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No surprise for Wilson!!!
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"Well, it was no surprise to me. In fact I predicted this 4 - 1 disaster (and the ludicrous goalline decision) in my post FOUR MONTHS AGO! My Wilson-like football knowledge knows no limits and continues to make me loadsa money." -- Dave Wilson
Michael Kenrick, Posted 27/06/2010 at 16:49:55
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Why will so many English fans be disappointed this evening? Because Sky and other media have over hyped these over paid, spoilt brats, who are nothing like as talented as they're cracked up to be.
Don't get me wrong ... on a personal level, I could't care less, but it does intrigue me why the fans fall for the same old BS tournament after tournament.
Spot on, Mike, listening on TalkSport all week and hearing how the England squad is so much better than the Germans and how confidence is back because we beat the mighty Slovenia 1-0. Now we will hear the excuses that they play too many games and how tired they are.
The players are good enough, its just as bad a cliche to come out with the nonsense Mike's just spouted.
That England team was never set up in the right way, three of them just aren't good enough (Barry, Upson and Milner) and Capello's management is incomparably bad. Even Steve McClaren made decisions that made sense (apart from the Scott Carson one obviously).
Having said that, I'm not disappointed, because its pretty much what I expected, although not the emphatic scoreline. What's to be said about the non-goal though? It was an absolute game changer, there were long periods of that game where England dominated and the possession was 55-45% in our favour until quite near the end.
That England team was never set up in the right way, three of them just aren't good enough (Barry, Upson and Milner) and Capello's management is incomparably bad. Even Steve McClaren made decisions that made sense (apart from the Scott Carson one obviously).
Having said that, I'm not disappointed, because its pretty much what I expected, although not the emphatic scoreline. What's to be said about the non-goal though? It was an absolute game changer, there were long periods of that game where England dominated and the possession was 55-45% in our favour until quite near the end.
My personal highlight of the World Cup was the an incredulous sounding Alan Shearer reflecting on the statement that proves he is a know-nothing, "We sat here before the game and to a man said the England players were better than the Germans. If the Germans are watching this they must think we are mugs".
Um... YOU ARE MUGS! As are so many England fans. Ze Germans are a good team, give them credit and realise the England 'boys' are nowhere near as good. Certainly they can't be moulded into a good 'team'. Give me that Ozil lad over Stevie G anyday...
Talking of which, Moyesie, hope you're scouting for players that good....
Um... YOU ARE MUGS! As are so many England fans. Ze Germans are a good team, give them credit and realise the England 'boys' are nowhere near as good. Certainly they can't be moulded into a good 'team'. Give me that Ozil lad over Stevie G anyday...
Talking of which, Moyesie, hope you're scouting for players that good....
Just glad none of our players in the crap on display today. How can defenders from struggling Prem sides get into the England team? Are managers like arse winger stopping good englih talent from progressing?
I'm more worried about the Mirror's story on Arteta than England's dismal display and subsequent early departure.
I think England'd have done better if Ronney had been playing!
I think England'd have done better if Ronney had been playing!
That fountain of knowledge Keegan after the Germany Ghana game said Germany are nothing to be worried about, laughed out loud then and lughed even louder at each goal today, including Fat Frank's disallowed goal which will be the reason Engerland went out no doubt, simple mathematics says it would still have made it 4-2 and a loss. As said above, spoilt brats and players not fit for internationals; King, Carragher, Heskey, Barry, Fat Frank, Calamity James, Plug from Bash Street Kids.
Thank god someone put them out of their misery for a few more years. Roll on another landfill stuffed to the brim with those crappy car flags.
Thank god someone put them out of their misery for a few more years. Roll on another landfill stuffed to the brim with those crappy car flags.
"simple mathematics says it would still have made it 4-2 and a loss"
Yes, but football doesn't work like that. England at 2-2 might not have been chasing the game with so many of their ponderous defenders upfield.
They would almost surely have lost anyway, though, and the margin of defeat will hopefully start an inquest into why the Germans look like a hungry team of athletes and England's looks like the bunch of slow, overpaid, miserable and disjointed lot they clearly are.
If ever the entire domestic system needed overhauling from the grassroots up it's now. Won't happen, though...
Anyway, as Brian says, the possibility that that story about Arteta could be true has hit me harder than anything that's happened at the World Cup so far.
Yes, but football doesn't work like that. England at 2-2 might not have been chasing the game with so many of their ponderous defenders upfield.
They would almost surely have lost anyway, though, and the margin of defeat will hopefully start an inquest into why the Germans look like a hungry team of athletes and England's looks like the bunch of slow, overpaid, miserable and disjointed lot they clearly are.
If ever the entire domestic system needed overhauling from the grassroots up it's now. Won't happen, though...
Anyway, as Brian says, the possibility that that story about Arteta could be true has hit me harder than anything that's happened at the World Cup so far.
At 2-2 this was a different game. Even watching from a TV screen I could see it crossed the line. How did both the ref and the linesman miss it?
England capitiulated. Gerrard and Rooney never performed, Green bottled it.
Question is; is this end for Capello?
England capitiulated. Gerrard and Rooney never performed, Green bottled it.
Question is; is this end for Capello?
@4: I don't do cliche. I leave that to the arrogant and ill-informed who feed on the hype and then feel bitter.
As I say, England's demise means nothing to me. As an Irishman, I prefer whoever play England to win.
But, as a human being, I'd prefer some sign of an intelligent appreciation of why the same thing keeps happening.
Not the manager, not the tactics,but sub standard playersat this level of competition. As in '70 etc.
Get with it, people. These heroes have clay feet.
As I say, England's demise means nothing to me. As an Irishman, I prefer whoever play England to win.
But, as a human being, I'd prefer some sign of an intelligent appreciation of why the same thing keeps happening.
Not the manager, not the tactics,but sub standard playersat this level of competition. As in '70 etc.
Get with it, people. These heroes have clay feet.
Michael Kenrick you are a coward. . . a coward of the highest order.
When you ejaculated all over the TW home page over a Donovan goal, a goal that will never be spoken about again - except on one of those great Goal keeping fuck up Dvds - I pointed out that it was a goalkeeping error.
Because rather than try to ingratiate myself - Brendan style - I pointed out the stupidity of your letter, you decide to delete my next 3- 4 posts and send me private threatening emails.
Daring to put exclamation marks next to a quote you've dreamed up and attributed to me makes you a fucken liar too.
Everything I predicted in My "Great expectations" article 23-4-2010 has so far come true. that is a Fact. . . People can look it up, - unless you delete the article too - they can then read some of the utter shite you come out with and draw their own conclusions.
Of course you will wave customary cowardly censorship card and delete this post and no doubt all my future posts, but hopefully enough people will see it to know what kind of a man you are
Wilson like Knowledge ? You wouldnt dare not delete my reply to that, but at least I stick my neck out . . .FOUR MONTHS before the event and I risk being wrong.
Kenrick- Like Knowledge ? Gutless wise arse gobshitedness . . .after the event of course.
Brendan
Schadenfreude means taking pleasure in other people misfortunes, compared to the Irish footy fan, nobody but NOBODY is unfortunate. Get some dignity lad and stop kissing kenricks arse, TW may be his train set, but you wont to find a match going Evertonian who doesnt think he`s a fucken idiot
Finally Kenrick
if you want to stand toe to toe with me on these pages have the bollocks to do so, but if you ever try to insult me again then Hide behind your gutless "big brother" censorship you will regret it.
You wont see me coming next time
When you ejaculated all over the TW home page over a Donovan goal, a goal that will never be spoken about again - except on one of those great Goal keeping fuck up Dvds - I pointed out that it was a goalkeeping error.
Because rather than try to ingratiate myself - Brendan style - I pointed out the stupidity of your letter, you decide to delete my next 3- 4 posts and send me private threatening emails.
Daring to put exclamation marks next to a quote you've dreamed up and attributed to me makes you a fucken liar too.
Everything I predicted in My "Great expectations" article 23-4-2010 has so far come true. that is a Fact. . . People can look it up, - unless you delete the article too - they can then read some of the utter shite you come out with and draw their own conclusions.
Of course you will wave customary cowardly censorship card and delete this post and no doubt all my future posts, but hopefully enough people will see it to know what kind of a man you are
Wilson like Knowledge ? You wouldnt dare not delete my reply to that, but at least I stick my neck out . . .FOUR MONTHS before the event and I risk being wrong.
Kenrick- Like Knowledge ? Gutless wise arse gobshitedness . . .after the event of course.
Brendan
Schadenfreude means taking pleasure in other people misfortunes, compared to the Irish footy fan, nobody but NOBODY is unfortunate. Get some dignity lad and stop kissing kenricks arse, TW may be his train set, but you wont to find a match going Evertonian who doesnt think he`s a fucken idiot
Finally Kenrick
if you want to stand toe to toe with me on these pages have the bollocks to do so, but if you ever try to insult me again then Hide behind your gutless "big brother" censorship you will regret it.
You wont see me coming next time
Mr. Wilson, you appear to be a bloated prick.
Does that count as toe to toe? Could I be a little more specific. Do tell.
Does that count as toe to toe? Could I be a little more specific. Do tell.
Dave - calm down lad. I know you're disappointed at going out of the WC today, but it was only a bit of banter.
Hmm. Dave Wison - looks like you have hit the self-destruct button.
I recenctly posted about how I felt England had not been good enough, and wouldn't get passed Germany playing the way they do.
You described this as a 'childlike mentality'. Now I hate to say I told you so.....
I recenctly posted about how I felt England had not been good enough, and wouldn't get passed Germany playing the way they do.
You described this as a 'childlike mentality'. Now I hate to say I told you so.....
Thank you Lyndon for putting that dimwit Gavin Ramejkis's constant anti-England attack into perspective.
Gavin — not sure what your problem is mate but you need help, us getting beat really surely mean that much. Whoever she was — forgive her.
For me. Its too early. We're still England. We'll always be the home of football.
Come on England.
Gavin — not sure what your problem is mate but you need help, us getting beat really surely mean that much. Whoever she was — forgive her.
For me. Its too early. We're still England. We'll always be the home of football.
Come on England.
Can we not blame Hibbert and Osman for this?
Oh - and Gavin, it's England not Engerland you witless cunt. OK?
Mike Green dimwit? Pull those pikey plastic flags off your motor and keep dreaming, Engerlands defence was shite, watch the replays and how far out of position Terry was for the first goal, ask yourself where the Terry and Upson where for the second? Better still sit back and join the journos with utter bullshit of the highest order on how your dear Engerland were robbed.
Engerland are not good enough, a young better side played them off the park and but for Klose not chipping Calamity James a few mins in and Ozil's shot being saved it would have been an even bigger embarrassment.
Engerland invented the game blah blah blah, one trophy blah blah blah, West Germany have three World Cups, three European Championships and including this tournament have reached the last quarter finals in the last 8 tournaments they have played in. If Englerland laid off the journo bullshit; dambusters, nazis, krauts, 1966 (44 fucking years ago!) thinking they deserve to win a tournament just by turning up and actually prepared and chose the right players and the right strategy they might, just might do something. I for one am not holding my breath. I pinned my colours way before the World Cup in Mike Kenrick's post, have followed the Germans since the 1974 World Cup.
There are plenty of folks I used to work with in Jersey who will testify I was in "the original wine bar" in St Helier the day Engerland put 5 past Germany but stayed put in my Germany top and chewed the fat with the entire pub and got plenty of drinks bought for me. Not twisted, just stuck to my colours and something I will continue to do.
Engerland are not good enough, a young better side played them off the park and but for Klose not chipping Calamity James a few mins in and Ozil's shot being saved it would have been an even bigger embarrassment.
Engerland invented the game blah blah blah, one trophy blah blah blah, West Germany have three World Cups, three European Championships and including this tournament have reached the last quarter finals in the last 8 tournaments they have played in. If Englerland laid off the journo bullshit; dambusters, nazis, krauts, 1966 (44 fucking years ago!) thinking they deserve to win a tournament just by turning up and actually prepared and chose the right players and the right strategy they might, just might do something. I for one am not holding my breath. I pinned my colours way before the World Cup in Mike Kenrick's post, have followed the Germans since the 1974 World Cup.
There are plenty of folks I used to work with in Jersey who will testify I was in "the original wine bar" in St Helier the day Engerland put 5 past Germany but stayed put in my Germany top and chewed the fat with the entire pub and got plenty of drinks bought for me. Not twisted, just stuck to my colours and something I will continue to do.
Jeez things are that heated in here nobodies even noticed my "Rooney" mispelling!
You make some good points Gavin but the car flags? I live in Germany and they have German car flags too. Every country has them. Are you gonna have a go at fans for wearing replica shirts too?
"But for Klose not chipping Calamity James a few mins in and Ozil's shot being saved it would have been an even bigger embarrassment"
And the England goal that never was? That would have changed things, and was better chance than either of the 'Germun' one's mentioned above.
"Engerland put 5 past Germany but stayed put in my Germany top"
Because that's not bitter.... I actually wanted Ireland to beat France because they felt like a 'home nation' to me. I didn't realise you lot are just as bad as the Scot's.
And the England goal that never was? That would have changed things, and was better chance than either of the 'Germun' one's mentioned above.
"Engerland put 5 past Germany but stayed put in my Germany top"
Because that's not bitter.... I actually wanted Ireland to beat France because they felt like a 'home nation' to me. I didn't realise you lot are just as bad as the Scot's.
Dave S - I don't think Gavin is actually Irish...
Gavin - sounds like you've got issues mate - not German but support Germany, live in England (or English territory) but hate England...?
Have a bit of respect though - I dont call the Germans the Bosch, Krauts or Nazi's etc. So it's "England" ok?
Besides - you keep going on about the 3 stars the Germans have over their badge, and right fully so. I'm pretty proud of the one we've got above ours no matter how much you want to belittle it. I'm not going to ask how many your mother country's has but personally dont give a toss. Whoever they are they cant be up to much if you're going to jump on the Germany bandwagon instead.
You Hero.
Have a bit of respect though - I dont call the Germans the Bosch, Krauts or Nazi's etc. So it's "England" ok?
Besides - you keep going on about the 3 stars the Germans have over their badge, and right fully so. I'm pretty proud of the one we've got above ours no matter how much you want to belittle it. I'm not going to ask how many your mother country's has but personally dont give a toss. Whoever they are they cant be up to much if you're going to jump on the Germany bandwagon instead.
You Hero.
"Dave S - I don't think Gavin is actually Irish... "
Ahem... Yes, my apologies Gavin. I believe I may have got myself mixed up on that one.
I hope no offence was caused...
Ahem... Yes, my apologies Gavin. I believe I may have got myself mixed up on that one.
I hope no offence was caused...
So we're not as bad as the Scots after all then?
It wouldn't appear so Brendan.
I may have been a tad hasty with that statement....
I may have been a tad hasty with that statement....
Dave Smith
"I told you so" You are having a laugh mate, I dont give a fuck How anti English you are, NOBODY can say with any degree of certainty that things wouldn't have been different but for a ridiculous decision. Any football fan knows that at 2-2 it would have been a completely different game. So don't come on all smug, you just look silly.
The game has gone, we were shite and got what we deserved.
Brendan.
Banter is a two way thing, but when one party insults another, then abuses their position by denying them the right to reply, that isn't banter ... it's gobshitedness.
"I told you so" You are having a laugh mate, I dont give a fuck How anti English you are, NOBODY can say with any degree of certainty that things wouldn't have been different but for a ridiculous decision. Any football fan knows that at 2-2 it would have been a completely different game. So don't come on all smug, you just look silly.
The game has gone, we were shite and got what we deserved.
Brendan.
Banter is a two way thing, but when one party insults another, then abuses their position by denying them the right to reply, that isn't banter ... it's gobshitedness.
Mike, you come out with 'Dimwit' and 'Witless cunt'... did you ask for help on those two? You also use the term 'hero' which is humorous when this is a web based forum with little or no chance of ever meeting the person you are trying to slate, try looking up hero and thinking about that. Then you denigrate why someone in a democratic society choses to support who they want? You taken it upon yourself to ram this country and supporting it down my throat all you like and I'll spew it back right at you.
The national side is a disgrace, the whole setup has been all my life, thats 41 years, I chose to support a side that doesn't have to revert to it's national press rolling out the old second world war antics and stories or build up a clearly inadequate team to the point where even the players begin to believe their own non-deserved legend status; just what is it the national team has won?
Geoff, there was a very interesting interview with some Germans on the radio this week before the game asking why the British press is non stop dambusters, the war, beating the hun, beating the nazis, etc and how the press stir up a whole storm of xenophobia. One chap even pointed out he was born in the early 80s and his father born after the war so what the hell does it have to do with a football game yet gets rolled out every single game with Germany?
You don't chose the country you are born in but you have every fucking right to chose what team you support be it in any league or competition you like. I chose to support Germany because as a boy I watched the 1974 World Cup and was mesmorised by the German team on display and even in the final against Cruyff's team and skill they overcame them and won. I watched the 5-1 game in the knowledge they could well be beaten but it was the one and only time I believe I will see that scoreline again, even your nationalistic friends sing "and even Heskey scored" which pretty much says it all.
Finally, to put the record straight, born in this country and family origins are English and Canadian on one side and Lithuanian and Irish on the other side, so yes, a mongrel... but one with a British passport but also one not so blinkered or spineless to not make my own mind up over who the fuck I support.
OK Dave, but hopefully I didn't insult you. The old 'W-L-F-K' was a bit of a laugh, that's all.
Gavin - I've just been on to "the orginal wine bar" in St Helier - I kid you not - and they said "Who? Oh yeah, that twat, yeah. Mate of yours...? Owes us £80 on unpaid bar bills."
I dont know.
I dont know.
Dave (12) - Now THAT was a post.
Has the media coverage been all about the Second World War?
I've personally seen a lot of sensitive stuff on the BBC about South Africa's apartheid history and even a smidgin of decency from ITV coverage. Pundits are still shit obviously, but no-one I listened to talked about WWII...
Clearly I must be reading the wrong paper.
I've personally seen a lot of sensitive stuff on the BBC about South Africa's apartheid history and even a smidgin of decency from ITV coverage. Pundits are still shit obviously, but no-one I listened to talked about WWII...
Clearly I must be reading the wrong paper.
OK Gavin - fair dues.
It's easy for me - I was born in England, as were my siblings, parents, grandparents etc.
So, I'm English, pure and simple. I threrefore support England, always have, always will.
I accept your position is more complicated and respect that.
There is a phrase known as "gracious in victory" which you might want to check out — given your team has given the team you've clearly got so much bitterness against a comprehensive thrashing?
Or maybe that's why you support a team that has zip to do with your nation of birth or origins. No character.
Well done, Germany, for tonight, they deserved it. Roll on 2014.
It's easy for me - I was born in England, as were my siblings, parents, grandparents etc.
So, I'm English, pure and simple. I threrefore support England, always have, always will.
I accept your position is more complicated and respect that.
There is a phrase known as "gracious in victory" which you might want to check out — given your team has given the team you've clearly got so much bitterness against a comprehensive thrashing?
Or maybe that's why you support a team that has zip to do with your nation of birth or origins. No character.
Well done, Germany, for tonight, they deserved it. Roll on 2014.
"Dave Smith
"I told you so" You are having a laugh mate, I dont give a fuck How anti English you are, NOBODY can say with any degree of certainty that things wouldnt have been different but for a ridiculous decision. Any football fan knows that at 2-2 it would have been a completely different game. so dont come on all smug, you just look silly"
I take it you didn't bother to read my post at #10? I believe you are the one who looks silly....
Your ' I dont give a fuck how anti-English you are' statemant is laughable. How can you not have noticed my Englishness by now?
"I told you so" You are having a laugh mate, I dont give a fuck How anti English you are, NOBODY can say with any degree of certainty that things wouldnt have been different but for a ridiculous decision. Any football fan knows that at 2-2 it would have been a completely different game. so dont come on all smug, you just look silly"
I take it you didn't bother to read my post at #10? I believe you are the one who looks silly....
Your ' I dont give a fuck how anti-English you are' statemant is laughable. How can you not have noticed my Englishness by now?
There's a few people in here "Oh, I support Germany" etc that is just pathetic attention seeking. Fair does, I don't care about international football anyway but I don't just decide to support the nation I live in's biggest rivals.
My Jesus has everyone been on the stella today?
I forsee a sharp increase in domestic violence. Roll on Blackburn away.
David - I've been on Birra Morriti and Pouilly Fuisse all day which combined has probably had the same effect.
Do I stick or do I twist.?
Cab Sav here I come!!!!!
Do I stick or do I twist.?
Cab Sav here I come!!!!!
Haha..
Mark Lawrencson gave me a good old cuckle during the match..."only 1 or maybe two of the German team would get into theEngland team"
Indeed. In the words of Lloyd Bridges.....'he picked the wrong day to give up crack cocaine'
Good one Lawro.
Mark Lawrencson gave me a good old cuckle during the match..."only 1 or maybe two of the German team would get into theEngland team"
Indeed. In the words of Lloyd Bridges.....'he picked the wrong day to give up crack cocaine'
Good one Lawro.
Wha-hey! Forget Cab Sav, pop open the champagne - here's McGlone! At last something to cheer about!
Ciaran, it was probably the first joke he cracked with any originality in it.
Probably a true statement from Lawro, Capello would not have picked any of those players.
Did we lose then?
It's times like these when you appreciate and love club football and not have to watch 11 spineless, gutless and dis-interested shitheads representing your national team!!! Roll on August 14th! Cannot wait.
Gavin - just out of curiousity I only had one team to choose from but you had four..........?
Why not support one of England, Canada, Ireland or Lithuania? Or even all of them rather than none...?
Or were you just too "blinkered" or "spineless" as you would put it to stick to your roots?
Why not support one of England, Canada, Ireland or Lithuania? Or even all of them rather than none...?
Or were you just too "blinkered" or "spineless" as you would put it to stick to your roots?
Couldn't be arsed to read most of the comments. Have we decided that the English are crap footballers, or is there a proportion blaming an Italian manager etc?
Nah. Don't care. We'll hear the same garbage come the Euros.
Nah. Don't care. We'll hear the same garbage come the Euros.
Why thank you Mike....But having read the thread above - I don't think I've anything to add to this particular little bitching session..
Dave appears to be getting it in the neck from Toffeeweb Towers.
Makes a change from me I suppose!
Haha...
Dave appears to be getting it in the neck from Toffeeweb Towers.
Makes a change from me I suppose!
Haha...
It'll be curious to see how many of these posts (including this one) last 24 hours...
Anyway...As an Irishmen, I wasn't too upset about today's result. Although, for once, I wasn't thrilled either: I genuinely don't like that type of humiliation. The only way English fans will lose my sympathy for having to watch that debacle is if they try to hide behind that phantom goal. I know it sucks, but it wasn't the reason you lost.
Here is the only thing I'm concerned about: Although the Premier League hasn't boasted many great English players for years, I still feel like this humiliating thumping of England resonates with a larger pattern in the last year: The poor performance of English teams in the Champions league this year; the migration of talent away from the league to Spain. In short, are we about to witness a relative eclipse of England as the site of world-class football? That could be bad for Everton because I think we can draw players here with the promise of first-team football in the greatest league in the world. It is patently not the greatest league in the world at the moment.
Anyway...As an Irishmen, I wasn't too upset about today's result. Although, for once, I wasn't thrilled either: I genuinely don't like that type of humiliation. The only way English fans will lose my sympathy for having to watch that debacle is if they try to hide behind that phantom goal. I know it sucks, but it wasn't the reason you lost.
Here is the only thing I'm concerned about: Although the Premier League hasn't boasted many great English players for years, I still feel like this humiliating thumping of England resonates with a larger pattern in the last year: The poor performance of English teams in the Champions league this year; the migration of talent away from the league to Spain. In short, are we about to witness a relative eclipse of England as the site of world-class football? That could be bad for Everton because I think we can draw players here with the promise of first-team football in the greatest league in the world. It is patently not the greatest league in the world at the moment.
It is somewhat ironic that I have spoken to a number of Irish friends today who have told me to stop whinging about the disallowed goal, when they whinned on about Thierry Henry's handball so much (to the extent that they were demanding a replay).
Point taken, Chris. I found the Irish whinging about the Henry goal a little much as well. If the shoe were on the other foot, we would have taken that "goal" in a flash.
That said...if the England game were even close, I would feel robbed if I were you lot. And while I accept the dynamic would have been different if you went in 2-2, I think the facts are that England were comprehensively beaten by a more quicker, more passionate, more inventive side.
And, as surprised with myself as I was, I did not relish watching that drubbing. But that is what is was. The English side looked absolutely exhausted. Can you name one player that was a hero for England on that park? I have lots of English friends and family and I know they're hurting this evening, but that team and that manager have been a disgrace.
Compare Mexico against Argentina. Mexico had to struggle on with a terrible decision which certainly lead to Argentina's second goal (the Mexicans heads weren't in the game), but they played on like absolute heroes. I'd be honored to wear a Mexican shirt after their campaign. Can an English supporter honestly say the same? And with the quality that the team has?
That said...if the England game were even close, I would feel robbed if I were you lot. And while I accept the dynamic would have been different if you went in 2-2, I think the facts are that England were comprehensively beaten by a more quicker, more passionate, more inventive side.
And, as surprised with myself as I was, I did not relish watching that drubbing. But that is what is was. The English side looked absolutely exhausted. Can you name one player that was a hero for England on that park? I have lots of English friends and family and I know they're hurting this evening, but that team and that manager have been a disgrace.
Compare Mexico against Argentina. Mexico had to struggle on with a terrible decision which certainly lead to Argentina's second goal (the Mexicans heads weren't in the game), but they played on like absolute heroes. I'd be honored to wear a Mexican shirt after their campaign. Can an English supporter honestly say the same? And with the quality that the team has?
Sorry to have have upset you so much, Dave. But based on your most recent predictions, It must hurt, I'm sure...
Shall we see what you actually said? Just for the record, here is the gem of Wilson-like Football Knowledge you dazzled us with just 48 hours earlier:
"If you`d watched England's warm-up games even their sluggish start was predictable, they were lucky in the sense that their group was particularly weak, in reality, they were always going to march on.
And what was the other gem? Oh yes... "brimful of confidence". Hahahahaha. Those bookies you've made so much money out of must be wearing a wry smirk tonight.
Shall we see what you actually said? Just for the record, here is the gem of Wilson-like Football Knowledge you dazzled us with just 48 hours earlier:
"If you`d watched England's warm-up games even their sluggish start was predictable, they were lucky in the sense that their group was particularly weak, in reality, they were always going to march on.
"Despite having to change their back four for every game so far, England are still there, they are growing in strength and confidence and they have good players, they will not be as poor as they were in the group stages.
"I`ll be amazed if Fabio's men don't see off a distinctly ordinary German side thus becoming stronger and more confident still."
And what was the other gem? Oh yes... "brimful of confidence". Hahahahaha. Those bookies you've made so much money out of must be wearing a wry smirk tonight.
It was a terrible decision but, bloody hell, Germany gave us a lesson today. They fully deserved the win.
Gavin, my point was about car flags, not about how stupidly jingoistic our media can be.
Gavin, my point was about car flags, not about how stupidly jingoistic our media can be.
Certainly both the Henri double handball and today's 'goal' by Lampard should have Mr Blatter squirming in his seat. Plus the fact that the ref in the Mexico game couldn't change his mind about the offside goal, even though he knew the officials had made the wrong decision! Laughable.
Chris - not all of us were demanding a replay, in fact most people who know anything about the game weren't. A lot of it was media driven as it usually is with such things. Though the FAI didn't cover themselves in glory either. You have to just accept the decision and get on with it.
Chris - not all of us were demanding a replay, in fact most people who know anything about the game weren't. A lot of it was media driven as it usually is with such things. Though the FAI didn't cover themselves in glory either. You have to just accept the decision and get on with it.
Dermot (51) - "In short, are we about to witness a relative eclipse of England as the site of world-class football?"
Can't see it happening anytime soon or ever, unless maybe if the CL becomes a regular league. Even then I'd expect more English sides in there then from another country.
The EPL is far far and away the most viewed league on earth. And so the most famous, generates the most income, etc. Also, the rich foreigners are attracted to where? The EPL of course.
I don't know about player development there, but England's top league seems to be getting stronger, not weaker. Especially compared to other nations' top leagues.
Can't see it happening anytime soon or ever, unless maybe if the CL becomes a regular league. Even then I'd expect more English sides in there then from another country.
The EPL is far far and away the most viewed league on earth. And so the most famous, generates the most income, etc. Also, the rich foreigners are attracted to where? The EPL of course.
I don't know about player development there, but England's top league seems to be getting stronger, not weaker. Especially compared to other nations' top leagues.
Cue the Graham Chapman Monty Python sketch... Right, stop this it's all too silly.
Get a grip ffs.
England, for all the above reasons and more were shite.
My 20quid at 9-1 is still looking good.
Compared to the EPL just how many foreigners as a % regularly play in the Serie A.
Get a grip ffs.
England, for all the above reasons and more were shite.
My 20quid at 9-1 is still looking good.
Compared to the EPL just how many foreigners as a % regularly play in the Serie A.
Well done,Germany — your players were several levels better than our English players in skill terms, as indeed are numerous national sides. This will remain the way of things until fans of English football understand our football is error-prone, emphasising power and aggression at the expense of ability.
It's not the "best league in the world" — it just pays the best. By the evidence of what i've heard and read today, nothing will change as media and like-minded fans continue to delude themselves about the qualities of English players.
I've just heard that the England players have recorded Cappello's team talks... they are going to get an interpreter to read it to them when they get home!
"Don't-a defend-a like-a Sunday liga pub team" Doesn't really require an interpreter!
Yeah, apparently they were going to let Rooney listen to it too! But nobody's seen him for a fuckin' fortnight.
"Everything I predicted in My "Great expectations" article 23-4-2010 has so far come true. that is a Fact. . . People can look it up, - unless you delete the article too - they can then read some of the utter shite you come out with and draw their own conclusions."
Err, Dave, I just read your article, the one you wrote on the 23-3-10, but hey what's a month between friends?
I was just wondering what predictions you made regarding the World Cup.
"When the Rooney, Lampard and Gerrard etc are running themselves into the ground, people like Baines, Jags and Anichebe will be at best fringe players and no disrespect to our overseas fans, but you would expect Pienaar, Cahill and Howard back early too. From the Everton contingent, only Johnny Heitinga has a realistic chance of seeing out the whole tournament."
Well, our three 'fringe' didn't even go. Rooney and Co most certainly did not run themselves into the ground. Calling an early return exit for Nigeria, Australia and South Africa isn't exactly hard. So where is this Wilson-esque knowledge I keep hearing about? I even followed a lead elsewhere to this quote:
"I predicted 16/16 of the quarter finalists, nearly all of them on these pages on one thread or another. Won plenty of money in the process too.
Read the article "Great Expectations" I wrote it FOUR months ago. I`m not even sure the draw was made then. I even predict Moyses telly job.
When Tim Howard flies out of SA this weekend I`ll have the full house.
Wilson like Knowledge is a terrific weapon to have in your armory when you walk into the bookies."
Your knowledge astounds me, 16 quarter finalists correctly predicted? One where? Two... There are only 8 quarter finalists; and, as you claimed that England would beat Germany, you failed to predict all eight.
Secondly, saying that you hope David Moyes is nowhere near a TV studio because he should be working his butt off isn't really a prediction of his TV job, more of a lucky comment, and his job is with Radio 5 Live... important word here is 'Radio' — as in not 'TV'. Oh yeah and if you wrote 'Great Expectations' four months ago, that would have been February, not April as you claimed earlier nor March which is when the article appeared.
What I will say is that it was a really good article about Everton but is not a good basis for the "look at me, aren't I clever" type comments that have appeared on TW recently.
Err, Dave, I just read your article, the one you wrote on the 23-3-10, but hey what's a month between friends?
I was just wondering what predictions you made regarding the World Cup.
"When the Rooney, Lampard and Gerrard etc are running themselves into the ground, people like Baines, Jags and Anichebe will be at best fringe players and no disrespect to our overseas fans, but you would expect Pienaar, Cahill and Howard back early too. From the Everton contingent, only Johnny Heitinga has a realistic chance of seeing out the whole tournament."
Well, our three 'fringe' didn't even go. Rooney and Co most certainly did not run themselves into the ground. Calling an early return exit for Nigeria, Australia and South Africa isn't exactly hard. So where is this Wilson-esque knowledge I keep hearing about? I even followed a lead elsewhere to this quote:
"I predicted 16/16 of the quarter finalists, nearly all of them on these pages on one thread or another. Won plenty of money in the process too.
Read the article "Great Expectations" I wrote it FOUR months ago. I`m not even sure the draw was made then. I even predict Moyses telly job.
When Tim Howard flies out of SA this weekend I`ll have the full house.
Wilson like Knowledge is a terrific weapon to have in your armory when you walk into the bookies."
Your knowledge astounds me, 16 quarter finalists correctly predicted? One where? Two... There are only 8 quarter finalists; and, as you claimed that England would beat Germany, you failed to predict all eight.
Secondly, saying that you hope David Moyes is nowhere near a TV studio because he should be working his butt off isn't really a prediction of his TV job, more of a lucky comment, and his job is with Radio 5 Live... important word here is 'Radio' — as in not 'TV'. Oh yeah and if you wrote 'Great Expectations' four months ago, that would have been February, not April as you claimed earlier nor March which is when the article appeared.
What I will say is that it was a really good article about Everton but is not a good basis for the "look at me, aren't I clever" type comments that have appeared on TW recently.
Dermot (51); I was saying exactly the same about the Mexicans earlier too... At 3-0 still trying to play football.
I've read some of the player and manager comments, which predictably point out the "unseen" goal... and saying we play "well" until then — except for the shocking defending, obvious weakness once Barry pushed up etc...
I've read some of the player and manager comments, which predictably point out the "unseen" goal... and saying we play "well" until then — except for the shocking defending, obvious weakness once Barry pushed up etc...
"We" were shit. Germany thoroughly deserved to knock us out and hopefully now England's stars can return home and stop being "bored" in their palatial £3k double room a night hotel.
Anyway, glad I laid off the Stellas.
I agree with all those who say Germany deserved to win. However, not all teams who deserve to win football matches actually go on to win them. Had Lampards goal stood seeing England score 2 in 2 minutes you wouldn't be surprised to see them go on to an "undeserved" victory. That's football. To claim the disallowed goal had no bearing on the result is simply ridiculous.
Man for man, I dislike the vast majority of the England team. But when they're playing as a team (if you can call the current lot such a thing) under the English flag, I am drawn to support them wholeheartedly. Can't help it. I wish I could detatch myself from my Country as many ToffeeWebbers clearly have, but I can't. It could be an illness perhaps.
I am not blind to what went on in South Africa though, and there is something inherently wrong with the England set up. Picking on form, Fabio? On that basis, I would have dropped Rooney before dropping Heskey! He was nothing short of fucking useless for all 360 minutes he was on the pitch.
I think we've got a great chance in Euro 2012 though, I really do. Beckham will be fit again by then, and David James will have another two years experience under his belt...
Nurse!
Man for man, I dislike the vast majority of the England team. But when they're playing as a team (if you can call the current lot such a thing) under the English flag, I am drawn to support them wholeheartedly. Can't help it. I wish I could detatch myself from my Country as many ToffeeWebbers clearly have, but I can't. It could be an illness perhaps.
I am not blind to what went on in South Africa though, and there is something inherently wrong with the England set up. Picking on form, Fabio? On that basis, I would have dropped Rooney before dropping Heskey! He was nothing short of fucking useless for all 360 minutes he was on the pitch.
I think we've got a great chance in Euro 2012 though, I really do. Beckham will be fit again by then, and David James will have another two years experience under his belt...
Nurse!
On a side note - I find it strange that the editor decided to air his dirty laundry and what appears to be a personal vendetta on the message board. Was this strictly necessary?
Having said that, if Dave Wilson really had Wilson-like football knowledge, he would be top of the toffeeweb World Cup prediction league. But he's not. I am. So this must mean I have more Wilson-like football knowledge than Wilson himself. Out-Wilsonning Wilson if you will. I must be able to make some money from these powers!
Having said that, if Dave Wilson really had Wilson-like football knowledge, he would be top of the toffeeweb World Cup prediction league. But he's not. I am. So this must mean I have more Wilson-like football knowledge than Wilson himself. Out-Wilsonning Wilson if you will. I must be able to make some money from these powers!
The thing is Jamie, Dave (or 'Nosto' as he is colloquially known) got 16 out of 16, which is 4 more than yourself, and obviously includes predicting that Italy would get knocked out, which is some predo.
The only thing is, he doesn't seem to have submitted his predictions to the competition... oh well, I'm sure he made a fortune at the bookies instead...
The only thing is, he doesn't seem to have submitted his predictions to the competition... oh well, I'm sure he made a fortune at the bookies instead...
Mr Wilson. If you are so good at predictions can you give us 1 - 20 the EPL table for next year? Maybe we can all go down your bookies to make us all loads-a-money!!!!
England tournament teams are always the same. Show great promise but always fail to deliver. "Maybe at 2-2 it would be different......" "We hit the bar twice" Bullshit. That German side played us off the park. They wanted the ball more, done more with the ball when they had it & the way they broke on the counter. Pace, Movement and that little Ozil. Fuck me, He just knows the right ball at the right time. Even squared for Mueller when he could of scored and BOTH Terry and Upson went to him. We have been shit since we qualified back in September last year. Ever since the loss to Ukraine we have look limp.This England team will have to have changes made to is BUT, it's more that just this player or that player. We, at clubs level, have to get the basics right. Positioning. Passing. Movement. Vision. We were all led to believe that Capello was going to be the Messiah who delivered the biggest prize with the greatest TEAM since 1966. Well that was a load of bollocks.
France had to do this back in the early 90's when Houllier set up Clair-Fontain and Spain have had the same happen to them. Change the youth structure in your country and develop a new ethos into your kids and groom them for 10-12 years time. Now England do have some very promising players i.e. our own Rodwell, Arsenals Wilshere, Lansbury, Walcott, Man Citys Joe Hart......... But these players will need game time to develop. Thes days of Joey Foreigner because he's cheap MUST come to an end.
This England campaign has been a disaster from start to its premature but justified end. There are more cons that pros on Capellos notepad for him to read on the flight back.
Where this leaves English football in general is anyone's guess at the moment but with EURO 2012 qualifying due to start in September someone better sort this shambles of a team out quickly.
Let's see if Capello can start to earn his £6M a ear in his most difficult job ever. Picking this nation up from is lowest period in some time. He hasn't got long.
A nation awaits..............
England tournament teams are always the same. Show great promise but always fail to deliver. "Maybe at 2-2 it would be different......" "We hit the bar twice" Bullshit. That German side played us off the park. They wanted the ball more, done more with the ball when they had it & the way they broke on the counter. Pace, Movement and that little Ozil. Fuck me, He just knows the right ball at the right time. Even squared for Mueller when he could of scored and BOTH Terry and Upson went to him. We have been shit since we qualified back in September last year. Ever since the loss to Ukraine we have look limp.This England team will have to have changes made to is BUT, it's more that just this player or that player. We, at clubs level, have to get the basics right. Positioning. Passing. Movement. Vision. We were all led to believe that Capello was going to be the Messiah who delivered the biggest prize with the greatest TEAM since 1966. Well that was a load of bollocks.
France had to do this back in the early 90's when Houllier set up Clair-Fontain and Spain have had the same happen to them. Change the youth structure in your country and develop a new ethos into your kids and groom them for 10-12 years time. Now England do have some very promising players i.e. our own Rodwell, Arsenals Wilshere, Lansbury, Walcott, Man Citys Joe Hart......... But these players will need game time to develop. Thes days of Joey Foreigner because he's cheap MUST come to an end.
This England campaign has been a disaster from start to its premature but justified end. There are more cons that pros on Capellos notepad for him to read on the flight back.
Where this leaves English football in general is anyone's guess at the moment but with EURO 2012 qualifying due to start in September someone better sort this shambles of a team out quickly.
Let's see if Capello can start to earn his £6M a ear in his most difficult job ever. Picking this nation up from is lowest period in some time. He hasn't got long.
A nation awaits..............
Kirk#66, you make really valid points, but the trouble is that at any time in the last 30years the same points have been made and very little has changed. One of my nephews was in the youth team at Everton at the same time as Anichebe, and I saw a lot of games, and it was all about pace & power and closing down, with very little silky ball skills, and remember Everton youth setup is considered to be one of the finest in the country.
But back to the game; for a manager who is supposed to be one of the finest tacticians Cappello didn’t have a plan B, and putting my fantasy premier league manager's hat on, even I could see that we were getting done by the extra man in midfield, and Ozil & Mueller were getting the freedom of the park. That Upson & Terry were all over the place, and that Gerrard looks like a bag of shite on the left, and that Rooney just looked like a bag of shite.
My solution at 2-0 down would've been to put King/Carragher on for Milner and gone 3 at the back. Even though it's an unfamiliar system, it would’ve solidified the back and the middle, and put Gerrard behind the front two, and of course the two backs look better going forward than defending. I think I’ll apply for the soon to be vacant England job, and I’ll do it for a mere £3million a year
But back to the game; for a manager who is supposed to be one of the finest tacticians Cappello didn’t have a plan B, and putting my fantasy premier league manager's hat on, even I could see that we were getting done by the extra man in midfield, and Ozil & Mueller were getting the freedom of the park. That Upson & Terry were all over the place, and that Gerrard looks like a bag of shite on the left, and that Rooney just looked like a bag of shite.
My solution at 2-0 down would've been to put King/Carragher on for Milner and gone 3 at the back. Even though it's an unfamiliar system, it would’ve solidified the back and the middle, and put Gerrard behind the front two, and of course the two backs look better going forward than defending. I think I’ll apply for the soon to be vacant England job, and I’ll do it for a mere £3million a year
I watched the England game at home with two Japanese work colleagues. When we were 4-1 down and Capello took Defoe off and replaced him with Heskey they went into fits of laughter and bemusement.
That was when I realized that Capello and England had truly lost the plot.
That was when I realized that Capello and England had truly lost the plot.
If Mr Wilson's "it was a goalkeeping error" is referring to Donovan's goal in the 2-2 draw, I beg to differ
The opposition goalkeeper patently made the correct, and laudably instant, decision to remove his head as far towards the rear of the goal as possible
Damn good judgement from what I saw
By the way - who's this Wilson? I was always an Alf Tupper man, myself
The opposition goalkeeper patently made the correct, and laudably instant, decision to remove his head as far towards the rear of the goal as possible
Damn good judgement from what I saw
By the way - who's this Wilson? I was always an Alf Tupper man, myself
This is the funniest post i've read in ages.
Just a couple of points:
England have the "Same procedure as every tournAment, James" attitude. First, the press say: this time we're going to win the cup as in 66. Finally, we have a really good team... Then, if we have to play Germany it's: The "Hun", Germ warfare etc, etc.
Comments in foreign newspapers, such as in Switzerland "What have some British journalists got against the Germans?" (Gutter press, I call it)... Well the German team had the last laugh AGAIN!
Ice Hockey uses technology with no problems, Tennis does too. Of course it can be done but the old boffers and fogies at Fifa don't want it. Believe you me, Sepp Blatter is NOT well thought of here in CH.
Would a 2-2 result at half-time have changed the final score? Quite probably as the psychological effect would have greatly affected both sides.. However, let's face it, the Germans were better tactically, physically and mentally. What on earth would have happened if we'd played Argentina with the same sort of performance that we showed in Bloemfontein?
Mike Green, sorry to have taken so long to reply to your ever increasing stabs at humour as I have both a life and work to deal with. I explained why I follow Germany. Explain to me why you follow Everton and not another team, where you born at Goodison or did you chose?
"Simple mathematics says it would still have made it 4-2 and a loss"
I know Lyndon dealt with this, but actually I think this is the single most stupid thing anyone has ever written on this website. Gavin, anything else you've said after this loses any credibility whatsoever.
I know Lyndon dealt with this, but actually I think this is the single most stupid thing anyone has ever written on this website. Gavin, anything else you've said after this loses any credibility whatsoever.
Gavin you can't justify supporting Germany with your background, no matter how angry you might be at another poster.
The whole point of international football is that it brings your country together to support the thing you all have in common. In effect what you're saying is 'Germany were the best team when I was little so I support them'. You're the absolute definition of a glory supporter.
The whole point of international football is that it brings your country together to support the thing you all have in common. In effect what you're saying is 'Germany were the best team when I was little so I support them'. You're the absolute definition of a glory supporter.
Gavin is just an attention seeker. Ignore and he will depart. To chose to support the nation that is 98% of England's population biggest enemy a large part of that due to non-football matters shows you only say you support them because you get off on the reaction of your victims. Pure stupidity.
Tony, Can you please drop this "attention-seeking" stuff. Gavin has explained his position and his particular background and perspective. The least you could do is respect that, even if you don't agree with it. He's also a long-time poster on here so can you please retract the "he will depart" bit too.
Thanks
Thanks
Dave Wilson, why don't you set up your own website then if you hate Kenrick's "gobshitedness"? Some of us regular posters have all experienced a Wilson tongue / keyboard lashing from you just because we dare to offer a different opinion. It's ironic that you can't see what an utter gobshite you sound in your response.
Post the link to your new website. I look forward to reading your informed rants of how shite Jagielka is and how shite Donovan is yet Osman is a God.
Post the link to your new website. I look forward to reading your informed rants of how shite Jagielka is and how shite Donovan is yet Osman is a God.
"England tournament teams are always the same. Show great promise but always fail to deliver."
This is not always true. Euro 2000 we were always going to be bad and the same was true this time. I don't claim to have predicted this before the World Cup, but as soon as I saw the line-up for the Slovenia game with Gerrard heading over to the left I knew we were done for.
The failure of this current, poorly managed team has NO REFLECTION whatsoever on previous teams in other tournaments, and to pretend it does is logically laughable. In other tournaments we've often been very good, showed football that made other teams sit up and take notice, and gone out of the tournament due to a refereeing decision, a penalty shoot-out, the eventual winners, or any two of those three factors.
This is not always true. Euro 2000 we were always going to be bad and the same was true this time. I don't claim to have predicted this before the World Cup, but as soon as I saw the line-up for the Slovenia game with Gerrard heading over to the left I knew we were done for.
The failure of this current, poorly managed team has NO REFLECTION whatsoever on previous teams in other tournaments, and to pretend it does is logically laughable. In other tournaments we've often been very good, showed football that made other teams sit up and take notice, and gone out of the tournament due to a refereeing decision, a penalty shoot-out, the eventual winners, or any two of those three factors.
Tony, I love the "98% of England's populations enemy" part do you write for the Daily Mail and The Sun and when did you promote yourself to mouthpiece of this country? Do you know anyone that has served in the armed forces since the second world war ended over 60 years ago? If you do did they by any chance serve in Germany with our German allies? Do you own or have you ever owned anything German such as a car or electrical device or kitchen equipment? Does that make you a "traitor"?
Do the German newspapers regale whenever their is an upcoming Germany v England match with tales of Bomber Harris systematically carpet bombing tens of thousands of German civilians with incendiaries and literally burning them alive? Does it run reminders that the country which created the concentration camp was lovely blighty during the Boer War imprisoning women and children? Does it fire up it's nation with the highly likely tale that St George was a Turk who probably never set foot in England?
I guess you need to realise it's just a game and England lost, it's not life and death. The better side won, the better side prepared and had players and tactics which outshone anything they met on the pitch. Move on, you can't change what has happened
Do the German newspapers regale whenever their is an upcoming Germany v England match with tales of Bomber Harris systematically carpet bombing tens of thousands of German civilians with incendiaries and literally burning them alive? Does it run reminders that the country which created the concentration camp was lovely blighty during the Boer War imprisoning women and children? Does it fire up it's nation with the highly likely tale that St George was a Turk who probably never set foot in England?
I guess you need to realise it's just a game and England lost, it's not life and death. The better side won, the better side prepared and had players and tactics which outshone anything they met on the pitch. Move on, you can't change what has happened
Mike Allison, again as you appear to have promoted yourself to some omnipotent all knowing being, can you explain why a four-year-old boy would have any idea of glory hunting? I watched the world cup and watched as many games as I could but was drawn back time after time to Gerd Muller's amazing knack of finding the goal and Germany's passing and movement which got them to the final and victory over a Dutch side which I also enjoyed watching with Cruyff showing his "turn" which we all tried to copy.
What made you chose Everton? Did you wait until you saw them lose a game and thought "that's the side for me" not daring to follow a winning side in case you got called a glory hunter by some anonymous twit on a web site some decades later?
What made you chose Everton? Did you wait until you saw them lose a game and thought "that's the side for me" not daring to follow a winning side in case you got called a glory hunter by some anonymous twit on a web site some decades later?
OK Gavin we get your point... but you are beginning to sound like a sour kraut.
Gavin @ 8.
KIng is a great defender. James produced saves to avoid a cricket score first half. Crouch has an excellent international scoring record.
@79 Do the English newspapers regale whenever there is an upcoming Germany v England match with tales of the Germans systematically bombing tens of thousands of English civilians with incendiaries and literally burning them alive during the blitz? Does it run reminders that the German concentration camps during the War imprisoned and murdered women and children?
Er, no ... Your bizarre second paragraph negates some good points made in paras 1 & 3.
KIng is a great defender. James produced saves to avoid a cricket score first half. Crouch has an excellent international scoring record.
@79 Do the English newspapers regale whenever there is an upcoming Germany v England match with tales of the Germans systematically bombing tens of thousands of English civilians with incendiaries and literally burning them alive during the blitz? Does it run reminders that the German concentration camps during the War imprisoned and murdered women and children?
Er, no ... Your bizarre second paragraph negates some good points made in paras 1 & 3.
Guy, King admits he can't play football with his children in his own garden, doesn't that sound like he shouldn't be playing international football? He doesn't play regularly for Spurs through injury and even Spurs mates of mine joke about when he does go to training its light exercise bike work. I'd expect an international player to not only have played that season but also to have been reasonably successful in that position too, neither of which King is/was.
"Crouch has an excellent international scoring record", can you tell me teams in the world top 10 he has scored against such as Brazil, Argentina, Germany, France? Surely you don't think England would make it to the final only playing minnows all the way and a lesser team when they got there?
The second paragraph shows how nonsensical the English newspapers reporting of every single England v Germany game is accompanied by equating it to the war and an early posting in which I mentioned Germans being interviewed on the radio and them asking why as even his father was born after the war and it just being a football match. The xenopohibic claptrap that the likes of Tony obviously lap up with his ridiculous "98%" statement.
"Crouch has an excellent international scoring record", can you tell me teams in the world top 10 he has scored against such as Brazil, Argentina, Germany, France? Surely you don't think England would make it to the final only playing minnows all the way and a lesser team when they got there?
The second paragraph shows how nonsensical the English newspapers reporting of every single England v Germany game is accompanied by equating it to the war and an early posting in which I mentioned Germans being interviewed on the radio and them asking why as even his father was born after the war and it just being a football match. The xenopohibic claptrap that the likes of Tony obviously lap up with his ridiculous "98%" statement.
Gavin, "can you tell me teams in the world top 10 he has scored against such as Brazil, Argentina, Germany, France?"
How can he score when he isn't given the game time?
The 1-0 defeat against Brazil last November he got 8 minutes, Germany 2008 he came on in the 93rd minute, Brazil 2007 83rd minute. The best he has had against any of the teams you mentioned is 45 minutes.
Point two, in the group stages we were failing to score against the sort of teams that Crouch is good at scoring against, therefore it is a fair argument to say that his presence on the park could have made a significant difference. It's like saying that Ossie isn't very good against Man U so don't play him against Crewe.
How can he score when he isn't given the game time?
The 1-0 defeat against Brazil last November he got 8 minutes, Germany 2008 he came on in the 93rd minute, Brazil 2007 83rd minute. The best he has had against any of the teams you mentioned is 45 minutes.
Point two, in the group stages we were failing to score against the sort of teams that Crouch is good at scoring against, therefore it is a fair argument to say that his presence on the park could have made a significant difference. It's like saying that Ossie isn't very good against Man U so don't play him against Crewe.
Gavin – I have nothing against you supporting whoever you want as it is your choice. After all, as a 4 year old you were only showing the same logic that sees millions of southerners, Scandinavians and Thai people supporting Man U or the Shite.
However, I support Everton for two reasons: 1) I was born in the area; and 2) my Dad supported them. I support England because: 1) I was born in England and my parents are English.
The old adage "Evertonians are born, not manufactured" springs to mind.
I think that Rooney and Gerrard should decide that they want to play for Argentina or Brazil or Germany from now on as they would be more successful on the international front.
However, I support Everton for two reasons: 1) I was born in the area; and 2) my Dad supported them. I support England because: 1) I was born in England and my parents are English.
The old adage "Evertonians are born, not manufactured" springs to mind.
I think that Rooney and Gerrard should decide that they want to play for Argentina or Brazil or Germany from now on as they would be more successful on the international front.
Raw nerve there Gavin. Your support for Germany is glory supporting. For an English/Irish/Lithuanian person to support Germany, well, there is no other way to describe it. Your analogy with club support is incorrect, as there isn't a club in my town (actually there is, and I do follow there Zamaretto League results).
I support Everton partly because they were the English team in the match I watched when I was 4 (The Cup Winners Cup final) and partly because they were the team that I'd heard of who weren't Man United or Liverpool, who everybody else supported. I tried watching the nearest team, Coventry, as a kid, but we always ended up supporting whoever the away team were, we couldn't help it. I don't know if you've ever been to Coventry, but I'm most definitely not from there and feel no connection to it whatsoever.
I support Everton partly because they were the English team in the match I watched when I was 4 (The Cup Winners Cup final) and partly because they were the team that I'd heard of who weren't Man United or Liverpool, who everybody else supported. I tried watching the nearest team, Coventry, as a kid, but we always ended up supporting whoever the away team were, we couldn't help it. I don't know if you've ever been to Coventry, but I'm most definitely not from there and feel no connection to it whatsoever.
Theres some proper flirting going on in here!!
"However, I support Everton for two reasons. 1. I was born in the area and 2. my Dad supported them. I support England because, 1. I was born in England and my parents are English"
I'm the same. However, the 'born in England and English parents' scenario is one Gavin can't relate too. Reading between lines, I can certainly understand why Gavin follows Germany.
Interestingly, had he chosen any other country, would we be having this debate?
I'm the same. However, the 'born in England and English parents' scenario is one Gavin can't relate too. Reading between lines, I can certainly understand why Gavin follows Germany.
Interestingly, had he chosen any other country, would we be having this debate?
Dave — whether Gavin likes it or not, he is English really (see last para 29), he just hates the fact and has decided to support Germany instead. That's all there is to it really.
What a very strange thread. I think the lack of Premier League football is effecting our reason. Frankly, I don't get what has gone wrong between Dave and Michael but Dave, whom I respect as a contributor to this site, is seriously upset, I think Michael can be a little severe to put it mildly but, like it or not , that is what is essential for any site or publication that aspires to seriousness and professionalism.
As for Gavin's support of Germany, well, I had a work colleague, an Irishman through and through, who supported Italy. When I mocked him for this he queried my support of Everton when I had a local team half a mile from my house. On reflection it was a fair point. I still like my local team to win but Everton is my passion.
Let's get back to transfer rumours. I have it on good authority that McGeady will be joining from Celtic with Vaughan and/or Ruddy going the other way plus £6million!!
Best part about this World Cup, is that England are out. They where shit in all their friendlies, they had to rely on japan scoring two own goals and your whining about a goal that was disallowed?
Wtf are you England fans on? They where shit in their friendlies they where shit in their group and even shitter against Germany. The best team won by a country mile.
There are some posters on here who are so far up their own arses they can see reality for what it is. The fact they where unable to score with 45 mins remaining belies just how crap that team is.
If I feel sorry for anyone, it's the fans who went to South Africa after eating all the press and media BS that is continously pumped out.
The team is over-paid, technically inept and absolutely useless, the World Cup will be better without absolute shite teams like England in it!
Wtf are you England fans on? They where shit in their friendlies they where shit in their group and even shitter against Germany. The best team won by a country mile.
There are some posters on here who are so far up their own arses they can see reality for what it is. The fact they where unable to score with 45 mins remaining belies just how crap that team is.
If I feel sorry for anyone, it's the fans who went to South Africa after eating all the press and media BS that is continously pumped out.
The team is over-paid, technically inept and absolutely useless, the World Cup will be better without absolute shite teams like England in it!
A very timely post, have to admit I made something of a killing at the bookies backing Germany, no room for sentiment here. You can't look a gift horse in the mouth after all. The cashier remarked to me that she'd taken hundreds of bets on England that day and that I was the first person to back Germany. I retorted I was an Everton fan and we were a more knowledgeable bunch. She laughed and then confided she actually fancied the Germans to win herself.
As for Dave, he did have a pop at some of Michael's comments after a run of good results during the season so I guess Micheal has taken the opportunity to return the favor. Time to move on perhaps and look forward to the coming season. Surprisingly we've made a few signings with another on the way perhaps. Let's hope Moyes's judgment is rewarded.
@Gavin 79,
St George was Palestinian.
Blue as well I'm sure!
St George was Palestinian.
Blue as well I'm sure!
Sorry,
Actually his mum was Palestinian his dad a Turk.
Actually his mum was Palestinian his dad a Turk.
Chris Leyland, my dad was a red and my mum was a blue, my mum's side were proper blues and went to the game and took me hence a blue. Mike Green can you please explain your amazing logic of how I hate the fact I am English as your arguments sound like they are in your own head? I support Germany as I watched the world cup oblivious of nations and enjoyed watching the Germans and the Dutch but thought the Germans were better. You never did respond to you having to wait for Everton to lose before you were allowed to support them or was that the raw nerve ending of your dodgy logic?
Come on Mike, less of your blustering nonsense and answer the question.
Come on Mike, less of your blustering nonsense and answer the question.
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1 Posted 27/06/2010 at 17:01:03
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