World Cup: Day 17

Just had to endure some cloth-eared clueless bint raving and near wetting herself about the prospect of watching Spain and Morocco, had to turn the sound down.

I wonder when the betting companies will be using women to encourage you to bet? It's nothing to do with women in sport, it's about making money off them after all.

This game must be causing mass heart attacks in Spain.

Pretty entertaining for a 0-0 draw (so far).

Sounds like the Turkey v Senegal 0-0 match in 2002 I think. Probably the best match I've seen but I was fairly inebriated in Dien Bien Phu so that could have had an effect. At work obviously.

"inebriated in Dien Bien Phu" is a phrase that, I'm quite certain, has never been written on TW before.

What a game. If only for an Everton type striker Morocco might have scored.

Ouch! Spain hit the post (again)!

Are we heading for a bit of an upset?

Vaya con Dios, Espana!

I'll take it as a make up for forgetting that Turkey scored late in said match. TW will provide some decent references from time to time. The tension. Two down, stay down Espana.

Morocco through on penalties

Cheeky!

Spain out!

Hakimi. Born in Madrid. Mother a house cleaner, father a street vendor, turned down Spain to play for Morocco. What a story.

It's a beautiful day. Some keeper that Bono

No excuse miss 3 penalty kicks on the trot

Bye bye Spain. Boring football anyway.

Crikey - well, who didn't want that result?

The Moors wars.

Good. Prevents us from having an entirely Euro/SouthAmerican QF line up. I worried about Spain's scoring ability when I saw Morata was in the squad. Just everything fell into place versus Costa Rica but three games since they have been nowhere near as good.

Morocco finally made a mistake. Dropped their manager.

I'm sure I just saw Rafa in the crowd, draped in a Moroccan flag.

4 games in and nobody's scored against Morocco yet, including 3 penalties! (Was an og v Canada)

I feel Mrs Merton would say to Luis Enrique, 'Why didn't you kick it at the goal a bit more often?'

I agree Peter. Fannying around playing tippy tappy in midfield for 120 plus minutes before going out on pens they can't really complain. Shoot at goal you numpties! Too many teams trying to walk it in. Have they had talks from the phenominal one?!

Time for the Swiss. Portugal have some players yeah just can't stand.

Well, if I could stand on them I'd be okay with that David. Almost as respectable as the Dutch that lot.

I like Embolo. We should have got him when Lukaku went.

Did I just see a safe standing area behind the goal Portugal are attacking ?

Don't think this will be going to extra time.

The Portuguese have been very impressive and have played some really great flowing football tonight.

Now that is some finish.

To think Goncalo Ramos was turned away from finch farm to make way for Rondon.

Agree with the fannying around by Spain. It's superficially quite impressive because there are nice neat passes and bits of technique to admire. But then you realise 20 minutes have gone by and nothing has really happened.

Goncalo Ramos looked exactly the sort of player we need. Rafael Leao too. Weve been strongly linked with both in recent years. You're not being serious about Ramos being at Finch Farm are you Keiran?

Kieran, he's Championship at best.

I was jumping up and down about Ramos in the summer as he can also play wider. He is one of the reasons why Benfica let the Redshite buy Nunez, they knew he was coming through. Out of our price range now sadly.

Peter @26 yes I always like Embolo when I watch him, made for the Premier League.

Good stuff, Steve, that one got past me but I did have ideas about Embolo.

I believe Embolo went to Monaco for a little over £10m in the summer. Absolute steal!

So, the great Spain had 77% of possession and made 1,019 passes - 926 of which were accurate (but pointless?) - compared to Morocco's 304.

They ended the match, though, with just six attempts and one shot on target.

That's what dispirits me about modern football.

Brazil go 4-0 up and then merely go through the motions for the remainder of their match. That's totally unprofessional. It's boring and robs spectators of what they've so extortionately paid for.

Portugal showed true professionalism, and fuck game-management and all the other psycho bollocks spouted to defend mundanity, endless possession, barely a shot on goal, and the obscene money paid for merely bog-standard unenterprising performance. Portugal not only won but entertained from start to finish.

And that sort of attitude and performance is what can make football great.

(Note to highly critical of me, fellow devout Toffee - at heart, I didn't watch either game live, just the highlights. But how are you doing on identifying just one shite match in which any of the plethora of brilliant players you elsewhere cited as "brilliant" took part in decades past? Your silence is deafening to me but I'm genuinely curious.)

All the best though!

I don't know what everyone is arguing about regarding the World Cup, it's been like it's always been: some good games, some great goals, some poor games – it's what happens when 56 games get played in a 3-week window, it's tournament football.

For those lamenting the glorious tournaments of the past, I recently watched the full 120 minutes of the 1966 final. Honestly, the quality of the football was dire, mistakes and misplaced passes everywhere; the modern game has come on in leaps and bounds, World Cup after World Cup. It's worth watching just to witness how bad it was.

If you think the final was dire, Jeff, you did well to avoid the opening game. You're on the money, of course.

I started to put up a list of really poor games from previous World Cups on the Day 16 thread. Unfortunately, finger fatigue forced me to stop. There are dozens and dozens... and dozens.

It would appear those who feel qualified to hammer a tournament they are not even watching, failed to watch the ones they thought were wonderful too.

Equally ignorant of all tournaments. I guess that's the closest you'll get to a balanced view!

My own favourite World Cup was Spain in 1982. Partly because I was a kid, and was so in love with the beautiful game, but also because it was the only time that I've seen a tournament produce two absolutely great matches.

Italy beating Brazil 3-2, and then the West Germany v France semi-final that ended up 3-3, before the Germans eventually won on penalties.

Also, the Italian players celebration after scoring in the final (I forget his name, Tardelli?) was the greatest thing I'd ever seen in my life up to then!

What was it like for those of a certain vintage when England failed to qualify for any tournaments between 1970 and 1980?

I remember missing 1994 and 2008 and that was bad enough but I can't imagine missing two Euros and a World Cup on the bounce. Weird too given that English clubs were dominating Europe in the 70s.

Were people annoyed?

I think there was a special meeting of cultural and footballing moments between and including the 1970 and 1990 World Cups. It was interrupted by a limp tournament in 1994 and I don't think the same spark has been present since. But it was indeed a cultural as well as a sporting thing.

Modern footballing tedium has something to do with the sort of technical awareness and physical excellence which others have rightly noted here. There are some fine matches and fine goals to be seen but there is an underlying monotony which comes from supremely fit and overcoached athletes who are forever measuring risk and reflecting upon themselves.

It is a great shining narrative, beautifully produced, but one from which authenticity and a certain innocence have been polished away.

I'm not trying to run the board on the front page. Just saw this article from Juan Manuel Lillo and it is a refreshing take on the cup for your perusal:
https://theathletic.com/3981374/2022/12/08/juanma-lillo-world-cup/

Tony (#42), I bow down to your perfectly enunciated sentiments when you say, "but there is an underlying monotony which comes from supremely fit and overcoached athletes who are forever measuring risk and reflecting upon themselves."

It's been going on for decades in so-called elite football and it's anathema to entertainment.

Portugal in their last game "resorted" to professional football as it should be played, gung-ho to the end. Germany demolishing Brazil 7-0 in 2014 until the last minute were of the same ilk.

These days way too many fans seem to accept a good half as sufficient, rather than a good match - and then complain like hell when the pseuds they support are found wanting in a full-throttle contest.

In other team sports no fan accepts one good half because it's taking the piss out of those very same fans. Simples!

Tony #42, I would heatedly dispute your characterization of the '94 World Cup as "limp." I was there. I saw six games in two different cities. It was electric from start to finish.

And the average attendance was 69,000 per game. Only the 2014 tournament in Brazil came anywhere close to that.

I don't trust my memory now, Mike @45, so I'm not going to disagree with you on that; but it felt to me like a change of mood. I do recall Diana Ross missing from 3 yards.

Yeah she wasnt as bad as Romelu.

He did it four times...And she didnt start crying either

I had a feeling about this one even at 0-2

Don't know what's going on with TW, Will? I thought it was all back to normal a few minutes ago, posts from everyone on various threads etc. I refresh the home page and it's just me and you again on the World Cup day 17 thread. 👹👹👹

Will, I haven't got a scooby doo what's going on? It's like threads and posters are disappearing down a black hole. I'm half expecting a poltergeist to jump out of my I Pad and drag me back through the screen. 😱😱

Jeff (38)), You forgot to add that Germany got robbed in that 1966 final and I had a fiver on them to win it, which they would have done in extra time,no thanks to that bleedin' Russian linesman who was as bent as a three pound note or some of the referees we've had in the last few years.

Will, I don't think anyone else can see my or your posts. I don't know what's going on?

I've posted a few, which I can see, but it seems nobody else can. Same with yours, I can see all yours, but they sometimes disappear, then re-appear.

Can anyone see this post, please?

I can, Will. 👍👍👍

Rob, I'm gonna log out on the other browser and see if that changes anything here.

Am I still alive?

Will, it's just me and you. Nobody else exists!! You can abuse anyone you don't like and get away with it.

I can see you Rob and Will!

Portugal not at the races here and resorting to theatrics.

Take nothing away from Morocco. Big strong and committed side.

Great header for the goal and I don't always like to criticise keepers to much, but he totally got the wrong side of the ball for that cross.

I can see an England v Argentina final as it stands.

Does this one show, Rob? Are you logged in on more than one browser?

Danny has joined the chat! Rob and I have been in digital jail...

I logged out of my other browser Will. But the funny thing is I could still submit a post which didn't show my name.

Danny, which thread are you seeing us on?

Danny is ok. He can join our little club.

World Cup Day 17 Will

Is anybody else out there?

SAVE ME AND WILL!

Are the Moroccan supporters given a whistle when they bought their tickets

Just the Three Stooges then!

Gonna log out of this one and back in, maybe that will do something.

I tried that, Will. Came back as a tree!

Bill Gall, do you see me?

(it's Will, from Digital Jail).

Ta, Danny.

Will, it's like Randall and Hopkirk, Deceased.

You're right, Rob - question is, which one of us is Hopkirk?

Rob, I'm a Larch now...

Pressure building here - hope Morocco can hold it.

Apart from Danny, I don't think anyone else can see our posts.

Damn! So close on that counter...

Welease Wob & Will

Yep - we're in limbo. Maybe Danny is our jailer, to keep tabs on us...

Brendan!

Can't believe Ronaldo and Cancelo didn't start.

It's definitely the Poltergeist, Will. We're swirling around in our devices looking for a way out. We need someone to jump in and pull us out.

They might regret that, Rob. Though I'm starting to wonder if Ronaldo has suddenly hit the wall hard.

Energy levels of Morocco, so fit.

Will I thought that was you playing the big drum

We're like those sheets of imprisonment glass in Superman, floating in space.

Morocco will win 2-0. They will score a breakaway goal in the last minute, with every Portuguese player, including their goalie, pressing looking for an equaliser.

Bill!

That's Danny, Brendan and Bill that can see us now, Rob.

I think they all got together to trick us, see how paranoid they can make us...

Wow, Bono to the rescue. I bet U2 thought that was in.

2-0. Would love it. Let's hope.

What a save that was.

Wow I'm back in the Rob and Will universe. I've been in the alternate one this morning. Anyway come on Morocco

If we thought Neymar's tears were bad yesterday, wait until we see Ronaldo after this.

Bill, I stopped banging my own drum years ago - nobody wanted to listen to me.

However this ends up, what a performance by Morocco, tactics, set-up, fitness... excellent.

And now Kieran sees the digital spacemen...

Probably 20 mins of injury time

But Danny has disappeared. Deffo taking it in turns to tease us.

Kieran, I just wondered about that time...

We can get them back, Rob. Already planning it.

8 minutes.

8 minutes.

No Ronaldo heroics today.

Why are Portugal diving and time wasting?

That's bad news...

Harsh red. I've seen far worse from St. Virgin and get away with it.

How does he get sent off but no one did in Arg v Holl?

Well at least we won't see him again for now...

Van Dick, I meant.

Fuck, thought that was the breakaway goal.

DAMN that was a bad waste.

Fuck me this is tense

Jeez... Pepe...

Let's hope Everton after the World Cup break, can derive the same focus and resolve as Morocco have shown in this World Cup.

Brilliant

YES!!!! That was FANTASTIC!

Waterworks time for the winker

Is Ronaldo

Ronaldo sobbing all the way down the tunnel. 😂😂😂😂

Is Ronaldo WALKING OUT THERE?

If he walked out there, that is petulant and entitled beyond belief.

Sportsman?

He will probably quit Portugal now and demand a Brazilian passport

Morocco fully deserved that - excellent.

Kieran, anything possible with that attitude. Surely he'll come back out?

It wasn't a straight red it was his second yellow

Ronaldo will quit football now. He's finished!

God alone knows what will happen in the England game.

Funny Lampard and Everton get criticized for playing defensive football and trying to score on the break yet Morocco deserve it.

Rob, maybe he should. To walk off like that as if they were unfairly robbed or cheated. "Too good" to congratulate the Moroccans.

Bill, it was a fine example of how to do it at that level.

They've beaten Belgium, Spain and Portugal. Talk about a tough route.

I'm made up for Bono, his team showed loads of desire!

Rob H, you could buy a lot of premier league clubs, with the wages Ronaldo is allegedly going to be earning in Qatar over the next two years. Or Saudi!

Will, he came on around the 50 minutes mark, put one cross in not long after, then after that I didn't see him touch the ball. He won't play for Portugal again, and it sounds like he could be after his final payday with a move to Saudi Arabia.

All the other teams will have a raised eyebrow, Kieran.

Sadly with three defenders injured and the red card I can't see Morocco beating France

Ps I'm trying to tempt fate

Have you seen the money mentioned, Rob?

One offer was (reportedly) 368 million for 3 years, another of 150 million for ONE season.

That is madness.

Tony - things have gone too far.

It was definitely Saturday Bloody Saturday for Portugal. (Ok, I know it's really Sunday Bloody Sunday!)

Love him or hate him we won't see the likes of Ronaldo for a long time to come. Same goes for Messi when he calls it time. Two of the top five GOATs in my lifetime.

Unless Iwobi continues his last minute bloom.

Pepe saying the ref cheated lmao

Ronaldo is a horrible narcissist, Colin, but yes one of the greats.

As you observe, though, he's no Iwobi.

Colin, spot on.

Taking the positives to have seen these players, is something and they will justifiably take their place in the hall of football fame.

They earned it.