Lack of height and lack of goals

I certainly agree with you about a lack of goals from midfield, particularly if Mirallas is on his way (which I hope he isnÂ’t).

Looking through the team, itÂ’s hard to see where the goals are coming from. Personally, IÂ’d like to see Baines training on his set-pieces much more, which we know doesnÂ’t happen under Martinez. Get him back on free-kicks and penalties because he is the best at the club by some distance.

ItÂ’s a big season for Barkley. He has to start adding goals and assists to his game soon. HeÂ’s on the verge of becoming a blunt instrument.

Does it matter?

You could have giants playing 1-11 but when you donÂ’t practice set pieces, we are still going to be a jigsaw of a team and fall to pieces in the box. Too many times last season we hadnÂ’t a bloody clue how to defend or attack corners.

Baines, such a wonderful player, canÂ’t get the ball over the first man. How about sharing the responsibility, we know Baines has a canon in his left foot and has decent pace, so he should be just outside the area for some of them.

Mix it up, itÂ’s invention we lack, not height. Certainly from an attacking front.

At an average height of 1.80 m, we are the shortest squad in the Premier League. We have a manager who does not believe in the importance of set pieces. What do you get? A disaster waiting to happen.

Alan Humphreys – who asked for 11 tall players? If you think we are a danger at set pieces at either end of the pitch then you are obviously entitled to your opinion.

However, you are right that, if we canÂ’t beat the first man from a corner, then how is it any advantage gaining one?

You suggest more invention from midfield; I assume you mean from Barkley because he is the only one in that advanced position. How many goals or assists did he provide?

What about the goals supplied from midfield? It's lucky Coleman gets a few from full back or we would be struggling to just rely on one striker for the goals.

You are right of course and it costs Everton on many occasions back and front. Stones is improving in the air and Jags has been pretty good over the years but age is beginning to catch him up.

Teams who do their homework usually suss out teams with smaller full backs and work their crosses to isolate their own big guys against them which usually brings rewards.

Distin in his prime was great in the air but Everton have missed him during the Â’Â’apprenticeshipÂ’Â’ of Stones.

However, it is a position that needs strengthening as they donÂ’t seem to have a ready made stand-in if Stones or Jags gets injured.

Crouch and Zigic up top and we would finish top 4 easy.

You are right about our lack of goals but not necessarily on height. Goal scoring is dependent on skill, control, determination and taking a risk. We have a lazy lump up front who is tall but has none of the attributes to score regularly – hence 6 goals from open play in the Premier League last season from 35 games. No effort = no goals.

ItÂ’s strength, presence and devil we lack, in all areas of the pitch. We have a big striker who shrinks when he walks on the pitch and two good centre backs who are frequently out-jumped and out-muscled.

We do need more goals from midfield but I tend to steer away from the call for taller players, it usually brings the quality of play down.

Steve (OP) I think we're a danger to ourselves at the back and atrocious going forward at corners. I don't disagree having height helps or as Richard intimates that being tall can sometimes make you less of a player, Ibrahimovic and Kanu to name but two with bags of skill and heads in the clouds.

My point is when you don't practice either defending or attacking corners you're going to come unstuck – as we found out a few times last season. Certainly helps having height I agree or at the very least a GK who is willing to command his area and claim everything.

But that's another thread.

Steve I'm struggling to see where I said we're a danger at set pieces - I'd need committing if I thought that mate.

My favourite player from the 90's was Rideout – 5'11" I think and could out jump 6'4" defenders and even his strike partner Big Dunc at times as he committed himself to wining that ball at all costs. Something Lukaku lacks.

Doesn't matter who is in our team, if we don't play attacking football then we are never going to get enough goals. Most of the midfield seemed to have a strange aversion to crossing the half way last season let alone get into the opposition penalty area.

We have been found out when our two centre backs have been sucked over to the same side leaving the vertically challenged Baines or Coleman to be out-jumped by a taller man.

However height isnÂ’t everything, as Naismith shows, springing higher than most, and winning more than his fair share of headers.

The old 1970s Cosmopolitan debate eh?

(does size matter?)

Agree Steve - in fact I think itÂ’s height and weight weÂ’re missing.

Something I noticed watching a Chelsea game on telly towards the end of the season.

Obviously, with practically unlimited cash, Â’the special oneÂ’ can pick and choose from the best players in the world.

But he (possibly) does more than that (which might have been the difference between winning The EPL and....not)

I canÂ’t remember which game I watched, but after a few minutes, it struck me just how Â’bigÂ’ they (Chelsea) were.

They were (legally) muscling opponents off the ball all over the show, just by being bigger physical specimens.

Now obviously there are loads of big puddins out there who couldnÂ’t trap a bag of cement, but if you can find (and afford) them with touch, pace, vision and and built like Earnie Shavers, thereÂ’s (yet) another advantage.

My guess is Mourinho has this on his tick-list.

There were probably one or two top players with stats to match Costa before Chelsea bought him, but without the same Â’fucking big beast factorÂ’ which has always helped in English/British football.

Also (have a look next season) I was struck by the amount of players they have who I didnÂ’t really think of as Â’bigÂ’, but when I watched a full game, I was (mentally) saying "HeÂ’s massive too...and him!...look at the fucking shoulders on him!"

(nb: maybe this is something everyone is completely aware of but...I rarely watch a full Chelsea game).

As for the difference it makes, well IÂ’ve never been one of the Â’Fuck Osman off!!!!" (ahem) Â’brigadeÂ’ but IÂ’ve seen fat 12 year old kids who could muscle him off a ball.

Please appreciate that I appreciate we wonÂ’t be buying any Diego Costas anytime soon and consequently, if the affordable choice is small(ish) with a bit of skill, versus big with no skill at all, IÂ’d tend to favour the former.

Considering we have a big powerful striker up top and one of the best crossers of the ball in the league in Baines, I think itÂ’s bizarre that the manager doesnÂ’t seem to bother with set pieces.

We saw LukakuÂ’s powerful header to put us 3-2 up in the derby in RobertoÂ’s first season, so we know he can be deadly from those situations.

We need more importance and priority placed on set pieces, and we need to see the full backs bombing forward, along with the wingers, Deulofeu especially, putting crosses in.

When the possession game canÂ’t break a team down, you have to revert to other methods, such as crossing and set pieces to break that deadlock.

After all, Einstein says that the definition of insanity is doing the same things over again and expecting different outcomes. Maybe Roberto should bear that quote in mind.

IÂ’m not sure of the stats on this, but LiuÂ’s post @ 3 states that the average height of our team 1.80m. That is 6 foot in old money. DoesnÂ’t seem that small to me.

Andrew (16) - 50 used to be a ripe old age, heavyweights used to box at 13 and a half stone, things change and imo, 6 foot now isnÂ’t what it was in 1970. Why? Better diet/health possibly (I was glad to see the back of them bleedinÂ’ Ricketts)

Eugene 17

And of course Mars Bars were bigger.

In reality increases in height in the UK have not been huge. Men born in the 80s are on average about 4cm taller than the counterparts born 50 years earlier. I suspect if there was a study of footballers it would be slightly more than this.

I think that there is a greater premium placed on athletic prowess rather than footballing ability. 30 years ago Jordan Henderson wouldnÂ’t have made a living, nowadays heÂ’s first choice for England.

But itÂ’s not about size. The best five players of the last 50 years were Pele (5Â’8), Beckenbauer (5Â’11), Cruyff (5Â’10), Maradonna (5Â’5) and Messi (5Â’7).

Also only 3 of our last League winning side (Southall, Mountfield and Sharp) were bigger than 6 ft.

And of course look at the Barca team or the Spanish national side if you want a modern day example.

Graham

Absolutely spot on, just look at the Barca team, Mascherano about 5ft 7 at Centre back, Alves at right back. I don't see them taken to the cleaners with teams playing high balls into the box. Then Xzavi and Inniesta and Messi hardly known for their height or muscle, but have an abundance of skill. Yes I agree Chelsea do have an above average of tall players, but they are also very talented footballers and thatÂ’s the key.

Graham/Brian - A couple of points.

I made it not just about height for a reason - specifically because I donÂ’t see 6Â’ 2" alone as a guarantee of anything.

Strength plus height plus skill though?

Secondly, even though each player you mention (last 50 years) is a genius, none of them played in the kick-bollock-scramble mistake-fest of the (AS IF!!) best league in the world.

Messi is undoubtedly a footballing genius but remember, he had to take growth hormones just to get to short-arse and my guess is he wouldnÂ’t have had things (as much) his own way here (could be wrong, thatÂ’s just a guess).

Chelsea, City and Utd can afford to pay (ludicrous money) to just about any player on the planet, but I get the feeling some of them arenÂ’t interested because..theyÂ’ve seen our football and feel they can be more successful playing a Â’less strenuousÂ’ game (plus they can make plenty where they are).

To be clear, IÂ’m not arguing Â’height is betterÂ’, IÂ’m suggesting that in England, skill plus strength and/or height can make a big difference.

By the way, human height increase in recent years has been incredible - seems we did virtually nothing growth-wise from the stone-age to the mid 1800s, then a ten centimetre spurt in 150 years.

(and Cyuyff wants a word with himself - someone needs to tell the slacker the Dutch are the tallest nation in the world)

Brian - how many teams get the opportunity to launch balls into the barca box. They play such a highline, itÂ’s easy to have such small men.

Ian

Barca also concede corners and again there lack of height doesnÂ’t seem to stop them defending corners. Yes they do play a high line, but this doesnÂ’t stop teams being able to deliver into the box in open play. I think Eugene may have a point that height and strength seems to have an advantage in the Premier league if not in the rest of Europe.

Eugene

I agree with most of what you say but IÂ’m just not sure about the height thing which was the premise of the OP.

Skill yes, speed yes, strength yes and all the players I mentioned had them in spades, I just think height doesnÂ’t make a huge amount of difference. After all ChelseaÂ’s best player and winner of both individual awards is 5ft 8 Eden Hazard.

And I think the fags stunted CruyffÂ’s growth.

Does anyone recall Brian Flynn? I think he was about the same height as Ronnie Corbett but wasnÂ’t a bad player. I also recall Derby, many years ago, having a very small goalkeeper, I think his first name was Les.

Andy his name was Les Green. I think he was south african
I know he ended up playing in South Africa after his spell at Derby.
Very agile.

Nobody ever told Bobby Collins he was too small – well not twice.

HeightÂ’s no use without the Â’fightÂ’ to use it.

I am not suggesting 11 6-ft 3-in players but most teams have two big centre halves for start and we have one who is 9 stone in his undercrackers.

My second point about few goals from midfield I felt was more crucial. If Mirallas goes then who is No 2 in the goal stakes?

Not long gone but already forgotten, I think Tiny Timmy Cahill would have an argument for not needing to be tall to win balls in the air.

Technique has a hell of a lot to do with it. IÂ’ve seen guys under 6Â’ beat a 6Â’+ keeper to a ball because the keeper was too lazy to get off the ground. Better delivery is the key, I reckon!