Football to return when it is ''safe and appropriate''

...while the governing body's executive committee has agreed to relax some parts of its Financial Fair Play rules that limit losses clubs can incur, saying “exceptional circumstances necessitate some specific interventions”. There is, for example, no longer a need to provide financial reports due to the “ongoing extraordinary events”.

“It sticks in the throat. This exposes the crazy economics in English football and the moral vacuum at its centre.”

Which probably echoes many supporters views on the subject but proposed caps or reductions haven't gone down too well with the PFA who said in a letter to their members:

“The PFA requested to see each club's financial situation before we offer advice to players on whether to accept the terms offered. "Before accepting or signing any paperwork from your club, it is vitally important that squads collectively discuss proposals with the PFA.”

Premier League set for civil war with PFA over wage cuts amid "moral vacuum" accusations

Could football be facing possible industrial action if an amicable agreement can't be reached?

If that is the case, then Walcott, Schneiderlin, Niasse, Martina, Bolasie, Sandro and Besic will all be off the wage bill by June 2021, some before then.

If you add the stadium naming rights, if they get the go-ahead before next June, then Carlo is going to have one hell of a transfer kitty.

None of this matters at the moment, but there is a massive light at the end of the tunnel for Everton and its supporters.

Have a word with yourselves you over paid wasters.

Much as we love these guys (well some of them) you can't tell me that somebody like Morgan Schneiderlin can't exist on £96k a week instead of £120k if he had a 20% pay cut.

I can see the Clubs effectively moving pre-season to now and rolling the start of next season straight on to the end of this one. Players might well argue that means they will still play as many games, and that may end up being true, but perhaps they need to think about how privileged they really are.

They may well also ask why other high-paid members of society, Individual Sportsmen or Entertainers aren't also taking a pay cut. That's also a fair question, but ultimately they are overpaid for what they do, they should know that, and in Football you rely on the Fans' goodwill and support more than other Sports I believe. There is no logic to following a football club, it's based on emotion. Ruin that emotional bond with the fans and what are you left with? Not much really.

If Lionel Messi can give up 70% of his wages, why can't Premier League and Championship players offer to give up 20%?

Because, Gordon, you are missing the point!!

I'm with you on this but a 20% cut from such high wages is nowhere near enough. I liked Messi's comment about the Barca players suggesting a 70% cut would be acceptable. The Premier League players have to get real! They'd all still be in mega comfort and that's without touching their savings.

The Football hierarchy should stop fannying around and make some clear decisions. At least they've reached the point of stating that football won't return until "it is safe and appropriate" to do so. OMG what an outcome after months of deliberation???

What makes them any more special? They are all just employees of a business.

The meetings these idiots running the game should be discussing what to do with the vast amounts of money the players are made to forego.

When so many people are losing their livelihood or at best seeing their income significantly reduced to see a selected few doing or contributing sweet fuck-all is galling.

Why can't they subsidise the non-playing staff at the least?

If these greedy fuckers don't voluntarily give up a huge percentage of their wages. We should boycott them.

BTW Hats off to Eddie Howe. Being one of the lower earners among premier league managers didnt stop him being first in line to take a cut. I'd like to see Carlo follow suit. If the worlds most successful manager can take a pay cut, it leaves the others with very few excuses not to do the same.

I never thought I could live without football. Who did ? but here we are. The world is still turning
If these players and managers don't start acting like decent human beings. They will kill the goose which laid their golden egg.

I can see football fans in their droves turning away from these greedy fuckers and going back to grass roots

Hearts asked their players to take a 50% pay cut.
Steven Naismith, star man by the way, immediately agreed. Their manager waived his salary. The rest of the squad told the club to piss off.

The Club gave them until yesterday to agree to the cut or their salaries would be deferred, I take it that means stopped.

There appears to be a clause in SPL contracts that give clubs the right, in certain circumstances, to implement this.

It will be interesting to read the outcome.

Everton players, as should all PL players, should give up a massive proportion of their salaries by their own volition.
If they don't they should all be named and bloody shamed.
Once this is all over, like shops and businesses who have abused this sad situation, there should be some sort of retribution

The fact that we are paying massive wages to wasters like Tosun, Walcott, Iwobi, Schneiderlin and now I must add Sigurdsson to that list makes me sick to the stomach.

In times of crisis when retail staff, delivery drivers and NHS staff etc... are risking their lives for a pittance and these wankers (with some exceptions) are proudly showing off their fully equipped mansions on social media, while refusing to lose any of their benefits, makes me hope the whole rotten, corrupt structure of the EPL comes crashing down!!

I’d love to see some of these prima donnas stacking shelves in Asda one day.

You say that you didn’t think you could live without football. I felt the same. I thought that it would leave such a void in my life that the days would seem pretty empty, with nothing to look forward to at the weekend, no trip to Goodison, no match to settle down and watch on tv with a glass of red in hand. But the longer this goes on, and the more we can see the greed and avarice, the selfish antics of mercenary, millionaire footballers, the breast beating, hand wringing display from “football people “ who’s main concern is money, and hanging on to it, the more I realise that football today is not the football I fell in love with when I was little. I still love Everton, always will, but I don’t love football anymore. How can you when most of the players you cheer from the terraces clearly don’t give a flying one for any of us?
To be honest, apart from seeing loved ones who are miles away, the thing I miss most now is going for a game of golf with my mates, and a coffee and some banter afterwards. I imagine that, countrywide, that I’m not the only one disenchanted with football now we see the level of greed and selfishness within. Football will kill itself.

There are obviously some players who know the score and can’t believe the wages they are on, the only one I have ever heard say it, is Mata of Man.Unt, he said it only last season that he can’t believe how privileged he is to be paid the wages he gets just for being a professional footballer.

I think the time has come for all sportsmen and especially footballers to realise the gravy train is coming for a long due overall and they will all have to come back down to earth.

We ought to be piling on to their twitter and Instagram feeds to alert them to the error if their ways.

It is an absolute disgrace. I am ashamed that Everton players aren't leading the way with this either.

If Barcelona and Juventus players can do it then I do not understand why the Premier league players think they are immune and they would rather see people struggling to survive than perhaps take a reduction in their 100-500k per week wages.

I will never watch another Premier league game again.

These people need to know how obnoxious most of us feel about their flaunting of wealth and indifference to society as a whole. They share the planet with the rest of us so they should share the pain as well.

Usually when anything major happens, as with this current pandemic, there is a stark reminder of how vulnerable we are as human beings. The good aspect is that people are prioritising life before anything else, and an appreciation of fellow human beings.

Hopefully we will come out of this stronger, and benefit from the lessons learnt, now whether that will extend to the footballers, when presumably there will be an end to this curse, will of course be a subject that remains to be seen.

Again hopefully we will have a game of golf when this is all over, take care, stay safe, a message I extend to everyone on TW, and people in general.

This thread is only going one way, and the fact that footballers have done nothing, only makes us realise we have been watching a phoney game for way to long.

Darren@15, first paragraph, bang on the money...How could any man earning a fortune, stand by and let the people who get paid a pittance, lose their jobs and do nothing about it?

Footballers, I remember being a young pro at Forest, when they won the league cup, and got £7000 a man bonus. The players had a party in a local wine-bar, and the bill was about two grand, and they were fucking fuming, especially because one of the young apprentices, got a couple of bottles of champagne, and was squirting it everywhere, even though this kid was Nottingham born, and absolutely loved Forest.

I remember arguing with a few first team players, telling them to get their fucking heads together, (it wasn’t even an argument) because they were trying to get £50 off everyone who was at the party, even though the apprentice kids were only on £35 a week.

I remember telling them that it was a good job they never played for Everton, because if they did that bar bill would have been about ten grand because of me alone, and couldn’t they see that Forest winning the cup obviously meant more to Sharpy, (the young apprentice) than it must have meant to themselves, which finally stopped some of the greedy bastards in their tracks.

When you read about some clubs cutting the wages of their non playing staff, and then asking the government to help by paying the retention scheme, is beyond belief.

I miss football as much as anyone, but FFS, the quicker we can find a vaccine to kill this disease, the quicker we can get back to normal everyday life, and the wages of these overrated players would go a long way to doing this.

Seems the Premier League is heading the same way.

I must confess that I am surprised at the direction of this thread. There are two clear points of issue:

1. That Premier League footballers are vastly overpaid. 2. That said Premier League players should be giving a large chunk of their pay too support lower wage earners at their own club and to save their employer from financial difficulties.

I assume that this dialogue is being driven by the press, hmmm. I haven't bought a newspaper in many years so I am unsure of this but why attack greedy footballers? They are in the entertainment industry, they get paid disproportionately to regular workers, not their fault.

Equally if workers are having to survive on 80% of their regular wage while laid off, then it seems reasonable to me that the playing staff should receive a similar reduction in pay.

I am sure that there will be complex tax issues to be factored in and their trade union is looking after their interests, as it should be doing. This will no doubt delay an agreed outcome. I don't think that we should decry the players, when we do not know their position on this vexed subject.

Take care and stay safe, COYB.

Well, I have to say we have seen very little response from hardly any Premier League players so far, and it just feels that they shouldn't need anybody to tell them what to do each squad should have got together and decided how each should contribute.

I don't know know how football will get back to normal, until a vaccine has been produced, as no football ground seats would qualify under the 2 metres safe distancing. But to be honest at this moment in time I am in no hurry to return to Goodison, I hope and suspect over the coming months my attitude will change.

Maybe if players do donate part of their salary to their fellow workers who have been put on furlough, then maybe if there is money left over maybe they could get in touch with the local Universities and laboratories who said yesterday they can produce many testing kits and there is no shortage of material to produce these kits. Then these kits could be distributed to our frontline NHS staff and care workers.

Now that would be a big statement from the Premier League players and it would make a massive difference and would definitely change people's current perception of our Premier League players.

At what point do we say "Ok, you don't need to because you're not earning what we've decided is too much?"

Don't get me wrong, I was one of the first to suggest each Premier League club adopt a lower league club/s during the crisis and help them survive, but I'm just throwing it out there rather than the thread just going down one road and pointing out how selfish and overpaid the Premier League players are.

Are there, for instance, any really well paid Toffeewebbers who've foregone a percentage of their salary?

As I see it in my limited capacity, there are three obstacles here, The Football League, who even IF they suggest that some financial deduction from players and Clubs me made by those who are in a position to do so.

Then there is the Players Union probably arguing that they are under an agreed Contract, and the present pandemic is none of their member's fault, and they are technically available to play, what they have been contracted for.

Then there are the individuals themselves, I don't believe, whether instructed or advised to, or not, nothing should prevent them from making a voluntary contribution, independent of any agent, union or League directive.

The only one I have heard of doing this was Steven Naismith at Hearts in Scotland, and he will always be remembered and respected by many for his unselfish actions. Not only at this moment in time but for his previous acts of unselfishness and benevolence, to those less fortunate.

I'm pretty sure that if any Premier or Championship Footballer had acted similarly to Steven Naismith we would have heard about it by now.

The clubs themselves are to blame, they have no inbuilt contingency plans for when circumstances alter and they certainly have no plans for times such as we have today.

As per usual the ordinary person is the first to suffer 'furlough' or a loss of job because they are an easy target and have very little power over their own destiny. Most footballers, however, have a great deal of power over their own destiny's they care not who pays their salaries, they care not for the shirt they wear, but they do know their own commercial value and have exploited it to the nth degree in the last decade.

If the players do 'give up' part of their wages who does this benefit? I'm not certain that the sacrifice will have a positive impact upon the ordinary club employee, of course lower down the pyramid it could help to keep the club viable but at the top end?

Perhaps the Government could impose a levy on players wages and redistribute that levy to the smaller clubs but I won't hold my breath.

The staff and supporters of those clubs will not easily forget this. It will backfire on clubs that have their greedy heads stuck in the sand. It will cause division and weakness in those clubs for many years.

Supporters will know, when the chips are down, they are definitely not all in this together in any sense.

If they weren't embarrassed by their riches then, despite seeing the poverty, unemployment and deprivation around Goodison Park, why should they be now? If they weren't offering Doris the tea lady a share of their enormous wages then, why would they now?

My guess is we'll see token gestures – players dropping the odd ten grand a week and expecting the world to pat them on the head for their generosity. Personally I don't give a fuck whether they take a pay cut or not – they earn ludicrous sums whatever happens, but it doesn't stop me paying to watch them.

Doris can do one, her tea is crap anyway.

It's all a bit pie-in-the-sky to expect (the majority) the high earners to sacrifice their luxurious lifestyles. St Barts, St Tropez, Las Vegas etc... will just have to wait.

Hopefully one good thing that will come out of this mess will be real sea change in football economics, including a realistic level of players' salaries. I would have no problem with a salary cap.

Subsequently, when I did go to the odd game, I found that I didn't really enjoy it. I was tense and the footy was mainly shite and I could see it for what it was as opposed to blindly following it.

Also, I felt that the entertainment on offer didn't justify the expense of a matchday. I go to British Superbike racing at Oulton Park and get a full day's high-quality entertainment from dedicated professional sportsmen consisting of about 10 races plus practice for about £30! In recent seasons, our overpaid prima donnas haven't even been trying!!

I have loved Everton since 1966 and will always be gutted when we lose but, when football begins again, I am going to be watching my local team, South Liverpool, for some grass-roots honesty and effort!

The players etc have become greedy, the clubs clamour for success, the fans demand it and the Media, Gambling, companies etc have supported it to increase their own revenues.

So we see Neymar getting a bonus of €375,000 per month to ensure he claps the fans and behaves himself, and all players getting paid to take an isotonic drink at half time and full time ……..

Yet as the Madrid Health Executive said last week - What type of society have we let develop when we have a huge shortage of nurses, doctors, many of who are losing their lives every day, on paltry salaries of €2000-3000 per month yet we pay our footballers €1,000,000 per month !!

Football has to crash, it's obscene.

I'm not saying this is, like, a good idea or anything. I just thought I'd pitch the idea for discussion - if it were to be replicated in England, how would that work? They've spec'd out the logistics and have said the 'lack of testing equipment' is 'not a problem'. I'm thinking Anglesey. The Orkneys?

Is right. People will not forget. But that works both ways.

Its not too late for these people to redeem themselves. I think they could all be forgiven for underestimating the gravity of the situation a month ago.
If the Everton players came out now and said they were donating a sizeable percentage of their wages I would be very proud... but if they're going to do it, they really do need to hurry up.

We remember kindnesses as well as crass selfishness.

Naismith is a shining example. We may have already forgotten most of his performances as a player, but his actions as a human being towards the less fortunate will live long in the memory.

"It sticks in the throat. This exposes the crazy economics in English football and the moral vacuum at its centre.”

It's absurd - obscene, even - that ordinary Joes and Janes on very basic salaries are being furloughed or laid off by football clubs.

I can understand the need for clubs to 'realign' their finances in the current climate, but they are surely going about it arse about face by starting at the base, rather than the top, of their financial pyramid.

The immediate and most beneficial readjustment they can make is with ALL their highest earners and work their way down.

For some clubs it may determine the continuation of their very existence.

It's no easy task. Contracts are signed for a reason. We live in a dysfunctional capitalist society in which many people are not suitably rewarded for the contribution and benefits their work makes to wider society.

I very much doubt, once this is all over, that that particular world order is going to change any time soon, more's the pity.

It is no casual decision to forgo 20-40-60% of your salary no matter who you are.

Yes, many high-profile players are well-protected from such measures, but people like Steven Naismith are a very rare breed. He has always displayed a strong social conscience towards those less fortunate than himself.

As others mention, players are sharing 'fun' videos from their ivory towers of how they are 'coping' with self-isolation.

Some have expressed sympathy about how it is impacting on society at wide.

Many joined in the NHS applause.

What disappoints me most about this issue is that it's become almost a game of dare. Who is going to blink first? The various football governing bodies? The clubs? The players? The invested media outlets?

There seems to be an awful lot of meetings without any resolution on this and other issues.

But to me it comes down to each and every individual.

Why wait for an order from on high?

What's stopping any player (other than his agent - ahem!) from unilaterally showing solidarity with his club, its supporters, its essential and lower-paid staff, by offering HIMSELF to accept a salary cut/cap at this time?

The Belgian League has been cancelled due to the coronavirus.
They have decided that the current table is final, which means that Club Brugge as champions and AA Gent go into the pre-CL stage as runners-up. However this needs approval from FIFA General Assembly

This could be the test case which could have a domino effect on the rest of the European Leagues but the possibility of TV companies suing the Premier League in particular, may muddy the waters somewhat.

If my view is naive and it is okay for the FA to treat richer clubs differently and there is a legal or procedural reason for it, then I am more than willing to be educated on it, so I don't keep banging on about something which is wrong.

Integrity is intellectual honesty, the difference between right and wrong, every normal person over the age of five has integrity, so if the players don’t know what they should do they are turning a very blind and selfish eye to this crisis.

Perhaps the best for a player is not to take a pay cut, because that requires a contractual agreement with the employer (club). The club dare not do it because that means a player could walk away under breach of contract. The player may not want to do it because that sets a precedent for the future.

But maybe the fair solution is - OK everyone, I am on £70,000 per week, I am going to donate £60,000 a week to. . . . . charity/local hospital/club staff on reduced wages.

That way
a. the rich are in it as well
b. no precedents for the future
c. the player comes out smelling of roses because, hey, we forget he is still living off £500,000 per year.

You somehow feel the Everton squad of mid-late noughties would have been one of the first to do this with the likes of Carsley, Neville, Cahill, etc.

Nail on head mate.

I don't disagree with anything you wrote, Phil.

As I said in my own post, it's a game of dare. Who is going to blink first and topple the first domino and set the precedent?

ALL the invested parties have very sharp lawyers and accountants behind them.

They could ALL make donations themselves without the imposition of a set percentage salary cut.

As Brent @ 55 mentions, Gift Aid is one way to 'soften' the blow whilst looking good to the public.

There are ways. What clearly is missing is the will.

And moral consciousness.

The fact Eddie Howe was the first and only so far to offer a voluntary wage cut didn't surprise me one bit. Eddie took that club from nothing, built it to what it is, and his hands are all over that club. Apparently he delegates little and is like an old-fashioned manager in that he's the heartbeat of them. His sacrifice is as much about leadership and responsibility and a shared journey. You get the feeling with him that it's not just a job or career path which is unique in the Premier League.

The majority of players and managers will only take pay cuts kicking and screaming and will instead hope to get away with the obligatory PR exercises and token gestures. I'm really delighted by our club's behaviour with EitC being a shining light to all Premier League clubs. We can only hope it's highly earning staff whether executives, management or players will follow its lead.

Personally I'm wary of the clamour to impel individuals to bail out a government that is doing precisely what many of us said they would do.

Weren't they 'the will of the people'? Or have 'the people' finally opened their eyes and deflected their anger onto a different group of 'others'?

Absolute disgrace this.

Barcelona and Juventus players can do it, and much more quickly, so for people above to be using tax and trade unions and contract breaches as excuses need to look at themselves in the mirror.

This is purely about being a good, caring human being and is a prime example of the rot that has torn through the Premier League and the cancer that are their agents. I still don't understand why Fifa, Uefa and the leagues have not come together to regulate agents properly, cap their earnings, stop clubs paying agents completely as they are solely acting for the players and themselves and not in the best interest of the clubs.

I am so disappointed and I hope this changes football for good.

"Personally I'm wary of the clamour to impel individuals to bail out a government that is doing precisely what many of us said they would do."

That is a sentiment I can wholeheartedly agree with.

For football fans, players and their inflated salaries make an easy target in crisis such as this.

What needs to be more under the microscopic is the very fabric of politics, 'Democracy' in particular, and capitalism and the 'free market' (which is anything but free) and what happy bed fellows they make.

How would supporters feel if, as expressed by many, highly paid sports men and women DID accept pay cuts, or contribute to the national treasury, only for the government to then bail out the likes of Richard Branson's Virgin Airlines as he requested?

The man who wasted no time in asking staff to take 8 weeks unpaid leave as soon as things got wobbly with the aviation industry? The great irony being some of those self-same staff came out in DEFENCE of Branson, saying they would do 'anything' to save HIS company!

How does that old time music hall number go?

'It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor wot gets the blame
It's the rich wot gets the pleasure
Ain't it all a bloomin' shame?'

Totally concur. Especially about Branson, who sued NHS for millions in the recent past. There’s a petition on line asking the Government not to support him.

Any bets?

I've felt that way for the past 4 or 5 years.

Football is increasingly out-of-touch with its traditional core base; is over-exposed in the media (previews, reviews and general air-headed chats and podcasts); has too many hangers-on and parasites (bloody Robbie Savage and even his mother on the radio); too many statistics and the bores who feed on that; and has become quite corporate and soulless in my opinion.

Then there's the banal interview post match with the classic, “How pleased / disappointed are you with that win / loss?”

Nigel Pearson when at Leicester is one of the few I've seen get hacked-off with that kind of question.

I'll always be an Evertonian but, when people use words like ‘brand' and ‘product' around the game, it loses its appeal.

Let's hope as a society we rise against it and start to value what's good instead. The ‘ low skilled' cleaners and care workers are now more important than your Morgan Schneiderlins of this world!

I for one will also not forget the behaviour of Tim Martins, Mike Ashley, and Richard Branson! Greed and arrogance!!!

Footballers just have to take a pay cut whilst this goes on! They have no option! If they had any sort of PR sense, they would be doing it voluntarily. If they do not I think, the house of cards will tumble very quickly!

I know this has been said before but, if it wasn't Liverpool who were to suffer, the Premier League would have been cancelled a few weeks ago! Wimbledon, Champions League, all other football, even the Olympics has gone but the Premier League is too important apparently and has to finish!!

I adore Everton as we all do but I'm not sure I can condone much more of this from the so-called greatest league in the world!

But most of my anger is directed at this government. I posted 2 weeks ago that the country which had been most successful fighting the coronavirus was South Korea. How had they been successful by testing and tracing, within weeks of knowing about the virus, they had tested 290,000 and traced all contacts of anybody who had the virus. They had also established an app that everybody with a phone could download, and it would alert them if they were in or entering a high-risk area.

Yet here we see members of the government saying that all the protective equipment has been delivered to all frontline services, not true. They said a week ago that we would shortly up the testing capability to 25,000 so far I think it's not up to 10,000 and still struggling to test every NHS worker on the frontline. Also initially, there was talk of a herd immunity; thankfully that has now been shelved.

Apart from a vaccine to lessen the effect of the virus or a vaccine that will kill off the virus, we need to massively roll out a testing and tracing policy. A government spokesman the other day claimed the reason they hadn't been able to produce enough testing kits was because there was a shortage of an element for the kit. Yet yesterday a guy from one of the top labrotories said there wasn't a shortage and they could produce the kits as soon as the government gave them an order to produce them.

Please make sure if you can you get out at 8:00 pm and applaud not only our NHS workers but all who are working to try and keep the country going.

There are several posts above which mention 'contracts' and how the Clubs could fall foul of these 'contracts' by reducing the players' wages.

Are these the same contracts that are regularly forgotten whenever a so-called 'Big Club' comes sniffing round the bottom of a player like a randy Labrador? The player who has 'always supported' this Big Club 'since I was a kid'... 'always watched them''... 'have unfinished business' with them and on and on...

The same contracts that mean Sweet FA to the shitbucket of an agent who hawks his player round any number of wealthy clubs so that player XYZ can play for the Champions League side where his talents deserve to be seen? This after half a dozen good performances at Sheffield Utd, Wolves, Palace, WHU and yes, Everton. Please, let's accept contracts for what they are. Worthless scraps of paper, heavily weighted in favour of the player (and Mr Shitbucket).

The likes of Posturing Pogba are the sort of player who has really turned me away from football. He's done fuck-all for Man Utd, just trousered a shed full of money every month, yet he shows his thanks by making eyes at Juventus where, no doubt, 'he's always wanted to play', in the Serie A, a League he's 'always followed'. Pricks like him are better off out of the Premier League. With his 'contract' protruding from his backside.

(For Pogba, read any number of mercenary players. It's just his arrogant, posturing, self-serving attitude and persona that pisses me off.)

Whilst I agree that Premier League players are obscenely overpaid and that many of them waste millions of pounds on ridiculous trappings, I hate it when over-generalisations are made about ALL footballers. There is one Premier League footballer, I've been told, donates a substantial percentage of his income to an African trust.

So, while I agree with the current outrage about players' earnings, let's not rush to tar everyone with the same brush.

On a wider note, what is Gordon Taylor doing with his enormous salary, I wonder? And "celebrities" in the wider entertainment industry?

Time for a re-think about society as a whole, I think.

I am totally disenchanted with the 'beautiful game'. After years of swallowing the guff spouted by clubs and media I like to think I have sussed out the whole charade that is now football. It's not what I knew, not what I expect. I no longer have any feelings for the game, and I will no longer subscribe to these astronomical salaries.

This virus is a disaster but I am sure it will mean many will review their priorities.

They need to act faster and get the NHS staff tested which takes me to asking this question.

How many people who have self-isolated at home survived and how many who have been taken into hospital have not been so lucky?

Is the hospital isolation not working as well due to the Government's slowness on getting the staff tested?

Not saying for one minute that is the reason, but does make you wonder if it is better staying at home, without contact.

The levels of hardship and stress placed on the NHS and 100s of thousands of workers, is unparalleled in peace time.

If the Premier League had anything about them, they'd set an example and make it mandatory to support their local hospitals and emergency services.

If it happens soon, better late than never, but I doubt it will.

I see an exodus away from the game which would only be capable of being fixed if the Premier League gate prices went down to under a score.

If and when business as usual is restored, the big bonus and sponsorship deals will not be common-place and normal hardworking people will be even more frugal with their hard-earned cash.

Fair play to clubs and players who are showing help and compassion, let's hope football players and their agents will learn from what's happening.

However, should the Premier League return without fans in the stadium, or before this pandemic is fully over, I won't watch another Premier League game again.

Using vital public services, ambulances and police, when they're stretched beyond endurance, just to satisfy contracts with broadcasters, would be abhorrent beyond words.

Fuck the broadcasters, fuck the pampered players and managers and agents.

I couldn't give a flying fuck about football at this time, and won't do until the world is back to normal.

If this results in players being worth less, or earning less, and they don't like it, let then leave the sport and take up a proper job.

This virus has shown up some people to be lovely, generous, caring, and wholeheartedly good people.

Unfortunately, it has also shown us some sections of society are selfish, black-hearted, twats, belonging in a sewer, and I'm afraid the Premier League is near the top of this pile of stinking shite!

Me and my wife and grandson got out last week and joined a disappointing few on my road to clap the NHS workers. I'll be out again tonight at 8:00 pm, it's only for a few minutes, try and have a go. It's only a token but it shows our gratitude for these people carrying on working, some for a pittance, and putting their lives at risk.

No one at the club (playing and none playing staff) will suffer financially during the crises.

All casual staff, stewards, hospitality etc, who work solely on match days will receive the money that they would normally earn. In addition, should the matches be rearranged for over the summer, they will receive additional payments.

Should the playing staff voluntarily reduce their wages, then that is for them.

At the moment, our club should not be criticised in the same way as the money grabbing bastards mentioned earlier in this post.

No shit! Even Klopp said so, according to Carlo.

Herd immunity was still the stance on 11th March, one of the advisors said as much the same day, but there were 6 confirmed cases in the city then and there's 262 now. You can't say it's contributed to that increase but you can say it didn't fucking help.

Whose decision? Maybe we'll hear from Liverpool FC now?

Article in the Guardian now.

Unfortunately, they are often advised by people bereft of morality. The Premier League engages us, but it is small beer to the vermin who really are milking it without conscience.

We can only make personal choices and mine is that I am embarrassed to have invested so much emotion into a decadent, obscene, circus that really is utterly pointless. This virus will hit Africa, Central and South America much worse than us.

Can any of us take any comfort in the fact that we might be watching our monumentally paid heroes once more on MotD while Africa is being ravaged.

Brian #73, it is definitely better to stay at home, without contact, if you have a mild case of the virus... and you have people who can help you, because this can worsen very, very quickly. Sadly, older people living alone in Brooklyn have been found dead of the virus in their apartments.

And it is certainly a problem that people like Eddie Large with pre-existing conditions can catch the virus at the hospital and die. My father-in-law in Wuhan has been kept home without his 3X/week cancer treatments for more than two months because the risk involved in taking him to the hospital was deemed higher than the risk of missing treatment. (He's doing OK.) Balancing the dangers of this pestilence is an every-day issue.

With regards to the title of this thread, I personally believe that footy has been more safe and appropriate since Joey Barton hung 'em up, but that's just me.

If you scale that up to the banks and the airlines etc, they all know they don't have to help because they can get bailed out by any government because it hurts too many others lower down the food chain. Players and big businesses know their value to the overall economy so can afford to be as greedy as they like.

It's disgusting.

I've long wanted the football bubble to be burst, in fact I'd had enough c. 2008 and got a season ticket at Barnet, I started to enjoy going the game again. I was lured back in 2013 because we moved stateside, and I needed the connection and nostalgia. But I don't want it to burst like this, with tragedy and upset.

Don't miss the footy one bit.

If / when the virus hits these national parks, then the death toll could literally run into many thousands. As you say, the whole of Africa, not just Kenya and Tanzania, will suffer mass deaths, as there's no way they will be able to receive any treatment. That's if the hospitals have the equipment to be able to treat patients. It's a really horrible thought as to how many Africans are going to suffer?

If the season is completed behind closed doors at some future date, I believe that the game will have alienated the very people who helped to make it so profitable in the first place. Many of those fans - as a result of that scenario - who have attended religously over the years will never attend again.

Many Evertonians in particular dislike the inconvenience and intrusion of Television and much prefer to watch the game live in the stadium, break that link and put it alongside the upcoming 'recession' or even 'depression' and folk will have a valid reason to walk away from the game. I do hope the authorities and clubs are taking note of that possibility.

As for the MP who began this debate, Julian Knight, according to 'TheyWorkForYou.Com

He consistently voted against higher taxes on banks;
He consistently voted for more restrictive regulation of trade union activity; and
he consistently voted for reducing capital gains tax.

He's no friend of the long-term sick either – rearrange these words to make a sentence – Bandwagon MP on It Jump?

It brings it home who the real heroes in society are, the people who keep our basic quality of life alive and kicking.

Footballers may be great entertainers (sometimes!) but most are not heroes.

I heard it said on a recent news report, that many Premier League clubs could actually give tickets away to match-going fans, so much have the finances changed.

Match going fans don't matter. Think match times. Think VAR.

The genie is out of the bottle mate, and it isn't going back any time soon.

Boycott all you want, they couldn't care less.

The price of everything and the value of nothing!

I don't know if it has changed, but at one time the club had to pay a fee to the agent as part of the negotiations, and I think it was the chairman of Crystal Palace that refused to pay it.

I firmly believe that the club should be allowed to cut a % of the players negotiated fees as they are not fulfilling their contracts by not playing.

The players are fully covered when injured or ill, and insured if injuries force them to be finished playing, so they should voluntary take a cut if the club can't do it.

Show the supporters that they are as fully behind them as much as the supporters are fully behind them in normal times.

Bill (88), Yes, the Crystal Palace Chairman at the time refused to pay the agent of Tim Cahill. So, in a roundabout way, he did us a favour, as Everton jumped in and signed him. But I agree – agents are mostly leeches and pimps.

I agree, Bill, it's got to be down to the players, especially because most of them will have come from working-class backgrounds, and I bet you that if you took away agents tomorrow, then at least 75% of players would probably be seen to be doing something, the very same day.

Regarding our "team"
It's a bloody sad state of affairs when multi millionaires have to have the PFA and other arseholes have meetings to decide if, when and how much they contribute to – hopefully – local organisations.

This City has 2 Premier League teams... think how much money these players can give to our local NHS and the hundreds of voluntary organisations working during this present crisis, and still be loaded.

Are these idiots really so out of touch that they have to be told to do the right thing? Every hour that goes by puts our clubs and the Premier League in a worse and worse light. They really have missed a trick, especially Everton, who have worked so hard to get EitC so well established and thought of.

In a strange way, Everton took a lead over the RS in many aspects of the Hillsboro campaign. The PR department can sometimes be well ahead of the game. I am afraid in this crisis the Club and the players have been a massive let-down.

Personally I don't give a shit what MP or other half-wit takes a lead in condemning the football hierarchy. The simple fact is that they do need condemning, big style.

Anything the club do now will look half-hearted and far too late.

Then go to the comments, and you “COULDN'T BELIEVE” that so many people are losing their lives, all over our country, and also the world right now.

I know it's only a few people making these comments, but I'm just glad I'm not a Liverpool supporter, thank god.

In a statement, the PFA said: "Contrary to some press reports the PFA has never stated that it will block all wage deferrals. What we have sought to put in place is a structured and unified approach to ensure a fair response across the leagues.

"The players we have spoken to recognise that the non-playing staff are a vital part of their club and they do not want to see club staff furloughed unfairly. Any use of the government's support schemes without genuine financial need is detrimental to the wider society.

"We fully accept that players will have to be flexible and share the financial burden of the COVID-19 outbreak in order to secure the long-term future of their own club and indeed the wider game. Our advice going out to players at this point reflects that expectation."

"Each club's financial standing will vary. We are aware of the public sentiment that the players should pay non-playing staff's salaries. However, our current position is that - as businesses - if clubs can afford to pay their players and staff, they should.(emphasis added)

"In instances where clubs have the resources to pay all staff, the benefit of players paying non-playing staff salaries will only serve the business of the club's shareholders.

"We understand the severity of the situation and the challenges that clubs from all divisions face. We have requested, via the leagues, that clubs provide us with information about their financial position, so that we can make informed decisions for the future - both immediate and long-term.

PFA Denial

Knights of the Realm. What a fucking travesty!

Any bets?

Really, the whole football hierarchy are trailing their feet, except for applying for furlong payments. It would make you want to throw up.

So their plan to look at every club's finances will take ages and another cop-out.

Do our doctors and nurses ask each patient how much they earn before treating them? Bloody rubbish.

I don't know what the average UK wage is. Let's, for argument's sake say £25k. Let each Premier League player get double that during the crisis. No, let's quadruple that. Let's give them £100k a year. They already have every luxury and can surely live on £2k a week while this thing lasts.

Our club should be taking a lead on this and putting all other Premier League clubs to shame. We should not be waiting for meetings. A disgrace.

If Everton have got a contract with the groundsman, it's usually binding to say that EFC will pay the person a salary, if they do their job in a sound manner and it's within their financial capabilities to do so.

Likewise, they give a contract to a player for x years and agree to pay him a salary, as long as EFC have the means to so and it must state somewhere, that the player must perform to the best of his abilities.

So it transpires that EFC cannot pay the groundsman his salary, because of forces beyond their control and they have to lay him off and ask the Government to pay most of his salary.

My question is, what is the difference between the groundsman and the player? They are both under contract to the club, however, the club can lay the groundsman off but not the player?

The groundsman's would be a straight-forward salaried contract of employment similar to what most of us have/had if we worked directly for a company.

The player's contract will be much more involved, containing very specific conditions, and of course it's a fixed-term contract too.

Oh and one last small difference, about £99,750 a week!

I would like the Everton lads to put two fingers up to the snide PFA's edict and do what Barca and Atletico have already done. Take a 70% cut. As Darren mentioned earlier, there is no time to lose, do it tomorrow. With hindsight, they will see it as one of the best things they have ever done. The goodwill it will foster is worth a million times the lost money.

Act.

In regards to the Belgium league, there was only 1 match remaining to complete the season and the title had already been won.

The other about the Atletico game going ahead, I mentioned before the game, the only reason they allowed the Spanish fans to travel was down to enable the Liverpool fans to attend the game and try but fail to use the crowd as the extra man.

Had they said no to the Spanish fans travelling, then the game would have had to be played behind closed doors. Had that game been played in Spain instead, you can guarantee it would have been behind closed doors.

As per usual, they bent over backwards for our neighbours and will do so again, had the Premier League been won, they would have cancelled the rest of the season, final placings stand, no relegation, but Leeds and West Brom promoted.

They are holding out to make sure our neighbours lift that title. Nothing else matters to the FA... disgraceful with what's going on, around the world.

But this is a massive own-goal for football. which will probably be forgotten by the media about 5 minutes after it returns, post-virus.

Yes, we all know the RS would probably win the Premier League but mathematically many issues are still to be decided in every division.

I cannot see any games going on behind closed doors as this would mean players training and officials having to ignore social distancing etc and of course travel problems.

I think 2020 is a write-off with everything this year, not just sport, which is secondary to people's health and survival.

UEFA have proposed to resume football around July and August in a letter sent to all members across Europe.

All matches have been postponed due to the coronavirus pandemic but the European Club Association and European Leagues body have urged leagues not to abandon their seasons.

The Belgian top flight earlier became the first major European league to recommend that the season was ended with current standings declared as final.

In a letter seen by AP, UEFA said: "We are confident that football can restart in the months to come — with conditions that will be dictated by public authorities and believe that any decision of abandoning domestic competitions is, at this stage, premature and not justified.

“Their work is now focusing on scenarios encompassing the months of July and August, including the possibility that the UEFA competitions restart after the completion of domestic leagues.

"A joint management of calendars is strictly required as the conclusion of the current season must be coordinated with the start of the new one, which may be partly impacted because of the overstretch.

“Closely following the development of the current situation, the calendar working group will indicate as soon as possible, and ideally by mid-May, which of the plans can be enacted for the completion of the season without leaving anyone behind.

“Since participation in UEFA club competitions is determined by the sporting result achieved at the end of a full domestic competition, a premature termination would cast doubts about the fulfillment of such condition."

Meanwhile, the players wages issue as reported by The Independent will be a collective decision, therefore negating Everton or any other club taking an individual stance.

Link

The general mood in the Premier League – and the instruction from on high – is that no club should strike out alone on this issue, and that all should wait for the 20 clubs to do it together.

The Mirror concentrate on the TV deals and the fear that cancelling the season will have on the Clubs finances.

BT/Sky Crisis Talks

Just finished watching it and enjoyed it.

At the moment that's sometime in 2021 isn't it?

Think about it. The players could easily cover the wages of non-playing staff who’ve been made redundant or furloughed. Any club that furloughs staff should get one minute of solid booing in the (Covid) 19th minute of their first home game.

The initial strategy was simply to let everyone catch it and hospitalise those who needed it. That ‘plan' had the advantage of not drawing out the pandemic and not requiring a great deal of social / economic disruption, but was destroyed by the obvious major flaw that the health service doesn't have anywhere near the capacity to deal with even a fairly moderate surge in intensive care cases. Hence the abrupt later switch to flattening the curve by self-isolation, social distancing and ultimately lockdown.

Now we wait to see if any vaccine is developed (not a foregone conclusion) and whether it becomes the main weapon in a drawn-out struggle to suppress the virus, or whether it will just be mopping up the (likely) minority of people who have avoided infection in the interim.

Of course the virus will be stymied by less than 100% population immunity if there are insufficient numbers of available hosts to keep it circulating – that is how herd immunity works.

"Using vital public services, ambulances and police, when they're stretched beyond endurance, just to satisfy contracts with broadcasters, would be abhorrent beyond words."

But football didn't stop in the winter of 2017-18 when over 50,000 died in the UK alone, and many more were sick in hospital due to 'flu and the cold.

When you think, though, some of the Scottish Premier League players are on, per year, what some Premier League players are on per week!!!

You look at the tosser who owns Spurs, a billionaire and then Anne Budge who's worth what, £2-3 million?

Admittedly players earning £2, 3, 4k a week is still great money and having £2-3 million is not to be scoffed at, it does put things in perspective.

A stark contract to Won't Budge, as per most of her much wealthier EPL counterparts!

As with most things in life someone has to stand up and 'grasp the nettle' if need be to encourage those who are hiding behind each other waiting for something to happen.

Poor old Liverpool

Brian, The English Game was mentioned by several of us, the ToffeeWeb connection is regular poster Sam Hoare who, as well as being a fine actor, wrote Episode 4. Sam was in the recent spy thriller series “Traitors “, another good watch.

And I'm NOT Sam's agent.

Having said that the Chief Medical Officer Prof. Chris Whitty falls similarly into that category, I know you can never, and shouldn't, judge a book by it's cover but It beggars the question if they are our experts, 'God Help Us All'.

As for players donating part of their income. Some will with a fanfare, others will do it quietly (both will claim their tax rebate) and some won't bother at all. File it with the Trickle Down theory.

I am absolutely certain some will have already contributed in whatever way, there's always work going on behind the scenes with players and foundations. However, at a time like this, the club needs to be doing something significant. If I was a Spurs fan I'd be sickened and highly embarrassed by their club's actions, but doing nothing also doesn't look good.

Remember those controversial plans to hold a 39th Premier League game overseas a few years back?

Well the English top-flight could belatedly end up going on tour with concluding the current campaign abroad one of the potential solutions set to be discussed at today's meeting.

According to a report in The Athletic, senior figures at the Premier League are becoming increasingly fearful that they have nowhere left to turn to resume the season in this country.

As a result, one club is believed to have suggested whether it is worth exploring if the season could be finished abroad as an alternative.

This has led to China, which is on the road to recovery after suffering an outbreak of Covid-19 earlier this year, being mooted as the destination of choice to play the remaining games.

Sadly, that concept disappeared with "Globalisation".

Everton and all other EPL and many lower league teams are no longer a collection of local lads, brought up locally and representing their "local" community.

95% or more of the playing staff have no more connection to Liverpool that I have ( I live in South West Wales).

So, to expect them to have any sympathy or empathy with local residents and local causes is unrealistic.

It's true that Covid-19, in its pandemic state, is a challenge to everyone on the planet and it is also true that EPL footballers should not be any more immune from its financial effects, than anyone else.

But appeals on the grounds of emotional attachment to the local community will, I fear, fall on deaf ears.

Few, if any of the current players will live within a 20 mile radius of the ground - local community - LOL

There is no such thing as an anti-Covid-19 jab!! Hence the worldwide research now being undertaken by scientists to find one, ie, a vaccine. So neither 'greedy' players, the Queen, nor anyone else anywhere has had such a jab as you suggest!

Was there a similar NHS crisis in 17-18? Were emergency 4,000-bed hospitals being set up like the Excel arena? I think you know there is no comparison so therefore you should understand the poster when he states that to use emergency services would be abhorrent.

Your post @110 states there are no reasons why the Premier League and others shouldn't use public money, I'll give you a very strong one, it is considered by most right-minded people to be ethically wrong.
Big businesses take this thing quite seriously. If the Premier League don't want to be bedfellows with Ashley, Martin, Brandon, Green etc, they should start making some big decisions. PFA included.

Hi Rob (126) You are right that China is on the road to recovery with the number of new cases falling to between 51 and 100 over the last few days and some of the restrictions being lifted. We have yet to see what happens when people start returning to their normal lives. I think the last thing they would want in the foreseeable future is a load of football players arriving from countries where the virus has yet to peak.

I agree. But they are going to come under increased pressure from the Communities that they serve , whether they like it or not.

Ex Players have now put forward the argument that because the Premier League players pay 45% tax, they are already making a contribution. If their wages where reduced they would not be able make the same contribution.

You will notice the absence of concern for the Clubs and Communities they serve. If they made charitable donations within the Communities they serve their contribution would be targeted locally, which would be worth 45% more than the value of the contribution, since a charity would with their consent by way of a convenant be able claim back the tax they paid which would cost the actual player nothing.

Colin you are right they are a shower of greedy bastards, who will do their required public relation bit in the Community, but the majority of them won't put their hands in their pockets to help the Community when they need it.

But, as Brian points out (100), okay to let 3,000+ fans from an infected city come into Liverpool and attend a football match for the sole purpose of retaining the home team's advantage re "crowd atmosphere".

Then the home supporters buggar off back to Norway, Kidderminster, Exeter etc, potentially taking infection with them

Some Atletico fans were drinking in Gt Charlotte Street pubs and said they came in on Mon for the Wed match as their own bars were closed.

Sheer madness - shameful; if it was Sheff Utd, West Ham et al, closed doors at best.

Colin#132, Lineker said yesterday that he has donated his net salary of the next couple of months to British Red Cross and Neville with his business partner Ryan Giggs have allowed NHS staff to stay at their hotel free of charge.

At the moment, it is illegal for more than 2 people to congregate! So if the regulations continue for many more weeks (which is likely) it won't happen.

At the moment, many restrictions are being relaxed by HMRC, so any argument about this being difficult to set up would also be false. If there's a will, there's a way.

What would happen if players got injured on the pitch and required hospital treatment when reources are so stretched and medical life and death choices are having to be made?

As for the Red Echo, ask yer mam to just get you the annual for Christmas

Instead of having a go at footballers, let's focus on the lying incompetent ministers, the facts-averse people who vote for them, the billionaire tax-avoiders that fund them, the club owners who fuel the wages spiral.

Trying to get football up and running again for all the wrong reasons is distasteful in the extreme particularly when you consider that somebody is losing their life roughly every two minutes in the UK given today's Covid19 death figures.

And stumbled and fumbled, continually bumbled
While Covid nineteen ran amok.

As with your post along similar lines yesterday in this thread, you again echo my own thoughts.

OK. This is an Everton footy forum so people are going to focus on the issue of players' salaries. But some posters clearly haven't followed what Everton the club has done to protect its own full-time and casual match day staff yet continue to castigate the club.

The greater questions you raise should be the real focus here. Namely:

* this is the Government the UK electorate recently endorsed and returned to power
* that it is their policies and year-on-year slashing of the health, social welfare and education budgets that has left the frontline NHS staff under-resourced and under-manned
* that they have enabled the avoidance of paying corporate tax by the world's biggest and richest companies which would be a far richer and more constant stream of wealth to the national coffers than a one-off gesture such as footballers taking a wage cut

Read here what the organization Tax Justice Network reported just last year when they described the UK as 'the world's greatest enabler' of corporate tax avoidance.

LinkLink

The maths is very simple.

How much do the many average Joes and Janes get taxed on the salary every month? Compare that to the world's largest corporations that make BILLIONS every year. And yet, the average lowest corporate tax rate in the top 10 listed countries (four of which are British territories) is...0.54%.

NOT 5.4%.
NOT 54% (which they could still well afford).
But 0.54%.

That adds up to BILLIONS in lost tax revenue that would dramatically improve health and education everywhere.

Yes, we are all getting antsy in lockdown.

But one way people could - perhaps SHOULD - best utilize their time is to reflect on the state of world politics and the symbiotic relationship 'democracies' share with the mega-capitalist corporations and how the burden always falls on those at the bottom of the pyramid in times of crisis such as this.

It's enough to search out David Icke as the messiah (NOT!!!).

Absolutely frightening.

And then it happens again. And again until it reaches its peak.

And then again but at a smaller level. Until it stops.

And this may not even be the full total of deaths as I understand it.

Whether all the stuff about footballers wages is some sort of displacement theory or just the inbuilt greed and venality in the PL and the overall structure of what this benighted game has become I have no idea.

But I reckon there needs to be a major reckoning in this and other countries. A resetting of values, of how things are going to be around here. It can start with looking at the culpability for our preparedness and response to this pandemic.

I’m not holding my breath though.

'I’m not holding my breath though.'

I would like it to be otherwise like yourself, Chris.

But I fancy it will be a binge party once the major threat has diminished and very few, least of all governments and corporations, will truly reflect on events, their root causes and consequences, and very quickly it will be 'business as usual'.

With the emphasis very much on 'business'.

"Was there a similar NHS crisis in 17/18?"
Yes, yes there was, except it was more severe than at present with 50,000 plus dying, mostly the elderly.

"Your post @110 states there are no reasons why the PL and others shouldn't use public money" No, no it doesn't. It's an answer to a question asked at #97.

Many international corporations are bigger than nation states now, and their interests are in nothing but self interest. They pretty much call the shots now, with governments composed of people with the same set of values, some fully understanding and some useful idiots.

EPL was built using the same values, and the same model.

For the few not the many, to paraphrase Corbyn.

So it’s hard to see it changing.

I went to the Supermarket early this morning and surprisingly there was no queue, the shelves were fairly well stacked although a lot of gaps for certain products.

I overheard 2 of the Security guards saying that a lot of vulnerable people were getting mugged for their shopping after leaving the confines of the store, unbelievable.

Unfortunately these scumbags probably won't catch the virus, as it is not that discriminatory, what a pity.

You are right HMRC have relaxed a lot of barriers. Even defering wages , like Juventus would help the Clubs, giving them a in effect a interest free loan to keep them liquid. This again would cost them nothing.

Obviously there has been resistance to doing anything, but there appears to be a split in ranks, so I expect a general change in attitude soon.

We've got lowlife pulling the same kind of stunts here in Brazil.

I read yesterday on BBC of an 80+ old dear with dementia having her home invaded by a 'public health inspector' demanding a £220 for a cleansing. 'But I've only got 20p' was the poor old gal's response.

Another story from Olham today, a couple of 'helping hands' fooled a 92-year-old lady into letting them in after they (falsely) shared news that a neighbour had died and they wanted to clean her house. They lifted a purse, money and jewellery.

There are no words to adequately describe such scum.

'Scum' being the most benign of four-letter words.

I think slower internet speeds due to isolation and increased home use might be to blame for double postings.

Over here, Ajax, AZ & PSV want to leave it for what it is.
How that will work for next years qualification for the Champions League and the Europa League is another matter, with Ajax and AZ tied for points.

In Belgium they have left it for it is, and awarded the championship to Club Brugge (Bruges), who were light years ahead.

Premier league players should not be let off the hook, simply because we have a twat government

These are long, long days and we all have a bit more time on our hands. Get the machine gun out Mate. There are plenty of culprits to go round.. Keep your distance when you shoot them and wash your hands when your done

And the worlds leadership continues to show a lack of leadership, foresight and togetherness.

I watched an interview with Bill GAtes yesterday from 2015 where he forecst this very situation and warned Governments to prepare for it.

A very sorry state of affairs in the 21st century!!!

I saw that the other day. Astonishingly accurate.

I knew Branson was a good guy!

China here we come.

Forgive the cynic in me but I am singularly uninspired by the actions of governments and large corporations.

Premier League revenue in the 2019/20 season? Over £5.2billion.

I'll put up this link again to BBC 4's EXCELLENT 'Contagion' documentary of just two years ago.

HIGHLY recommended!

Link

Available on BBC's iPlayer. Need a VPN to view it outside the UK.

It is chillingly accurate at how a virus spreads and the havoc and casualties it can lead to.

Just two years old, relevant to the Bill Gates interview, it specifically states that governments worldwide are also well aware and constantly prepared for the onslaught of a new virulent virus such as Covid-19.

It even shows footage of gianormous warehouses filled to the rafters with PPE and the like in the event of an outbreak.

But then you read reports (outside of this documentary) of US and UK budget cuts that have directly impacted on those nations' abilities to promptly and effectively respond to this scenario and I for one conclude that official policy contrived to gamble with people's lives, rather than maintain a state of preparedness for such an event.

You are both right, Hancock had a go at the Premiership to take the heat away from his own and the governments incompetence.

Johnson and his government initially adopted the policy of let the market find it's own level and protected vested interests. In their case it was a excuse to do nothing. They got badly caught out and thousands are going to suffer as a result.

The problem is that it all about power at Westminster and not about serving the people whose taxes and vote out them there.

Harry Maguire suggestion that Premier League players should donate 30% of their salary to the NHS, is a publicity stunt, and a attempt to appease Hot Air Hancock and associates. . What about the local communities where the Clubs are actually based? The funding of the NHS is the sole responsibility of the Government.

Actually I am glad we have Keane and gianomous fridge, and not Maguire.

We have not only stood by but have demanded mega signings and success, every transfer window - the cry has been spend, spend, spend on players and managers. The clubs have spent and spent, & at the time we all concured. Every pre season the cry goes up spend - we need seven players to compete etc.

The bubble must burst, a severe tradgedy has finally woken us up.
I for one have lost my love for SKY/ BT Infused football a long time ago.

The only way to burst this bubble is to abandon this total media control of our game in our droves, they even decide when the games are played. I will never lose my love for Everton, but pray this is the end of TV giants running our game. Stay safe.

The NHS didn't exist in 1917/18 so no there wasn't a similar NHS crisis. But yeah there was a bigger humanitarian crisis with Spanish flu ravaging the world during World War I. Due to the lack of an NHS and a cover up of the flu during war time, people, many of them poor, were left to die at home with no medical treatment. It was terrible. We now have an NHS, better healthcare and longevity but this crisis is testing the limits of the status quo we have grown use to. So it's a new phenomena within the context of the modern era

A far cry from the game as portrayed in "The English Game" series but still with the greedy bastards at the top milking it.

Tough, tough that the EPL, don’t have any sense of true reality on this pandemic.

I guarantee that the game will never be followed in the same way again after this pandemic.

Titles don’t mean anything until the health of the people is guaranteed.

The word hero in context of EPL, players must be re worded.

True NHS, key workers, volunteers giving their all and these fairies, take self pity and lament for what their consciences are telling them to do.

The Red Echo should loose it’s license and in context should be fined and donate its revenues to the NHS until this crisis is over.

It’s tough, tough times. But the EPL, must get a reality check.

It won’t be the same again after this virus has been contained.

I’ve read about Yerry Mina, and Moise Kean, doing things in their country of birth, so maybe a lot of foreign players are doing this already, and are more concerned about helping financially where most of their friends and family live, rather than worrying about the country in which they ply their trade?

Or is it they DID know but hoped it would just fizzle out? Like Jay Harris@ 165 the cynic in me does not place any faith in Governments and Official Institutions. They play a game with peoples livelihoods and more importantly their lives.

I just hope when, hopefully this is all over that people won't conveniently forget the present scenario as it has unfolded and how it has been mishandled!

On a different tack my missus said yesterday "Isn't it ironic that a couple of weeks ago supermarket workers, bin men, postmen, cleaners and the like were classed as low skilled workers, and now the whole country is relying on them."

Sobering and humbling thought!

Given that all but the kids playing in the Prem pay 40% tax to HMRC on their mega earnings, the higher their salaries, the more they contribute. I've never been good at sums, so I'll leave the calculations to The Esk or similarly talented TWers !

A question for you left wingers and I don't mean in the football sense.

Is there anyone who seriously would have wanted Corbyn and his crazy cronies in office at a time like this?

The thought frightens me.

P.S. Darren, what's a 'twat government' ?

Dave, let’s see what Johnson and his crowd do in office before you make comparisons with Corbyn and his chums. They haven’t made a good start in my opinion, and that’s not taking into consideration the Coronavirus situation which hopefully they can turn around and save a lot more lives than it looks like they can at the moment.

The public which includes various political persuasions is for the most part doing its duty and observing the necessary restrictions but they are all watching very keenly the people in charge because their actions will impact on every household in the country. It isn't only so called left-wingers who are critical of some of the issues that are causing anxiety.

Let’s see if these poor urchins, ( my arse) - ex players and current players of the EPL, don’t grow some Courage, soon, and do the right things, for fellow mankind.

These losers have no idea.

1984 and Band Aid, clearly mankind in context of football has not learned anything.

Youve got G7 and economic get togethers but where was the joint discussion and planning when this thing broke and so much for the European union if you could ever call it that. Where was the help for Italy and then Spain.

Politicians worldwide are no longer in it for principle they are in it for self gain.

I am certainly not a left winger but at the end of the day if you don't look after the less well off then don't expect them to look after you.

You seem to think corporations are people, like "Joe and Jane", but they're not, they're legal entities. They only exist to make profits for their shareholders. They pay tax on their profits, and what remains of those profits after paying corporation tax is distributed in the form of dividends, which are again taxed when they reach "Joe and Jane" - the shareholders. Of course, if you have a personal pension, I would imagine that you can ask that the dividends your fund manager receives are sent straight to the government, if you think corporations' profits should be more highly taxed.

Ireland receives around 18% of its total tax intake in the form of corporation taxes. The UK receives less than 10% of its total tax intake via corporation tax. And yet, Ireland is one of Europe's biggest tax havens, with a corporation tax rate of just 12.5% as against the UK which charges 19%.

So, the lesson seems to be, the lower the corporation tax, the bigger the receipts, and those who think corporations should give governments more of their profits should send anything they have in Stocks and Shares ISAs or pension funds straight to their local tax office.

Christ, I'll be glad when the football is back.

Dave #185. I love it You criticise Johnson, you're 'left wing'. Clearly, truth and competence are left wing these days, eh?

And your post is an equally simplistic one.

I made no such claim that corporations are people, like Joe and Jane. YOU made that association.

Yes, they're legal entities. But to describe them as 'only existing to make profits for their shareholders' is an extremely naive view.

Practically every mega corporation which are now household names started as small family businesses. Many of those founding families retain the majority of shareholdings in the business. So in that regard they are like Joe and Jane.

So individuals, the controlling families, are very much the major beneficiaries of paid dividends.

The dividends, as you correctly state, are taxed again when they reach ALL Joes and Janes - the shareholders - large and small.

Why you see fit to make the snide remark about anyone holding a (very modest) personal pension should request such (taxed!) dividends be sent straight to the government rather than benefit from a lifetime of labour and contributing to a pension fund, well...only you know.

You tell but half the story. 'Offshore tax sheltering' as corporate tax avoidance is euphemistically called tells another. Indeed, some are so adept at it they EARN tax subsidies, rather than merely avoid higher taxes.

PFA may worry that teams cut player salaries but then turn around and spend that money by trying to snag Messi or Ronaldo once this settles down.

Clubs may worry if they cut wages that players would be a)more likely to leave e.g. Kane at Spurs and b)their transfer values would decrease exponentially.

Solution: Do what Henderson proposes. Don't cut salaries unless clubs plan to payback season ticket holders and BT sport viewers pound for pound. Instead have players direct 50% of their money to NHS or other needy causes. That way we ensure the money is put to good use at a societal level, and not used by clubs to manipulate FFP rules, or save cash for the next window. Also, there PFA can have no qualms about money being misdirected. It's simply a case of are you a Scrooge on Christmas Eve or a Scrooge on Christmas Day e.g. not a Scrooge.

Other point I would make is that not everyone does things for publicity. There may be players already, quietly and independently shoving boat loads of cash to needy causes. I presume many aren't but I like think some of them are

Well sam a big thumbs up to you for a fine programe, will have to watch Episode 4 again.

Yeah I read your post at 130 where you said "Was there a similar NHS crisis in 17-18?" and Eric's at 150 and I pointed out your error of mentioning the NHS existing at time when in fact the NHS didn't even exist but you then took offence to that "history lesson."

So, how should I proceed going forward? read your posts and correct your false information, not read your posts, or read your posts and pretend false information is accurate? Please advise. Cheers!

Now I am one bitter Blue first and foremost, however, there is no way they should play the remaining fixtures without supporters at the stadium.

Hate our neighbours with a passion, yes we could say Karma, but as a football fan even through gritted teeth, those season ticket holders across the park deserve to have the right to be at the game, if and only when we get through this, but all the Premier League are thinking about is money and completing their contract to the broadcasting companies, screw the fans if needed we play behind closed doors, that cannot be right for any match going supporter.

This is becoming genuinely comical. I suggest you read my post at 184 which explains that myself and Eric were discussing flu fatalities from the year 2017-18. In case you never noticed this for the third time, 2017-18 was the year we were discussing. I would suggest you read other people's posts at least out of courtesy before you "educate" us.

I am familiar about the Spanish Flu and its deadly toll. I was also aware that the NHS didn't exist in 1917. I would imagine Eric is very much aware of these facts also.

Over to you, now I would suggest you read my post slowly and, like I said, go back to post 97 onwards.

Agreed. Think back to 85-86 if we'd had a 4-month delay. Southall could've recovered and replaced Mimms thus giving us a better shot at the double.

If and when it returns, various injured players will be back giving a different outcome than had there been no interruptions. Therefore, to me, it will always be one of those titles with an asterisk beside it.

I was referring to post 194, I would love the red shite to win the league as it would mean this nightmare is over and people would not be losing their lives and livelihoods.

I guess it won’t hurt smaller clubs if no one has fans. But you’re still talking about scores of people in close proximity. So what’s the safe number 50? 100? 200 with police etc. in which case part time teams could say “well we only attract 100 fans, no media so why can’t we play if city can. Who needs the money more?” Behind closed doors opens up a can of worns

Deferrals are no good that's merely delaying payment. Accepting a reduction now to be repaid at a later date surely isn't what this is about!!!!

Coming up as page cannot be displayed, from an iPad on google.

Do you have your fingers in your ears humming loudly?

Answer my post @207, go on mate, do the right thing.

I think Paul's point is it is never actually important who wins it if you weigh it against tragic loss of life so Covid-19 has reduced the conclusion of the 2019-20 EPL to a minority interest side-show.

Just 2 years ago.

If the players don't take pay cuts, clubs may well go bankrupt and then they'll have no teams to play for.

I recommend Vietnam. A harrowing account of the war. It really beggars belief how politicians to save face are prepared to send thousands of young men to their death.

Nothing changes; no lessons learned in this mad insane world.

Go and get yourself tested, mate, something definitely not right there.

I've been tested, doctors give me the all clear physically but my mental health is an issue due to reading too much ToffeeWeb, haha!

Another thing I do to pass the time is write songs and produce videos like this one..

The gout is PAINFUL!

The Truth Will Set You Free.

https://youtu.be/JZegCTF-mFo

What still pisses me off is the fact that our own team have not taken a lead on this from day one.

A few of them made a few phone calls to older and more vulnerable supporters, theClub announced they would honour payments to part time staff, in the scheme of things that's nowt.

The players and management should have taken massive cuts, no deferrals. Cuts could have subsidised non playing staff with the remainder given to local charities, help groups and non league teams.
A player on 30k a week even after a 30% cut still gets an obscene amount in the present situation and climate.

I am really disappointed with the Club, we have missed the chance to not only lead but to prove we really do care about the support and wider community.
People's Club my arse!

Apologies to Harry Maguire, obviously he was mid quoted in the Newspaper report I read.

What I have not seen is any suggestion as to what should be done with the sacrificed wages?

If the players agree to the sacrifice, but the clubs keep the money - then it is the clubs that benefit.

By far the best suggestion is that the Chancellor makes an emergent increase in the rate of tax for those who's taxable income exceeds £150.000.00 per annum

Donations come out of their gross salary, so the tax man losses out on 45% of any 'gift'. These player pledges cost them half of the reported amount in their take home pay.

I see that Danny Rose is telling politicians to keep their nose out. That's right he's unhappy that politicians are saying give up some of your salary, when his contracted club have put non playing staff in furlough at government expense.

I understand that Lewis Hamilton is a tax exile. Many of the super rich just don't pay tax in the UK. Either their wealth or themselves is held offshore, to avoid UK tax.

https://www.evertonfc.com/news/1651840/everton-pair-Richarlison-and-mina-provide-coronavirus-support

I suppose many overseas players are brought up in a culture where support in family and community are given high prominence, especially in some less well off areas, where the hardship caused by all of this will be felt much harder.

Jeremy Corbin as party leader has never been on the winning side in a general election. It would be completely illegal for him to order emergency services etc around during the crisis. Probably even treasonous.

It's the clubs I hold accountable not necessarily the players, they're just overpaid wankers. The club's meanwhile are funding these overpaid wankers. The clubs are the villains in this scenario, pandering to these wankers and fucking off the actual workers who earn modest wages. So hardfaced. I hope some of them do go out of business.