Three points. Clean sheet. Job Done.

Now on to Tuesday, COYB!!!!! We can take Arsenal.

5 points clear ahead of the shite and a game in hand; makes the trip to Arsenal quite interesting and I hope we have some belief in ourselves for that fixture as I think we can win it.

COYB

No Neville again then. Hmmm, what was said after Wigan....

Today's performance... did enough.

Let's hope the officials don't decide the game in Arsenal's favour on Tuesday, although I still feel we can get past Chelsea and Spurs. Spurs are going to find it difficult losing the chance of a trophy and Chelsea could still have a load of games to play. But I would love us to win at the Emirates just to shut the London media up and take notice of us.

Too much Supertramp back in the day I think... (Dreamer)

Indeed, why does Ovido never get a chance, from what we have seen of him so far is has something good to offer (much more than Naismith).

What did people make of Fallani today? I think he looked a bit - for want of better word - unmotivated.

I've the champagne on ice... just in case.

I think the drawn games we should have won could end up being costly but to still be in this position at the business end of the season at least gives that bit of excitement we all crave.

You can say what you want about Moyes, and some certainly do, but he has made us very hard to beat. 5 defeats in the last 41 PL games. And Goodison has become the proverbial fortress with only one defeat in that time. Just makes the Wigan result even more frustrating.

Arsenal are in pretty phenomonal form since beating Bayern in germany and we will do very well to get 3 points there but with a decent gap forming to the RS there's not much to lose.

Will be there on Tuesday, hope we at least give it a good shot.

The help they get as a club sickens me!

One gripe: No Oviedo or Barkley. Moyes has even said that Osman was a risk and Fellaini wasn't 100%. Surely to god we can give these players experience 2-0 up against that shite.

Anyway, mustn't moan. Decent performance and another 3 points.

Oh, and what's going on with the pitch? The grass was about 5 inches long and absolutely sodden. Why do they insist on watering it when it's already soaked?!

Also nice to see us win in third gear. Anichebe was great, and Gibson did well...but I thought most of our players, and surprisingly Pienaar, Fellaini and Mirallas, were quite average. Hopefully the sheer domination of the display will benefit us in terms of fitness and confidence levels come Tuesday.

Would love to sign Remy in the summer as well.

Joy

But will be back on TW forum on Tues. It's a bit like poking a bad tooth with your tongue. Doesn't help but you just can't help it.

11 years and at last I can see he is the Moyesiah... or maybe just a naughty little boy who won't sign his contract.

Maybe it's the Toffee curse of bracing yourself for the inevitable disappointment...I've still got faith, ducks have to be broken sometime, and we've come within a whisker of doing the Arse in 2010 (Pienaar's breakaway goal). Keep a shread of optimism mate, we still believe!!!

As for the champions league it aint gonna happen but I see that as a good thing. Rather we get into Europa,where we could maybe have a decent run.

Let's carry it through and beat the Gooners. COYB

I'm not totally convinced he can be a 20 goal a season striker, that we desperetly need. Lets just hope he carries on his good form for the remaining fixtures

"But, with games to come against Everton and Fulham before top-four rivals Tottenham are next in action............"

This sort of thing should be enough to get our team up for the remaining games. Fuckers. It's as though we don't exist.

Fucking love it if we can stick it to them!

The sooner he realises that, in the pantheon of great footballers, even in this day and age, he is a long way off gracing the uppermost levels. Indeed he has ability, but what Everton need is for someone of that ability to be committed 100% each and every game, whatever the opposition.

If Everton could get a hefty fee in exchange for him in the close season, enabling them to sign talented and regularly committed replacement(s), I for one would not be shedding too many tears. He should take a closer look at his centre-back Distin for an example of professional application and commitment.

For those who were at the game, were Fella and Pienaar just walking around once we got the 2nd goal? Saving their legs for Tuesday, maybe?

We'll see in a couple days.

Did anyone listen to the phone ins after the game? Moyes said that Fella was not at full fitness, nor Osman.

James #503, you must be having a laugh. Everyone around me was imploring Moyes to get Pienaar off as, having been booked and being his hyperactive self, he was a sending-off waiting to happen.

The two key games are Chelsea and Liverpool, but we usually do badly against lesser teams where we are expected to win, and that is a concern. In my view, we need to be as aggressive against Man City if we are to have any chance of 4th.

I think we have taken our foot off the gas a little after the Man City game, and that to me is a huge problem. Moyes needs to motivate the squad like he did prior the Man City game if we are to win either Arsenal away, Liverpool away or Chelsea away.

Most likely we will get 5th, but if the squad and Moyes gives it their all then 4th is possible. Based on former results I do not feel overly confident in getting 4th.
Still, I am hoping Spurs will trip up and also perhaps Chelsea. It would be fantastic to get 4th and Moyes should expect to win every game until the end of season, but I fear he will be pleased with draws in these games.

"Anfield, Emirates and Stamford Bridge. Three grounds where David Moyes has never won. "
So, each game we play at these grounds brings forward the eventual victory that will break that run. Up until recently we hadn't won at Craven Cottage since 1966, in fact we had lost every game there. Yet since 2009 we've only lost once.

Hopefully that shoulder spasm will teach Vic to stop waving his arms about when he thinks he has been wronged.

All in all standard day at the office.

Roll on Tuesday.

I wonder what Jelly thinks about Moyes' saying his wish would be to have a centre-forward in his response to Gary Lineker asking him what his one wish would be on MOTD.

We spend about 75% of turnover on playing staff already and I don't want us to try to push for CL qualification via excessive spending like Leeds did.

Moyes is doing a great job at the moment to keep us where we are and give us a realistic chance of 4th, but I'd rather finish 7th or 8th and still have an Everton to support in 3 years than spend £20M we don't have, try to finish 4th, fail and go into administration. Even if we get 4th thats no guarantee of decent income as we found out a few years ago, getting knocked out by Villereal before the group stage.

In short, if Moyes wants to stay and is happy to work within the financial capability of the club then I'll be happy to see him sign a contract. If he wants to spend more money than we can safely afford then he should go.

As for todays game, I thought we were very good in patches, and its a good result, but I was disappointed to see us take our foot of the gas near the hour mark.

QPR were poor today and a better side may have come back into it. If we're going to move to the next level we should be trying to go on and score 3, 4 or 5 goals when we come up against opposition who are mentally defeated.

Was also disappointed with the subs. Heitinga and Naismith with a few mins left against a poor side, 2-0 up. I'd have liked to see some of the lesser used players given a few more minutes in a low-pressure environment.

He's not particularly demonstrative. Is he giving the refs the business during games?

And, I must ask, why is Rednapp continuously hired? QPR was shit.

I don't quite understand all the hate spewed in Fellaini's direction after today's game. By no means his best performance – but he wasn't bad at all. His inclusion in the side does lead to many more aimless long balls from Jags and Distin though.

I'm convinced Moyes is either an idiot – or trying to prove a point to BK. He mentioned on MotD the subs Arsenal were able to bring on – while we drew on the might of Heitinga, Naismith and a misfiring Jelavic. Is that him showing the chairman that his squad seriously lacks depth?

What has Oviedo done wrong? He surely deserves 15 minutes here and there. I'm sick of saying that to be honest.

I'd hate to 'boo' an Everton player... but I really wanted to let Moyes know what I thought of Naismith coming on. I've seen some shite at Goodison Park and this guy ranks right up there. He is absolutely fucking hopeless. I think with Billy we all knew that he had talent, but he just couldn't apply it. Naismith has zero talent, zero ability and it is frankly criminal that this lad picks up a wage as a professional footballer.

On the game, we had some good moments but generally it was just a solid performance against a side that tried every trick to stop us playing. Add to that a heavy pitch and you've got the reason why some of the performances were a bit subdued. Against a better team we'll be better.

Vic had a good game but I am a bit concerned about Fellaini's position. Moyes seems set on playing him off the forward but it makes us a bit static up top and takes away the space that Mirrallas would operate in. To my mind, if Vic is playing the hold up role then you don't need a target man playing 10 yards further back. But you do need someone buzzing around him and trying to get behind the defence.

If we had gone on to get 4 or 5 goals, those players who score immediately get a confidence boost(and a few of our players could do with the confidence), and we probably will end up doing less work than taking our foot off the gas and chasing QPR players while they attack.

Its also a mentality thing. It doesn't matter today, but it might matter in the future. Easing up on the opposition has cost us lots of points in the past. The better sides generally don't do it. They wont sit on a 1 or 2 goal lead and let you come at them, they'll keep trying to score even when 4 nil up.

Redknapp is a decent manager who plays decent football. Unfortunately he's only been able to do that by spending vast amounts of money and sending clubs he's managed into financial ruin in the process. If he'd been at QPR since the start of the season they'd be ok because Fernandes has got the cash to soak up 'arrys spending....I think QPR's problems stem from Mark Hughes reign to be honest.

Anywho, appreciate your response. I just don't get why Fella's carde so much.

Same people wanted to see Junior, I don't wanna see him again ever.

And Rednapp has been running the longest, lucrative bluff in the history of English football. He'd be exposed quick over here in MLS.

Alas, Moyes must stay with us, because he'll never get a good offer in the EPL if he leaves. And if he gets an offer, he'll have to take a massive wage cut.

Or so I've heard.

Barkley was by no means a 'disaster' away at Spurs. And if he was a little off colour, I'll put much of that down to him having fack all PL experience in his locker.

I don't think anyone is calling for Barkley, Junior, McAleny and Oviedo to be starting games...but we have a small squad, these lads have bags of talent but no first team experience - they aren't going to get any better on the bench.

And to write a player off after a mediocre 45+ mins away against Spurs is pretty fucking laughable mate. Definite FrontRowSports 'fan'.

Your words: "You think no other club in Europe will offer Moyes the money he's getting now? Really?

I want Moyes to stay. But if he goes? He'll name his price to the clubs in for him (and there will be many) and he'll get the salary he demands."

You're the one that said "Europe", "many" teams and "get the salary he demands" but can't back a single statement up.

Now, in the Crazy World of Jimmy Flynn, Harry Redknapp is going to be found out by the white heat of the most intense football test known to man - the MLS. Forget the EPL. Forget the Champions League. Shit the bed, here comes the MLS! :D

Another great American comedian.

I don’t much like Harry Redknapp, but must admit that he has proven himself pretty well, Relative to resources, I would say perhaps most of all at Pompey.

And when it comes to appreciation of Moyes, it is (sadly) ONLY among a number of Evertonians (such as yourself) for which he has a credibility deficit. His support amongst knowledgeable neutrals is incredibly high, and for sure he would not be short of suitors if he moved on.

I sometimes mention to fiends and colleagues who support other teams that there are Evertonians who what Moyes to leave – and they think I am winding them up – the punchline being that some supporters view him as holding us back from our glorious ascent into the CL.

You've made the worst error in a discussion board. You're boring.

Annoy someone else..

He's a nobody who's made a fortune fooling owners otherwise. Nothing more.

Here, I willing to change my mind. Why did QPR hire him?

His skill is not in improving the goods you receive, but improving your perception of the goods you receive. He's tricked many in the media.

Referees certainly hold grudges. Just can't see why Fella seems to be top of the list.

I can only conclude he gives them the verbal business all the time, every game.

He's not a dirty player.

I was watching one of the European games in Midweek, forget who exactly but a player was rightfully booked early in the game in the second half the same player with a similar bookable challenge was let off without a second yellow because of who he was, now that really grinds my gears.

But they are Phil, a lot of fans on this forum anyway. And Velios too, even though he has started games and shown he's not up to it.

Or something about Woods.

all due respect.... Mike Green isn't boring. His comments and analysis are excellent and thought provoking.

He wants, and I think justifiably, and explanation of your Moyes comments.

Moyes can't just name his salary demands because there would be zero takers. There isn't another Club in the world that would hire Moyes at his current wage. He's not won anything!

I like the guy in part, and at times he infuriates me.

To say he can just pop himself in the managerial shop window and get takers at his current salary frankly isn't realistic. No-one, especially not the "big" Clubs, will pay him what he's currently on.

if he moves on it will be for a smaller payday.

He's in no position to name his price and get the salary he demands outside of Everton.
He may move, but it won't necessarily be on his terms with a "bigger" Club. In fact, it wouldn't be on his terms at all.

Not speaking for Mike, just sayin...

If it wasn't you posting, I'd have nothing more to say about Green. But it's you, so . . . . .

The only thought he's provoked is that he's a dead fucking bore.

I don't care where Moyes goes, if he leaves. What is thought-provoking is how anyone can think he WON'T be inundated with offers from other EPL clubs, "Name your price, Davy" somehow not being part of the offers.

What more can I say.

Wait, I can say something. Red Sox in 2013. Hahahahahahahahah!!!

You have as much rope with me as you want to take - and you know it. :0)

But you said that Moyes could name his price and salary demands. Not gonna happen friend.

Yes, he'd get multiple offers. But not at his current salary and no way on God's green earth could he "get the salary he demands."

I think that's where Mike is coming from. I know that's where I'm coming from.

Now go worry about that shit pinstripe, sold their soul to the devil, disgusting baseball team of yours and stop fucking about saying Moyes can name his salary demands.

No way James. He's respected but not in the elite group of managers.

It initially surprised me in TW to find so many attaching a player's wage to how well he should perform during games, when we both know the current new contract is based on what you did before, not what you're doing now.

The EPL is swimming in an ocean of cash. The wages offered are what is available to pay; player or manager. Moyes being one.

People disagree with my view? They're wrong.

And I'm not going to reply to a hypothetical to conclude a hypothetical to project what hypothetical might come next.

If Moyes stays or goes to another club, he's going to be paid a huge chunk of change. You know and I know it. Or is Francona working for free in Cleveland?

Most of us for many years would have been glad just to finish above them but suddenly that's not good enough!! I will repeat again 4 pts off 3rd, have a word with yourselves will you.

Look above Everton, look below Everton, what do you see? You see money, and lots of it.
Moyes with a net spend of £1m per season over his time. And here we sit in the company of Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs. And still, you want him out.

Save your breath mate, your flogging a dead horse, the Moyes out brigade have their fingers in their ears.

Moyes has got us up there with comparatively no money. So, what's to stop us smacking moneyed clubs Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool in their own back yards? — Money?

What's keeping us in such exalted company? There's a nullary logical connective somewhere...

If Moyes had spending power and had the likes of RVP or kept Rooney etc, would we still go there and lose every year? Probably not. I know Moyes has his short comings, I'm not blind, but money is what holds us back, blame the board.

We may well have a new manager next season, but still have the same chairmen and the same amount of money (lack of).

Now we have a manager were we expect to win most of our home games and are able to be competitive away from home as well. Yet despite our upturn in fortunes since David Moyes joined the club we now have some fans saying they would agree to him staying if we finish fourth. On our net spend we should be between 10th and 14th in the league, so with 6 games left to be competing for 4th is nothing short of remarkable.

My point is that, even with a spend of about £4 million in 10 years, Moyes has got us to where we can compete with the moneyed clubs, so money can't be the only factor for success, albeit, sensibly, the main one nowadays.

We have some cracking players and a wonderful team ethos; I'd rather we went down fighting, having a go, rather than trying to preserve a 0-0.

We stick it to Man City and compete on occasion with the rich but, when the chips are down, stakes are high, we don't seem capable of saying "Fuck the money — let's get out there and twat 'em".

I'm one of those people who see both sides of the argument and I also get the feeling that you are the same. I would just like to see Moyes have some financial clout in transfer dealings before everybody wanted him out. We can only judge him on what he has to deal with now; if he had a few million and still rolled over and had his tummy tickled at the said grounds then I too would join the MOB.

Why don't the board take their £20 odd million what they bought Everton for and stick it where the sun don't shine! The reason why is that they now want someone to come in and buy Everton for a ridiculous and unrealistic price, even though they have invested fuck all! – and run the club further into the ground.

We know that, given the restrictions of Goodison Park, matchday incomes cannot be increased and commercial deals for future seasons are set in stone and money banked and spent.

The killer is that even if the Board were to revise their asking price as suggested above – and we know they won't – there would be no rush of purchasers given the archaic stadium and mountain of debt.

It seems ironic to say it but my only hope is that Kenwright`s crutch (and his crotch!) is not removed by Moyes kicking it from under him!

Most of the clubs in the PL and the championship have changed owners in the time Kenwright's been here. You can't tell me Everton are that unattractive? The board either doesn't want to sell or they want to squeeze every last penny out of our beloved club.

Change of manager and attitude could take us further, It also could see us fall back, no one can predict with substance either way. I for one, would rather be in solid safe hands under the current regime than some one untried and tested without any funds to buy us out of trouble if the cause arises.

They have big highlights in the season, for example, Sunderland battering Chelsea at Stamford bridge a few season ago, go on a good run usually at the season's start, then they get found out, and drop off, like Sunderland a few seasons ago! Blackpool did it... Bolton did it... Norwich and Stoke too in recent seasons; they all drop off the pace. West Brom to some extent this year too.

One thing Moyes knows is how to get a better return from his players over the season, because his core tactics are usually spot on. His problem is having an effective Plan B, and of course two or three more top players.

Obviously they will sell if they receive an offer they cannot refuse, but that is highly unlikely. It is difficult to argue that football will not see even larger revenues in the future, as the possibility of pay-per-view becomes a reality.

It is costing the current Board nothing to keep their positions, so why would they want to sell, when they know they will see massive returns one day?

It doesn't 't even cost them their time - it is probably the finest investment Robert Earl has ever made, so why be in any hurry to get out?

Someone is also making plenty of money in the BVI, so that's another reason not to sell the club.

The debt is rising annually, but it is not hurting them personally, so they are quite happy to dispose of assets and players players to keep control.

The only reason for them cash in would be if the value was falling, or if they had to prop the business up with their personal wealth.

We gained a reputation as perennial strugglers (3 close calls since the 50s?) and developed significant newer types of fan base: "We were worse under Walter", "careful what you wish for" etc.

Like you, I would love to see Moyes given sufficient resources, without having to sell our best players, to see if he CAN make the breakthrough. For all he's done to raise us from the depths, he deserves the chance

We, as much as Moyesy, are victims of the...

Actually, the current debate (alright Nick, how's it going?) really is a bit like 'Game of Thrones' Will DM continue to occupy The Big Chair or will he be replaced, after a fantastically complex series of poisonings, beheadings and untoward events?

My money's on the dwarf.

One thing bothering me, and not meaning to drag this on, but you say you would love to see Moyes operate with more money, then why are you so keen to see him out now??

This makes it even more vital that we battle for fourth or fifth. It is still in our hands with Arsenal and Chelsea to play. At least we aren't relying on other teams dropping points. I'm sure that Moyes decision on signing a new contract will be effected by us qualifying for Europe.

Despite the downsides of midweek games in far corners of the continent I for one would love to see the Toffee's competing against top European sides under floodlights once again. The prospect of European football would also be a big draw, especially for players who might be tempted by higher wages from teams of lesser stature. Last summer I was gutted to see talented free agents like Hoilett going to QPR.

Despite having the best squad in many years I think we have been sliding back after our peak a few years back. We need one last massive effort to keep the club progressing. Anything below fifth will feel like failure to me. COYB!

I agree with you.

Fair enough, give a Europa spot to FA Cup winners... but that shouldn't defer to a runner up in these circumstances. Surely a 38-game league campaign is a better way of sorting out who deserves a spot.

Is there still a spot going for 'Fair Play'? I could be wrong, but I fear The Shite may be in pole position – despite having the dirtiest player in the league. Now that would be a true travesty.

Think Spurs have City next week. They owe us a favour for the 4-4 draw at OT. Good to see them win today actually – we need them up for it and hopefully Chelsea deflated.

I have no objection to the runners-up going into Europe, we would have done in 2009 if we hadn't have already qualified with our league placing.

We must be due a pen at the Emirates on Tuesday in the interests of justice.

Wigan need all the gate receipts they can get. Their fan base is the main reason they can't establish themselves as a fully fledged Premiership outfit. A European campaign would drum up some much needed interest. Plus I think Whelan is too much of a romantic to allow that opportunity to pass him by.

It's convenient to say this now, but I've always thought top 6 deserve Europe. Top 3 is CL and 4 to 6 should be Europa. As it is the top three get a stab at each competition which I'm yet to hear a positive argument for.

We should be able to trade with them. They get Naismith and 10,000 of our supporters and we get to play in the Europa League. If they offer a Martinez/Moyes swap we'll shake our heads and frown a lot, hold out to the last minute then very reluctantly agree. When it's all signed we will jump in the air, whooping with joy at the superb bargain we have cunningly struck.

If we're sending them Naismith may I suggest a further 10,000 fans as a goodwill gesture.

I think my Game of Thrones analogy was spot on. There is something afoot - and it ain't gonna be pretty. You need to have eyes in the back of your head, mate. I mean, as well as in the front, not instead of - that would be pointless.

Yes Kev, the assigning of fans to Wigan would be a controversial one. I propose that I be in charge and select persons who I see fit. First up - the 8ft 7ins freak who sits in front of me in Lower Bullens.

I hereby second you to take charge of reassigning some of our fans to Wigan. Good luck. It won't be an easy job, but the end result will be worth it.

I do hope this 'fan transfer' plan doesn't break any TW house rules.

I've consulted the TW staff and they are happy with the fan transfer policy. They also agreed to pay for various medical procedures to ensure me; an eye either side of my head, and you; a 360 degree swivel-neck.

Ah, if only everything in life was so easy to sort out...

Oh and I know we got to a Final against Chelsea but I for one was sure Daft Davey would blow it – and he did – just like the Big Game Bottler blew the semi final against the Shite.

We will never win anything with Davey in charge apart from Premier League survival – and if you consider that a SUCCESS then good luck to you.

I love the how just the other day we were all saying how great TW debate was and how we are all so much more sophisticated in our debate then those fools at Kipper.

Perhaps it is the words "my friend" that sets us apart?

On footy - reackon we will win 2-1 against Arsenal - coming back from a 31 second goal by them of course.

Also, for our small squad, three games in a week at this stage of the season is tough and unless we get the six points I can see our players start to switch off. The confidence of winning the two games could make the difference over tired legs.

It's odd that you should find the owl content controversial, but make no comment on my slightly questionable idea that we should transfer some of our fans to Wigan in return for playing in the Europa League next season

[Insert Sheffield Wednesday gag here.]

And a whole post without recourse to the SHIFT key, however I must disagree. Squad rotation has become an accepted part of football in the last ten years for a reason, it works. Therefore teams with bigger squads with higher quality replacements will have an advantage when it comes to playing more than one game a week for a sustained period of time.

The main reason is the increased pace and intensity of modern football, which puts huge demands on footballers. Perhaps a misconception is that players are rested solely so they don’t become ‘tired’. Tired is the wrong word to use – implying that the players are in some way unfit, or incapable of lasting the 90 minutes. It is more that they are unable to play every game at 100% intensity.

It is very easy to portray the modern day footballers as molly coddled prima donnas and there are quite a few that help support that view but it is simply a case of sports science. The days of Aston Villa winning the title using only 14 players are long gone.

To some degree if we are seriously ambitious of qualifying for the CL then playing in the Europa Cup would be about the worst thing for us.

How do you get players to peak 3 times in 8 days? And consistently over a 10 month season. The right balance of recovery, fuelling, training. Where are the gaps to allow the nervous system to recover?

90 minutes of football in front of 35k-60k people and another few million watching on TV is intense. I'm not playing the violin for these millionaires - just saying that matches every few days isn't conducive to being at your peak for each game.

In what way is the pace and intensity of modern football demonstrably greater than it was in the 1970s? Then players had to trudge through muddy pitches and play in apocalyptically bad weather conditions, thereby severely testing their muscles. Plus they had the added worry of decapitation or limb amputation if they got in the way of a tackle from one of the many hard men who used to patrol the pitch in those days.

no it's an opinion but I'm fairly comfortable in it holding water. Let me give you a few reasons the game is quicker and therefore more intense.

The players are fitter based on advancements in training methods and nutrition. Players spending the afternoon in the boozer are generally a thing of the past.

The pitches are of a much higher quality allowing faster football to be played.

The advancement of the concept of a high pressing game has speeded up play.

Teams have generally placed more emphasis on developing and signing athletic players.

Reducing the number of league games played and eliminating replays.

Bigger squads, squad rotation, more substitutes.

The equipment, footwear and footballs have had an effect.

Now I'm not saying these things are all necessarily for the good but I am pretty convinced having watched football for 5 decades that the game is quicker and more intense than it has ever been.
Just watch an old edition of the Big Match on youtube if you need convincing.

I pretty much agree with your analysis of the game - having been there to see it - I hope that doesn't sound like shouting my mouth off..

As for "more intense", I don't really know what you mean by that. It's true that they are under more emotional/psychological pressure than before, what with all the media interest these days, but I have a feeling that's not what you mean. If you were to watch the Chelsea v Leeds 1970 Cup Final on YouTube I think you would find that just as physically "intense" as yesterday's Chelsea v Man City match.

Oh, and another thing. I am no fan of Barcelona's style, but it is the dominant one at the moment - and it is not based on speed or intensity. It is based on keeping possession, playing cat and mouse and then pouncing. It's the same with the Spanish national side.

Why does every successful team (bar none!) adopt a policy of squad rotation other than to maximise the ability of their players to perform at as high a level as possible?

You concede the game is quicker, anybody watching football now can see that, despite in your earlier post seeming to deny it. The players are fitter but it is the pace and subsequent intensity that means squads are rotated giving even more of an advantage to the sides with the greatest resources.

You quote Barca, I watched yesterday's game vs Zaragoza where they played virtually a second string. They still battered them though and that Tello is going to be one hell of a player.

My earlier post did not deny that football is faster in the Premier League than it used to be in ye olde Division 1, it questioned your statement that "the increased pace and intensity of modern football... puts huge demands on footballers". I'll say it again: if fitness, pitches, equipment, etc have increased then surely this balances the fact that the game is a bit quicker - otherwise, we are going backwards! And I still don't know what you mean by "intensity".

My opinion is that squad rotation is over-rated. In particular, I assert that we have enough players in our squad to challenge for trophies. It is not that which is holding us back. I know you're a Moyes fan, Graham, so tell me if you think he would rotate if he had a bigger squad - because I don't think he would. He's not a rotator. He likes to stick with same players week in and week out.

Ha-ha! I seem to have turned the argument so that I (a man disillusioned with all that is Moyes) am supporting his non-rotation policy, whereas you (a fan of the man) are in disagreement with his preference for fielding his favourites! Ah, it's a funny old game...

I'm guessing you don't watch a lot of Barca. Under Guardiola they developed a high pressing game unsurpassed by any team in Europe. They have undoubtedly used possession of the ball as the key element of their game plan but your description of quick slow slow quick is miles off. That better describes how maybe the great 70s Brazil side played not this Barca side. They move the ball very quickly and in Messi, Xavi and Iniesta they have three of the best there has ever been.

Maybe I misread your original post but when you said 'In what way is the pace and intensity of modern football demonstrably greater than it was in the 1970s? ' I sort of assumed you didn't agree with it, but if that's what you meant fair do's.

As I said the evidence that squad rotation works is that all the most successful clubs use it. Why would they not play their best eleven players in every game if it wasn't necessary to rest them on occasions? Intensity is the physical exertion involved in playing football games by the way.

Finally I know you want to pigeon hole me as pro Moyes, a common approach by some on this site. Maybe if you read some of my posts you would find whilst I believe Moyes has done a great job, I think the time has come for a parting of ways. With that comes a load of risk but maybe just maybe a breakthrough.

Finally I think if Moyes had the luxury of a £50m bench you would see a lot more rotation.

Barca make the ball do the work. That does not equate to pace or intensity. Quite the opposite. The reason that they bore me - and they do bore me - is that they lack the dynamism that I want from a football team. I would rather watch a German team than a Spanish one.

Anyway, we're going round in circles a bit here, so I'll leave it at that.