The Mail Bag
Fickle
Comments (35)
Fickle: Not constant or loyal in affections. This is something that us fans are constantly being accused of. Once things go wrong for your club of choice, you desert the club in droves. No loyalty, they say, no heart, no love for the club.
Well, I beg to differ. To me, I will always have a strong emotional tie to Everton. Whether or not I show a physical interest in the club simply depends on which particular set of emotions is to the fore.
Over the last five months since the end of last season I have experienced elation, joy, despair, anger, bitterness, hope, depression, petulance and incredulence.
And yet, despite having such extremes, all it takes for me to swing from a deep depression to pure joy is 45 minutes of football like we experienced against United on Saturday. Months of torture, catastrophe after catastrophe, both on and off the pitch, and suddenly I am full of happiness again.
Being a fan has nothing to do with being fickle, not a jot. It is simply a love affair in all it's crazy glory!
Kieran Fitzgerald, Posted 30/10/2008 at 18:44:52
Comments
Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer
Michael Kenrick
Well said, Kieran. "Fickle" is one of the words I'm thinking of banning... along with "perspective", "reality check", "short memories" and "let's get real"... along with Richard Dodd for good measure!
The ’fickle’ nature could be in reference to peoples view on the squad’s abilities rather than their support for the team and this in itself you proved by saying all you need is 45 minutes. Also given that ’fickle’ is normally followed by the word ’fans’ or ’supporters’ then this is one constant that would point towards my preceeding view being correct... but what the hell do I know? I had an F for English in GCSE.
Michael, I would ban people from making a point then following this up with End of.
I.e. Moyes has got to go. End of.
Kind of thing you expect someone who of self righteous virtue to say before he gets up to order his 5th Stella.
Michael, I would ban people from making a point then following this up with End of.
I.e. Moyes has got to go. End of.
Kind of thing you expect someone who of self righteous virtue to say before he gets up to order his 5th Stella.
When have you felt elation?
I was pleased with our comeback against Man U but working in Salford all I’ve has all week is "bloody hell, anyone would have thought your lot had won the cup final."
So far this season we’ve played well for 45 minutes (in fact that was only about 40 minutes). Moyes still has a lot to do to get me to restore any faith in him. It seems the team and him are far more fickle in their Jekyll and Hyde displays.
I was pleased with our comeback against Man U but working in Salford all I’ve has all week is "bloody hell, anyone would have thought your lot had won the cup final."
So far this season we’ve played well for 45 minutes (in fact that was only about 40 minutes). Moyes still has a lot to do to get me to restore any faith in him. It seems the team and him are far more fickle in their Jekyll and Hyde displays.
Please, please also ban people from saying something like the following:
"Do you remember the Walter Smith days? Look how far David Moyes has taken us since then."
Frankly I’m sick of that type of argument, as it isn’t really an argument at all.
"Do you remember the Walter Smith days? Look how far David Moyes has taken us since then."
Frankly I’m sick of that type of argument, as it isn’t really an argument at all.
Whether I show a physical interest in the team depends how I feel.
Inevitably if they are playing well you will feel good about being an Evertonian and therefore go and support the team, if we are playing shite you will feel the opposite and not go and support the team. That my friend is Fickle.
I?m not calling into question how much you care about EFC because we have all done the same thing at some point and could all be accused of being fickle on occassions.
I feel that our fans including me can be very fickle at times.
Inevitably if they are playing well you will feel good about being an Evertonian and therefore go and support the team, if we are playing shite you will feel the opposite and not go and support the team. That my friend is Fickle.
I?m not calling into question how much you care about EFC because we have all done the same thing at some point and could all be accused of being fickle on occassions.
I feel that our fans including me can be very fickle at times.
John Cats, absolutely spot on.
Michael please don?t ban fickle. It?s a nice word and it?s DM?s fault that it must be used.
Michael please don?t ban fickle. It?s a nice word and it?s DM?s fault that it must be used.
Are you going to ban Richard Dodd the words ’Richard Dodd’ ?
Both suits me.
Both suits me.
What is Richard Dodd’s crime, may I ask? Is it that he supports the people running the club he supports?
God Forbid.
God Forbid.
John Cats I completely disagree. We were shit a long time before Walter Smith. In fact before Moyes took over we endured over a decade of shitness. Countless managers came and went but with the constraints of being Everton manager none were able to overcome our shitness. Moyes is the only of these managers who has succeeded in making us not shit ? with the exception of Joe Royle, however you?d have to admit that the longevity of his making us not shit was limited, compared to Moyes.
Let?s get real,too many Evertonians have very short memories. They?ve forgotten the dark days of Walter Smith and refuse to recognise how far we?ve come under Davey Moyes. Fickle in the extreme, they only see things from their own very limited perspective and most are seriously in need of a reality check.
That should do for Doddy!
That should do for Doddy!
Interesting Michael that all the words you wish to ban are the ones used by posters who are defending the Manager/Team/Board.
What about the continual use of the words coward.....spineless.....shitehouse....inept.....clueless?
You obviously have your views on Moyes etc but when you start dictating how we speak about them then you are on a slippery slope.
As Mark says, what is Dood’s crime? He is over the top optimistic, whereas Marsh is over the top pessimistic but he is in no danger of the same fate that awaits Doddy if he persists in being upbeat about Everton.
Totally agree with the "End of" issue though, reminds me of Koppites.
What about the continual use of the words coward.....spineless.....shitehouse....inept.....clueless?
You obviously have your views on Moyes etc but when you start dictating how we speak about them then you are on a slippery slope.
As Mark says, what is Dood’s crime? He is over the top optimistic, whereas Marsh is over the top pessimistic but he is in no danger of the same fate that awaits Doddy if he persists in being upbeat about Everton.
Totally agree with the "End of" issue though, reminds me of Koppites.
Walter Smith kept this club in the Premier League with zero resources. He played dour football out of necessity. At Rangers, with money to spend he built a good footballing side that included Brian Laudrup and Paul Gascoinge.
Time to stop praising Moyes by knocking Walter.
Couldn’t agree more with the original post but my indifference lately is not toward Everton but toward football in general. Man City’s purchase has shown me that our way can’t work. We can only get so far and so close before the big four (or six/seven, whatever) smell danger and buy a superstar to pull away again.
Tony Williams: I think MK was being ironic. I don’t think he really is going to go through every post and edit out the offending words. It was a joke. You know, one of those little ways of adding humour to life. The thing the separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom.
IRONY
1. the use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning: the irony of her reply, ?How nice!? when I said I had to work all weekend.
2. Literature.
a. a technique of indicating, as through character or plot development, an intention or attitude opposite to that which is actually or ostensibly stated.
b. (esp. in contemporary writing) a manner of organizing a work so as to give full expression to contradictory or complementary impulses, attitudes, etc., esp. as a means of indicating detachment from a subject, theme, or emotion.
3. Socratic irony.
4. dramatic irony.
5. an outcome of events contrary to what was, or might have been, expected.
6. the incongruity of this.
7. an objectively sardonic style of speech or writing.
8. an objectively or humorously sardonic utterance, disposition, quality, etc.
IRONY
1. the use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning: the irony of her reply, ?How nice!? when I said I had to work all weekend.
2. Literature.
a. a technique of indicating, as through character or plot development, an intention or attitude opposite to that which is actually or ostensibly stated.
b. (esp. in contemporary writing) a manner of organizing a work so as to give full expression to contradictory or complementary impulses, attitudes, etc., esp. as a means of indicating detachment from a subject, theme, or emotion.
3. Socratic irony.
4. dramatic irony.
5. an outcome of events contrary to what was, or might have been, expected.
6. the incongruity of this.
7. an objectively sardonic style of speech or writing.
8. an objectively or humorously sardonic utterance, disposition, quality, etc.
John you can try and be as condescending as much you wish but I never for once expected Michael to delete the words put in his reply. The point I was making is that again it is a slight against the "defenders" of the manager/team/board and "their" words.
Read the post again and use your dictionary or thesaurus to work out what I was getting at. (that was sarcasm, not irony on my part)
Read the post again and use your dictionary or thesaurus to work out what I was getting at. (that was sarcasm, not irony on my part)
John Cats:
Patronize:
Treat condescendingly
Seriously though, why should anything be banned on this website other than redshite coming on and mouthing rubbish? Doddy and Marsh have two totally different views yet at the same time the can both come out with a lot of sense.
I?d stop reading this site if it was censored or moderated too strongly.
Patronize:
Treat condescendingly
Seriously though, why should anything be banned on this website other than redshite coming on and mouthing rubbish? Doddy and Marsh have two totally different views yet at the same time the can both come out with a lot of sense.
I?d stop reading this site if it was censored or moderated too strongly.
Tony Williams: I’ve just read your post again. I’m not particularly impressed by its content. In fact, if the point isn’t that you want to stop things being banned (that are not actually going to be banned anyway), then I fail to see what its point is. And I’m not intending to be sarcastic now.
John, my post was not entered to impress you, merely to put my point across.
I will certainly not lose sleep because some anonymous poster failed to see what my intention for posting was and I certainly won’t suffer any pangs of sorrow because they were not impressed with my prose.
I will certainly not lose sleep because some anonymous poster failed to see what my intention for posting was and I certainly won’t suffer any pangs of sorrow because they were not impressed with my prose.
Tony Williams: I’m very impressed with your prose. I’m just less confident that you’ve anything to say. But really, I’m only kidding. I think you’re ace! So how about we stop arguing about trivial matters now that I’ve just had the last word? End of!
Rest assured I have it on good authority that our esteemed chairman continues to work for us 24/7/52/365 (366 in a LY). Us apologists are not sheep, merely proper, true fans with a real-world view of how far we have come under David
?You can look up at the stars but if you do you?ll fall in the gutter? (Olga Wilde)
While we’re banning words, how about ’but’.
Not ALL buts of of course - not buts like "Yak is capable of 25 goals a season but..."
Or "I wouldn’t like to see any player badly injured, but if Gerrard or Carragher broke their thigh bones I’d piss mys..." etc.
No, the ’but’ I’m talking about is the one that says "I’m pretending to engage in debate but in actual fact I’m not listening to anyone, unless they happen to agree with me"
It’s the ’but’ many of us will have experienced many times in work, since office twat-speak was invented in the 80’s.
It is THIS but.
"I hear/understand/’take on board’ what you’re saying....but"
Not ALL buts of of course - not buts like "Yak is capable of 25 goals a season but..."
Or "I wouldn’t like to see any player badly injured, but if Gerrard or Carragher broke their thigh bones I’d piss mys..." etc.
No, the ’but’ I’m talking about is the one that says "I’m pretending to engage in debate but in actual fact I’m not listening to anyone, unless they happen to agree with me"
It’s the ’but’ many of us will have experienced many times in work, since office twat-speak was invented in the 80’s.
It is THIS but.
"I hear/understand/’take on board’ what you’re saying....but"
EJ Ruan: Doubleplusgood point.
Just so I?ve got this right,
When Marshy tells everyone that he?s at the end of his patience and the the club will not be getting another penny of his hard earned, but then after a half decent 45 minutes anounces triumphantly "I?M BACK ON BOARD" he shouldn't be discribed as fickle?
Fair enough Keiran, you obviously have a much wider vocabulary than me, what adjective are we to use?
When Marshy tells everyone that he?s at the end of his patience and the the club will not be getting another penny of his hard earned, but then after a half decent 45 minutes anounces triumphantly "I?M BACK ON BOARD" he shouldn't be discribed as fickle?
Fair enough Keiran, you obviously have a much wider vocabulary than me, what adjective are we to use?
EJ
’Thank you for that...I’ll just put in on the back-burner for the moment’’
’That’s all very well as far as you’ve thought it through’
’I have an issue with that’
’Let me lay this caveat before you’
(What would Fr Adamson have made of such verbiage?)
’Thank you for that...I’ll just put in on the back-burner for the moment’’
’That’s all very well as far as you’ve thought it through’
’I have an issue with that’
’Let me lay this caveat before you’
(What would Fr Adamson have made of such verbiage?)
Phil - If some one told me they were going to ’lay a caveat’, my response would be to leave immediately, telling them the last thing I would ever watch is someone have sex with a small South American wild-cat.
Tony Willams you say...
"What about the continual use of the words coward.....spineless.....shitehouse....inept.....clueless?"
I hear what you?re saying....but if we ban these words, how are posters to answer when responding to a post that is a bit... erm... cowardly, spineless, inept and clueless?
Oh.... and sent by a shithouse.
It?s tricky one.
"What about the continual use of the words coward.....spineless.....shitehouse....inept.....clueless?"
I hear what you?re saying....but if we ban these words, how are posters to answer when responding to a post that is a bit... erm... cowardly, spineless, inept and clueless?
Oh.... and sent by a shithouse.
It?s tricky one.
Is banning the word ?but? in the context intented - simply a way of propagating the behaviour it was intended to remove?
Is someone who utters the word ?but? automatically wrong? Or are you just referring to people who say ?but? in your direction, EJ?
Bit of an non-sequitur wrapped up in an infinite regression if you ask me..
Is someone who utters the word ?but? automatically wrong? Or are you just referring to people who say ?but? in your direction, EJ?
Bit of an non-sequitur wrapped up in an infinite regression if you ask me..
That’s why I don’t ask you.
"I hear what you?re saying....but if we ban these words, how are posters to answer when responding to a post that is a bit... erm... cowardly, spineless, inept and clueless?
Oh.... and sent by a shithouse.
It?s tricky one."
I agree that it is a tricky one, I usually just end any lines of conversation with the shithou.... sorry, poster ;-)
Oh.... and sent by a shithouse.
It?s tricky one."
I agree that it is a tricky one, I usually just end any lines of conversation with the shithou.... sorry, poster ;-)
Catomite is a good word.
Feedback is a gift... according to my manager anyway. If I may borrow the words of Voltaire to illustrate my point
"I disagree with what you say but will fight to the death for your right to say it."
On to more important matters: hopefully Cahill and Fellaini will play together on Saturday and overpower the Fulham defence.
"I disagree with what you say but will fight to the death for your right to say it."
On to more important matters: hopefully Cahill and Fellaini will play together on Saturday and overpower the Fulham defence.
Franny, you may be trying to spice things up with "catomite?... which didn?t register for me. But ?catamite? ? well, we try to discourage that sort of thing amongst the predominantly male readership!
BUT...and there is always a BUT... why don?t we ban everybody who uses the word ?ban?.
Get Lynne Truss in to edit the grammar.
also ban ? oops, can?t say that, reverse acredit all those who post so-called whimsical, surreal, fantasy, alternate histories, allegorical and the just plain bollocks type posts, all music, film, historical, including those who say if you know yer ?istory, with or with out the apostrophe, those, who, use, too, many, commas, those who don?t use any in the manner of James Joyce anybody who uses 3 dots instead of a paragraph any one who say anybody when they mean anyone and anyone who says anyone when they mean anybody.... that episode of blackadder 3 about the puritans....TLA aka three letter acronyms like aka
cue Tina Turner..... alehouse shithouse woo oo woo oo nutbush city limits.
This is not the citizen kane of postings...
And why not
If yer knows yer ?istory !!
oh and exclamation marks !!
Get Lynne Truss in to edit the grammar.
also ban ? oops, can?t say that, reverse acredit all those who post so-called whimsical, surreal, fantasy, alternate histories, allegorical and the just plain bollocks type posts, all music, film, historical, including those who say if you know yer ?istory, with or with out the apostrophe, those, who, use, too, many, commas, those who don?t use any in the manner of James Joyce anybody who uses 3 dots instead of a paragraph any one who say anybody when they mean anyone and anyone who says anyone when they mean anybody.... that episode of blackadder 3 about the puritans....TLA aka three letter acronyms like aka
cue Tina Turner..... alehouse shithouse woo oo woo oo nutbush city limits.
This is not the citizen kane of postings...
And why not
If yer knows yer ?istory !!
oh and exclamation marks !!
I seriously believe you should just close down the site.
END OF.
END OF.
Derek - the puritan episode was in Blackadder II, not the third.
I'd like to see all winking faces banned ;-)
I'd like to see all winking faces banned ;-)
I knew that: and we should deffo ban smart arses like you Joe, who pick up on typos
© ToffeeWeb
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
-sm.jpg)
