Barton 'petrified' about Everton's future

And he really has his finger on the pulse of the true feeling amongst typical Blues.

I heard the talk-in and for once they spoke about the situation at Everton like it is rather than paint the usual bullshit rosy picture.

Everton Football Club is no longer punching above its weight..

IT IS UNDERACHIEVING!!

Kenwright got lucky with Moyes dragging the club into respectable league positions more often than not on a shoestring budget most of the time compared to what Martinez has been given in his 3 year's.

The money we have spent and the players this manager has at his disposal demands better results than this last 18 month's has brought.

Its only natural questions are going to be asked if he's really the man to take this club forward.

I'm sure there are thousands of families in Liverpool who moan about Everton over dinner, Joey.

Michael Ball is another Blue who is increasingly worried about our future.

It will now be very difficult for RM or BK (or whoever is truly in charge nowadays), to avoid the fact that RM's capabilities are being called into question and therefore it will bring mounting pressure on RM to change or leave.

The analogy is akin to the proud mother watching her son in a march past and saying to her friend "oh look, everybody is out of step except our Johnny".

Why can’t RM see what everybody else sees? Defence; set pieces; substitutions both personnel and timing; unbalanced selections; Kone/Howard – this list goes on – unfortunately so does RM until the penny drops with somebody responsible, given there is such a "somebody" in a position of responsibility.

Craig Walker.

Yeah you are spot on, thousands of families and not just in Liverpool were having a right good moan about Everton over their Sunday roast.

Whether you agree with it or not, the BBC know that people will listen to the likes of Joey Barton. As an Evertonian, his comments, which in this case are 100 percent correct, come from his heart and for me he is hitting the nail right on the fucking head.

Tell me one word that Barton has said that is wrong or that thousands have expressed in the last two seasons. Everyone, especially Evertonians, has a right to say what they feel, including Joey Barton. I just wish those who have a bit of access to the media said it as well.

The arseholes at the Echo, the ex-players at the Club, those who see what we see and say nothing are the ones you should condemn – not Joey Barton!

The players look full of fear especially at home, and Joey’s just reflecting the fears that the fans have that this talented squad will simply break up as he players surely cannot be happy.

The likes of Lukaku, Stones and Coleman will have their agents getting twitchy, in fact, it would not surprise me if things are already happening... and the treatment of Mirallas is a disgrace , despite Bobby’s weasel words.

As The Stranglers said... Something Better Change.

I agree with Barton – very worrisome times

Anyone who thinks the hapless Kone is a better option than Mirallas when you are chasing a goal is clearly beyond all help.

Hopefully the new owners signal their intent and get rid of Martinez when they see the fans' anger and just look at the stats. If they are going to Invest in a club even for a short flip (I have seen banded about on here and other websites), they will want to build a Brand and have a team that is challenging for honours, not that we are learning from 18 - 24 months of mistakes.

They will want to invest to make money. If Everton are nowhere near that, I am sure that they would put in place a man that they think will. They will treat Everton like any other business that they have run and it will be based on results.

Companies always have a strategies and plans be it 1, 5, 10 years. You look at Martinez in his 3rd year of maybe a 5-year plan and not even his staunchest fans could say it is on the right track. Stats don’t lie.

Come the end of the season and if the players mentioned are unhappy with the way things are going under the current manager, whose head will be first on the block? Because these players are the Everton Brand; the names we put on the back of the shirts the club sells are the players, not Martinez.

I know people are very wary, but in a way this could be what Everton need. Drive and Business Acumen, instead of "everything is okay, we are building for the future".

I truly Believe that Martinez is that self-centred that he cannot see what is happening around him. I am not worried about the takeover because as long as Everton have fans there will always be a club. I am worried about our status in the Premier League whilst Martinez is in charge, though.

The more Evertonians that stop "toeing the company line" and come out with the truth the better.

Everton has been run by bullshitting charlatans for far too long.

Too let Naismaith go and keep Kone proves this man is a clown, get rid now to save our season and our squad before the players become disillusioned altogether. Imagine what Claudio Ranierei would do with this squad of players.

A couple of Saturdays ago, it was Paul Merson (I know, I know). He was comparing Roberto to ’Men in Black’ with the comment along the lines of – "You watch Everton at the moment and think what the hell ...? Then Roberto does his press conference uses that flashing memory eraser and you end up thinking ah Everton were just unlucky!!!"

This season has made me so sad. Not because we have been bad. We haven’t been. We’ve been excellent at times and may well yet finish a respectable 7th/8th. It makes me sad because we could and maybe should have been celebrating something special. We were lucky enough to have our best squad in an age assembled at a time when the big boys were faltering and the league was wide open. I fully believe that even a middle-of-the-road coach (Hughes, Pardew, Moyes) would have had us competing seriously for top 4 and that a great coach would have had us fighting for the title.

As it is, we are mid-table and left constantly pulling out our remaining hair and blaming consistent tactical mistakes, poor substitutions, clear favouritism in selection, and seemingly endless bad luck.

We have all been waiting for Martinez to prove that he can: a) Coach a team that is both potent attacking and solid defensively; b) Get consistent results.

The truth is that he has never done either (with the possible exception of his first season with us... but was that Moyes's influence? Who knows?) and may never do. Next season, I think the least we deserve is a manager who has proved he can lead a team to success and has a consistent record building balanced teams.

I don’t like Joey Barton but I agree with his concerns. I play football with a Baggies fan who was going to Goodison on Saturday. I told him that they would get an away win. I don’t expect much from Everton after years of being let down but I do expect a win at home against a struggling West Brom side.

Mirallas hasn’t really had a chance since the penalty debacle against West Brom last season. Think he’ll be on his bike this summer.

The footage on the BBC of this 5Live footy discussion with Joey Barton. He's not everyone's cup of tea but his comments are spot on and I hope to god this coverage starts some media momentum against Martinez and his clueless reign as our Manager.

Also can any fan explain why season ticket prices are yet to be released for next season. Is this to do with takeover?

I bet there is a long list of dragged ups working in the media and Barton is only one of them.

Ferguson was hung out to dry by the Scottish FA because he wouldn’t toe the line. Can you imagine if what Ferguson was sent to jail for applied to football now? Most teams would have half the squad behind bars.

He done nothing to deserve even a court case, your comment is unbelievable.

I think you need to understand the details of this case, as I don’t think you are aware exactly what happened. He was not sent to prison for what he did on that football pitch.

At the time, he was already serving a suspended sentence for two previous assaults, neither of them on the pitch, one of which I believe was against an officer of the law.

He was not sentenced on the basis of one isolated incident on a football pitch

Talk about deluded and childishly one-eyed.

Why not cut to the chase and just post "Ay juss fuckin’ love big Dunc me, love the bones of ’im like" (while punching the air)?

Firstly, whether he was ’hung out to dry’ by the Scottish FA (or not) is neither here nor there in relation to my point.

And whether he ’done nothing’ was (as the judgment against him suggests) debatable.

But let’s say he was harshly treated (re the offence that saw him jailed); it could be equally argued that he got off lightly for other (violent) altercations that saw him simply fined.

Fact: Like Barton, he had/has previous.

Fact: Like Barton, he is (Craig’s word) a ’jailbird’.

"Yeah but he wasn’t as big a nutter as..."

Subjective.

But here (for me) is the important bit.

Both men (it appears) have attempted to put their pasts behind them and lead more sensible and productive lives and with some success it appears. Good on them

But don’t tell me the ’glass houses’ adage doesn’t apply to Craig’s post (unless of course you want to look daft twice).

Both assaults and both he got away with, other than being banned for a few games.

It’s a journalist’s job to "get to the story" and I am glad the BBC went to look for it from an Evertonian, and as a footballer still playing at quite a high level, not from some random ex pro?

Barton, as many have said on here, very clearly articulated the concerns of many fans, and some on here have also correctly pointed to the rather curious perception outside our fan base that we are somehow "doing OK"?

I hope the Barton interview gets an even bigger audience, as with Michael Ball and his observations in The Echo. Whilst the management and players probably don’t read TW postings or other social media, those working for potential owners just might?

I like Joey as a pundit but he does beg the reply "Do you mean apart from Robles, Funes Mori, Jagielka, Browning, Galloway, Oviedo, Garbutt, Galloway, Baines, McCarthy, Besic, Cleverley, Barry, Deulofeu, Lennon, Mirallas, Niasse, Kone and the £190 million we'd have to spend on new players?"

I’m just saying comparing Barton, who is a real thug, to Ferguson is a bit much. Aren’t you being deluded and childishly one-eyed by comparing, as you see it, like for like?

Also deluded in the ’We are all Evertonians, so it doesn't matter what we do?’ If Hitler was an Evertonian, your ’He's one of us’. comes into play does it? Surely not, I'm sure you are more intelligent than that.

While I don't disagree there is cause for concern and the solid defensive base Martinez had to work with has been eroded. I still think there is a good manager somewhere in Martinez. I think we've played great football this season but the games now seem to follow the same pattern in how they play out and I expect us to finish 9th-11th come the end of the season. Is this underachieving? Most certainly yes!!

I think this could be fixed and we could be the same Everton we saw in Martinez's first season. Will Martinez tweak and make these necessary changes?? Well, I'm encouraged to see that the likes of Howard, Stones and Baines have been replaced with inform players. We hear Tim Howard's injured but I'm certainly in the camp that this injury has been invented to save face for the hapless American.

I had thrown the towel in where Martinez was concerned after the Swansea result but the I've seen some encouraging things from the games after that. Although I'm at a loss to say what happened last Saturday. But to reinstate the point, I don't think Martinez is the total clown he's been made out to be by many on this thread.

For one, he's the manager who's put this team together. I can never remember a time during Moyes tenure where we had such an exciting youth team and Just pulling the example of what's happened at Derby with Paul Clements exit. He was allegedly sacked for not having a long term vision. Well, we have that in Martinez, and the one thing he always wanted at Wigan was a youth academy so he could build the club from the bottom up. For me, he's achieving that and building team for longevity where they're be players in contention for the first team squad every season.

This all said, we're still all asking the same questions about his defensive philosophy and for me he has until the end of the season. This is because I have faith in his long term vision but I have serious misgivings about tactics that are pretty on the eye and can appear to be progressive but are appearing to be more and more fundamentally flawed.

Personally I'm not as concerned as Joey Barton. I think he's giving a very populist opinion that borders on scaremongering. A bit like something Nigel Farage would say on his soap box.

So I say I'm not panicking because It's looks pretty certain now that we're have new owners in the summer. I would have serious doubts they would give Martinez another season based on another 11th placed finish. A new board with fresh ideas and ambition could encourage the said players to stay. I'm not including Stones there because I think he will be sold. But I don't see why the others wont still be here next season. And what happens if they're sold?! The new manager has a huge transfer budget to buy who he wants.

Personally I'm optimistic about next season because I don't think for one moment Roberto Martinez will be manager next season unless we finish in the top 7. And if we do finish strongly that will go some way in vindicating him and I'll be equally happy because I'm not anti-Martinez and want him to succeed.

Within the last couple of months there has been a distinct change, with a number of high profile ’pundits’ and the national press putting the boot in.

'a bit much'?

Oh brilliant, touché!

Clarence Darrow: "Your honour, I just feel that despite all the evidence, the blood in the car, the photo of my client holding the gun over the victim's lifeless body, the prosecution's case is...a bit much.'

Judge: (bangs gavel) 'Case dismissed!"

Seriously, what the fuck does 'a bit much' mean?

Actually, I think I know - 'Shit, the lack of insight in my post has been pointed out for all to see, but instead of conceding anything, I'll just push ahead with more posts that will leave me painted into a corner.'

So you add - 'Also deluded in the 'We are all Evertonians, so it dosnt matter what we do?' If Hiler was an Evertonian your 'He,s one of us'. comes into play does it? Surely not, im sure you are more intelligent than that'

Well when I eventually got through this paragraph (one that appeared to have been typed by a bladdered anteater with a boxing glove on it's beak, hammering at a keyboard) I realised you appeared to be quoting someone else and the points you attribute to me, I didn't actually say.

My 'he's one of us'?

Where!?

Your first post made no sense, as for 38 & 39, just...

Link

This is an intriguing point and begs the questions, how? and why?.

The only perceived difference between the goalkeeper and the back four of Moyes' final couple of seasons and Martinez first couple of seasons, was the disappearance of Distin.

Was he the key to the solid defensive platform we previously enjoyed?

If not, what has caused one of the most parsimonious defences in the EPL to become one of the most generous, in two and a half seasons?

It is even more mysterious when one considers that Roberto likes to play two defensive midfielders in front of the back four - always.

I would appreciate it if someone could explain this mystery to me?

Barton is right, most Evertonians are concerned and, whatever you think of him, he is actually pretty sharp.

Even Adrian Cundy is getting onto it and slated Martinez for his comments on Howard the other day. RM is treading on very thin ice and is not learning from his own repetitive mistakes.

I wonder who he has dinner with for the rest of the week? In fact if there is discontent with his family once a week I personally would stay well away.

Seems poor ’Dick’ Barton is spreading discontent where-ever he goes. Evertonian or not, never liked the twat. Nor Ferguson for that matter, as for Eugene and Paul why not have a ’Kissoff’ ffs....

If we could work that one out I reckon we would know conclusively what's going on with this team and manager.

On the one hand you could say the likes of Baines and Jags are now in their 30's and have had a few long term injuries between them. I seem to remember our defence from our last championship winning side of 87 went downhill pretty fast.

The flip side is that Moyes had those defenders so well drilled that was their default setting during Martinez's first season and Martinez came in and took all the glory because he gave the team an extra dimension of attacking flair. And for the last season and a half this defensive mentality has been coached out of them for Martinez's flawed vision.

Who knows?? One thing for sure is that Martinez hasn't continued his opening proclamation of improving what was already there. He certainly did it in that first season but thoughts of defending seems to have gone out of the window since we beat Arsenal 3-1 when Martinez was being heralded as a tactical genius for playing Rom on the wing.

As for his comments, I cannot help agreeing with him.

Martinez out!

Or was it a more wide ranging discussion about football in general that eventually turned to him coming from a family of Evertonians?

Good post Gavin 40, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. We don't know if "the board" are questioning the results, if he has targets to meet, if they are happy with his progress etc..... Everything else is conjecture and speculation (I personally think no one is in charge right now and Martinez has been left to his own devices) and we are left in the dark as usual.

Personally, I can't see him surviving another 10-11th place season unless this takeover falls through and BK lets the status quo remain in place.

I am sure if we took a cross section of our supporters we would find fault with any of them but why we are condemning the right to free speech by saying Barton shouldn’t be commenting because he is a villain is ridiculous.

He is obviously an Evertonian through and through like the rest of us and he makes a very valid point that the majority of Evertonians would like made to the media and to the board.

Out of interest do you still think Barton could have been the player to give us a bit more steel in midfield? You were pretty vocal about him being an option. Personally I’ve always rated him as a player and thought he could be a replacement for Barry when he was having a long lull in form last season. Although Barry has been better for me this season.

Going off this interview I get the feeling Joey Barton might have caused us more problems in team togetherness.

As critical as I am of our manager, I would have loved to see him succeed, but it would take a turnaround of Nigel Pearson proportions for me to think it could happen. I am sure that, if the Moores takeover is going to happen, the incumbents will look at things like projected season ticket sales as part of due diligence, so whether that links to the manager’s position I guess is open to question?

At least the Barton interview puts a strong point of view, there’s nothing at all wrong with it being a populist view.

My point was that we need(ed) a passionate, blood and guts, skillful player like Barton in our MF to gee up the rest of the team.

My major criticism of Martinez is that the team reflects HIS personality, ie, nicey-nice, soft and wimpish. Our lads don’t get nasty or complain, they just grin and bare it unlike everyone else who moan and groan at the refs. Barton wouldn’t take that but then Roberto wouldn’t take someone like Barton.

I think that most Evertonians would agree with Barton’s comments – I certainly do and I am glad to see this getting more air time.

In terms of his "If Everton sell Lukaku, Stones, Barkley and Coleman in the summer, what’s left?" comment, I think that this is a bit of hyperbole but fundamentally true – ie, if we don’t get our act together, then big names will walk and seriously weaken the team and morale of the club in general.

Back to the main point; whatever one thinks of Joey Barton (I’m with Colin Glassar on this) surely past misdemeanours do not invalidate every comment he makes.

Probably why Joey Barton was asked to talk, is that he would not refrain from criticising. If Sharp and Snodin came on, it would only be the same old bullshit the BBC have heard for years off them.

Mind you he’d get booked every week leading with his arm and that.

His sentiment is that Everton are currently underachieving and most of us on here and that go to the matches (witness the regular dissatisfaction) agree

So let's stop missing the point and debate properly:

It's been brought to major media attention that Martinez is doing a poor job. He cannot organise a defence and unfortunately defending is a vital part of winning matches

He either gets us top 8 this season and a good run in the FA cup or get rid in my opinion

Never has an Everton manager been given so much money to spend with such a great head start in the squad he inherited and blown it

Season 1: we should have come 4th but he didn't buy a striker instead opted for Luciana Traore and given both he and Lukaku got injured, had no able back up. Negligent management

Season 2: boring aimless football whereupon we started and finished badly. I ignore the European run because it meant nothing

Season 3: some good football undermined by some awful defending. This is not entertainment Mr Martinez. I don't enjoy watching us score a great goal knowing we'll more than likely concede 2

Learn quick or get out

I like you’re thinking. I was just imagining a dictators XI

GK Idi Amin

A big unit much like Nev when he made his comeback at Bradford

RB Pol Pot
LB Joseph Stalin

Neither of these take any prisoners

CH Genghis Khan
CH Vlad the Impaler

Going a bit Stoke here

CM Hitler
CM Mussolini
CM Franco

May be a little unbalanced here as mostly right wingers although Mussolini plays the Jan Molby role

RW Gaddafi
CF Julius Ceaser (C)
LW Chairman Mao

All-in-all, a pretty formidable line up, let’s see how Clattenburg deals with that line up.

RM and the business guys also reduced the club's debt. Everton’s financial picture is looking good, so that investors are interested. It's a young team beginning to work together and changing a manager would break up the team. That in my opinion sets Everton back another 3-5 years (financially too).

Too much of ’Monday morning quarterbacks’ pundits and instant gratification Evertonians. The club was almost insolvent. Keep RM.

Imagine the likes of Graham Sharp, or Ian Snodin being asked, yeah got great players, just been unlucky, I see a rosy future for this team.

The 85 team was full of winners, every player tackled, chased and harassed teams, this team is too nice, we don't seem to have any leaders on the pitch, seem to accept what refs dish out,

Joey Barton may not be everyone's cup of tea, but a few years back, he would have been like a bulldog that's just caught its bollocks on a nettle, tare-arsing the Goodison pitch, and battling away for his beloved Everton, never giving up, and tackling anything that moved.

Personally, I would add Timur Lenk to that selection.

"Scholars estimate that his military campaigns caused the deaths of 17 million people, amounting to about 5% of the world population."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timur

Lovely fellow...

"Timur's legacy is a mixed one. While Central Asia blossomed under his reign, other places such as Baghdad, Damascus, Delhi and other Arab, Georgian, Persian, and Indian cities were sacked and destroyed and their populations massacred. He was responsible for the effective destruction of the Christian Church in much of Asia. Thus, while Timur still retains a positive image in Muslim Central Asia, he is vilified by many in Arabia, Persia, and India, where some of his greatest atrocities were carried out. "

A bit like Moyes used to divide the opinions on here...

Link

I mean if any paper could get the scoop, it would surely be the paper with it's finger on the local pulse.

Then again..

Link

Absolutely hilarious. a good laugh
there lads.

Yes, it's mostly TV deals but the club debt ratio under RM's watch is getting better. Here in the US, Everton is getting noticed. There is an Everton tour leaving Seattle just before Everton plays Arsenal and from what I understand it’s full.

It’s about US$2500 a pax for less than a week. Wife vetoed it and opted for a cruise otherwise I would be there.