The Mail Bag
Stop hiding, Bill
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The attendance at today's match was a very worrying development. Less than 30,000 for a cup tie against Chelsea was startling. At the moment, Evertonians are in the dark. Rumours of administration, disagreement among supporters, talk of protests... It doesn't have to be like this.
What we need is leadership. A state of the union address from Mr Kenwright. Tell it like it is, Bill. We can take it. How skint are we? Is there any hope of a takeover? Is a fire sale going on?
Honesty and transparency could go a long way in making up for the money you don't have. If we know the worst Evertonians will stand together. Look at the proposal from Tony and Mike. What do you think? Come out of hiding and tell the truth. You'll feel better for it. Who knows ,you might even gain some respect.
Andy Crooks, Posted 30/01/2011 at 00:49:37
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Even if we are in a situation like Leeds or Portsmouth, the fans have a right to know.
Expect a soundbite on the 1st Feb saying how close we where to signing 2/3 players BUT we just ran out of time
oh darn it, that old time thingy again
Bill, he aint arf a card.................
Still, at least he is a true blue, heh?
Trite responses to a good comment Andy, but I would not believe him now anyway.
No excuse for the poor attendance as far as I am concerened. The team needs support now more than ever and some supporters see fit to run and hide when the going gets tough. We should have record crowds at the matches showing support, where's the so-called true blue spirit?
OK, it is frustrating at the moment but get behind the team and show your support. You should count yourselves lucky and privelaged to be able to attend the games.
All of that said, do the Board really have to make a statement just because people are making stuff up on the Internet and would such a statement do more harm than good with the Club's creditors? I just don't know and maybe some Toffeewebbers with background and expertise in such matters could offer a view rather than the nervous speculation of the uninformed, me included.
Match days cost over £100 a pop for me, and I know it's more for others. I'm staggered so many turn up to watch this turgid excuse for football.
You are joking Peter???
It's about 100 quid a game for me as well when you cost everything out and when you think about 2 under 5's and all other living costs regular attendence becomes a secondary concern sadly.
Think yer comments are rather daft, Peter, and insulting to a lot of us "lucky and privileged" fans who can't get to every game due to real life having caught up with us.
Also John, surely the board can see there is a lot of unrest amongst the fans??? This is one of the times where someone should come out and make a statement of some kind.
Things are bad for BK now, imagine what it's going to be like after the transfer window closes, without anymore players coming in?
Think about it; if this was any other kind of business, eg a restaurant or clothes-shop, and it was this appallingly badly run, with utter contempt for its loyal customers, it would have gone out of business by now. I don't somehow "owe it" to Everton to attend. if anything, THEY owe ME, for suffering a 20-year debacle.
Actually any transparency at this stage would basically be an admission of all of his lies. Ten years too late. If he had been more honest at the beginning, he wouldn't be in the shit he's in now. And probably niether would we.
Moyes must surely have had enough, he's cocked this season up but next season promises to be worse... BK just sits in his ivory tower having dinner with Marina (if anyone remembers that film) and GIVES THE IMPRESSION of doing nothing at all about it.
Silence is golden so twat once sang, Silence is bollocks more like........
So getting to my point, I think that yesterday's crowd have every right to voice their disapproval with the current standard of football/mis-management from both DM & BK with their feet and pockets. It's just a shame that the so-called protests that have been popping up on TW never materialised or if they did I failed to see or hear any of it, whether it was pointed at dithering Dave or bungling Bill.
I have a feeling there may be more Saturdays like yesterday and should be of no great surprise. We need many things to happen and change over the forthcoming hours/days/weeks, and I don't think there is enough time in the day to even start listing them. I will start though by stating the obvious, an urgent influx of new players is needed in a variety of positions, leadership and a statement of the current plight of the club from the very top is needed.
Then the list just goes on and on... to should we get rid of Moyes or not, his tactics, the club as a whole... like I say it's endless and I'm bored of it all. I can't see any of the above being addressed any time soon, so I'm off to read the Sunday paper's to see guess what? Everton doing eff-all about possibly the most concerning aspect of what I said ? getting some new players in!!
When you deliver eff-all at boardroom or pitch level don't expect at least some to think about utilising their HARD-EARNED on something that may actually bring a little more joy than what Everton have to offer right now. When things do change or at least a voice is heard from BK or Elstone, then we may get what is expected a bumper crowd for the visit of the "Champions" but until then don't expect everyone to keep putting up with shit because, as you have seen yesterday, they won't.
IMO I think BK should walk asap ? well, as soon as a replacement can be brought in with a bit more than BK's left over Tesco vouchers and a few Blood Brothers spares in his back arse pocket, and Moyes/Round to see out the remainder of the season then both handed their P45s with a pat on the back a swift thanks for NOTHING and then shown the door so the real work can begin.
I'm not even angry with Everton anymore or the chairman/manager/players. I'm just tired and fedup of what we have become, which is Everton FC!
This is what gets us wound up, Dave Prentice, you patronising prick, you won't say boo to a goose at Everton ever since they slaughtered you for the Man City shout.
All clubs have a hardcore support who will turn up week-in, week-out, as well as an element of fans whose decision to attend is determined by whether they feel they are getting value for money, ie recent results / performances etc.
Everton have a hardcore fan base of approx 25-30,000 who will turn up week-in, week-out, whatever the results / performances etc. If we were to win the replay and get a home tie next round, you can guarantee a vast majority of the stay-aways from yesterday's game will be at Goodison for the 5th Round.
Does the fact that any club would then be after our players and offering a third of the price of their value and players agents would be touting them about to anyone that would listen not bother you? This naive and overly romantic "let's be honest and open with the fans" vibe seems more like rank stupidity that even Bill is not capable of, thank heavens!!
16,000 at Birmingham v Coventry, a local derby. That attendance surprised me more.
As has been said earlier, it's too fucking expensive!
I hope Sky dies and piss-taking wages with it. Bring back the eighties when anyone could win the league.
I remember, if I was the first one to the turnstyle and there were 5 of us, I would pay for everyone and next week someone else would do it, it just meant that you would get all your ale bought for you all night. These were the days when it was about £2:50 to get in, and I'm not going back that far. Imagine going up now and saying 5 please mate, err that will be £155 smackers, no fuckin chance!!!
The last time I was in Madrid, I went to watch a game... ?8... 8 FUCKIN EUROS. that was 18 months ago. Premier league prices are just a fuckin big joke, but not many people are laughing now.
I gave up 2 years ago after watching the boys for 40 years ? I just couldn't afford it anymore... and guess what: it's an easy habbit to get out of.
I was at the Park End @ 11:30 to see this protest which was being organised and the chants of "Speak From the Harbour" (for those of you who don't know/go, this is a fanzine sold outside the ground on matchdays) were deafening and in almost a show of defiance Kenwright turned up on the nose, parked his car and talked to a steward for a few minutes before walking off with a grin on his face.
For the record, I felt the low gate was as a result of home fans' apathy; I myself very nearly didn't bother. Chelski may have sent tickets back, but I've seen less fans turn up from clubs closer to home. Maybe the protestors didn't turn up?
it would be impossible for Kenwright to gain some respect because he has no respect for others.
The apology for a man is thick skinned and obstinate.
I can't ever forget the way he stabbed Paul Gregg in the back after getting his "lifelong friend's" support to buy the club from PJ.
Apparently the same is now happening with Green and Earl.
All so that he can be the "big I am".
It is pointless him making any statement because very few (except Doddy) would believe him anyway.
According to who??
Fuck em; enjoy the bankruptcy but don't come complaining after it's too late ? this would never be a "told you so" scenario ? it's as obvious as a car crash in extreme slow motion.
I presume by your post that you are quite willing to protest? I presume you were outside the Park End at 11:30 yesterday hoping to join the protest?
I protested at the end of the season before DK got it's fuck-off from the government with a very large banner in the Park End that we were told by Stewards to lower and ignored; I've protested outside the Main Stand with KEIOC members during the hearings before a game... and guess what: I don't live in Liverpool or own a burger bar or chippy or alehouse ? as that seems to be the other smear levelled at anyone who did protest, I run my own company which has nothing whatsoever to do with football or sport.
Away from football, my old man was a union shop steward for years back when trade unions hadn't had their balls cut off by the Tories and he told me the workers' biggest enemy is themselves; moaning bastards that went quiet the second it came to the crunch and stand firm. I protested Agent Johnson out yet I'm astounded at the shit BK has gotten away with without any form of stand from the fans and supporters.
A buyer who has the seller by the balls has the advantage of paying what they want as they know the seller is desperate, selling a midfielder on the cheap and letting three strikers go on loan when you can't score in a brothel, a defender on loan and fucking up a contract offer so a midfielder goes for a free isn't a secret.
Andy Crooks:
'Rumours of Administration' ? Very naughty to put that in I think. Care to name your source? Reliable is it or is it just a shot in the dark you read from some moaner on here?
I thought I asked whether you were at the protest or not?
By your response, I must have asked you to give me your life history in two paragraphs.
I'm not sure why you are telling me about your family. I would imagine every person going the match and contributing on this site has got a job and family etc.
In essence, after your comments "I agree the apathy from those demanding a protest and fuck all happening is sickening" and "but the majority of fans here literally can't be arsed", are you stating you can't be arsed yourself and you find it sickening? I presume that must be the case because you are one of the main posters on this site demanding a protest and then, when there is talk of one, you don't turn up.
And if he did suddenly get "every single fan behind him", how on earth would this "give us a fresh start"?!?!? It's a nice notion, but us all getting together, slapping Bill on the back and saying "Everything is going to be ok!" won't clear our debt of what... £40, 50, 60, 70, 80 million; it won't give Moyes £30-40 million he needs for players; it won't build us a new (or rebuild the old) stadium.
I don't doubt your commitment (or that of anyone else on here) to the cause but we need to deal in cold hard fact, not romantic notions.
In my opinion, Bill Kenwright has at best got us into this situation by purely dealing in romantic notions and ignoring cold hard fact!! At worst, Kenwright's notions are of a more sinister financial gain motive.
One other thing that some people don't seem to realise is that other clubs don't necessarily have more money than us, they have wealthier guarantors of these loans they are getting to finance player purchases.
There are some Clubs like Stoke or Wolves or WBA who have come up with very little debt and by being prudent in their first season up have managed to get nicely into the black and able to fund transfers after that. That situation may not last forever of course. Others like Hull and Burnley tried the same approach but did not have enough quality to survive, but still returned to the Championship with a better balance sheet, although Hull had too many players on crazy contracts and soon encountered problems.
So Everton's problems are twofold. Firstly, by being in the Premier League all along we have always been paying high wages and buying players in and living on the edge financially. No chance to financially revive ourselves. But the biggest one is that we don't have a wealthy Guarantor of the financial muscle of Lerner at Villa, Joe Lewis at Spurs, those arabs at City, Abramovich, Ellis Short at Sunderland, that cock at Newcastle etc. Thus nobody will lend to us. Back in 2007, I think it transpired that Earl and Green, thinking Kirkby was going to happen guaranteed the money to buy Yakubu for £11M and Fernandes for £12M. Since DK went down the tubes so has their willingness to cover our loans. That's why BK was desperate for it to succeed, because there was nowhere else to go financially with him in charge.
We now need a new plan, a new way forward and we have a stark choice:
1/ Keep BK, keep an Evertonian in charge. He won't do a Gaydamak and drop us from a great height, but he has no money to guarantee any loans and the well is now dry so expect many more transfer windows like the last three... The risk is we stagnate and start going backwards. We live in hope of an Investor daft enough to give us money for no power or control or that some sort of sanity regarding wages and transfers is forced upon our League by outside forces such as FIFA or UEFA or the EU.... unlikely, I fear, but you never know. There will be little or no money for players or ground improvements as it's all going on players' wages and paying off loans.
2/ Kenwright leaves and the Club is taken over by some person or persons offering to clear the debts and guarantee more loans to fund player purchases.
This has happened at a number of clubs, but has only worked at Man City (so far) and Chelsea. At Liverpool, Newcastle, Portsmouth it has resulted in a noticeable decline in football performance. West Ham is a great example of what can happen. Icelandics come in, promise the earth, guarantee the purchases of donkeys like Ljungberg, Boa Morte, Dyer etc on ludicrous wages and very soon they are £100M in debt with a crap team and facing relegation and administration. They are then sold to a pair of fans who cannot offer any real money, but can guarantee more loans and also can't keep their mouths shut or stop interfering. All their financial hopes are pinned on moving the Club to an athletics stadium.
In all these cases, the owners can call in the money any time they like by effectively forcing sales like Milner at Villa or Bent at Sunderland (and soon Torres at Liverpool). The Manager and his footballing considerations are not the main driving force. It's all about the money. Should the owner want their money back, the Clubs are so far in debt that administration and relegation are certainties because, either way, all the best players will be sold and the team will fall apart. Where does that leave the fans?
Neither of the above scenarios appeals to me... Between a rock and a hard place I think is where we are.
Tthere's only way to sort this out,
FIGHT!!!!!
Plenty of time sat in the Park End as a regular if you ever visit.
You and many other posters on this site have posted like broken records for a considerable amount of time that protests are needed and they are needed urgently. However, these protests have never materialised. Instead of yourselves sounding like broken records talking about the need for protests all the time why don't one of you organise one?
Gavin,
I was sat in the Upper Gwladys, like I am at every home game.
You state that "Back in 2007, I think it transpired that Earl and Green, thinking Kirkby was going to happen guaranteed the money to buy Yakubu for £11M and Fernandes for £12M."
We have no proof that Earl or Green put up the money and we didn't buy Fernandes for £12 million ? in fact, I've been looking ever since for the £12 million that BK had "ringfenced" for Fernandes to "sign in the morning" because Fernandes himself stated that EFC had never made a firm offer ? they just had him hanging on and the supposed £12 million just vanished into thin air.
Yet another example of Kenwright's deceipt.
So you have done them and retired now? You are sticking to demanding other supporters carry them out now on your behalf?
Which one would I have seen? Could you be more specific. Also which games have you been protesting outside the main stand at? Could you be a bit more specific? I walk past the main stand before and after each game and have never come across any protest. How many people were involved in the protests you were involved in, etc?
1. Well wishers expected us to get stuffed... especially after West Ham game.
2. It was before payday for some people after a 6 week month... and tickets were not cheap: mine was £33.50 (STH) but others in the Park End paid £37...
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1 Posted 30/01/2011 at 07:53:01
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