Silva baffled by VAR inconsistencies

Sunday, 27 October, 2019 76comments  |  Jump to last

Marco Silva revealed his frustration with the Video Assistant Referee decision that helped cancel out his side's lead yesterday at Brighton.

From Stockley Park, Lee Mason advised that the decision by match referee Andy Madley not to award a penalty when Michael Keane accidentally stood on Aaron Connolly's foot with 10m minutes left of the match be overturned, allowing Neal Maupay to score from the spot and make it 2-2.

The Seagulls went on to the win the game 3-2 with a stoppage-time own goal by Lucas Digne but Silva was left rue incomprehensibly inconsistent officiating by VAR after a foul on Richarlison by Lewis Dunk went unpunished earlier in the second half.

“Our players did a big effort,” Silva told evertontv. “We conceded a goal from one direct free-kick but we reacted and showed ambition and desire to come here and win our first away game but the VAR decided [the game], in my opinion.

“We did well, we controlled the game, we took the lead and the decision had a big impact because after VAR found that a penalty, at the same time it needs to find it in the opposite box because with Richarlison it was clearly a penalty.

“If they find that a penalty from Michael [Keane], they have to do the same for Richarlison because it has to be the same for both clubs. Unfortunately, it's happened many times for us and our players are like the way they are in the dressing room at this moment because it's really tough.

“I cannot understand why things are so different for us as a football club and how we are going home without three points but with zero.”

Silva appeared happy with the way his players had put themselves in a position to win the game having fallen behind with a quarter of hour gone to another cheaply-conceded free kick.

Pascal Gross fired home with a direct effort to put Brighton 1-0 up but Richarlison prompted Andy Webster into heading past his own goalkeeper shortly afterwards and Dominic Calvert-Lewin stepped off the bench to make it 2-1 to the Blues within just a couple of minutes of coming on for Theo Walcott.

“We came here with the clear intention of following how we played last week — to came here to win the game,” Silva explained. We knew it would be tough; they are a good team with fast players on the counter-attack.

“Even if we didn't make a good start, we had a good first half. We scored to make it 1-1 and it was a balanced game, tough for both sides.

“In the second half we scored to take the lead after there were big chances for either side and we were leading, more or less controlling the game and after that moment [with VAR] it was tough but there were some positives to take from the game, for sure.

“Unfortunately, we didn't get the result and it's a tough moment for us because many things are against us so it's just us together fighting and improving to achieve the results we want.

“Of course, the mood is really low because we made a big effort, did everything we should do, we scored twice and VAR didn't see for one side what it did for the other.

“It's difficult for [the players] to see that and to understand why it keeps happening to us like it also did last week. But you have to respect the decision and keep going.

 

Reader Comments (76)

Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer


Mark Guglielmo
1 Posted 27/10/2019 at 12:52:13
Lyndon, this part "Lee Mason overruled from Stockley Park the decision by match referee Andy Madley not to award a penalty..."

isn't quite right. VAR cannot overrule, only recommend. The final decision is always up to the in-game ref. What adult allows someone else to definitively decide something for him, especially a professional referee? I have no clue why EPL refs are refusing to use the sideline review booth, but it illustrates yet another reason as to why VAR has been such a disaster in this league.

I also have no clue why the VAR "recommendations" are so wildly inconsistent. Why didn't Mason say to Madley "pssst go look at your non-call against Richarlison?" Infuriating.

If you're at all interested, ESPN has IMO an excellent breakdown on how VAR is supposed to be used in the EPL: Link

Robin Cannon
2 Posted 27/10/2019 at 13:10:08
Honestly, Silva can fuck off with his "VAR decided the game" bullshit. Perfect excuse for him.

After VAR's influence, the game was 2-2 with 15 minutes left (inclusive of injury time).

What decided the game was the unforgivable, and yet absolutely predictable under this manager, mental collapse that came after their equaliser.

John Audsley
3 Posted 27/10/2019 at 13:12:48
Its getting too painful now, we cant do anything to stop VAR but we should have "Manned Up" at 2-2 and took the game to Brighton but we didn't.

Marco - We bottled it again, fuck VAR the players had a point to save and 3 point so win . they lost the plot again.

No heart in this team and club.

Lyndon Lloyd
4 Posted 27/10/2019 at 13:19:18
Mark (1), you are correct and I have amended the story accordingly, I would say, however (as you do) – and this is one of the big issues people currently have with VAR – that in the absence of Madley looking at it again himself, Mason is in effect overruling his on-field decision.

So, yes, Mason isn't the one making the final decision but Madley is taking his (Mason's) opinion as gospel and that is the problem (and not just because it's Lee effing Mason we're talking about here).

Mark Guglielmo
5 Posted 27/10/2019 at 13:29:21
No doubt Lyndon, no doubt. I'm watching Swansea v Cardiff to scout out our competition next season, I say laugh crying.
Steve Carse
7 Posted 27/10/2019 at 13:33:10
Just read the ESPN piece -- hadn't realised that it was still illegal to falter in the run up to taking a penalty. I recall Roy Vernon having a penalty disallowed for doing this in the Charity Shield game in 1963. Royston simply shrugged his shoulders and stroked in the re-take.
Back on subject, one good thing in the VAR rules is what's considered as the relevant phase of play when a goal has been scored. Apparently it's the same phase (and so subject to being disallowed if the officials have missed a foul in the build up) if the defence has not organised itself by the time the goal is scored. That's going to be one massive bonus for us then.
Jay Harris
8 Posted 27/10/2019 at 13:47:39
Steve
Our defense couldn’t organize themselves if you gave them the rest of the season never mind a few extra minutes.

We seem to have Martinez syndrome back. Can’t score goals can’t prevent them.

Andrew James
9 Posted 27/10/2019 at 14:26:25
I am totally sympathetic with Silva on this one.

We were royally done by VAR twice. Once for the goal and then because they scored in the added time resulting from the VAR decision.

We have not won back to back games for a while nor come from behind and when we looked like we might, the FA basically intervened in a way most people agree is either corrupt or stupid. The players, understandably, lost their belief.

And Silva is also correct in his suggestions that EFC are on the wrong end of a lot awful officialdom. I remember last season calculating we were probably 8 points worse off due to the Arsenal offside, the Jags red card, the ball going out of play at Anfield, unpunished tackles against City and Chelsea that should have been reds...oh and the Millwall fiasco.

Personally I think he should engineer a spirit within the dressing room that nobody likes us and stop being good old friendly Everton. The FA are taking the mick out their longest serving top flight member so we should call them on it.

It's been going on too long...the Sterling semi final goal, the Hibbert derby red card, the Rodwell red card...

Neil Gribbin
10 Posted 27/10/2019 at 14:33:46
Give it a rest some of you. How is the inadequacy of officials our managers fault?
Like him, or loathe him, this is not on his toes. Behave
Minik Hansen
11 Posted 27/10/2019 at 14:34:20
Am I the only one who's noticed, when Marco has a bad hairday, we tend to lose? (Maybe he just pulls his hair, when we're behind)
John Keating
12 Posted 27/10/2019 at 14:39:15
I have to agree with Silva I am also baffled by VAR, however, I am equally baffled by his Sigi substitution.
Andrew James
13 Posted 27/10/2019 at 14:41:51
Neil

With you on that. Was saddened to see the amount of posts saying to sack Silva.

We got totally and utterly done by the FA yesterday and no coach can legislate for that.

Frank Crewe
14 Posted 27/10/2019 at 15:23:08
Maybe he should spend less time worrying about VAR inconsistencies and more time worrying about his teams inconsistencies.
Alan J Thompson
15 Posted 27/10/2019 at 15:30:06
Has it been omitted or did he not comment on his substitutions other than the bleeding obvious of an injured player or even how he thought the man he sent on may help swing the game our way?
Seamus Lynch
16 Posted 27/10/2019 at 15:43:47
Silva has had two years, he is alas as far away from delivering as he was the day he arrived. He has had the money and the support, so time to go.

Mourinho, Wenger or Moyes would steady the ship and start the real rebuilding of pride and purpose.

Craig Harrison
17 Posted 27/10/2019 at 15:58:14
Isn't this the same ref (Lee Mason) that Silva got fined for comments earlier this year? Seeing as VAR is an independent committee, maybe we should consider suing for obviously malicious and wrong decisions?
Mark Guglielmo
18 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:04:20
Craig I googled it and you are very much so correct. Bastard.
Minik Hansen
19 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:09:06
So Lee Mason got beef with Silva. Hopefully not.. The outcome of the game should not be dependend on the refereeing. With attacking intent and scoring legitimate goals, referees can't do jack to influence the game. I guess that's what we've been dreaming of with EFC for a pretty long time now. I hope January brings in quality, like Zouma (how much is he playing for Chelsea?) and a stable Gomes/Davies/Iwobi partnership in midfield, that Silva needs to keep going in order for it to take shape.
Andy Crooks
20 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:10:37
Good post, Mark, @1
Seamus Lynch
21 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:18:27
Marco Silva has been fined £12,000 after he confronted referee Lee Mason following Everton’s defeat to Newcastle earlier this month.
Spud Head is more a fool but it is interesting that he over ruled the ref.
Kenny Smith
22 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:22:45
That by far is the most passionate I've seen Silva in the post-match interview. It's all too late, I get his point about consistency In VAR but we should be able to withstand a half-hearted effort from a team like Brighton to win the game in the last 15 minutes.

Put a tenner on Silva's potted plant and picture of his wife and kids being put in a cardboard box at finch farm on Wednesday morning If Watford win this week.

Dave Abrahams
23 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:40:19
Brent (21), I saw that and thought it was 100% a penalty, Brighton’s was given and this one ten times worse wasn’t, bet Lee Mason was the same VAR referee!!!
Brent Stephens
24 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:45:06
Dave, if I saw it correctly, there was also a drag back on the shoulder after the attempt to “rearrange” his shirt.
George Cumiskey
25 Posted 27/10/2019 at 16:46:53
All the people saying VAR cost us the game, sort your heads out.

It was only one bad decision and the score was 2-2. So what happened? We collapsed – that was the problem, not VAR.

Mark Guglielmo
26 Posted 27/10/2019 at 17:37:29
Agreed with George and anyone else who realizes that your success or failure should never ever come down to a single play (I mean, unless that play is one of the last of the game of course). Did it suck? Yes. Did the ref suck more? Yes.

But there were 90+ other minutes where we could have won the match. The real problem is that we continuously put ourselves in a position where these bad/terrible moments do become game-deciding for us. If we're up 2-0 at that point, would it have been a big deal? Guaranteed there'd be 358 fewer posts about it, that's for sure.

Gary Willock
27 Posted 27/10/2019 at 17:45:10
I’m baffled why we still employ a manager who was sacked by Watford, has not won a single game where we’ve conceded first, and concedes more set pieces than any other manager. 5th from bottom with over 1/4 of the season gone.

The fact he’s still here at 5.43pm today unfortunately indicates that Moshiri et al may be just as inept as he is. Something that I’m gutted to think after all the money he has put in.

Rob Halligan
28 Posted 27/10/2019 at 17:49:25
George # 28. So I'm assuming you think the VAR decision was wrong, but at the time of that farcical decision the score was 2-1. Had it not been given then there's a good chance we could have gone on and won the game, nobody knows. So yes, VAR probably did cost us the game.
Brent Stephens
29 Posted 27/10/2019 at 17:50:49
2-2, with a bad VAR decision - but still gutted the way we seemed to fold. Okay, it wasn't our best performance anyway but the inability to get back in the game against bloody Brighton speaks volumes about where we are being taken.
Tony J Williams
30 Posted 27/10/2019 at 17:58:40
There are games that you can place firmly at the manager's door. I don't think this was one of them.

Soft arse Pickford fully at fault for the first after a soft turnover in possession and daft foul. The penalty was a fucking joke and then an oggy from our Captain.

Kept the same team - plus point. Brought on Calvert-Lewin – he scored.

It's the usually soft belly shithouses who cant hold out against shite sides.

Mark Guglielmo
31 Posted 27/10/2019 at 18:01:14
Rob @31, same thing I said above. Removing the disastrous nature of the VAR play for a moment, what about the other 90+ minutes? I'm confident when I say these 'moments' only become hugely problematic because we constantly shoot ourselves in the foot and allow them to.

Why were we struggling mightily against Brighton? Brighton!

Drew O'Neall
32 Posted 27/10/2019 at 18:41:01
Allowing the referees to use their discretion as to when they use VAR is just adding to the scope of how these inept individuals can fuck up a game of football and create even more unpredictable, home-biased, unjust outcomes.

I was all for video refereeing but trust FIFA, UEFA, The FA to completely balls up its implementation.

They need a panel of 3 judges watching the game with access to 3 angles of replays shown rapidly, immediately after the incident and if all three press the button the ref blows his whistle.

Giving these idiots any more power is like asking the inmates to lock up the prison!

Jack Convery
33 Posted 27/10/2019 at 18:58:41
I tell you all here and now that decision would never have occurred if it had been Matip / Van Djyk - and we all know it. EFC need to make a formal complaint. Niasse the first player to be banned for diving and now we are the 1st club to have a pen awarded by VAR - even if the ref has the final decision. What ref is going to go against VAR.

The whole thing is a sick joke and EFC are on the end of the vomit fallout - as usual. We need to stuff Watford and I mean stuff them. I'm guessing given their League position they won't put out a strong XI. So concentrate minds, channel the anger and frustration and stuff Watford.

Brent Stephens
34 Posted 27/10/2019 at 19:08:46
Drew #37 I'm not sure but I think it's a panel of three making the VAR decision though I stand to be corrected. I thought one of the three looks at the recording and makes the recommendation. A second in the meantime is watching the game for other potential incidents. And the third manages the technology (you know, the algorithm that starts with “Did the incident involve Liverpool? If yes, was the original decision against Liverpool? If yes, reverse the decision “).
Bill Watson
36 Posted 27/10/2019 at 19:22:49
What baffles me is that Silva is still in a position to be baffled by VAR!
George Cumiskey
37 Posted 27/10/2019 at 19:24:29
Jesus boys, get off VAR and focus on how weak and fragile we are when we go behind.
Mark Guglielmo
38 Posted 27/10/2019 at 19:35:31
Shouting into the void, George
George Cumiskey
39 Posted 27/10/2019 at 20:02:25
Your right there, Mark. I give up.
Dave Lynch
40 Posted 27/10/2019 at 20:35:40
George how can we stay off VAR when it's blatantly discriminating against teams...

Did you see that penalty at Anfield earlier? I am 110% convinced there is an agenda going on here with regards certain teams.

VAR was supposed to level the playing field so to speak, it was supposed to cut out diving, shirt pulling and settle controversial decisions on the spot.

Instead it's played right into the hands of the cheats and media darlings.
Seriously, I'm fucking finished with the game, it becomes a pointless exercise when a decision is still so blatantly wrong that a blind man on a galloping horse could see it, despite having a ruck of so called professionals fuck it up with the aid of computerised video technology.

I fucking despair, I really do, Arrrrrrrgghhh.

John McFarlane Snr
41 Posted 27/10/2019 at 20:37:55
Hi Rob [31],

I agree with you, the VAR decision had an enormous effect on the game. If the penalty had not been given, play would have resumed by way of a goal kick and not by a kick-off. The whole pattern of play would have been altered, and we could have held out until the final whistle, or we may well have been beaten by a larger margin – no-one will ever know.

Had we held on, I don't think that there would be criticism of the substitutions, and the thread would be a positive one, celebrating the end of an unpleasant period, and we'd all be looking forward to Tuesday evening.

Mark Guglielmo
42 Posted 27/10/2019 at 20:47:32
Dave @44, I watched the Liv/Spurs match, what was your issue with the Mane penalty call?
Dave Lynch
43 Posted 27/10/2019 at 20:56:17
Mark.
This is my issue. The spurs defender has his back to Mane, he clearly pulls his foot back to clear the ball, Mane then moves in front of the defenders right peg as he's about to clear the ball.

The defender did not even see Mane and made contact when he was trying to clear the ball.

Never a penalty in a million years mate, more like a foul on the Spurs defender. This is not bluenose bias by the way, it was a shit decision...End of.

Ian Riley
44 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:02:38
I never wanted VAR in the premiership. My reason was if the referee on the pitch calls it wrong what makes us think the referee with video replay calls it right. We are Everton not the sky four. It will be brushed under the carpet.

However, this does distract from the bigger picture. The team should not be putting themselves in this position.

Rob Halligan
45 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:14:36
Dave # 47. Agree 100% with what you say. The way you describe it is exactly the same way I described it to someone via text. There is no way on earth Aurier knew Mane was about to put his leg in front of his swinging boot as he was about to clear the ball. As per the norm, Mane goes down like the usual bag of shite.
Tom Bowers
46 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:27:10
Yes it is frustrating that VAR is not really better than the average referee when another referee at another place calls a poor decision like the one for Manure today. At least justice was done when Rashford missed the ''penalty''
Hard to say whether it is helping or not.
Having said that it was yet another ''perfect'' weekend for Everton.
We should be used to it by now despite thing last weekend was a ''turning the corner'' moment.
Now Bernard will be out for a while so the bad news continues and Silva is still here.
All the so-called average sides are reaping the benefits of playing this Everton side and we still have to play some of the better teams God help us Southampton are coming up !!!
Anthony Jones
47 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:31:04
VAR doesn't play Sigurdsson, who is the second coming of James Beattie.

Both signed for Everton and immediately lost their athleticism.

We need 3 high energy midfielders. No less.

Andy Crooks
48 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:31:15
George@41, we are weak and fragile before we walk on the pitch. However, George, we were robbed. You know what, though, the weaker you are the more you are robbed. Too much bad luck is not coincidence. I look at our team and there is not a man among them. Not one of them hurts enough. They don't get it. Not one of them.
Billy Roberts
49 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:36:18
John@45
If, If, If, the biggest word in the English language.
George Cumiskey
50 Posted 27/10/2019 at 21:51:24
I give up boys and girls it's all vars fault thank you and goodnight.
Jason Lloyd
51 Posted 27/10/2019 at 22:01:28
Andrew James no 9 you nailed
it. We need to get tough and get a siege mentality going.

I hope Silva uses this, however the fact remains our players are mentally weak.

I look at players like Keane and just see a player who is mentally looking over his shoulder for the next clanger to happen to him.

There are about 5 players in the same boat. Add to that players like Sigi who is the new Scott Gemmill and you are doomed as a club.

John Pierce
52 Posted 27/10/2019 at 22:09:30
Ah VAR. What a treat this is. The rules/laws are not written in a way which reflects the use of technology. Until that is cracked we will get increasingly inconsistent application.

Mike Riley should resign, he won’t, that’s a topic for another day.

In order to funnel down to a clear set of parameters even on a subjective decision you have to embed a layered process with several pieces of criteria to satisfy before you can over turn a call. At the moment it is someone’s else opinion. Utter nonsense.

The VAR is a red herring, the guy in the booth should and in other sports does administer the call. Where football I believe is getting it wrong is that it intervenes, usurping the on field official.

If we take our situation yesterday, the referee dismissed the situation, no appeal from the players or fans, everybody looked to the restart. There is no need to intervene, unless the referee asks for assistance, it’s in the name; VAR.

Much like the AR aka ‘the lino’ who gives a penalty after he is asked by his lead referee for assistance if he cannot see, he just doesn’t give it!

If the process is layered and then applied you will get a consistent outcome, only to be used if the referee asks for assistance.

As suggestion you might ask “does the player have possession or likely to gain possession?” A particularly useful thing when the ball goes over players heads or the ball played is too heavy and could never actually be played. The check would end right there and remain as it is. If it satisfies that first point of enquiry, you could then drill down further etc. and if it satisfies your layered criteria then over turn away! The VARs would then be asked to judge on things a referee needs help with and not go hunting for stuff that isn’t there.

A lot of refinement needed and actually I wouldn’t blame the operators, the referees, one bit. They are being screwed by a flawed process and been criticized by a host of people with subjective views and vested interests, which is just hilarious since 99% will know nothing of the preparation it’s takes and strength of character to do this particular role.

Bottom line for me at the moment, keep the offsides and bin the rest until you’ve got something better than a beta version you’ve foisted on us.

Everton are shit enough without adding to the woes!

Johan Elmgren
53 Posted 27/10/2019 at 22:13:05
People saying the VAR-debacle wasn't to blame for this loss need a reality-check. Have you ever played football? Psychology and momentum are major players in the game. BHA got all the momentum on their side after they scored the penalty. Before that they were hardly in the game. How many shots on target did they have prior to the penalty? One? We we're cruising, and then the clown Mason decided to take matters in his own hands... It was a disgrace and we were blatantly robbed! People need to put away their hate-tinted glasses and see things for what they really are. Silva might not be right for us, but this loss was mainly because of bad refereeing, not bad coaching...

This VAR-tech is showing to be a farce. The referrees behind the screens are as bad as the referees on the pitch. Biased decisions are still taken despite the technology. I don't see a decrease in refereeingerrros in the games, there is no difference from before... but now they are dithered about, involving more referees than the one on the pitch.. They need to get it straight or it will destroy they game.

Dave Lynch
54 Posted 27/10/2019 at 22:13:18
Come on George, no one is saying it's "all" VARS fault.

IMO opinion we are a decent enough team with Captain Clueless at the helm, it doesn't help though when you get kicked in the nadgers by a faceless knobhead with a million quids worth of technology at his fingertips.

Si Cooper
55 Posted 27/10/2019 at 23:10:23
Even Brighton supporters who were 10 yards away from the incident are bewildered that it was even checked by VAR. That sort of decision going against you will surely knock your confidence if it is already fragile. A run of good results (by any means) would give the players a psychological boost that no amount of training field application can supply.
The Mane penalty? It is a foul on the defender, simple as that. It seems the refs have responded to the criticism of the bar being set too high for over-turning on-field decisions by setting it bizarrely low instead. Unless they start broadcasting the conversations the officials are having during these reviews there is no guarantee of a level playing field for all.
Simon Smith
56 Posted 27/10/2019 at 23:25:41
Having just watched MOTD2 it seems we aren’t the only team to be screwed this weekend. Arsenal were too.
It seems ridiculous some of the decisions that are being made.
Rob Halligan
57 Posted 27/10/2019 at 23:34:17
Simon, fair play to Solskjaer, he did say he didn't think the first United penalty was a penalty, but he's wrong in saying VAR should have been used for possible retakes of both penalties as the keeper was off his line.

The ruling says the keeper should have at least one foot on the goal line when the kick is taken, so I'm not sure if this was the case in both incidents, but more importantly, the FA said VAR would not be used to determine if a keeper is off his line or not. This is left to the on field officials to decide.

Kunal Desai
58 Posted 27/10/2019 at 23:38:45
Went to the Emirates today. That Atkinson produced some performance. No way should Sokratis second goal be chalked off. These decisions are garbage week in week out.
Simon Smith
59 Posted 27/10/2019 at 23:53:07
I see Xhaka is a popular figure at the emirates kunal.
Kunal Desai
60 Posted 28/10/2019 at 00:12:00
Simon - not sure which boos were louder for those of Xhaka or for Atkinson at the end. No way for a captain to behave after giving a half assed performance and then telling the fans to fuck off before trudging down the tunnel. That was disgraceful.
Simon Smith
61 Posted 28/10/2019 at 00:35:56
100% agree. He comes across like a bit of an arrogant dick. Hard for a player to come back from losing the fans.
Derek Knox
62 Posted 28/10/2019 at 01:22:08
Never thought I'd agree with anything that Silva came out with, but alas he has got me on this one, I think the concept of VAR is a good one and was needed to clear up any discrepancies. Although it is killing the game rather than making it fairer, by it's very execution.

The trouble is with it is in it's present form, still left to the idiots who created half of the discrepancies in the first place. As they say most are pissing in the same pot, and will cover for each other or try to be el supremo off the field if being the (VAR) senior man on the day.

Martin Berry
64 Posted 28/10/2019 at 08:50:31
It was tough to take, but would we have taken it if happened at the other end ?
Without the pen, they were allowed Brighton to come on and put us under pressure and force a draw
The fact is we have lost against
Villa, Bournemouth, Sheff Utd, Burnley and now Brighton, added to a scraper against Watford at home its not all down to bad luck just poor performances.
I get the impression that Silva is a good man, liked by his players, but If we lose against Watford in the league cup then can he survive and would we want him too ?
Rob Halligan
65 Posted 28/10/2019 at 09:19:19
Martin, of course we would take it if it happened down the other end, but hand on heart, I would still say it's not a penalty. Unfortunately us as fans have no influence whatsoever on these decisions. There has been many instances down the years when a decision, not just penalties, have gone in our favour, and I've said to me mates, that's the wrong decision by the officials.

Spot on with the rest of your post by the way.

Stan Schofield
66 Posted 28/10/2019 at 09:29:34
The VAR decision did not in itself decide the game. But it did have a massive influence on the game, a major turning point that changed the course of the game. So Silva is right in many respects.

However, we still shoot OURSELVES in the foot by not killing off games. With this squad, we play good football, we dominate a lot of games, there is no 'hoof ball' like there had been under previous managers, there seems good team spirit and energy, BUT we fail to kill off games. We need to do that in order for our obvious technical superiority over most other teams, especially the likes of Brighton, to bear fruit.

To do this, we need to be mentally far tougher. I think we've improved in that respect, in that there are signs of some fortitude, but there's a way to go. If we don't get tougher, we simply won't progress.

Injustice from officials is probably here to stay, but we can at least make put own luck despite this injustice.

Jerome Shields
67 Posted 28/10/2019 at 09:52:02
You can't beat the referee, even with new technology, Marco. I would advise you to concentrate on motivation, coaching and tactics, all lacking in this particular game.
Johan Elmgren
70 Posted 28/10/2019 at 10:50:03
Stan #66. Exactly, and that is why I said it 'mainly decided the game' in my post. Not fully, because firstly you can't forsee how the game would've panned out if the penalty hadn't been given. I though, have a feeling we would have gone on to win, because BHA weren't threatening at all, we controlled the game and I felt we had it in our pocket.

The other reason for mainly is the one you're stating... We should have killed them off earlier. We had many good passages of play, many great openings to go on and score, but most of them were simply thrown away by sloppy play and poor decisionmaking in the final third. Walcott the main culprit, but also Iwobi and Sigurdsson were guilty. This is the main gripe for me with Marco Silva. As you say we play som decent stuff, nice football, but when we come to the final third we get sloppy. And giving the ball away sloppily in the final third, gives the opponent the chance to counter and score (third goal just such a passage). This is, in my opinion, the main thing Silva must fix, or he will be sacked, and rightly so...

But I definately think he has the right to be puzzled... Who the hell isn't?

James Marshall
71 Posted 28/10/2019 at 11:04:31
The thing about VAR is this - it's being brought in to stop the questions about decisions, yet you still have questions about the decisions because those decisions are still being made by human beings = nothing changes = VAR is a stupid idea.

I always hated the idea, and that dislike has only gotten worse now it's a reality.

VAR is and will ruin football.

Mark Guglielmo
72 Posted 28/10/2019 at 12:06:12
James, what sucks for fans of the Premier League is that they were told it was being brought in to do that. But then someone decided to remove the aspect – having the ref use the sideline booth monitor for a final (human, yes) confirmation before making the final decision. I don't know why.

I have my suspicions, but that component is critical in making VAR work as best it can. So, by ignoring that part, VAR isn't working (no argument from me here) and everyone with a preconceived notion that it wouldn't work is then feeling validated.

It's like the Premier League is purposefully sabotaging it, to "prove" that it doesn't work? I dunno... The refs use those monitors for all major decisions in all the other leagues and have very little controversy or discontent as a result.

The Premier League has been given a vehicle they don't know how to drive. So they should either learn to drive or give the car back, IMO.

Ray Jacques
73 Posted 28/10/2019 at 16:32:06
Hands up, who thought we would all be debating VAR when it was first introduced? It is supposed to take away controversy – not increase it.

What a farce football has become... I despair. It is run purely for the benefit of TV, here in UK and abroad, to make more money and look after the top teams.

Mike Gaynes
74 Posted 28/10/2019 at 16:49:47
Amazing how the conversation has gone with regards to the reasons for the loss.

The mentions of "VAR" must outnumber the mentions of "Pickford" and "Sidibe" by about 1000-1, but the former's mistake and the latter's lazy idiocy were just as much to blame as VAR.

We would still have earned a valuable away point if Sidibe hadn't fallen down a goddamned manhole on the gamewinner.

The fact is that VAR is something we can't control. The other fact is that we are shitty at controlling the things we can and should control. Like player intelligence and effort, neither of which our new RB showed on that play.

Mike Gaynes
75 Posted 28/10/2019 at 16:58:10
Ray #73, both hands up. Of COURSE we were gonna be debating VAR. It was certain to be controversial, as it always is when newly deployed. No matter the league or the sport, it always takes players, officials and fans a long time to adjust to replay technology and accept it as part of the game. If history is any guide, you can figure on 3-4 more years of this level of debate, and it'll never go away completely.

The current replay review system in the NFL is 20 years old now, and there are still heated debates about some calls.

Jay Wood
[BRZ]

76 Posted 28/10/2019 at 17:26:32
Mike @ 74.

Not for me it hasn't Mike. To the names of Pickford and Sidibe (you left out Gomes!) add the name of the manager for his poor substitutions and in-game tactical and formational switches. And throw in the lack of resilience in the face of adversity whenever any misfortune befalls to Everton, as it inevitably will in any professional sport.

The VAR decision is a worthy talking point, but it also deflects the debate away from what should be of deeper concern: the manager's and the players' performances in the 15 months since the ball first rolled in Silva's first match away to Wolves.

People are tying themselves into a Gordian Knot over a one-off incident and in doing so ignoring the deeper, more serious and repeated issues.

The game was not lost following the awarding and converting of the VAR penalty. It was still 2-2 and - with added time - there were still 16 minutes to play.

However, only one team looked like winning in those closing minutes and they duly did so. Yes, DCL scored within 2 minutes of entering the fray, but having already lost Bernard for Siggy, Silva then subbed out Iwobi and Walcott for DCL and Delph, ensuring a considerable reshuffle in the formation and tactics.

The pitch was made narrower. Speed and guile in attack was sacrificed. Tom Davies was pushed forward in a no-man's land kind of position. Sidibe - in the absence of any forward to fill the role - continued to support the attack deep in the Brighton half. Our midfield was left undermanned. There was little or no transition from midfield to attack as a result (not that it had been that great all game).

This was at a time when Brighton's own sub Trozzard was causing havoc with the Everton defence, attacking the space in our half so conveniently left by Sidibe playing so advanced.

Sidibe was playing down the flank on which the coaching staff were gathered. Did none of them see the above and think:

'Hang on! We've been kicked in the goolies with the VAR decision. Let's not go all gung-ho. Let's regroup and solidify again and only then seek out a winner if it presents itself. Sidibe, stay at home and don't go a-wandering. Tom, sit in with Delph. Siggy, keep forward but lie a bit deeper to offer an out-ball in the Brighton half. Richie and DCL, split wide to close their out ball from defence. Then we'll look at it again in 5-10 minutes."

The VAR decision was cack. But their winning goal was self-inflicted and Everton self-harming again.

That loss had absolutely zero to do with 'luck'. And even if 'luck' did play a part on Saturday, or in all the other 20 PL games in which Everton has scored first but failed to win, one might conclude that Silva is not a lucky manager.

If he was a General under Napoleon, I fancy Monsieur Bonaparte would have replaced him by now.

John Boswell
77 Posted 28/10/2019 at 20:59:31
I have said it before on other threads, that for Everton to break through the top 6 or 4 the team will have to be strong enough to overcome poor decisions by officials, big 6 bias (blatant or otherwise) and the pure bad luck or adverse rub of the green.
We need to develop a roll sleeves up attitude amongst the players, an altitude that refuses to lie down when bad things happen in a match. I am reading a number of posts on this site from fellow members of this special family who clearly agree with this view.
I had hoped that Marco Silver would be the answer but I do not believe that he has the ability to manage an individual game. The way he makes his personnel changes to chase a result seem to be prompted by panic.
I wish to see a calm and measured response to the situation of any particular match, change shape or change players but keep whatever shape you have chosen, do not throw everyone forward leaving the goalkeeper exposed.
I thought, oh dear, when Brighton scored on Saturday,but we equalised before halftime and took the lead in the second half. All good but, my, when we conceded that penalty, what a change. THAT is what needs to change, that last 15 minutes Everton changed character, their play became stressful, lacking control and ultimately unravelling.
Must do better, we will always suffer poor luck, dodgy decisions and outright deception of officials until we can stand up to this and still get the results that put us on a par with the "so called" big boys.
. and breathe.
COYB ON TUESDAY NIGHT.
Martin Mason
78 Posted 28/10/2019 at 23:38:00
Silva baffled by VAR inconsistencies? Everton fans baffled by Silva inconsistencies.
Lee Brownlie
79 Posted 29/10/2019 at 03:53:37
So.. (according to some) we need the likes of a Mourinho, a Wenger, or even David Moyes, to get us back on track???

WTF??? No-one notice, or are you just too hateful of Silva to care now, that none of these so-called 'would-be saviours' did anything but fail dismally in recent years, and in the Premier League, itself??? FFS.

Matthew Williams
80 Posted 29/10/2019 at 13:38:39
Some team needs to react to VAR like how Harringay Borough reacted in the racism row in the recent Cup game: If what you don't like is happening all around you... then just walk off the pitch,the bigger the game the bigger the reaction.

Nowt would please me more (apart from a League Cup win) than if the above team was the Blues who said loud and proud a big "Fuck You" to the EPL, but sadly we're far too nice. That's why we folded at 2-2 and made a bang average Brighton look like world beaters.

We need to get really fucking nasty as a club,signing a proper Midfield General wouldn't hurt for starters, followed by a statement from our owner that the club feels we've been unfairly treated in the past few seasons and will react if this thread continues...

Everton FC 1878
Premier League 1992

We have history in our side, they have only greed.

FUCK 'EM.

Roger Helm
81 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:21:53
The standard of refereeing has been awful for years. Two suggestions - if we import the world's best players why can't we import the world's best referees?

Other sports have more than one referee on the pitch – two in the NRL, seemingly a whole committee in the NFL. Why can't football do this? The refereeing set-up is as it was in the 18th century.

Add Your Comments

In order to post a comment, you need to be logged in as a registered user of the site.

» Log in now

Or Sign up as a ToffeeWeb Member — it's free, takes just a few minutes and will allow you to post your comments on articles and Talking Points submissions across the site.


About these ads