No new stadium at Walton Hall Park

Maybe Moshiri took one look at the plans and realised what a farce it all was.

We need a complete break with the past if we are to ever progress.

We might have a chance under Mr Moshiri, under the present chairman doubt it very much, I hope to hear him sing very soon, "I"m your yesterday man".

My choices would be:

1. Redevelop Goodison
2. Stanley Park
3. City Centre / Waterfront.

After all wasn't this the reason behind the Moshiri sale?

Elstone's mealy-mouthed criticism of Joe Anderson and LCC at the AGM didn't sit right with many at the time. Still puzzled how and why he is still CEO and more, now has an official seat on the board.

Hopefully better news on all fronts will be forthcoming as the Moshiri revolution picks up pace.

Sounds like Moshiri has sacked Liverpool council off, and is going full speed ahead for our own purpose built football stadium. Or is that just wishful thinking on my part?

Maybe, or maybe he has just taken a different tack than Elstone.

Maybe he's decided not to treat fat Joe and the LCC as mugs and dupes and engage with them without coming across like Private Walker.

That would make sense - last time (November?) Flash Harry tried to give it 'I'm the big CEO', Anderson understandably responded with 'Fuck off!'

(well ok it was more along the lines 'great, show us your plans' but it amounted to the same thing).

"I think there is a real acceptance by them and I'm pretty confident that within three years there will be a new stadium for Everton football club in Liverpool."

WOW!!!

That's a big categoric statement. What does Joe (a Blue himself, of course) know to be so forthright in his declaration?

Intrigued ...

I then hope the fans will be consulted at various stages of its development.

Regarding the Waterfront there is a huge swathe of derelict land where Regent road meets Waterloo road. It's ideal as its in a business district so there's less chance of the local RS residents forming a protest group.

Moshiri Is already showing he isn't afraid to make the right calls and will do the right thing. Long may it continue!

There's plenty in here living in and around Liverpool. Could the city and Moshiri get all the legal, municipal and financial ducks in a row so soon after he bought into the Club?

We own the school don't we?

Worry ye not, we can watch Anfield continue to grow instead. I got the impression WHP was nothing but a decaying mess and needed a new life? Christ I wanna see us in a new ground while i'm still in my 40's, as it is the last time we won something I was 25. We are pinning a lot of hope on Mr Moshiri, I hope he will buy that tosser Kenwright out, we are 20 years behind thanks to him. Hopefully there will be some money left to build him a boys pen in the middle on the North Sea.

"Just had a meeting with the boss of peel holdings. Says he's in talks with your new owners about a new £300m stadium on princes dock near us... Be good that!"

What?? Where??? How????

I go past there regularly and its footprint is greater than Goodison. The Summer pops is held there, so its not too far from the City Centre, although I believe Liverpool One's developers stipulated a limitation on retail developments within a given radius of Liverpool One so that may limit the options.

The problem is I think Peel Holdings have the land locked for 'Liverpool Waters'. It would be great to see redevelopment of the dock road with the overhead railway rebuilt.

Between the 2 tunnels, near Albert Dock?

Please let it be so!

Ever more intrigued!

Wonder if 3yrs is a reaction to things being simpler for us now?.

A few years back we had to be infrastructure-led as a club and we needed the ground to make every penny of revenue it could. Four or five million quid of conferencing revenue would've been a godsend.

Now though with the new TV deals and the, very commercially-convenient, Leicester fairy-tale for the FA/Sky to sell its hard to see that TV money drying up any time soon. Plus we have the redoubtable Mr Moshiri and anyone he may be able to involve. That few million quid we make 'on the side' are we going to care much about it?.

So, if we don't care, and we only need to build a shiny new stadium now, instead of a business empire, does that make any specific sites come back into focus that werent before?.

Damian

New owner stamping his mark ...

New manager in soon ...

New blood coming through the academy ...

Now new stadium (allegedly) to add to the mix ...

I feel a swoon coming on!

Best to adopt a Phil Walling stance:

BK to expose Moshiri was a playful hoax ...

David Moyes to return...

Academy players all loaned out to Brentford and never hear of again ...

Goodison Park remains untouched and our spiritual home, gaining world heritage listing from UNESCO. Key to doing so was retaining the 'unique obstructed views' which recall football stadium and spectating from a bygone age ...

All taken with a pinch of salt, rather than waking from a swoon with smelling salts.

Here in London the new stadiums (Arsenal and the Olympic stadium) were both built on brown-field land, and there plenty of sites down here as London is so big. Though most of them are not anywhere near central.

The Olympic stadium is way out east and not really that easy to get to - people who live in London see it as being 'out of town' if you like.

The Arsenal stadium is not far from where I live, and is also a nightmare to get in/out of with regards to public transport - as for driving, forget it. It's also not anywhere central London either.

Londoners are very insular people, and we even scoff if we have to wait 5 minutes for a tube train. London central has no sites for new development at all, which is why both the above stadiums are a little further out.

http://www.liverpoolwaters.co.uk/

But with the myopic Kenwright and Elstone there was no chance.

http://www.liverpoolwaters.co.uk/development/overview

http://ToffeeWeb.com/season/13-14/rumour-mill/27236.html

Ray, I remember your post, it stuck in my head as you were spot on regarding Kenwright.

Still sufficient acreage in any of the Dock Front redevelopments to build a 21st century fit for purpose football stadium, Ray?

Specifically, at Princes Dock as Damian mentions?

Top, top location, if so...

Hopefully Moshiri has started to turn things around which by the look on Kenwrights face yesterday isn't to everyone's liking. Maybe Bill and all his greasy pals like Green won't be coining as much from the club anymore and can't hold us to ransome over the stadium issue (the eternal pot with no piss in).

If Moshiri has identified a world class site on the waterfront, and why wouldn't he, then I would expect this to be the prelude to a larger takeover from perhaps his business partner Usmanov. Hopefully this spells the end of the wilderness years under the lying bastard Kenwright who'll still walk away with a massive sum. Biggest Evertonian my fecking arse.

I can't wait to hear the bullshit to come from the board to explain this. But we are Everton and should expect these things to happen.

Imagine two potential scenarios:

One, an iconic, 50,000-seater purpose-built stadium close to the waterfront so that, for example, all the cruise ship tourists would be in awe, as they sailed into port.

Two, a flat-pack cheapo job up the East Lancs, handy for Kirkby, Crocky and Norris Green. Swarming with scroats in North Face jackets riding those little bikes and offering to mind your car.

I repeat... this is Everton. Which option is more likely?

I would love that to be the case, and, has been clearly shown is viable if those in charge have the wherewithal. Take a look at Man Utd, Newcastle and our dear neighbours to name but three...

I am sure, though I appreciate as with any exercise of this scale, there would be difficulties. However, the planning permissions and any objections would surely be minimal obstacles and more importantly it would be supported by 100% of the fan base.

There's scope for riverfront apartments, offices & parking. Think of all of the retail drivers who'd want in... Whitbread with a Costa & Prem' Inn, BK, M&S.

Ok, I need to lie down now.

Let's hope it's not the same as the spades will be in the ground come April crap the Redshite were spun!!

Complete non-starter and a waste of time.

Ffs, redevelop Goodison Park instead of chasing pie-in-the-sky stadium schemes. They should have done it years ago.

Croxteth....not too far out if you live there ! Would prob increase crowd with M57 link.

Speke ...bout time they got something. People from Kirkdale could fly to the match.

Who knows and don't get all excited by a non-rumour. Otherwise you'll get bitter again and see RS conspiracy.

Okay guys, sorry I have been wrapped up in mental health work stuff. What I posted was copied and pasted (verbatim) from one of my best/closet friend's who I do trust.

In answer to someone's question, yes he is a red, but not the sort to lie for the sake of it.

I haven't spoken to him on the phone or had any further messages, so can't elaborate yet. All I have is that message, which he sent as he knew I'd be interested.

Will it happen? Who knows. This is Everton after all.

Sorry it's all a bit ambiguous, but that's all I know at the moment. Mind you after being under the management of sideways bob we should be used to ambiguity, right?!

Who would've thought it....

It would be a change in tune for Peel because initially they didn't want a football stadium as part of their Liverpool Waters vision but it makes lots of sense.

I said at the time Moshiri came on board that if he is as ambitious as he seems, if I were him I'd have got got straight on the blower with Peel to see if something could be done. What a legacy that would be for him!

That would be worse than Kirkby ever was.

I'm not sure Tranmere would be too happy with that either.

Ste (97) that made me laugh :D People's bluntness on here does make me chuckle.

(OK, being honest, I will be here hourly and even reading Twitter to find out if we're going to start acting like the big club we think we are.)

And

"...we are hopeful that the new sites provide us with a much more straightforward, deliverable opportunity to build a new stadium.”

Reads like this to me: the Walton plans relied on pie in the sky revenue generation from non-football activities to prop up an a highly optimitic investment case. Now, the club has a credible source of wonga (from a wealthy new shareholder) for the project and can look at the best sites from a purely footballing point of view.

Purely my reading of the matter. Its a major step forward if the club's plans are being taken seriously....

Also, walking through Stanley Park in the sunshine on Sunday for the first time in ages I'm really glad that there are no plans to build there. It is really a beautiful park with the lake and the bandstand and I'm really against removing precious green space from inner cities. It never comes back. The city would definitely gain more from a stadium development of a disused dock than a recreational park space.

When I was back last year, I saw the Wirral docks and it would be a great location, but I also don't think it would be the right place to move to; Everton belong in Liverpool, and my preference would be (i) waterfront or (ii) somewhere with a higher vantage point and profile than Liverpool.

My concern about anything else would be to always be in the metaphorical and actual shadows of the burgeoning Towers of Mordor.

Seems like somebody has drive and ambition we've not seen for way too long, and their initials aren't B K !! I'm not getting excited just yet though.

Mr. Moshiri is pulling strings it seems! Interesting times.
About time. Bring it on.

Why would it? It's so very much linked with the RedShite, I would not want it near anything of ours.

They copyrighted their Liver Bird logo, not the Liver Bird per se as it is a symbol of Liverpool as a city. The Echo for example use the Liver Bird extensively. The logo is a very specific thing and they did it understandably to clamp down on unofficial merchandise. It would be perfectly to use a Liver Bird representation that was not identical to the RS symbol. Plenty of businesses in the city do.

Besides, who wants a blue Liver Bird as - trademark or not - less informed people would think we were cashing in on them. They got the Liver Bird, we got Prince Rupert's Tower. That's just how it is.

However the point of my post is to ask if anybody can explain why these waterfront sites are now possibly on the agenda having wasted so many years on Kirby; WHP etc. They must have been there since the King's Dock fiasco, so why the sudden appearance of them as suitable sites?

Or is this just guesswork on the part of contributors to this thread - still fascinating - just a question!

imagine though our famous waterfront having a 60,000 blues stadium in the images.. Call it Peel Park for all I care to get the land.

Would be lovely if true.

Liverpool has the travel, hotels and general infrastructure to make this happen? Any thoughts....

My preference would be to redevelop Goodison. I believe the guy who redesigned Twickenham (originally very similar to Goodison) put forward plans to redevelop Goodison. Does anyone remember this or even have a link.

I had another message from my mate (see my post at 29 if you haven't already seen) after I asked him to elaborate (judt to note they were not meeting about the stadium, other business matters:

"Never really mentioned much else mate. Says it's either there or Knowsley, but docks their preferred option."

As for a riverside stadium sinking - what about The Riverside stadium in Middlesborough? Or the Stadium of Light in Sunderland?

Sell Rom and Stones, use the money for the squad rebuild and build a stadium without being dependent on retail.

Come on Everton lets make this happen it would be a real statement not only for the club but for the city !

That was my doubt about the Princes Dock rumour. It's some years since I made a pilgrimage back to the city, but not THAT long ago and from recall, I couldn't see how they could squeeze a 60,000 stadium in the remaining acreage.

Trafalgar Dock makes more sense, with its ample neglected space, is no distance away, offers the iconic waterfront location and any such development would be welcomed by LCC, I'm sure.

Fun to dream, isn't it..?

I do believe Moshiri is not messing about and I do believe it'll happen asap so he can start getting a return on his investment but, as I say, I have enough on my plate to be spending time fantasising about what might be.

Sorry, is that miserable??

If it was up to me (nb: someone with no class) you wouldn't be able to move 20 yds in any direction in Liverpool without seeing 'Everton F.C - The City's Original Football Team' (fuck 'The People's Club' - spell it out).

What good is this 'class; if no one knows you exist?

Plus, given PL sides are allowed to carry the CL stars (nb: a different competition) we should stick 'Football League Founder members 1888/89.' and 'Premier League Founder members 1992/93' on our shirts (and posters, t-shirts...)

I'd love us to redevelop Goodison, but there is also a very appealing image in my mind of a spanking new ground in the docks with a gateway/entrance that says 'Everton F.C - The City's Original Football Team', in neon letters (so big they can be seen from Rhyl) that would drive them fucking nuts.

I picture a baffled German tourist looking at our new state-of-the-art, city-centre ground, all lit up: "I em a liddle confused - Liverpoolz Anfield stadium iss nod in ze centre off ze ciddy?"

Hopefully Moshiri's thinking will be 'fuck class, let's have the best of everything, win a load of stuff and build a ground that makes the spruced up Anfield look like a bus shelter in croccy (lad).

It's one thing having the city council on board (they owned the King's Dock site, hence their ownership of the Echo Arena), and another trying to deal with the likes of Peel. It only serves to remind us, as time and time again we have been reminded, what a massive missed fucking opportunity the King's Dock was!

No thanks, Damian!

Oh, to be singing Ottis Redding numbers, sitting in the shadow of Everton's iconical stadium on the waterfront.

Has anyone asked what is the source and cost of financing for a long term infrastructure project of this nature, whether it be a shiny new waterfront stadium or a redeveloped Goodison Park?

Point in case, I've got a new boss, very switched on, lifelong Baggies fan, had NO idea about our beginnings. Likewise I was on the train out of London a couple of weeks ago, got talking to a Red in his late 20's from Croxteth who flatly refused to believe how they were borne out of us and told his mate it was a 'bitter blue conspiracy theory'!!! Unbelievable.

Having said that is there a local team that precedes us....?

Oh, damn it, let's just do it! :)

I do have some hope that Moshiri has come in and finally has a "plan" to move the dial at long last - something the other two muppets couldn't do in 20 years under Kenwright

A flashy new ground bang in the city would help put us on the map. We all love Goodison, but it's old-hat, a tin-pot stadium from a bygone era that we would do well to let go of in some ways.

We need a new vision, a new Everton, not the stuffy old Grandad of the Premier League telling stories of it's glory years all the time - and that's what we are. We stink of mothballs and Pears soap, when we should be shiny, modern and 21st century. 1878 was a very good year, but it's the future that really matters.

We were left behind when the Premier League started, and now is THE time to make future proofed choices that catapult us back up to the top - modernise the club from top to bottom, starting with the playing staff, a new manager, and a NEW stadium in the heart of the city.

Fuck the RS - they can stay out at Mordor and pull up the drawbridge while we rule on the waterfront!

Accrington Stanley? Who are they?

Everton? Who are they?

Then I drive past where our ground should have been and it really pisses me off. Talk about missed opportunity for a measly £30m.

Let's hope we really do make a statement here with a new waterfront stadium. I'd like it to be part of the tourist route with the Archibald Leitch designs incorporated into it. And the waterfront location would allow some great lighting effects to be seen for miles around (similar to the Allianz arena).

(How about a rollercoaster "the ToffeeCoaster" designed into the stadium roof and architecture (like the New York NewYork Hotel in Las Vegas). This would reflect the nature of being an Evertonian!!! I suspect I've had too much coffee today.)

Link

The blue emblem thing is a great idea by the way!

Every time I go near the Echo Arena, I could cry. Before I open my mouth, my wife says in a mocking voice, "That should have been our ground, that."

Yes but it's not, is it... so don't even go there.

West Ham have 52,000 season tickets sold for their new stadium; we are buzzing if it's over 25,000.

60-70,000 minimum with concessions for the younger generations and free tickets for OAPs.

Don't forget bring the overhead railway back, James Street station to Trafalgar Dock development.

£30 million was never, ever going to be enough from Everton to do the KD development, not even double or maybe even treble that. We didn't have the money to do the deal that is why we didn't get the ground. Nothing to do with Kenwright, the club was penniless and in no position to do it. Kenwright thought for a while that the £30 mm could be raised but the lender knew that it wasn't enough and that EFC couldn't repay it anyway.

DK wasn't lost because of BK, the planning review ruled that another retail development wasn't needed in the Kirkby area and it was the retail development that financed the ground.

Walton Hall also hasn't been lost by BK and the process of finding a new ground is still ongoing. Again we don't have the finance to develop a ground without the help of outside agencies. We really need to stop generating and repeating these myths as some may start believing them.

That's a great idea. We could do fly-bys over Mordor and drop things on them.

We should build our very own Allianz Arena.

I love the idea of Trafalgar Dock.

Call the ground ' Trafalgar Stadium' and offer away supporters cheap accommodation at the Lord Nelson hotel.Then, every October offer free rum at the ground.The Spanish and French teams would hate playing us in Europe.

Surely, 'victory' would be guaranteed.

I'm going for a lie down now.......'...kiss me Moshi.....'

Cue the smoke and mirrors......

Everton have been fucking the council around for years!!

Pre-moshiri, when LCC received contact from EFC regarding a new stadium, I'd imagine the first thought would be "but you're skint and couldn't organise a fucking tea party"

However, we get a billionaire business man on board and all of a sudden we're starting to be taken seriously! I bet the difference of dealing with suntan Bob and moshiri is night and day to LCC!

I'm clueless as to how all this works regarding privately owned land and councils and would love to know if you (or anyone else) know if councils can exert any pressure in a 'shit or get off the pot' way.

I suppose what I mean is, an individual can own land but the council can say what that individual can and/or can't build on it.

Just curious to know the full extent of the council's powers (as I say, I know nothing of how this type of 'thing' works).

To build a new stadium will need big money and I can't see Moshiri doing this on his own. If Usmanov wants to come on board and take us forward then, welcome aboard tovaritch.

I'm sure it no coincidence that word of exciting new stadium plans has leaked days into our search for a new manager. Fair play.

Colin's point about the 50.01% was my very first thought. Unless Moshiri sells him a bit of his. Can't seem him coming on board, but could be decent if he does. Ia the other reason for Moshiri's specific stake due to Bill?

I love Goodison. I have a great seat. Though I was shifted for the cup qf to the main stand (away fans had mine). Leg room was crap. Slight post in the way and shocking concourse. I sat there and thought 'feck me we need a new ground'. Posts in the way is a joke.

Things look to be happening for us all if a sudden because Kenwright is finished and there's a new man running the show.

Jumping the gun maybe but when I first joined TW I was belittled by a certain someone when I dared to mention that Mr. Usmanov might be lurking in the shadows.

Moshiri works for Usmanov still does. Other posters tonight have mentioned Usmanov yet have not been challenged... interesting that.

Anyways with Kenwright not calling the shots anymore there is more chance of us getting a new stadium than ever. NSNO.

If you look at the plans it's pretty impressive , hotels , residential space and yes why not a shiney new stadium it might just be the spark that the project need to get going .

As for the redevelopment of Goodison ... Well don't get me wrong I love the old place but it's looking so tired these days and just how much would it cost to redevelop ? Plus you would still have obstructed views at varies parts of the ground , it's a 20th century stadium and sadly it's time to leave .

I remember a poster saying that they would rather stay at Goodison than building a soulless bowl well for my part having been to The Emirates and compared to to our place ... Give me the bowl any day of the week , let's stop living in the past and move forward !

The advantage of buying the lot, or most, is to remove any board opposition and the requirement for awkward AGMs.

The last thing we need is a stadium out by the motorway for the benefit of a couple of thousand away fans. Nonsense! Don't we have the biggest walk-up crowd in the league?

In reality, there is very little local authorities can do to force private landowners to do something commercial that they would rather not do. There are public safety grounds, and CPO powers if for example, a major road scheme is being held up, but beyond that, they're stymied. Court proceedings would cost millions they don't have.

They can try to shame landowners to make a move, as with the retail project slowly taking shape on Edge Lane. These guys do tend to have very thick skins, and very deep pockets, so it is very difficult for local authorities in cases like this.

There was a piece in last night's Echo about the death of another major Liverpool land owner, Joe Davies, and those of you with long memories will recall the long running spats he had with councils over a major tract of brownfield land between 'Royal' Bootle Golf Course and the Giro off Dunnings Bridge Road.

Now that would have been a great stadium site, 2 miles from Switch Island. It's still largely undeveloped apart from some speculative office stuff on Dunnings Bridge itself I think. Anyway, it can't be on Mayor Joe's radar because it's in Sefton!

If his shareholding was 75% + 1 (i.e. 76%) then, unless the shareholders' agreement states otherwise, he could then do whatever he wanted with us.

You really think that's progress? It's a terrible stadium for football. The seats are too far from the pitch & the gradient is too shallow so the place lacks all atmosphere & sense of intensity, apart from when the away supporters all stand & generate some noise. A far cry from the excellent vibe they used to have at Highbury. So no thanks to the soul-less bowls, ta!

As I recall, someone posted a while back about redevelopments on the continent for one of the major tournaments, possibly in Germany [?], where there was great emphasis on creating modern stadiums akin to classic English style grounds - with 4 sides, fairly close to the pitch & a steeper gradient to keep more seats nearer & help create that intense atmosphere .

Maybe some agreement beneficial for all will be 'negotiated.'

Pictures twitchy, beaked-up, plazzy replica uzi wielding mob screaming at Sir Herbert Peelingforth (or whoever).

"Juss fuckin' sign it lad, swear down if y' don't, I'll fuckin blow yer 'ead raaar off lad, on me baby's life lad"

Etc lad.

Wanted to mention having worked a little with Peel and know how they work, Peel do all the ground work and use investors to do the build. They work along the same principle as a REIT (Look at Shaftbury They own most of London) Even though I don't know if Peel are registered as a REIT I think they are 22 in the UK. So having input from a very know Investor like Mr Moshri would be win - win for Peel. Also the plans for the water front have been place for years and Peel cannot build another Liverpool One just down the road, However a Football Stadium, Offices and Residential would be a investors dream (And LCC's all the extra Rates they would pull into the coffers)

Remember when the RS was going to Build on Stanley Park? My Ex Sister in-law work as a Project Manager on that site, Apparently from what I can remember the then Liverpool board Shafted Peel in a big way when that got dropped I mean Millions of Pounds down the Drain, Maybe this is Peel's way to stick 2 finger up to the RS.

It has to work as an investment proposal for Peel Holdings. These guys are ruled by numbers not any sort of sentiment. What's my yield, what's my return, what's the risk. They certainly have never shown an appetite to build stadium because ultimately residential, office and retail will definitely give them more in such high profile locations.
Also this is a highly complex development which could take 50 years to complete. It will be riddled with complexity. If three years is the aim, I just can't see it being on this site.

I'd start checking bus routes to Croxteth.

As you're so clever, I'll leave you to work out what that means.

PS You snobbily talk about 'lack of intelligence, education/small minds' as one of your hypotheses. Well I have 'Level 8 qualifications' so you'd better get back to the drawing board, eh.

I see you're very upset 'offended' perhaps. I quite like Stephen Fry's quote on this:

"It's now very common to hear people say, 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more... than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so fucking what."

This is a discussion forum – and had you Damian floated a similar perfectly reasonable idea for discussion in a public place and a compete stranger had responded by telling you to "fuck off" to your face, I suspect that you would have done a little more than chuckle!

My faith is eroded after the numerous false promises and BS spewed forth by Chairman Bill and his bum chums on our board for the last few decades.

Cmon, Moshiri, make me a believer again, please!

With regard to the liverbird issue - Terry#212 - spot on!

We had the bird first, why should we cede usage of our cities image to the usurpers?

Theres two of them anyway, so why can we not incorporate an opposite facing (to the pinkies versions) Blue Bird, which is combined with our tower etc on our club merchandise/paperwork/strip/crest? No copyright infringement there?

I don't know how much money Mr Moshiri is willing to invest in a new stadium but you can be damm sure that Peel Holdings will sit down and hear what he's got to say because they know full well he is a businessman with friends and associates with seriously deep pockets it could be a win win for both parties .

Let's not be too quick to write it off just yet , keep dreaming boys keep dreaming !!

I tend to find that businessmen with 'deep pockets' are most likely to be hardest nosed about investing their money.

It's not for me to write off, I'm sure everyone would 'want' a landmark stadium. But with my relatively limited real estate experience I know that a new site in Croxteth or the likes will be significantly cheaper than one situated in a city centre location. And I'm not sure realistically why it would deliver significantly more revenue.

I could off course be completely wrong but it's going to take a bit more than Damian Wilde's mate and his intimate working relationship with John Whittaker to get me dreaming.

Personally, I would much prefer a water front stadium down at the docks, than Croxteth. As Eugene said "Docky, not Crocky".

May I apologise if you were so offended a little bit of industrial language you see often on TW.

And I can assure a sensitive soul like yourself that there was no alcohol involved when I posted that. At 17.04 I'd only just finished work, and I take it you don't even go to the match if you find a little bit bad language so offensive.

You simply came out with what I saw as the most ridiculous suggestion I've ever seen on here ie move the club to bloody Wirral ( so sorry about the language btw).

Do you not even remember the controversy over moving the club out of the City to Kirkby then you suggest moving over the water???

We're a football club, not a franchise to be shunted around.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/could-new-Everton-stadium-help-11344102

Could be Croxteth :(

No issues with Joe tying an Everton stadium build in with a Commonwealth Games bid.

More concerned with:

1) the site being at Stonebridge Cross, rather than the waterfront

2) his clear statement that the stadium would NOT "just be for the Commonwealth Games but things like the European Athletics championships and other sporting events...

"The new ground could accommodate that. And most of these events take place outside the football season so the ground could be used all year round."

Continental multi-functional sports stadia like the one seemingly proposed here with an athletics track seriously distance spectactors from the footy and impact on the ground's atmosphere.

I know engineering and architectural design is very inventive these days, but as the City and Hammers examples show, they had no desire to retain the running track in their football stadium.

Tricky one...

But an Usmanov eventual takeover of EFC? Why would Moshiri do that?

As far as the "I know a guy, who heard . . ." comments. Usmanov mad about how Kroenke runs Arsenal is public news. We're all ITK. He wants to divest, so purchases another 15% of that club?

What's the chances that the club would seek support from fans by asking fans what they would like?

I feel a TW poll on its way!

Sounds like Anderson wants it as a stadium anybody can use! Would it feel like ours?

In the words of BK. What a missed opportunity!

Better go check my facts now.

There is no requirement for a major athletics facility anywhere in the UK and certainly not in Liverpool. Both of the stadiums built in 2000 and 2012 have ultimately ended up being converted. There is no way we are waiting until 2026 for a City / West Ham type of deal.

Let's assume we could deliver something on either of the sites, it will be done on a commercial basis not as any sort of vanity scheme in my opinion.

Imagine if you car is goosed, literally on its last legs and you suddenly come into a little money. You've always wanted a Ferrari but it's going to take a big chunk of that money and fuck me the running costs are high which means you've got less money to spend on other things.

Ultimately I watch Everton because I want to see us win, I've got no problem with heading out to Croxteth if it makes financial sense. If I want to spend a day on the waterfront I will go for a meal with the other half.

TW asks us to report abusive comments made by one ToffeeWebber to another and that's what I did – whoever looked at my report clearly agreed that the comment was abusive as it was removed.

As to attempting to belittle you, I am sorry if that was the way my comment came across – I quoted a common saying used as a generality. Clearly there are exceptions that prove the rule, eg, every cloud does NOT have a silver lining, the hokey cokey is NOT what it's all about! Whatever, shall we call it quits?

Do they know they're expected to share all of their business and financial planning with the fans I wonder?

Do they know they don't own the club but the fans do? I'm sure they'll do OK regardless :-)

Yeah, no problem, let's move on.

Re your specific points, firstly I saw my first match at Goodison Park in March 1963 (a 2-0 win against Nottm Forest) and have not only been (and currently am) a season ticket holder for more years than I can remember but have travelled over Europe supporting our Club and still go to about 40/50% of all away games.

I don't know how old you are, Ste, but if as I guess you are considerably younger than me, I hope you'll forgive me for using the time honoured phrase "I've (probably) been to more games than you've had hot dinners". Apologies if I'm wrong but as an aside, you've hit on something I've thought about for some time, that being exactly how many of our fellow ToffeeWebbers actually do go to the match? And consequently why it would bother some as to exactly where we do play?

Secondly, I did not SUGGEST a move to Wirral, merely put it up as a discussion point – that is why I thought a "fuck off" response was OTT. I am a born and bred scouser (to my shame, I went to same school as Billy Bullshit!) who now happens to live on The Wirral so I do not see the river to be as much of a barrier as some. I doubt, for example, that a Fulham, Chelsea etc fan would see the Thames as an insurmountable barrier should the prospect of a state-of-the-art stadium on it's other bank be a possibility. That said, I respect your view that a move is unacceptable – you clearly feel as strongly about a move "over the water" as I did about the proposed Kirkby move!

Anyway, we're both Evertonians so like I said to Damian, shall we call it quits? I drink in the Saddle before all home games – if you're ever passing, call in and have a pint with me as I suspect we've got more in common than is immediately apparent!

A proper purpose built football stadium is what we need, and although Croxteth would be cheaper, surely a stadium nearer the city centre would generate much more income with bigger gates, concerts, events, conferences etc etc.

However I am now warming to the idea of a new "Mersey Stadium - Home of Everton Football Club"

One of my fondest memories of my last visit to Birkenhead - the place of my birth, was standing on Bidston Hill at the Windmill with my brother Len looking across the river at "The Pool". It is a magnificent view.

I can just imagine our new blue stadium on the "royal Blue Mersey.

Position, position, position.

Isn't it great to be dreaming big again!?

Up the Blues!