding on-loan players – but I can't see this being a decision of Moyes. If it is, I have lost what little faith I had in him.

Winston Williamson #448 "Howard - Shit"... Winston you know Fuck All. As you realised when you posted a U-Turn #462.

Andy Kay #524 - There speaks a bloke who has some idea of what he's talking about.

How many of the Sidey/Williamson style clowns have ever been to Goodison, much less the outposts of the empire like Southampton.

Yes I was there, yes we were crap in the first half; and I came away disappointed; but then I got my act together, thought about it, and realised that it was a bloody good goal-less draw; I don't know whether you guys got your (no) money's worth on Sky (or whatever); but the £60 that it cost me was well spent.

Good on you if you felt you got value for money for your night out, but frankly from where I sat (on me couch in Johannesburg, infront of the box) I saw the team in blue get completely bullied in the first half, lucky to go in at in 0-0.
As someone else said, we dodged a bullet.

(BTW, I am no Scouser, but am proud to be part of the blues ever growing international fanbase).

As a life-long Evertonian, which you clearly aren't, I'm slowly learning to recognise the fact that our game is now a global phenomenon, and anybody from South Africa (or wherever) who has joined our ranks earns my admiration and respect for not choosing Manure, Chelski, Citteh or (God forbid) the RS.

Having, as a schoolboy, been privilaged to play one game (and only one - a final - we won) on the Holy Ground, I am protective of my Scouse status - I was a crap goalkeeper in a very good side, so I know about "Shit Goalkeepers" because I was one!

Armchair supporters are fine. (Snigger, snigger)

Start of the conversation went like this -

Me - "Did you watch that shite last night?"
Him - "I actually thought it was a good game to watch"

Strange times hey?

But as an Evertonian, all I felt was increasing maddening frustration, as echoed everywhere on here. Indeed, when it became obvious we were getting nowhere, I mentally switched off / gave up... it was that bad.

As for people wishing Neville and Osman didn't get a game... Who else have we got? There's no use in bemoaning Moyes, when he doesn't have sufficient back-up. Now is the time for the filthy rich Board to use some personal funds until we can repay then with the TV money or Fellaini transfer funds. Simply, if we don't sign in this window, we are never getting CL football.

So, tell me, am I less entitled than you and less of a blue than you with less of a view of matters than you? I was born and raised in Liverpool, I had a season ticket from 1978-2002 (and rarely missed always from 1983 on), since 2002 I have lived in the State, and yesterday I couldn't get to the match as I was in Chicago.

Climb down from your high horse soft lad.

Er, Dave Price (735) the first sub was a forced sub and he ought to have made a third; Osman and Naismith, who were still on the pitch at the final whistle, were both utter shite. Your views are, needless to say, entirely credible and informative but not helped by your claim that we signed Donovan this time last year.

"Opinions of others"...No. "Opinions to others"...Yes.

My season ticket was from 1955/1982, so I reckon I beat you by a year or so, however yours was more recent than mine, so we'll call that a draw, shall we?

I now live in rural Worcestershire, which doesn't match Chicago for impact; but it does mean that it's usually easier and more convenient to travel to away games which are south of a line Birmingham to the Wash than it is to get to The Grand Old Lady, and you'll gather (from the S/T starting date) that I'm past the first flush of youth.

I haven't been called "soft lad" for years, makes me quite home-sick and nostalgic. (sniff, sniff).

If you think anyone here is going to win anything without shit loads of cash and if you think we are even going to consistently challenge for trophies without even a mediocre budget then you continue to be deluded mate!

Kudos for choosing the blues though, especially at the time you did!

Hope roman doesn't get a ban - can he appeal? Who sits on the panel? Where was the referee?

Last week you informed us that if we fail to reach the Champions League "we'll be fucked," which I thought was pure hyperbole...now you state that Moyes...."indoctrinates his followers with dreams of mid-table obscurity."

I believe this is wrong on several levels: First, that simply doesn't stack up with either his stated outlook, or record; and second, you imply that you're somehow more ambitious than both Moyes, and the rest of us who do back him.

Again, simply untrue.

But after two consecutive 0-0s to teams below us when we could have made up ground on the clubs above us, I now don't think we'll qualify. Make of that what you will, mate.

But to look things another way, if you had told me we'd be where we are (5th with 3rd in reach) at this point at the start of the season I'd have taken it in a minute. Just got to start winning the matches we should be winning. Look at how many points we've dropped to the bottom five teams? I need a drink!

ps: Glad the soft lad made you a little winsome for home!!!!

Roman, on your 'to feet or to space' theme, I would have thought it depends entirely on the situation. For slick, first-time passing it has to be to feet, but if you want to bypass the opposition quickly a ball into space for someone to run onto will do the job. Being able to get yourself and the ball past a man from a ball to feet is trickier, but useful in tight situations, and maybe this is what your German friend meant as it is the preserve of the top players.

On a similar vein, there was an incident in the first half that made me cringe. We had partially cleared the ball (from a corner I think) and the ball fell to Pienaar on the right. Naismith was in support with one of the oppo in front and some space behind him. You could see Pienaar was wanting Naismith to make a run up the line for Pienaar to either play the ball ahead of him, or switch back inside and carry it himself if the defender pre-empted the pass and went with Naismith. Naismith dawdled and by the time he cottoned on to the possibility the defender had narrowed the angle sufficiently that Pienaar had to play it to his feet rather than a few yards ahead. Unsurprisingly he couldn't quite take it in his stride and the opportunity was lost.

2. We need Naismith off immediately and Neville off even quicker. Should have someone like Barkley as an option to play in the middle who can keep things moving forward and have a go. Don't understand why we keep loaning him out when central midfield has been an issue this year.

3. Unfortunately Jelavic is the best striker we have when he is on form but I don't think giving him a break is the solution. Maybe more support with Anichebe who I thought has been a massive attacking influence upfront is the answer. In previous years, I haven't been a fan but he's been great this year.

4. If we can remove the slow disastrous infection that is Neville and Naismith and take a few more risks playing the likes of Oviedo and Barkley, we can still push to make the CL – if not, I worry we may have hit the peak for a number of years to come.. :'(

Of course it was harsh, otherwise these threads become the Roman Sidey Show; as an alternative to which I'd rather watch "Neighbours" (which I never saw in my life).

In an earlier lifetime I compared him with Martin Mason; so I would like, here and now, to apologise to Martin.

You surmise correctly that the 1982 cessation of Season Ticket coincided with a move south with the job; but we still had a lot of family in the city, and I was young enough to do the 'there and back' journey in a day. Then 1987 heralded a move further south, to Reading, which I didn't like as a place to live; but which did mean that, for the four years we were there, I was very conveniently situated to visit Wembley, which had been the Blues second home for a period.

I don't know about "the autumn of life". As I look out at a foot (or more) of snow, and wonder how the hell I'm going to get hold of some fags for the missus if she runs out, it seems more like "the winter of discontent".

Good luck.

Roman,

In what universe is forecasting impending "disaster," for Everton, as you did....not hyperbole?!

Would you prefer I thought of it as 'sensationalism,' 'fear-mongering,' or simply-mad-as-a-bag-of-spanners,' instead?!

Naismith for all his faults is a right sided attacking player. We have heard all the "dour" "negative" jibes aimed at Moyes but it seems that others can suggest playing defensive players now is the way forward.

I hate using this comment, but Moyes "does" see them everyday and one can only assume that Oviedo is not showing enough in training/reserve games to warrant a starting place......fuck knows what Naismith must be like in training.

However, hopefully this point will be redundant now, if Mirallas can stay fit.

On the left you would have two defenders marauding forward but probably heading for the same area.

Now the above is just the musings of a fella who is not involved in football management, so I am guessing Moyes would have thought of that too.

I don't agree entirely with Steavey, that we need to play him on the left and shift Pienaar to the right, because if paired with two overlapping fullbacks the midfielder doesn't have to be the one going for the bye-line for an orthodox cross.

I will readily concede that Pienaar hasn't been in particularly sparkling form but I disagree with Steavey's assertion that the Baines / Pienaar partnership has been rumbled. It has been obvious for a long while how to counter this threat but what we are seeing at the moment is the lack of any other reliable attacking route which means the opposition can commit extra personnel to counter our left-hand threat.

Roman may have over-done the criticism of Naismith in response to my earlier post, as the main point I was trying to make was a general failure to be on the same wavelength (which training together should give the players) though I am also convinced that Naismith doesn't have the natural instincts to operate as an effective wide midfielder / winger.

I think with an Oviedo / Coleman partnership you would at least see them seizing every opportunity to move it quickly and attack on that flank, and if enough was being created we would benefit directly and it should pull some pressure away from our left-hand side allowing Baines and Pienaar to flourish again. The left-footed defender/ right -footed midfielder combination works on the left, so I don't see why the opposite wouldn't work on the right.

Coleman is the same, he was right back but because he was handy getting forward he was stuck on the wing. His defensive ability now getting better he is being entrusted with the right back spot.

I imagine that is what will happen with Oviedo, if he makes it. Put on the wing but essentially a defender who likes getting forward.

Kevin, I will refrain from using any figurative language in future posts. I do sincerely hope that you appreciate the effort I will put into this endeavour.

Have fun with as many linguistic devices as you please; but if you deliberately mis-characterise the manager's 'agenda,' or utilise apocalyptic language when discussing the 5th best team in the country, then it's possible you may get called-out on it again.

You've just proved what I knew all along, you're much more intelligent that me!

It's not a word that I've used very often on this forum; but I haven't got a fucking clue what you're babbling about.

Would one of my fellow contributors who's got an IQ as low as 170 (around about mine) please explain what this genius is going on about?

Tony, all I can say is we have different memories from pre-season. I remember the furore when people were assuming that Oviedo was being sought as a replacement for Baines, and that it was relatively quickly defused by the revelation / realisation that Oviedo gave us cover from back to front on the left.

"If you think anyone is going to win anything without shed loads of cash your deluded"

Swansea?

That should be "space programme".

The fact that your spell-checker accepts Americanisms doesn't make then acceptable in polite company.

And how do you know that I wasn't?

The convention of not beginning a sentence with a conjunction is MUCH more out-dated than any Colonial perception about the acceptability of Americanisms.

Signing-off for this thread, have the last word if you wish.