The Mail Bag
Has he signed yet?
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In light of yet another inept performance, I have come to the conclusion (at last) that if DM can't motivate the current crop of players he should be shown the door. Two up and to capitulate in such circumstances was bloody pitiful. I'm ready for a change... anyone else?
Eddy Grundy, Posted 05/10/2008 at 17:57:30
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How anyone cannot see positives from this game is beyond me, we played well (specially in first half), the game was a nice open one, we finished aggressively. It was a stupendous performance, but surely there were positives. How does slagging help?
it?s getting to the point where, if Moyes doesn?t go, many others will!
POSITIVES!!! In this context, having 11 fit (?) players on the pitch for 90 minutes is about the only positive there is. We had one shot on target in the ?dramatic? second half, when with Newcastle sensing some joy plastered Everton - who were supposed to be cruising - hahahaha.
If this is what he can acheive on only £35k a week, imagine what heights he can take us too when fully recompensed & focused on £70k a week. At least our superb chairmen has got that covered & I?m sure he?ll be signing shortly.
I can?t fathom those who think our current form will see our super talented squad struggling against relegation. Today was a valuable point in our push for 4th spot against a massive team with big aspirations themselves. Remember what KK said they want to be where we are.
THANKS Ken & Moyesey for all your hard work in the summer to get us where we are now.
SHIT, I feel all light headed, what am I writing??? I think Doddy must have put something in my Chang!!!
People are so keen to attribute what has been a fairly poor start to the season to problems behind the scenes. Yes, that?s right, Kenwright is to blame for the loss to Blackburn, he and Moyes should take all the blame for the Derby defeat and don?t get me started on Liege, yadda yadda yadda.
It?s really doing my head in, people who have a slightest understanding of the game of football can see it?s the players who aren?t pulling their respective fingers out!
Blackburn, Lescott playing offside.
Derby, players collectively lacking any passion whatsoever to win the game despite doing well up until half time then capitulating!
Liege, yet more poor defending, game lost in the first leg due to lack of concentration.
Newcastle, players not doing enough collectively to retain possession, harry the opposition, command penalty area - If Yakubu had of held the bloomin? ball up instead of poncing around then their first wouldn?t have happened, and their second may not have come meaning confidence taken from first half into second half instead of reverting to type ie trying to do an impression of an assured team in possession then cheapily losing the ball with aimless long passes!
Exactly what does Kenwright have to do with Lescott, Jagielka, Howard, Hibbert, Neville, Yobo and Baines all belting the ball upfront and losing it? Absolutely nothing!
I?m annoyed at the players more than anything, end of the day THEY and only THEY play the football! And that?s what gets points, wins cups etc.
The defence has become a disaster zone. Howard doesn?t come for the ball, and Hibbert loses his man, so Newcastle scored a goal almost the copy of Liege?s. If this isn?t fixed very soon, we will be fighting relegation.
You wanna bet on that?
1. Joe Kinnear matching David Moyes?s ability.
2. Nicky Butt matched Fellaini.
Makes you think which club is in crisis.
It may be closer than you think.
I really worry where our next points are coming from!
With the exception of Wenger and Ferguson in the modern game, long dynasties don't exist as things go stale....
Why would Moyes's pay affect his performance? You suggest that if he can do this on £35k a week just imagine what he can do on £70k a week, which begs the question: Is he only giving it 50% now?
This guy has missed golden opportunities to win matches for us this season, but seems to be above blame.
He?s cost us far more than 2 points today.
Further, how do you intend to give him a contract, a pay-as-the game type or a 1-year extension? Again, is that just reward, for a person who has taken a sinking ship, stabilized it, done some neat achievements and (though we are struggling now) overall has done a good job...
Titanic.
I?m dumbfounded that we are about to reward failure with a double your money deal.
Varun - I?d let his contract run down & review it in January & the summer. Why give him a £17 million deal when his body language says he?s given up. Also why saddle any new owner with a potential massive pay off, if he doesn?t improve and turn things round.
Second half she sat dejectedly as I hurled abuse at that shower of shite. Her final words?
"But we used to be good last season..."
Walking back to the car, some drunk mag shouted: "Two nil, and you fucked it up."
I gritted my teeth and had to agree really. In terms of form, they are the worst team in the league and we managed to chuck a two goal lead away to them.
Get your head out the sand, Varun. Time for a change.
- Felliani will definitely come good, he links well and I thought his goal today was excellent - went in where it hurts.
- Lescott and Jags will form a good partnership
- Pinnear another game to get fit , and also looking good in 1st half
- Baines contributed so much
The negatives
- Arteta’s contribution as player and captain
- we once again lost the ball in our own half (Yak today , Arteta in Derby) and within 5 secs we’ve conceded, with a defender ball watching (Hibbert today , Yobo in Derby) basic errors
- confidence is at all time low , and today wont have helped.
http://www.hbo.com/rome/cast/character/lucius_vorenus.html
If we give him the contract he is after, it will make us even more unattractive to any prospective buyer as to fuck him off will cost a fortune. GET RID NOW!
Man City this season. How things change so quickly. I think Yakubu needs dropping, he’s not a team player and doesn’t work anywhere near hard enough and when he gives the ball away he just stands still and shrugs his shoulders (like for newcastle’s first goal). I would have liked to see someone more enthusiastic, who would give 100% effort to the cause and put Newcastle under pressure brought on earlier with a good 30/20 minutes to go like James Vaughan. Yakubu thinks he’s untouchable, so lets’ see someone else get a chance at his expense for his pathetic and larthargic performances.
Looking at the next two fixtures against Arsenal and Man United, it's looking very bleak. I am worried at the mo and it this continues, then it's going to be a relegation battle this season. I do think Baines, Jags, Pienaar, Osman, Fellaini had decent games. I was please he scored today.
I'm telling you for sure, if Carsley was here, we would not have these frailties in our defence or forward line. If Felliani is worth £15 mill, Carsley is worth £20 mill.
We've got to get this position sorted very soon and that means dropping Fellaini.
We were clueless today and I thought we badly missed Neville.
And also Carsley had years of experience behind him; Fellaini is only 20 and when you come into a struggling team at that age, it's going to be hard work, believe me ? especially when you make the most elementary schoolboy mistakes that we do.
It was the same for Rodwell. He is a young lad who was expected to come into a team that had been ravaged through the sales of too many key players, to make a big difference, and the fact is he looked completely out of his depth positionally against Portsmouth and Blackburn.
Our manager should not have let so many key players leave the club during the summer without having the slightest inkling of what he was going to go with for this season and as a result we look a disjointed, inept and immobile team.
I could pick out individuals that have been here for years such as Tony Hibbert being our worst right back in recent memory for the amount of times he is caught ball watching or the amount of times in his seven years in our team that he gets out-jumped on that back post by the opposing man, and that's not getting started on his ability to put the ball out of play every game from a pass/cross when under no pressure from anyone.I could say our goalkeeper is having his worst spell since he joined the club and that is not helping matters at all. I could say that Lescott has struggled woefully from third season syndrome rather than second...
I could say we should never have sold Andy Johnson because only now are we realising and seeing that we can no longer thump the ball into no-man's-land near the corner flag for AJ to chase the usual lost cause. We don't have that kind of pace anymore.
I could say why, in Moyes's 6½ years have we never had any genuine wide players for either the right or the left midfield, the ones he has signed have never been up to the task, such as Simon Davies, but he has never corrected that problem, which is why we are left with the likes of Anichebe stuck out there ? or Cahill on Thursday.
Moyes has to take a fair whack of the blame for all that has gone wrong over the summer. I for one am really staring to lose faith and I wont even bother listening to the Arsenal game as I am well used to the fact now that Everton do not spring a surprise and win that calibre of match and it's exactly the type of game we havent won for a decade, no win at a top four club since 1999.
Come the Fulham game, it will be a six-pointer at Goodison and we may as well get used to the idea of it. Ignoring the fact that a relegation battle is on the horizon is just plain stupid. Maybe Ipswich fans called George Burley the messiah too. After all, he got Ipswich fifth just nine months after getting them promoted on an even smaller budget than David Moyes.
Just food for thought...
Only time will tell, but up to now he ain't good enough.
Yes Newcastle were poor but Yak was piss poor in giving the ball away and Howard should have collected the cross for the first goal. That transformed what up until then was a very good first half performance.
For some reason, individual mistakes are completely fucking up our season. We desperately need something from the next 2 games. Unfortunately I can?t see it happening. Can anyone else? Getting very worried.
I can see the benefit in continuation with Moyes but what sort of chairman offers a manager a double your money contract for 5 years when your club is in the relegation zone? Madness!
With Cahill out we’re forced to play 442 which none of these players is really used to - Fellaini is a decent player, he’s only 20 though and struggling for all the reasons Tony mentions - having a pop at him is nonsense.
Passionless? I dont agree, lacking confidence? Definately.
I am an Evertonian and I think that although we are having bad period it's not appropriate after 7 games to be calling for the manager's head and fans predicting that we are going to be bottom of the table are simply deluded so I am willing to bet against that we will be bottom of the table anytime this season.
English is not my mother language so maybe I so if there was a misunderstanding I apologise about that.
Arsenal and Utd next.
We are scoring lots but conceeding more, it wouldn?t surprise me if we had more goals at this stage than last season... in fact..... just checked, we have one goal more than last year after seven games, we are attacking but can?t keep a clean sheet.
If Yak could stay on his feet (he is worse than Hesky at the moment) maybe we wouldn?t have conceded just before half-time. Let?s not forget he lost the ball on 20 yards for the defeat at Anfield, it doesn?t help the defence if the midfield and forwards give the ball away so easily in their own half.
Tony, if Fellaini is a box-to-box player, who was our holding player today? Watch out, Gerrard and Lampard...
It was Cahill that equalised at Stamford Bridge and not the Yak. And who was to blame for the goals? Goal 1 ? Yak for losing possession with his half-arsed flick so our defence were caught napping... Goal 2 ? Saha for not passing the ball when he had the chance then tried to take on 2 players and, alas, we lose possession once again & what happens then? Our defence caught napping again. Poor decision-making from so-called pros cost us in the end, not Moyes.
Did you see this, boys?
Manny wasn?t good enough for Davey, and that?s good enough for me, for Davey is an honourable man .....
We haven't got a single ball winner.
Fellaini for all his ability is not a good tackler.
It?s coming to something when Leon Osman is the only MF player able to put a challenge in.
And why oh why did we let Fernandes go as well as Lee Carsley?
FFS I?d even have Nicky Butt at the moment.
Surely they are thinking, "Well, if he has no commitment, why should I?"I
If any one player has lost form it is Joleon Lescott. Hard to know what is happening there. And we don?t seem to have any pace any more.
Fellaini is not defensive, he is box to box. He was in the box yesterday and scored a goal, pretty much the same as what Cahill does in a match, Cahill does little in the way of creation or doesnt offer pace but he arrives in the box late and scores goals. I'm not for one minute suggesting Fellaini will get the goals Cahill has got but to say he is shit and cant play the Carsley role is ignorant.
As far as I can see Castillo was brought in to play that holding midfield role and with his international experience you would think he would be given more games, I certainly found it weird when Moyes picked a full back ( Neville) to play there ahead of him on Thursday.
The point I am trying to make is, after 6½ years in charge, Moyes still hasn't got the look or shape of the team anywhere near right; we play half-decent football for the quarter of a match then, like yesterday, when we are dragged level, we have no other answers other than to revert to long-ball-type.
Give Newcastle their due, at least even at 2-2 they were knocking it around on the floor and two players I wouldn't mind from them is N?Zogbia and Duff.
As I said under Moyes we have never corrected our wide position area by bringing in men who can go past a full back, even Pienaar is not that type of player who is going to go past one or two players, Pienaar's main strengths are his deftness of touch, likewise Arteta, likewise Osman... there is nobody there to get behind a defence and I am sorry but David Moyes is the manager, Everton have currently the sixth most expensively assembled squad in the Premier League so he cannot keep blaming money, and he has failed to rectify too many glaring problems in my opinion.
Thought Anchibe shoudl have been on earlier.
Man City were 2 up on Liverpool and lost the game - albeit they were reduced to 10 men but if they couldn’t win at home when 2 - 0 up with their stars [ Robinho etc] then perhaps we didn’t do too badly. I thought Newcastle played much better than expected - perhaps they are fed up with being slagged off as well.
I got the impression he was auditioning for Bill?s new musical ?Can?t Smile? based on the Barry Manilow song ? all eye contact and deliberate voice control. It was, for me, a sham, set up purely for the media. If his acting is as good as his managerial skills I hope he doesn?t sign up... 5 more years of this shit will be the end of the club!!
I hope you can come back before that first game in November and tell me I was wrong but you have no chance it just wont happen, Arsenal, Utd and Bolton away, how many points are you expecting from those games?
This opinion is not based on what’s happened just this season but observation of virtually every home game under Moyes management. I’m not saying we haven’t had some good ones and I’m not saying Moyes has achieved nothing. I am saying he has demonstrated that he has been at limit of his managerial abilities for far too long. We need somebody better.
Get a grip you’re starting to sound like the RS fans we laugh at on the phone in’s!
Please don’t compare Screech with Frank Lampard. He isn’t a Carsley you’re right but he sure as hell isn’t a Lampard. I am not sure what he is in fact since he can’t jump for headers, pass more than 6 feet, pass forward at all or tackle.
Teams are just walking through our midfield.
Someone like Scott Parker who could sweep up and then give it to the likes of Arteta and Pienaar but at the moment we have to wait till one of our defenders win the ball to get posssesion, and then its hoofball.
Calling for it after six and a half years of winning fuck all and playing piss poor football, however, is extremely patient.
Get the contract off the table fast and tell Moyes to fuck off and take his dithering in the transfer market, his hoofball and his fear of any half-decent team with him.
I think that if the club had stated early in the summer that we wouldn't in real terms be spending any money, that after initial disappointment we would have pulled together. All I got from Moyes's interview yesterday is that he is just going through the motions and wonder if we would be better off parting company.
He is a good manager but something tells me he's lost that desire he once had in abundance. If that's the case let him move on and maybe club and manager will rekindle some passion. But then again, this is Everton and we can't believe anything until we see it with our own eyes. I may have him totally wrong and that's the problem at our club. Who the fuck would know? Bullshit, Bullshit, and more fucking Bullshit...
Now I was never Moyes?s biggest fan (especially his tactics) but to blame him for yestersday's shite is fucking madness. He sent out a good side (on paper) to do a job...... they did, and went 2 goals up. And then the SAME team fall apart....and you fucking blame Moyes????
I?m sick of this shite of protecting the players all the time, it?s become a joke. I?ve heard all the excuses now for the players who play for us..... Oh he?s carrying an injury... Oh he?s been played out of position..... Oh he?s not getting the service.... Oh he needs more games under his belt.... Oh Moyes hasn?t signed his contract..... Oh it was very fucking cold yesterday....
Come on, lads, get fucking real. We have a team of average players (because that?s all we can afford) and half of them couldn?t give a fuck, simple as. I suppose yesterday was Moyes's fault because he had Neville sitting in the stand.... FFS. Also, I just can?t believe this Carsley thing. Last year, both he and Neville were the most slagged of players week-in, week-out.... he has no pace.... he has no vision.... he can?t pass the ball 2 yards.... he?s too fucking old..... Now this year we?re shite cause he was sold??????
I give up! Look closer guys...it?s the players...THE PLAYERS!!!!!!!
"What a spineless bunch of backstabbers you are."
Is that the best you can do?
All that money from the Rooney deal and look at the season we came up with in 2005-06. One goal scored by the end of October, out of three cup competitions at the first time of asking, and losing games 4-0 to Bolton, West Brom and Aston Villa. As soon as Moyes has money to spend, he still can't get it right.
A good manager at a club that doesn't have expectations in my opinion.
Step forward STEVE ROUND.
It’s obvious whatever he’s bringing to the table should be sent back to the chef because it’s not cooked properly.
I?m fed up of listening to people defending him on here, "it?s not Moyes? fault, it?s the players fault", what sort of argument is that? Who buys the players, chooses the team, tells them the tactics and is paid a fortune to motivate them and get them prepared?
Also the amount of times Moyes throws players in who aren?t match fit is astonishing and does anyone know why he does it? I do, it?s because he hasn?t signed enough players as back up for when players are injured and it?s costing us goals e.g. Tony Hibbert against Standard Liege and his marking for both the goals against Newcastle!
Don?t get me wrong some of the players need a kick up the backside, especially Yakubu because unlike the rest of the team he doesn?t play with any passion or commitment whatsoever, he is one of the laziest players I have ever seen!
But one thing I will say is that I don?t believe Moyes can be blamed for the way the defense is performing. He has dropped Yobo who was probably the most error prone, he is playing Hibbert due to injuries to Neville and Jacobsen, he is playing Baines which is what everyone was calling out for. Fact of the matter is, Yakubu gave the ball away yesterday when the defense were on their way out and Geremi cleverly put the ball to our weakest area, right back.. GOAL!!
Given the fragile nature of our defenders this season, it was the worst possible thing that could have happened.
I fail to see how the blame lies with DM or BK.
Eddie O'Neill is right, its the players.
Talking about good investments, when is Andy van der Meyde, the forgotten man of this Premier League chasing side, going to be fit for contention? We might need him soon. How long has it been.... 3 years on full pay.... can anyone remember what he looks like? Wish I had a job like his! Then again, I think I?m too good for this lot... hehe!!
They need more than a kick in the arse mate. It?s the same all over football today... not just Everton.... the players get too much protection. The likes of Sky et all make excuses for these players all the time.... Andy Gray is typical... Player misses open goal... Gray says, "Oh I think there was a bobble on the pitch there" ? give me a fucking break will ya!
"Players who were reliable for us last season have suddenly become unreliable".
That just about sums it up for me. At the back there?s no real changes DM can make as we?ve got limited personnel. Centre back has got to be from Lescott, Yobo, Jags (maybe Rodwell), right back from Neville and Hibbert (Jacobsen when fit), and left back from Baines, Valente and Lescott. Various permeatations of those players have been tried this year with the same result...... goals leaked.
Undoubtedly there is ongoing training to try and rectify this (Moyes etc doing their jobs) but ultimately the players need to shape up.
If we?d have conceded one goal less in every game, which should have been highly possible, we wouldn?t be having this discussion.
Not the problems with the whole club, is Kenwright coaching the defence? Nope. So how is it his fault?
Did we have one of the better defences in the league last year? Yes
So how is it the players fault?
Maybe you should learn to read before you have a kneejerk reaction to replying to posts.


A POINT! We got our first home points of the league campaign... and it's only October! Wooohooo!!!