The Mail Bag
Carried Away?
Comments (81)
First off, an excellent win against Chelsea with heroes all over the pitch - especially Landon Donovan and Louis Saha who were sensational. However, it's easy to get carried away and suddenly think Moyes is the messiah, Kenwright should stay and the players are all good enough to wear the shirt.
The problem is that the Liverpool game and this game show exactly what the problems are with Everton — too many players who go missing one week and turn up the other. The case in point is Saha, who was non-existent against Liverpool.
What's annoying is how divided Evertonians have been ever since the Kirkby debacle. It's now transcended over to debates over Moyes and certain players. People automatically think others have an agenda when they criticise, and whenever we get a win like this we have the ol' "fuck you doubters" etc. comments rolling in. Conversely, when we lose, "Moyes out" etc. comments come creeping onto ToffeeWeb.
Personally, my opinions don't radically change regardless of one win, draw or loss.
Perhaps some have to learn not to get carried away with any one single result. Tonight, a good win, many positives to be taken, but there are cracks that are merely papered over — both short- and long-term.
Lee Kidd, Posted 10/02/2010 at 19:05:40
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Osman put a fucking shift in tonight, throwing some great tackles in, Cahill was Man of the Match though.
Oh and it wasn’t the same on Saturday with the knees jerking after our one and only league defeat in 10 matches? Perspective is needed by all parties me thinks.
Listened on the radio. A true nail-biter. The atmosphere sounded amazing. In fact, one of the commentators said , something like "Everton may want a new ground but on nights like this, this is a great football ground." Well done to everyone, players, coach and supporters.
Jay- exactly. There seems to be far more knee jerking after a single defeat (in 11 matches) than after a victory such as this.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but are we unbeaten in 4 league games against Chelski now?
Correct me if I’m wrong, but are we unbeaten in 4 league games against Chelski now?
Disgraceful performance. I blame Osman, Hibbert and of course Moyes.
Seriously, great result against a very very good team. Delighted.
Let’s just enjoy the moment and beating one of the Sky 4 for once before we pile in with the perspective, shall we?
COYB!
Seriously, great result against a very very good team. Delighted.
Let’s just enjoy the moment and beating one of the Sky 4 for once before we pile in with the perspective, shall we?
COYB!
They made the mistake of playing football against us - in contrast to cut you off at the knee bastards we played against last weekend.
It took us a while to work it out, but we won.
More later, but as Arteta regained his PL composure, slowly but surely, midfield came back to us.
Oh what a night.
It took us a while to work it out, but we won.
More later, but as Arteta regained his PL composure, slowly but surely, midfield came back to us.
Oh what a night.
We were shite on saturday and got what we deserved and it spoilt my entire weekend. Tonight we were the total opposite and I’m gonna fucking enjoy this victory!
Johny Heitinga - speechless!
I guess the difference tonight was that at least there was some fighting spirit. We still play too many sideways passes, play too much out wide, are not quick or direct enough to break into attack (save for the 2nd goal tonight!) and rely too much on set pieces because our attacking play is so limited.
But for all the effort and determination that was missing against the RS, it was there tonight and I am so pleased with the team that they fought back from a goal down. I thought "here we go again" as others must have done, but the players did not. So as Michael says, let’s enjoy the moment.
But for all the effort and determination that was missing against the RS, it was there tonight and I am so pleased with the team that they fought back from a goal down. I thought "here we go again" as others must have done, but the players did not. So as Michael says, let’s enjoy the moment.
John Crook, you are spot on.
Great win.... so long coming and well done to the lads. Nobody let the team down tonight.
Our defence held strong and played as they have in recent matches. Our midfield put in a great display all trying their socks off. I thought Cahill and Donovan were great. Bily showed some really good glimpses at times and tried hard and it was good to see Arteta looking a bit more like himself.
Finally a tip of the hat is needed for Saha. The guy is quality and I look forward to watching him over the next few seasons.
Bring on Lisbon!
Our defence held strong and played as they have in recent matches. Our midfield put in a great display all trying their socks off. I thought Cahill and Donovan were great. Bily showed some really good glimpses at times and tried hard and it was good to see Arteta looking a bit more like himself.
Finally a tip of the hat is needed for Saha. The guy is quality and I look forward to watching him over the next few seasons.
Bring on Lisbon!
Yeah Yeah... still a lot to prove but what a bloody game. Sign Donovan up... somehow! And whatever Saha had for breakfast needs to be served to the team. This is what I wanted against Liverpool... but too be fair.. those cheating bastards prevented the atmosphere of this game. UP THE BLUES!
I’d like to hear more about how Arteta looked. Was he that instrumental in the win?
Joey - Donovan is a must.
Can he have imagined how well he is doing?
Can he have imagined how well he is doing?
Gradually improving I thought Neil. Showing signs of getting back to his normal form, but still a bit short of fitness towards the end. Thought he brought a bit more composure to our midfield.
Neil - nothing spectacular, just more and more composure and control in MF. Priceless.
Tonight sums up why I love Everton. You just never know quite what you are going to get. Fantastic!
Depression to Joy in 20 minutes.
Company Conference - Evening Do. Left the bar 0-1 (had to rely on a colleague's husband texting while she was on the dance floor).
Back to the hotel room — connect to the Internet... Reception have just been up to complain about the noise in my room.
Great Result!!! Roll on Friday when I can watch MotD and as me, my kid and my colleague all sang, "I never felt more like singing the blues, when Everton win and Liverpool Lose!!!"
Company Conference - Evening Do. Left the bar 0-1 (had to rely on a colleague's husband texting while she was on the dance floor).
Back to the hotel room — connect to the Internet... Reception have just been up to complain about the noise in my room.
Great Result!!! Roll on Friday when I can watch MotD and as me, my kid and my colleague all sang, "I never felt more like singing the blues, when Everton win and Liverpool Lose!!!"
Finally, a win over Chelsea — and that after going a goal down. Excellent performance but this highlights the inconsistencies with Everton — poor one week and great the next. Now we must push on and take this momentum against the Mancs in 10 days times... but this is Everton so you just don’t know what to expect.
Don’t forget Donovan was against the best left-back in the world. We were as good tonight as we were bad on Saturday, it looks like our high energy game can only be produced once a week.
Redemption! Blues win, Gobshites got bummed. God’s in His Heaven! Considering our history, it seems slightly hollow and pathetic celebrating a win over Chelsea, but such is life nowadays. We just out-fought the best team in the country — pride restored. Minus the two recent blips, we’re doing just fine!
Osman has been class since returning from injury - and was excellent again tonight. The double tackle and through ball that led to the penalty was great to see.
We absolutely must must try and buy Donovan - he’s class now - such a shame he did not come here 5 years ago or even another prem club and he might be even better by now
Just watched the MotD stuff. There was no way that the editors could keep us out of it. Over 90 mins we outplayed them.
It was a game of three thirds!
The media men will talk about Abramovich’s lads. Let them. We know the truth.
It was a game of three thirds!
The media men will talk about Abramovich’s lads. Let them. We know the truth.
Michael was that first sentence written with your tongue firmly in your cheek? Wise-arses, like the ones on Saturday talking about us still in with the possibility of a relegation battle? Or the ones saying that Moyes will never beat any of the Sky 4 because his tactics are gash?
Yes, lets not go overboard with a great win over Chelski, the first in 10 years but let’s not then have a thread saying the same, yet there was the exact same one on Saturday about 200 long, along with the numerous others slating off every player and all the wise-arse posters telling the other posters who dare to slag off Moyes at all what idiots they are.
Yes, lets not go overboard with a great win over Chelski, the first in 10 years but let’s not then have a thread saying the same, yet there was the exact same one on Saturday about 200 long, along with the numerous others slating off every player and all the wise-arse posters telling the other posters who dare to slag off Moyes at all what idiots they are.
Tony Williams:
My very point with this post is to state that both "sides" of the "argument" are "wise-arses" who need to get some perspective and not see it as a personal war depending on the result of each and every game.
If I’m going to label myself, I’d put myself in the "anti-Moyes" camp. But that doesn’t mean I agree with every pillock spouting crap every game about Moyes.
If we’d have lost today, I would have sent a very similar article in stating "it’s not the end of the world, we lost against one of the worlds best sides".
Basically, from both "sides", let’s have perspective and sensible discussion instead of "LET’S SEE TONY MARSH NOW LOLZ!" sort of shit.
My very point with this post is to state that both "sides" of the "argument" are "wise-arses" who need to get some perspective and not see it as a personal war depending on the result of each and every game.
If I’m going to label myself, I’d put myself in the "anti-Moyes" camp. But that doesn’t mean I agree with every pillock spouting crap every game about Moyes.
If we’d have lost today, I would have sent a very similar article in stating "it’s not the end of the world, we lost against one of the worlds best sides".
Basically, from both "sides", let’s have perspective and sensible discussion instead of "LET’S SEE TONY MARSH NOW LOLZ!" sort of shit.
Lee you talk a lot of sense, I am the opposite I would class myself a Moyes supporter and even I think I can be wearing rose tinted goggles sometimes.
Tonight was an excellent result and a throughly deserved one, I hope everyone can enjoy it because, in deserves to be and for the right reasons, the players, the crowd, the manager.
Just one thing though, I heard Ray Wilkins post match chat on the BBC. I thought he said it right and a lot of credit to him, not often you hear such a well worked and thought out sum up from an opposition manager/assistant after a game such as the one tonight.
Tonight was an excellent result and a throughly deserved one, I hope everyone can enjoy it because, in deserves to be and for the right reasons, the players, the crowd, the manager.
Just one thing though, I heard Ray Wilkins post match chat on the BBC. I thought he said it right and a lot of credit to him, not often you hear such a well worked and thought out sum up from an opposition manager/assistant after a game such as the one tonight.
Agree with Tony that there does seem to be a lot more negative knee-jerk reaction allowed than positive.
Of course we all get annoyed when Everton play badly but very few (if any) teams play to their highest level every week.
What is exciting is that in the last 7 or so matches we have outplayed Chelsea and Man City at home and Arsenal away. Thats quite possibly 3 of what may be the top 4 clubs this season.
And thats without having a full team to play with. Can’t wait to see what midfield Moyes puts out with Fellaini and Peanuts back.
Of course we all get annoyed when Everton play badly but very few (if any) teams play to their highest level every week.
What is exciting is that in the last 7 or so matches we have outplayed Chelsea and Man City at home and Arsenal away. Thats quite possibly 3 of what may be the top 4 clubs this season.
And thats without having a full team to play with. Can’t wait to see what midfield Moyes puts out with Fellaini and Peanuts back.
I think Lee is spot on with his comments and I think perhaps it is time I took some action to curb some of the more vindictive posts that get put up in response to what is perfectly reasonable post-match reaction from across the spectrum.
In my opinion, it’s fine to describe how we played, be that well or crap — just call it how YOU see it. No need for vindictiveness. If you don’t agree with someone’s viewpoint, then offer your alternate, but there is no place on here for this reacationist stuff that lurches between trumphalism and schadenfruede.
It’s nothing to do with so-called "perspective" — everyone’s perspective is different — and if only some of the more obnoxiously self-righteous posters would recognize that and refrain from the "in your face" personal shit they like to post, I think we’d all get on a lot better without the need for providing personalized castigation.
If you want to critique or praise the players, that’s fine by me. If you want to critique or praise the manger, that’s fine too. So let’s stick to that and please cut out this other crap.
All in favour, say Aye!
In my opinion, it’s fine to describe how we played, be that well or crap — just call it how YOU see it. No need for vindictiveness. If you don’t agree with someone’s viewpoint, then offer your alternate, but there is no place on here for this reacationist stuff that lurches between trumphalism and schadenfruede.
It’s nothing to do with so-called "perspective" — everyone’s perspective is different — and if only some of the more obnoxiously self-righteous posters would recognize that and refrain from the "in your face" personal shit they like to post, I think we’d all get on a lot better without the need for providing personalized castigation.
If you want to critique or praise the players, that’s fine by me. If you want to critique or praise the manger, that’s fine too. So let’s stick to that and please cut out this other crap.
All in favour, say Aye!
Only negative is that we became ridiculously deep after we took the lead, heart in mouth for the last 15...
That would be an Aye for me
Lee, I wasn’t having a go at you, just thought it was quite funny that after two completely different types of results, one being poor and the site full of all angry and negative posts up until tonight and yet there is a post saying that we should have some perspective when we pull off a completely unexpected win. There was hardly any "perspective" on here for over 72 hours after the turgid game on Saturday.
And as part of this cleansing process, can we please ban the term "knee-jerk"?
I want people to post their opinions and analysis about what they just watched, so for anyone to label those efforts as "knee-jerk" is just counter-productive, aside from being deliberately demeaning.
So, no more use of the term "knee-jerk".
I want people to post their opinions and analysis about what they just watched, so for anyone to label those efforts as "knee-jerk" is just counter-productive, aside from being deliberately demeaning.
So, no more use of the term "knee-jerk".
We just humbled the most dominant team in the league. Celebrate.
Watching Match of the Day. Post match analysis, experts view, Everton’s second goal. To paraphrase:
"long ball...."
"poor positioning by Terry"
"did it go through Cech’s hands"
why not say:
"Pinpoint pass......"
"Moved off his marker, superb chest control"
"First time left foot finish, too much for the keeper"
I’ll tell you why:
Media manipulation. It’s all bollocks, it’s all skewed. Reverse the circumstances; any of the ’loved up’ 4 playing against Everton and attacking. Pretend Ashley Cole made the same pass to Drogba; Evra to Rooney; Clichy to Bendtner or Insua to Kuyt - it would be seen as class and not the "fault" of Distin or Howard. As I say, it is all bollocks. Anyway, well done tonight lads
"long ball...."
"poor positioning by Terry"
"did it go through Cech’s hands"
why not say:
"Pinpoint pass......"
"Moved off his marker, superb chest control"
"First time left foot finish, too much for the keeper"
I’ll tell you why:
Media manipulation. It’s all bollocks, it’s all skewed. Reverse the circumstances; any of the ’loved up’ 4 playing against Everton and attacking. Pretend Ashley Cole made the same pass to Drogba; Evra to Rooney; Clichy to Bendtner or Insua to Kuyt - it would be seen as class and not the "fault" of Distin or Howard. As I say, it is all bollocks. Anyway, well done tonight lads
Michael surely that’s a knee jerk reaction
I think Louis missing the peno kind of did us a favour.
I think if we had gone in leading then Moyes would have set us up to defend and invited them on.
But as it turned out the game was there for the winning and win we fucking well did.
I think if we had gone in leading then Moyes would have set us up to defend and invited them on.
But as it turned out the game was there for the winning and win we fucking well did.
There you go, Tony, look what you are doing:
"There was hardly any "perspective" on here for over 72 hours after the turgid game on Saturday."
On the contrary, "perspective" is exactly what it was — for the broad diversity of Evertonians responding to exactly what they saw.
For you to make a statement like that, denigrates a massive wedge of opinion posted on here by genuine Evertonians, and I personally, as the Editor of this site, utterly reject such a stance.
If you can’t accept that those were in the main reasonable reactions to an utterly dismal game and performance, then I seriously question the wisdom of providing you with the privilege of posting on here.
"There was hardly any "perspective" on here for over 72 hours after the turgid game on Saturday."
On the contrary, "perspective" is exactly what it was — for the broad diversity of Evertonians responding to exactly what they saw.
For you to make a statement like that, denigrates a massive wedge of opinion posted on here by genuine Evertonians, and I personally, as the Editor of this site, utterly reject such a stance.
If you can’t accept that those were in the main reasonable reactions to an utterly dismal game and performance, then I seriously question the wisdom of providing you with the privilege of posting on here.
Let’s hope this is a turning point for the team. Psychologically it’s so important to get this win, and to do it by coming from behind says a lot for the lads’ spirit.
Add to this the fact that we were unfortunate not to win at the Emirates and things start to look good. Certainly in 2010, the FA Cup and Derby game aside (on another day I think we might’ve buried Brum), I think we’re doing well. Moyes’ Manager of the Month Award would appear to bear this out!
Let’s hope we can build on this. Manyoo can’t be looking forward to playing us in 10 days time (and a trip to Milan in the interim).
COYBB
Add to this the fact that we were unfortunate not to win at the Emirates and things start to look good. Certainly in 2010, the FA Cup and Derby game aside (on another day I think we might’ve buried Brum), I think we’re doing well. Moyes’ Manager of the Month Award would appear to bear this out!
Let’s hope we can build on this. Manyoo can’t be looking forward to playing us in 10 days time (and a trip to Milan in the interim).
COYBB
Out of Hell and into Heaven, Chelsea unlike our previous opponents came to, and did play football, and for the first time in a fortnight we were also allowed to play football.
And when we are allowed to play, we are as dangerous as anyone.
And when we are allowed to play, we are as dangerous as anyone.
John, completely agree. On paper when everyone is fit, we have as good a midfield as anyone in the league. Still too much hoofball for my liking on occasions, though some good stuff tonight as well.
Can’t help but be a little frustrated that yet again a poor start to the season is costing us. Not a lot we could do about a freakish injury list to be fair, but highlights as always the need for bigger squad.
Can’t help but be a little frustrated that yet again a poor start to the season is costing us. Not a lot we could do about a freakish injury list to be fair, but highlights as always the need for bigger squad.
Michael, you know full well what posters mean when we use the word "perspective", especially when in inverted commas.
Calling for Moyes head and calling him a shithouse is not having "perspective" for the grand scheme of things, only for an immediate response after such a poor game.
You question the wisdom of providing me the privilege of posting? Pompous much? Maybe I should just continually swear my head off and submit to your view that Moyes is the Devil and have done with it?
Calling for Moyes head and calling him a shithouse is not having "perspective" for the grand scheme of things, only for an immediate response after such a poor game.
You question the wisdom of providing me the privilege of posting? Pompous much? Maybe I should just continually swear my head off and submit to your view that Moyes is the Devil and have done with it?
Tony, don’t twist my words. I allow — encourage — both praise and condemnation of players and manager — and all shades in between, if that’s genuinely what people think.
But what I’m not going to allow is for people like you to come on here and condemn outright the perfectly valid and forthrightly expressed opinions of other Evertonians — as you have in that blanket denigration of the opinions posted on here for 72 hours after that dreadful match. It’s exactly what you’ve done before and I’ve had enough of it.
But what I’m not going to allow is for people like you to come on here and condemn outright the perfectly valid and forthrightly expressed opinions of other Evertonians — as you have in that blanket denigration of the opinions posted on here for 72 hours after that dreadful match. It’s exactly what you’ve done before and I’ve had enough of it.
They all fear us, of that there is no doubt. This evening EFC sent out a statement in no uncertain terms to the so-called big 4 - that we are getting oh so very close. Don’t even blink! They are fully aware of our capabilities (an uncharacteristically belligerent RS is ample proof of that) and that fellow Evertonians is one mighty weapon. Should we beat MU I predict mayhem on this site. And if so, let’s all come together and push together in one direction, with one voice, to put this club back where it ought to be - at the pinnacle of English football.
Or is it just me?
Or is it just me?
Hope Baines doesn’t get an England call - purely from a selfish EFC perspective.
Great result! Thought Landon Donovan was our man of the match tonight. He looked a threat every time he was given the ball. We simply have to get him signed up quick fast. Cahill wasn’t far behind him and obviously the king was on fire!
Back to 9 points behind the dark side with a game in hand!
4th place thoughts again? Anyone, is it possible? Or am I dreaming again?? We would need to go to Spurs, Villa and City and win for a start! Not worried about the RS as I am confident they will drop plenty more points yet!
Back to 9 points behind the dark side with a game in hand!
4th place thoughts again? Anyone, is it possible? Or am I dreaming again?? We would need to go to Spurs, Villa and City and win for a start! Not worried about the RS as I am confident they will drop plenty more points yet!
You see why this site gets its reputation - even when we win the professional miserablists just have to create something to have a moan at!
I just watched the game again on Football First after reading the matchday comments thread
what I read on there bears very little relation to the actual game... and paraphrasing every other comment was.. "We’re shit" "Osman is Shit" "Moyes is shit" etc etc etc... and Lee Kidd you are the star turn!... you and Kenrick should tie the knot
Fuck me... it’s like being at a suicide awareness course run at the Wailing Wall by ’The end is nigh society’
Still... I suppose it takes all sorts.
I just watched the game again on Football First after reading the matchday comments thread
what I read on there bears very little relation to the actual game... and paraphrasing every other comment was.. "We’re shit" "Osman is Shit" "Moyes is shit" etc etc etc... and Lee Kidd you are the star turn!... you and Kenrick should tie the knot
Fuck me... it’s like being at a suicide awareness course run at the Wailing Wall by ’The end is nigh society’
Still... I suppose it takes all sorts.
Kevin, I think you’re being very selective in what you critique, just as Tony is. We played poorly at the beginning of the game, and those comments were fully justified. It’s what people say in direct response to what they see, and I’m reacting against this revisionism that somehow those responses are invalid or have no merit.
They occur in context, and form part of the community reflection that is this website. It that’s not your bag, then fine. But we are providing that avenue for people to comment and I have no time for anyone who is going to condemn that.
They occur in context, and form part of the community reflection that is this website. It that’s not your bag, then fine. But we are providing that avenue for people to comment and I have no time for anyone who is going to condemn that.
Kevin - now you wouldn’t really want to be in the company of half-wit arse-lickers would you?
A fucking famous victory. And well won at that. Just give a little grace to those backsliders over there on the mercy seat. I do believe they are truly happy tonight. As they should be.
A fucking famous victory. And well won at that. Just give a little grace to those backsliders over there on the mercy seat. I do believe they are truly happy tonight. As they should be.
Can anyone tell me when Donovan's loan spell is supposed to come to an end? Is it the end of the season or before then?
Dave, it was 10 weeks from the beginning of January, so that’s mid-March, which I think is when MLS cranks up again.
I think they start in March, Dave, and he doesn’t want to miss the start of the season...
Great win and no player was MOTM which is how it should be... I reckon Leon Osman had a fine game, both in attack and defence. His stamina is still suspect but he is an excellent team player and squad member.
Everyone played his part, worked hard and closed Chelsea down... pity it did not happen last week!! I just think that every player did his bit to ensure a great win over a very good team... Let's hope that we can reproduce form like tonight for the rest of the season.
Jesus Christ, please stop moaning, people.
We just beat a very good Chelsea team who have been absolutely dominant in the league this season.
Distin and Heitinga shackled one of the league’s best strikers.
Donovan had a man of the match performance against England’s left back.
Saha ran rings around England’s centre-back and until recently captain.
Osman had a cracking game for once and suddenly remembered how to tackle.
Bily had a decent second half and showed some nice touches.
Baines continued his decent form and got forward a lot to support the attack.
Arteta continued his return to full match fitness.
Neville was shite (okay... we can’t have it all good can we?)
Rodwell and Gosling made a return to the team.
And we did all this without Pienaar, Fellaini and Jagielka.
Inconsistent we may be but let your hair down and revel in the moment for once.
We just beat a very good Chelsea team who have been absolutely dominant in the league this season.
Distin and Heitinga shackled one of the league’s best strikers.
Donovan had a man of the match performance against England’s left back.
Saha ran rings around England’s centre-back and until recently captain.
Osman had a cracking game for once and suddenly remembered how to tackle.
Bily had a decent second half and showed some nice touches.
Baines continued his decent form and got forward a lot to support the attack.
Arteta continued his return to full match fitness.
Neville was shite (okay... we can’t have it all good can we?)
Rodwell and Gosling made a return to the team.
And we did all this without Pienaar, Fellaini and Jagielka.
Inconsistent we may be but let your hair down and revel in the moment for once.
I think that something was learnt from Saturday.
That being Landon Donovan, he played the most physical game yet for the blues and took the piss out of both Chelsea left backs when they were on with his turn of pace.
My MOTM was split between Donovan or Saha.
Heitinga doing a Jagielka on Drogba was also a highlight.
But I think without Donovan we’d not've got back into the game tonight.
And Saha well... what can you say: "blink and you miss it".
You see, they *DO* learn game to game. Donovan , and Neville (who noticably played more balls for Donovan to run onto second half) have.
Love it. COYB
MORE PLEASE!
That being Landon Donovan, he played the most physical game yet for the blues and took the piss out of both Chelsea left backs when they were on with his turn of pace.
My MOTM was split between Donovan or Saha.
Heitinga doing a Jagielka on Drogba was also a highlight.
But I think without Donovan we’d not've got back into the game tonight.
And Saha well... what can you say: "blink and you miss it".
You see, they *DO* learn game to game. Donovan , and Neville (who noticably played more balls for Donovan to run onto second half) have.
Love it. COYB
MORE PLEASE!
"Kevin - now you wouldn’t really want to be in the company of half-wit arse-lickers would you?"
Hmmm point taken... both Michael and Keith.
For what it’s worth I thought we were out of the blocks pretty sharpish but the legacy of that horror performance on Saturday was still hanging over us and confidence was low...
How did we raise our confidence? By doing what we should have done Saturday and taking the game to Chelsea intelligently and sometimes directly. (That means ’hoofball’ - it worked)
I enjoyed this game as much as I didn’t enjoy Saturday’s...
Hmmm point taken... both Michael and Keith.
For what it’s worth I thought we were out of the blocks pretty sharpish but the legacy of that horror performance on Saturday was still hanging over us and confidence was low...
How did we raise our confidence? By doing what we should have done Saturday and taking the game to Chelsea intelligently and sometimes directly. (That means ’hoofball’ - it worked)
I enjoyed this game as much as I didn’t enjoy Saturday’s...
Just about in Neville’s case. He was still in no-man's land for the goal. Hadn’t learnt much from last week! Apart from that though a great performance!
Oh and I’d just like to say, Chelsea’s stats against us this season:
W 0
D 1
L 1
Enjoy!
W 0
D 1
L 1
Enjoy!
Yeah, will give you that James. Soft goal to give away.
Again lack of aggression - attacking the ball.
But he was solid enough second half I thought. And wasn’t giving the ball away like at the weekend.
*(Hence my not mentioning the goal)
Again lack of aggression - attacking the ball.
But he was solid enough second half I thought. And wasn’t giving the ball away like at the weekend.
*(Hence my not mentioning the goal)
Great performance tonight which goes some way to vanquishing the despair of last weekend's result. I think tonight’s game was much more appropriate to introduce Arteta and he looked a lot more comfortable on the ball. That for me was probably the most encouraging aspect to the game.
I know many will be ecstatic with this result but my feet are firmly on the ground. On the back of tonight’s game I won’t come out proclaiming we’re in the race for 4th, I think that’s beyond us, neither am I going to call for the managers head if a result goes against us. I do however reserve the right to praise individual performances and criticise in equal measure.
I know many will be ecstatic with this result but my feet are firmly on the ground. On the back of tonight’s game I won’t come out proclaiming we’re in the race for 4th, I think that’s beyond us, neither am I going to call for the managers head if a result goes against us. I do however reserve the right to praise individual performances and criticise in equal measure.
In the context of tonight's game I thought Cahill, Saha, Donovan and Hetinga were outstanding, Osman put in a good shift but was less influential as the game progressed. Neville was prone to mistakes early in the game and was directly at fault for the opener, also caught out on another few occasions which on another day could have cost us dearly. Donovan gave us a glimpse tonight as he did on Saturday of what a good player he can be and one wonders how good he might become if he had the support of a wing back.
Moyes did well to motivate the team following the weekend's debacle though I fear tonight’s result may cause him to persevere with one or two players who need to be benched.
I’m in agreement with Lee and MK on this. Understandably, for a significant proportion of fans, a derby defeat hurts more than any other (not me, but 6 years living in Asia has dulled that). Couple that with the turgid performance on Saturday, and there will be an outpouring. I think there were something like 7 post-match articles (not mailbag items - columns and articles). We never get that with any other single match.
Where I would disagree with Lee - I think as well as the "doubters/Moyes-out Brigade", the "apologists/pro-BK" (label them what you will), we also have "the revisionists" - people who twist history, or postings, to suit their own point of view.
Lee - I don’t think Kirkby did cause the split you refer to on ToffeeWeb. It polarised opinions (as it did amongst Evertonians everywhere), and what I think happened is this:
Lyndon et al changed the mailbag. To respond to a comment you previously had to submit a new post - now you could comment directly - thus the "thread" was born.
All I think is happened is there are factions and individuals who "despise" what certain other factions / individuals write, and will immediately respond irrespective of the relevance of any counter-argument.
It’s easy to be abusive over the Internet. I doubt the vitriol would be as intense if it was in a pre / post match watering hole, face to face etc. Who knows, they may even have been friends in another life!
Where I would disagree with Lee - I think as well as the "doubters/Moyes-out Brigade", the "apologists/pro-BK" (label them what you will), we also have "the revisionists" - people who twist history, or postings, to suit their own point of view.
Lee - I don’t think Kirkby did cause the split you refer to on ToffeeWeb. It polarised opinions (as it did amongst Evertonians everywhere), and what I think happened is this:
Lyndon et al changed the mailbag. To respond to a comment you previously had to submit a new post - now you could comment directly - thus the "thread" was born.
All I think is happened is there are factions and individuals who "despise" what certain other factions / individuals write, and will immediately respond irrespective of the relevance of any counter-argument.
It’s easy to be abusive over the Internet. I doubt the vitriol would be as intense if it was in a pre / post match watering hole, face to face etc. Who knows, they may even have been friends in another life!
Fair play to Butch Wilkins tonight for turning all his post-match interviews into giving us the credit for winning, rather than making stupid excuses for his own team.
Refreshing.
Refreshing.
I’m with Tony on this one. While our derby display was not good, Liverpool were no better. It could just as easily have been us who nicked a goal and then everyone would have been lauding a superb defensive display, limiting Liverpool to scraps. They just put their whole team behind the ball and if there is one thing Liverpool know how to do, it is defend in numbers.
We were in no way outplayed; in fact I don’t even think we were particularly inferior.
People were slagging Moyes but apart from maybe giving Coleman a go, which would have been a risk, what else should he have done? People seemed a bit too quick to dismiss our recent good run.
Anyway, who cares? We finally beat Chelsea, and more remarkably, Lampard didn’t score against us! (Nobody left him unmarked, twenty yards from goal, cos what’s he gonna do, shoot?)
We were in no way outplayed; in fact I don’t even think we were particularly inferior.
People were slagging Moyes but apart from maybe giving Coleman a go, which would have been a risk, what else should he have done? People seemed a bit too quick to dismiss our recent good run.
Anyway, who cares? We finally beat Chelsea, and more remarkably, Lampard didn’t score against us! (Nobody left him unmarked, twenty yards from goal, cos what’s he gonna do, shoot?)
Here, Here, Victor!
Back where we belong, Up the Toffees!!!
Back where we belong, Up the Toffees!!!
Wonder if we will be the only team to put 5 past Chelsea in the league?
James Stewart - Why do you have to pick on Neville, when the fault was Arteta for getting caught under the ball in the first place and not heading it away like he should have done.
Neville got caught out cos Malouda reacted slightly quicker to the flick from Drogba, but to blame him for the goal was a bit unfair.
Neville got caught out cos Malouda reacted slightly quicker to the flick from Drogba, but to blame him for the goal was a bit unfair.
Listening to the match on the radio made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up! The roar of the Goodison Faithful made me feel we were in a Cup Final, surely they were the 12th Man and therefore Man of the Match!
What happened across the Park at the weekend reminded me that my Granda always told me they put "something" in our water "over there" and it especially affected our at cuppa half-time!
Enough fairy tales, fantastic performance, great goals, Arteta should have taken the pen, Saha signs 2 year deal & celebrates with 2 goals, should I go on?
Yes! Donovan hasn’t played a bad game yet and he simply gets better each game! Neville played great last night and Distin wasn’t bad either (his long distant pass for Saha’s 2nd goal was superb!). Baines was solid and Cahill was outstanding and took some rough punishment, let’s hope he gets a good massage today! Howard, as usual, was on the ball and Rodwell & Gosling again looked great prospects when they came on.
Yes, I am One Happy Chappy Today! Enjoy it, I know there’s more to come!
COYB... I said COYB
Neville was too busy shoving Drogba in the back. He should’ve been goal side, marking and blocking Malouda all along. RB marking the LM. Neville can do nothing right at the moment.
Lee;- fair point, we shouldn’t get carried away either after a crap result/performance at Anfield or a good win against the champions elect.
However, saying that, I do feel that there was one common denominator in both games that does worry me and that is a certain Mr Neville playing right-back. He screwed up on Saturday (wrong side of Kyut for their goal) and last night he was (in my opinion) clearly to blame for their goal as Malouda should NEVER have got to that knock-on from Drogba to score. (unbelievably bad defending).
I don’t doubt Neville’s total commitment. In that respect he is as good as anyone. That part of his game is good. But at times his positional sense is not good and that that has been clearly demonstrated in the last two games. With that in mind may I suggest we keep Neville in midfield from now on and not in defence where such weaknesses in his game are easily exploited. (DM, we still need a quality right back!!!)
Apart from that — well done to the team and lets hope we get more performances like against Chelsea and Man City and less performances like the ones against the RS and Hull City away. (For me, the lowest I felt supporting Everton in the last lord knows how many years...)
However, saying that, I do feel that there was one common denominator in both games that does worry me and that is a certain Mr Neville playing right-back. He screwed up on Saturday (wrong side of Kyut for their goal) and last night he was (in my opinion) clearly to blame for their goal as Malouda should NEVER have got to that knock-on from Drogba to score. (unbelievably bad defending).
I don’t doubt Neville’s total commitment. In that respect he is as good as anyone. That part of his game is good. But at times his positional sense is not good and that that has been clearly demonstrated in the last two games. With that in mind may I suggest we keep Neville in midfield from now on and not in defence where such weaknesses in his game are easily exploited. (DM, we still need a quality right back!!!)
Apart from that — well done to the team and lets hope we get more performances like against Chelsea and Man City and less performances like the ones against the RS and Hull City away. (For me, the lowest I felt supporting Everton in the last lord knows how many years...)
Aye.
Schadenfruede? Best left back Bayern Munich ever had...
Schadenfruede? Best left back Bayern Munich ever had...
"With that in mind may I suggest we keep Neville in midfield from now on"
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May I suggest that we don’t?
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May I suggest that we don’t?
The vicissitudes of supporting Everton football club! Crap one minute, brilliant the next. It’s amazing the range of emotions you can go through within 4 days.
A great performance last night, well after the first half hour or so, but I think one thing that is blatantly obvious is that we need a decent right back. I’m sure Nev is a great motivator and leader but he badly lacks pace. He’s been at fault for the only two goals in our last two crucial matches. Stupid goals that we should not be conceding. I think it’s time for him to make way. Coleman could be one for the future. We certainly need to start giving him some game time to build up his experience.
I think with a decent right back and a good reserve for Baines at left back and maybe another influential midfielder we could seriously challenge for the top four next year and even beyond!
We’re nearly there but we do need more consistency of attitude. More of the blood and thunder stuff if we are to progress next year to a higher level.
Totally agree about Donovan, he’s what we’ve been crying out for.
A great performance last night, well after the first half hour or so, but I think one thing that is blatantly obvious is that we need a decent right back. I’m sure Nev is a great motivator and leader but he badly lacks pace. He’s been at fault for the only two goals in our last two crucial matches. Stupid goals that we should not be conceding. I think it’s time for him to make way. Coleman could be one for the future. We certainly need to start giving him some game time to build up his experience.
I think with a decent right back and a good reserve for Baines at left back and maybe another influential midfielder we could seriously challenge for the top four next year and even beyond!
We’re nearly there but we do need more consistency of attitude. More of the blood and thunder stuff if we are to progress next year to a higher level.
Totally agree about Donovan, he’s what we’ve been crying out for.
Lee, I feel I need to set a few things straight.
I belive you are refering to my post match post.
I belive what I said was SO Howard is shit, Osman is shit, Neville is shit, Moyes will never beat a top 4 team again etc etc.
’Fuck all the doubters’
Firstly I feel I should appoligise for the ’fuck the doubters’ comment as it was over the top and my emotions were running high from the jubilation after the match. I am unfortunatley prone to being over the top post match (just ask my wife when we lose. She says ’we may as well cancel the rest of the weekend then’.)
This was basically in response to comments posted on here which I have been discussing for the last three days with various posters, who as is usual when we have a poor performance jump on the backs of the players I feel they should be supporting as they are wearing the famous royal blue. Which in my mind means they are one of ours no matter what.
Maybe those days have gone and in fact supporting Everton does not mean through thick and thin anymore, just join in the fun when we win and call for the heads of those very same people we celebrate the next time it goes wrong.
I also wanted to state as I did in my following post Lee, that I was in fact basing my comments on the last ELEVEN GAMES where I had thought that we had been playing great except for the game (fight) on Saturday. Which had lifted us from the relegation scrap we were increasingly getting dragged into up to a outside shot of getting back into Europe. (which we have got very used to over the last few seasons thanks to DM and these same players).
Anyway I am going on so in summary sorry for my terminology and any offence caused. But any chance of us all getting behind everyone on the pitch in an Everton shirt to try and support and acheive something together.
I belive you are refering to my post match post.
I belive what I said was SO Howard is shit, Osman is shit, Neville is shit, Moyes will never beat a top 4 team again etc etc.
’Fuck all the doubters’
Firstly I feel I should appoligise for the ’fuck the doubters’ comment as it was over the top and my emotions were running high from the jubilation after the match. I am unfortunatley prone to being over the top post match (just ask my wife when we lose. She says ’we may as well cancel the rest of the weekend then’.)
This was basically in response to comments posted on here which I have been discussing for the last three days with various posters, who as is usual when we have a poor performance jump on the backs of the players I feel they should be supporting as they are wearing the famous royal blue. Which in my mind means they are one of ours no matter what.
Maybe those days have gone and in fact supporting Everton does not mean through thick and thin anymore, just join in the fun when we win and call for the heads of those very same people we celebrate the next time it goes wrong.
I also wanted to state as I did in my following post Lee, that I was in fact basing my comments on the last ELEVEN GAMES where I had thought that we had been playing great except for the game (fight) on Saturday. Which had lifted us from the relegation scrap we were increasingly getting dragged into up to a outside shot of getting back into Europe. (which we have got very used to over the last few seasons thanks to DM and these same players).
Anyway I am going on so in summary sorry for my terminology and any offence caused. But any chance of us all getting behind everyone on the pitch in an Everton shirt to try and support and acheive something together.
I just can’t get my head round it... words can’t describe how bad we were against the shite; 4 days later, superb against the league leaders, and one of the best teams in Europe.
Why didn’t we adopt the attitude of last night against the shite?
I wonder what team will turn up against the Mancs? Maybe this is one for Mulder and Scully.
Why didn’t we adopt the attitude of last night against the shite?
I wonder what team will turn up against the Mancs? Maybe this is one for Mulder and Scully.
Re the knee-jerks on Saturday, can I just add that Saturday's result was against THEM and, as long as I have lived and breathed Everton, THAT game is the one I have most wanted to win!
I really enjoyed last night but I would swap it 100 out of a 100 for the win at that shitehole last Saturday! A win there on Saturday and I would quite happily have settled for 8th to the end of the season knowing that I could just tell them red glory hunters to STFU!
It's understandable that people get off their box after a derby defeat so I, for one, am not going to fling it back at them!
Chris -
I have heard it all now! How on earth is it Arteta’s fault!
Neville was pissing about pushing and grabbing at there player then gets caught out of position and has no pace to catch up. He is just a very poor player and I would not want him in midfield either. Best off the pitch.
I have heard it all now! How on earth is it Arteta’s fault!
Neville was pissing about pushing and grabbing at there player then gets caught out of position and has no pace to catch up. He is just a very poor player and I would not want him in midfield either. Best off the pitch.
"With that in mind may I suggest we keep Neville in midfield from now on"
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May I suggest that we don’t?
-------------------------------
Ciaran, point taken. Can I revise my initial statement to.... "keep Neville away from the back four"!
I hope we can both agree on that.
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May I suggest that we don’t?
-------------------------------
Ciaran, point taken. Can I revise my initial statement to.... "keep Neville away from the back four"!
I hope we can both agree on that.
Actually Christian, it wasn’t aimed at you specifically at all although that was the last comment that stuck in my mind when I wrote the article. Fact is it happens every week from dozens upon dozens of people both pro and against Moyes particularly.
But like you say, your comment was emotive and I understand that, and I understand the comments that have in the recent past caused that emotion - it’s all a load of crap basically!
But like you say, your comment was emotive and I understand that, and I understand the comments that have in the recent past caused that emotion - it’s all a load of crap basically!
Great result, Heitinga & Distin were superb at the back, limited Drogba & Anelka to very few chances. Bily looked the weakest link, don’t think he has fully come to terms with the pace of the PL just yet, his passing was poor especially in the first half.
Cahill, Saha, Osman & Donovan were outstanding. Arteta keeps a much missed calmness in midfield. Agree that we need to shake up the RB position, Neville does not inspire confidence at the moment.
More of the same against Lisbon & Man U.... Any update on Fellai’s injury?
Jekyll and Hyde team? Hope not. Arteta came back at just the right time to replace Fellaini and inspired the others. We have missed him more than some people were ready to admit.
Okay, we could have been out of it after the first half an hour but what character after King Louis equalized. Thankfully, his penalty miss did not cost us like the Burnley game. Perhaps Arteta will take the next one?
Heitinga was superb a la Jags at his best and big improvements from Saha, Cahill and Osman after the Derby match. Can we carry this on to Sporting Lisbon and Manurre? Let’s hope so.
Hello All,
Glad to be here as a new Everton man. I’m an American in America and like most over here, see mostly Man U, Chelsea, LP, and Arsenal (Who I loved when they had Henry).
Heard of Everton because of our boy Tim Howard but didn’t follow the team except for how Tim was doing. Now that the Toffees have signed our #1 Landon, it’s "Up Everton" from now on.
Although I’m a new member of the fan base, I was aware of the emnity between Everton and LP through reading about Howard. So I was actually depressed last weekend after watching the game on ESPN.
Now, after watching the highlights from our win over Chelsea and the way things have been going for the last few weeks, I think we are still in the running for the top 4. We certainly have the talent.
Let me ask, though, since I don’t get the games live. How do you guys think our Landon is fitting in over there and what do you think of his performance so far?
Glad to be here as a new Everton man. I’m an American in America and like most over here, see mostly Man U, Chelsea, LP, and Arsenal (Who I loved when they had Henry).
Heard of Everton because of our boy Tim Howard but didn’t follow the team except for how Tim was doing. Now that the Toffees have signed our #1 Landon, it’s "Up Everton" from now on.
Although I’m a new member of the fan base, I was aware of the emnity between Everton and LP through reading about Howard. So I was actually depressed last weekend after watching the game on ESPN.
Now, after watching the highlights from our win over Chelsea and the way things have been going for the last few weeks, I think we are still in the running for the top 4. We certainly have the talent.
Let me ask, though, since I don’t get the games live. How do you guys think our Landon is fitting in over there and what do you think of his performance so far?
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Make no mistake, this does not erase the awful memory — nothing can surely. For me, it is and has always been one game at a time, but don't forget that each game contributes to a total picture of the season... and this season is one so far with very very few highlites.
But thankfully one more tonight to savour.