Before Z-Cars?

by Laurie Hartley | 05/06/2016

78 Comments [Jump to last]

Before Z-Cars was introduced, the Blues used to run out at Goodison to a marching band tune. It's driving me mad trying to remember what it was - can anyone help.

I know I should know but I just can't remember.

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Chris Williams
1 Posted 05/06/2016 at 15:33:45

Laurie

I don't remember them running out to anything pre Z Cars, but that doesn't mean very much these days to be honest.

They sometimes had a brass band playing live on the pitch.

Bob McEvoy
2 Posted 05/06/2016 at 16:09:52

I'm pretty sure the Z cars theme entrance started on the first game of the 63/64 season proper v Fulham . Prior to that I have no recollection of an entrance theme tune

Chris Williams
3 Posted 05/06/2016 at 16:21:02

It was first played as a one off at Easter in 62-63 season. We were going to win the League and Z Cars was the number one show. Terence Edmonds- PC Sweet was an Evertonian and brought Bert Lynch and Fancy Smith along to see the game. They came on at half time to the theme being played and the rest is history .

Imagine Brian Blessed at Goodison. 'Dive Vardy, Dive!'

Colin Glassar
4 Posted 05/06/2016 at 17:56:04

I love Z Cars but I always regret not having an emblematic song like the other shower.

Brian Williams
5 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:01:27

Fuck the other shower!

Colin Glassar
6 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:05:50

So many great Beatles songs we could've used Brian.

Tony Draper
7 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:06:29

Colin, the other lot's "Feem Choon" was literally enforced upon them by indoctrination, that song from "Carousel" was played relentlessly to them.

Finally, it sank in.

"Z-Cars" makes the fuckin hairs son my neck stand up like iron filings upon a magnet !
Always has, and always will.

(BTW, I'm a self employed Plumber and I reserve "Z-Cars" only for those very closest to me as their ringtone on my phone. Others get other beloved Everton anthems. The upshot of this is that when my phone goes off in the presence of a new customer two out of three respond most favourably. How I deal with "Twisted Reds" ? Well that's a trade secret.)

Colin Glassar
8 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:10:25

I'm not saying to do away with the Z Cars tune Tony, on the contrary, I love it. I would've liked us to have chosen a song to sing DURING games that makes us stand out from the rest. I loved the "Can't buy me Stones" when it was sung.

Chris Williams
9 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:12:59

Under Walter Z Cars became the highlight of a Saturday afternoon. The journey was in hope and then Z Cars played, hairs on neck tumescent , then .....fuck all. Stomach in knots frustration, travel home, pissed off, sulk and get abollocking,

The highlight of the afternoon. Bitter sweet.

Keith Richmond
10 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:21:22

It would have been before my time, but I read somewhere that a song frequently played at Goodison Park in the 1950s was "Once More The Blue And White".

It was recorded by Bing Crosby, accompanied by the Ken Lane Singers and Victor Young's orchestra. The song featured in Bing's 1950 film "Mr Music" and is a college (American) football song, hence the words 'black and blue', which nevertheless must have sounded appropriate in an era when football was more physical than today. It was not one of Mr Crosby's better recordings.

Is there a ToffeeWeb reader out there who was a regular at Goodison in the 1950s and who could verify whether this is the song in question?

Link: Video

Tony Draper
11 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:37:19

Colin, I wasn't for a second suggesting that you wanted us to ditch "The National Anthem" !

At every opportunity I try to gather support for this song written by a mate of mine, an artist, a rockabilly, the founder of "The La's" and a thoroughbred "Blues Blue", Mike Badger.

Link

The lyrics parallel "Evertonians are born, not manufactured.....".

This DID used to be played when the team ran out after half time, I think that it should be again. It's not too difficult to hear this adopted by the Street End as a one and only truly original "Blues Choon".

Paul English
12 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:46:33

My 1st memory of a song at Goodison Park, besides the military band music, was at half-time against Arsenal in 1962-63 League winning season. A night game; 1-1...

The blues took ages coming out for the 2nd half as Gordon West was injured and had his thigh strapped up... The song was by Andy Williams called..... "CANT TAKE MY EYES OFF YOU"....

Paul English
13 Posted 05/06/2016 at 18:58:29

Sorry guys ,wrong song...It was Andy Williams, the song was...."Can't get used to loving you"!!!!!

Mathew McKay
14 Posted 05/06/2016 at 19:34:58

What Colin said. I have always lamented the way the dark side have had a passionate song to sing before and after the games that embraces the hardships of the club. I've also always thought ours should be "to dream the impossible dream" but that's wishful thinking. As much as I love z-cars and the hair standing ovation, it doesn't suffice. We need 40 thousand blues singing a song in harmony so loud that sky sports have to stop their commentary (a bit like they do for every red shite game).

Rob Halligan
15 Posted 05/06/2016 at 19:42:58

Interesting story behind the first fans to sing YAWN. Apparently, Man Utd fans were the first to sing it following the Munich air disaster when a group of them went down to old Trafford to pay homage to the dead players and started singing it.

Mathew McKay
16 Posted 05/06/2016 at 19:45:20

https://youtu.be/lp3op0e4Mw4

Dave Abrahams
17 Posted 05/06/2016 at 21:18:34

Mathew (14) your suggestion for an Everton theme song brought back memories of when I went to a funeral of an old and genuine friend, the song he had chosen was the one you mentioned " To dream the impossible dream". I said to my mate aLiverpool supporter " you wouldn't have imagined John ( the lad who had passed away) choosing that song". My mate replied "Well he did support Everton.

That's a true story and I think " To dream the impossible dream " is a great and inspiring song, but maybe not for Everton.

Mathew McKay
18 Posted 05/06/2016 at 21:23:32

Dave (17) I'm truly sorry for your loss. I agree that it may not be THE song. But something or that ilk. For example, Swansea and West Ham and they who must not be named all have inspirational songs that get the crowd together and make their grounds intimidating. We need our own.

David S Shaw
19 Posted 05/06/2016 at 21:52:19

Laurie, there was a couple that I know of, the tune that Monty Python use and also Rawhide was used as well for a bit.

Ken Buckley
20 Posted 05/06/2016 at 21:59:27

Laurie,

I think it was 'Entry of the Gladiators'.

Tony Abrahams
21 Posted 05/06/2016 at 22:04:56

I think it would be great if we could get something like this going. Just go to YouTube and type in the Hibs fans singing "Sunshine on Leith" at Hampden the other week. A moment that will live in Hibernian folklore forever.

David S Shaw
22 Posted 05/06/2016 at 22:11:09

Was Robin Hood another one? Or was that a fan song from back then?

Colin Gee
23 Posted 06/06/2016 at 01:14:32

Whenever I hear Z Cars, it bring a smile to my face.

Whenever I hear that song from across the park, it makes me want to punch someone in the face, that's the difference!

Derek Thomas
24 Posted 06/06/2016 at 02:31:15

Yeah I'd go with Entry of the Gladiators, chimes in with an old memory.

Getting towards the start of the game and the ground was nearly full they would play the same 4 or 5 ' J.P. Sousa' type brassband tunes, in the same order, every home game, I'm still word perfect on 76 trombones to this day. Another was, Hooray for the red(?), white and blue...on as it was in those days with no colour telly...Hooray for the grey white and black...boom, boom.

All supplied by Creases of County Rd of course

The half time thing used to vary with what was popular or requested. It wasn't that they came out to it at HT as such, just it hadn't quite finished, by the time the teams reappeared. The records at HT thing was a function of the newly craze for pop music hyped up via Mersey groups success after 1962-63.

Laurie Hartley
25 Posted 06/06/2016 at 04:24:45

Ken # 20 - I am not sure - I think Dave # 19 has jogged my, memory with the "Monty Python" tune. It's the Liberty Bell March.

Link

On the other hand Derek # 24 could be right - it may have been a medley.

I think Colin's # 8 and Tony's # 21 suggestion about a song that we can sing during the game to lift the team has merit.

Laurie Hartley
26 Posted 06/06/2016 at 04:34:42

Sorry fellas I posted Matthews (very funny) link #16 by mistake.

Here is the correct link

Link

Jim Gore
27 Posted 06/06/2016 at 08:28:19

I started going to Goodison Park during the 1959-60 season. I seem to remember the marching bands, and the records played (courtesy of Robert Crease's Music Store, County Road).

There was usually a mix of current pop and military music. One of the songs I still remember being played was Anchors Away, by the band of the Royal Marines – stirring stuff to a young lad!

Dave Abrahams
28 Posted 06/06/2016 at 09:22:09

Laurie (26) yes just played it now it is definitely the Liberty Bell March. I didn't know the name of the tune but as soon as I heard it I knew it and I knew where it came from, Goodison Park.

I wouldn't be surprised if it was played in the late forties when I first started going to Park it was certainly played throughout the fifties.

Who wrote it and what is it about? Liberty Bell ? Was it connected to one of the wars?

Ray Roche
29 Posted 06/06/2016 at 09:39:05

Dave, The Liberty Bell has some connotations with the American War For Independence. I'm afraid I'm going to have to delve into Google to find out exactly what! I remember the marching bands that were on the pitch before home games, I used to say to any crumpet I was trying to chat up in the sixties that "I used to sing with a band" before admitting it was the band on the pitch. Worked sometimes, got them laughing anyway.

When the Mersey Sound became a growing influence and more and more popular, Beatles songs in particular were played over the tannoy and this invariably got every one singing (not just the Kop as the BBC would have you believe) and this all added to the atmosphere.

I recall a mid week FA Cup match against Hull when the Dave Clark Five "Glad All Over " was played and all the fans in the stand stamped there feet in tune. I thought the stands were going to collapse, the ground literally shook. Any one else remember that?

Derek Thomas
30 Posted 06/06/2016 at 10:23:08

Yes, Ray; clear as a bell – don't ask me what I had for dinner the other day though.

David S Shaw
31 Posted 06/06/2016 at 10:24:38

Was another of the marching band songs that the crowd used to join in wth "Steadily shoulder to shoulder, steadily blade by blade"?

Ray Roche
32 Posted 06/06/2016 at 12:56:52

Derek, ask your carer,.....she'll know. ;-)

Gary Cummins
33 Posted 06/06/2016 at 13:12:28

Colin I have always thought that Dwight Yoakam's version of the Buck Wight song only you would be fantastic for 40,000 Evertonians to sing

Only you can make my dreams come true
Only you can turn my skies blue
Love like ours should not be far apart
Only you can break my heart

Only you can end these sleepless nights
Only you can make things turn out right
You and you alone can keep us far apart
Only you can break my heart
Only you can break my heart

Only you can make my dreams come true
Only you can turn my skies blue
Love like ours should not be far apart
Only you can break my heart
Only you can break my heart

Only you
Only you
Only you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMItbnK7S8g

Jim Lloyd
34 Posted 06/06/2016 at 13:19:51

I think the Liberty Bell was that rung to say the War for American Indepence had started.

Tony Draper
35 Posted 06/06/2016 at 13:22:10

Of course there have been so many, many times when the following song was entirely appropriate.....

Link

Ray Roche
36 Posted 06/06/2016 at 14:43:29

I've always thought the Benny Hill theme, Yackety Sax, would do...or, last season, Send In The Clowns...

Colin Smith
37 Posted 06/06/2016 at 14:49:23

We adopted Z cars theme based on local folk song Johnny Todd and linked to beginning of the city's breakthrough in the national media. So it celebrated local culture.
The other lot chose a recycled mawkish American show tune.
Which decision had the most class?
Does anyone else remember Goodison crowd singing When You're Smiling when winning in the 1950s ?
With present mood of optimism could be just the time to revive it ?

Ray Roche
38 Posted 06/06/2016 at 15:33:16

Colin, "When You're Smiling" went right through the sixties, too. "Without Yer Kecks On".......

Colin Smith
39 Posted 06/06/2016 at 21:49:32

Agree Ray. Always loved the typically scouse deprecatory humour of that added line.

Neil Madden
40 Posted 06/06/2016 at 21:58:04

#4 Colin Glassar. Maybe some Evertonian wordsmith could put words to Z Cars?

Jim Lloyd
41 Posted 06/06/2016 at 22:00:12

Haha, Well remembered Ray. Sung in unison too. I doubt the opposition had a clue what we were on about

Patrick Murphy
42 Posted 06/06/2016 at 22:02:29

Here's a version sang by Bob Roberts. Dylan has also recorded this version on his bootleg albums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1m_ysiV4uVY

John Hughes
43 Posted 06/06/2016 at 23:16:09

Don't forget the old Seekers favourite - "We shall not be moved".

Tony Draper
44 Posted 07/06/2016 at 06:23:03

May you be forever chosen
May your feet always be swift
May you know your proud history
When the winds of changes shift
May your vision be always golden
And may our songs be always sung
May you always be EVERTON
Forever EVERTON, for EVERTON
May you always be EVERTON

Bob Dylan's "Forever Young"
Audra Mae's version Link (used in "Sons of Anarchy") hits exactly the right tone for me.

Although, in fairness, Dylan's words are so pure Everton, as they are, that probably they could be just left alone.
(Wasn't there an Everton/Bob Dylan dialogue last year ?).

http://www..com/lyrics/bobdylan/foreveryoung.html
Alternatively, keep ALL the original lyrics, but simply change "forever young" for "My Everton". Works for me.

Laurie Hartley
45 Posted 07/06/2016 at 07:47:00

Tony it wasn't my intention to start a discussion on an Everton "signature song" but I think your idea at post # 44 is absolutely fantastic.

I followed your first link and think that version is great.

I think you had a blooper in your second link for Dylan's lyrics so I have taken the liberty of inserting one from Dylan's official web site.

Link

We could sing that song no problem and I believe it would really stir everyone up - players included.

I hope your idea gains momentum - I am 100% behind you.

Perhaps we could get a "name" to sing it at the opening of our new riverside stadium ;). I know I'm getting carried away now but that is just how I feel at the moment

UP THE BLUES!!

Ian Jones
46 Posted 07/06/2016 at 08:52:40

Or one for the younger supporters

One Direction and History

Some of the lyrics include lyrics like 'You and me got a whole lot of history (oh) We could be the greatest team that the world has ever seen'

Fits in with the 'If you know your history'

Tony Draper
48 Posted 07/06/2016 at 09:32:10

Laurie.
I do realise that your original intention was to evoke our history, so I apologise for getting all "blue eyed" and allowing myself to be drawn off topic.

Thanks twice over Laurie, firstly for your kind appreciation of my suggestion, then secondly for the official Dylan link.

I'd be absolutely delighted should Evertonians belt out something inspirational and heartfelt and original such as above.

And yes, I know precisely how you feel, but we should all dare to dream.

Lloyd Brodrick
50 Posted 08/06/2016 at 03:07:49

i'd go for a powerful song easy to belt out, Red and Black from Les Miserables only we would change black to Blue.
'Red the seed the devils sporn...Blue an Everton reborn...and so on.

Lenny Kingman
51 Posted 08/06/2016 at 13:52:59

The shine has been smeared off Z Cars somewhat when you hear piss poor Watford trotting out to it at Vicarage Road. Does anyone know how long those gaudy gobshites have been using it.

Kieran Kinsella
52 Posted 08/06/2016 at 13:57:19

What does Watford have to do with Z-Cars anyway? Shouldn't they play Always Look on the Bright Side of Life or some feel sorry for me Elton John ditty?

Patrick Murphy
53 Posted 08/06/2016 at 14:06:01

Kieran (52) Apparently a former manager of Watford Bill McGarry liked the tune and he asked for it to be played prior to home matches I think it coincided with some long unbeaten streak.

In 1963, Former England international Bill McGarry joins as Manager [Watford] replacing Ron Burgess.
Introduces Z-Cars "His favourite TV Programme" and the Hornets establish a 29 game unbeaten home run.

Wikipedia says: The first football team to use it was Watford F.C. who adopted the theme in the early 1960s, as it was then manager Bill McGarry's favourite TV programme.[3] It has been played as the players come onto pitch since then. During the rise of the club through the leagues in the 1970s and 1980s, it became associated with the club's success under manager Graham Taylor.

Workington A.F.C. are also known to play the theme when the players enter the field. This is because Evertonian Ken Furphy was manager of the club in the 1960s. Sunderland A.F.C. were also known to have played the song as their players ran out to the field during their days playing at Roker Park.

David Barks
54 Posted 08/06/2016 at 14:25:14

I think it's time to move on from Z Cars. It's just not a match for the modern game and this generation. I would much prefer something more up tempo that could get the stadium rocking.

I actually love what Crystal Palace have down with the rocking music and the cheer leaders. It looks incredibly fun and is a raucous atmosphere. Z Cars just seems old and from a previous era.

Patrick Murphy
55 Posted 08/06/2016 at 14:31:44

I remember what happened when Peter Johnson tried to 'update' Z-cars David it didn't go down well at all, what was it 'bad moon rising' or something. Traditionalists aka old farts like me would be most upset to have some rapper booming out of the speakers at Goodison Park prior to the game. What I would like to hear before we leave Goodison forever, is the crowd belting out "Champions!" after we have won the Premier League.

Ray Roche
56 Posted 08/06/2016 at 17:34:44

Patrick, Everton used Z Cars first. Wikpedia is notorious for fans altering "facts", especially when a team is about to sign or try to sign a player. See the link below about Z cars,

"“Ironically, after it had been played for the first seven or eight home matches, it was left out on the very day the late Mr. Leonard Williams of Twentyman fame was a guest of the club, only three or four days before he died."
He died in Nov 1962.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/david-prentice-real-story-behind-7795561

Patrick Murphy
57 Posted 08/06/2016 at 17:50:59

Ray (56) I always understood that Everton were the first to use it and David Prentice's article would seem to bear that out.

Ray Roche
58 Posted 08/06/2016 at 18:10:20

True, Patrick, just don't believe EVERYTHING on Wiki.!

Patrick Murphy
59 Posted 08/06/2016 at 18:13:32

I most certainly never have believed everything that I read on there Ray, which is why if I do use it to research something I always make it clear which source I'm using.

Phil Parker
60 Posted 08/06/2016 at 18:14:31

Love Z-cars, and You'll never walk alone in my mind is now for the families of the Hillsborough disaster, god bless them all. It was first performed at Man Utd after the Munich disaster. It was made a hit by a 22 year old Evertonian, Gerry Marsden...but that's another story.

John Hughes
61 Posted 08/06/2016 at 18:20:58

Colin Smith "When Your Smiling" and Ray " without yer keks on" for ending is the one for me, also the other John Hughes "We Shall Not Be Moved" another blast from the past. Always put that one on the Juke Box wherever I was, with the comment from all in whatever town or pub he's an Evertonian " that fellah! And proud ( still am).

Chris Williams
62 Posted 08/06/2016 at 18:56:54

I'm absolutely convinced that the first time Z Cars was played at Goodison was Easter 1963 on the day that the actors from Z Cars visited and came on the pitch at half time. We were well on the way to being champions and Z Cars was the number one TV programme.

As a result of the response it was played at every home game from the beginning of the following season.

Ray Roche
63 Posted 08/06/2016 at 20:38:50

Chris, read the link I provided from an Echo article at
#56

1962 was the first time it was used at Goodison, the show, Z Cars started in January 1962.

Jim Wilson
64 Posted 08/06/2016 at 20:52:54

We have a song but we rarely sing it. It's a classic and is the best football song ever and the RS don't mind pinching it to sing. 'We shall not be moved' is our song and should be played before every home game and sung. Fact is we don't sing at home games!

Hugh Jenkins
65 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:32:37

What about the adaptation of "all together now", by the Farm?

That has a very stirring and haunting quality to it - certainly as stimulating and poignant as the piece from carousel. It was written by an Evertonian and the title neatly lends itself to a memorable acronym "ATN", that is every bit as "catchy" as that used across the park.
The title signifies harmony and a sense of all belonging to a united ideal.

Brent Stephens
66 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:36:52

Hugh - or this "all together now" from the Muppets?
Link

Darren Shirley
67 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:37:31

'The story of the Blues' by the Mighty Wah (a local group) in the mid 80's.
Was very surprised at the time that a toffee lyricist didn't tweak the words to our use, loads of potential.
Apologies as I don't know how to add a link but easily available with a quick search.

Colin Glassar
68 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:40:14

Happy memories Jim 64

Hugh Jenkins
69 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:47:12

Brent (66) - Yes - why not? After all, it was written by the Lennon - McCartney partnership, so also has a clear Merseyside connection.

Brent Stephens
70 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:53:31

Of course, Hugh!

Rob Halligan
71 Posted 08/06/2016 at 21:59:25

Here you go, Darren.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fnUotdp_YHY

Darren Shirley
72 Posted 08/06/2016 at 22:06:22

Cheers Rob,
For me a song full of uplifting potential

Chris Williams
73 Posted 09/06/2016 at 07:16:02

Ray, I did read it, and it just doesn't fit with what I can recall of what happened at the time. Sadly in some ways that is unsurprising perhaps, but as a regular match goer then ( and now) the first time I can recall it at Goodison was at Easter 1963 but never before. Because of fan reaction and suggestion it was adopted from the start of the 63/64 season when they were reigning champions.

Can anybody else enlighten us?

Ray Roche
74 Posted 09/06/2016 at 09:20:26

Chris, so, you were a match goer in the early 1960's, consequently, you can recall teams, matches, players etc.

Q. What did you have for your tea?

(and what did I have yesterday, 'cause I can't remember....)

but I do think that the ECHO article pretty much nails it with more accuracy than my memory recalls it.

Kieran Jones
75 Posted 09/06/2016 at 10:33:46

My dad was Irish and he remembers the Gwladys Street singing "The Holy Ground" back in the '40s and '50s .

Chris Williams
76 Posted 09/06/2016 at 14:21:21

Ray, you may well be right, but I can remember highlights and some other strange things which have stuck in my mind for some reason.
Like a player called Jimmy Hill who played for us and was awful. Signed from Norwich and he was crap. Why do I remember him? No idea.
Or Jimmy Fell, RAy Veall, and a selection of crap left wingers. Between them they maybe played 30 games. Why? No idea.
I remember Roy Vernon and a great goal he scored against Blackpool on Good Friday in 1960 and the first Derby Match in 1963 when they came back up, and particularly the argument with my mates afterwards.
Or the Leeds match when both teams were sent off and the crowd after the game demanding the referee on Goodison Road.
And Tommy Rings debut and Fred Pickerings debut, both against Notts Forest I think at different times.
All these things I remember as events, probably better than last nights tea because they are events I recall happening. I don't recall the detail though.

It's the same with Z Cars but I stand to be corrected as in all things. It would be nice to bottom it out just for personal reasons I guess.

Memory eh? Bloody Hell.

Ray Roche
77 Posted 09/06/2016 at 15:08:00

Chris, some memories of mine there, too, Pickering scored a hat trick on his debut against Forest as well. Tommy Ring, would have been a true great but for a broken leg. I don't recall Veal or Fell being THAT bad though, Micky Lill, bought from Wolves and with a goal scoring record of a goal every third game but we still sold him after a couple of seasons. The first Derby game of the current run, a 2-2 draw at Goodison. I could not sleep for excitement for days before the match. The return was 0-0 so honours even.
It's no wonder the events of yesterday will remain a mystery when my head is full of useless stuff like this...

Chris Williams
78 Posted 09/06/2016 at 15:21:01

I just wish that Harry C allowed the cameras in more often then. Roy Vernon was a great player, at least in my memory, and the first great player I saw for Everton but everybody remembers Greaves and Law but nobody remembers Roy. I was only 11 when He made his debut against Wolves ( we got beat 2-0 ) and I guess at that age you're impressionable .

But I remember him as an all time great. Only Everton supporters seem to remember him these days.

Dick Fearon
79 Posted 08/07/2016 at 09:19:55

John Sousa's marching tune, Stars and Stripes Forever, preceded Z-Cars.

Brent Stephens
80 Posted 08/07/2016 at 09:54:34

John Hughes - "without yer kecks on". Remember it well. Did you live in Maghull?

Dick, also remember the Souza stuff. The tune brings back other memories, specific games and players.

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