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You practice what you're teached
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My mate together with 20 other fans was lucky enough to win a days training with the first team at Man City as part of celebrating their FA Cup triumph. He got to meet and spend time with some of the first team, the manager and members of the coaching staff. They included:?
- Roberto Mancini (Manager)
- Massimo Marratti (Celebrated Italian goalkeeping coach)
- Brian Kidd (Tactical, defensive coach)
- David Platt (First team coach)
- Atillio Lombardo (former Juventus superstar, now attacking technical coach)
- Ivan Carminatti (Highly rated Italian fitness coach)
Now, whatever your opinion of the above, one thing for sure is they know how to play football.
Interesting that Man City has a very cultured back room staff. This is an area where we are lacking, we have a defensive manager and a very workman like coaching team.
Sure, Man City have money but coaching isn't about money ? it's about imposing your footballing ethos on your first team.
Rather than new signings this season, how about new technical/cultured coaching staff added to the backroom to give us a plan fucking B???
Daniel Johnson, Posted 24/05/2011 at 18:37:02
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Bullshit to attack Moyes and the regime. We beat City twice this year, second time playing great football in the second half. It's not their managerial set up, it's players like Silva, Yaya Toure and Tevez who make their attacking play so good. Put any team of management in charge of them and they would be attacking.
Is this a serious post?
They know how to play football? They must have been doing it when I wasnt looking.
World class players like Tevez and Silva may illuminate Eastlands from time to time but if the negative shite City regularly play is the best this crew can do with one of the most expensive squads ever assembled, let them stay at Eastlands.
Perhaps if this dazzling array of talent ever send a team out to beat the much maligned Moyes sides, we might stop laughing
BTW Daniel, what were the top prizes in this competition like?
They know how to play football? They must have been doing it when I wasnt looking.
World class players like Tevez and Silva may illuminate Eastlands from time to time but if the negative shite City regularly play is the best this crew can do with one of the most expensive squads ever assembled, let them stay at Eastlands.
Perhaps if this dazzling array of talent ever send a team out to beat the much maligned Moyes sides, we might stop laughing
BTW Daniel, what were the top prizes in this competition like?
I'm not saying we copy the Man City football blueprint which is 100% Italian ethos: "Let's win 1-0"... but in terms of coaching staff they are much better set up than Moyes, Stubbs, Woods and Round. Imagine if we had Platt and Lombardo as attacking/technical coaches or someone of a similar breed. It could only benefit us. Imagine Rodwell being told how to trap/control and pass the ball on the ground with attacking intent. Or Platt/Lombardo spending time with Distin and Jags improving passing/distribution.
Appparently the "lucky few" were amazed they spent nearly 4 hrs on the training pitch doing various training drills with the different coaches and had a few kick-abouts with the players. Then they all had pictures taken and were each presented with a portfolio of action shots of themesleves taking part in training (taken by a pro sports photographer) which, even I admit, looked really impressive.
Appparently the "lucky few" were amazed they spent nearly 4 hrs on the training pitch doing various training drills with the different coaches and had a few kick-abouts with the players. Then they all had pictures taken and were each presented with a portfolio of action shots of themesleves taking part in training (taken by a pro sports photographer) which, even I admit, looked really impressive.
LoL ? this made me laugh. You want us to use Man City as an example of how to train a team in cultured and attacking football?
Man City??? The most boring workman like team in the Premier League?
Man City??? Who the press slam for their over defensive style of play?
That's so funny.
Man City??? The most boring workman like team in the Premier League?
Man City??? Who the press slam for their over defensive style of play?
That's so funny.
If anything Man City are perfect examples of how boring defensive football can crack the Top 4.
Man City play like a David Moyes team and they have now proven it works by cracking the Top 4.
Man City play like a David Moyes team and they have now proven it works by cracking the Top 4.
Totally agree that we need to look at ALL areas of the club and certainly the backroom staff. It's long been my belief that there is no super manager but there are super management teams.
Whilst I wouldn't look to Citeh for guidance as I think, with the money spent and players available, they should be closer to Manure than they are, I would be interested in a European coach for fresh ideas and, if nothing else, an ear to the ground for emerging talent in their homeland.
It amazes me how much our coaching set-up is talked about on here, there was even a Steve Round out post. What's this based on? Has anybody been to finch farm and seen them at work?
Also where you played does not neccesarily mean that's the only position you coach. A good football brain mean's you know how positions work and the game as a whole.
The fact is the coaches we have may be the absolute best in the business, but it's the manager who deems the style of play we use. We all know this style inside out because we watch it week-in, week-out.
Watching us I always feel the more creative players are playing within themselves. Whether this is down to them, instructions from the manager or an indirect result of his nature,language and demeanour leading up to the game is hard to say.
Also where you played does not neccesarily mean that's the only position you coach. A good football brain mean's you know how positions work and the game as a whole.
The fact is the coaches we have may be the absolute best in the business, but it's the manager who deems the style of play we use. We all know this style inside out because we watch it week-in, week-out.
Watching us I always feel the more creative players are playing within themselves. Whether this is down to them, instructions from the manager or an indirect result of his nature,language and demeanour leading up to the game is hard to say.
What I would say is that, by and large, Moyes and Co seem to get the best out of the players, when compared to the performance of players who have moved on.
Lescott, Lescott ? what's the score?
Is teached even a word?
Is "Is teached even a word" even a sentence?
Let's have a bit of reality here, take a look at the relative results before saying City are defensive or boring.
To continue,
W D Goal Dif PtsDoes that teach you somefink?
City 21 8 27 71
Everton 13 15 6 54
Dick, they did what we haven't this season... beat the lower end teams. If you took the results of the top seven vs each other we are second behind Manure. You quote the final stats for the season and that's fair enough, but if I'd spent £250M I'd expect to be able to beat shite AND the "big" clubs. Not sure either club can claim perfection in either regard but we didn't spend shed loads of cash.
Daniel - Had to be a great experience up-close with a top side. But shouldn't you spend equal time at Finch Farm before comparing?
Man City is a poor example, but I get the drift.
No I have not been down to Finch Farm to watch the coaches, and they might be the best in the business. I doubt it, but they might be.
I'm not convinced with the way Everton attack and pass, so the suggestion that we might need to look at some new attacking/passing coaches could well be valid.
Completely unrelated, but I am fucking tired of Sir Alex. Can he just piss off and retire already??
No I have not been down to Finch Farm to watch the coaches, and they might be the best in the business. I doubt it, but they might be.
I'm not convinced with the way Everton attack and pass, so the suggestion that we might need to look at some new attacking/passing coaches could well be valid.
Completely unrelated, but I am fucking tired of Sir Alex. Can he just piss off and retire already??
Hmmm load of toss!!!
Obvious point that seems to be missed - these are all Mancini's mates, largely from his Sampdoria playing days.
Jobs for the boys doesn't mean anything in terms of style.
Obvious point that seems to be missed - these are all Mancini's mates, largely from his Sampdoria playing days.
Jobs for the boys doesn't mean anything in terms of style.
Ok apart from Brian Kidd who took Blackburn down......
You may be a great player, but it sure as hell dont make you a great coach/manager
Richard, and vice versa
I have always liked the idea of Moyes being assisted or having say a European/Sth American technical adviser. I am sure he shall admit himself he still has a lot to learn and having some experienced offsider shall not only help Moyes but the players too. So maybe as well getting new players this summer we look to boost the back-room staff too.
Maybe mancini is keeping his pals in jobs.
But teh agin so will Moyes we have P Neville and David Weir wating in the wings to eventuallu join the existing coaching staff of:
Moyes
Rounds
Stubbs
Woods
We have a complete defensive coachings et up all based on former defenders and a mini match day yes man (round).
All I'm saying is lets get some people in who know how to pass and attack, to counter act the dour negative safety first cancer which always runs through our starting 11.
But teh agin so will Moyes we have P Neville and David Weir wating in the wings to eventuallu join the existing coaching staff of:
Moyes
Rounds
Stubbs
Woods
We have a complete defensive coachings et up all based on former defenders and a mini match day yes man (round).
All I'm saying is lets get some people in who know how to pass and attack, to counter act the dour negative safety first cancer which always runs through our starting 11.
Brian Kidd tactical defensive coach??????
I played at a decent level as a youth not quite making the breakthrough to pro mainly because of a motor bike accident which resulted in tor cruciates in my legs.
A friend of mine who managed a couple of sides asked me what was the secret to a successful team.
My reply was straightforward.
"There is no secret to a successful team it just needs to have good players".
Over 40 years my opinion hasnt changed.
Despite the attempts of coaches to stereotype players good players play there own game and stand out.
Examples: Rooney,Ronaldo,Messi,Tevez.
Do you honestly think Brian Kidd could coach anything into these players.
Coaches need to concentrate on the team tactics and effectiveness rather than individuals.
Sorry to say Daniel but yet another failed attempt to discredit Moyes.
A friend of mine who managed a couple of sides asked me what was the secret to a successful team.
My reply was straightforward.
"There is no secret to a successful team it just needs to have good players".
Over 40 years my opinion hasnt changed.
Despite the attempts of coaches to stereotype players good players play there own game and stand out.
Examples: Rooney,Ronaldo,Messi,Tevez.
Do you honestly think Brian Kidd could coach anything into these players.
Coaches need to concentrate on the team tactics and effectiveness rather than individuals.
Sorry to say Daniel but yet another failed attempt to discredit Moyes.
Daniel,
I think Moyes needs to change his outlook more than his staff.
Steve Round was supposed to be one of the best attacking coaches and tacticians in England.
I think Moyes needs to change his outlook more than his staff.
Steve Round was supposed to be one of the best attacking coaches and tacticians in England.
"My mate together with 20 other fans was lucky enough to win a days training with the first team at Man City ." Was second prize two days training?
Jesus, all this negativity... I don't see the harm in introducing a diff way of thinking into our dour and sterile defensive set up.
I wouldn't trust David Platt to successfully drive our team coach, let alone meddle with our tactics
Kidd=shithouse, Platt=hasn't got a fuckin clue, who was it he nearly ruined Forest? Lombardo= Dont know a lot about him other than he reminds me of Collina, so thats enough to dislike, On a serious note how much can 50m worth of striker learn from a man who's knowledge of English football is doing a poor job at Palace? And Mancini who leaves Inter after a successfull period the problem is Mourinho took over and won the lot.
I wouldn't mind some of Cities money or even a couple of players but the backroom staff and manager no thanks, Hughes would have done just as much imo.
I wouldn't mind some of Cities money or even a couple of players but the backroom staff and manager no thanks, Hughes would have done just as much imo.
"Imagine if we had Platt and Lombardo as attacking/technical coaches or someone of a similar breed"
I'm sorry mate, but how they hell do you know what these former players are like as coaches? And how can you compare them to Steve Round and colleagues? Do you study the coaching styles of all of these people? If not are you just basing your reputations on what they were like as players? Doesn't work like that.
I'm sorry mate, but how they hell do you know what these former players are like as coaches? And how can you compare them to Steve Round and colleagues? Do you study the coaching styles of all of these people? If not are you just basing your reputations on what they were like as players? Doesn't work like that.
To be fair to Daniel looking to improve in any area and freshening things up should always be looked at, but on the otherhand improving the quality on the field has to take priority especially given the current manager and coaches have not exactly failed us or the club in any way.
Jay, you're ethos on coaching/success is shared by the coaching genius that is Bryan Robson. I forget how many times he was sacked.
Geoff, in defense of Jay, Bryan Robson never had any good players at his clubs to prove his theory
Daniel, I totally agree in principal. I got torn to shreads a few weeks ago when Moyes was creaming over Weir, making noises about wanting him on the coaching staff. I dared to suggest we could do with somelike like Ray Wilkins instaed of another ex defender, then of course all the abuse starts.
The problem probably is that Mancini and Co come with a huge salary bill. And before anyone says that Moyes is being well paid, I'm sure it's far more than he would even dream of getting.
Dick (14) it probably teaches you that City spent £47m on Tevez, £28m on Dzeko; £24m on Balotelli for starters, while we have Saha, Beckford, Anichebe, Vaughan (all free) plus Yakubu- out on loan. Hard to play effective attacking football when you can barely rub together one fit, decent striker
Dick (14) it probably teaches you that City spent £47m on Tevez, £28m on Dzeko; £24m on Balotelli for starters, while we have Saha, Beckford, Anichebe, Vaughan (all free) plus Yakubu- out on loan. Hard to play effective attacking football when you can barely rub together one fit, decent striker
Stuart, he took a team containing Ravanelli, Emerson, Juninho and possibly Boksic (not sure on that last one) down to the 2nd tier.
If Jay's theory was right Boro would've survived that season, as would West Ham this, and Bayern Munich wouldn't have finished 3rd in the German league either.
If Jay's theory was right Boro would've survived that season, as would West Ham this, and Bayern Munich wouldn't have finished 3rd in the German league either.
Wish to echo #25 Jay Harris comments. Defense can be coached as it's more a team effort. How to react as a team unit to their movements. Offense is more based on individual talent that the player needs to conjure up the unexpected based on a high level of skill, in order to open up defenses. Innovation cannot be coached.
What Moyes is (should be) doing is providing a solid platform and backbone to which the creative players can operate. Risk management against the fast break for example. That's why Carsley was should an important Moyes player, and equally our lone striker up front can only be solved with money.
What Moyes is (should be) doing is providing a solid platform and backbone to which the creative players can operate. Risk management against the fast break for example. That's why Carsley was should an important Moyes player, and equally our lone striker up front can only be solved with money.
Man City scored 55 league goals last season with Tevez scoring 20, 9 penalties approx.
Everton scored 51, with basically a makeshift set of strikers, none of them costing a penny, with 3 penalties.
Man City have, at a conservative estimate (Tevez - £40m, Dzeko - £30m, Balottelli - £30m, Jo - £18m, Adebayor - £25m) £150m worth of strikers. Whoever is coaching these guys on how to score goals needs to collect his cards from Mr Mancini as they have not got a fucking clue.
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1 Posted 24/05/2011 at 18:50:04
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I don't see the point in using their set-up to attack ours.
For me, we need to buy more attack-minded player's whose first thought is to play forward, opposed to player's who are naturally combative or hardworking.