The Mail Bag
Sublime to Ridiculous
Comments (65)
How can a team go from playing the Premier League champions elect off the park on a Saturday, to not being able or interested enough to string two passes together on the following Thursday?
I could understand if Sporting were as good as Benfica but they're NOT! They're a poor side and we, tonight, were even poorer.
Talk about ups and downs with Everton! We only started playing after we went two-nil down; before that there was no interest, no idea, no nothing!
So was it down to tactics? Were they told to do a job? Either way, I'm totally pissed off!
Brian Williams, Posted 25/02/2010 at 22:28:28
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The campaign starts here. European football next season depends on league position much more than the slender chance of winning a deeply flawed cup competition.
If anyone says Moyes didn't want to win the game tonight they would be wrong. But at any price'? I think he reigned his players in. Going out of this competition doesn't harm what we can achieve this season, and its not impossible - implausible perhaps - that we can be in Europe in the top flight next season.
As the opening games of this season came and went, I feared a battle at the bottom with the likes of Stoke and Sunderland prospering. Stoke are doing well, but we are doing better.
Europe next year depends on what we do next, not what we did tonight
Can, and will, be done.
Keith, what does it all mean though? Ok so we edge European qualification this season, the same thing will just happen again next February...
We are completely clueless when we play well known Clubs in Europe, we either fuck it up so bad in the first leg that we leave ourselves clutching at straws in the second leg or we conceed stupid fucking away goals like this time around.
I’d much rather we had a proper go at the two domestic Cup’s, I’m sick and to be honest, bored of seeing us exhaust ourselves to qualify for a competition that we just make a show of ourselves in, year in and year out.
Next season, it would be so refreshing not to be in Europe and to go for both the FA Cup and League Cup.
We are completely clueless when we play well known Clubs in Europe, we either fuck it up so bad in the first leg that we leave ourselves clutching at straws in the second leg or we conceed stupid fucking away goals like this time around.
I’d much rather we had a proper go at the two domestic Cup’s, I’m sick and to be honest, bored of seeing us exhaust ourselves to qualify for a competition that we just make a show of ourselves in, year in and year out.
Next season, it would be so refreshing not to be in Europe and to go for both the FA Cup and League Cup.
EFC
NSNO
COYB
Here’s another one for our collection:
WEWTUT!
Which Everton will turn up today??????
NSNO
COYB
Here’s another one for our collection:
WEWTUT!
Which Everton will turn up today??????
Oh well. We have to develop consistency. At least we are at the point where our talent is 1st rate. Moyes has this year and next to move us forward. Certainly we have what it takes to raise EPL siverware in 2010-2011.
Today’s loss should serve as a measurement for Moyes on who can or cannot be important in Everton’s aspirations. 5th or 6th finishes are no longer enough. The SKY 4 are NOT more talented.
Big game this weekend. No complacency!! Up the Table we go.
Up Everton
Today’s loss should serve as a measurement for Moyes on who can or cannot be important in Everton’s aspirations. 5th or 6th finishes are no longer enough. The SKY 4 are NOT more talented.
Big game this weekend. No complacency!! Up the Table we go.
Up Everton
What’s the point of qualifying for Europe if you’re going to put in performances like that?
"The idea was to get a goal and get the tie finished but Sporting started well and we found it difficult." DM
Good idea Davy but you must have forgot to tell the players. They went out on the pitch with their minds still in the hotel. Started badly and went downhill from there.
I like the new numbering by the way. It makes it easy to find a previous post.
"The idea was to get a goal and get the tie finished but Sporting started well and we found it difficult." DM
Good idea Davy but you must have forgot to tell the players. They went out on the pitch with their minds still in the hotel. Started badly and went downhill from there.
I like the new numbering by the way. It makes it easy to find a previous post.
You can talk all about key players being injured and cup-tied, we’ll do it next season. But come next season you know another family silver(s) will be sold to balance the books, and all this rebuilding crap starts over again.
Why do we keep coming back to have our teeth kicked in?
Why do we keep coming back to have our teeth kicked in?
Keith, if we play that badly against one of the worst teams in Europe, what’s the objective of getting into the CL places? Are we so desparate to be humiliated in late summer?
I think we definitely had the players to win last night. Moyes is just totally inept in terms of picking a side/tactics to get a result on our travels in Europe.
Let’s take a step back and look at what Roy Hodgson’s Fulham have done away from home. They went to Roma and took the game to the Italians. In the end, they were unlucky to lose 2-1. They defeated Basel 2-3 by going for the jugular, and then held out against last season’s UEFA Cup champions, Shaktar Donetsk. Now does Fulham have better players than us? I don’t think so. What they do have is an experienced manager who knows how to get results in Europe. Unfortunately, we don’t have one.
Let’s take a step back and look at what Roy Hodgson’s Fulham have done away from home. They went to Roma and took the game to the Italians. In the end, they were unlucky to lose 2-1. They defeated Basel 2-3 by going for the jugular, and then held out against last season’s UEFA Cup champions, Shaktar Donetsk. Now does Fulham have better players than us? I don’t think so. What they do have is an experienced manager who knows how to get results in Europe. Unfortunately, we don’t have one.
No Consistency in the tactical department cost us the game.
DM at times can we very good, but all in all not good enough for Everton!
Reason for this is the following:
This season’s the first time since the DM era that we were able to put some good performances against the “Sky 4” teams and get some points, sadly the smaller teams seem to be our stumbling block.
How can I manager be supreme in one and totally clueless days later? (that has happened over and over this season)
Judging by our squad we should be 4th or 5th at least.
DM at times can we very good, but all in all not good enough for Everton!
Reason for this is the following:
This season’s the first time since the DM era that we were able to put some good performances against the “Sky 4” teams and get some points, sadly the smaller teams seem to be our stumbling block.
How can I manager be supreme in one and totally clueless days later? (that has happened over and over this season)
Judging by our squad we should be 4th or 5th at least.
Keith, let me get this straight, you are saying that in order to be in the same competition we were in last night (That is deeply flawed) we can now start our campaign to get back into it by getting knocked out of it......... I think that logic is a bit flawed. However, if you think we needed to get knocked out of a flawed European competition to get into the Champions League then I think that logic is flawed too. Firstly, we’ll never get into the top 4 this year, secondly, even if we did we’d get anhialated, Bucharest, Benfica, Sporting, Fiorentina away????? Role on Barca, Juve, Inter, AC, Madrid et all, that won’t be embarrasing at all.
Reigned his players in!!!
thats an unbelievable comment Keith
U dont really think that do you???
If that was true (and it aint) what an insult to the folk who went to Lisbon
dear, dear me
thats an unbelievable comment Keith
U dont really think that do you???
If that was true (and it aint) what an insult to the folk who went to Lisbon
dear, dear me
"Keith, if we play that badly against one of the worst teams in Europe, what’s the objective of getting into the CL places? Are we so desparate to be humiliated in late summer?"
Worst team in Europe? Are Chelsea & ManU in that category too? We played like shit but let’s see how Sportng go for the rest of thir big vase campaign. Like us they’ve been battling for consistency but have some quality players.
Let’s hope the fewer games now but us in better stead for a shot at 4th!
Worst team in Europe? Are Chelsea & ManU in that category too? We played like shit but let’s see how Sportng go for the rest of thir big vase campaign. Like us they’ve been battling for consistency but have some quality players.
Let’s hope the fewer games now but us in better stead for a shot at 4th!
Excuse me guys for being naive, I was going to create my own thread to aid my confusion, but I figured I’d just comment here.
The formation and personnel in relation to the Man U/ Chelsea matches, as well as Sporting first leg was pretty much identical. We’ve already established that, when on their game, or midfield is a fine outfit and we play well with a single striker up front with wingers and central midfielders supporting as follows. In the games I mentioned we played fantastic, attacking football (first leg Lisbon probably being the worst, yet we still dominated). In fact I’d go as far as say, I’ve really been enjoying our play.
Which brings me to my question. Considering Moyes’ pre match comments regarding playing them like we did at the weekend, and him knowing well in advanced we couldn’t play negatively...why aren’t more fingers being pointed at our players? Of course I realize private judgement can be made about in-game decisions, when to sub, re shuffle, etc. But isn’t this all down to the individuals on the pitch, players just not showing up last night. All but Howard and Jags in my opinion. We settled deep from the first whistle, and I refuse to believe Moyes wanted that.
There isn’t ment to be any sarcasm within this statement, I’m really curious about all this. Why people honestly believe anyone would deploy a team to sit behind the ball knowing full well we have the ability to take the game to them, is beyond me. Some of the comments in the other Mail Bag thread are just toxic and angry; anger I understand, yet it all seems so matter of fact and too routinely on whether or not we lose.
I guess all I’m trying to say is, from my understanding, these were the same tactics employed by the gaffer only a few days ago, so what was the problem with him or them (tactics) then? Or was it just failed execution and poeple are just bitter?
Sorry for the essay, just confused and seeking answers. I’m no expert, so any rational, informative insight would be appreciated.
Thanks
The formation and personnel in relation to the Man U/ Chelsea matches, as well as Sporting first leg was pretty much identical. We’ve already established that, when on their game, or midfield is a fine outfit and we play well with a single striker up front with wingers and central midfielders supporting as follows. In the games I mentioned we played fantastic, attacking football (first leg Lisbon probably being the worst, yet we still dominated). In fact I’d go as far as say, I’ve really been enjoying our play.
Which brings me to my question. Considering Moyes’ pre match comments regarding playing them like we did at the weekend, and him knowing well in advanced we couldn’t play negatively...why aren’t more fingers being pointed at our players? Of course I realize private judgement can be made about in-game decisions, when to sub, re shuffle, etc. But isn’t this all down to the individuals on the pitch, players just not showing up last night. All but Howard and Jags in my opinion. We settled deep from the first whistle, and I refuse to believe Moyes wanted that.
There isn’t ment to be any sarcasm within this statement, I’m really curious about all this. Why people honestly believe anyone would deploy a team to sit behind the ball knowing full well we have the ability to take the game to them, is beyond me. Some of the comments in the other Mail Bag thread are just toxic and angry; anger I understand, yet it all seems so matter of fact and too routinely on whether or not we lose.
I guess all I’m trying to say is, from my understanding, these were the same tactics employed by the gaffer only a few days ago, so what was the problem with him or them (tactics) then? Or was it just failed execution and poeple are just bitter?
Sorry for the essay, just confused and seeking answers. I’m no expert, so any rational, informative insight would be appreciated.
Thanks
The Arsenal and Chelsea games apart (and Hull in the CC), our form in all away matches this season has generally been shocking - even the games that we have won, so last night’s non-perfomance really isn’ t that big a surprise to me.
If you’re going to defend deep like we did last night, then you need pace on the counter-attack - which we lack. The Baines / Pienaar combination apart, when do we ever attack at speed with slick passing / running off the ball?
The hold ’em and grind them down tactics may work in the PL occasionally but will never work against top European sides.
As for the assertion that we’re perhaps better off out of the competition in order to secure Eurpean qualification for next year, well it won’t make a jot of difference unless our style of play changes or becomes more flexible.
Last night was abysmal - worse than the Benfica result in my opinion.
If you’re going to defend deep like we did last night, then you need pace on the counter-attack - which we lack. The Baines / Pienaar combination apart, when do we ever attack at speed with slick passing / running off the ball?
The hold ’em and grind them down tactics may work in the PL occasionally but will never work against top European sides.
As for the assertion that we’re perhaps better off out of the competition in order to secure Eurpean qualification for next year, well it won’t make a jot of difference unless our style of play changes or becomes more flexible.
Last night was abysmal - worse than the Benfica result in my opinion.
Sporting aren’t a bad side, they are a good side struggling for confidence; similar to us in many respects. But the way we played for 85 minutes last night enabled them to regain their composure and forget about their league form.
Quite simply we didn’t have any ambition to win the tie yesterday. We gave them the ball, room to work with and the result took care of itself.
Nights like that make me wish I was never an Everton fan. I’ve no problem if we get beat fair and square by a better team, but I do expect the 11 players that go out there to at least make a go of it. Even if you lose, you have to at least give your best or something approaching it. That display was probably the worst gutless, spineless excuse for a performance its ever been my displeasure to watch. I’m just glad I didn’t go to the trouble and expense of heading out there.
Only arteta and yakubu in the last few minutes of the game looked like they were prepared to graft. The rest were just inept. Especially Neville and Bily who stood out as being particularly disinterested/shit.
All the changes in defence didn’t help. Yobo/Senderos/Jags haven’t played much football between them, so it was bound to affect the side. All the more reason not to go out to defend a slender lead if you ask me. When we’ve done it in the past, it hasn’t worked, so it wasn’t going to work here either.
What I can’t put my finger on is whether Moyes is sending the side out to be negative or if its just a psychological block that the players have when they have a lead to defend. Either way its Moyes fault/problem, since all the players are his own.
Quite simply we didn’t have any ambition to win the tie yesterday. We gave them the ball, room to work with and the result took care of itself.
Nights like that make me wish I was never an Everton fan. I’ve no problem if we get beat fair and square by a better team, but I do expect the 11 players that go out there to at least make a go of it. Even if you lose, you have to at least give your best or something approaching it. That display was probably the worst gutless, spineless excuse for a performance its ever been my displeasure to watch. I’m just glad I didn’t go to the trouble and expense of heading out there.
Only arteta and yakubu in the last few minutes of the game looked like they were prepared to graft. The rest were just inept. Especially Neville and Bily who stood out as being particularly disinterested/shit.
All the changes in defence didn’t help. Yobo/Senderos/Jags haven’t played much football between them, so it was bound to affect the side. All the more reason not to go out to defend a slender lead if you ask me. When we’ve done it in the past, it hasn’t worked, so it wasn’t going to work here either.
What I can’t put my finger on is whether Moyes is sending the side out to be negative or if its just a psychological block that the players have when they have a lead to defend. Either way its Moyes fault/problem, since all the players are his own.
When are some people on this site gonna learn.
After the Utd game some posters where spouting that much shit it stunk the place out.
Comments like. ’4th spot is up for grabs’.
’Best mifield in the league’........
Well now it’s back down to earth, with a bump.
Everton are like that little girl with the curl in her hair.
When they are good, they are very very good. But when they are bad they are awfull.
There was no excuses for last night. Lisbon where a team without confidence and we should have battered them.
Davy boy does it again. As for Kieths comment about the team being reigned in.
Tell that to the near 4,000 fans that spent their hard earned money on the shit.
Total disgrace.
After the Utd game some posters where spouting that much shit it stunk the place out.
Comments like. ’4th spot is up for grabs’.
’Best mifield in the league’........
Well now it’s back down to earth, with a bump.
Everton are like that little girl with the curl in her hair.
When they are good, they are very very good. But when they are bad they are awfull.
There was no excuses for last night. Lisbon where a team without confidence and we should have battered them.
Davy boy does it again. As for Kieths comment about the team being reigned in.
Tell that to the near 4,000 fans that spent their hard earned money on the shit.
Total disgrace.
I actually think we missed Cahill last night.
Surely its no coincidence that the tie started to go tits-up for us once he left the field in the first leg..
Surely its no coincidence that the tie started to go tits-up for us once he left the field in the first leg..
Ryan
You are right in thinking that Moyes didn't want them that deep but whatever he said didn't change anything. Pip was next to him on the touchline and never relayed any message to "push up". In fact, the captain looked as gormless and shellshocked as anyone through out the whole game
I've got no idea what happended last night, after the first 45 I expected Moyes to send them out with a rocket up them but nothing changed. Thing is that they took all the plaudits after the last 2 Prem games and stoked the fires by saying they where gonna go for it in Lisbon.
They never got out of first gear last night so its time for the brickbats this morning. Moyes spent a lot of time rowing with the 4th official which gets you nowhere. It was a total European shambles from start to finish.
You are right in thinking that Moyes didn't want them that deep but whatever he said didn't change anything. Pip was next to him on the touchline and never relayed any message to "push up". In fact, the captain looked as gormless and shellshocked as anyone through out the whole game
I've got no idea what happended last night, after the first 45 I expected Moyes to send them out with a rocket up them but nothing changed. Thing is that they took all the plaudits after the last 2 Prem games and stoked the fires by saying they where gonna go for it in Lisbon.
They never got out of first gear last night so its time for the brickbats this morning. Moyes spent a lot of time rowing with the 4th official which gets you nowhere. It was a total European shambles from start to finish.
The two biggest problems we had last night was Senderos and Yobo. Both are simply not good enough. They played too deep because they are too slow and that gave Sporting all the space they needed to play.
This is the difference between last night and last week.
This is the difference between last night and last week.
Ah, Everton FC. A riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma. On last night’s showing it was more of a mockery of a travesty of a sham.
It’s like there are 2 Evertons at the mo’. There’s the Sublime Artists who sweep aside all comers in a royal blue tsunami. Then there’s Cheryl Cole’s Hair - dull, limp, lifeless, no shine, that turned up against the shite, Birmingham and last night. That was truly awful. Let’s be honest, if it wasn’t for Howard it coulda been a Benfica style humiliation.
There were only 2 positives for me in Lisbon, (cue Mark Morrison music) - the return of the Jag, and Mikel’s fantastic but ultimately fruitless run near the end.
So, who we gonna get against Spurs, I wonder? The Sublime Artists or Cheryl Cole’s Hair?
It’s like there are 2 Evertons at the mo’. There’s the Sublime Artists who sweep aside all comers in a royal blue tsunami. Then there’s Cheryl Cole’s Hair - dull, limp, lifeless, no shine, that turned up against the shite, Birmingham and last night. That was truly awful. Let’s be honest, if it wasn’t for Howard it coulda been a Benfica style humiliation.
There were only 2 positives for me in Lisbon, (cue Mark Morrison music) - the return of the Jag, and Mikel’s fantastic but ultimately fruitless run near the end.
So, who we gonna get against Spurs, I wonder? The Sublime Artists or Cheryl Cole’s Hair?
At the end of the day the whole momentum of the tie shifted when we conceded so late at home. That was always likely to cost us as they were able to keep the ball, play patiently in the knowledge that they just needed to score once. Yes we played deep but we were bound the be under pressure - the away team in a european tie usually are. It’s a harsh lesson for a team that in European terms are still inexperienced - the trick is to learn from it. However next season we may benefit from a year off as the europa league takes a real toll on teams with a smallish squad. Come back year after next refreshed and stronger.
Clumperos and Fifty pence head combination (Senderos and Yobo) were shite, the tactics of defending so deep were only going to end one way. How many times do you have to watch Neville getting ripped a new one by that stepover kid does it take to think you need to change that. Jags comes on having not played a competitive game for nearly a year and shows up the defence straight away. DM needed to tell Osman to either man mark Mountinho or play his normal game and it’s also his job to get players to do their jobs or fuck them off and replace them with subs that will. Overall a completely gutless performance and not interested in any hard luck stories or other such shite, no doubt the three wise monkies will be on telling us to get perspective or over it.
"From the sublime to the ridiculous" Stole my intended title but exactly right!
It would be interesting to see the replies if Michael had posted his well observed (imo) but horrifically timed piece from saturday, this morning!
IF we can play like we did v Chelsea, Arsenal, man U, and other games, with the very good and skilled proffesionals he, give him credit here, has built into a team, why do we then perform like last night, Brum home, Hull away etc? Thats what is so frustrating - we are better than last night and whilst i am not laying it all at Moyes door, he is the orchestrator and has to take the brickbats as well as the plaudits!
last night though, I dont think Moyes "reigned them in". He had Pienaar, Bilya, Donovan, Arteta, all attacking midfielders, on from the start. If he was going defensive surely he would have had Rodwell or Pip in midfield, probably at the expense of Bilya (who was woeful!). he was also heard clearly shouting at them to step it up!
Our players simply couldnt pass to each other when it mattered.
Plusses from the night were:
Arteta showed some glimpses that he is back to his best - they couldnt buy the ball off him at the end!
Jags slotted right in and one clearance with his "gammy" leg shot like a rocket up the pitch! England will probably call soon! (not my preferred scenario)
Senderos will never wear a blue shirt again! (I will be mortified if I play like that next sunday morning!)
People will now hopefully get off Distins back and recognise that he is a better centre back than given credit for.
We now know that Heitinga, Fellaini and Cahill are integral parts of this team and must do all we can to get them 3 back in the side asap. Heitinga and Jags will be immense and Fellaini would have made a massive difference there last night!
Harry Redknapp will relax for sunday and (hopefully) the PL Everton of late will turn up!
I’m disappointed but have felt worse this season!
It would be interesting to see the replies if Michael had posted his well observed (imo) but horrifically timed piece from saturday, this morning!
IF we can play like we did v Chelsea, Arsenal, man U, and other games, with the very good and skilled proffesionals he, give him credit here, has built into a team, why do we then perform like last night, Brum home, Hull away etc? Thats what is so frustrating - we are better than last night and whilst i am not laying it all at Moyes door, he is the orchestrator and has to take the brickbats as well as the plaudits!
last night though, I dont think Moyes "reigned them in". He had Pienaar, Bilya, Donovan, Arteta, all attacking midfielders, on from the start. If he was going defensive surely he would have had Rodwell or Pip in midfield, probably at the expense of Bilya (who was woeful!). he was also heard clearly shouting at them to step it up!
Our players simply couldnt pass to each other when it mattered.
Plusses from the night were:
Arteta showed some glimpses that he is back to his best - they couldnt buy the ball off him at the end!
Jags slotted right in and one clearance with his "gammy" leg shot like a rocket up the pitch! England will probably call soon! (not my preferred scenario)
Senderos will never wear a blue shirt again! (I will be mortified if I play like that next sunday morning!)
People will now hopefully get off Distins back and recognise that he is a better centre back than given credit for.
We now know that Heitinga, Fellaini and Cahill are integral parts of this team and must do all we can to get them 3 back in the side asap. Heitinga and Jags will be immense and Fellaini would have made a massive difference there last night!
Harry Redknapp will relax for sunday and (hopefully) the PL Everton of late will turn up!
I’m disappointed but have felt worse this season!
It may just be me but it seemed to me that through most of the match whenever the camera went to Moyes he looked seriously pissed off with the players like they were doing nothing like he had asked, he kept shouting instructions and the players just didnt seem to be doing it, after the game he didnt say as much but the look on his face said it all he was not happy! I by no means am a moyes ’apologist’ and when he’s fucked up i will say so but i think i’ll blame yesterday on the boys who pulled on the shirt, there was no effort, it seemed like they just didnt care that much, totally different to the Man U game where they would not rest. The only player to come out with any credit was Baines. It is quite worrying to see that after a year out injured Jags was head and shoulders above our other centre backs (Not including Heitinga in that by the way!) Cant wait to see them form a partnership!
Peter - post 21. Very good !
The players looked tired to me, maybe Moyes had them doing altitude training 2 hours before the game.
False dawns are so typical of Everton, I sometimes want to give up. We should get special medals from the Queen for being Evertonians.
Is the season over ? Probably, I’m just looking forward to a summer of no transfers and another shit start to the season only to ask again this time next year what might have been.
The players looked tired to me, maybe Moyes had them doing altitude training 2 hours before the game.
False dawns are so typical of Everton, I sometimes want to give up. We should get special medals from the Queen for being Evertonians.
Is the season over ? Probably, I’m just looking forward to a summer of no transfers and another shit start to the season only to ask again this time next year what might have been.
Problem last night was that most of our recent ’success’ has been built upon possession and accurate passing from the back.
With Heitinga and Felliani out there was none so we didn’t start any moves or build any momentum, we continually squandered the ball. Yobo was utterly atrocious with his hoof-ball and needs shipping off to Allardyce and we had no balls right down the spine of the team.
Saha had one of his many ’can’t be arsed really’ days.
Not good enough.
With Heitinga and Felliani out there was none so we didn’t start any moves or build any momentum, we continually squandered the ball. Yobo was utterly atrocious with his hoof-ball and needs shipping off to Allardyce and we had no balls right down the spine of the team.
Saha had one of his many ’can’t be arsed really’ days.
Not good enough.
Brian, its not "pissed off" ...it’s PISSED OFF !
Reality Check!!!!!!!!!!!
You cant get away too long playing a lightweight midfield, at home maybe, but away from home and in Europe no.
Donovan is not a left sided player
Why break up the Pienaar/Baines left sided partnership.
You cant get away too long playing a lightweight midfield, at home maybe, but away from home and in Europe no.
Donovan is not a left sided player
Why break up the Pienaar/Baines left sided partnership.
What a fucking shambles....
An absolute pile of shite from start to finish....We’ve heard a lot about Nevilles organisational and directional skills - what a pile of crap...
The back line were all over the place until Jags came on - what does that tell ye? He has fuck all influence and what influence he has is fucking useless...It’s alright stating that he does a lot of organising throughout the match - but if that direction results in a shambles then how much credibility can we give to it’s importance?
Time for a change of captain.
However the criticism doesn’t stop there...the entire midfield were pretty useless..It seems that Pienaar was not the only one pissed at the weekend...four day bender by the looks of it..
Billy was a disgrace...ambled about like a pensioner..Pienaar didn’t know what he was at and Donovan was lost....Arteta just about put in an average performance and Osman was made a complete mug out of by Moutinho - I’m mean seriously...who in teh good name of fuck - came up with the idiotic idea that we needed to man mark Moutinho - Moyes needs a good slap for that one - if you’re gonna use a man marker [which I believe was completely unecessary and both stopped out game and allowed theirs to flourish] then at least use someone who’s capable of doing it!
Osman was certainly not that player.
However I have to qualify Osman’s performance because the LEON POLICE might be watching - overall he was our best player when he had the ball...very few mistakes and a couple of pieces of class..
But my God..what a crock of crap...Senderos has potential - but my god, he needs a serious amount of coaching, whenther he’s got the brains to ferment it is another matter...he just looks bloody lost.
Poor tactics, pish poor play and little effort.
Disgusting.
An absolute pile of shite from start to finish....We’ve heard a lot about Nevilles organisational and directional skills - what a pile of crap...
The back line were all over the place until Jags came on - what does that tell ye? He has fuck all influence and what influence he has is fucking useless...It’s alright stating that he does a lot of organising throughout the match - but if that direction results in a shambles then how much credibility can we give to it’s importance?
Time for a change of captain.
However the criticism doesn’t stop there...the entire midfield were pretty useless..It seems that Pienaar was not the only one pissed at the weekend...four day bender by the looks of it..
Billy was a disgrace...ambled about like a pensioner..Pienaar didn’t know what he was at and Donovan was lost....Arteta just about put in an average performance and Osman was made a complete mug out of by Moutinho - I’m mean seriously...who in teh good name of fuck - came up with the idiotic idea that we needed to man mark Moutinho - Moyes needs a good slap for that one - if you’re gonna use a man marker [which I believe was completely unecessary and both stopped out game and allowed theirs to flourish] then at least use someone who’s capable of doing it!
Osman was certainly not that player.
However I have to qualify Osman’s performance because the LEON POLICE might be watching - overall he was our best player when he had the ball...very few mistakes and a couple of pieces of class..
But my God..what a crock of crap...Senderos has potential - but my god, he needs a serious amount of coaching, whenther he’s got the brains to ferment it is another matter...he just looks bloody lost.
Poor tactics, pish poor play and little effort.
Disgusting.
Last night Sporting Lisbon did to us what we always try and do to other teams - simply not let them play.
Against Man City, Chelsea and the Manure it worked a treat, but then Sporting Lisbon, just like the Red Shite, did exactly the same to us;- just didn’t allow us to play because they were quicker, more aggressive, more determined and had a mind set of "we ain’t gonna loose this".
Maybe Moyes and the backroom staff now have to do some work on making our team mentally stronger because to me it was evident right from the start last night that the Everton mindset was one of fear and trepidation. (almost accepting defeat even before defeat came knocking.)
Disappointing, so so disappointing
Against Man City, Chelsea and the Manure it worked a treat, but then Sporting Lisbon, just like the Red Shite, did exactly the same to us;- just didn’t allow us to play because they were quicker, more aggressive, more determined and had a mind set of "we ain’t gonna loose this".
Maybe Moyes and the backroom staff now have to do some work on making our team mentally stronger because to me it was evident right from the start last night that the Everton mindset was one of fear and trepidation. (almost accepting defeat even before defeat came knocking.)
Disappointing, so so disappointing
Apparently, Moyes aim was to score a goal then park the bus.
Unfortunately the players thought he meant, park the bus then nick a goal.
That is why for over an hour we played with 5 completely defensive midfielders.
Will we ever see the benfit of this learning curve that Moyes has been on since day one.
He seems to take an eternity to recognise when things need changing. For example,
everyone bar him could see that Bily should have been subbed long before the end of the first half.
Unfortunately the players thought he meant, park the bus then nick a goal.
That is why for over an hour we played with 5 completely defensive midfielders.
Will we ever see the benfit of this learning curve that Moyes has been on since day one.
He seems to take an eternity to recognise when things need changing. For example,
everyone bar him could see that Bily should have been subbed long before the end of the first half.
Could it also be that the much vaunted "greatest league in the world" is not what it is cracked up to be ?
O.k. we played at our best against Chelsea and Man U and then a lot of peole assumed that we could turn up against Sporting and get a result.
Fact ... we were totally outplayed by a team that worked, passed to feet, moved off the ball, can shoot, are athletic, are comfortable in every position
The overall level of skill and ability is higher on the continent in my opinion...lokk at the way the RS have been turned over this season.
We are improving but have a long long way to go
O.k. we played at our best against Chelsea and Man U and then a lot of peole assumed that we could turn up against Sporting and get a result.
Fact ... we were totally outplayed by a team that worked, passed to feet, moved off the ball, can shoot, are athletic, are comfortable in every position
The overall level of skill and ability is higher on the continent in my opinion...lokk at the way the RS have been turned over this season.
We are improving but have a long long way to go
We can be great on our day - IF we put on a tremendous effort, work for every inch of the field and give the opponents no space whatsoever. As soon as we start to lean back and expect we are the finished product and can win games without wasting too much energy, we are a very mediocre team.
Apart from that I’m wondering if Heitinga really makes that much of a difference in organising the squad and putting in the believe we can, should, must win every match.
Apart from that I’m wondering if Heitinga really makes that much of a difference in organising the squad and putting in the believe we can, should, must win every match.
sorry for everyone; we were too concerned with what they were doing," Arteta reflected. "We have not been positive enough, we tried to defend too deep, we never got a grip of the game and when we tried to attack it was too late. It was not just their late penalty at Goodison that has cost us, it was all the chances we missed in the last 20 minutes of that game."
mIkel’s comment in today’s Guardian.
What interests me is ’WHY?’
were they instructed to play that way?
Is it part of the club culture now to be defensive first and foremost so it becomes the default mode?
Are there too many ’bottlers’ in the team?what is plain is that there is a mismatch here - a discrepancy between the talent available and CONSISTENT good performances.
For every Man City or Chelsea there is a Birmingham display. For every Man Utd there is a display like last night’s fiasco. Maybe it’s cup ties - I don’t know.
I suppose on that trend we should hammer Spurs on Sunday, but at least it’s nice to see some honesty and realism from at least one insider
mIkel’s comment in today’s Guardian.
What interests me is ’WHY?’
were they instructed to play that way?
Is it part of the club culture now to be defensive first and foremost so it becomes the default mode?
Are there too many ’bottlers’ in the team?what is plain is that there is a mismatch here - a discrepancy between the talent available and CONSISTENT good performances.
For every Man City or Chelsea there is a Birmingham display. For every Man Utd there is a display like last night’s fiasco. Maybe it’s cup ties - I don’t know.
I suppose on that trend we should hammer Spurs on Sunday, but at least it’s nice to see some honesty and realism from at least one insider
What can you say to a performance like last night... dire springs to mind, we didn’t turn up at all. It took us a whole 60 odd minutes to get a 1st shot on goal,pathetic.
I think it was one change to many changes at the back Senderos looked looked like a cripple, I guarantee if he plays again he’ll get paced or give away cheap freekicks like he did last. As for Yobo his reading of the game isn’t the best, he loves to ball watch, switches off and doesn’t shout enough for my liking. I felt sorry for Jags he must of felt like he was pissing into the wind and abit of an anti-climax for his return.
If anyone thinks Moutinho will sign in the summer, think again I think he’s seen all he needs to see about our club toothless and no guile, he was pulling the strings in midfield all night dropping deep and threading passes to cause chaos and mayhem which the defense couldn’t deal with.
I think it was one change to many changes at the back Senderos looked looked like a cripple, I guarantee if he plays again he’ll get paced or give away cheap freekicks like he did last. As for Yobo his reading of the game isn’t the best, he loves to ball watch, switches off and doesn’t shout enough for my liking. I felt sorry for Jags he must of felt like he was pissing into the wind and abit of an anti-climax for his return.
If anyone thinks Moutinho will sign in the summer, think again I think he’s seen all he needs to see about our club toothless and no guile, he was pulling the strings in midfield all night dropping deep and threading passes to cause chaos and mayhem which the defense couldn’t deal with.
I think Ciaran pretty much sums it up for me. Putting Osman on Moutinho was one of the worst tactical decisions I have ever seen. I actually feel sorry for Osman in this case.
I also second the shout for a change of captain. I have seen and heard about all I can take now from that useless cunt Neville! Stop talking complete utter shit prior to matches! Terrible player simple does not deserve the armband.
Pretty much everyone must hang their head in shame. Only Arteta had a okish game. Apart from his one dire corner.
The fans who travelled should be refunded after that shite!. Its ok striving to be in Europe again but what is the point if we are going to play like that! We looked again like we arn’t good enough to compete in it & it’s embarrassing.
I also second the shout for a change of captain. I have seen and heard about all I can take now from that useless cunt Neville! Stop talking complete utter shit prior to matches! Terrible player simple does not deserve the armband.
Pretty much everyone must hang their head in shame. Only Arteta had a okish game. Apart from his one dire corner.
The fans who travelled should be refunded after that shite!. Its ok striving to be in Europe again but what is the point if we are going to play like that! We looked again like we arn’t good enough to compete in it & it’s embarrassing.
I cannot believe they way we DID not perform last night.
From the sublime to the ridiculous.
Lets hope that this is the kick up the ass that they need. I agree that we missed Cahill, he would have given Moutinho a run for his money! Like a wasp that won’t go away!
I can certianlly see why Moyes wanted to sign him, he ran the show!
Lets start to put things right with 3 points against Tottenham.
I thought Billy’s performance was lacklustre, terrible and shocking at times. I genuinely think he will be a star next season just remember he has played a full season in Russia!
He is not a right winger, that was a bad decision he should have played Billy behind Saha like he did against Utd.
Lets just remember we are moving in the right direction but still need improving in many areas!
From the sublime to the ridiculous.
Lets hope that this is the kick up the ass that they need. I agree that we missed Cahill, he would have given Moutinho a run for his money! Like a wasp that won’t go away!
I can certianlly see why Moyes wanted to sign him, he ran the show!
Lets start to put things right with 3 points against Tottenham.
I thought Billy’s performance was lacklustre, terrible and shocking at times. I genuinely think he will be a star next season just remember he has played a full season in Russia!
He is not a right winger, that was a bad decision he should have played Billy behind Saha like he did against Utd.
Lets just remember we are moving in the right direction but still need improving in many areas!
Michael Kenrick.
Accept my apologies; your post and observations were unfortunately correct, and my subsequent post regarding your comments were unfortunately totally incorrect.
You would think that after 35 years of watching this lot that I would be more aware; nope - those games against Chelsea & United certainly threw me.
Last nights showing was bad. I mean fucking bad. Senderos will surely never wear the blue shirt again and the midfield five looked like they had a bet on who could do the least; with or without the ball. I mean Billy, in our pen box, passed directly to one of them (a 3 yarder) and watched him shoot.
Accept my apologies; your post and observations were unfortunately correct, and my subsequent post regarding your comments were unfortunately totally incorrect.
You would think that after 35 years of watching this lot that I would be more aware; nope - those games against Chelsea & United certainly threw me.
Last nights showing was bad. I mean fucking bad. Senderos will surely never wear the blue shirt again and the midfield five looked like they had a bet on who could do the least; with or without the ball. I mean Billy, in our pen box, passed directly to one of them (a 3 yarder) and watched him shoot.
One of the worst performances of the season. They played well, but just about every single Everton player was pure shite.
We all knew the Yobo and Senderos were gonna be useless, but to see Arteta, Bily, Donovan misplace just about every pass they attempted was so frustrating.
I really feel for the fans that travelled all that way, only to see Sporting take us apart like it was a training match.
Lets hope they pick it up for Sunday, and can regain a bit of focus in the league.
We all knew the Yobo and Senderos were gonna be useless, but to see Arteta, Bily, Donovan misplace just about every pass they attempted was so frustrating.
I really feel for the fans that travelled all that way, only to see Sporting take us apart like it was a training match.
Lets hope they pick it up for Sunday, and can regain a bit of focus in the league.
I said on another thread that with possibly 20 games left Ha Ha ha - it would be too much to think of 4th, now with only 12 games left (7 away) - playing like that, lets hope 10th isnt beyond us - what a load of shite last night - Oh to be a blue
Due to other long term commitments I couldn’t watch it live last night and recorded it on the Sky Box . I finally switched on at 11pm not knowing the result but it was clear after 30 mins that we were going to be tonked well and truely. I fast forward it to 90 mins ,saw 3-0 and promptly erased it from the Sky Box . I haven’t seen the goals but I damn well knew they were going to win.
The first 30 mins showed to me that the Yobo, Senderos combination was a nightmare about to happen, Billy was in his "this is all too much for me" mode and Saha was in his "cant be bothered mode". But worse by far worse was that our real hope of the footballing threesome - Arteta,Pinnear,Donovan, were completely outclassed by a Lisbon midfield . They went missing as did Captain Pip, and by the end of the 30 mins it looked to me that Howard was also at nerves end.
What went wrong ? , tactics possibly , caught between defending our 1 goal advantage or trying as previously stated by Moyes and Neville that we were going there to attack. Or was it the players that didn’t just turn up for the night. I tend to agree with Arteta’s post match comments that the outcome of the last 20 mins of the game at Goodison left the team in the defend or attack quandry , and neither was done at all. Moyes or players , we’ll never really know.
What it did prove to me last night that we seriously missed Fellaini and Cahill , our current midfield is too lightweight to get us through the games you need to scrap to get a result AND finally Yobo and Senderos are not good enough cover let alone first picks.
I dont think we’ll recover by Sunday and I suspect trying to get the 7th place and Europa place will depend on City imploding. But do we want a Europa place - I suspect we have in fact its a must to if only to keep the management and ambitious players at the club.
The first 30 mins showed to me that the Yobo, Senderos combination was a nightmare about to happen, Billy was in his "this is all too much for me" mode and Saha was in his "cant be bothered mode". But worse by far worse was that our real hope of the footballing threesome - Arteta,Pinnear,Donovan, were completely outclassed by a Lisbon midfield . They went missing as did Captain Pip, and by the end of the 30 mins it looked to me that Howard was also at nerves end.
What went wrong ? , tactics possibly , caught between defending our 1 goal advantage or trying as previously stated by Moyes and Neville that we were going there to attack. Or was it the players that didn’t just turn up for the night. I tend to agree with Arteta’s post match comments that the outcome of the last 20 mins of the game at Goodison left the team in the defend or attack quandry , and neither was done at all. Moyes or players , we’ll never really know.
What it did prove to me last night that we seriously missed Fellaini and Cahill , our current midfield is too lightweight to get us through the games you need to scrap to get a result AND finally Yobo and Senderos are not good enough cover let alone first picks.
I dont think we’ll recover by Sunday and I suspect trying to get the 7th place and Europa place will depend on City imploding. But do we want a Europa place - I suspect we have in fact its a must to if only to keep the management and ambitious players at the club.
I posted in an earlier mailbag at the start of the year that we would get to either the 4th/5th round of the FA cup and would not get passed Sporting Lisbon. 2 out of 3 with the third being 8th place finish in the league.
After reading many of the comments after that performance last night, I think a change of Motto would not be out of place.
"We biuld you up to let you down"
"We biuld you up to let you down"
Have to agree with the vast majority of comments so far. The whole team performance was a disgrace but even here some stood head and shoulders above the rest. Billy’s performance was appalling. In watching Everton for over 56 years I cannot remember being so angered by a player’s complacent attitude. His lack of effort, commitment and application was an utter disgrace and should not easily be forgiven. Senderos proved to be the lumbering oaf many observers have long suspected. Yobo has become a complete liability and needs castigating for his complete refusal to develop even the basic skills of the game, ridding himself of the dreadful, tiresome hoofing of a ball aimlessly upfield. In my humble opinion only Osman, Arteta and Jagielka could hold their heads up when it comes to professional application and dedication to the task at hand. I truly felt for the fans who had travelled to Lisbon and the humiliation inflicted upon them. At the very least they are entitled to a public apology from Mr Moyes and the team and most certainly some form of recompense. When young Coleman, Duffy look at some of those occupying their positions they must weep in anger and frustration.
Settled down to watch the game last night with the feeling that this might be a game too far, and without wishing to sound smug, was proved 100% right.
What people tend to forget is that in every level of football, right down to kids’ leagues, teams always up their game against opposition preceived as better than them.
We’ve just come off the back of very good performances against Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal, Citeh. All teams seen as better than us, either by the media or by ourselves.
To expect us to carry on ad infintum at that level with our small squad, half of which are not 100% fit after injuries, is optimistic in the extreme and somewhat naive.
I’m convinced Moyes would have tried to get them going, but the energy was just not there.
My main worry now is that the hangover continues into the Spurs game. Lose that and any chance of finishing higher than 6th goes right out the window.
Good point from last night was Jag’s return, but boy did he look knackered towards the end - he seems to be at least half a stone overweight!
What people tend to forget is that in every level of football, right down to kids’ leagues, teams always up their game against opposition preceived as better than them.
We’ve just come off the back of very good performances against Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal, Citeh. All teams seen as better than us, either by the media or by ourselves.
To expect us to carry on ad infintum at that level with our small squad, half of which are not 100% fit after injuries, is optimistic in the extreme and somewhat naive.
I’m convinced Moyes would have tried to get them going, but the energy was just not there.
My main worry now is that the hangover continues into the Spurs game. Lose that and any chance of finishing higher than 6th goes right out the window.
Good point from last night was Jag’s return, but boy did he look knackered towards the end - he seems to be at least half a stone overweight!
I understand all the anger about Evertons performance last night - It was awful. However, I don’t undersatand anybody saying we should have beaten Sporting just like that because they are rubbish.
Thats doing a great team (granted a struggling one) a real disservice and sounds churlish.
Ok, we were really poor but Sporting played us off the park last night and even at our best it would have been a close fought contest.
I think we were dazzled by how well they passed the ball and just panicked.
Thats doing a great team (granted a struggling one) a real disservice and sounds churlish.
Ok, we were really poor but Sporting played us off the park last night and even at our best it would have been a close fought contest.
I think we were dazzled by how well they passed the ball and just panicked.
I think the problems started further down the pitch that Osman. Yobo and Senderos were that bad that Arteta and Ossie were playing in the back four and Baines and Captain Pip had to hold fire on going forwards. Bily was terrible. Taking Bily and Senderos off and getting Jags and Rodwell in the team made us look better
More even and Sporting looked more vulnerable.
Stan Collymore made the point that Saha wasn’t able to keep the bal lvery well or lay it off to people - that is because the full back were staying back because of the liability of Yobo (who is looking worse with each game) and Sendros - in his 2nd / 3rd Everton game.
I’d rather we got closer to the fight for 4th that carried on the European 2nd Division!!!!!
More even and Sporting looked more vulnerable.
Stan Collymore made the point that Saha wasn’t able to keep the bal lvery well or lay it off to people - that is because the full back were staying back because of the liability of Yobo (who is looking worse with each game) and Sendros - in his 2nd / 3rd Everton game.
I’d rather we got closer to the fight for 4th that carried on the European 2nd Division!!!!!
We were shite last night, 100% shite. Given the talk before the game about going at them and not messing about, you can only wonder where the fuck that performance came from.
It was like watching Wimbledon (before they were good). Shocking. We made them look like Barcelona. Long ball from first almost to last. Putting ourselves under pressure with crap movement and passing.
And so to Spurs. Will the season still be alive after Sunday? Not if we play like last night.
Haven’t stopped shaking head since final whistle and in severely pissed of frame of mind today.
Bastards! :)
It was like watching Wimbledon (before they were good). Shocking. We made them look like Barcelona. Long ball from first almost to last. Putting ourselves under pressure with crap movement and passing.
And so to Spurs. Will the season still be alive after Sunday? Not if we play like last night.
Haven’t stopped shaking head since final whistle and in severely pissed of frame of mind today.
Bastards! :)
We got what we deserved - nothing. Looked like a side that had never played in Europe before - out played, out thought, out fought, no desire, no idea, no passion, no heart.
We can’t use the small squad and injuries excuses - look at Fulham.
Our tactics were wrong, one up front which lets the other side attack you and then we defend on our own 18 yard line, although I use the word defend in it’s loosest sense.
It raises the question - should we bother trying to qualify for Europe when everytime we come up against even an average Euro side it’s like men against boys. We’re ok at home - Fiorentina, Sporting, Zenit - but we’re crap away. Can you imagine playing against the best European sides - the Barcas, Real, etc.
We’re out of our league in more ways than one.
We can’t use the small squad and injuries excuses - look at Fulham.
Our tactics were wrong, one up front which lets the other side attack you and then we defend on our own 18 yard line, although I use the word defend in it’s loosest sense.
It raises the question - should we bother trying to qualify for Europe when everytime we come up against even an average Euro side it’s like men against boys. We’re ok at home - Fiorentina, Sporting, Zenit - but we’re crap away. Can you imagine playing against the best European sides - the Barcas, Real, etc.
We’re out of our league in more ways than one.
Robbie
Fulham’s last 4 league games were against Brum, Burnley Bolton & Portsmouth. If we had come off the back of playing that lot maybe we wouldn’t have been so knackered?
Fulham’s last 4 league games were against Brum, Burnley Bolton & Portsmouth. If we had come off the back of playing that lot maybe we wouldn’t have been so knackered?
Yobos distribution was shit. Senderos was playing with a back problem. We missed Jonny H big style.
I’m fed up with pundits and everyone else pointing to the goal conceded at Goodison as "a turning point" or "when we lost the tie". Absolute rubbish. Going into last night we were 2-1 up, playing great footie and just needed to go at them and we would now be contemplating the Athletico tie. We lost it in the second leg, not the first, because we played like 11 strangers who’d forgotten what they do best. 2nd leg tactics and player lethargy cost us last night not a "first half" penalty.
By the way Rodwell was again culpable in the build up to one of their goals last night (I think it was the first) with a sloppy pass just like the one to Distin; which conveniently got forgotten IMO. A great goal against Utd. doesn’t excuse getting the basics wrong for a player with so much "potential". I’m glad we are getting senior players back now so he can go into a slower learning curve and get these simple mistakes out his system.
By the way Rodwell was again culpable in the build up to one of their goals last night (I think it was the first) with a sloppy pass just like the one to Distin; which conveniently got forgotten IMO. A great goal against Utd. doesn’t excuse getting the basics wrong for a player with so much "potential". I’m glad we are getting senior players back now so he can go into a slower learning curve and get these simple mistakes out his system.
For me Everton are a basically a (sorry, can’t think of a way to sugar-coat this) dumb as fuck.
I don’t think there is one really good brain in the entire organisation.
Arteta?
His play at times is pretty enough and he has a better touch than most but (because we’re dumb as well) we tend to think a lot of the continental players are smart.
Smarter than our chaps maybe but that doesn’t make anyone smart, clever, canny etc.
Collectively and as individuals, the same mistakes are repeated over and over and over and...
Nobody seems to learn anything.
It’s as if the mental slate is wiped clean after every game - win lose or draw.
"What did we do right that got us that last win?"
"Durr...........forget"
"And that defeat?"
"Durr.......forget!"
I remember in one game last year watching Howard welly the ball from goal-kicks EVERY single fucking time to the opposition centre half (who would simply butt it back to the halfway line).
I thought will it at ANY stage occur to him that this isn’t working and he might have be better rolling it out to someone.
No it didn’t.
Moyes is a slightly different case (though no towering intellect) - his problem (therefore ours!) is a lack of imagination.
For me the only thing good that could come out of this season, is the amount of young players ready to go NEXT season.
That would mean using the rest of this season to play as many of them, in as many games TOGETHER.
I mean we’re not going down and we’re not finishing fourth so why not do something that could excite and surprise.
Why not play them, tell em’ "don’t worry about results, go out and show off, do tricks, fuck - about"
Of course I know that won’t happen, because I know (and so do you) what WILL
ie: There’ll be a few more wins, couple of defeats, couple of draws, couple of decent performances, couple of shite performance and if we’re VERY ’lucky’ more Europa.
In other words more of the same treading-water dullness.
I don’t think there is one really good brain in the entire organisation.
Arteta?
His play at times is pretty enough and he has a better touch than most but (because we’re dumb as well) we tend to think a lot of the continental players are smart.
Smarter than our chaps maybe but that doesn’t make anyone smart, clever, canny etc.
Collectively and as individuals, the same mistakes are repeated over and over and over and...
Nobody seems to learn anything.
It’s as if the mental slate is wiped clean after every game - win lose or draw.
"What did we do right that got us that last win?"
"Durr...........forget"
"And that defeat?"
"Durr.......forget!"
I remember in one game last year watching Howard welly the ball from goal-kicks EVERY single fucking time to the opposition centre half (who would simply butt it back to the halfway line).
I thought will it at ANY stage occur to him that this isn’t working and he might have be better rolling it out to someone.
No it didn’t.
Moyes is a slightly different case (though no towering intellect) - his problem (therefore ours!) is a lack of imagination.
For me the only thing good that could come out of this season, is the amount of young players ready to go NEXT season.
That would mean using the rest of this season to play as many of them, in as many games TOGETHER.
I mean we’re not going down and we’re not finishing fourth so why not do something that could excite and surprise.
Why not play them, tell em’ "don’t worry about results, go out and show off, do tricks, fuck - about"
Of course I know that won’t happen, because I know (and so do you) what WILL
ie: There’ll be a few more wins, couple of defeats, couple of draws, couple of decent performances, couple of shite performance and if we’re VERY ’lucky’ more Europa.
In other words more of the same treading-water dullness.
People are blaiming Moyes.
But the players are responsible. You don’t go from passing Man United off the park, to being incapable of stringing passes together in the space of 5 days if the players were getting too ahead of themselves.
Anyone blaming Moyes wants to think, does he really want to be having Yobo, floating hanging hoof balls in all night?
I don’t think he does! At least Heitinga thinks about what he’s going to do with the ball.
Someone saying that this was the - reverse of the Man Utd game would be spot on.
We never got going. And the passing was terrible. But thats not the manager thats the players.
In European competition you keep hold of possession. Thats the key to defending.
Certain players though couldn’t string a pass together last night though (yet were performing at the weekend).
I don’t doubt Moyes was apoplectic last night with one or two.
POSSESSION POSSESSION POSSESSION.
The midfield did it against Utd. But not last night at all.
The only thing Moyes was forced to change was the defenders..................... which didn’t help to say the least.
I am much more confident with Heitinga at the back. Aside from giving away one two may corners or throws, when he’s in possession he slows the game down and thinks 9 times out of 10 about what he’s doing.
But the players are responsible. You don’t go from passing Man United off the park, to being incapable of stringing passes together in the space of 5 days if the players were getting too ahead of themselves.
Anyone blaming Moyes wants to think, does he really want to be having Yobo, floating hanging hoof balls in all night?
I don’t think he does! At least Heitinga thinks about what he’s going to do with the ball.
Someone saying that this was the - reverse of the Man Utd game would be spot on.
We never got going. And the passing was terrible. But thats not the manager thats the players.
In European competition you keep hold of possession. Thats the key to defending.
Certain players though couldn’t string a pass together last night though (yet were performing at the weekend).
I don’t doubt Moyes was apoplectic last night with one or two.
POSSESSION POSSESSION POSSESSION.
The midfield did it against Utd. But not last night at all.
The only thing Moyes was forced to change was the defenders..................... which didn’t help to say the least.
I am much more confident with Heitinga at the back. Aside from giving away one two may corners or throws, when he’s in possession he slows the game down and thinks 9 times out of 10 about what he’s doing.
No energy from the first whistle. Yobo had one of his baby giraffe in flip-flops games. Mentally not prepared, no fight and clueless.
I sincerely believe that if Heitinga and even Distan had been playing, it would have been a different result. The whole team were shit scared to push on because they had no confidence in our two centre backs. Instead of our results against Manu & Chelsea helping, I actually think it made us believe we could win playing at 70%. They believed their own publicity, the stupid twats.
I sincerely believe that if Heitinga and even Distan had been playing, it would have been a different result. The whole team were shit scared to push on because they had no confidence in our two centre backs. Instead of our results against Manu & Chelsea helping, I actually think it made us believe we could win playing at 70%. They believed their own publicity, the stupid twats.
I seriously doubt Yobo would get back in the first XI with that showing last night.
As I say the huge difference with Heitinga when he has the ball, is he’s looking to use it. Not just get rid of it (unless he has to).
I saw Osman come deep to try and pick it up,but Sporting obviously did their home work from the Man Utd game and tracked anyone doing this.
You win by passing teams off the park, especially in Europe but it seems
- that the winning midfield on Saturday against United, needs someone like Heitinga at the back to work off... who uses the ball
- that the midfield played on Saturday can’t play two consequtive matches in the same week without tiring.
Everton aren’t a hoof ball team.
They’re just made into one when Yobo stops thinking about what he’s doing and the midfield stop (or incapable) of continual moving and passing.
Because players like Yobo just hit it....
(And I’m not normally one to single a player out)
As I say the huge difference with Heitinga when he has the ball, is he’s looking to use it. Not just get rid of it (unless he has to).
I saw Osman come deep to try and pick it up,but Sporting obviously did their home work from the Man Utd game and tracked anyone doing this.
You win by passing teams off the park, especially in Europe but it seems
- that the winning midfield on Saturday against United, needs someone like Heitinga at the back to work off... who uses the ball
- that the midfield played on Saturday can’t play two consequtive matches in the same week without tiring.
Everton aren’t a hoof ball team.
They’re just made into one when Yobo stops thinking about what he’s doing and the midfield stop (or incapable) of continual moving and passing.
Because players like Yobo just hit it....
(And I’m not normally one to single a player out)
Mark the trouble with claiming DM isn’t responsible for the tactics and strategy and what his players do on the pitch is plain wrong. Neville was constantly being told to push up, the defensive lumps DM played were fucking awful, he could see that from the first few minutes but it was only Senderos’ injury that forced him top make a change. Neville was constantly skinned yet he left him on, the midfield looked so shite as it was constantly bypassed with trademark hoofballs from Yobo and Neville with a fair few early on from Baines too. The midfield had to drop back to bring the ball out of defence themselves far too many times and didn’t challenge for the majority of second balls. The midfield and defence let Sporting players come at them at least ten yards or more before even trying to tackle them.
All of these are schoolboy mistakes, yet DM is still paid very handsomely to coach and manage them but yet again doesn’t appear to have learned any lessons or be capable of making the changes needed to change the game. I watched the Inter Chelsea game the other night and was quickly reminded on how Mourinho makes his changes early and how well he can see a game changing tactic and employs it. I’m not claiming to have half the decent players in our squad they have even warming their bench but the premise is a simple and proven one, manager and evolve your gameplay to the game at hand.
All of these are schoolboy mistakes, yet DM is still paid very handsomely to coach and manage them but yet again doesn’t appear to have learned any lessons or be capable of making the changes needed to change the game. I watched the Inter Chelsea game the other night and was quickly reminded on how Mourinho makes his changes early and how well he can see a game changing tactic and employs it. I’m not claiming to have half the decent players in our squad they have even warming their bench but the premise is a simple and proven one, manager and evolve your gameplay to the game at hand.
Think last night showed quite a few players that are frankly not good enough and need to be shipped out.
Yobo being one- probably the 4th choice left back when all are fit. Would also be tempted to flog Bily in the summer, as he just doesn’t really look interested and put in a shocking display last night. I’m not sure how long the tiredness excuse is going to wash. Selling Bily could potentially free up some money to make a bid for Donovan in the summer. The fact that a half-fit Jags who hadn’t played for 10 months was about our best player when he came on just about sums it all up
Yobo being one- probably the 4th choice left back when all are fit. Would also be tempted to flog Bily in the summer, as he just doesn’t really look interested and put in a shocking display last night. I’m not sure how long the tiredness excuse is going to wash. Selling Bily could potentially free up some money to make a bid for Donovan in the summer. The fact that a half-fit Jags who hadn’t played for 10 months was about our best player when he came on just about sums it all up
"the defensive lumps DM played were fucking awful"
He couldn’t play Heitinga or Distin so what’s you point?
And Neville is on the flank - he should be pushing up.
Anyway someone’s already commented that if the players don’t follow instruction (As the England Team example - it happens), then theres only one option and to ship the ones not doing so out.
You’re making comparisons with Mourinho? I think thats just aload of bollocks.
The players fault, coupled with us missing Heitinga.
Watch replays of the Chelsea, Man City, Man Utd games.
He slows the game down when we need to or speeds it up as well.
Not what Yobo was doing at all.
He couldn’t play Heitinga or Distin so what’s you point?
And Neville is on the flank - he should be pushing up.
Anyway someone’s already commented that if the players don’t follow instruction (As the England Team example - it happens), then theres only one option and to ship the ones not doing so out.
You’re making comparisons with Mourinho? I think thats just aload of bollocks.
The players fault, coupled with us missing Heitinga.
Watch replays of the Chelsea, Man City, Man Utd games.
He slows the game down when we need to or speeds it up as well.
Not what Yobo was doing at all.
Another false dawn.
I guess thats why Chelsea,Man U and The RS pay over 250 million for squads witha winning mentality and why they are far more consistent over the longer term.
Our lads shit themselves last night.
Billy didnt look like a 10 bob player let alone 10 million.
Pienaar looked as if he was still pissed in Liverpool,maybe he was because he didnt show up last night.
As someone else said Howard thinks its better to kick the ball 60 yards down the pitch and it comes straight back at you than to keep possession.
Maybe they were tired after the Utd game?
But there are no excuses.
That was a pitiful performance apart from the last 15 when they woke up to the fact they were going out.
I guess thats why Chelsea,Man U and The RS pay over 250 million for squads witha winning mentality and why they are far more consistent over the longer term.
Our lads shit themselves last night.
Billy didnt look like a 10 bob player let alone 10 million.
Pienaar looked as if he was still pissed in Liverpool,maybe he was because he didnt show up last night.
As someone else said Howard thinks its better to kick the ball 60 yards down the pitch and it comes straight back at you than to keep possession.
Maybe they were tired after the Utd game?
But there are no excuses.
That was a pitiful performance apart from the last 15 when they woke up to the fact they were going out.
We lined up exactly the way we did against Chelsea and Man United, but all of a sudden we were employing negative tactics, who the fuck was going to legislate for Yobo and Ponderous insisting on keeping Howard company? Neville was screaming at them, Moyes was screaming at them, Arteta was screaming at them every fucker in the ground and watching telly was screaming at them but they couldn't muster the bravery to march on, poor baines didn't know whether to shit or bust
That was only part of our problem, Bily and Donaovan hardly broke sweat and more to the point didnt look as if they intended to. We were spread out like Queens Drive leaving a compact skilfull little outfit to run rings around us.
Moutinho run the show for half an hour, until Ossie put the shackles on him, but by doing that we merely sacrificed our most creative player and anyway people like Mendes proved more than capable of picking up the baton. whist they moved as a unit, our midfield were falling between a couple of stools that were sixty yards apart
This competition has been ill fated from day one, we have never at any stage been able to put a fully fit defensive partnership on the pitch, which is crucial in European football.
Everton or certain Everton players were painfully naive last night and they paid the price,
So let the vultures enjoy their feast, they haven't had any bones to pick for a couple of weeks. let the clueless single out their usual whipping boys, they know no better.
We travel to Spurs on Sunday and we’ll beat em and the vultures will be scrambling for cover again.
"The back line were all over the place before Jagielka come on" ...fuck me
Now I’m not having a go at Jags here, he was understandably off the pace but the three goals we conceded in the half hour he was actually on the pitch provide conclusive proof that no matter how dumb Eugene thinks our players are, some of the posters on here to make them look footballing Einsteins.
Lots of justifiable angst. Tactics v Players personal responsibility.
Does anyone seriously believe that all outfield players did not show up because of coincidence? There are reasons when a whole team fails to perform. This is not a new phenomenon at Everton as we all know.
There are also reasons why Howard/Yobo continually hoof it-if the coach disapproved they simply wouldn’t do it. But what could possibly be the reason fo banging r ignoring the football/creative element in the team and simply the ball over their heads in Saha’s general direction?
Aye, Dave...Osman put the shackles on Moutinho..
What a pile of shite.
Should’ve went to specsavers mate...
I’d explain the difference between being defensively organised and shipping deflected goals...but I doubt you’d understand.
What a pile of shite.
Should’ve went to specsavers mate...
I’d explain the difference between being defensively organised and shipping deflected goals...but I doubt you’d understand.
Try me
I’d love to hear this one
I’d love to hear this one
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1 Posted 26/02/2010 at 01:54:51
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It's was only 2 games and 6 points, ok we played well... but 2 wins doesn't mean we are world beaters or on par with great sides from the 80s.
Perhaps we just need to get things in perspective and realise we aren't the finished article?
It's only the Europa League for Christ's sake! Can we really expect to compete or even qualify for the CL!??
That performance last night was nothing short of a disgrace and all fans who attended should be given a refund or apology...
The whole team had a bad night.. can't blame it on the first leg, we were awful when we should of defended our slender lead by attacking more.