Carlo Ancelotti has a number of options available to him as he plots a course through to round three
Everton continue their busy start to the new season with the first step of what they hope will be a long journey in the Carabao Cup as they host Salford City.
Carlo Ancelotti makes 10 changes for tonight's tie, with debuts for Joao Virginia and Niels Nkounkou. New signings Allan and Doucouré are on the bench while James Rodriguez is rested.
There is no place in the matchday squad for the likes of Yannick Bolasie, Muhamed Besic or Sandro Ramirez while there are suggestions that Alex Iwobi has a hamstring strain.
Former Everton midfielder Darron Gibson is on the bench for Salford along with former Blues academy player Alex Denny, while fellow ex-Everton Academy player Ibou Touray starts for the visitors.
Everton kicked things off and retained the ball reasonably well early on, moving it around until Kean gave it away, allowing Salford City to mount their first attack, firing over.
An early chance was created by Bernard, Walcott heading it over rather than into the goal. Gordon, who had already shown some really bright touches, showed a great turn of speed to beat his man and win a corner that was converted in the simplest of fashions by Michael Keane on a superb delivery from Sigurdsson.
Salford thought they could equalize straightaway but Towell's shot was straight at Virginia. At the other end, a swift move saw Davies lined up to fire a foot wide of the far post. Kean and Davies tried to combine but it didn't come off; however, Nkounkou showed some great skill, driving forward and firing hard from a very narrow angle.
The build-up was too slow at times against a well-disciplined defence, with Kean not showing well, producing a couple of poor touches in promising positions. Kenny was getting a decent workout when Salford attacked down the right some of the midfield passing brought back unpleasant memories of last season.
Branthwaite appeared to turn his ankle and found that he could not carry on, being replaced by Lucas Digne after just a quarter of the game. There was a lull in any attacking intent until Walcott drove forward and wastefully fired over in typical fashion.
Everton had not really followed through on the opening goal and poor quality passing (slow, sideways, backwards, inaccurate, unimaginative) in midfield meant that advances into the Salford area had become increasingly rare whilst the visitors were given every encouragement to build their attacks, admittedly without getting close to the Everton area.
Grordon tried again to produce a textbook move along the 18-yard line but curled it just wide off a defender, and nothing came of the corner. Kenny finally put in a low cross but it lacked the required accuracy. Bernard pulled out a great snapshot that was only just pushed around the post by Hladky as the Blues finally applied some sustained pressure as half-time approached.
Nkounkou and Gordon were linking nicely at times down the left but the quality of the final ball was lacking and care of the ball in intricate passing moves was sometimes lacking, but they went off at the break with an important one-goal lead.
After the restart, Salford tried to build something but again shot over from distance. The unchanged Blues looked to do better, and a fantastic build-up with a gorgeous delivery from Sigurdsson to Moise Keane was a goal all the way, except when Kean stooped and somehow got the ball to fly off the top of the crossbar.
Everton were having a better spell, moving the ball around well without creating a decent chance, Nkounkou a little profligate with an overhit cross and then an overhit shot.
Gordon again drove in well form the left and delivered a hard cross that fell nicely for Bernard who should have done a lot better than walloping the ball at the stanchion behind the goal. At the other end, Towell was set up well but spooned it miles over the bar when it looked easier to score.
Worryingly, the visitors were getting a decent sight of the Everton goal with the Premier League side's lead looking rather slim and vulnerable. Gordon tried to make another run down the left channel but was bundled over a little too easily.
Nkounkou did very well to drive in a low cross that should have been inviting to Kean and Walcott, neither of whom had shown sufficient anticipation to get close enough. Gordon drove in against and shot this time, the ball batted back by the keeper.
A delightful piece of trickery by Nkounkou deserved much more but clear chances were at a premium in this one, while at the other end, Salford again shot wide as Carlo Ancelotti wondered with increasing frustration why his second string were making such heavy weather of finishing off some stubborn opponents.
Finally, Nkounkou and Gordon combined to lay it on a plate for Sigurdson who could not miss with a well-placed sidefoot shot that he drove home. Everton would have had a third but for an amazing reaction save that denied Walcott. Then Kenny tried to get one with a nicely curling lob.
Sigurdsson thought he had a second but his low drive skinned the outside of the post as he Blues looked to finish Salford off with a flourish. Gordon came so close to doing that with a brilliant strike that hit the afar post. Gordon was chopped down by Andrade and Kean took the penalty with a bizarre hop-skip and jump that saw the ball hit the roof of the net.
Another fine flowing move near the end saw Kean hit the post and then Gordon incredibly smash a difficult rebound shot onto the bar. Bernard could then only shoot straight at Hladky before the final whistle.
Scorers: Keane (8'), Sigurdsson (74'), Kean (pen:87')
Everton: Virginia, Kenny, Keane, Branthwaite (24' Digne), Nkounkou, Davies, Sigurdsson, Gordon, Bernard, Walcott, Kean
Subs: Pickford, Coleman, Allan, Doucouré, Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin
Salford City: Hladky, Threlkeld, Turnbull [Y:58'], Eastham, Touray, Towell, Lowe, Hunter, Wilson (61' Andrade), Henderson, Thomas-Asante [Y:67'] (75' Elliott).
Reader Comments (196)
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1 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:19:09
2 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:20:53
3 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:21:55
4 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:22:45
5 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:23:59
6 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:24:48
7 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:25:51
Delph's absence surely signifies the end.
8 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:29:01
9 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:29:15
10 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:34:18
This team should be technically a million miles ahead of Salford City, a few can stake their claims here.
It concerns me a bit that it is a bit lightweight, a bit short on hard men fighters and I am concerned about its resilience to defend set pieces.
Its a 4th division club ! What am I worrying about ?
11 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:34:24
12 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:38:52
Is that a fact or just a wish? Haha
13 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:39:31
Iwobi's absence is certainly curious.
This would seem to signal the end of Bolasie's flickering hopes of playing a role this season. I would have given him at least a chance to make an impact in this match.
My only potential concern is Virginia - he imploded so badly on loan with Reading, I have no idea what the current state of his confidence is. What purpose does Jonas Lossl serve in the squad, exactly? Because it sure doesn't seem to be as a backup keeper.
14 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:40:21
15 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:44:22
Iwobi and Delph must be on the way ! And maybe Lossl who was on the bench on Sunday but now been leapfrogged by Virginia!?
Im a little nervous now!
16 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:47:26
The likes of Walcott, Sigurdsson and Bernard need to show some real effort whilst the young lads like Kenny, Kean, Davies, Nkounkou and Branthwaite have a chance to stake their claim. It should be interesting!
17 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:47:40
18 Posted 16/09/2020 at 19:58:04
19 Posted 16/09/2020 at 20:01:10
20 Posted 16/09/2020 at 20:02:17
21 Posted 16/09/2020 at 20:11:28
22 Posted 16/09/2020 at 20:44:58
23 Posted 16/09/2020 at 20:47:50
24 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:01:38
25 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:10:51
Who's the masked person in the stand?
26 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:13:43
Yes, it's a bit flattening so far.
27 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:17:52
Kid at left back looks promising though.
28 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:26:14
29 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:31:54
30 Posted 16/09/2020 at 21:49:48
31 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:00:27
32 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:09:28
33 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:09:56
34 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:10:00
35 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:11:59
36 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:13:36
37 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:14:28
38 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:18:12
And I don't know why
But I felt the same about Besic.
39 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:18:46
40 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:20:02
42 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:25:02
43 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:28:14
44 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:29:54
45 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:30:47
46 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:31:16
Siggy & Tom were fine in the second half but Bernard and Walcott were expensive passengers.
Defence OK even with Digne at center back. Moise has a long way to go before he is worth a start in a prem match.
47 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:34:51
48 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:36:26
I should think he is trying too hard to impress and in doing so, looks gauche.
Hopefully the fact that Carlo picked him tonight, and let him take the penalty, will start to calm his nerves, and he can begin to deliver on his promise.
After all, as the old saying goes, he hit the woodwork a couple of times tonight, that, on another night, would have gone in - so we would have scored five and he could have had a hat trick.
Lady Luck - if she smiles on him and he can then relax, he will be OK.
49 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:44:07
Its mad how we all see a different game, I thought Gordon was only good in snatches, and although his finishing was wayward, I thought Bernard constantly showed and consistently recycled the ball all night.
The left back looks very good, Kenny got stronger as the game went on, which was the polar opposite of the man in front of him, because Theo doesnt really look like he wants to play.
A good run out, the ball got moved quicker at times, and now to get rid of some players hopefully.
50 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:47:00
Most of those on the field are adequate bench players. Nkounkou and Gordon show lots of promise. Kenny is okay but no more than just that.It just wasn't the type of game to make any serious judgements. After the Spurs display almost anything would be underwhelming. Still good to be able to watch any game.Just hope Branthwaite isn't too badly injured because he also shows lots of potential.
51 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:47:35
I'll stay positive and praise Nkounkou and Gordon. Solid performance for most of the rest against a lower level team.
Roll on Saturday..
52 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:49:47
53 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:52:32
We are short now at CB and relying on Mina to stay fit, which is a bit worrying. I think Carlo will be discussing the options with Marcel in the morning, we need someone in within a week if we can.
54 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:57:50
55 Posted 16/09/2020 at 22:58:02
56 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:02:42
Thank God we have the new signings
Tom needs a good season on loan at a Championship Club to further his development
I know Im in the minority but I still believe Moise Kean will come good
A couple of years ago that match could have been much closer or gone to penalties. Im noticing a really different mind set now under Carlo
Lots of positives all round tonight though so roll on Saturday
57 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:06:16
The only thing we lack is a goalscoring winger or striker to give us more options up front and a dependable center half to add cover in defence. Hopefully Carlo can sort these issues out before the window shuts.
58 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:08:41
I was very impressed with our left hand side though. Thought Gordon was MOTM and Nkounkou not far behind.
Moise Kean was very poor and looked totally pissed off to be here. Not a patch on DCL when he was learning who showed good mobility and a good attitude. Kean seems to want the game to come to him rather than make a mark on it himself.
Poor attitude; dusty bin for me along with Walcott and Iwobi.
Tom gave 100% as usual but he has got to improve his tackling and passing if he is to make the necessary move up. Siggy showed he still has the brain for the top level even if he is half a yard slow.
59 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:12:05
60 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:12:28
I found Kenny competent. The back line played well. Davies needs to cut down on losing possession, his no 1 weakness. He needs to study the video of the Spurs game and learn fast. Sigurdsson was good enough and Walcott was as per usual. I still think final third play is weak, which did not help Kean in particular. , but Gordon was the exception.
The contrast between Everton final third play and the Spurs game shows you difference of all round better technically midfield.
A good result.
61 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:22:14
Realistically the bulk of the back up squad didnt do anything spectacular and youd think theyd be fighting for their futures, as Im sure time will be called soon, directly or indirectly, for some of the squad tonight.
Which clubs would bid, or take on loan the back up squad is interesting.
Im not going to single out players but the midfield and wide players, who were the core last season, in my view didnt help their causes.
My views, are Bernard, Tom, and Siggy, will stay, the rest I reckon could go.
Great potential for Anthony Gordon and Nkounkou. The French lad, was playing before he was born; seriously he looks like the real business and strong and sharp in descision making, and Anthony Gordon, is stepping up and in my view will be a key player for the future, at EFC.
Hard work, guts and effort, and the basic ingredients, are vital in any sport.
Interesting if some some players have been rested, if only to make them easier to sell before the transfer deadline.
But Fleetwood, away will be a tougher game, but lets see how we do against the Baggies.
Im hoping we can stay in tune and beat them well.
Lets hope so.
Two clean sheets, back to back, thats a good start, and hopefully will nurture belief, confidence and conviction through the whole squad.
Common Lincoln City!
62 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:22:24
Hopefully some desperate Premier League teams will come in for some of this lot...
63 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:23:39
I've been saying this from the moment he signed – somewhat gently, but now more directly – Kean scored goals for Italy and Juventus in teams in which he had little responsibility. With top players around him, and little expectation, he scored a handful of goals when opposition teams knew little about him, and his reputation quickly grew. But he's not a good footballer, and he is showing no real sign of improvement.
It's about time that the people who believed the hype start to accept the reality: Moise Kean is already a busted flush at this football club.
Joe (40) - I have always supported Calvert-Lewin. There were obvious (to me anyway) signs that he has what it takes, even if there are areas of his game that need work. I do not see signs of a top player in Kean - who is more of the crash, bang, wallop type of player who relies on ricochets and brute force to beat players.
I do not go in for this philosophy of cherry-picking parallels with certain players in the hope that what applies to one will somehow end up applying to the other. Instead, I let what I see on the pitch dictate to me who displays enough positive signs of being a top player and who does not. Kean does not.
64 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:27:26
Kenny I think cemented his back-up role to Coleman. Sigurdsson, Bernard and Davies are squad players only. Walcott is finished and Kean nowhere near ready for the first team.
With Holgate out for possibly 12 weeks, Mina injury-prone, and Branthwaite injured, it is imperative we get a centre-back in on loan.
65 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:32:35
Nkounkou - Excellent looks a very capable understudy for Digne
Gordon - When his confidence grew he looked very dangerous
Bernard - Played well in central position and will only play better with a stronger team around him
Kenny - Played well considering he had Theo playing in front of him and will only play better with better players around him. Give him James in front of him and Allan and Doucoure in CM and I think he will flourish
Gilfi - I thought he played quite well. Yet again played deep and not as comfortable in that position but when he plays with Allan and Doucoure he will be a valuable squad player
66 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:34:56
His first touch so many times was awful, which is a basic requirement from any striker, and just lacks that desire and intelligence needed at this level. I know many will say he's still young but, for me, I haven't seen enough in 15 months to suggest he is improving.
67 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:36:07
I think these under performing, diss motivated players have stamped their exit visas out of EFC, tonight, and if not tonight, a tough game at Fleetwood, next week, could if its not already, a wake up call, be the penultimate, or final game, in the EFC, first team.
No more excuses, the mercenary, lazy arses at EFC, will be training with the U23s, very soon.
The club hopefully will tighten up and no longer accept mediocrity.
That will raise questions and hopefully, lessons learnt about transfer policy.
Now to beat The Baggies.
68 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:38:53
Looks like a poor man's Stuart Barlow to me, others may say Deidre Barlow.
Not for me. We have got the midfield sorted; now, we need a proven striker to back up Calvert-Lewin.
Any decent bids for a Kean, snatch their hands off.
69 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:43:52
People like Gordon and Nkoukou come straight in and show poise and skill so why not Kean???
He really doesn't warrant inclusion any more than Sandro, Tosun or Bolasie who are other players who have struggled to impress.
70 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:45:08
71 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:47:29
Tonight, Bernard played as a hub through which we took the ball forward. Not necessarily showy, but he worked his socks off.
Sigurdsson did what he can do when he has space created either by poor opposition (tonight) or hard-working players around him (Allan and Doucouré maybe?). He will never be a workhorse type. But he has the ability to play the killer ball and, with an on-form centre-forward, we would have had the second goal much earlier.
On the down-side, since his early days at Arsenal, I had always rated Theo Walcott. So I was always looking for him to come good here. Sadly, tonight must be his last game for us. If nobody wants him, he can go and play golf for the length of his contract. All it takes against 4th Division opposition is for top players to back themselves. He didn't.
Virginia, Nkounkou and Gordon all showed promise. It was hard to judge Kenny as he was doing the work of 2 players down his flank. What would he have given for a mirror image of Gordon in front of him?
On the whole, job done. If, as it looks, Iwobi and Bolasie are gonners and one or two more follow them out of the door, we may have the funds to bolster the defence and attack before the transfer window closes.
Roll on Saturday.
72 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:50:19
Next week's encounter with Fleetwood will be tougher and probably most who played tonight will be on duty again – I don't think we'll see 32 shots at goal at the Highbury Stadium, but hopefully, Everton will progress.
Gordon and the young left-back gave good accounts of themselves and could feature in Saturday's squad.
73 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:53:05
Someone compared him to Calvert-Lewin but IMO he is polar opposite to Calvert-Lewin who, even when he wasn't scoring, was working hard for the team and making good movements and always looking to learn.
Kean looks like he is carrying a bag of cement on his shoulders and never looks for the payers around him.
Brian #68, I think Deirdre Barlow would be insulted.
74 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:55:00
I recall Kean being compared by some to a young Lukaku around the time we signed him. Twelve months on, I have yet to see anything from Kean to suggest he will ever come close. But he is still young. I have not given up hope he can in time develop into a half-decent forward.
75 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:55:29
We need a more experienced and quality forward as back-up and competing with Calvert-Lewin up front. Carlo will have someone in mind. I can see Moise going back to Italy... which may be a better environment for him to progress.
76 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:56:54
Ancelotti is one of the few types of managers who could cajole him into staying and fighting for a regular first-team place, but if the lad's heart isn't in it what can be done?
77 Posted 16/09/2020 at 23:59:58
I only watched the 2nd half, and we looked comfortable and didn't leave 1st gear. If anything, it was a decent fitness exercise for the second string.
Only Keane will play on Saturday, but we'll need some of the others throughout the season. Gordon and Nkounkou will be happy with themselves and should be involved with the first team more and more. Davies, unfortunately, looks like a move away will be on the cards. Probably the Championship, and maybe he'll do well, but he really doesn't look the part.
And hopefully we can get a winger so Walcott can go and fulfill his potential somewhere else. And a defender is absolutely necessary.
78 Posted 16/09/2020 at 00:02:26
The most talented player at the club. He has skills that remind me of Alan Ball. Never gives the ball away.
79 Posted 17/09/2020 at 01:03:31
Was he "great"? Well no he wasn't – but very few players were "great" – particularly in that first half. I thought it had big sense of déjà vu from last season which should be no real surprise as we were playing Davies and Sigurdsson in centre-midfield, as we were a lot last season.
I think Kean will benefit from playing the full 90 minutes in the cup games so I hope he starts the next one. I'll defer to Carlo's judgement on what he see's on the training field as to whether he is worth keeping in mind for the first team as first choice back up for Calvert-Lewin. Kean strikes me (albeit from afar) as a character well suited to Carlo's style of management.
Gordon and Nkounkou looked particularly good amidst a sea of mediocrity btw.
80 Posted 17/09/2020 at 01:09:16
Tonight, he went back to looking disinterested & basically half-arsed. So the cynical side of me wonders if that Bournemouth performance was really a shop-window come & get me shout. Because on tonight's performance, we aren't gonna get a buyer for him or have as reliable back-up for Richarlicon & Calvert-Lewin.
81 Posted 17/09/2020 at 02:44:48
Simple question for you: Do you want to win this cup?
If No, keep playing the shite that started tonight. If Yes, when should we start playing the best available players to win some bloody silverware?
Why is it that some on here think the WBA game is more important than this competition?
25 fookin years without a trophy... why is that I ask? Because we never take the cup games seriously.
82 Posted 17/09/2020 at 03:13:30
My guess is that Sigurdsson and Bernard will remain as squad players, which leaves Besic, Bolasie, Delph, Sandro and Walcott as surplus to requirements; Tosun will probably go out on loan in the January window when he is fit.
Ideally, I would still like a left-footed centre-back and right-winger to come in before the end of the transfer window.
We look like we have good coverage at full-back with Kenny and the excellent Nkounkou – what a spot he is turning out to be.
83 Posted 17/09/2020 at 03:51:14
Sigurdsson looked better in a deeper role with more time to look up but not first choice now. Davies, the same old player, gave the ball away far too often. Left-back was great, a real find and a good back-up to Digne.
84 Posted 17/09/2020 at 03:54:37
Many saying Bernard was okay, but I was disappointed, as with Walcott, Jonjoe and Kean. As for the others who didn't even figure as bench warmers, it is patently obvious they have no place in the plans.
Worryingly more so, how do we get shut? Who's going to go in for underperforming highly paid misfits?
Fleetwood Town next, we will need to revise personnel and be more aware for that one, as they are capable of a giant killing on their day!
85 Posted 17/09/2020 at 04:42:47
I am not optimistic of offloading them. Palace would seem like a destination for Iwobi given Hodgson signed Benteke, Townsend etc after similarly failing at “bigger clubs” but the issue is that we paid way over the odds pre Covid.
Since then he has sucked ass causing a devaluation even with Covid. With Covid, best case we ship him out on loan.
86 Posted 17/09/2020 at 06:32:55
Virginia – did fine.
Defence – All solid; Jonjoe didn't offer much of a threat in attack. Nkounkou looks like a very exciting player
Midfield – Bernard and Sigurdsson did what they do. Both are Premier League players and decent back-up. Davies looks short technically, hence loses possession too often.
Attack – Anthony Gordon looked great in patches. Walcott was okay. Moise Kean – he was awful, the ball just does not stick to him and I think that is a basic ability you don't learn aged 20. Sell if we can.
Second goal was lovely and both Bernard and Gordon almost scored absolute crackers. A few great balls in from Sigurdsson too.
88 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:25:15
89 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:29:21
His performances are no better than Barlow, Angell, Branch, Anichebe and Madar.
He must have something as hes a current Italy international and happy to give him time but my eyes dont lie!
90 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:37:25
I don't think Kean was confused, Bill G, especially because he wasn't given the penalty to take, he stood by the spot waiting for the ball, and after he scored he looked like he wasn't happy with Anthony Gordon, because the young scouser might have also wanted to take the penalty kick.
His look to Gordon was like a “Can't you see I need a fuckin goal? Get on it, Anthony, I'm struggling a bit here, whilst you are playing on your doorstep and coasting." That's how I saw it anyway.
91 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:40:20
Sigurdsson got going late-on when the space opened-up. Alas, Davies looked no better than the Salford lads, he did some very sensible things but continues to cough-up possession when under little pressure.
Gordon looks a shy soul and hopefully his confidence will increase.
Moise Kean has a poor first touch but I thought he was trying too hard, but how did he not convert that easy header... those goals are bloody massive, and to hit the bar from 4 yards with no-one jumping next to you is shocking.
Very glad we didn't risk any of the others, especially after seeing Branthwaite pulling-up. (Has he been on Mina's excercise routine?)
I enjoyed the second half.
92 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:40:55
93 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:54:14
94 Posted 17/09/2020 at 07:55:46
95 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:06:55
That said, Walcott needs to go and I wouldn't be too upset if Kean was moved on to fund a move for Lozano or Ünder.
96 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:07:15
Anything less than that and he will be deemed an abject failure; there's very little sign of him delivering the goals required so far. He would need to at least get into double figures in the Premier League. He's had a season to adjust, there can be no excuses this season.
97 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:11:00
98 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:13:47
Cut the lad free and let him kickstart his career back in Italy.
99 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:14:47
However, we won 3-0, with the second string, and hit the woodwork five times so, job done.
I expect some of the dead wood to be shipped out towards the end of the window when clubs, who've had a poor start, will be desperate to add a new face.
100 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:16:25
Gordon and Nkounkou are clearly excellent. First 11 quality already.
Kean scored and with a bit of luck would have had a hat-trick. Someone said that's 3 goals in his last 3 starts. Once he relaxes a bit, he will be fine. I really wouldn't be surprised to see him dislodge Calvert-Lewin by the end of the season.
No need to sell him or Iwobi. In fact, no need for any sort of clear out. Maybe one or two, but we do need some depth to get us through a season where hopefully we'll be competitive in league and cups.
A few will leave on loan before leaving for good - Bolasie, Ramirez. The rest we might well need.
What we do probably need is CB cover, with Branthwaite injured now and Gibson not featuring last night (about to go on loan perhaps). So one of Tomori, Adarabioyo or AN Other hopefully.
101 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:16:38
That saving could make a difference regarding FFP, or by shifting three ineffective players for an effective one.
102 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:18:22
Kean has made 35 appearances for Everton. On several occasions recently he has looked for all the world like he has never played the game. The kids's game is on the floor. His confidence and self-belief are so low, it's impossible to gauge which level he can achieve.
We paid a lot of money for this kid, so it's natural to be disappointed with what we have seen from his so far... but there is zero mileage in battering away at him.
There is a huge gaping hole in the logic of people who repeatedly hammer young players whilst exonerating the guy who keeps putting them in the team. Only one person picks the team and if he is repeatedly selecting players who are not good enough, it's his fault and his fault alone.
These kids don't pick themselves.
103 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:19:12
What surprised me was other players who should have stood out against poor opposition but didn't, Walcott proved why he should move on.
As for Moise Kean, a young man who I want to do well, he was dire, there was not one aspect of his game you could recommend on last night's showing, even when he scored the pen his face said it all: he is not happy, probably wants out, and after last night's performance, may get his wish.
104 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:26:18
I do want us to win the cup, any cup of course. However, the second string are adequate for the first couple of rounds and the league will always be priority. A win at WBA and we are set up for our best start to the season for donkey's years.
Are you saying you'd have been happier winning at a canter yesterday with our best 11, then limping to a 1-1 draw against WBA?
105 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:30:34
I'm all for picking him in these games. I think he needs more time coming off the bench as well.
He strikes me as the archetypal modern Everton signing; talented but not very effective. We'll only know how effective he can be if he's on the pitch more.
Me? If the prices were right, I'd sell him and buy Edouard off Celtic.
106 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:34:27
Exchange loan - if Carlo/Brands put their minds to it, I am sure an exchange of Kean for Chucky Lozano at Napoli can be worked out, with an option to buy at the end of the season.
Buy a left footed CB like Tomori and loan out one of Branthwaite or Gibson.
GK: Pickford, Virginia, Lossl
CB: Keane, Mina, Holgate, Tomori, Gibson
Full Backs: Coleman, Digne, Kenny, Nkounkou
MF: Allan, Gbamin, Gomes, Doucoure, Davies, Siggy
Forwards: James, Bernard, Iwobi, Richarlison, DCL, Gordon, Lozano
Hopefully, Gbamin regains his fitness by November and can play a role in the 2nd half of the season.
107 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:44:42
It's very dangerous to have this lad as a third option. Either try Simms out or swap Kean for a proper striker who can at least hold a ball up. Big financial loss on the cards but that's our trademark at the moment until all these substandard players are off and away.
I just hope the fact that he is the same nationality as Carlo doesn't make him stubborn or cloud judgement... surely not, eh?
108 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:46:59
It might be a good idea to give the lad a break. After all, Brands did tell Kean's mum that he'd be looked after.
109 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:55:46
Walcott very poor again considering what he's on and his history, Bernard did try, but didn't set the world alight either unlucky hitting the post. Kean gives me the impression he doesn't want to be here.
You'd think that a game like last night, or indeed others in the past (pre-season/friendlies etc) fringe players would be busting a gut to impress the Manager, and the fans alike, to be either in the first team consideration or at least a place on the bench.
I did think Gordon and Nkounkou were the epitome last night of what the others should have acceded to!
Paul T, good shout there for Odsonne Edouard of Celtic, what a partner or standalone striker he would be with DCL. Good strong, right age, wish we had him.
110 Posted 17/09/2020 at 08:59:58
I thought Gordon was great and very unlucky not to score, we hit the woodwork at least 5 times didnt we? Could have been 6 or 7 quite easily so not much to moan about
111 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:00:09
112 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:01:24
Walcott still doesn't feel the need to step up. A regular feature when he plays is commentators and their side-kicks commenting on his once-promising career, as a way of contrasting with his performances now. 100 goals, second-youngest England-capped player, 47 Caps, 2 FA Cup medals. . .
I suppose we all remember him moving at pace and scoring. He still is tactically aware, but technically he is now off the pace and appears to be playing to avoid injury. He seems basically to have found his comfort zone and is staying there, his big wages roll in anyway. Probably planning for his MLS move in the last year of his contract.
113 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:04:22
Kean might just start to get his game going given a couple of 20-minute cameos with some quality service but, until then, at least he has the Fleetwood game to continue his development.
As Darren says, his game is at a low ebb but I'm sure he has plenty to offer. If his header had dropped in, he might have gone on to get more but, in fairness, some are suggesting that he looked unhappy, whereas I thought he looked angry with himself for not doing better. The pen was a little embarrassing (as Sigurdsson would normally take it) but it shows his peers want him to succeed.
I, for one am willing to be patient and Darren remember that a lot of those 35 appearances have been off the bench with little time on the clock.
I think the other thing worth mentioning regarding him is that Salford sat deep and he usually received the ball with his back to goal. Perhaps not his strongest skillset.
If we get past Fleetwood, then it will be interesting to see how this lot would cope against a good Championship team. I wonder if Carlo would feel the need to bring in the big boys?
114 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:04:54
Whereas, the full-backs and Gordon will see it as an opportunity to impress. Shows the importance of buying players with the right mentality, attitude and desire.
Good result, but it's starting to become clearer who is buying into the team and who is happy to collect their cheques with minimal input... off you pop (transferred or into the reserves never to be see again).
115 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:07:10
After Kean put in a MotM performance against Newcastle last season, instead of giving his confidence a boost by naming him in the next lineup he was dropped.
As you say, his game, and confidence, must be on the floor.I wonder how he would have performed with Sunday's midfield behind him.
116 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:07:30
117 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:07:42
"Thankfully Carlo is running the team and not some of the punters on TW"
Imagine the fun and games we would have during the debates on the "Everton Senior Team Selection Committee: TW Division."
And having made our selections we could then present them to the Live Forum
118 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:14:14
They'll all have a part to play this season. They'll all have better games too.
Next summer will result in a deeper overhaul as contracts expire.
119 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:23:39
I dread to think what the outcome might be if team selection was left to us amateurs on TW, haha. Of course, it's good fun playing fantasy football manager and all part of the experience being on this forum.
I prefer to leave the big decisions to the manager provided he knows his stuff... Carlo is obviously an excellent manager and is proving it.
120 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:25:08
Kean can trap it much harder and further...
121 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:29:24
He's a kid a long way from home – who knows how many different things he's struggling with? But I'm not sure if we are doing him too many favours keeping him at Everton.
122 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:30:39
This kid trains every single day with professional coaches and cannot trap a ball with any part of his body? He learns to do that... then we might start to see something.
That is such a basic thing. In fact, if Carlo wants to send him over to my place l will teach him within an hour in my back garden. £50 grand a week, my arse.
123 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:39:23
He wouldn't have got anywhere near the Juventus first team if he genuinely couldn't get the basics right.
124 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:45:31
He needs to go on loan; we need reliable back-up. Not this kid right now. Of course, there's Tosun... and Theo.
125 Posted 17/09/2020 at 09:53:40
As many of us have been saying, without Carlo we would have struggled to attract players of the level of James Rodriguez and others, especially given the lack of European football.
He's certainly an improvement on some of our more recent managerial choices. I must admit to having some doubts about him after the post lockdown restart. He seemed unable to get the team performing in some games and we were really dire at times. I guess you have to put that down to the quality of some of the squad with which he had been saddled.
126 Posted 17/09/2020 at 10:24:25
Bernard, Davies, Sigurdsson and Walcott played their normal game with all their normal faults. And Kean was ineffective. Dont be fooled by Sigurdsson taking a corner for his assist, and scoring a tap in. He was crap, invisible as usual.
On about 70 minutes, Carlo and Duncan were looking increasingly concerned. Gary Neville suggested we might have to bring on some of our big hitters as it was getting uncomfortable.
From there on in, however, we bossed it. We got the second goal, then could have scored another 4/5. Sigurdsson suddenly started playing and looked a good player. We were brilliant in the last 20 minutes - no doubt Salford were lacking fitness and they knew theyd lost by then.
Id say 4/5 players took their opportunities last night, but I wasnt impressed by any of our established midfielders or Kean in attack.
127 Posted 17/09/2020 at 10:24:35
Certainly Nkounkou and Gordon put in excellent performances, and were probably the only 2 who impressed the manager, and did their first team squad chances no harm at all. I do feel for Moise Kean as it just hasnt happened for him yet, but he is young enough to put it right, lets not forget its difficult for home grown youngsters, let alone young players with no network of friends around him, to try and help him.
But we won comfortably probably could and should have scored at least 4 or 5 more goals, and we progressed without having to call on to many who played against Spurs.
128 Posted 17/09/2020 at 10:30:44
Shocking player totally bereft of the basics
129 Posted 17/09/2020 at 10:34:41
130 Posted 17/09/2020 at 10:37:51
For heavens sake give Kean a chance everyone. Young lad, learning his trade, foreign country, strange language ( plus the accent!!)- of course it will take time with him, especially given the midfield and striking partners he had last night. Give him a decent run with the new midfield in place and see if he improves. Look how people slagged off DCL ( and how some still do)- Kean will make it big time somewhere and I just hope its with us and not with Serie A.
131 Posted 17/09/2020 at 10:54:35
132 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:06:38
That is code for, “ they are bubble wrapped and waiting to be dispatched “
133 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:17:31
Although it will be interesting to see, given a few more games, if Moise Kean will come good, but up to now, taking into account his poor first touch and control, there is little or no comparison to Lukaku.
I often look at his facial expression which are often an indicator of whether a player is enjoying his game, and unless he is a miserable sod by nature, that never comes over that he is.
134 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:25:45
135 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:29:14
All that said. I would have loved to see him celebrate a bit more after his cheeky penalty though! Whether he knows it or not, it comes across as being a bit disenchanted IMO.
138 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:47:04
Doubling down on your ludicrous logic from last nights live forum I see. Let me lay it out for you. Ancelotti inherited a squad from Silva. Last season he could only pick players from that squad. Add in injuries to a few players and hes even more limited in who he can select. All of our squad should be good enough to play for Everton - thats why they are here in the first place. If there are players who are regularly underachieving then what is he going to do? We cant put out a team of 3 players because the manager decides that the others simply are not good enough. You have to select 18 players from the club to be the match-day squad. Thats it. So Im sorry but youre the one with the flawed logic if you keep criticising a manager who is giving opportunities to players - young and old - to turn a corner and prove themselves, when really it is those players that deserve the criticism for simply not being good enough to take their chance.
Michael Kenrick (111) is bang on the money; Kean simply had to start last nights game. The fact that his performance only served to illustrate the reasons why he has been used so sparingly up to now is on Moise Kean and nobody else. Players need to take their opportunities. Gordon did. Nkounkou did. They proved themselves to be good enough. Kean is way behind.
139 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:59:19
Good point. Smile and the whole world will smi!e with you.
140 Posted 17/09/2020 at 11:59:59
141 Posted 17/09/2020 at 12:03:53
142 Posted 17/09/2020 at 12:12:07
This is an good thread, all the difference in opinions is what makes football so interesting, and although I might have been guilty of it myself in the past, Im only ever dismissive about a footballer, if I see a lack of effort, and thats why Im not giving up on Moise Kean.
Gordon was great in patches, but Im not sure the kid is ready because I think he switches off a little bit to often. But the more he plays, the more he will develop, and some of his forward play was very good.
Sometimes its about being patient, especially with the younger players. Its easy being dismissive, Ive done it myself with Theo Walcott, but thats only because I see a lack of desire, and not because he lacks ability.
143 Posted 17/09/2020 at 12:20:50
Being dismissive is actually not so easy. Because we all want every player to be a success. We all want to believe. But faced with evidence to the contrary I am not going to let desire and hope get in the way of reason; I'm going to be critical.
145 Posted 17/09/2020 at 12:32:41
146 Posted 17/09/2020 at 12:44:33
I thought he had a good game. He was always willing to make himself available, showed good energy and also showed his quality. Yes maybe we are a little impatient for him to reach his potential and yes he is now 22 but think of where Jack Grealish was at his age and where he is now after a couple of season's in the Championship to boost his confidence. Tom is going to be backup to Doucoure and he has a job on his hands to shift him but performances like last night showed me he has the quality to be a premier league player for us and playing in a team with top midfielders and a bit of stability will only help him. Last night reminded me more of his quality than gave me a stick to beat him with.
I view him, Nkounkou and Gordon as the big "winners" out of last night and potentially Sigurdsson (who is in direct competition with Gomes for a place in the team as it stands, Gomes didn't have his best game at the weekend). Nkounkou must be delighted with himself, he has basically progressed his career a year by showing that he can be an able understudy to Digne and us signing another left back doesn't look a great idea now.
The losers from last night for me were Kenny, Walcott, Bernard and Kean. I thought Kenny was trying too hard, he knew he had to perform and do something special and I think he knows that Coleman over the course of the season is definitely someone who can be shifted from the team. He isn't a young player anymore he has had a season being first choice RB in a top European league. He didn't do anything to convince me he should be considered over Seamus as it stands - I expected better. Walcott was so anonymous that I would be tempted to have a look at Bolasie as the backup for the RW ahead of him now and give him a go against Fleetwood. Theo has rightly been in and around the team as he has been the only natural option on the RW (Richy can do a job but is much, much better either up top or on the left). With James seemingly first choice there now and the potential for others to play out of position to cover it (Gordon, Richy, Iwobi, Bolasie!! etc...) he looks like a very expensive bench option and surely we will be looking to move him on. Bernard I don't think had a bad game to be honest, he is more a victim of the performance of Gordon. I don't see what the established pro and Brazilian international offers that we can't get from our young scouser and if I was to give one of them some minutes I know who would get them. I expect Gordon may make the bench for the weekend and Bernard is the most familiar player to him to likely miss out. Again from a cost perspective does he offer enough given the alternative options. Finally Kean, I think we have to be patient with him, playing up top on your own is a tough job there are plenty of examples of that, he needs more opportunities like this to boost his confidence and also get used to the responsibility. DCL didn't become the player he is now overnight and let's remember Kean is 3 years younger than him. That said only by dominating in games like this is he going to be trusted in that role in the premier league (It is no shock he got shunted to the wing when he came on against Spurs). He had the chances and didn't take them. One positive is he seemed to put more effort in and that seems to be an upward trend.
Anyway, I am delighted we drew another lower league team in the next round and hopefully we will see the majority of this line up again in that game, maybe less a few we have managed to get rid of.
147 Posted 17/09/2020 at 12:45:50
I'm just not sure why some seem so eager to cut bait on him, like... what's the benefit? He's a relatively low earner and there will always be a market for him in Serie A. If he doesn't want to be here, then fair enough... but otherwise, why not see what Carlo can do with him over the course of a season in a stronger side?
148 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:06:30
149 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:14:02
150 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:17:43
Also if Tom Davies and JJK can't stand out and dominate against division 2 players they should be moved on.
151 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:21:35
152 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:22:09
Spot on with your last sentence Stan
“Some people seem to make their minds up, and theres no shifting them”
Theyre never wrong
153 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:28:18
You could have saved yourself a lot of embarrassment if you actually took a minute out to find out how Mr Ancelotti rates Kean. He thinks he is an "incredible talent".
Despite your long list of daft arsed excuses about him having no choice but to play Kean, Carlo himself (The one who you think can do no wrong ) thinks differently
The really funny thing here is, that Carlo is front and center of the group you dismiss as "Moise Kean apologist". There are numerous quotes from him extolling the virtues of his young talent. If only you had looked ?
The reason he has chosen him so often (as opposed to being forced to by last nights circumstances) is because he rates him.
He very recently told gathered press that he has THREE strikers available to him.
"I think Moise Kean has many qualities. He is a great talent and as I said before, football must surely be based on talent, which must be supported with great character, professionalism and personality. He is very young. He is a serious boy, helpful and will surely do well"
So there you have it. The flaw in your logic. The guy you are making excuses for, clearly thinks you are talking shite.
154 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:29:57
155 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:30:44
156 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:32:50
157 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:37:06
His all round game is obviously miles behind Calvert-Lewin - games like last night demonstrate just how good our favourite championship strikers all round game really is.
He does naturally seem to be around the right areas at the right time, which is one area that Calvert-Lewin seems to need to think about. If his header was 2 inches lower and his last shot 2 inches to the right then he has a hatrick and no one debates any of this.
I think theres a player in there, but a completely different player to what we have now. Hell turn out to be more of a poacher than a player and, with a bit of confidence, could be very useful.
158 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:42:01
Tell you what, let's pause this and talk at the end of the season. We'll find out exactly where we are on Moise Kean. My guess is that Kean will play less than 750 minutes in the Premier League (if he even stays here beyond the transfer window) - which would suggest that maybe Carlo doesn't actually think he's as incredible as you think he does. Seemingly nobody on these pages can change your mind about anything, but if I'm proved right then I'm hoping that time can.
Also, I'd appreciate if you didn't take that patronising "Oh dear" approach. It doesn't come off well.
159 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:45:35
160 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:51:32
Jonjo has the ability to perform, along with Seamus, to share the right back position this season and eventually make it his own, he did enough last night to make me confident he has a good future at Everton, especially playing with better and more responsible players around him.
161 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:57:26
Fully agree regarding JJK
I find it strange some are calling for Kenny to go and spend money, thats in tight supply, on unknown oversea players
As has been proven with all our best teams over the years. Its not so much having the best individual players but having the best team players
162 Posted 17/09/2020 at 13:58:18
163 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:01:40
164 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:05:30
Kevin@157-spot on...on all fronts.That's exactly how I see it.
165 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:08:07
Some right choosey folks as well, suggesting we turf out potential superstars just because they havent yet hit their straps.
Rather than those who played being in the shop window last night, Id suggest that it was the ones who played last night who are most likely to be seen as genuine squad players.
166 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:11:18
167 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:15:23
But the boy has a nose for goal. He played really poorly last night, but still could have had three goals! He' putting himself in the right positions for success.
We need to be patient and not cut bait yet. Having said that, the kid needs to improve and buckle down. Someone should be fizzing balls into him at 100 mph and expecting him to keep them within inches of himself when he receives it, all the while regaling him with stories of one Romelu Lukaku.
It's too early to write the kid off. He's got to up his game though, soon.
168 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:22:52
169 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:27:37
And Niasse got a whole contract to come good!
170 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:27:57
171 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:35:37
Now that Allan and Decoure are in the team, I think he can flourish - I would put him in the 10. Some or most people think his time is up - I couldn't disagree more. Now that we have intelligence with James and actual proper central midfielders, I think this precisely the time that Sigurdsson can finally use out his technical and brainy skill set.
I'd have Richarlison on the left, James on the right. Carlo has said that James' best position DCL up top.
(Both would cut in often, the fullbacks would give width, Allan would cover and Decoure could too when both the fullback and winger were forward.)
Sigurdsson is a very good player. Just needs a strong central midfield behind him so he doesn't have to worry about Everton losing the ball and getting smashed the other way - he was always worried about this to me last year. He was played as some sort of 6/8 hybrid nonsense position - for lack of other options. Always trying to make sure we didn't give the ball away because it was obvious that if we turned it over there'd be noone quick and robust enough to save things before they got close to the defence and the goal - certainly Sigurdsson himself isn't, and he knew it. And he doesn't really have the pace to make many options for people to pass to him when they're coming out of defence - he's just way too slow to maraud around the middle of a pitch. So he was basically useless in terms of his own play.
(To me, tonight was somewhat (there were obviously differences - quality of opposition, etc) a microcosm of this dichotomy. First part of the game was a 6 - useless. Next part of the game was more of an 8 - a bit less useless. Last 20 minutes we thought we should go for it - Salford tired, if we got one more goal it would sure things up - Sigurdsson feels less unencombered and starts hanging out nearer a 10 position without worrying as much about defensive stuff - he does good things. His goal wasn't a big deal - but his movement for it was good - nothing crazy, but good. He played some good balls. Etc)
172 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:51:02
- Kean has all the poor attributes of Lukaku- poor touch, ponderous to build through- without the significant redeeming feature of an eye for a goal.
- Gordon looks like a talent, or at least he looked more so against this lowly level of opposition than anyone else on the park, excepting perhaps the left back. Whether he will ever be up against a right back as slow as Salford's is debatable.
- Mostly everything else is what we already know. Bernard and Siggy are not messiahs, they are no more than decent squad players who can do a job. If they are all you have, as was the case last year, you will struggle. Walcott is past playing even at that level and Davies hasn't even reached that level, and probably won't. Brutally put, those two are probably excess to requirements. Then there is all the other expensive flotsam and jetsam we have acquired; Iwobi, Tosun, Sandro, Besic, Bolasie, the list goes on. Problem is, which we also already know, while we have 6 or 7 we could do with moving on, few if any will have them at their current wages and certainly not anywhere close to the transfer fees we shelled out.
Maybe we could have a jumble sale. Or a buy 2 get 1 free offer...
173 Posted 17/09/2020 at 14:54:23
We have a limited stable of forwards so hes staying and getting cameos until either they yield great results, Calvert-Lewin needs resting or is injured. The key element here is when he is presented with the opportunity, he takes it. I think he will.
Similarly Sigurdsson only really became useful when Salford tired. He became prominent in the last 20 minutes, this is his role, teams either become fatigued or are searching for a goal, space frees up and he then becomes dangerous because he has time. Even last night he was passive and off the pace, but still has that set piece delivery that keeps him on the side.
The left side made a good fist of making a case and Virginia was unfussy, although untested. The rest were so poor; ball pace, control, static, wayward passing. It was all pretty turgid. Lets be fair it was only when they tired we started peppering the woodwork.
They have some tine to think about their performance but this incarnation may well be back at it against Fleetwood in a weeks time. Im expecting a lot better.
174 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:28:40
We are starting to see young players coming into the first team, and that was what a lot of supporters wanted,so lets give young players a chance and not judge them on 1 game.
175 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:30:11
I'm more than happy to leave it there. I don't hold out much hope for Kean myself.
I suspect you are not old enough to have watched your own sons playing grown up football. or coached young lads trying their best to play well. If I'm right, One day you probably will. then you will understand the natural instinct to desperately want a boy who is struggling to come good.
You feel the term "Oh dear" is patronsing, but you have just dismissed people wanting to offer support to a struggling youngster as "apologists".
Carlo is not "Gilding the Lilly". As Conor quite rightly points out. He was an admirer of Kean before either of them even got here.
Dont be fooled by Carlo's "favourite uncle" persona. The guy can be fucking ruthless when the need arises. If he doesnt want a player who will fetch a fee. The player will be packed off in short order. Better players than Kean have found that out to their cost.
I hope we are both wrong. I hope young Kean bangs in so many goals, Carlos is forced to go to DCL and Rich and tell them to shape up or ship out
176 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:32:23
Moise Kean at such a tender age is now a lap dance away from the poisoned chalice which is the wrath of our rather fickle supporters.
He shows great promise for a young striker still growing into his own body. He does look awkward sometimes and his much maligned “first touch” is about as Lukakus was at a similar age. His confidence is a bit drained but lets face it even last night when not playing that well he hit the post, twice and took his pen well.
Has he scored in the last three games that he has started? Is the lad going to develop into one of those annoyingly rough center forwards who can play entire games and just clumsily barge the ball into the net twice every three games. I think he might just turn out to be that bad.
Wouldnt it be great if our third striker was more of a rough and tumble bruiser who could push defenders around a little bit? This kid will be awesome when he manages to hold the bit in his teeth. Patience Patience Patience.
177 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:34:36
It would be interesting to see how Moise Keane got on in our stellar 4-3-3, with Richie on the left and Rodriguez on the right. Gomes, Allan, Doucoure behind him.
I am not advocating starting before DCL at all, but it would be good to see Kean play 20-30 mins if we were 2 or 3-0 up. It would be interesting to see his predatory instincts with that level of service around him.
For me , he is 20 and really needs more competitive games, with Juve so superior,he hadnt really had that full on. He needs time to work on his game and improve. There is a player there, a strong bull of a predator but it is going to be a work in progress.
Patience is the quality that is needed with Moise, but sadly, it is a lost treasure and has become a thing of the past.
178 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:34:48
Everyone criticises, but its when people just criticise for the sake of it, rather than giving constructive criticism, or something we might learn from, thats what Ive never understood?
I used to play, and honestly used to get embarrassed if a coach said Id played well, because I already knew if Id played well, (twice a season) and I used to be even worse if I was told Id played badly, because I also knew when Id played shite.
Thats the point Im trying to make, we only learn when people tell us why they are being dismissive, whilst indecision is usually just stringing someone along imo.
Kean is probably not smiling because hes probably not happy with his game, I love football, because actions always speak louder than words!
179 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:43:57
180 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:49:59
John P #173, likewise.
I'm in the "keep Kean" contingent as well. Talent worth nurturing.
181 Posted 17/09/2020 at 15:56:31
My take on it is he has a goalscorers instinct but is not suited to the Premier league where everything is closed down and players tightly marked so close control, retaining the ball and laying off to a teammate are all necessary qualities.
Regrettably Kean doesnt show me any of this. He is a head down, run at defenders and try to get round them or bulldoze the way through which obviously does not work even against lowly Salford. Technically he is not too bad but his attitude and awareness of other players is not good.
People say "If only that header would have gone in" and I have to tell you that even at 69 years of age I could and should bury that header with only the GK to beat. To head it onto the bar was very poor.
Brandthwaite is 18 and Gordon is 20 we don't have to make excuses for them because their quality and attitude shows.
Last season I was all for being patient with Italy's potential superstar but on the basis of 90 minutes against lowly Salford I'm afraid this kid will not make the breakthrough.
182 Posted 17/09/2020 at 16:14:14
This should be his role, coming on against teams who are either tired or chasing the game and putting the game to bed. In this scenario - he is still an excellent squad player.
183 Posted 17/09/2020 at 16:23:27
184 Posted 17/09/2020 at 16:48:10
I couldnt understand the criticism of Bernard, except for his wastefulness, in the final third considering his quality, So I was very surprised to hear Jerome, had to look at his stats, to be impressed because I thought it was the little Brazilian, who constantly tried to get on the ball, and kept us playing all night. (He will become a much better player, playing with our new additions imo)
Jonjoe is basic, nothing flash, nothing extravagant, rarely wastes the ball with his passes, put it on a six-pence for Moise Kean to miss, and is hopefully going to be the unsung-hero, in a similar way both Carragher & Neville became to both their home-town clubs.
Big teams need that local identity on the pitch, and if we can sign another good wideman, Im predicting we might just become one of those big teams again. At least Im dreaming now - anyway!
185 Posted 17/09/2020 at 16:52:42
Richarlison doesn't smile very often on the pitch, and he has a very serious resting concentration face.
So Kean doesn't smile when he scored, he probably accepted that one goal, given to him by Siggy who normally would have taken the penalty, would not have matched up to the three he should have had if he hadn't hit the post.
A more accurate reflection of the kid's reaction to scoring a goal would be his celebration after scoring against Newcastle. Passionate and exuberant.
Also, why is smiling so important to some people when things are still tough for the kid and yet smiling is the death knell when Pickford is trying to shake off a mistake and prepare himself for the next time he is called into action.
If Kean wants to have a serious look on his face whilst knocking them in then I'm cool with that. I'm more interested in how the rest of the team reacts when he scores, and they are reacted well showing a close knit group.
186 Posted 17/09/2020 at 17:35:37
I did have to look at the stats to see what others had seen and that I hadn't watching the same match, on a mini screen. Glad I did since those stats show a player that will be able to make a valuable contribution to the first team squad.
I was concentrating on final third play.
It's the perception it gives. It would help with the perception people have of him. I think that he is a player with a lot to offer, it would help gets fans on his side, which would also benefit him.
The penalty was well taken.
187 Posted 17/09/2020 at 17:44:10
188 Posted 17/09/2020 at 18:32:12
189 Posted 17/09/2020 at 18:42:15
I saw nothing but positivity and a massive strengthening of the squad that the new arrivals have brought. Jonjoe Kenny and NKounku were massive pluses. I found nobody disappointing in Wednesday's team.
Sigurdsson played really well but unfortunately will never fit into a modern squad, Tom Davies hasn't reached his potential yet and gives the ball away dangerously but his time will come. Gordon is like us having bought a £40M player for nothing.
This transfer window has been devastatingly good for us and if we could get a central defender on loan could be perfect.
Kean? Just get off his back and see how it goes with him, he has the potential to become good in a position where most develop late and few are successful at 20. If Carlo rates him, then he's good enough for me.
190 Posted 17/09/2020 at 18:44:30
191 Posted 17/09/2020 at 18:49:26
His move to us is going down the pan and there are only so many chances you get at new clubs before you get moved down the pecking order of clubs interested in you and thus down the salary scale and it's a long if not impossible journey back. He won't want this to go wrong.
Wanting the penalty is, in my view, one of the few positive aspects of his contribution last night. At least he didn't shy away.
Is there a player in him? There might be despite last night when frankly he looked a bit desperate, over hyper. I can't see it being as a hold-up player who can guard the ball, lay it off. It might be as a player feeding off runs and through balls where he has some pace and power to offer. Same as Rom really. Or Vardy in Leicester's winning year. We may not have seen much of it but I can imagine he has a decent shot on him if he's in the mood so could maybe flourish in that type of set up.
But that is not, from what I can see, the gameplan we have right now so he might be a square peg in a round hole.
192 Posted 17/09/2020 at 19:29:15
I was interested when you mentioned Bernard because, watching the game last night, I thought he'd been our most industrious player, but I agree, he's got to become much better in the final third.
I thought Gordon played in patches, but he helped create a number of chances, and that's definitely what you want off these type of players. I can understand the people who were more impressed with “young Anthony” whilst Everton are hopefully going to become more entertaining than watching The Sopranos!
193 Posted 17/09/2020 at 20:44:13
I listened to last night's game, and some of the players who were considered to have played well, have been crucified on this thread. Experience has taught me that we can go to the same match and see a different game.
I must confess that I expected Everton to win comfortably, but experience has also taught me that anything can happen in a game of football. There are some players that I favour more than others, and I may be critical, but not to the extent of some on this site.
My take on things is that anyone who earns his living playing football, can do exactly that, 'play football'. As I have stated I have my favourites, but I defy anyone to find a post where I have vilified any Everton player.
At games I experience elation, deflation, pleasure, frustration, but the most important thing to me is the fact that I offer support to those players who wear the 'Royal Blue' shirt, irrespective of favouritism, or otherwise.
194 Posted 17/09/2020 at 20:56:49
There were a good number of people on this site who said Lukaku was a waste of £28M, I promise you!!
195 Posted 17/09/2020 at 21:04:26
My only worry is up front. I'm a big fan of Calvert-Lewin, I think he will be as good a centre forward as Graeme Sharp, but if he's injured do we really believe Moise Kean could replace him? I've seen nothing to convince me he has what it takes. I'm fact I've seen nothing in nearly 40 appearances
196 Posted 17/09/2020 at 21:44:36
Kean needs to relax his feet, as Michael said in 111 this was the perfect game play him. Bernard and Sigurdsson if they are squad players shows good depth to me. Feels like we have a good blend of experience and youth in the squad now.
197 Posted 17/09/2020 at 22:03:17
My own take on things is that its dead easy to criticise, but if you want people to listen and learn, youve got to earn their respect. Youve got to show them you know what youre on about, and also that you care. Sadly I never met that many, once I moved away from playing with my mates, because football is absolutely brutal.
200 Posted 17/09/2020 at 23:01:28
I think most people give credit to players who have played well, whereas they are naturally critical of those who haven't. And that's entirely as it should be on a forum like this.
As far as I can tell, football's always been like that. It's about summing up what you've seen and what your reaction was to seeing them play.
Of course, if you deliberately don't actually watch them play, then you might not be in the best place to judge for yourself how they played, or how reasonable and justified the views are of those who did actually take the trouble to watch them play.
201 Posted 17/09/2020 at 23:35:20
I came to the same conclusion about Moise Kean before Souness, after witnessing his earliest appearances for us. My nephew sat next to me in the Gwladys Street stand pleaded his case, complaining that Kean wasn't being fed enough by his team mates.
I pointed out that it was his lack of positional awareness and inability to create space for himself off the ball, which made it impossible for others to pass to him. It meant he was easily marked, or found himself continually turning and dribbling into dead ends, as soon as he received a pass.
Moise has shown absolutely nothing in the ensuing months to convince me otherwise. People who are attempting to make a case for him, are clutching at straws. He has an athletic frame, devoid of a football brain. To compare him to Lukaku is absurd.
Excuses about a young lad in a foreign land are nonsense. He's living in the lap of luxury, with a manager who speaks his native tongue. What more could any young man ask for?
He was quite simply yet another costly mistake. Iwobi is another who falls into the same category. Arsenal mugged us. I bet they couldn't believe their luck at the fee we paid for him.
It's a long list of deadwood. I don't need to name the rest. Their performances speak for themselves. Carlo's priority should be focussing on shifting them quickly and bringing in players of similar quality to our magnificent recent signings.
202 Posted 18/09/2020 at 00:21:28
203 Posted 18/09/2020 at 08:54:23
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