The Mail Bag
What's happened to Hibbo?
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After the amount of stick Hibbo has taken from supporters most of it unwarranted and extreme you would wonder why a lot of supporters are anxious for him to feature on Thursday against Di Maria.
However, I am a bit perplexed at the moment because he didn't even feature in the squad on Saturday. He is not reported as injured on the official club site. And some media reports are saying Gosling will be playing RB again on Thursday.
I dont think he was suspended and although I normally take media reports with a pinch of salt it does seem strange. A bit like when Yobo was out for 3 games with what was initially described as a head injury, then a calf strain then a head injury again.
Does anyone know what's going on?
Jay Harris, Posted 02/11/2009 at 12:29:41
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Thank you, Michael.
I guess the flu doesn't warrant a mention on the OS.
I wouldn't be such a Sicko fan(T) if some fans didn't change their opinions with the weather.
Either he is or isnt a decent full back we’ve all had long enough to judge him!!
Seems like Dave Wilson and myself are the only two who give him a modicum of credit.
I guess the flu doesn't warrant a mention on the OS.
I wouldn't be such a Sicko fan(T) if some fans didn't change their opinions with the weather.
Either he is or isnt a decent full back we’ve all had long enough to judge him!!
Seems like Dave Wilson and myself are the only two who give him a modicum of credit.
I’m actually with you, Jay, in that I do think he is a good defender. In, fact, I think he’s a great deffender... and I say so on my much maligned Squad Index.
I thought he was extremely unlucky in the Cup Final. He seemed to have the measure of Malouda but on that one occasion, the Chelsea man got an extra yard on our Tone and he had to stretch just a little bit too much... caught an ankle... yellow card, an the rest, as they say, is history.
But, be that as it may, I defend to the hilt the right of our correspondents to critique players’ performances and current form... at least up to a point.
Most of the comments on players posted here are reasonable. I don’t agree with all of them but until they cross the line of being abusive, I’ll listen to what people have to say.
To claim that, regarding Hibbert, most of it is "unwarranted and extreme" is disingenuous and a poor way of avoiding the issues regarding players who are not quite good enough to take us forward, or who are going through periods of bad form.
Please show some respect for the right of others to hold opinions that may differ from yours.
Michael.
Are you really suggesting that the comments directed at this guy haven’t been unwarranted and extreme ? I think even his biggest critics would raise an eyebrow to that
When looking to blame this guy for a defeat no stone has been left unturned, no profanity unused. He has been blamed for goals when others have been so obviously to blame, for penalties he/we didn’t even concede, for red cards that were never issued, he’s even been blamed for goals and penalties conceded when he wasn’t playing.
Jay
For the record, I see all of Hibberts shortcomings sure he’s a decent defender but when people say he panics when in possession, I see that too, I agree, a professional footballer should be more comfortable on the ball, but the premiership is littered with players who are uncomfortable with the ball, the 100MPH pace at which its played at breeds them.
I dont have a problem with people who say what they see, that’s what this site is all about, its the things they claim to have seen that didn’t happen which prompted me to pen the recent "saint or sinner" article it was what I too believed to be "unwarranted and extreme" stick directed at him.
What I have learned since penning that article is this : The seemingly endless steam of abuse directed at Hibbert on these pages come from the same handful of people, every time, I’ve also taken particular notice of the way the crowd treat him and although we ALL get frustrated with him, there is a very Genuine affection for him amongst Evertonians
IHSWR
Are you really suggesting that the comments directed at this guy haven’t been unwarranted and extreme ? I think even his biggest critics would raise an eyebrow to that
When looking to blame this guy for a defeat no stone has been left unturned, no profanity unused. He has been blamed for goals when others have been so obviously to blame, for penalties he/we didn’t even concede, for red cards that were never issued, he’s even been blamed for goals and penalties conceded when he wasn’t playing.
Jay
For the record, I see all of Hibberts shortcomings sure he’s a decent defender but when people say he panics when in possession, I see that too, I agree, a professional footballer should be more comfortable on the ball, but the premiership is littered with players who are uncomfortable with the ball, the 100MPH pace at which its played at breeds them.
I dont have a problem with people who say what they see, that’s what this site is all about, its the things they claim to have seen that didn’t happen which prompted me to pen the recent "saint or sinner" article it was what I too believed to be "unwarranted and extreme" stick directed at him.
What I have learned since penning that article is this : The seemingly endless steam of abuse directed at Hibbert on these pages come from the same handful of people, every time, I’ve also taken particular notice of the way the crowd treat him and although we ALL get frustrated with him, there is a very Genuine affection for him amongst Evertonians
IHSWR
Undoubtedly some of the comments directed at Hibbert have been over the top. His strengths and weaknesses are there for all to see. Good and at times top class defending, at best average and at times poor going forward.
There is something else to be said in his defence, something Alan Jackson often bangs on about on RM. and that is the poor quality of cover Hibbert gets. I’m not turning this into an Osman bashing post, but most would agree Leon is not the best wide right midfielder around and is too easily beaten down that side. I thought of this on Saturday against Villa where Cahill was constantly back helping out Neill, a pretty ferocious twosome for anyone to have to deal with. Villa didn’t get much change down there all afternoon while on the other side the Villa goal stemmed initially from Bily’s failure to prevent a cross coming in.
Given Hibbert or Gosling on Thursday I’ll take Tony every time.
There is something else to be said in his defence, something Alan Jackson often bangs on about on RM. and that is the poor quality of cover Hibbert gets. I’m not turning this into an Osman bashing post, but most would agree Leon is not the best wide right midfielder around and is too easily beaten down that side. I thought of this on Saturday against Villa where Cahill was constantly back helping out Neill, a pretty ferocious twosome for anyone to have to deal with. Villa didn’t get much change down there all afternoon while on the other side the Villa goal stemmed initially from Bily’s failure to prevent a cross coming in.
Given Hibbert or Gosling on Thursday I’ll take Tony every time.
Think he was at Tony Marsh’s birthday party as Guest of Honour last weekend which is why he couldn’t play.
Who cares? Silence is golden!!
Jay, I think you need to look harder when looking for people who don’t automatically hit the "Blame Hibbert" button.
One surprising name is Ciaran, he often defends Hibbert, along with myself. We both agree he is pretty gash going forward but his defending is usually top notch.
My guilty pleasure last week was to have the Liverpool Unites Purple Shirt delivered with Hibbert’s name on the back of it, partly to wind a few of my mates up but mostly because in my youth I was a right back (and a right footed left back for some time) and I appreciate what it takes to play there, especially when you see the worlds most expensive player constantly changing wing when playing against him, as he gets no joy down there.
The only two players who have skinned him constantly in the last couple of seasons are Young, because he dived that many times Tony was booked and Malouda, again after he was unfairly booked.
Most of the posters who slag him off, do it for his foward play, which we all know can be dire but I actually think was improving this season until we were hit with the Black Plague.
One surprising name is Ciaran, he often defends Hibbert, along with myself. We both agree he is pretty gash going forward but his defending is usually top notch.
My guilty pleasure last week was to have the Liverpool Unites Purple Shirt delivered with Hibbert’s name on the back of it, partly to wind a few of my mates up but mostly because in my youth I was a right back (and a right footed left back for some time) and I appreciate what it takes to play there, especially when you see the worlds most expensive player constantly changing wing when playing against him, as he gets no joy down there.
The only two players who have skinned him constantly in the last couple of seasons are Young, because he dived that many times Tony was booked and Malouda, again after he was unfairly booked.
Most of the posters who slag him off, do it for his foward play, which we all know can be dire but I actually think was improving this season until we were hit with the Black Plague.
He can’t pass, shoot, head, trap a ball or take a throw in. He gets caught out of position, ball watches and makes rash challenges. He is quite good at tackling. Would he be first choice right back for any other team in the Premier League? No.
Peter, I think your mind is somewhat clouded if you think Hibbert wouldn’t be first choice at clubs like Wolves, Burnley, in fact most of the teams that finish below us.
Have you actually watched him when he has decent players around him that don’t toey the ball to him then leave him no pass? Last season when Arteta was fit and looking for the ball, Hibbert’s passing was spot on, he would receive it, look for Arteta, pass to him then overlap him....granted when he got it back for the cross it invariably ended up overhit or in row z behind the goal but his passing leading up to the cross is generally quite acceptable.
It’s when the ball is given to him and there is no outlet and he is closed down he hoofs it and it seems that’s all the Hibbo Haters remember, nothing else.
Have you actually watched him when he has decent players around him that don’t toey the ball to him then leave him no pass? Last season when Arteta was fit and looking for the ball, Hibbert’s passing was spot on, he would receive it, look for Arteta, pass to him then overlap him....granted when he got it back for the cross it invariably ended up overhit or in row z behind the goal but his passing leading up to the cross is generally quite acceptable.
It’s when the ball is given to him and there is no outlet and he is closed down he hoofs it and it seems that’s all the Hibbo Haters remember, nothing else.
Let me add that I don't think Hibbo is the greatest footballer on our books I dont even think he’s our best RB (I think we’ll find Coleman is in due course) but look around and you’ll see RB is a problem for ALL teams.
There arent that many good RBs around.
Look at Johnson for £18 million!! He’s good going forward but very poor defending and he’s an England regular.
There arent that many good RBs around.
Look at Johnson for £18 million!! He’s good going forward but very poor defending and he’s an England regular.
Like many I’ve watched Hibbert for a number of years and his passing has never been "spot on". It is this, over-the-top comment, that annoys people like me. Take the editors comments above — "he seemed to have the measure of Malouda" until he got booked — what, in the 8 minutes until he was booked!!!! Just nonsense.
I thought Neill played a better game than Hibbert ever has at right back on Sat.
Full backs are essential in modern game and should be able to go forward too. the RS paid £18m for Johnson but Portsmouth got him for about £4m two seasons a go so we could have went for him them then. Neill cost only wages and seems a good acquisition.
I stand by my comment about Hibbert not getting into any other Premier League team — perhaps some like Burnley etc you would say much of a muchness but he would not, as some suggest, walk into any other Premier League team and be automatic first choice as right back.
I thought Neill played a better game than Hibbert ever has at right back on Sat.
Full backs are essential in modern game and should be able to go forward too. the RS paid £18m for Johnson but Portsmouth got him for about £4m two seasons a go so we could have went for him them then. Neill cost only wages and seems a good acquisition.
I stand by my comment about Hibbert not getting into any other Premier League team — perhaps some like Burnley etc you would say much of a muchness but he would not, as some suggest, walk into any other Premier League team and be automatic first choice as right back.
Peter, how many crosses did Neill put in, how many times did he overlap with Cahill, how many times did he get to the byline? I cannot for the life of me remember any times at all.
If you are going to compare Neill to Hibbert then compare him to his whole game.
"I thought Neill played a better game than Hibbert ever has at right back on Sat." — Absolute rubbish!!
If you are going to compare Neill to Hibbert then compare him to his whole game.
"I thought Neill played a better game than Hibbert ever has at right back on Sat." — Absolute rubbish!!
He didn’t put many crosses in, he played a hell of a lot of passes on floor and to feet of midfield man rather than crosses.
Both full backs, particularly in first half, didn’t get forward too much — I’m unsure if instruction from Moyes to keep it tight or lack of confidence. In the second half, after a nervy 15 mins, both full backs then really pushed on and Neill overlapped several times. Himself and then Heitinga, aware that we were pushing forward in last 5 min and injury time, tended to stay back, aware of their defensive duties, Neill doing great tackles on Young and Agbonlahor quickly near the end.
Both full backs, particularly in first half, didn’t get forward too much — I’m unsure if instruction from Moyes to keep it tight or lack of confidence. In the second half, after a nervy 15 mins, both full backs then really pushed on and Neill overlapped several times. Himself and then Heitinga, aware that we were pushing forward in last 5 min and injury time, tended to stay back, aware of their defensive duties, Neill doing great tackles on Young and Agbonlahor quickly near the end.
If being very critical, perhaps he could have done better to stop Warnock crossing for Villa’s equaliser but he had two players to contend with and understandably felt Young was more of a danger.
My argument about Neill having a better game than Hibbert ever has at right back "absolute rubbish" — nice argument Tony.
Absolute rubbish indeed and spouted by one of the usual handful.
The Villa goal originated from a cross from our right, that's just not opinion, it's fact. I saw young Warnock get in three crosses in three minutes after that, Carew almost scored from one of them too.
I was much happier with Neill this week, he showed geniune backbone and imposed himself on several Villa players... boy did we need someone to do that, but If Hibbert was playing right back and all those crosses came in, we all know he’d have been slaughtered.
The Villa goal originated from a cross from our right, that's just not opinion, it's fact. I saw young Warnock get in three crosses in three minutes after that, Carew almost scored from one of them too.
I was much happier with Neill this week, he showed geniune backbone and imposed himself on several Villa players... boy did we need someone to do that, but If Hibbert was playing right back and all those crosses came in, we all know he’d have been slaughtered.
I think we all know by who now too.
Absolute Rubbish - spouted by one of the usual handful. Do you honestly think it’s just a handful who think Hibbert is useless ? I would say it’s a handful who think he should retain his place.
By the way, I agree that their goal originated from a cross from our right. Hibbert would have made no difference.
By the way, I agree that their goal originated from a cross from our right. Hibbert would have made no difference.
This gets better and better, not only do we have people seeing Hibbo concede goals and penalties when he is playing, we also have people who KNOW.
He wouldn't have stopped a cross if he was, LOL!
Peter my "argument" matches your comment. Neill plays a half decent game and in your eyes that is better than anything Hibbert has ever done, I can’t begin to argue with that because of the daftness of the comment, hence the two word reply..
Irrespective of what we all think about Tony Hibbert, is there anyone on here who would seriously rather have Dan Gosling at right back this Thursday evening?
Surely not?
Surely not?
Hilarious thread...
Can’t really comment on Neill’s performance at the weekend, because I didn’t get to see the match..
But the throw-away comment of him being "better than any game Hibbert's ever had" seems more than a little far fetched!
Can’t really comment on Neill’s performance at the weekend, because I didn’t get to see the match..
But the throw-away comment of him being "better than any game Hibbert's ever had" seems more than a little far fetched!
Thanks Ciaran, I think is funny too. Throw-away comment was at "right back" Hibbert had a brilliant performance at CB against Bate.
Jay. You mentioned Yobo missing with a mysterious complaint. I read that his cousin died in Nigeria on October 15 and it hit him hard. He played for the Super Eagles in a vital World Cup Qualifier, against Mozambique I think, and for some reason a paltry crowd of 5,000 Nigerians booed them onto the pitch and throughout the entire game before a last minute goal secured a 1-0 win. Joey said he was traumatised by the death and the fans just made him feel worse. Maybe Moyes thought our fans would leave him feeling similarly unappreciated........
As for Hibbo, him and Osman have been seen on their knees outside Tony Marsh’s begging for an audience with the Great One and hoping for forgiveness. Marsh came to the window and released some black ravens before ordering their execution. Apparently they were beheaded in a Pub Car Park and their heads sent to Finch Farm as a warning to others who dare to upset him.
As for Hibbo, him and Osman have been seen on their knees outside Tony Marsh’s begging for an audience with the Great One and hoping for forgiveness. Marsh came to the window and released some black ravens before ordering their execution. Apparently they were beheaded in a Pub Car Park and their heads sent to Finch Farm as a warning to others who dare to upset him.
Ciaran
if you get a chance to see the game, see if you can count how many times young Warnock — Not Ronaldo, or Messi mind — went past Lucas Neill during this "best RB display for years" ... hope your maths are as good as your English.
Another unwarranted and extreme post, Warnock’s field day was only curbed by him getting knocked senseless in a clash of heads with Cahill.
You have to ask yourself, if Hibbert is so bad, why do his critics feel the need to make this shit up ?
if you get a chance to see the game, see if you can count how many times young Warnock — Not Ronaldo, or Messi mind — went past Lucas Neill during this "best RB display for years" ... hope your maths are as good as your English.
Another unwarranted and extreme post, Warnock’s field day was only curbed by him getting knocked senseless in a clash of heads with Cahill.
You have to ask yourself, if Hibbert is so bad, why do his critics feel the need to make this shit up ?
Good post Karl
I’m still chuckling.
I’m still chuckling.
Well Hibbo wasn’t playing in the match I saw on TV in Spain here tonight - AC Milan v Real Madrid. Very skillful, athletic, and expensive, players filled the pitch. The game was, of course, a cup tie, almost a derby game, and was played at that frantic pace.
The beautiful joined-up football many TW posters crave was not apparent. Lots of other virtues were, like for instance, the long ball pass, and the long clearance. Milan and Madrid playing Evertonian ’hoofball’. Would you adam and eve it. At times it looked more like bagatelle, ping-pong or crazy golf depending on your age.
So I started thinking - Mikel would easily live with this lot, Tim Howard no problem, and so on. And then I thought about Hibbo. And I looked. And nothing that a RB did, as far as I could see, was what he doesn’t do week in week out. A few of the players around him - the likes of Seedorf or Kaka, might have helped a bit. But if he has the ability to learn Italian, no reason he shouldn’t be on the next plane.
Which would please some regulars on this site.
The beautiful joined-up football many TW posters crave was not apparent. Lots of other virtues were, like for instance, the long ball pass, and the long clearance. Milan and Madrid playing Evertonian ’hoofball’. Would you adam and eve it. At times it looked more like bagatelle, ping-pong or crazy golf depending on your age.
So I started thinking - Mikel would easily live with this lot, Tim Howard no problem, and so on. And then I thought about Hibbo. And I looked. And nothing that a RB did, as far as I could see, was what he doesn’t do week in week out. A few of the players around him - the likes of Seedorf or Kaka, might have helped a bit. But if he has the ability to learn Italian, no reason he shouldn’t be on the next plane.
Which would please some regulars on this site.
Hibbert is rubbish.
The injustice here is not that he gets abuse from our supporters, it's the fact that he earns more than the minimum wage.
He probably earns at least £10k a week, for that he has a shocking first touch and his crosses either don't beat the first man or sail over the goalkeeper the wrong side of the net.
Sorry, no sympathy at all.
The injustice here is not that he gets abuse from our supporters, it's the fact that he earns more than the minimum wage.
He probably earns at least £10k a week, for that he has a shocking first touch and his crosses either don't beat the first man or sail over the goalkeeper the wrong side of the net.
Sorry, no sympathy at all.
"His crosses either dont beat the first man or sail over the goalkeeper the wrong side of the net"
Do you mean like Arteta’s and Baines’s corners?
Do you mean like Arteta’s and Baines’s corners?
Tony are you having a laugh or are you Hibbert's uncle?
If Hibbert was as good as Arteta, then this whole thread wouldn’t exist would it?
I agree that our corners aren’t good enough though, could do with Hinchcliffe giving a training session to the team.
If Hibbert was as good as Arteta, then this whole thread wouldn’t exist would it?
I agree that our corners aren’t good enough though, could do with Hinchcliffe giving a training session to the team.
Come on ian, don’t be so pedantic, you know full well I am not comparing Hibbert to Arteta but you are using something to berate him with yet it is the same throughout the team.
Oh to have Hinchcliffe’s corners again, I thought we had that with Bily after the AEK game but since he pulled his muscle in that game his corners haven’t been the same.... it’s hard being an Evertonian sometimes.
Oh to have Hinchcliffe’s corners again, I thought we had that with Bily after the AEK game but since he pulled his muscle in that game his corners haven’t been the same.... it’s hard being an Evertonian sometimes.
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He's had the flu. End of mystery.