The Mail Bag
If you're going to moan...
Comments (34)
... moan in the right direction
Evertonians would do well to remember the cause of their frustrations. Rather than booing the team or individual players, they really ought to be directing their anger towards a chairman and board of directors who have consistently failed to back David Moyes and his squad. Mikel Arteta, for one, does not deserve the criticism that is coming his way. Fans ask for loyalty, and Mikel has shown Everton tremendous loyalty since arriving at Goodison six years ago. Yes, he is handsomely rewarded, but he could quite easily have picked up that money or more at other richer clubs.
Don't forget either what David Moyes has done for EFC: a brief synopsis shows six seasons in which his team have been in and around the 60-point mark (or well beyond); four of those campaigns have yielded European football; and, I believe, in any other era of English football pre-1992 he would have brought silverware to Goodison.
Patrick Hart, Posted 23/01/2011 at 14:24:04
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Patrick I agree with you - a good post!
Lyndon yes we have a good bunch of players but we must be the only team in the premiership that is not improving in quality. In addition there is relatively little competition for places - if arteta or fellaini have a couple of bad games do they really think that they will be out of the side until a poor performance by someone else lets them back in - of course not.
We have a good starting 11 but all of the players must be frustrated that we're not converting any chances, we do need some fresh faces in (not loans) to inject a bit of life into a squad that is probably a bit too comfortable.
Lyndon yes we have a good bunch of players but we must be the only team in the premiership that is not improving in quality. In addition there is relatively little competition for places - if arteta or fellaini have a couple of bad games do they really think that they will be out of the side until a poor performance by someone else lets them back in - of course not.
We have a good starting 11 but all of the players must be frustrated that we're not converting any chances, we do need some fresh faces in (not loans) to inject a bit of life into a squad that is probably a bit too comfortable.
Here, here. Completely agree.
We should be collectively putting more pressure on BK and the board instead of moaning between ourselves about the manager's and the players' failings. Neither have much of a chance with zero investment when teams around us and below continually outspend us in transfer windows. It's not rocket science; no wonder morale seems shot.
We should be collectively putting more pressure on BK and the board instead of moaning between ourselves about the manager's and the players' failings. Neither have much of a chance with zero investment when teams around us and below continually outspend us in transfer windows. It's not rocket science; no wonder morale seems shot.
Spot on Patrick. Unfortunately it is all about backing for the manager and the introduction of good new players to keep us moving forward.
If the manager has not said "This is the best squad I have had at Everton", then fair enough, but as Lyndon has said, everyone at that club is responsible.
Not equally responsible, but responsible nonetheless.
Mikel Arteta is having an absolute stinker of a season, and criticism is levied towards him, and rightly so. He is the top earner at the club, but he is certainly not the top performer. It's his job to take games by the scruff of the neck and dominate them, when was the last time you saw that happen?
All I see is Arteta picking up the ball and sliding it backwards or wide for other players to take responsibility.
Its not good enough. You don't get to have a free season just because you were mustard pre-contract.
Far too many Evertonians refusing to look at what is happening right now.
Not equally responsible, but responsible nonetheless.
Mikel Arteta is having an absolute stinker of a season, and criticism is levied towards him, and rightly so. He is the top earner at the club, but he is certainly not the top performer. It's his job to take games by the scruff of the neck and dominate them, when was the last time you saw that happen?
All I see is Arteta picking up the ball and sliding it backwards or wide for other players to take responsibility.
Its not good enough. You don't get to have a free season just because you were mustard pre-contract.
Far too many Evertonians refusing to look at what is happening right now.
I seen an article in the Liverpool Echo about how Moyes would of won the league in 69/70 there is no way Moyes could of rubbed shoulders with likes of Catterick Shankly etc
?English football pre-1992" There is also no way Moyes could of competed with Kendall Paisley Clough Alex Ferguson do you really expect me to believe he would of? As for Moyes having no backing Fellani 15 million awful player, Fellani compare him to Scot Parker who is a good midfield player not a great one and he makes Fellani look dog shit which he is. Yak 11 million wasted Billy 10 million wasted Heitinga 7 million and a top earner at the club and he doesn't fit in the Moyes? plans madness. 40 odd million on shite Believe me last person I would give 40 million would be Moyes!
If Moyes was in charge in 69/70 he would of played Alan Ball on the left Harvey on the right and Kendall in goal. I can?t wait for him to leave Moyes Out.
?English football pre-1992" There is also no way Moyes could of competed with Kendall Paisley Clough Alex Ferguson do you really expect me to believe he would of? As for Moyes having no backing Fellani 15 million awful player, Fellani compare him to Scot Parker who is a good midfield player not a great one and he makes Fellani look dog shit which he is. Yak 11 million wasted Billy 10 million wasted Heitinga 7 million and a top earner at the club and he doesn't fit in the Moyes? plans madness. 40 odd million on shite Believe me last person I would give 40 million would be Moyes!
If Moyes was in charge in 69/70 he would of played Alan Ball on the left Harvey on the right and Kendall in goal. I can?t wait for him to leave Moyes Out.
I'm happy to allow Moyes one crap season after so many good ones. Well three and a half good ones. Plus I really don't see this season as over. There's still a battle for 6th.
75 grand a week to under perform and you think people should sympathise with him?
He needs dropping to remind him that he is not the be all and end all.
Does his two arms in the air at setpieces signal that he is aiming at the first defender?
It's funny how people can translate a 75 grand a week contract into loyalty!
He needs dropping to remind him that he is not the be all and end all.
Does his two arms in the air at setpieces signal that he is aiming at the first defender?
It's funny how people can translate a 75 grand a week contract into loyalty!
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Patrick, when Moyes comes out and says this is his best squad of players ever, and is capable of challenging the top. And then fucks it up, then he is to blame along with the players he puts out. He picks the team, tactics, etc.
BK is there as the money man, and he's skint as fuck. He is also a fuck-up.
So at the end of the day, the club as a whole has fucked-up big style.
BK is there as the money man, and he's skint as fuck. He is also a fuck-up.
So at the end of the day, the club as a whole has fucked-up big style.
I'm not saying that people don't have the right the to moan at whomever takes their fancy but just saying that I agree totally with your post.
Patrick, a very good post and well received.
Andy, I am cheesed off myself of all this loyalty shite. Moyes was loyal, yeah, after he had a huge pay rise. The same with Arteta, loyal after a huge pay rise... Also, what's all this "Arteta could have left ages ago to a better club, and earned more money"?
Could any of you lads point out where bigger clubs put a bid in for Arteta, and also offered him more wages than us, but he decided to stay loyal to us? If you're going to say these things, you need to back it up with proof.
Could any of you lads point out where bigger clubs put a bid in for Arteta, and also offered him more wages than us, but he decided to stay loyal to us? If you're going to say these things, you need to back it up with proof.
Arteta does need dropping... by the manager. He's not playing well and he doesn't pick himself for the team.
Spot on Patrick, Evertonians need to stop moaning on websites and actually start doing something about romoving Kenwright and the other board members who are killing OUR club!
Seriously, why are we sitting back and letting this happen??? We can call them bastards across the park what we like, we can take the piss out of all their marching and protests but at the end of the day they got rid of what they thought was killing their club!!!
Seriously, why are we sitting back and letting this happen??? We can call them bastards across the park what we like, we can take the piss out of all their marching and protests but at the end of the day they got rid of what they thought was killing their club!!!
Well I`m loyal and `they` pay me nothing. Won`t even do me a favour for the kids` birthday... but I don`t go around slagging all and sundry because of the shortcomings of a few no-mark employees!
Moyes is culpable because, whilst he hasn't had shedloads of cash, he has had time. If he had a strategy beyond defensive football, it would have bedded in by now ? it hasn't. You'd better be Mourinho playing defensive stuff because, unless it's successful, it has no value.
There's a growing sway blaming Kenwright; fair enough ? he needs to go... but Moyes is responsible for what happens on the pitch and it's crap.
@Richard - a few? Pretty key though aren't they mate? I mean people in general are all quick to jump on the government when they seem to mess up the country.
But Kenwright, wow he just seems to be untouchable by some.
Tell you what, in 10 years when we have not improved at all, due to the fans not really arsed about their club, then see if that comment still works.
A few. God help us.
But Kenwright, wow he just seems to be untouchable by some.
Tell you what, in 10 years when we have not improved at all, due to the fans not really arsed about their club, then see if that comment still works.
A few. God help us.
Patrick I agree with you, good post.
Arteta has been poor but can anyone say that hiking his salary wasnt the correct thing to do at the time? He's lost his ability to get away from players in the tight which alowed him to do the damage. Noones to blame its just a fact of life esp following injury (whats with the brain dead 'diego fucker' comment?). Add to that Saha and Yaks incompetence (again not foreseeable) and Piennars departure, then you have the core reasons why we're so ordinary at the moment.
Moyes needs to start again, like all managers do from time to time, but that means investment. It is now an imperative.
Arteta has been poor but can anyone say that hiking his salary wasnt the correct thing to do at the time? He's lost his ability to get away from players in the tight which alowed him to do the damage. Noones to blame its just a fact of life esp following injury (whats with the brain dead 'diego fucker' comment?). Add to that Saha and Yaks incompetence (again not foreseeable) and Piennars departure, then you have the core reasons why we're so ordinary at the moment.
Moyes needs to start again, like all managers do from time to time, but that means investment. It is now an imperative.
"Moyes needs to start again" Fucking hell, John, he's had 9 YEARS!!!
Yes I agree, Patrick. After all, they could have given Pienaar a five-year contract.
Brian, it's inevitable within that timeframe that he will need to make changes, and at some point fairly radical. It's not like he can build for nine years, the reality surely is that players and a particular team formation reach the end of their shelf-life, or at least need a decent shake-up.
'Start again' may not have been a good description, but we need to look again at the spine of the team, perhaps three key players ? a decent forward, centre-midfield and an effective wide midfielder. You could argue for others (including a centre-half) but for me there lies our priority. "Dream on," I hear you say!
'Start again' may not have been a good description, but we need to look again at the spine of the team, perhaps three key players ? a decent forward, centre-midfield and an effective wide midfielder. You could argue for others (including a centre-half) but for me there lies our priority. "Dream on," I hear you say!
Thing is, though, John, Moyes came out at the start of the season, and told us this was his best squad ever, and was capable of challenging the top 4.
The Chairman and the Manager are too 'cosy' and it breeds complacency ? you need to be fearful of your job if you are not performing well. Moyes always looks smug ? things need to be shaken up at the club, in this order:
1 NEW MANAGER
2 NEW CHAIRMAN
3 NEW PLAYERS
This should be 1 but, until we do 2, this won't happen.
John, you are correct in quoting Moyes's comments about having his best squad. However, he was not alone in thinking this. How many fans were convinced this was THE year to have a good go at the top 4. Some even thought we would win the damn thing.
The trouble was raised expectations, poor form from players and mainly no new names in the squad. As Moyes has said, new players gives everyone around the club a lift and puts pressure on players to perform. We are royally fucked if we have to "sell to loan" as has already been quoted.
The one good thing that seems to have come from this mess, is that people bemoaning Moyes have realised he is not totally to blame for this, and have finally started to vent their frustrations at the totally inept board we have. There is no forward thinking, no initiative, no dynamics and certainly no fucking money.£1M SPENT IN 3 TRANSFER WINDOWS IS JUST A SICK JOKE.
Only 1 month ago , DM was saying we hav'nt even got the money to fund a loan players wages... never mind loan players. If you think about it, that is a hell of a statement.
I'm now seriously thinking we shouldn't be in buisness if we can't fund players loan wages.
Questions should be asked were is all the money going.
We have strict wagew structure, apart from 1 or 2 players on big money.
We don't spend big in the transfer market and hav'nt for quite some time.
So were is the gate reciepts money, Sky money, League money, FA money, merchandise money, big transfer sell-ons (Rooney, Lescott etc).
I am now seriously considering my support & commitment to EFC.... .I just feel they're taking the Michael out of me and many other supporters!!!
I'm now seriously thinking we shouldn't be in buisness if we can't fund players loan wages.
Questions should be asked were is all the money going.
We have strict wagew structure, apart from 1 or 2 players on big money.
We don't spend big in the transfer market and hav'nt for quite some time.
So were is the gate reciepts money, Sky money, League money, FA money, merchandise money, big transfer sell-ons (Rooney, Lescott etc).
I am now seriously considering my support & commitment to EFC.... .I just feel they're taking the Michael out of me and many other supporters!!!
This could be a very difficult summer for Everton. (Even more than the last two which have been bad enough!) For me, Moyes does need to make some radical changes because the whole thing has gone stale and we are crying out for a class striker.
The best football we've played in recent years was in 07-08 when we had the Yak at his peak, but he's never going to be the player he was then because of injury. The same is true of Saha, although he is capable of the odd moment of class still. Beckford is looking every inch the free transfer signing he was and I don't know what Moyes sees in Anichebe, it sure beats me and the mates I go to the games with anyway.
The only position we are blessed with a bit of depth is centre mid with the likes of Arteta, Fellaini, Cahill, Rodwell, Neville, Heitinga and Osman all capable of doing a job there. Being realistic, I would suggest Rodwell, Fellaini and Arteta (still a great player, just having a shite spell) are the most valuable assets of that lot and I would be surprised if all three are the club next season.
Whether Moyes can raise enough cash to rebuild by selling one of those three in addition to Yak, Yobo, Vaughan and possibly Heitinga as well remains to be seen. For all his faults he is still the man who brought Arteta, Cahill, Pienaar, Howard and Saha to this club for a combined total of around £10M. Of course, he is also the bloke who signed Kroldrup, Beattie and Bily for a combined £20M but I'm doing my best to put a positive slant on this!
The best football we've played in recent years was in 07-08 when we had the Yak at his peak, but he's never going to be the player he was then because of injury. The same is true of Saha, although he is capable of the odd moment of class still. Beckford is looking every inch the free transfer signing he was and I don't know what Moyes sees in Anichebe, it sure beats me and the mates I go to the games with anyway.
The only position we are blessed with a bit of depth is centre mid with the likes of Arteta, Fellaini, Cahill, Rodwell, Neville, Heitinga and Osman all capable of doing a job there. Being realistic, I would suggest Rodwell, Fellaini and Arteta (still a great player, just having a shite spell) are the most valuable assets of that lot and I would be surprised if all three are the club next season.
Whether Moyes can raise enough cash to rebuild by selling one of those three in addition to Yak, Yobo, Vaughan and possibly Heitinga as well remains to be seen. For all his faults he is still the man who brought Arteta, Cahill, Pienaar, Howard and Saha to this club for a combined total of around £10M. Of course, he is also the bloke who signed Kroldrup, Beattie and Bily for a combined £20M but I'm doing my best to put a positive slant on this!
David Mathieson, Fellaini an awful player!
He will be the one who we will no doubt sell to fund our summer targets, as he is the only player we have worth more than the £15M we paid for him and in a top side just watch how good he will do.
He will be the one who we will no doubt sell to fund our summer targets, as he is the only player we have worth more than the £15M we paid for him and in a top side just watch how good he will do.
Gerry #24, Why don't we as fans do something about it then!
The club ARE taking the "Michael" out of us no doubt about it and have been for some time.
One of many, many, many examples is the way Kenwright has alienated himself from the fans but you can bet your life he'll be 'in touch' come April when it's time to renew our season tickets!
The club ARE taking the "Michael" out of us no doubt about it and have been for some time.
One of many, many, many examples is the way Kenwright has alienated himself from the fans but you can bet your life he'll be 'in touch' come April when it's time to renew our season tickets!
What Premier League team would Big Vic and Leon Osman get into? They're Championship players at best, so straight away we start games with a handicap.
Also, if Moyes doesn't rate Bily, sell him while he still has a bit of value.
The solutions to our problems are right under our noses. We have a global passionate fan base willing to be shown how to help. We just need a few souls to make the first steps to get us going and the masses will follow.
Also I've said before, without fans it's just 22 young men kicking a ball around a field. We are the key ingredient. We are the most important. We are the only ones who will be here for all our days. Everyone else just has their finger in the pie.
PATRICK are you the same Pat Hart who worked for SQ some years back ? Agree with yourt post by the way and I wonder why people are slagging of Fellaini and Bily. The former is having a pretty good season and Bily has more skill in his left little finger than most of the rest of the squad combined. If he can make the Russian squad I fail to see why some folks don't think he is good enough for Everton.
Richard,
Evertonians with mind-sets like yours are a huge part of the problem. I sensed on Saturday, though, that more natives are stirring and getting very restless as regards Uncle Bill.
Evertonians with mind-sets like yours are a huge part of the problem. I sensed on Saturday, though, that more natives are stirring and getting very restless as regards Uncle Bill.
Lyndon
I dont normally disagrre with you but I feel the way we are playing this season is directly attributable to the boardroom.
Since DK was a non starter I get the feeling that Green has insisted on his money back hence a selling of the better higher earning players and a curfew on buying.
That IMO is the reason why the team is showing a total lack of spirit particularly against sides we should be wiping the floor with.
Something similar has happened at Chelsea and that was only to do with Wilkins sacking.
I dont normally disagrre with you but I feel the way we are playing this season is directly attributable to the boardroom.
Since DK was a non starter I get the feeling that Green has insisted on his money back hence a selling of the better higher earning players and a curfew on buying.
That IMO is the reason why the team is showing a total lack of spirit particularly against sides we should be wiping the floor with.
Something similar has happened at Chelsea and that was only to do with Wilkins sacking.
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1 Posted 23/01/2011 at 15:16:57
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With the same squad as the one that stormed the last half of last season — with the (perhaps crucial?) exception of Landon Donovan, the least you'd expect from the current personnel is to stand still.
We're regressing, though, and the concern is that Moyes either hasn't known how to fix it or has acted far too slowly in response and is now turning his back on things that had clearly started working (e.g. the Beckford-Saha partnership).
As much as I loathe the ineptitude of the Board and don't believe we're ever going to challenge for anything while the status quo remains intact, the way we're playing right now is not entirely down to a lack of investment. That team should not be struggling in the wrong half of the table.