In the recent light of changing Everton's crest, I asked myself to which point of changing EFC's identity I will be able to like it and support it? You know, I "fell in love" with a specified set of symbols and wouldn't be able to feel the same passion if a certain amount of these ones disappear. So I made a list of symbols which must exist in order for me to call myself a Toffees fan.
These are: (1) The Name of Club (Everton); (2) Colours of home kit (Royal blue shirt, white shorts, royal blue or white socks) and (3) if there is a crest on the shirt, it must contain at least one of these symbols: Prince Rupert's Tower, two laurels or "Nil satis nisi optimum".
About the last item, I don't know if there is more "heraldic" symbols of Everton (maybe toffee...), and I think i will continue to be a Toffeeman even if our crest would contain some other things.
Now, I'm interested in how much change some of you can stand and still consider yourself an Evertonian?
Ognjen Mojovic, Posted 24/06/2013 at 13:21:40
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931 Posted 24/06/2013 at 15:39:29
Nothing, but nothing will alter one fact.
Born a Blue
Live a Blue
Die a Blue.
934 Posted 24/06/2013 at 15:43:35
935 Posted 24/06/2013 at 15:50:13
936 Posted 24/06/2013 at 15:52:31
938 Posted 24/06/2013 at 15:57:15
940 Posted 24/06/2013 at 15:57:31
It would have to take something like the: Wimbledon and MK Dons thing to stop me being a supporter altogether
942 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:00:35
I would be even more annoyed if they changed the colour of the kit, like they have at Cardiff. I would be out protesting and would refuse to buy any club merchandise. I would still love the club though.
I would sign a million petitions and hum it to myself anyway if the decision was ever made to stop Z Cars as we run out.
Moving the club to Kirkby, I was against, but I would have still gone and continued to love the blues.
Moving us to Milton Keynes and calling us The MK People's Club, I reckon would be going too far and I would transfer my allegiance to the inevitable FC Everton that would spring up and I'd follow them through the leagues.
943 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:13:38
If you don't understand, you don't understand.
If you had ever met my father you would understand.
945 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:16:53
946 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:14:14
Say we recruited Ratboy, John Terry, Stevie Me, Craig Bellamy etc. plus managed by Mark Hughes. With Bill selling out to the Venkys chicken people.
947 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:19:00
More and more foreign interest/investment pours in to the Prem.
More Americans get involved.
The terns of ownership (franchise) get twisted.
The Everton 'franchise' ('brand') is moved elsewhere,
say Milton Keynes, Ipswich, or Bognor Regis
Now that would be a potential cause for breaking it off for me at any rate.
Don't rule this out as we become more and more Russianized, Americanized, and Sheikified
952 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:35:26
Little point in you doing that
955 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:42:52
958 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:37:32
Let's not let yet another thread disintegrate into tit-for-tat,
causing more work for our hard-working editors.
For what it's worth Shane, I simply cannot understand why you have any issues at all with the being born blue statement.
It is not, as you say, somewhat dismissively IMO, 'passion in overdrive'.
It is the simple fact, not hard to imagine, that Paul, like this Paul, has never known anything else, and EFC is indelibly stamped in his identity and his sense of who he is. It is not just part of his life, like me, it is a way-of-life.
Crikey, tears streaming, 'passion in overdrive', get a grip on yerself PF ........
'Passion in overdrive'?
117th minute at Highbury '84
964 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:51:11
Now to your point. You can't understand my point about being born a blue? This is common sense and I'm sorry if that sounds dismissive. I'm a blue but I know when and how I became one. You may not remember anything else but had circumstances of your childhood been different then you may not have been a blue. Surely you can see that?
Maybe it's the atheist in me but this is up there with religion for me.
966 Posted 24/06/2013 at 16:57:37
My point was if you we're born into a house like mine and were privileged to have a father like mine you were a Blue,full stop,my sister is worse than all of us when it comes to Everton.
No disrespect intended,and no innuendo,where were you born?
970 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:01:32
I do, but they are two different points.
I actually really had no choice to make at all.
It was drummed into me from the time I was old enough to
know - a little like Catholicism, though I seem to have dropped
I suspect that that it was Paul has in mind.
Being born into an Everton culture.
I actually don't remember when I became a blue.
I always was one, I think is the best way to put it,
or, as before, I had no choice.
971 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:02:16
I understand your point about your family. I guess we differ only on our definition of "Born a Blue". There was little doubt you'd end up a blue, but you weren't actually born a blue is how I see it.
I can't compete with that :-)
973 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:07:25
I guess it's like my following or our local GAA county except I have the additional county boundary to dictate who I follow plus all the players are from the county and are amateur. Takes it to a new level.
987 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:36:07
Your'e very serious for an Irishman.
With all that "you weren't actually born a Blue" bollocks.
Stop nit picking.
990 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:43:09
I'm not serious at all. Sure all us Irish are mighty craic. Every last one of us.
993 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:51:32
Still, each to their Eoin.
994 Posted 24/06/2013 at 17:49:12
014 Posted 24/06/2013 at 18:41:06
As for what I could tolerate to stay an Everton fan, well a change of Chairman would do for a start!
015 Posted 24/06/2013 at 18:52:46
022 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:02:58
024 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:12:02
028 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:16:56
030 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:13:50
I didn't question it and never felt the need to either, even in the dark days of the mid 70s when we where shite and I took all that grief at school I never ever once questioned it.
My wife is Irish ( from Tullamore ) and I go over very regularly to see the inlaws. The amount of people I have seen in that town over the years ( 20+) change the colour of their shirt is unreal.
One guy started off a gunner then a Manc then Chelsea and now wears a city shirt. I was drinking with him one night and asked him why ?
He said he had a right to follow who he wanted.....
033 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:28:12
036 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:34:06
038 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:15:45
That's a great line Tony, and probably speaks to many Evertonians not born and bred in Liverpool, all with different connections and paths to which they found the club.
Personally I do think we are born Evertonians, it just takes some of us longer than others to realise that we are, but we all get there in the end.
After all it's not where you're from, it's where you're at.
041 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:39:10
If we took over the RS and made them into a netball team, then might stick with the Toffees
042 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:42:53
046 Posted 24/06/2013 at 18:57:48
Just imagine if we were like players and we could get offers from other club's supporters.
The news of a possible move would no doubt first appear in TW rumours.
"Villa supporters demand Ruane-style support".
Yeah, I could be off to Villa!
A Villa supporter's club spokesman would then have to be all coy when asked about the possibility of my move.
"As far as we know, Eugene Ruane has a life-time contract with Everton and he's their supporter. It would be unfair to say anything right now about any move. We haven't spoken to the supporter and we wouldn't without permission from The Park End"
Then there's be loads of threads and posts on here.
"It'll never happen"
"He was a fucking smart-arse, fuck him off" (Dan Brierley)
"Knew he wasn't a real blue, he wouldn't put COYB! at the end of his posts"
Then eventually the pressure would become too much and I'd be forced to post that the rumours are indeed... true.
"Starting 2013/14 season, I will be giving my support to Aston Villa. It has not been an easy decision to make but it has been made for the right reasons which are, despite what some are saying, purely supporting reasons. Villa have not been through an easy time recently but with my support, I really feel I can add something to the Holt End. I have enjoyed my time supporting Everton, but feel it's time to move on. I wish the players all the very best, they've been great to me...apart from not winning enough games and giving away possession far too easily".
Unfortunately, soon after my post, details would emerge that Villa supporters are giving me a buckshee seat on the halfway line, all my pre/post match beers will be paid for. Plus free curry and chips before the game and free half-time snacks, a free programme AND... a taxi home, again, all paid for.
There'd be fucking sleet and slaughter and I'd have to be smuggled to Birmingham in the bog of a Virgin train.
Basically I'd be the Rooney of Everton supporters.
When Villa played Everton at Goodison I'd be in the lower Bullens kissing the Villa badge and fellers in the Park End would be giving me the slit-throat gesture for 90 mins.
Then a few years later there'd be a thread on TW.
"Ruane - would you have him back?"
Well in that case, fuck you - COYV!!
(sorry but until the season starts again, or we buy someone, there WILL be more of this gibberish)
047 Posted 24/06/2013 at 19:32:02
One of my most poignant memories as a blue, was watching the derby where McAllister scored that ridiculous free kick. After the match, I was standing in a bar with three other blues surrounded by reds and we just started singing every Everton song we knew over and over, even ridiculous shit like 'Idan Tal my lord, Idan Tal'.
I remember a Kopite coming over to us, baffled, and saying 'what the fuck are you singing for nobheads, you lost!!' which only made us sing louder. That moment just summed everything up. It's hard to explain, but being an Everton supporter is in some ways more important to me than winning or losing. It really extends much further than even just symbols on a badge. By virtue of the fact that I spent most of my time watching Everton sat halfway down on the right hand side of the Park End says it all!
052 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:07:01
054 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:06:59
Would one of the 'big boys' have tempted you? I said no. As far as I knew you'd never been interviewed by any of them or any other supporters group for that matter. I'm not sure any had even shown formal interest.... and now THIS!?
For fucks sake! Football supporting's not what it used to be....
(Exits, kicking cat on way out to boozer)
056 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:03:04
062 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:33:41
Until I'm 6" under, is my answer
063 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:04:47
065 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:39:39
066 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:44:47
So for some respite, you log on to 'Villainweb' to tune into your fellow fans. You make a post, and then monitor the replies from the home page, and just after refresh you see a post from 'Dan Brierley' in your thread.......
068 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:46:14
.....we could all log on tomorrow and find ourselves signed into - and members of - ThrostleWeb - The Indepenent W.B.A. Website (Est. 2013)!
All it would take is for Lyndon and Michael to get out of bed the wrong side one morning and BOOM! Gone.....
069 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:45:58
070 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:33:09
071 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:48:16
Save the money and go watch the Lions every 4 years.
072 Posted 24/06/2013 at 20:53:56
No doubt saying "I think the proposed move to Kenilworth is our only chance to progress because...."
073 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:03:44
Al Philby 056, that is a legendary post. Take a bow good sir.
077 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:13:40
Picking up on your point Al, lets say football ceased to exist.....would we remain Evertonians and start to follow something altogether different as a group....like....needlework.....?
It's a thought.
079 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:12:25
082 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:23:20
"lets say football ceased to exist.....would we reamin Evertonians..." interesting way of thinking. First of all, I love football game and then I love Everton as one of ways of football existence. I can't imagine that someone love Everton and not liking football. It's like being in marriage with women and hidding the fact that you are homosexual (or some other sexual orientation).
083 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:33:10
084 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:35:37
086 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:36:28
why capitals? I didn't write that as an insinuation about Mike's sexuality and I don't want to insult anyone. Maybe I made bad comparison?
088 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:24:49
Personally I think if you get involved as a kid you're done for - it's classic Jesuit - "give me the boy and I will give you the man ".
The saving grace is you see the parallels with nut-job religious fundamentalists and are a bit more understanding.
At various times in my life I might have supported bombing Anfield .... I know it's dreadful but what can you do?
089 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:44:37
092 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:36:39
093 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:47:29
Men in bra's. classic Reeves and Mortimer. You sayin av got nowt like.....
101 Posted 24/06/2013 at 22:07:47
105 Posted 24/06/2013 at 21:33:57
We had just been relegated and most of my mates supported the other lot. Trips to the old lady with my best mate 'Molla' were incredibly exciting as every yard nearer to the holy ground our spirits lifted and hope was restored. There was and even after the passage of 60 plus years there still is something magical about the name and everything it stands for.
These days there are 12,000 miles between me and 'Molla' yet our passion for our club burns as bright as ever.
Had we chosen the path to perdition, our lives would have filled with Premierships and European nights of glory yet neither of us would or could swap what fate has bestowed.
Though we were not fortunate enough to see him in the flesh, tales told and retold of the great Dixie gave us something to cling to.
Over the years there's been other icons to carry the flame, Young, Ball, Duncan, Cahill to name a few.
My answer to Ognjen's query Is there is a connection a kind of contract or lifelong bond that is struck between us and Everton and there is nothing we can do about it.
110 Posted 24/06/2013 at 22:30:36
Peter #069, I don't know what "got your end away" means but I'm damn sure not going to take another phrase literally.
112 Posted 24/06/2013 at 22:47:58
116 Posted 24/06/2013 at 23:10:05
117 Posted 24/06/2013 at 23:14:57
122 Posted 24/06/2013 at 23:28:26
On limits, there must be one. I was born an Englishman (and a proud one who was passionate about the national team) but I gave up on the national team long ago. The sort of players that represent 'us', the lack of planning, the gutlessness - all contributed to a group I could no longer support. I just didn't have it in me anymore.
Everton is different. But I'm sure there would be a limit I just don't know how far they could go before I felt nothing for them.
131 Posted 25/06/2013 at 02:39:08
138 Posted 25/06/2013 at 06:12:30
139 Posted 25/06/2013 at 06:38:20
Hes a true blue
Like Chad (131)
I fucking love Eugene
Leave Highbuhy '84 , Kensington High St St, 78, Enclosure 78 Nov Chelsea Rotterdam Eugene alone
144 Posted 25/06/2013 at 07:38:06
Errol, I live in Cavan town but am from Killeshandra. What about yourself? We could have our own Cavan reunion here.
145 Posted 25/06/2013 at 07:34:18
If I took the Villa 'job', I'd have to do a Lineker with those events, simply convince myself they never happened.
156 Posted 25/06/2013 at 09:00:48
186 Posted 25/06/2013 at 12:42:31
189 Posted 25/06/2013 at 12:43:46
193 Posted 25/06/2013 at 13:07:18
207 Posted 25/06/2013 at 14:22:54
Basically we are asking for replica home and away shirts but Villa supporters groups (pun intended) won't wear it.
My agent (Robin U. Blynde) said yesterday..
"Look lad, if you employed Mozart, wouldn't you make sure she had all the right paints and paint brushes? Of couse you fuckin' would! Well this is the same. So if you want Ruane in the middle of the Holt End, givin' it loads, cough up the shirts or fuckin' do one".
Villa supporters club Chairman, Ken Hardlee-Reede said "Ooo the fuckin' 'ell ar yeeeOWWW looooyke?"
218 Posted 25/06/2013 at 16:10:34
284 Posted 25/06/2013 at 20:35:01
Errol/Shane, Granard man myself, only a mile from the Cavan border. Still a longford man in GAA terms but can be an associate member of the Cavan Everton brigade.
344 Posted 25/06/2013 at 23:22:15
Just wait until the franchise system kicks in, our new foreign owners will change the kit to red+white and move the club to a more affluent part of the country (or world).
Remember that clown from the Prem league (Scudamore?) wanted to play some of our games abroad to "spread the message". There's the first rock of the US style franchise/corporate landslide.
Will I still be a blue then?
353 Posted 25/06/2013 at 23:44:12
Dad was a soldier and coinciding with my younger years the family were nomadic, according to where he got posted. Aged 6 in 1965, playing football in the drive with my dad, brother and a kid from next door, my brother and his pal said "We'll be (Glasgow) Rangers" - we were then living in Stornoway, on the Isle of Lewis - and my dad says "We're Everton" (followed by me saying, as if we were discussing Accrington Stanley, "Who are they"?).
Years later when we moved to Harrogate, I flirted with the Leeds United my classmates supported - until Everton dumped them out of the cup - I can still remember my dad laughing at my crying over this, watching the highlights show the day after on ITV. Ironically by the time the semi came round, and we lost to Man City, we were living in Manchester. Going to school there, I then flirted with Citeh, who most of my classmates supported. But very soon I was back to Everton, and stayed a blue ever since. This despite getting several kickings from Man City and Man U fans combined, especially the year Manyoo went down.
My elder brother had briefly got into Manyoo (1968 European Cup and all that), but he returned to the fold. His enthusiasm for Everton later helped take me to Munich and Rotterdam and I followed his lead in investing in many years season tickets for the Gwlady's Street.
Likewise my younger brother (born in Stornoway) flirted with other clubs, mainly because he 'followed' his beloved Joe Royle to Norwich and Man City, but he too returned to Everton, in 1983. Why? Because my old fellah died in the September of that year.
You see, we're all blues now, and have ALL been since 1983, because of my dad. We can't change the fact he's not been around since 1983, and boy were were grateful for the football at least throughout the rest of the 1980s, and beyond as well. Those things, our past, and our great loss, are immutable. And so I'll stay being an Evertonian whatever happens, whatever changes, until the day I die. Then maybe me and the old fellah can talk about old times.
I'll stop now. I'm filling up.
358 Posted 26/06/2013 at 00:13:56
360 Posted 26/06/2013 at 00:33:31
361 Posted 26/06/2013 at 00:35:30
364 Posted 26/06/2013 at 00:45:58
370 Posted 26/06/2013 at 01:26:05
372 Posted 26/06/2013 at 01:27:09
377 Posted 26/06/2013 at 02:05:25
463 Posted 26/06/2013 at 12:58:36
554 Posted 29/06/2013 at 07:28:05
574 Posted 29/06/2013 at 08:51:57
Once you pass 20 yrs old and lifes warning signs about impending "mug situations" kick in the idea of football club support defies any rational thought.
I support the club at 55 and always will it really doesn't matter what happens - turn the kit red, sell everyone, get relegated.
I find it shocking to conclude this part of my life makes me completely irrational and truthfully a nutter but what can you do?
If I thought medical help would help I'd take it but science is shite as well these days.
933 Posted 30/06/2013 at 10:35:59
Don't worry about Eugene's capital letters. I doubt you have offended anybody, Eugene has had his head turned and is about to embark on a new project in Birmingham, they speak differently down there.
Good to have your support from Bosnia and Herzegovina.
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