Everton leave big chances too late

Can't say I'm pleased we're playing 550 again...

David #4 - New on here I think? Welcome if so, and where are you out of interest. My Dad was David but I know you're not him!

Rondon available. Suspended just one week - not quite sure what for.

It's becoming 1998/99 reincarnated lol

From Cornwall but currently in the midlands, pretty sure I am not your dad 😂

Gordon - 4 goals
Gray - 5 goals
McNeil - 0 goals
Doucoure - 2 goals
Iwobi - 2 goals
Mykolenko - 1 goal
Patterson - 0 goals
Tarkowski - 1 goal
Coady - 4 goals
Holgate - 2 goals

Not exactly promising.

Surly we should be playing 4/3/3 like everyone else in the bloody league, I get 5 at the back against top 6 teams but not against everyone else. I just hope I'm wrong but I can see villa doing us 2-0 today.

This match could be decided on who is better prepared tactically and adapted to playing in the heat. I'd have Rondon ready to hand out the lolly ices, nothing more.

Cheers, Dave A - I should have remembered that for myself! But not much that Rondon does sticks in my memory tbh.

We've let three go….

We are in real danger of ending up 5 games in without a single point on board, even after facing 3 of likely bottom 5.

Own worst enemies.

He has options which we will argue over but I can see he will try to get a settled formation and we can only hope that it works out.

Not starting Dele Alli the one player who has pedigree for scoring means he will hope a set-piece may settle this in Everton's favor. We hope so too.

Rondon is the only striker we have, and should have started, because Gray or Gordon and McNeil would be a lot more of a threat when they have a striker to aim for. Here's hoping we get a result.

Now Rondon is fitter, surely he should play and at least give the team some shape. I live in Newcastle and I know he's older, but Rondon was outstanding when he played for the Magpies. Given where we are, a 4-2-3-1 would make much more sense.

He has about 8 games before he triggers his 20-game clause, so that gives him 5-6 games to show something, otherwise he won't be seen again.

Onana has only just arrived, is only 20, so is normal for him not to start. Ease him in, he'll be raw, so we need patience.

No use putting Rondon up front on his own, with no service, as he'd be as effective as a giant cube of sugar in a monsoon.

But getting pretty nervous now...

Coady looking pretty vocal pre match - good sign. The line up looks about as good as it can be to me. There are goals in there if we can not be afraid to have a go, and a decent press too.

Obvs want the win and we can definitely do it but I'm feeling a 1-1 here.

With Slippy's issues with Mings we might just surprise a few people

Jim B, they'll either run out of steam or come off the rails ! Hoping !

Haven't beaten them since they won promotion?

Given the performance of the UK rail system, I'm not too worried... hoping for some lengthy delays and maybe an all out strike in the second half

Insert Rondon

He is offering fuck all

So many defenders on the pitch yet a striker scores a goal.

Striker a unknown word at Everton lol

Doucoure going off for skateboard Tom.

No great loss anyway Doucoure, been as anonymous as usual

If we don't start looking like a team that will ever score a goal and sign some attacking players then I'd be putting money on us being relegated this season.

We look as shit as ever

Another long hard season with diabolical away performances look imminent

McNeil seems lacking confidence already, that's what Everton do to you.

Why can't we play attractive football like say, the mighty Brighton

That's all we're hoping for. Nothing else is happening.

Yellow card already in a area where you need to be combative

I don't mate!

We were shite last season and this season we have sold the one player who score a few goals.

We couldn't score goals last season so that's why I don't see any improvement this time.

VIlla not out of first gear.

As for Rondon, if we're not going to use him, we should sell him.

Stupidity is killing us.

We're obviously not a great team, but then we are also rebuilding. Get a target-man and I think we'll be fine.

The screenshot on VAR shows Digne pulling the shirt off Tarkowski, but other than Iwobi, every other offensive Everton player just seems too lightweight, whilst Mykolenko doesn't appear to suit our system, and might be better moving inside because he does possess a lot of defensive awareness.

We are in a much worse situation than last year when we had DCL, Richy and Rondon to potentially lead the line. Also I hate 5 at the back.

Hope I have to eat my words :-(

Points keep you up and we are toothless.

Gray started running the channels but soon gave that away. You wouldn't have known McNeil was on the pitch except for his cock ups while Anthony Gordon has done a wonderful job with his hair but not his football. Apart from Iwobi who has probably been our best there is nothing in midfield to create anything for the non-strikers.

The defence seemed adequate until giving that rubbish goal away but as per last week we don't seem to have any plan or idea about what to do when attacking albeit we could have scored once or twice by mishap. It again looks down to poor team selection looking painfully short of a striker to worry the opposition's defence.

Ability won't get us anywhere. We will rely on a lucky break to get anything out of this second half.

Interesting moment for Lampard. He needs to assert himself and make an attacking change, even if it is as extreme as bringing Stanley Mills on. I'd like to see Rondon on to give us an aerial threat and move the Villa defenders back a few yards in fear of Rondon winning a few flick-ins from long balls.

Iwobi has been our best player. Again.

It's absolutely dreadful. At some point we have to admit that we are desperately lacking in actual quality.

Doucoure, Gordon, Davies, Myko, Iwobi... They might have some attributes, but can any of them control and pass a ball to the required standard? I don't know much about McNeil but it doesn't look great so far.

We're going to be technically inferior to every team we play. So how is it a plan to sit in our own half and wait for the inevitable?

It's the equivalent of the lesser boxer just planting themselves in the corner. Our actions aren't that of a team trying to win.

I'd have more respect if we said "we're crap, so we're signing a big unit from the lower leagues and going long at every opportunity". At least it would be a plan.

This is unwatchable.

If you're not doing that then you're simply parking the bus.

Has to change it completely or no points here.

As we speak managers, including Frank are terrified of relying on youth because their jobs and reputations are on the line. Mills off the bench may offer something that Gray and Gordon have tried to do for months on end.

The board deserve every bit of criticism that goes their way…..but really starting to feel that Frank is the latest mistake in a very long line of them. This is poor. Not sure we will score more than 30 goals if we carry on like this. We're already back in a relegation fight.

Get Gordon off.

Loads of hype last season despite not exactly doing much other than loads of running with little end product.

Gordon granted the Number 10, dyes his hair albino and that's that, he's made it.

But we're getting beat!

We always give Villa their easiest game of the season, nothing new here.

Villa players don't look drained.

We only get anything if we go direct or get lucky with a set-piece. Passing is just shocking.

Massive game next week against Forest.

Already after three games it feels like a six pointer given the paucity of our quality.

I've seen more attacking threat in an empty hamster cage.

Urgency when the game is 99 percent out of reach.

We're still crap though.

Villa are so average here yet we show no urgency to get the result.

Why, why, why, why is he still on them?????

I'm not knocking the young local players, but Davies and Gordon are not going to give us what we need. Accurate passing from both and goals from Gordon.

Onana should have started this game, get the game won Frank and play your best team from the start.

Another poor opponent that we gift the win to.

Davies has been dining out on that goal against Man City for about 5 years, should have been jettisoned long ago!

I'm behind him 100%. We've got fuck-all upfront, blame golden boy Gordon who has missed a couple of presentable opportunities.

We have done okay today, we missed a couple of really good opportunities, I'm confident we'll be okay.

Not sure why Rondon and Onana didn't start.

I said last season when we lost a couple of games on the run that losing becomes a habit. I'm saying the same after the first 2 games.

Start the game with that tempo then you probably give yourself a good chance of winning.

We sat off Villa too much and allowed a mediocre team to dictate.

When we got the chance late on to go for it, we threatened them but our limp dicks up front can't shoot for toffee.

I don't know where the answer comes from in terms of goals but none of those in that current squad possesses it.

Be braver Frank, FFS.

The game isn't that difficult. If you're not good, find a way to apply pressure. You can't just go out there hoping to exist.

Lotta huff and puff but this team just doesn't have anything decent up top. Need a decent striker ASAP.

Two games, zero points. Hardly surprising when you don't have any strikers.

This board has committed absolute negligence in not replacing Richarlison. It's beyond disgraceful

The number of times we had the ball 30 yards from their goal, and had no clue what to do with it, so we sent it backwards to Pickford, then try again only to lose possession on the half way line. absolutely shocking.

Little movement, little urgency, and no vision. Beyind that, always capable of giving the ball away cheaply and offering up a chance.

Onana, despite his mistake, looked an improvement. Coady looked an improvement.

But the team is lacking in so much. Gray, Gordon, and McNeil offered close to zero. A striker and a Richarlison replacement attacker are absolutely essential.

Dele Alli still looks like a parody of his former self.

Lampard is just awful.

Bright spots: Onana, Iwobi and Patterson, what little we saw of him - no service!

Will we beat the drop? Yes - but we need a centre-foward.

We were woeful, absolutely woeful, going forward. Just a complete waste of time.

You cannot start with that shite again next week.

What I'd give for Ings. Gordon is completely useless where he is.

Not rocket science, just buy a fuckin striker, but this negligent and careless board just continue to wallow in some sort of stupour of failure of duty.

Awful awful, rancid board. Not fair on the training staff, players or fans.

Franks needs to be braver like Mathew @200 says. Can we somehow get rid of Tom Davies, recall Ellis Simms back from loan and get at least 2 striking options in asap. Look at somehow offloading Calvert-Lewin in January, as Arsenal certainly didn't even put an offer in (where he thought he was going).

The club needs to be much smarter at offloading players, didn't Moshiri say judge him by the end of the Window? Well, we will be bottom by the end of today, and will be by the end of the window also, with yup (the Everton way) a negative goal difference.

No wins, No Goals, No Trophies, No Europe – the People's Club!

Villa are a poor side and that was a six-pointer. We lost it comfortably. A couple of games in and I suspect we're already in dire straits. Those who are bound to tell us that it's all going to be okay aren't paying attention.

That was a very sobering performance indeed.

On top of a striker, Onana must start and the transfer of Gueye should be completed so we can get a hold of the midfield and dictate the games for a change.

Judge at the end of the window? My arse! We'll be well adrift by then, sadly.

Starting Gordon as the spearhead was a mistake. What was he thinking.

When you select a team like this you cannot afford to concede first because then you are chasing the game with no strikers to speak of (big mistake).

Easy for Villa and Slippy G and dare I say many other teams if Lampard doesn't wake up.

Should have started with Rondon, especially as we seem to go long so much. He won everything in the air and was a handful for Villa's defence. And once Rondon and Dele were on, Gordon could go out wide and do what he does best.

I thought Patterson was surprisingly good, and Onana looks a class above the rest of our squad, even if he did give the ball away for their second. He's not the finished product but, in a couple of years, he'll be one of the most sought-after players in Europe.

For fuck's sake, Frank, start Rondon next Saturday! He might be a bit shit, but he's the only shit we've got.

210#

You summed it up pretty well mate.

Hope Allan, Onana and Rondon start the next game.

And well, talking once more on the need of adding a striker sounds too obvious...

1) Doucoure and the wingbacks were too far up the pitch for the first goal - really naive.
2) McNeil, Gordon and Gray were poor in possession and their ball retention - they should not play as a front three again.
3) Coady and Holgate were decent, but Tarkowski had a disappointing game.
4) Iwobi and Onana will be an energetic midfield pairing
5) We need a striker THIS WEEK!

Lampard was too cautious with his formation and tactics this week.

C-minus for this game. Hope you learn your lesson for next game. 5 at the back and 2 in midfield does not work, especially when you've got 3 forwards that can't head a ball or keep hold of the ball.

We won't get anyone in for Forest so expect the same again. The only positives for me were Holgate and Onana.

At least one point thrown away today!

Poor game but defensively we look better and Onana looks good.

We need a striker asap and to be honest an effective winger.

I think Tom Davies has to be written off. Not gonna make it now.

I'd drop Gordon for a bit. McNeil looks worryingly lightweight. Long season ahead.

let's hope that all changes by the end of this month and the clear-out continues until he has his own team in there.

Ridiculous!

Gordon is not a centre-forward and looked 100% better when he went wide left. Davies is not a starter but is a good squad player, did nothing wrong today.

Why Lampard left it so long to make changes is beyond me, in fact after proving last week, that three wingers up front does not work, l can't believe we started exactly the same system with exactly the same result.

Patterson, Iwobi, Mykolenko, Tarkowski and Onana all positives.

42% possession – I can't actually remember the last time we dominated the ball.

Next 3 games are huge.

I'd start next week like this:

Pickford
Patterson Tarkowski Coady Holgate Mykolenko/Vinagre
Iwobi Onana Dele Gordon
Rondon

It feels like we will be in for a Mike Walker start to the season as we wait and wait until we actually win a game. We lose games so cheaply.

Rondon should have started the match, really not sure why he didn't. Very strange decision.

Forest at home next, followed by Brentford and Leeds away. It's already at the stage where we're getting desperate. Simply have to get 4-5 points from these 3 games as we're getting zero from the 2-3 thereafter.

Get a bloody striker!

What is with Everton managers making a signing of worth, them starting them on the bench and giving them 10 minutes? It's not big and it's not clever.

Something Mourinho would do to make himself look good.

As the School Report would have said "Must do better"!

Dele Alli - the clock is ticking on him, Lampard would be better served by shifting him off to the MLS or something similar.

I don't get the abuse that Gordon and Davies and (not today) Holgate get. They are very adequate PL players and play an important squad role. Sure, not world beaters, but they still have a lot of upside and their development has not at all been helped by the manager merry-go-round at Everton.

Until we are able to afford another half a dozen Onana like players, fans would be best served by being patient and encouraging them - you never know, they could turn into Iwobi (whew, never thought I would say that!).

On the game itself, Villa would consider themselves lucky to come away with 3 points. But for some great last ditch defending by Mings and Callum Chambers, at least one of those close range toe pokes by Onana and Rondon would have gone in.

Also, the referee should have added at least 2 more minutes to the playing time considering the insane amount of time-wasting and injury-feigning that the Villa players were indulging in.

I think the key to making the 3 at the back work is to have 2 mobile, physical and hard-working central midfielders. Hopefully that is Onana and Gana. Oh.. we do need to add a centre-forward in the next few days. Still no goal scored by an Everton player so far in 2 games, but the "Shots on Target" statistic is encouraging.

We should have matched up Villa and gone 5-3-2 with the wing-backs providing width. Then we would have seen more of the ball.

Lampard could have taken any two of the front three off, including Gordon and it would have improved the side. All they did was run around like three headless chickens.

Next match, I fully expect to see Onana play along with a proper forward even if it's Rondon. We cannot start another game without a striker.

McNeil looks a poor buy.

Dele is a waste of space and will drain the wages bill for a couple of years.

We still have time to sell Gordon.

Lampard is all talk but a shocking manager.

Granted he had one ridiculous pattern of play, but he gave a better midfield perfomance than Doucoure had managed before his injury.

Given the poor performances of McNeil, Gray, Gordon, Doucoure and Tarkowski, why single out him?

8 months in and we are still watching a performance lacking in drive, skill, confidence. Headless chickens all of them.

I am not calling for his head only two games in, but something needs to change fast, like signing a couple of strikers and using tactics that actually get them on the ball in scoring positions.

Just when I thought it was safe to come out from behind the couch!

Onana looked good. The system we played gives up too much possession in midfield. I hope Lampard doesn't become stubborn and sees that we need a big mobile forward.

Richarlison was sold 6 weeks ago and we all knew he was likely to leave well before that anyway. Calvert-Lewin was injured most of last season. Rondon is a Championship-calibre player.

The management team only have themselves to blame for not addressing it sooner. They will be in panic-buy mode now.

I will say, next game 4-4-3, play Onana, Allan, unless we sign Gueye, and Iwobi in midfield and a new striker.

I thought McNeil was very poor today.

Gordon definitely not the answer up there though because he's really flat and has a lazy body language. McNeil and Gray also failed to get into the game though so very disappointing from all of them.

I could not bear to watch that game again, such was the paucity if our general play, and yet we still had some half-chances because Villa are not great either.

Big result needed against Forest.

We can't judge them today on a game played in 30+ degree heat, it was like a friendly match played in that temperature. If he starts Rondon then he would fade massively and it made sense to bring him on later when their defenders would be more tired.

And Onana will start soon, he'd only been involved with the squad for 3 days so I can understand not starting him.

He doesn't have loads of options at his disposal (4 potential first-teamers injured already) so he's doing his best with what he has got at his disposal.

Chill your boots.

Gordon wasted through the middle. He's best out wide where he can use his pace.

Doucouré was pretty poor again, and then added to the injury room.

Alli looks way off the pace. 㿀M fee and wages when we have no recognised striker fit?

Rondon isn't the answer.

Iwobi and Patterson were the rare bits of positivity.

Big game next week, a game we have to win.

Agreed. We came into the season half-baked because of finances but, if we hold our nerve and ride out some choppy waters, I am confident we will finish strongly under Frank.

With Gordon playing as a Number 10, alongside a proper striker. We could do alright. Or we could stink the place out and be down by Christmas.

But we have to play with a striker, not the powder-puff gang.

The problem is there for all to see. We don't need Coady telling Tarkowski how to play and we certainly do not need McNeil, Gray, Gordon and Iwobi in the same team.

Get another proper midfield player who can score goals and a couple of goal-scoring forwards.

We're off to a bad start but it's early enough to rectify it. Even though I think Frank was at fault today I would not be calling for his head.

Blame any individual player by all means, but they're on a hiding to nothing. Criticise Tom Davies by all means but he won't perform until you put him in a 3. He'll still be technically limited, but his strengths (workrate, moving the ball quickly through the thirds) come to the fore instead of him being exposed needing to do everything in a 2.

We have to be pragmatic about getting results so that we're not in trouble. That involves finding ways to show some kind of attacking threat.

Building up the quality in the side can happen progressively. That was Moyes's greatest skill – he improved the team gradually while still getting performances out of what he had.

- throw on Patterson last season;

- throw on Onana today (until it was too late);

- bear with Simms, Dobbin and Branthwaite;

- give Mills and Warrington a proper go;

- make early and sweeping changes, especially when the game plan is already clearly dead;

And most of all – too scared to switch to the 4-3-3 / 4-2-3-1 we all know is needed to make genuine progress in this league. He's too scared of upsetting Thelwell who wants the 3-4-3 “fluid” (ie, confusing for our players) system he's wrote a book on.

Coleman's leadership pulled him out of the shit last year (he knew it, and we saw it with the cringy praise in the last game). He's tried to build on that with Coady and Tarkowski, but I fear ‘3 Lieutenants and no general' is going to ultimately be very counter-productive.

The recruitment of McNeil stinks of a manager who just buys players he likes the look of, with no discernible plan on how they improve what we already have. If Dele can't get in ahead of any of those front 3 today, then he's another very poor buy.

Personally, I'm that concerned with what I see (5 defeats in last 6 league games?) that I would act now and get him out. If Moshiri had any balls, he'd break the bank to get Pochettino in the way Spurs got Conte. Especially if there's money left in the kitty to give him a few players.

Utter pipe dream though, because thats just not our thing. Instead, we'll stick with him until end of September or early October and then panic into a Dyce or Nuno... most likely the latter!

Grow some balls Frank…..throw the dice now.

1) Go 4-2-3-1 immediately
2) Buy TWO goalscorers this week
3) Use 3 subs by 60 and all by 90
4) If Newcastle or Spurs still offering 㿏-40m for Gordon, bite their hands off.
5) Drop McNeil right from the squad if he plays once more like the last two games.
6) Treat Mills like Gordon has been, get him on the pitch and leave him on (this will make us forgive the Gordon sale necessary thanks to the pointless McNeil buy).

…..ffs go all out to win at least 3 of the next 4. If you don't, grow some balls and resign.

I hear from a good source that he has been going demented at Lampard and Thelwell and has told them that no more signings will be authorised until a goalscorer is on the payroll. He's as frustrated as us so something must happen!

Mustn't it?

Before the obvious 11, I will start with this: since the start of Frank's time in charge, we had the likes of Patterson and Dobbin on the bench, so taken away from any matches for the U23s, neither got any extended play time, odd cameo here and there with a few mins left now and again.

Now Patterson is finally getting game time and, to be fair, is looking decent, with Dobbin and Simms out on loan. Stanley Mills has now been drafted in, taken away from the Under-21s, yet zero minutes in both games this season, every sub has that familiar "who is coming on and who is going off?" syndrome feel to it.

Anyway, now to today's game. I think once our backline gets a few games together, we will be fine in defence. One or two have had a pop at Davies, I agree, not a long-term fix for us, but I do think he had a decent game when he came on. Iwobi yet again doing a lot of things, keeping it simple but, for me yet again, one of our better players today.

Already covered Gordon in another thread, about set-pieces, running down blind alleys, likewise with Gray, both greedy and don't look for a killer pass to a teammate.

Overall, I thought we looked unbalanced the first half, until Davies came on, so for me we need to get a better balance in midfield for the Forest game.

Does not take a rocket scientist to work out we need a proven centre-forward in the team – and quick.

So overall, if we get the other midfielder to come in along with Onana and one, if not two forwards in, then going forward for the rest of the season, we will be fine, but only if we get it right now, in the transfer window.

If we do not get a striker, we are screwed.

We'd all like that but they are not easy to find in our budget range.

If we get Gueye, I assume the plan is to use Onana was a box to box midfielder. The fault for not replacing Richarlison promptly with a new forward sits with the recruitment team, not Lampard.

They were the best team for most of the game we only got on top when we had to throw everything at them at the end.

Iwobi was our best player again, he was everywhere.
Onana looks to be a star going on what we saw of him, you cant blame him losing the ball that led to their second goal he was well tackled, end of.
Patterson looks like a quality player in the making too.
We will be ok, but we are missing Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison, any team would. Top strikers don't grow on trees though they are hard to sign.

Its time to be disappointed when we are favs and expected to win, today we wern't.

Me thinks Arteta is glad he moved for Gabriel Jesus and not Calvert-Lewin (I didn't realise they are the same age).

Gary - I agree with your bullet points

Ernie correct, but Moyes did have 11 years in the job, and the season we finish 17th was not progress. We didn't win anything in those years or win at Anfield remember.

I wonder if Martinez and Marco Silva were given 11 years what the outcome would have been?

Simms – loaned out and free-scoring?

Got to get a striker in ASAP and start Onana who looked very good in his short cameo. Long way to go yet.

You're all talk. And not one bit remotely funny. He's been here 8 months, digest that.

We are where we are because we keep axing managers.

Meanwhile, Simms notches again for Sunderland.

Villa were there for the taking and, in typical fashion, we blew it big time. We played over-cautious, negative football against an out-of-form side and got what we deserved – nothing.

First and foremost, the manager got his starting team selection totally wrong imo. Rondon simply had to start today as Gordon, as we saw last week, is woefully out of his depth as a number 9. That starting line-up put us on the back foot from the off and showed the opposition way too much respect.

The manager also got his subs wrong: Davies did okay by his low standards but this was a perfect opportunity to blood Onana. Instead, the manager chose, once again, to play it safe. Then bringing on Onana and Alli with only 10 minutes to go was both mystifying and frustrating. Why on earth we waited so long to change it when we knew that we had to chase the game, only the manager can explain.

Not sold on playing 5 at the back, week-in & week-out, but this is where we seem to be at the minute. Angry and frustrated now as this was a game we definitely should have got at least a point out of.

Here's hoping the manager wises up and quickly. Ending on a positive, looks like we've bought a real player in Onana. Surely he has to start next week.

Here 8 months and he doesn't know about Simms. Now that's funny!

And I thought this was a supporters' forum.

It's possible though that Onana didn't have an hour in him, hence Davies, but he and Alli definitely should have been on earlier.

We need two strikers, one before next weekend and another before the window shuts. Games where it's possible to take points, like today and the next three up-and-coming games, are absolutely crucial as we are likely to pick up very little in September.

I just don't understand it. Maybe he can explain his thinking.

Even though Rondon might not get us the goal, he's given some balance to the formation knowing that someone can hold up the ball upfront.

Disappointing result but Onana is very promising. His power and physique is what we need. Sort out the front and result will come.

But what concerns me beyond the tactical questions is that we didn't attack this game with the necessary intensity. Villa came out cracking electricity all over the place, and we just didn't. If there's one thing last season should have taught us, it's that a game we don't play with that junkyard-dog attitude is a game we're simply not gonna win. And it's Lampard's responsibility to instill that before kickoff.

The "coward" comments here are blathering idiocy in my opinion, but yes, this one is 100% on Frank.

It won't get any better until we get another midfield player in and a couple of strikers so be prepared for another anxious week waiting for them to arrive and maybe the depression will start to lift, good job we are used to being Everton fans.

Two games gone and Villa are out of form? Errmm, okay.

It's August with the transfer window still wide open and two games gone. Not feeling good with two defeats, but 'tis a bit early to be hitting the bottle, pipe and panic button right now.

The negativity from some on the forum before we've even got remotely close to kick-off time is... well there are no words.

Now we can all agree we need a centre-forward and quick. But when you allow Dobbin and Simms to go out on loan, then start the only available centre-forward on the bench, you get what you deserve.

No, I am not in the Rafa camp, he had to go in the end, but at the same time he got absolutely hounded, while Frank is getting away with everything.

In time, Frank will hopefully get it right, but he should not been exempt from blame, no more than be applauded when he gets it right, just because he replaced Rafa.

However, it's clear that Lampard has to wise up and grow a pair soon otherwise the knives will really be out.

Wish Gordon would cut out the play-acting. If he were an opposition player I'd be livid with his antics at times.

Davies is not good enough and I hope that performance proves it. McNeil was anonymous. Gray has been poor for a while now. Iwobi was by far our best player.

We need a first win. Not too concerned yet. Last two seasons have seen us start well and then the wheels fall off. Our problems are there for all to see and we urgently need options up front.

What I can't understand is when we lost our biggest goal threats over the last few years in Lukaku and Richie it is never addressed somehow try to replace what we have lost.

We never score enough goals in any season and Simms should not have been loaned out. We really do need to see if we can get money for Gordon, I can't see him being the player we want him to be. Continously can't cross and shoots with the power of 3 year old Emily.

If we sack him after a few games we are in the same boat as we have been previously, with a new man ( if I'm allowed to use gender still) trying to work with a squad of players that he may not want and starting fresh with tactics and systems.

I am prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt for the time being until all transfers are completed. This is HIS squad now with HIS choice of players and HIS system and tactics. There is nowhere to hide or anybody else to blame this season, unless of course the striker situation isn't sorted out.

Did you throw your cushion?

Gary #290 Villa got well beat by Bournemouth last weekend and they did not look like setting the world on fire today either despite being at home for their first game of the season. Saw them here in Perth during pre-season as well and they looked decidedly average imo.

No panicking or knee-jerking from me Gary, just pure frustration because as I posted earlier, I felt like this really was a winnable game if only we showed a bit of canny in-game management. That's on the manager imo.

It's part of the modern game. Hence all the ‘cramp' in and goalie throwing the ball out of play for ‘injuries' in added time.

They do so to see if the referee will have the gumption and bottle to add the time on again. This is a grey area that teams look to exploit. Fortunately today Oliver was strong enough to let it play out as it should've done and we had 2 chances to win the game in added time.

If there are things to critique then I'm afraid it's not the performance of Anthony Gordon which was full of endeavour if somewhat lacking in quality at times. I still feel he is not fully physically developed and that extra strength and power will only emerge in time.

Things for focus are 2 defeats in 2. Home and away. Two tough games of course but we got nothing from them. And although I am encouraged by what looks like improved solidity and Lampard getting some good individual performances from players who'd previously failed to perform - facts are we haven't looked like scoring a goal or winning a game.

The decision to allow Simms leave on loan for me is a mistake. I'm not convinced he'll be a premier league performer but he'd have been better value for his minutes than Rondon ever will be in an Everton shirt.

Simms should've been given a shot this season. It's regrettable that he hasn't.

It's plain to see that at least 2 attacking options need to be added to this team immediately.

Now, somehow he is the messiah who will catapult us up the league?

Honestly.

That was actually a fair performance in the end with some showing that we have maybe 70% of a very good side in there and Tom Davies will be an important part of it as Kevin Richardson once was.

The problem was that we started with a stupidly negative formation filled with the wrong players. If Lampard doesn't learn from this, then he must go – but please, not this week.

I reckonTop 10 still and a massive success in Onana, what a player.

Clearly Frank wants a striker: that's why he didn't start Rondon.

Relax punters: and hopefully a win vs Forest for my first match of the season…..

I thought Davies played well, Iwobi put some excellent balls in, particularly defensively. The big issue is a striker and set-piece taker.

I would far rather have a dodgy start and a strong finish. Thought the new lad Onana was excellent, what I saw of him. Patterson also coming good.

Pick of personnel and tactics do not tally, substitutions poor and end result inevitable.

Why do we so rarely see an Everton side that is going for the game, home or away, instead of just sitting back and soaking up the pressure before conceding softly, with no way back?

Says something about the coach surely?

Those valiant fans who stand this away crap, week-in & week-out, they merit the Alan Ball medal for bravery.

We can offer what we like and the other club will except it but is up to the player to agree to a contract, and a number of mentioned who we should go for may have been contacted, plus other clubs aware of how desperate we are will want more than we want to pay.

We need a striker, but what are we going to go for, someone to be backup for DCL or someone better than him.?

It is early days yet, but I don't believe there is any need for negativity, start of the season and 2 days before we loose our center forward. 2 days later we loose 2 of our central defenders. Our midfield has always been suspect but so far we have strengthened the midfield and defense. There is no doubt that the manager is aware of the weakness up front and that Thelwell is trying to find another striker, finding one that wants to come may be harder.

Oh, and Simms scored again today!

Admittedly most are not Premier League standard and weren't his choices, but McNeil, Gordon and the ever regressing Gray don't have a football brain amongst them and should never line up together, whatever the circumstances. It will never work and the manager should see that.

Whether he doesn't start with Rondon to make a point or he just doesn't rate him is Lampard's decision and he will be judged over the coming months by such choices.

On a positive, we have two young, exciting full-backs and a couple of experienced centre-backs to rid us of the comedy double act of Keane and Holgate. Why does he then play three centre-backs?

Again, a decision that is on him and I believe is a poor one as our midfielders cannot compete with the opposition as the full-backs play too deep in the five and don't support or offer an out ball.

We will see how results go but, if you want my opinion (and no, I don't want the manager sacked after 2 games), I see a struggle through to the winter recess and I would put money on the sack for Lampard and our "wonderful" board appointing the likes of Dyche.

5 defenders, 3 midfielders and 2 forwards and yet we fail to close the opposition down and allow them to find far too much space.

Away from home, we need to start picking up points. We have to defend as a team and stay solid. We have a bad habit of conceeding first. This must stop!

Positives are we scored thanks to Onana who looks a very very promising player.

Doucouré and the front three were terrible.
Early days, I know , but I'll take the positives from the solid defence. Vinagre ahead of Mykolenko for me.

Tom Davis is not.

Bit surprised Frank didn't start with our only available striker though. We are not Man City bud, this false No 9 malarkey is not for Everton because City's midfielders score more than our strikers anyway!!

Lacking a bit of elementary understanding of a team set up in relation to balance and cohesion. You don't just rely on your defence to stop goals – it's the responsibility of the whole team. Similarly, your goals are scored because the whole team takes the responsibility and the understanding of how it happens. At the minute, the side is out of shape in and out of possession badly.

Forget the system for now and concentrate player's on working their part of the pitch only in attack and defence-keeps the shape of the team and will give you the balance left and right, and front to back.

The midfielders are being bypassed by long balls, so when it inevitably breaks down, they are in no-man's land and can't affect the game – hence teams can run at us easy.

Players can't and never will run faster than a ball travels so why make the pitch so massive? Pull the entire team closer together and play short for goodness sake!

You can't do any of this without a specialised striker because you lose the shape of a team,trying to teach wide player's to stay central,which they won't because its alien to them. Everton sold the bloke who could do both to Spurs.

Less tactical bollucks Frank, play with a natural balance across the field and make players accountable for going missing from their areas of the pitch.

The best teams have the best points of the compass balance, and it shows because when they do lose the ball, they rarely get played through because their team is nicely set up and players are where they should be - in balance.

Other than that, it's still too sunny and summery for all this footy lark! Bring on the rain, grey days and cold – then it starts properly! Miles too early to be falling out over these games too!

Play simple, work hard, play clever, and stay in your bit of the pitch!

Today, he did exactly the same and again it failed.

I would like to think now he realises those three together do not work and so ends the experiment.

Just for confidence alone. we need 3 points next week. If not…

Anyroad, to stop the rot, then go 4-4-2 and give it a real fucking go against Forest at home... If we still ain't got a top striker, then my side would be:

Pickford

Patterson
Tarkowddski (Capt)
Coady
Mykolenko

Gray
Onana
Alli
McNeil

Iwobi
Rondon

Not sure we can be expecting much from them this season, unfortunately, so unless we can get some quality forwards in, we are going to need a shed load of clean sheets this season.

Up front the three kids are busting a gut but there's no one to pass to. Neither Alli (invisible today again) nor Rondon (knackers yard?) are the answer.

I see a huge improvement over last season but the midfield and 1-2 strikers are now a question of life and death.

Mid-table safety will be acceptable to me this season. IFIT.

Anyway, I don't think it is panicking to have the opinion that the performance of the coach has been utterly abject in our first two games, with team selection, formation and substitutes. Another defeat and we are crisis club Everton once more.

Dale, dodgy start and strong finish is the road to another cliff hanger. We can make excuses all the way to the Championship. Unlucky defeats breed complacency.

This lot seem to be still on the beach. Didn't last season's shit-show not disturb them from their collective football inertia.

Frank needs to fucking wake -up and smell the coffee. We had enough personel available to do a lot better.

Start with your best 11 and if they tire -change them. It's a bit like watching a Moyes team.

ps: Davies was far better than Doucouré... we actually started to play a bit when Tom came on. And the big feller looks like Pogba (on an interested day!).

I heard the gobshite commentator on BT say there "were some big clubs watching how he does at Everton". Gunt!

The game was poor, we were poor and they were poor as well, just unfortunately these may be the games come the end of the season that cost us. They did nothing; however, we have a knack of this. We can't beat the worst teams.

Now apparently his flaw is he only knows how to defend? Also, as for the selection, Tom came on and did better than Doucouré but, based on Tom's career to date, would anyone have actually expected that to happen?

And would you feel confident that Tom will continue to play well? No. Rondon and Dele both on the bench for a reason -- whenever they've played, everyone has said they're crap. Now they start on the bench and suddenly they're wasted talent who can't get a chance.

The fact is, Frank is doing what he should do first which is building a solid defence. Now it's time to bolster the attack but, with little to no money to spend, it's difficult to do.

But even then, we played well enough against Chelsea to get a point and were unlucky. Today we lost 2-1 at a ground where we always lose. In isolation, neither result would be viewed as a disaster and yet some on here are acting like the sky has already fallen.

Lastly, the last 2 years we had people thinking we'd win the league after the first 3 games. How did that work out? Maybe this time we will do the reverse and get better over time – not play well for a month then throw the towel in.

We didn't deserve to lose either game. We lost because we don't have anyone to score goals. It's that simple.

I think we'll be fine once the new lads settle in and we get someone who can actually score a goal or two.

No player developed at Everton can succeed because they aren't Wayne Rooney and a large portion of our fans just don't get the concept of a good player when they come through the club system.

I despair at our fans, we could be so much better without the worst of them.

Really childish posts slagging Frank off. It will improve. Trust the manager.

If you've been asleep all summer, we are looking to buy some strikers and more. Take a chill pill and calm down, for fuck's sake.

Rondon is obviously not good enough to be a starter, as is Dele Alli, so Lampard had little left to start with but why did the club allow Simms and Dobbin to go on loan so soon?

Playing Gordon basically up front on his own was an awful decision and made it easy for Villa to dominate in the first half.

As usually happens, they got the clincher just before we scored and, as luck would have it, their player scored it.

So, as everyone agrees, we could have the makings of a good side but only when they get that forward position sorted – and I don't mean when Calvert-Lewin is fit.

I switched the game on at the start on the radio today, and within 30 seconds we'd lost the ball and conceded a corner. I know you can't extrapolate much from that, but it wasn't surprising to me that we were instantly on the back foot.

I think there is a big part of Frank's brain which thinks 'How do I set up a shit team not to lose?' And the latest manifestation of that was his 5-5-0 formation. Against a truly crap side.

I felt he didn't play Rondon or Dele Alli so he could say to the world 'Look, we haven't even got a striker!' And I really didn't like his 'It doesn't feel like we've got a goalscorer' comments afterwards. We had a striker, but he chose not to play him, and sent two others on loan to the Championship.

If he loses next week (and who would bet against that?) the sky will fall in and he will be out by September. Them's just the facts.

A centre-forward is essential, Ings showed how a decent one can make room and a goal for himself in a split second. Expecting Gordon to fulfill this role is demanding enough but to expect him to fulfill it through high balls is nonsense.

Get someone in this week and beat Forest and the world looks rosier but we don't have a good squad to not worry about winning games until Calvert-Lewin returns.

Onana looks like he could be a very good signing – we will see.

Gray and Gordon are not effective in such a formation. McNeil is lightweight and Rondon is not anything like the required centre-forward. Onana appears to have done well.

Frank is really going to struggle if he does not get a result soon.

Yes, I agree, and so we'll sack Frank before he gets his own squad together. We'll get Man Utd to sack Ten Hag too while we are it because he's shit too and we'll get Sam Allardyce back before it's too late.

Diminished standards there have been but people need to stop sucking their thumbs and grow up. Frank and his team are trying to arrest the dismissed standards you refer to. Knee-jerk reactionaries. We have to allow time to rebuild a poor squad assembled by many before Frank.

The almost complete disappearance of McNeil since his promising opening against Dynamo Kiev is representative of how, mysteriously, things tend to wilt for us.

Something else which continues to baffle me is our failure to retain possession. We have been consistently awful at this under different managers.

I genuinely have no idea why it should be so but our first touch is usually a bobble or an outright miscontrol. If you give the ball back to the opposition easily then you will always be under pressure, obviously.

It's that looseness and a besetting lack of mental strength which still affect us so fundamentally. As I say, baffling.

Hope i'm wrong but I wouldn't count on Calvert-Lewin making a huge difference to us.

Could be worse... we could be bottom only for Brentford! lol

Liverpool, Man City and Barcelona have all shown in recents times that, if you have the right system and fast interchangeable players, you can win games without a centre-forward.

Already, alarm bells are ringing re Lampard's poor judgement both in team selection and in-play inertia!

I bet he's looking forward to the World Cup break.

Yes, agreed.

It does seem a bit much to be putting the boot in after two games, but he's been here 6 months and I've not seen any evidence that we look any better. The crowd kept us up last season, let's face it, it wasn't Lampard.

I do give him every credit for putting up with the pressure that went with being manager. I just don't think he's a coach. And I'm not convinced at all by his recruitment. That Dele All deal was an absolute shocker. And the Dutch lad came for big loan money and did fuck all too.

The switch to five at the back also feels like a cop-out. 'We aren't good enough to defend with four'. And this lack of confidence knackers us all over the pitch.

Five can work if you know what you're doing. Wolves may have had five at the back, but they were then able to play two massively footballing centre mids just in front; we've got Doucouré and AN Other.

Everton fans have history of turning on our youngsters. From Derek Temple, through Mick Buckley and in modern times, it has happened to Barkley, Davies and now Gordon.

Young players don't need building up then swiping down callously and cruelly.

Davies isn't fit enough to lace Richarlison's boots and will never be an important part of the side.

He's slow, can't tackle, can't pass a ball, is physically weak, and gets booked more times than Chubby Brown.

We're the club we are because of this type of limited player.

I personally wouldn't bat an eyelid if he was sold tonight, then again I doubt there'll be many takers. 'Limited' is the phrase I was looking for...

That is what I am saying, with the centre -forward as part of the interchanging play. At the moment, Everton have no centre-forward. We both agree that Everton need one.

Disappointed with the result, many aspects of the performance, initial formation, and the nature and timing of the later substitutions.

Was Onana really so unfit he could only take 10 minutes of effort? An unfortunate slip in his first minute (but the defence is not blameless – it's there to mop up mistakes like that); however, if the pace we saw from him thereafter, and his desire for the ball, are what we'll see every week, then I'm excited. If we get the likes of Gana, the midfield will be an improvement on what we've had.

Iwobi was again impressive – always looking to move forward with the ball, or to release an early pass of quality, as well as closing down the opposition.

I'm also willing to believe we have an improved collection of defenders (Patterson, Coady, Tarkowski, Holgate even, and Mykolenko). They need time to knit together.

And, of course, some signings up front. The window isn't closed yet so I live in hope.

Frank is going nowhere so a bit pointless calling for his head.

If Stan Mills shows further development, and Lewis Warrington after his time with Tranmere, then they will be a further small margin of improvement.

Early days. Hopeful. But disappointed with so much today.

We have lost the first two games but, according to the betting, we were expected to.

We have the makings of a decent team we just need a couple of class players.

The defence looks okay, it's upfront and midfield where we are lacking. I get the impression we have the players in the pipeline – why else would you loan out our young strikers!

Having endured (watched) the game today, I think Frank's team selection could have been more positive from the outset, and I am losing patience with his lateness in the timing of subs. We have had this with many managers before, if we can see the need for change as amateurs, what is going on with them?

I think Onana looks a player, from what little I saw of him. We still have a very weak midfield and Davies is not the answer from the bench either.

Anthony Gordon should give his head a wobble, he is slowly becoming each week, the proverbial 'headless chicken' and why he is chosen to take a lot of set-pieces is bewildering. His deliveries are like the 'Drunken Milkman' – too many or not enough. And where's Number 9's Strawberry Yoghurt? :-)

I mean exactly how many games has Tom Davies played for Everton? A lot, and not one club has ever shown interest in trying to sign him (there must be a reason why).

This is a player which brought tears to Unsworth's eyes because he was so proud. An example of so many things that's rotten at this club, and why we have seen a slow decline over the past 30-odd years. Small club mentality, living on past glories decades ago.

I saw a lot of positives in his signing. But those were 2 absolutely dreadful performances.

The team has been mediocre for years, but Lampard has been here for 8 months, becoming Everton's seventh manager in seven years.

In defense of the Board, what else can they offer us except another thorough and purposeful strategic review?

I dare say having trained all week in similar temperatures, and even being a bit younger than you and I by about 50 years, say, I would have expected at least a draw.

I can't bear to watch the Blues at the moment, they offer zero entertainment.

Until we get forwards in who offer a goal threat, we will keep losing against any Premier League team. Just how we keep neglecting this issue year after year is a shameful indictment of all who run the club and everything we stand for. Which used to be entertainment with a touch of class.

As Frank said at the end of the game 'It is what it is'. Well, he was right about that. We are shockingly fcking awful to watch; he has a week or two to sort it or he will be out by November or sooner.

Frank has inherited a shite squad and lost Richarlison in that process. Give the man time, we'll be fine. Just stay calm.

And then there's Alli. I hope Lampard isn't starting a collection. At least we could give Van de Beek back.

"Without a pivotal centre-forward, an attack based on wingers and midfield is always going to come up short"

Colin #393:

"I disagree you need a pivotal center-forward"

Jerome #400:

"We both agree that Everton need one."

Sounds like two guys having a conversation and one of them is deaf in one ear.

Why isn't Dele playing?? Aside from Dom, he's the only player in the squad who has a history of scoring double figures (albeit a few seasons ago); he needs a run of games. Are we worried about paying the 㾶M impending transfer fee?

I'm not overly concerned with the result cos we've tightened things up and look a different animal this season. However, we look completely toothless and need a striker and another midfielder ASAP.

Laughing stock of a club, in this league you cannot wing it and hope to nick draws until strikers are signed last minute. Typical losing mentality, no wonder confidence and belief have been stripped from the players, already on the back foot.

Imagine a golfer expecting to use a wedge for a putter Sort some fucking strikers out, Everton, for fuck's sake, before it's too late!

Iwobi needs to be on in place of Gray or Gordon and we need more strength in the middle of the park so we can build play up and we have proper ball winners instead of forwards with very little aggression in the challenge.
Then we need at least two players who know where the net is (Just like Ellis Simms has shown consistently at every level

Frank, please sign a decent striker.

Simms, who is on loan at Sunderland has scored his 3rd goal in 2 games, while no Everton player has registered a goal.

Fair enough if we have nailed-on players but that's beyond Everton daft – just reckless. A full month's games up for grabs at least. I was starting to believe in Thelwell so time to scramble the wreckage of the season.

He scores occasionally when he cuts inside and shoots, the classic "inside right" that works well with overlapping wing backs.

That looks like Frank's plan. The problem is that McNeil and Gray have not been very effective so far.

A disappointing start to the season from Gray, Gordon and McNeil. I hoped for better from the last two especially.

From what I've seen and heard, Iwobi was very good again and Onana bought a lot. If Gueye is added to that pair ,it could make quite a powerful trio.

Sounds like Guirassy (or Diang or Ajorque) might be joining soon, which will give us a focal point for Gordon to play off; so maybe we can play the 5-3-2 like Brentford did today.

Pickford
Patterson Holgate Coady Tarkowski Mykolenko
Iwobi Gueye Onana
Guirassy Gordon

I think that's a pretty decent team (if Guirassy settles quick) though possibly you need more offensive threat from wingbacks and so Vinagre could be useful instead of Mykolenko, who is good defensively but mediocre in attack.

Whilst recruitment this far appears good, it would be very poor overall without genuine effective forward options.

There was precious little going forwards and it was a boring awful & turgid watch for the most part.

It signals 2 wasted games to get points from: even a draw today would have been half-decent. Instead, we've piled the pressure on ourselves with these blunt performances.

We didn't replace Lukaku and so far we haven't replaced Richarlison: we were bereft of goals even with Richarlison but it's even worse now: no focal point, no meaningful threat and a winnable game wasted.

Carry on like this and we'll be staring relegation in the face. We're playing not to lose rather than to win and it's depressing and we're getting found out.

Surely forward options were the most important priority of the recruitment this window?!?!

If true, he's looked the part the most of the YouTube bits compared to other links. Can't afford another dud up front or injury-prone.

I think he could easily get 20 goals in the Championship doing his confidence the world of good and he will come back and do a job next season.

I think Simms also shows that there's a substantial gap between the Premier League and the Championship.

We have been linked with the Swede striker from Coventry this week, but we already have a striker in Simms who can probably perform at the same kind of level in that league. So we should be cautious looking at Championship strikers.

Let's hope we can get the deals done for the Rennes striker and Gana or Mo Camara next week.

Simms scoring goals for the past 3 seasons while on loan proves he is ready and Rondon never will be.

It's worrying isn't it? Besic and his drag back had a lot of Evertonians, many on here but not me, convinced that we'd signed some kind of midfield maestro.

Nyarko: the new Vieira.

Dwight McNeil. Who knows. But in the midst of 2 defeats upon his arrival – he's been the worst player on the pitch… twice.

As for Tom Davies, it is said that God loves a trier – but I don't think the Everton fans will put up with just a trier, they expect more, and we have better.

That's me, after a disappointing day ... time for bed.

I'm sorry but Frank is far from the solution, there was a reason why he was Chelsea's second-worst manager in their Premier League history. He is shit. A great player but not a manager. He doesn't seem to be able to react to changes in games and adjust his playing style or make changes to suit.

This is going to be another shit season with the club relying on home support to save us from Championship football for a long time.

Just watch Broadhead playing, half a chance and it is in the back of the net. He has his weaknesses, he cannot take the ball from midway and create a goal but neither can Rondon. Dobbin is as fast as Gordon and even he is not being utilised correctly.

Q) How many strikers from League One have we signed? To my limited knowledge, the answer is zero, so why are we sending players there for valuable experience? Why not to Championship teams?

We could offer Championship teams a set amount for playing our strikers at least 10 times in a season as well as offering a free loan salary-wise. Then they would be getting experience or we could at least sell them.

I just posted in another thread – without a proper forward in there, it leaves almost zero option short of someone having a go at taking two or three players on in a direct run at goal.

I suppose all we can do is wait for new personnel. Pretty sad to have zero effective flexibility at this stage.

Watch Gray: several times today, he beat a player or two and then kept the ball instead of providing an assist. Now Gordon is following suit, with the same useless result.

Lampard, you need to bring Gray on later when the opposition is more tired, or coach him. Tell him it is a team game. It is better for the team to score than any individual to endlessly tackle players resulting in no goals.

Their incompetence over the past 6 years has all but guaranteed a relegation threat this season and the way in which they've royally fucked-up the club finances ensures that nobody has a chance of buying our way to safety as their lay-about signings remain on their exorbitant contracts, perennially stinking out Finch Farm.

Instead, we scramble around for players nobody else with aspirations of even mid-table seems to have ever wanted, paying them way beyond whatever they've been paid up to now, and we have, again – and this way precedes Moshiri, btw – a very, very inadequate strike-force.

Still, let's turn on the manager and DoF eh, again, and again, and again, instead of the cack-infested boardroom that so consistently destroys even blind hope before every season kicks off?

Kenwright Out!

As an optimist, I'm with you.

However. He's been really poor in the 3 games. Awful. Almost pathetic

Am I wrong?

The main differences were 2-fold and obvious. Villa bossed midfield through McGinn, not that it was difficult to do so. They had strikers on the pitch compared to us having none.

I thought the defence was looking pretty solid, but any defence will succumb eventually if you sacrifice the midfield to the opposition. Gordon tried, but he's no striker. He's also clearly labelled as going down too easily, because there are many occasions he should get a decision but it gets waved away.

Pickford reverted to type. There seems to be some kind of electromagnetic force around his 6-yard box that prevents him coming out of it. And he always seems to opt for the rugby style percentage punt when a lay off to a full-back or wide sitting centre-back is on.

Can someone explain the laws of the game to me? In the build-up to the Gordon "goal" at 0-0, there is a shirt pull on an Everton player. Shirt pulling is a foul and a foul in the penalty box is a penalty??

And then the kung fu kick on Tarkowski? Is that allowed even when the VAR looks at it?

Anyway, a flat performance where we conceded the midfield and had no end product. We didn't deserve to win it.

The positives?

Firstly, Onana made a difference when he came on. Mistake for the 2nd but he gave us something in midfield. Perhaps the change came too late?

Second, there are 38 games in the season!

Looks like that Graham Potter wasn't a bad shout either.

McNeil looks a different player than as against Kiev, albeit that was a friendly. There must be a cause.

I guess I'm clinging to the optimism for now, since the whole thing is an ineffective mess that just has to be improved soon – then maybe we can judge more aptly. As it is now, I don't even know what I'm trying to look for!

Having a target man, focal point up front would have made a difference today.

Early days and a long season ahead, but there's more steel in this squad than there was 12 months ago.

It's never going to be easy to change how we play from a 25-30% possession defensive shite footy to one where we are braver, smarter with the ball and hopefully more entertaining by creating more chances.

There are positives already as the back line, even with 2 injuries, are already looking at least 10 times better, which is your base; now, he's got to get the right mix in midfield and sign a striker.

We have way more talent than last season, we just need the hunger from a few more, I believe we will have a decent season; I'm saying around 12th by Christmas, then I think as the side gets more used to playing with each other, we will have a big push in the New Year.

Also isn't it nice that it seems that Moshiri is letting Thelwell and Lampard do their jobs and not listening to super agents?

Coyb

I really hope this is not true.

The main difference today is that they played with 3 proven goalscorers up front. We played with none.

I wish I could offer you an answer but completely stumped myself.

One thing I will say, though, whenever there is a chance of us getting anything at all with the VAR, the checks always seem to be done quickly and over with, in the blink of an eye, but god forbid it being a Top 6 team, they look at all sorts of different scenarios, sometimes taking well over 3 minutes to make their minds up.

So who do we attack today? Davies. I thought he had a reasonable game coming on as a sub. Let's be honest, Tom is not going to be a starter but, as posted on here, will be a good squad player.

Yes, we need a striker and quickly. Apparently, they are looking for a Calvert-Lewin replica, somebody good in the air that can feed off McNeil crosses.

Once we get this striker across the line and another quality midfielder, then we can start to question Frank's tactics. Until then I think we need to give Frank a chance with his team selection and not one inherited from Benitez.

On today's evidence, I think Onana could be one of the signings of the season.

On the topic of Simms, I think we should have kept him. He offers something totally different to Calvert-Lewin and I think that is why we let him go because he doesn't fulfil the style of football Frank wants to play.

I believe we are now more solid at the back which gives us the opportunity to build from there and so I am hoping that, with a new striker, Frank will turn things around.

But I was holding my breath. I'd like to count how much time I spend not breathing when I watch Everton!!!

That's the abysmal level they've long-since reduced us to, for seasons to come – "us" being the manager, DoF and fans; you know, the fuckers who don't matter a damn to those still calling the shots after their self-admitted serial incompetence for six seasons minimum.

I agree on the defence. The other thing is that sorting our defence shouldn't be underestimated. It's been a shambles since mid-Martinez era.

If, as it appears, Frank has sorted it, then that's something no-one since Moyes has accomplished

Davies, Holgate, Calvert-Lewin and now Gordon have been targeted for relentless abuse. It seems part of our DNA to undermine our young players. Talk about eating your young.

It makes me wonder why so many posters are calling for Stan Mills and Ellis Simms to play, despite them requiring more development to be ready? Probably gives them someone else to slag off so they don't get bored.

I get that plenty on here don't rate Tom Davies, for example, as a player. If he plays badly, it is fair play to point it out. But, he was a serious improvement on Doucoure yesterday and our midfield functioned better when he came on.

So, why is he getting abuse on here, yet Doucoure, Gray or McNeil are not highlighted? They were absolutely dreadful but you wouldn't know it from the comments.

Judge the player on his performance on the pitch, not pre-conceived ideas about him.

I agree – the defensive shape looks far better in the first two games.

Last week, Doucouré was hanging onto Sterling's shirt as Sterling went down in the box and we got the free-kick. Later, he did it again but this time it was a much longer pull and the penalty was given.

Today, when Ings scored, Doucoure was pulling his shirt. Who knows if a foul would have been called if Ings had missed. I doubt it.

It looks like there will be no foul if the ref thinks that the pull was not strong enough to cause the player to go down or miss his shot.

Yeah, I posted on here in the summer saying that I thought fans would get on Gordon's back this season. A year ago, he was seen as another overhyped prospect who couldn't cut it on loan. But he worked his ass off and got himself into the team and had a pretty good season.

But suddenly expectations are heightened. He goes from the kid people had given up on to the new Raheem Sterling and, after a few poor games, now he's being crucified by some. I hope like Aaron Ramsey who had a similar experience at Arsenal that he bounces back and takes the next step.

Being stupidly optimistic, I note Danny's comment @447 that there are 38 games in the season. If we lose the first 8, then win all the remainder, we could win the Premier League!!

Silly? But the Man Utd manager said they had to win all their games, just before they played Brentford. And who are bottom of the table at present?

But Frank, the transfer window is closing fairly soon.

You mention Neil Maupay.

My son-in-law is a Brighton season ticket holder (many years), and to quote him, he would drive Maupay to Goodison himself.

Hopefully it's paper talk, but worrying all the same.

Did someone at Everton have a brain fart at a crucial moment and signed the wrong player??

If Simms continues to score lots of goals, then he may hopefully prove he is ready but his all-round game definitely needs work still — and dare I say Rondon might score a few goals in the Championship too.

We need a reliable, top-level striker. Clearly Lampard and his team did not think Simms or the other youngsters are there yet. From what I've seen of them in youth games and on loan so far, I personally think he's probably right.

I'm astonished at how poor McNeil has been. He's always looked to be an industrious type of player whenever I've watched him.

He's taken to the pitch and looked complete shell shocked.

He has offered his team absolutely nothing in his first two appearances.

Gordon has real energy and skill. All he lacks is experience. A 20-goal-a-season target man next to him would take the pressure off him. In my opinion, he is there to fail… and the club has done that with no striker signed.

The general consensus among Blues travelling back was that Tom Davies had been a significant improvement on Doucouré.

It's a complete mystery to me how Davies dominates the thoughts of so many. Sure he is just about Premier League level on a good day, but at a club riddled with so many substandard people on and off the pitch, he hardly warrants so much comment. He's a squad player. He didn't feature last season and we still very nearly fell out of the Premier League.

Yesterday was another disappointment, but there were some positives to take from the game. Coady's distribution was even better than I thought. Tarkowski continues to do what it says on the tin. He will be the rock on which Frank builds. Patterson is a pleasant surprise. Confident and stylish. Iwobi and Holgate continue their improvement under Frank. Maybe as a result of not being shifted around.

This season reminds me of the season Rooney left. We came into it without a proven scorer. I feared the worst. God bless Marcus Bent, what he couldn't give us in style, he gave in effort. He ran himself ragged for the cause.

We will be quite some way down the pecking order if a proven scorer becomes available. Maybe we should focus on finding a player who will occupy defenders and get us up the pitch as Marcus did.

Not the most imaginative idea, I know, but Frank hasn't just had to trip it up and start again. He's had to do it with his hands tied.

Rondon may not be able to last a full game but, in the ten minutes he was on in this game, he made a huge difference in my opinion. He has to start next week – simple as!

Lampard's selection upfront is limited but I thought he could have given Rondon and Dele Alli a bigger share of playing in the game. It reminded me of Frank's naivety when we played at Watford, another poor defensive team like Villa, last season. Frank played for a draw when a more attacking game might have got us a win.

We all know what we need to give us a better season, instead of a worrying one. Hopefully we get these players in before the end of the transfer window or we'll be getting the prayer mats out again.

Despite my disagreement on Marcus Bent (I'm not going to contradict myself), I agree with Dave @471; we need a player to get us up the pitch. Players even. I was encouraged by the cameo from Onana. He has drive in him. And it was great to see Coady and Tarkowski urging the team forward when they could. Two leaders on the pitch.

Even just watching yesterday, Coady is a footballer as well as a defender. I don't know his history, but he strikes me as a midfielder who at some point has been converted to centre-back. Sweeper?

Apparently, according to Thelwell, Coady was a central midfielder when Thelwell signed him for Wolves. It was the manager who converted him to centre-back and sat him in the middle of a back 3, where his great strength was in his reading of the game, and his playing the ball out.

So spot on.

We need to be patient, Frank is doing this with a mismatched squad, new signings who have yet to fully settle, and question marks remaining over who is coming in. Both of our matches could easily have been draws (if we were cursed Everton anyway); if that had happened, we would all be calmer I'm sure.

Let's try to remember that most of us would 'take' a mid-table finish this year so let's do something very 'un-Everton' and manage our expectations accordingly. This will manage the usual knee-jerk vitriol by some of our fans. We asked for money to be spent and it has, with more to come.

We will get a striker this week, Frank has as good as said so. Personally, I think we should ask for Gilmour on loan and spunk the cheddar on an exciting forward. 㿊M is being suggested for Ramos of Benfica, if we can find that money, we should do it. We need a spark up there.

Of course who we get in much depends on Calvert-Lewin this season, if he is going to remain fit (cough), then a back-up striker option like Maupay, Guirassy et al would be acceptable to me. If Calvert-Lewin is going to keep breaking down, then we have to go all out and buy quality.

I'm sure it's been mentioned already on this thread but I see Simms scored again, letting him go given Calvert-Lewin's injury record last season seems borderline negligent. We could have killed two birds with one stone, covered our frontline for a bit and got valuable Premier League experience for our boy.

As for the game, I think there are signs of a solid structure at the back to build from. I went absolutely nuts at Frank when he brought on Davies for Doucouré, the game was crying out for Onana to come on earlier.

The loss was on Frank, I'm afraid, too tentative which is a mistake when you don't have the system or the players to hurt other teams at this moment in time. That said, Tom did okay and it's good to see him back.

The negatives for me were poor performances from McNeil, Gordon and Gray and the way we conceded both goals.

Still plenty of positives for me to grab onto (Danny style!) despite the drab game and performance. I think Patterson is coming on really nicely, I like him a lot. Onana looks like he could be a beast of a player. Imagine him, Allan and Gilmour in the middle together and we could look a completely different outfit. Tarkowski and Coady are only going to get better together. We have some leaders finally.

Now, where is that goalscorer, Frank?

The policy seems to be to sign players for positions which we seem to have adequate cover.

Somebody will say that we had (have?) five central defenders but bought a couple more who are an improvement and that we had a couple of wingers but bought a third. Then a third left-back who can at least cover as a defensive midfielder, then buy Onana and possibly Gana to go with Allan.

I suppose we could offer Sunderland (or Wigan) Rondon as a replacement for the return of the loaned player. As somebody has said, Lampard sees them at training so might think they are not ready but is not starting Rondon, albeit this one game, something he has also seen at training.

It does raise the question of Richarlison being sold just to balance the books before their late July submission and how we do the same if necessary next year given we must have spent, or promised, all the Richarlison money and still need to acquire a striker.

Tierry Henry was an ineffectual winger at Juve. Drogba was from an African country, I think, Papua New Guinea. Big world out there if we have a scouting system worthy of the name.

Just saying it can be done. Instead of Thelwell getting Onana for over 㿊 million, get him when he's ٤ million. It's called having vision, being savvy.

Hope it's third time lucky with this DoF Soon find out.

I personally think he will also give a penalty for the one he turned down on Holgate yesterday, because these referees are just as inconsistent as the players they officiate.

I shouldn't give Ings credit for scoring against Everton, but he was full of aggression and he was very honest, and that's why I personally think the ref would have given him a penalty if he hadn't scored.

I'm not sure Gordon put the ball in the net, Danny, it looked like an own-goal to me, and yes, I think Coady has been a central midfield player in his younger days.

If there is any truth in the rumours about Gordon, how many would be happy to see him leave, if Newcastle offered Everton 㿔 million for him?

I've seen his stated a few times now. A year ago, I recall Richarlison wanted out but was persuaded to stay for one more year... bringing us to Summer 2022, when he was fully expected to leave – because he wanted out.

Yes, the influx of cash was I'm sure very welcome for the bottom line, and no question it helped with the accounting to get it done in the 2021-22 financial year.

But "just to balance the books"? No, I don't think so.

Morning, blue boys... great to be back in the loop. Not.

They are being signed by other clubs and I see Forest, our next opponents, have signed a couple of good players just in time to oppose us, par for the course!

Injuries are again doing us no favours, we are not blessed with much luck, are we?

Did you see those clowns on MotD, Lineker is paid ٟM a year, Shearer 𧺬k and laughing boy 𧶲k all they could do was poke fun at Onana's name and titter like kids. Talk about overpaid, no wonder they're always laughing.

Decades and we rarely get the striker we need, and in recent times have never got close to replacing Lukaku.

So we have midfielders who are afraid to take ownership in the box, when chances arise and so, scoring goals has become a major challenge for Everton.

Let's hope in this window Thelwell can unlock some genuine hope and provide a proper get-in-the-face, nuisance striker to defenders.

If not by the Forest game, in my view, Rondon must start, to make a target, try and get an end-product from Everton possession.

Lampard appears too hesitant to make changes during the game but we don't know exactly what each player's fitness level or minor injuries situation is. Lampard and his staff do.

Once we sign a mobile centre-forward and Onana is integrated into the team, we will look much better. I also think Mykolenko would be better as one of the 3 centre-backs, allowing Vinagre to play the wingback role.

With the system we seem to be playing, there will never be a starting place for Deli (unless used as a false 9) so, before we shell out the 㾶M, we should look to move him on.

Yesterday, like against Chelsea, it was a back 5, with Anthony Gordon being asked to play the role of the main striker, and, like against Chelsea, it didn't work. Anthony Gordon is a winger, still very much learning his trade, and is surrounded by players who haven't got goals in their locker.

We sold not only our best player in June but also last season's top scorer and are still no nearer bringing one in despite having signed 5 other players.

I know stats can sometimes lead you to a false conclusion but these are the stats of the midfield and attackers Lampard has left himself with:

Games Goals
Gordon 60 4
Gray 249 24
McNeil 136 7
Iwobi 185 1
Doucouré 301 35
Allan 375 12
Davies 136 6
Gomes 228 21
Alli 86 14

These are figures from 2018-2022 for Spurs plus his Everton stats.

So not rocket science to see where we are lacking and worryingly Lampard and Thelwell have brought in McNeil to play in an attacking role but he doesn't score many either. Quite interesting that he has been subbed in both games he has started, is that just change of tactics or is Lampard not happy with what he is showing?

When Gray signed and played his first 5 or 6 games I thought "How did we get him so cheap?" but his performances for the last few months of last season and the 2 games this season show why we got him so cheap. He has ability but lacks goals and disappears for long periods of the game.

Iwobi massively improved his general play but another who lacks goals and he very rarely gets in the box to shoot.

Alli is still the enigma that Levy sold us and it doesn't look like Lampard is any nearer solving that problem.

Looks like Lampard is looking to sell Allan and Gomes but the salaries they are on, they will be in no rush to leave till their contracts finish.

I thought Davies did okay when he came on but, if he was going to hold down a midfield position, he would have done it by now. All the previous managers have all given him a chance but all decided he just wasn't up to it.

Lampard said after the game he expected to bring in more players before the window closes, I just hope whoever they sign has goals in their game; otherwise, with the squad we have, it won't be enough to avoid another relegation battle, I fear.

This will be another survival season with the aim of 40-ish points and each quarter (basically every 9 games) needing to average 10 points. Two games into this quarter and zero points – oops!

In my opinion, we've brought in the same type of players as always – moderate plodders with the odd waning star. Not disastrous as long as we play “park football” as per the end of last season.

Moderate players should not “think” simplicity is the key. Play with the instincts of a kid on the rec off Rice Lane and those 40 points will arrive in double quick time.

I also believe that Gray, McNeil and Gordon are being criticised harshly, for the simple reason, their game is to look up and find the target man which we haven't got, and they're like a fish out of water. We need a striker this week.

Also, the comments saying why we didn't buy Cornet who was less money than McNeill, Burnley wanted the 㾽.5M upfront, all the deals we have done are structured over 3 o 5 years because of the FFP.

I thought Davies was a big improvement on Doucouré yesterday, so why is he getting slated and not Doucouré?

I can't agree on the 1985 point. This is a different era in football, and we have no goal scorers at the club at all.

We have a team that isn't going to score hardly any, and so when we concede we are bang in trouble. We don't just need one striker, we probably need 2 or 3 players brought in.

Most competent mediocre Premier League sides like Southampton, Villa, Palace have got 4 plus recognised forwards at the club. I am not talking big 6, I am talking teams that stay in the Premier League. We have Rondon. That's a joke, and we will be in big trouble if we are relying on an injured Calvert-Lewin and Rondon this season.

Two defeats now, and another 6 or 7 and Frank is gone. Not what I want, but it's a results-based business. And it's a business that is missing the basic tools.

All the above are better options than the winger Gordon, all of them. I despair.

Couldn't agree more. Selling the best striker without having a goalscorer lined up is total poor management.

Now desperately scouring Europe at this stage with a potential panic buy to replace an injury-prone Calvert-Lewin sums up the chaotic state of Everton sadly.

Watching them now after 67 years saddens me even more. But I still live in hope. COYB

Common sense and pragmatism (Jeez, I sound like Little Ms Dynamite). Every goal, albeit lower level, by Simms heaps more unnecessary pressure on Frank.

We need not only a goalscorer but someone who is physically capable of holding the ball and bringing others in to play. Due to FFP, we had to sell someone.

Money restrictive wise we seem to be looking at guys most of us have never heard of. Will that solve the problem? Will they be any better than Rondon? Who knows?

Finally, I hope Lampard is given time and can sort this mess out; however, if he does get the bullet, who, with the players we presently have, could do anything to improve things?

It does seem that very few managers want their players to play with instinct, or maybe it's coached out of most by the time they get into the big league?

However, I'm concerned with his approach to the game yesterday and goals were not addressed as soon as he knew Richarlison was leaving. We have all known for over 12 months. With money so tight, I'm mystified why McNeil was brought in and not Cornet. Now Dennis has also gone to Forest, although Cornet would have been the better option.

Our current strikers are a goosed Rondon and a male model with a record of injuries who can only shoot from around the 6-yard box.

If this isn't addressed in the next 2 weeks, we won't be in a relegation battle, we will be relegated.

The most used phrase in football, which goes back to the day of playing with a pig's bladder: "Goals Win Games".

Gross negligence and mismanagement has been the order of the day since we accepted self-preservation, and it's that ingrained that trying to rip it up and start again, usually ends up with another sacking.

I think you're being harsh on Iwobi's goals by missing a 5 off the end. He's scored 15 goals including 4 for us.

Should have read 15 goals for Iwobi and as you say that includes 4 for us, hardly prolific. Sadly, other than Calvert-Lewin, our most promising forward is probably Andros Townsend, and given his age, not someone you could see being a regular under Lampard.

The issue is that, as much as it's great to see the improvement in his game, it's largely in defensive work and this come at the expense of more attacking play meaning he's unlikely to add to those few goals.

Yesterday he was one of the few making space and runs while others were playing at statues.

Not only did Richarlison want to go, I thought we did a great job in getting 㿞M for him with possibly more to come, that money has enabled us to get some players in without which we really would be in a mess.

Everton have had to be clever spending that money and obviously players have had to miss that we wanted because of the way FFP works and we are still trying to bring in players that suit FFP rather than players where ready cash dictates who we get.

So we will sign a striker but whether he suits the fans is another tale and when Richarlison scores for Spurs, ToffeeWeb threads will immediately be 2 or 3 hundred posts long, even if Spurs lose!!

We're a tricky old club to manage, aren't we?

1. Don't play 3/5 at the back
2. Don't do zonal at set-pieces
3. Don't play a 2 in central midfield
4. Don't play open away
5. Don't play Gomes

All of this still stands.

The big issue, though, is our lack of goal threat. Last season, Richarlison really dug us out of trouble when Calvert-Lewin was injured. We played much of yesterday with no real goal threats on the pitch. In a 4-2-3-1 we could have Rondon, Alli and two of Gordon, Gray and McNeil. A poor striker is better than no striker.

That will ask more questions of the opposition than what we're currently doing.

I hear lots of people going on about Lampard needing time to sort the mess out (and he does) but anyone who doesn't think he already is under pressure even after two games is in cloud cuckoo land.

I want him to do well, but his tactics and sub decisions and timing are very open to debate. I don't know if the guy wasn't fit but, if he was, Onana should have been on in front of Davies for me; Rondon should have been on earlier.

If we don't beat Forest on Saturday, expect the pressure to rank up even more. After only three games, this is a must-win game for us and Lampard.

The guy McNeil had a couple of chances yesterday to let fly and didn't, for me that's a confidence issue, so I hope he scores soon.

Lampard hasn't got the luxury or time right now to experiment with formations and he needs to recognise when something isn't working and change quicker.

Yes, I know it's Thelwell's preferred model and we have the defensive players to play 3-5-2 or 5-3-2, for now 4-2-3-1 makes the most sense. Be that with Rondon up front alone, or the much anticipated new fella.

If we get Gana, then I would love to see us play 4-2-3-1 with Onana and Gana shielding the defence, McNeil and Gordon feeding balls into the box for Dele and a striker.

Rondon nearly assisted Onana to a goal in the very short time they were both on the pitch. I think he is a better player than many on here consider.

We indeed have to be realistic about our qualities, or lack of them, and play accordingly.

Toothless up front. Richarlison was no striker but had a goal in him. We're basically winging it, hoping someone can score, Calvert-Lewin has been out of form for 12 months, Rondon has never been in form, and we buy McNeil who I was excited about, but those Burnley fans were right, he offers very little so far.

Gray is another one who has shown nothing in months. Get a striker, for fuck's sake, and hopefully Frank can learn like he did towards the end of last season. Kept it simple.

I know you didn't care much for Richarlison, but to say 㿞 million was good business, when we have seen Brighton sell their left-back for 㿬 million and Leicester about to sell Forfana for 䀁 million.

Richarlison carried this club to safety and his impact on his team our supporters and the opposition were immense. I have compared Richarlison to Davie Hickson who also carried this club on his shoulders for a long time. Yes, different players but the desire to win was in both and Alan Ball had that same burning desire, don't see that from any others in this squad.

Now, if they had have got nearer 㿲 million and bought 2 strikers, then it might have been worth it, but we have brought in mainly defenders and a midfield player who doesn't score goals, so how in anybody's estimation that's a good deal is beyond me.

I can only assume the 㿞M up front was the only enticing aspect of this and got us out of the shit financially.

Frank is able to do it in a very short time in terms of bringing the fans to back the team once more and players seem to slowly bounce back from low confidence. The defending from set-pieces has improved. He can attract young players and will improve us.

He has bolstered the spine of the team and, when the new lads bed in, coupled with a striker, we will be okay.

If ever a game showed what we need and need urgently, it was this one. We were as effective as melting ice cream up front yesterday. I don't blame Frank Lampard for this but rather the continuing disarray at higher levels at the club.

Get it sorted now before we find ourselves anchored at the bottom! We might not get out this time around.

Michael Oliver and his two assistants were absolutely dire yesterday. Stopping the game because a player has cramp. It's not a head injury so play on!

There were two very clear incidents towards the end of the game whereby the Villa goalkeeper was still holding the ball outside of the penalty area prior to kicking out of his hand, both not spotted by the linesman on our side because he was too far up the pitch.

The Villa goalkeeper turning and clapping and waving to the Villa fans behind the goal after making a couple of saves. Villa players going down with “mysterious” injuries towards the end, sometimes more than one player.

Of course it's all tactics and a clear case of time wasting. These are not excuses for the defeat, but there should have been a lot more than 5 minutes added on time.

Imagine if Villa applied the same tactics against the so-called Top 6 clubs, there would certainly be a lot more than 5 minutes added on, especially if Villa were leading going into added time.

I, like most, was surprised to see Tom Davies come on instead of Onana when Doucouré limped off. Onana applied himself quite well and, with a longer run out, could have maybe imposed himself on the game a lot more.

Tom Davies did nothing, apart from getting himself booked for a reckless lash-out on a Villa player.

Anthony Gordon, sorry mate, you're not a centre-forward, and if that's where you're going to play until (hopefully) we sign a centre-forward or two, then you're better off sitting on the bench.

Rondon, although not great, should have started. He's a target man, which was sorely lacking until he came on, and if not Rondon, then Dele Alli?

Christy #365 – “I also believe that Gray, McNeil and Gordon are being criticised harshly, for the simple reason, their game is to look up and find the target man which we haven't got”

I agree with the first half of that statement but not the second half. In the 10 minutes Rondon was on, they looked for and found him about 7 times – 5 of those times, he found a teammate.

Rondon bashing is rife on here – him and Alli gave the Villa centre-halves something to think about when they came on. Too late, Frank.

You say that Richarlison was worth a lot more than 㿞M comparing the prices that other players have been sold for, the clubs selling these players stuck to a price they wanted and got it.

Which other club was in for Richarlison? Did we sell because we were desperate for the money? Possibly, but who else came in for him considering you think he was worth quite a lot more than the 㿞M we got?

I don't think Richarlison carried us at all. He helped, as did Pickford, and in certain games, so did a few more. 10 goals Richarlison scored, three penalties, in losing games, another couple at least in other losing games. He missed plenty of good chances in other games from January that should have made our fight for safety well over before we secured our place in the Premier League.

Richarlison lost the ball too easily, putting the other team on the attack as many times or more than he won it. Of course he was one of our better players, which told me how pitiful the whole squad was and only now are the changes starting to get sorted out.

Brian, I understand why you like Richarlison and I think many more will agree with your assessment of him than mine but I'm sticking with the way I saw Richarlison: Good on his day but nowhere a great player.

3 minutes was usually the standard add-on at the end of games. Yesterday in the second half there was about 7 subs, 2 goals, a drinks break, and various “injuries” yet the pillock ref only deemed it necessary to add on 2 minutes over the “normal” added time, it's bent.

Should have been 10 minutes, not 5.

I'm afraid Frank is like a rabbit caught in the headlights when it comes to selection and tactics.

Rondon is a poor striker but a better target man than Gordon.

Davies is not suited for this level. He's had long enough to prove himself and hasn't. Onana should have been on before him.

If Frank continues with his negative tactics, it would be cheaper and more efficient to hire a bus for the weekend and park it in our goal. He's as negative as Maureen and doesn't see anything wrong with himself.

Would a club start without a keeper? It's a specialist position so why do we start without a centre-forward, also a specialist position? We need to start on the front foot, even with a poor Rondon, until we can get an alternative.

False 9, no 9... Frank's taking the piss.

I've got nothing against the lad but he's worse than useless.

We do need a striker quick, but who? It's no use buying players on par with the young players we've loaned out.

Anyone answer post 501?

When I examine the Everton team, who do we have in midfield that we could name on matchday, and expect decent performances? We have no cohesion, no leaders, no dominance, no spirit, no ability, no reliability, and no determination. This is why these very average teams overrun us, home and away, week-in & week-out.

It's been repeated many times on this site: we sell Richarlison; Calvert-Lewin is injury-prone, and Rondon... well, say no more. So what does the club do? Send a forward out on loan!!! Who makes these decisions? The manager?

Our player recruitment is an absolute joke. We are a nothing team with no spine, no guts, nothing. Each season, we produce negative statistics: the current one is we've lost our first 2 games in 32 years. The season already is going from bad to worse.

I applaud those supporters who stay the course and support their team, in such awful circumstances. Personally I cannot endure watching them any longer.

I cannot wait for the Kenwright era to end. I'm convinced he still thinks Kendal and Ball are still alive. It's stuck in fucking time warp this club!

Apologies for the language, I've just had it with how this club has been run for my entire Adult life, which is several decades. If we ever do win anything again, I'll be so old the nurse will have to let me know.

He is also far from useless as he had a decent game but for some he can't do right for doing wrong.

your posts are usually worth reading, but not that one, cheers

I would bite there hand off.

I was literally screaming blue murder at the officials and Villa yesterday. Blatantly exploiting the rules. Feigning injury, using the 5 sub thing to waste time. Some would call it clever gamesmanship. Cheating in my eyes. It was frustratingly clear to see. I recall a token yellow card but that was it.

I'd much prefer a system where the clock just stops rather than this mysterious who knows how long is left approach we currently have. Every time the ball goes dead for whatever reason, stop the clock. No need for made up added on time then. But let's not give our incompetent officials too much to think about. They need to look good with their headsets and massage their inflated egos.

On Richarlison, I think if you read between the lines, we did get more than the 㿞M fee for him. I don't claim to have insider information, but I'm suspecting the 㿀M for Alli has been written off, so on the accounts, it makes it a 㿲M deal if my theory is close to being correct. Player plus cash.

Big month. 9 points up for grabs, into the next round of the League Cup and then slay Lucifer's children in a bear pit of an atmosphere as we enter September and they give me an early Birthday present.

We had a massive period of self-preservation which obviously lowered the expectations, but then we got Moshiri's money, and found out that it's not just about money, it's also about being organized from top to bottom.

This just isn't something we have had inside our club since the narrative was changed and we allowed ourselves to become plucky little Everton.

We do need at least one other striker, but we also still need midfielders, and we also definitely needed to make changes to the back four, and judging from our signings so far, this is where Lampard has decided to start first.

Also, can somebody explain how the hell this karate kick on Holgate wasn't deemed penalty worthy by the VAR!?

Karate kick on Holgate

I personnally think that there isn't any reason why we couldn't have signed one,

We had to start at the back even though I was being told (not by you!!) 2 or 3 years ago, that it wasn't a priority.

I'm excited by Onana from the very little I've seen of him and let's see what this week brings.

That we are plucky little Everton is what they've convinced a generation of Evertonians and non-Evertonians of. Not me. Not you. Not here. Never.

Sorry for getting all over-the-top, but they are never taking my soul or my belief.

Top to bottom organisation and structure with a plan. Not just throw money around in the transfer market and expect mud to stick to the wall. Look no closer than Man Utd.

This might end up taking the fee even higher, which would obviously depend on how much Newcastle want Gordon, but I think it'll take a bigger fee than 㿔 million because our manager does seem to rate Gordon very highly.

Everton's lack of goals — it's appalling.

Rondon - 1 PL Everton goal
Gray - 0 in 8 months
Gordon - 4 in 54
Alex Iwobi - 4 in 85
Dele Alli - 1 goal since 19/20
Allan, Gbamin - never scored for EFC
Doucoure - 4 in 64
Davies - 6 in 137
McNeil - 7 in 134 & none last season in 38

Ironically we need the money badly to make important additions before that window slams shut for a few months. Gibbs-White, Conor Gallagher, Broja and A N Other.

Thanks, Anthony, you will have helped us no end, more than you did on the pitch!

If the barcodes are going to table a "can't turn down" offer for Gordon and maybe Calvert-Lewin, they will probably leave it to the last week of the window. Lampard might want to keep him, but Moshiri might have other ideas.

Personally, unless he can be replaced, Gordon needs to stay – nowhere near the finished article, but he is a threat and we have too few of them!

I can never work out what people mean when they just write out a series of numbers as a formation. For instance, in your proposed 4-2-3-1 wouldn't the wrong 2 contravene your third supposed ‘golden rule'?

Surely it's the players and their qualities that make a formation / system work? It's up to the manager to tailor his tactics to his players or to make sure his players are capable of playing the way he needs them to.

Yesterday was disappointing in that I thought too many players didn't get out of second gear mentally. For both their, goals we had plenty of defensive cover and yet managed to make it easy for them to evade any sort of serious challenge. Don't concede those goals and we are fairly comfortable in that game, with a chance to get at least a point.

Tony (531), yes there must have been the opportunity to buy a striker, but has there been the opportunity to buy the right player at the right price? We aren't clear of the FFP mess by a long chalk and can't really afford too many more flops.

Until Calvert-Lewin's injury, the manager and DoF may have been prepared to start the season with Calvert-Lewin and Rondon, and use the whole of the transfer window to get their preferred choice(s). It is dead easy with hindsight to say things should have been concluded by now.

I've got nothing against the lad but he's not Premier League standard. But who knows? He could be another Iwobi – my fave Everton player right now.

Three goals in two games. what's not to give him his big chance?

McNeil has been powderpuff except in a friendly, Gray has been very disappointing since he burst onto the scene last season, so for me, Anthony Gordon must be kept at any cost. He is not a false 9 – despite Frank thinking he is a magician and can turn a poor goal scorer into a great one – but Gordon can be effective if we get a couple of goalscorers in.

Perhaps I should have omitted the word "just" but neither the player wanting away nor the need to balance the books excludes the other although the length of time left on his contract might have been a factor, we can but speculate.

Tom Davies has played for eight different managers, Gordon was making his breakthough season under Benitez and then Lampard.

But nay, nay and thrice nay, these players are shite and should be shipped out, preferably after being flogged after being tied to the statue of Dixie Dean.

Not opinions I hold or even consider. Tom may not be world class but I am yet to see him hide when playing. Seen that from plenty of other players but not him. Gordon keeps trying but is still learning and, if he can minimise his reactions to fouls, will only get better.

But never mind… keep berating our youngsters, Happy fucking days!

I think Richarlison is a lot better player than you make out, and you don't think he carried us?

In my opinion, without him, we'd have been playing Championship football this season.

4 Players out of 11 equals more than a third of the team not contributing on a matchday.

Not good enough and a massive clearout is, and was, essential to our Premier League survival.

Jesus, it's depressing supporting Everton. We are shit, and we have an inexperienced Manager who is way out of his depth.

It's pie-in-the-sky, never-neverland wishful thinking to hope he's going to do the business for us. If he can attract players of the level of Onana to the Club then fair play, but why are McNeil and Dele Alli here?

Less of that shite being brought in and more Onana's please, Frank.

Honestly, I sometimes despair.

Injuries and suspensions do occur in football!! Need three lads all vying for the main striker role – not one and a half!

Still, not to worry, look how shit Man Utd are and they have about 6 strikers!

Goals win games last time I played footy.

Footy today is overthought, over-coached and over-talked. Players, by-and-large, are thick as shit, so don't over-complicate it for the little darlings eh?

McNeil has gone missing since he said Calvert-Lewin and Davies are "looking after him" and giving him advice on clothes – that explains that then!

Ah well, hope springs eternal and all that!

I believe the reason we never signed another striker before the season started was, at the time – and you only have to read most of the comments after the end of last season – we needed to strengthen our central defense, replace a wide man for the loss of Richarlison and a creative midfielder. Tarkowski was brought in for the defense and McNeil as a winger.

Before the start of the season, the club had been mentioned to be looking for a striker but, at the time, Calvert-Lewin was fit and, at that time, the midfield was still not solved. A couple of days before the season started, Calvert-Lewin gets injured and, with Rondon suspended, during the first game, we lost 2 central defenders and that sent the alarm bells ringing.

Coady and Vinagre came in to help out in defense and midfield with Rondon being available for the next game. "Why he was not used to start the next game, you have to ask the manager". And they signed a midfielder Onana that was a surprise and looks like a good buy.

Everton had still been mentioned in most reports, that they were looking for another striker. The problem is Who will come?" How good are they? and Can we afford them with the FFP hanging over them?

We are not Man City that are able to replace with a player usually around the same standard of the player he replaces, and I don't believe we would have had as much criticism if Calvert-Lewin was fit, unless we are looking for someone who is better than him.

They don't grow on trees you know ! :-)

It would have been very soft but influencers like Bellow bringing up VAR being against us is probaly a good thing - we need all the help we can get !

And yes, Colon, McNeil is clearly a bang-average player, it's pretty obvious.

And yeh, Onana clearly looks like a potential superstar, seems to have his head screwed on as well, do you not get that impression?

Not saying that Lampard is shit, but he could become a shit manager given time, hasn't got enough experience yet.

That's our problem as soon as we get a good player they attract attention from the usual top 6 clubs, how the hell are we going to assemble a top team? After his 10 minutes on Saturday, they will be eyeing Onana already.

Lampard will know who he would like to sign but he can't force them to come here.

Correct, we are a selling club and have been since Kenwright took over. It started with Rooney and has continued since. Lukaku, Stones, Fellaini, Digne, Gueye, Lescott, Barkley, Jeffers, Rodwell, Arteta, Ferguson, etc..

If Onana proves to be good, I'll give him two seasons with us tops..

I agree with you about the players but think Lampard needs longer before he is judged, as all managers do. He inherited a complete shambles and the worst squad I have seen in over 60 years supporting EFC.

Well you could be right with your opinion of Richarlison, I think he is overrated by many Evertonians and I definitely didn't think he carried us last season or any other season.

Everton have had some great players since I started watching them and the only player I believed who truly carried us was Bobby Collins when he came from Celtic. Everton were in a terrible state and Bobby installed his will to win and professionalism on everyone around him. He dragged that team gradually from the depths to a team ready to become Champions.

The team got better with players like Vernon, Gabriel, Labone coming through the ranks and another player you might have heard of, his first name was Tommy. He was only here for a year but his memory never fades.

I doubt if Richarlison will bother my memory when I recall outstanding footballers who played for the Blues. We all have different opinions of players and I'm happy to stick with mine – that's all they are, opinions. They do start quite a few debates though!!

He was full of endeavor, but I genuinely couldn't make my mind up on how good I think he could be, and now he's playing with better players, I think it's something that we will now find out?

I think he carried us to victory against Chelsea, and along with Pickford's save that day, this will live long in my memory, because of the iconic picture, whilst he was holding that blue flare🙏

Just as it was the previous manager, and the one before him, and the one before him, and etc etc
Do some of you not see? In 9 years, we've had 6 managers and seemingly they're all shit!

This age of wanting everything now instantly is really beginning to piss me off, as is the attitude and outlook of some of the whingers on here. Give Lampard at least a season, for fuck's sake... Or shall we just opt for lucky number seven?

I believe Richi was a sitting duck to be made an example of, because we are seen as a soft touch for meeting out so-called punishments which the top 6 clubs etc would have received a slap on the wrist.
I still think Richi's intention was to throw the flare into the corner pitch side, however, only one person can answer that.

Clive 558

I would like to disagree with you over us being a selling club, but your examples speak for themselves.

I can't see Lampard and Thelwell agreeing to sell Gordon, however, BK may have other ideas, hopefully not.

Although early days, with the exception of signing a striker, Lampard must be given time to mould a squad, all this nonsense about sacking him is far too shortsighted, after the merry go round of managers since Moshiri arrived.

Lampard and Thelwell won't sign a striker for the sake of it, if the said striker is not what they are looking for. Hopefully said striker may be signed asap.

Lampard needs 2 years to get some continuity and try to get the players he's happy with, playing the ways he wants.

It's then still down to the players to play well and get the desired results, it's all easier said than done.

The last 30 years have proved that, you can also add that the Premier League has become much more difficult to achieve success in recent times.

Me, all I saw was a lad who gave 100% every time he pulled the shirt on. Limited maybe, skilful maybe, but his workrate was never found wanting.

Yes, he missed chances but he scored a few as well.

I'll tell you this: if we don't get 2 strikers in by the end of the window, we'll rue the day we let him go.

I think Frank Lampard feels exactly the same way about our fans, so let's give the man some time. If he does fail, I'm sure it won't be for the want of trying, and this is very important imho!

Agree completely, it's about opinions and completely agree re Collins, love the Witt about'Tommy'.

Iwobi and Gordon as wingers, Ali and Rondon in the middle.

Problem is Thelwell wouldn't be happy.

When I saw it was Michael Oliver refereeing the game yesterday, I just knew we would lose. No action about the arm in Gordon's face – no action on the karate kick on Holgate; etc. Memories of last season.

And now that West Ham have joined Man Utd below Everton at the bottom of the League – well that will never do – and pressure is sure to go on us once more.

Maybe he hit his chin on the ground when he fell, that's why he was holding it!

Cut it out for fuck sake.

There are probably some who have a bit of a personal grudge against us because of what some player, club official or fan said to them at some time, but nothing that amounts to a conspiracy against us.
If they were out to get us, we'd be sunk by now for some dubious reason. Or do you think we are on a bit of a list and they just haven't got to our turn yet?

I'm curious; how exactly did Michael Oliver make our defence so porous when it was a three-on-five and then a two-on-four (well, six and five if you include our goalie with the outfield players) for their goals?

Because that is the reason we lost this game, not either of those challenges you mentioned.

Or equally ‘clearly' that we haven't (yet) found one we really fancy in our price range?

No doubt dwindling time will eventually push us into making a choice of which ‘not really what we feel comfortable gambling this amount of money on' gets the golden handshake.

Colin #573

I agree. Lampard doesn't seem to learn from his mistakes, particularly his obsession with a midfield two.

Every one at the game expected changes at half time but there weren't any and Villa continued to dominate midfield and their centre backs were allowed to cruise through the game.

Frank's substitutions are often too few and far too late.

However limited Rondon is he provides a focal point up front and occupies defenders. When he was finally introduced we, at last, started playing with some purpose.

I feel for McNeil, his role is to find the striker... we didn't have any outlet. Agree with the shouts of playing Broadhead or Simms until we get someone in. Rondon is wasting everyone's time, if he would have ran instead of jogging, he'd have had a tap-in.

Being a big Evertonian from the North-East, I have never understood why fans tend to jump on the local lads. The abuse Tom Davies gets online is so unjust, I just don't get it. I thought he came on and did a very good job.

Iwobi was the best player on the pitch... again he needs to stay in that role.

Lee (583), I know it is all about opinion and you may be deliberately using some hyperbole, but there is no way you can link Anthony Gordon's performance in that game to how we conceded either of the 2 goals, which is the actual reason we lost.

No -one is saying Anthony Gordon is our only (or even best) option through the middle but he is not responsible for all that went wrong for us in that game.

The manager sees more of the player's than we do. I don't think you can easily break loan deals these days so we just have to accept that Broadhead and Simms are not options for our teamsheet for the duration of their loans.

I think they went out before Calvert-Lewin's injury. What none of us know is how realistic are (were) the plans for bringing in alternatives, and we actually need to wait until the transfer window has actually closed before we can draw a conclusion.

As for the local lads... I think it works both ways. Some people give them a harder time, some seem highlight anything positive. Overall, I think there is just more interest in and scrutiny of their performance, which is natural.

I think any realistic assessment of Tom Davies would find that he really hasn't developed much in the last 2 to 3 seasons, and unfortunately the club can't be run forever waiting on what ‘might' develop.

I do think Anthony Gordon is getting too much stick for his performances thus far this season, but I can also understand how aggravating his theatrics are to some. Physically he is still rapidly developing which is a big plus for him.

Tom Davies's literal weakness was all too evident in one passage of play yesterday when the ball came to him 30 to 40 yards out as they scrambled the ball clear from one of our corners. The ball was not travelling quickly and he had multiple options to maintain the attack, and yet he contrived to merely aimlessly spoon the ball up into the air towards possibly the one area around their box where we had no-one to even compete for the ball.

They easily thumped the ball clear and then Tom was in a race to get back to the ball to deal with it. Despite having anticipated the treatment his gentle lob would receive and thus having a healthy head start, by the time he actually got to the ball in our half, he had been closed down and was then far too easily ‘bullied' off the ball.

It just has to be acknowledged that Tom has lost his mojo and his current physicality just isn't enough for him to be effective at this level. He was initially a welcome spark and remains a trier but, for me, he is dangerously close to being (fairly) written-off as just another ‘nearly' player who needs to be superseded by better.

Iwobi was class once again, and the central defense looks way more solid and confident. Patterson looks like he may become a gem. Onana looks like he can be a real handful. Dwight McNeil will prove to be a very good signing, and writing him off now is utterly ridiculous.

On the negative side, we do need a striker (or two) and maybe another midfielder. Gray for me, has shown very little since the opening few weeks of last season. I would bench him and play Deli. I don't see how that could be worse. Deli has more physical strength and will keep the ball better.

Guys, it's just two games! I think Lampard and the team will come good once we make a couple more signings and players bed in.

Iwobi was class once again, and the central defense looks way more solid and confident. Patterson looks like he may become a gem. Onana looks like he can be a real handful. Dwight McNeil will prove to be a very good signing, and writing him off now is utterly ridiculous.

On the negative side, we do need a striker (or two) and maybe another midfielder. Gray for me, has shown very little since the opening few weeks of last season. I would bench him and play Deli. I don't see how that could be worse. Deli has more physical strength and will keep the ball better.

Guys, it's just two games! I think Lampard and the team will come good once we make a couple more signings and players bed in.

Agree it wasn't Gordon's doing at all for the 2 goals conceded and I actually thought he did a commendable job. I meant without a recognised striker we lacked any proper chance of getting in the game, whilst removing Gordon from a position where he can cause more of a threat.

I know it's too late to break the loans, it's a shame they weren't at least given a chance with current options.

Agree Tom has weakness that are clear to see but it's not all bad and I see a good squad player, but even if that's not the case and he isn't good enough it appears to be the popular thing for people online to get on his back. Isn't going to help the guys confindence and the local lads tend to get a rougher ride, but thanks for your insight on it.

You can start making plans to visit Goodison before she closes her doors for the final time, in hopefully, about 21 months! Jeez, only 21 months and 37 league games. 👍👍👍

Hopefully, like a lot of ‘families' we can have our little disagreements without it driving us apart. :)
I agree with you that any criticism ‘our boys' should be kept as moderate as possible, based on the general assumption that they are desperate to do a good job unless there is clear evidence otherwise. There should never be anything truly insulting.

Yes, Tom's confidence is obviously low and perhaps he hears / is aware of the criticism, which won't help. I would never be the one standing there hurling abuse at him – and I hope what I write is not at the hysterical level as well – but, unfortunately, I think the best (only?) way for him to stop it is for him to somehow start producing top level performances on a fairly regular basis.

That is not necessarily just down to him. It is possible the squad may develop in a fashion that gives him a perfect ‘Tom-shaped' niche to showcase his abilities. If that does happen I think you would find the vast majority of us would be ecstatic to see Tom seize the opportunity.

What is slightly frustrating to me is that the two additions we have needed since last season and all over summer have not been sorted – a proper defensive midfielder and a striker who scores goals. Until that happens, we will continue to get done on transitions and have trouble whenever Calvert-Lewin is out.

Lampard must get these players in – especially the defensive midfielder role. It is too specialised and disciplined a position to ask a midfielder who doesn't usually do it to stand in effectively. Look at how much of a difference Delph made last season when fit and playing there.

I know we are trying to sign Gueye for this but it's time to wrap that deal up or get someone else in. We can't give away our first 3 or 4 games while we wait.