Season 2011-12
The Mail Bag
Hanging on to Leighton Baines
73 Comments: People have talked about the possibility of player sales in the Summer. Various names ? notably Rodwell and to a lesser extent Jagielka ? have been bandied about. For some time I have felt that the real challenge this Summer will be hanging on to Leighton Baines.
Opposing managers have long since spotted that if they can stop Baines, then he is our main threat from open play. Also, his dead ball expertise has begun to gain more attention recently.
The usual suspects would take our hands off if we offered Baines for sale: the Shite would like him certainly; and even if ??Arry ain?t no longer there?, whoever takes over at Spurs must see the mouth watering prospect of Baines and Bale attacking down the left flank.
My fears have grown recently because apart from Cashley, Baines could arguably replace the current left back at any of the likely CL teams. Baines himself has given us good service. He has only one career, and would we now stand in his way if he had the opportunity to test himself against Europe?s best?
For me this encapsulates the real indictment of the current régime. I can understand, now that I think he has come clean, that Kenwright is looking at around £500m in order to sell. But if that is the case, and he does care about the club, then whilst waiting for a rich Godot to turn up, he must in the meantime find some resources from somewhere. This would at least keep us where we and offer some hope to ambitious players that we can retain our current personnel and position.
Tony McNulty, Posted 07/04/2012 at 15:51:07
Comments
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Clubs will no doubt be interested Baines and i also think we could lose Heitinga
Well if they do we should bleed them dry for him and then reinvest the money on someone else. That's what every other team does. Liverpool sold Alonso, Mascherano, Benayoun, Meireles and Torres to bigger clubs yet no one brands them a selling club. Newcastle did the same and made themselves stronger. Even Man U sold Ronaldo. It seems to be only Everton fans who have a complex about selling anyone. Part and parcel of football.
The worrying thing for me is Baines said earlier this year that he loves Everton but wants Champions League footie.
We are a selling club now due to BK's total mismanagement. That is the only way we can stay afloat. So of course we will sell Baines and anyone else if we get offered enough. Get used to it!
James, Liverpool then spent a shedload on new players to replace them...happily some complete dirge,
Spot on - I just mentioned in the replies to today's match that Rodwell and Jagielka have played their value down. As we know we'll need to sell someone, I fear it will be Baines, Jonny or Felli. (Jelavic is too recent a signing but will be in the bracket in another 12 months if he keeps up this form).
Of the 3 I'd prefer to lose Felli first, then Jonny.
Of the 3 I'd prefer to lose Felli first, then Jonny.
No chance he will go to the scum, the one decent purchase they have made is Enrique - although for me he isn't in Baines' league.
Man City need a quality player in that position so watch out for a summer akin to the Lescott saga
Man City need a quality player in that position so watch out for a summer akin to the Lescott saga
We will be lucky if we get £15 million for Rodwell. He seems to have a hamstring problem? I can see him fading off like James Vaughan. I hope I'm wrong.
James - the players you mentioned left a sinking ship.
The Torres situation - Russian kleptocrat spends petty cash to buy flavour of the month. Anfield half-wits use much of it to buy Sunday league player.
Arteta was great for us - but I will never forgive him. And if he could do what he did any player might. But that's not the same as being a selling club.
We are not - I hope - a selling club simply to be able to afford to survive. We would never have had Jelovic if that was the case.
The Torres situation - Russian kleptocrat spends petty cash to buy flavour of the month. Anfield half-wits use much of it to buy Sunday league player.
Arteta was great for us - but I will never forgive him. And if he could do what he did any player might. But that's not the same as being a selling club.
We are not - I hope - a selling club simply to be able to afford to survive. We would never have had Jelovic if that was the case.
This is an issue I really can be positive about! There isn`t a chance in hell that Leighton will leave us this summer. He is as big a fixture as Davey and Captain Pip, I can assure you.
Rodwell is dispensable as is Barkley, Jagielka and Anichebe although none of the first three will fetch anything approaching £20M and the Big Fella is in the £5M category.
One of these will go for certain but Baines... forget it!
Rodwell is dispensable as is Barkley, Jagielka and Anichebe although none of the first three will fetch anything approaching £20M and the Big Fella is in the £5M category.
One of these will go for certain but Baines... forget it!
Doddy, you're a legend.
I only wish I was as certain in life about one thing, as you seem to be about everything.
I only wish I was as certain in life about one thing, as you seem to be about everything.
Richard, this sentence is more like your old self!!
"There isn`t a chance in hell that Leighton will leave us this summer. He is as big a fixture as Davey and Captain Pip, I can assure you".
Keep the faith!!
"There isn`t a chance in hell that Leighton will leave us this summer. He is as big a fixture as Davey and Captain Pip, I can assure you".
Keep the faith!!
Anichebe £5m? We got Jelavic for £5M ? do me a favour. It's difficult to keep reinventing teams but is possible.
Do not get rid of Rodwell Barkley or Duffy, do your best to keep Fellaini Heitinga, Jelavic, Baines but, if you do sell, you've got to be talking 20 m min.
Do not get rid of Rodwell Barkley or Duffy, do your best to keep Fellaini Heitinga, Jelavic, Baines but, if you do sell, you've got to be talking 20 m min.
Aside from our right side, the keeper is a position I would try and improve.
No matter what, we have to keep Baines. Without a doubt, he is the best left back in the country and up there with the best in Europe. The players I would let go are Rodwell, Vellios and Big Vic ? the reasons being: Rodwell is always injured and to be honest I didn't think he was that good a player; could not see Vellios and Jelavic being good and Big Vic, if he pulled his finger out, could be a half-decent player but he is a lazy twat and never plays as a team player.
If I could bring a player in to play up front with Jelavic, it would be Defoe ? that would be something else... alas, we can only dream. COYB.
If I could bring a player in to play up front with Jelavic, it would be Defoe ? that would be something else... alas, we can only dream. COYB.
I think he'd be daft to go to Citteh ? I don't know whether he's considered as good as Clichy (not by me, but by Mancini et al). He's better off at Everton where he's top man.
You know what I'd like to hear at goodison? A Richard Dodd song. Just saying
It's true that Everton are a bloody circus when it comes to the transfer market in the summer (which is curiously at odds with how astute we often seem to be in January), but I just don't see Moyes parting with Felliani, Baines or Heitinga come hell or high water. Along with Gibson, Howard and Jelavic they are forming a quality spine of our current and future team.
The only way they would go is player pressure (which frankly should be stamped down on at EVERY club), and whilst it's conceivable Heitinga and Felli (or at least his father) could try and exert that there are clearly more expendable and saleable assets.
I'm not convinced Jagielka should be one of them either (at the very least he's an amazing back up central defender), but compared to the options above he'd be a better option. I'd cry no tears over shifting along the massively overrated Rodwell though or the harshly treated but inconsistent Anichebe and without wanting to seem disloyal there's also a strong case for loosing Timmy Cahill for his final payday (and freeing up some budget too!)
If we got c £10M for Rodwell and Anichebe (high valuations compared to what they've achieved, but they are young still) and shipped out Cahill, then spent half on getting Pienaar back a little on signing Drenthe on a free and gave most of the rest to the bank (aside from a couple of loan fees) for prospects in the Drenthe/Stracq mode (i.e. talented but not likely to attract bigger clubs for one reason or other) I'd be happy.
The squad would be slightly smaller, but I think we could push Barkley through, get Coleman and Gueye playing more regularly and give a few more youth players a proper chance (Duffy, McAleny and maybe Hope too) to provide some options behind a very strong first 11.
The only way they would go is player pressure (which frankly should be stamped down on at EVERY club), and whilst it's conceivable Heitinga and Felli (or at least his father) could try and exert that there are clearly more expendable and saleable assets.
I'm not convinced Jagielka should be one of them either (at the very least he's an amazing back up central defender), but compared to the options above he'd be a better option. I'd cry no tears over shifting along the massively overrated Rodwell though or the harshly treated but inconsistent Anichebe and without wanting to seem disloyal there's also a strong case for loosing Timmy Cahill for his final payday (and freeing up some budget too!)
If we got c £10M for Rodwell and Anichebe (high valuations compared to what they've achieved, but they are young still) and shipped out Cahill, then spent half on getting Pienaar back a little on signing Drenthe on a free and gave most of the rest to the bank (aside from a couple of loan fees) for prospects in the Drenthe/Stracq mode (i.e. talented but not likely to attract bigger clubs for one reason or other) I'd be happy.
The squad would be slightly smaller, but I think we could push Barkley through, get Coleman and Gueye playing more regularly and give a few more youth players a proper chance (Duffy, McAleny and maybe Hope too) to provide some options behind a very strong first 11.
Hey,Mark,d`you mean one I`ve written or one about me?
Got to negotiate my image rights with you first!
Got to negotiate my image rights with you first!
All just complete speculation!
Sure there will be comings and goings but Baines won't be one of them.
Rodwell won't be sold until he is fully fit and has some games under his belt otherwise BK won't get the right price.
Some others who have seen their best days may go on free transfers such as Distin,Cahill,Osman,Neville and of course
Anichebe.
The squad needs fresh younger faces.
Keeping the same faces will just produce the same scrappy results and they will be a year older.
Sure there will be comings and goings but Baines won't be one of them.
Rodwell won't be sold until he is fully fit and has some games under his belt otherwise BK won't get the right price.
Some others who have seen their best days may go on free transfers such as Distin,Cahill,Osman,Neville and of course
Anichebe.
The squad needs fresh younger faces.
Keeping the same faces will just produce the same scrappy results and they will be a year older.
Phil, if you can get a Doddy song going at Goodison I'll pay you myself. I sit in the Paddock (best seats in the ground; I see the skill of Baines and Pienaar like you wouldn't believe).
But can't start a song from there
I love the self confidence of people who "know" Baines won't be going. Was Arteta going?
Just to cite two of the variables which could affect this:
- the bank decides they want cash and he gets seen as the most in demand or saleable asset
- he himself decides he wants to go to test himself against or play as part of Europe's elite (when that happens they are off faster than rats up a fucking drainpipe - it happened to Arteta, Lescott, Rooney and elsewhere with Ronaldo)
Just to cite two of the variables which could affect this:
- the bank decides they want cash and he gets seen as the most in demand or saleable asset
- he himself decides he wants to go to test himself against or play as part of Europe's elite (when that happens they are off faster than rats up a fucking drainpipe - it happened to Arteta, Lescott, Rooney and elsewhere with Ronaldo)
Tony - I would be a bit suprised if Leighton went abroad, seeing as he is a bit of a home-boy. He got droped by England for his comments about being at home, as I recall. As for the banks, we will see how the accounts sit at the end of next month. I think we did enough to stave off the impending doom already, hence the ability to bring in two full time signings in January.
Baines won't ever leave us.
To be honest, I dont think Baines would do well as there with Spurs.
Don't get me wrong, Bale is a far superior player, but Pienaar cuts in a lot and gives Baines some space. Bale's more direct, predominantly left footed, so tends to stay wide, therefore restricting Baines a bit.
With him moving abroad, didnt he reject a move to Bayern last summer? If he rejects a move there, probably in the top 5 clubs in the world at the moment, then I doubt he would move abroad.
Don't get me wrong, Bale is a far superior player, but Pienaar cuts in a lot and gives Baines some space. Bale's more direct, predominantly left footed, so tends to stay wide, therefore restricting Baines a bit.
With him moving abroad, didnt he reject a move to Bayern last summer? If he rejects a move there, probably in the top 5 clubs in the world at the moment, then I doubt he would move abroad.
Baines would not be replaceable so there would be no point in selling. Man Utd have Evra so the only danger would be if city came sniffing.
Jagielka should be first out the door closely followed by Rodwell. Both have regressed so far it's untrue. Be lucky to get 5m a piece.
Jagielka should be first out the door closely followed by Rodwell. Both have regressed so far it's untrue. Be lucky to get 5m a piece.
Keep em all. Winning the FA Cup should give us enough bucks to keep off the bailiffs.
Need new owners though.
Kenright OUT!
Need new owners though.
Kenright OUT!
Like you Tony I've thought for a while now that Baines is the next player likely to be leaving us as he's the only one really worth anything.
It'll all come down to what the accounts say in May (although we won't see them until October) and I don't expect it to be good.
As a possible replacement for Baines, that Kyle Naughton looked good coming on at left back against us last night. Was he the one we were after from Sheffield or was it Walker?
It'll all come down to what the accounts say in May (although we won't see them until October) and I don't expect it to be good.
As a possible replacement for Baines, that Kyle Naughton looked good coming on at left back against us last night. Was he the one we were after from Sheffield or was it Walker?
Baines is a big fish in a small pool whilst he's at Everton, this won't be the case if he goes.
Everton's busted financials mean the club has to sell. Bear in mind the spin on the last accounts - that we broke even (before finance charges). Oh, a £5m loss then.
The attendances are down significantly, so much so that the calculation shows that increasing season ticket prices will probably lose less than the current pattern of holding early bird prices at last seasons full price (which is only a lag effect anyway).
If we accept that last summer and January's player trading balances itself out approximately, then it's not difficult to imagine that there will be a trading loss before finance charges. The run in the FA Cup will offset some of the reduced matchday revenue, but from memory getting to the final in 2009 wasn't worth much more than £3m.
Therefore we could be looking at a loss in the region of £7-8m, and if DM wants to bring in a couple of new faces, even on loan, that means at least one "name" on the way out.
Whether the player wants to go or not is immaterial. Everton has been selling players against their will and spinning it to suit the club for decades. The fans have been swallowing it for decades. It's what they do.
The attendances are down significantly, so much so that the calculation shows that increasing season ticket prices will probably lose less than the current pattern of holding early bird prices at last seasons full price (which is only a lag effect anyway).
If we accept that last summer and January's player trading balances itself out approximately, then it's not difficult to imagine that there will be a trading loss before finance charges. The run in the FA Cup will offset some of the reduced matchday revenue, but from memory getting to the final in 2009 wasn't worth much more than £3m.
Therefore we could be looking at a loss in the region of £7-8m, and if DM wants to bring in a couple of new faces, even on loan, that means at least one "name" on the way out.
Whether the player wants to go or not is immaterial. Everton has been selling players against their will and spinning it to suit the club for decades. The fans have been swallowing it for decades. It's what they do.
Baines won't go anywhere this summer. We are not that desperate for money and we have appeased the banks. If we can finish seventh and win the FA cup (extra revenue) we are ok till next year. Only thing is we will only be able to bring new faces in if we sell.
So if we have to sell it would be Jags for me. We would get around 8 million. Then a couple of fringe players like Anichebe. This would rake in another 5million which would allow us to go out and buy one proven experienced forward to support Jelavic and keep Peanuts. I would let Stracq go.
The secret is then to hit the ground running in August and beat teams like Wigan and Norwich at home. We have better players than Newcastle, Spurs, Chelsea and Arsenal we just need to function as a team for the whole season and I would make Heitinga captain.
You can't beat a bit of optimism.
The key then is to hit the ground running in August.
So if we have to sell it would be Jags for me. We would get around 8 million. Then a couple of fringe players like Anichebe. This would rake in another 5million which would allow us to go out and buy one proven experienced forward to support Jelavic and keep Peanuts. I would let Stracq go.
The secret is then to hit the ground running in August and beat teams like Wigan and Norwich at home. We have better players than Newcastle, Spurs, Chelsea and Arsenal we just need to function as a team for the whole season and I would make Heitinga captain.
You can't beat a bit of optimism.
The key then is to hit the ground running in August.
Highly doubt Baines will leave. He loves us and we love him, plus not sure that he would fit in to any top 5 team with possible exception of Arsenal.
Most likely departure is Rodwell though his price has probably halved in the last 6 months since his promising England debut.
I think the revolving doors will be pretty quiet this summer with main business revolving around Pienaar and maybe Drenthe and Denis.
Most likely departure is Rodwell though his price has probably halved in the last 6 months since his promising England debut.
I think the revolving doors will be pretty quiet this summer with main business revolving around Pienaar and maybe Drenthe and Denis.
Here's an idea, if we have to sell, it will have to be someone that we get an offer on.
Short of placing people on the transfer list, which instantly reduces their value, we don't sell players; other clubs buy them and they choose who they want to buy.
Simple really.
Short of placing people on the transfer list, which instantly reduces their value, we don't sell players; other clubs buy them and they choose who they want to buy.
Simple really.
James @373.
The only thing you get from winning the FA Cup is kudos.
There is no great financial reward and any monies gained would not pay the electric bill for a season.
The only thing you get from winning the FA Cup is kudos.
There is no great financial reward and any monies gained would not pay the electric bill for a season.
With Cole looking like he could on his way out of Chelsea, then I could see huge intrest from them. Also, some say we love him and he loves the club, wasn't the same said about Arteta?
So, the big question is , will Baines play the full game against Sunderland and so complete 100 consecutive matches without missing a single minute, a feat that very few have ever achieved? That will be a tough one for Moyes to decide upon. Lets see, umm, no just can't see him ever dropping Baines, thankfully!!
Matt #395, you also need to take into account that the last accounts included £10 million from the sale of Bellefield which we can't do again this season so you have to add that to your £8 million.
Steve #409 is right, we can only sell players that we recieve bids on and we're not likely to recieve good money bids for the underperforming players in our squad which make Baines the most attractive candidate for other teams.
Steve #409 is right, we can only sell players that we recieve bids on and we're not likely to recieve good money bids for the underperforming players in our squad which make Baines the most attractive candidate for other teams.
I thought that Leighton was an Everton fan, I seem to remember that was being said when he was at Wigan and we were trying to buy him? If so, he is more likely to want to stay, it's just if the club sell him.
As for Rodwell, he's our player so we know all about his injuries and form, but other clubs are more likely to think about the promising youngster who made his england debut not long ago and so, would still be interested, especially if he gets fit and playing again. Much of the same would be true of Jagielka. Therefore, I think the value of either would be higher than that has been predicted on here.
As for Rodwell, he's our player so we know all about his injuries and form, but other clubs are more likely to think about the promising youngster who made his england debut not long ago and so, would still be interested, especially if he gets fit and playing again. Much of the same would be true of Jagielka. Therefore, I think the value of either would be higher than that has been predicted on here.
Claire, Baines is a confirmed RS fan as are most of his family although his Dad has swapped allegiance to attend the games to see his son play.
Thanks for that Eric, I guess he's a blue now though.
Decision comes down to Baines. He's the best left back in the country and will likely miss out on being England's first choice in the summer.
The reason is no Champions League experience.
So he has a decision to make in the summer and it probably won't come around again.
The reason is no Champions League experience.
So he has a decision to make in the summer and it probably won't come around again.
City missed Kompany and Lescott at key parts of the season which has cost them the league. I woudn't be surprised to see them coming in for Jags as cover.
Would he go? Would Moyes sell him to them?
Would he go? Would Moyes sell him to them?
I cant see us getting Kompany and Lescott as cover for Jags ;)
Baines is a good player but over rated. He is defensively weak in terms of his positioning, tackling and aerially. He cost us a goal against Norwich (alongside his co-conspirator Distin) marking space when the ball came across - How many times have we conceded like that this season? Lot's..
Baines is a good player but over rated. He is defensively weak in terms of his positioning, tackling and aerially. He cost us a goal against Norwich (alongside his co-conspirator Distin) marking space when the ball came across - How many times have we conceded like that this season? Lot's..
Maybe though Drew we could put in a cheeky bid for Lescott as cover for Distin?
Or a swap, Jags for Lescott?
Or a swap, Jags for Lescott?
I would take Johnson plus £6m for Jags. He was linked with Sunderland this morning, although he is left footed I do like him.
^Ian, it's a left footer we need to either partner Baines and cover his back when he's up in their box like Distin does, or to take his place when he's injured which thankfully he never is.
Eric, Judas? Never..
Eric I am assuming we take Pienaar back.
He probably wants big wages and would have no sell on fee , but he makes us tick that you would struggle to get so guaranteed for a modest outay. If we can get him in, we need a right midfield and another striker. That will cost wedge and I would be prepared to sell 2 from 3 of Jags, Coleman and Rodwell.
He probably wants big wages and would have no sell on fee , but he makes us tick that you would struggle to get so guaranteed for a modest outay. If we can get him in, we need a right midfield and another striker. That will cost wedge and I would be prepared to sell 2 from 3 of Jags, Coleman and Rodwell.
Sorry Ian, I was thinking Johnson was a left back but he's a midfielder.
Joe @242: "Rodwell & Jagielka can both go for £250 each. Not worth Millions at all, we should have got rid of both in the summer. "
Deffo, Rodwell imo has been overrated, and it wouldn't suprise me if he's off to Man Utd this summer as part of the Gibson deal. ;-). If we get over £10mil for him, I'll be happy. Jags tho I'm still not 100% sure... we have imo three great CBs, but will find it difficult holding on to JH if he feels he's not wanted; he's been on fire this season. I think we need to keep Jags if we can. Also don't wanna see Baines go nowhere either.
Deffo, Rodwell imo has been overrated, and it wouldn't suprise me if he's off to Man Utd this summer as part of the Gibson deal. ;-). If we get over £10mil for him, I'll be happy. Jags tho I'm still not 100% sure... we have imo three great CBs, but will find it difficult holding on to JH if he feels he's not wanted; he's been on fire this season. I think we need to keep Jags if we can. Also don't wanna see Baines go nowhere either.
Apparently Baines has chronic home-sickness, so I can't imagine him heading down to London.
He wouldn't join the shite either, as this interview tells us...
http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Everton-defender-Leighton-Baines-says-he-could-never-play-for-Liverpool-article806564.html
He wouldn't join the shite either, as this interview tells us...
http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Everton-defender-Leighton-Baines-says-he-could-never-play-for-Liverpool-article806564.html
As Steve said earlier, you can only sell the players other clubs want to buy & the obvious candidates for an offer have to be Baines, Fellaini & Heitinga.
If we had to sell then Jagieka and Rodwell would be my obvious candidates, we could squeeze 18M from them two.
Straq out, Pienaar in, maybe time to cash in on Cahill as well, I would replace him with Dempsey, can play the Cahill role but also play in midfield and wide right.
Drenthe could make us some money like Beckford, not sure he is Moyes's type, but get him in on a free and if things dont work out we could get 5-10M for him in the January.
We also need to pick up some younger replacements for Distin and Neville in the near future.
Straq out, Pienaar in, maybe time to cash in on Cahill as well, I would replace him with Dempsey, can play the Cahill role but also play in midfield and wide right.
Drenthe could make us some money like Beckford, not sure he is Moyes's type, but get him in on a free and if things dont work out we could get 5-10M for him in the January.
We also need to pick up some younger replacements for Distin and Neville in the near future.
Fine player that he is Distin is moving toward the end of his career.
Johnny Heitinga is a tremendous centre half and if he is offered Champions Legue football, as he should be playing, he will be off.
The Jag aint flavour of the month so we should be selling, apparantly.
He is club captain, an England international, who could have agitated for the Arsenal move but didnt.
He is a cracking player. He should not be, and if its down to Moyes i very much doubt he will be, sold.
Johnny Heitinga is a tremendous centre half and if he is offered Champions Legue football, as he should be playing, he will be off.
The Jag aint flavour of the month so we should be selling, apparantly.
He is club captain, an England international, who could have agitated for the Arsenal move but didnt.
He is a cracking player. He should not be, and if its down to Moyes i very much doubt he will be, sold.
If Pienaar is sub 4 million quid there's no chance Jags and Rodders worth 18 mill.
Jags 7 mill as a proven centre half and Rodders 3 millionish for someone who likes a punt.
Jags 7 mill as a proven centre half and Rodders 3 millionish for someone who likes a punt.
£3 million for Rodwell??!? Don't be stupid. Henderson cost £18 million for goodness sake.
Thomas you ask for 'young replacements for Neville & Distin'...
I reckon Duffy has a future, and I also reckon that Seamus can be 'coached' into being a full back. A lot of defensive coaching, but certainly worth a punt.
I reckon Duffy has a future, and I also reckon that Seamus can be 'coached' into being a full back. A lot of defensive coaching, but certainly worth a punt.
Roger Johnson is 28 and went to Wolves for 7mil in the summer. The Jag is just much better, and worth double figures easy.
And disappointing as this season has been and injury prone your Rodwell valuation is insane Barry!!
Theres this crazy premium on players just for being English, the Henderson fee is all we need to compare it with. Bit of potential, get a cap and its double figures. Rodwell also seems very highly regarded within the game, but it is getting to the stage where he has been underwhelming.
I feel thats mainly due to injuries and not being able to get a rythm going. Still only 20/21 as well. Plenty of time, as the Barkley zealots would do well to remember
And disappointing as this season has been and injury prone your Rodwell valuation is insane Barry!!
Theres this crazy premium on players just for being English, the Henderson fee is all we need to compare it with. Bit of potential, get a cap and its double figures. Rodwell also seems very highly regarded within the game, but it is getting to the stage where he has been underwhelming.
I feel thats mainly due to injuries and not being able to get a rythm going. Still only 20/21 as well. Plenty of time, as the Barkley zealots would do well to remember
Bobby, Rodwell baffles me. I clearly just dont see what others see. What I see, is a player who will turn out to be a good footballer for Everton / Whoever. I dont see a superstar. He will turn out, if he continues down the midfielder route, to be a Carrick. If he goes down the centre half route, then who knows. He isnt strong enough for me, yet, to be a top defender.
As for Ross Barkley.. I just get the hint of not really knowing what to do with him next ?
As for Ross Barkley.. I just get the hint of not really knowing what to do with him next ?
Mark, i know what your saying.
Ive seen Rodwell run mids fort the under 21's, Phil Nevile says he's the most 2 footed player hes ever seen.......but its not happening, althoughh the injuries are really stalling him.
Rodwell views himself as a box to box midfielder. I dont know how many times he has been given the opportunity to be that player at Everton, not enough in my eyes.
I have advocated selling him on a couple of threads, as based on what he has shown so far he would be no great loss.... and for the dollar....but also for the sake of his own development, to a more footballing team who would maybe use him more effectively.
We play him so deep and all the dribbling, bursting attacking aspects of his game seem to have disappeared. When he was in the England squad... straight into an attacking mid role.
We tend to play him holding role, i dont think that gets the best out of him, and i actually dont think hes that good at it. Best holding players tend to be more experienced i feel.
I think he does have alot more than he has been allowed to sow ansd injuries have let him show. But i am a little worried about his personality, the anonymity in some games.
Currently, yes i am maybe leaning to him becoming a Jermaine Jenas, unfulfilled potential type. i think its there though. He needs an injury free season, badly. Its still very early........*crosses fingers*
Ive seen Rodwell run mids fort the under 21's, Phil Nevile says he's the most 2 footed player hes ever seen.......but its not happening, althoughh the injuries are really stalling him.
Rodwell views himself as a box to box midfielder. I dont know how many times he has been given the opportunity to be that player at Everton, not enough in my eyes.
I have advocated selling him on a couple of threads, as based on what he has shown so far he would be no great loss.... and for the dollar....but also for the sake of his own development, to a more footballing team who would maybe use him more effectively.
We play him so deep and all the dribbling, bursting attacking aspects of his game seem to have disappeared. When he was in the England squad... straight into an attacking mid role.
We tend to play him holding role, i dont think that gets the best out of him, and i actually dont think hes that good at it. Best holding players tend to be more experienced i feel.
I think he does have alot more than he has been allowed to sow ansd injuries have let him show. But i am a little worried about his personality, the anonymity in some games.
Currently, yes i am maybe leaning to him becoming a Jermaine Jenas, unfulfilled potential type. i think its there though. He needs an injury free season, badly. Its still very early........*crosses fingers*
I know it's the done thing to "big up" your own...
But Dalglish's valuations as a yardstick for transfers......oh dear!
But Dalglish's valuations as a yardstick for transfers......oh dear!
Bobby, in an Everton Squad, thats actually competitive, surely keeping Rodwell would be perfect back-up for Fellani.
If we are ever going to progress, we need a squad. Todays bench looked good for me and competition for places, big game coming up or not was nice to see.
We need to remember that a fair few of our better performers are not Everton players, they will leave in a few weeks.
I also think we could pinch a few of the decent prospects out of Glasgow Rangers team for absolute peanuts, dont laugh, they have some good ones.
If we are ever going to progress, we need a squad. Todays bench looked good for me and competition for places, big game coming up or not was nice to see.
We need to remember that a fair few of our better performers are not Everton players, they will leave in a few weeks.
I also think we could pinch a few of the decent prospects out of Glasgow Rangers team for absolute peanuts, dont laugh, they have some good ones.
Barry, there is a premium on English players, with caps, and we all know it.......Lescott, Milner, Bent, the Glenn Johnson fee was nuts.....
Its absurd, but a fact. So stop talking utter bollocks with a £3mil Rodwell and comparing the Jag to virtually a championship player and get in the real world. Its you who is as off the scale as Dalglish.
Mark, dont disagree with alot of that. I just sometimes wonder the best way to get Moyes a bit of dollar to play with at minimum disruption to the squad.
Currently we are looking much better balanced with a £500k midfielder
Plus if Rodwell actually fulfils the potential he has got then, lets be honest he will get taken anyway as the constant Chelsea/Utd rumours suggest. Playing for one of those clubs may be better for him than the rigid system he plays in here that, for me, throttles his game.
But yes, of course i want a strong, deep Everton squad.
Its absurd, but a fact. So stop talking utter bollocks with a £3mil Rodwell and comparing the Jag to virtually a championship player and get in the real world. Its you who is as off the scale as Dalglish.
Mark, dont disagree with alot of that. I just sometimes wonder the best way to get Moyes a bit of dollar to play with at minimum disruption to the squad.
Currently we are looking much better balanced with a £500k midfielder
Plus if Rodwell actually fulfils the potential he has got then, lets be honest he will get taken anyway as the constant Chelsea/Utd rumours suggest. Playing for one of those clubs may be better for him than the rigid system he plays in here that, for me, throttles his game.
But yes, of course i want a strong, deep Everton squad.
Bobby Thompson
First you say this:
"the Henderson fee is all we need to compare it with"
Then contradict yourself by ridiculing the man who bought Henderson:
"Its you who is as off the scale as Dalglish."
Get a grip it's you talking "utter bollocks" if you can't take an alternate view wind your neck or at least be consistent, nob'ead.
First you say this:
"the Henderson fee is all we need to compare it with"
Then contradict yourself by ridiculing the man who bought Henderson:
"Its you who is as off the scale as Dalglish."
Get a grip it's you talking "utter bollocks" if you can't take an alternate view wind your neck or at least be consistent, nob'ead.
Barry,
A player, who has had an England cap, young, with potential, and is already experienced in the Prem.
For 3 million?
Doesnt that sound a bit stupid to you?
A player, who has had an England cap, young, with potential, and is already experienced in the Prem.
For 3 million?
Doesnt that sound a bit stupid to you?
Ben Jones
It's academic, the lad appears to be an injury prone player and hasn't progressed.
What you and others are tuned into is the media hype of the "next big thing" a few years ago.
Kidding yourselves, now that's stupid.
BTW look up the one cap wonders that england have had then disappeared, it means fuck all.
It's academic, the lad appears to be an injury prone player and hasn't progressed.
What you and others are tuned into is the media hype of the "next big thing" a few years ago.
Kidding yourselves, now that's stupid.
BTW look up the one cap wonders that england have had then disappeared, it means fuck all.
Rodwell is the next dare I say it Steven Gerrard. Put him on the weights machine and he'll have the body to match his dynamic playing style.
Well at least we saw last night what life without Baines would be like, Neville or Hibbert as left back, and doing a pretty good job of it too.
Where would Baines go? People seem intent on creating panic out of nothing. None of the top sides need or want him and he wouldn't go anywhere else. I'm pretty sure he'd see Europe as a massive risk.
Barry
You're putting words in my mouth mate, I didn't call him the next big thing. Hes got potential, he looks a natural footballer, but next big thing I'm not too sure about.
And how old is he? 20? So you think he's injury prone all his career even though he's so young? Another not so clever statement.
I think you won't get anyone agreeing with 3 million for him. It is pretty loony.
You're putting words in my mouth mate, I didn't call him the next big thing. Hes got potential, he looks a natural footballer, but next big thing I'm not too sure about.
And how old is he? 20? So you think he's injury prone all his career even though he's so young? Another not so clever statement.
I think you won't get anyone agreeing with 3 million for him. It is pretty loony.
Barry, I will give you credit for consistency. You do manage to talk bollocks on a regular basis, whilst clearly maintaining a high regard for your own opinion.
Lets be clear.
You have, flippantly or not, valued Rodwell at £3million. Lets be generous and call that questionable.
You also have the Jag valued at £7's.
The same as Roger Johnson.
Now, you will notice a theme emerging here. What im consistently saying is, your talking out of your arse.
I believe there is a premium on English players and referenced the Henderson fee, amongst others on which you have made no comment. The Henderson example is the most relevant bearing in mind age, postion and caps.
Dalglish has overpaid for Henderson, a fee which i believe is "off the scale". Imo Liverpool have overpaid by around £6 mil, even in the context of young English players going for an excessive amount.
But it is typical of the premium which exists on young capped English players and is a clear trend, highlighted by the the other players I have mentioned, of which there are more.
I feel, with this premium on English players, even an underperfoming Rodwell fee would lie around £10/11/12 mil, hopefully rising if he can put in consistent, injury free performances.
I struggle to think of any reasons, based in reality, other than a flippant post, that £3 mil is a realistic valuation.
Please attempt to justify, it will be amusing.
You do seem to think your omniscient Barry, but sometimes its just best to admit you have typed plain shite.
Finally, I wasnt ridiculing Dalglish.
I was ridiculing you.
Lets be clear.
You have, flippantly or not, valued Rodwell at £3million. Lets be generous and call that questionable.
You also have the Jag valued at £7's.
The same as Roger Johnson.
Now, you will notice a theme emerging here. What im consistently saying is, your talking out of your arse.
I believe there is a premium on English players and referenced the Henderson fee, amongst others on which you have made no comment. The Henderson example is the most relevant bearing in mind age, postion and caps.
Dalglish has overpaid for Henderson, a fee which i believe is "off the scale". Imo Liverpool have overpaid by around £6 mil, even in the context of young English players going for an excessive amount.
But it is typical of the premium which exists on young capped English players and is a clear trend, highlighted by the the other players I have mentioned, of which there are more.
I feel, with this premium on English players, even an underperfoming Rodwell fee would lie around £10/11/12 mil, hopefully rising if he can put in consistent, injury free performances.
I struggle to think of any reasons, based in reality, other than a flippant post, that £3 mil is a realistic valuation.
Please attempt to justify, it will be amusing.
You do seem to think your omniscient Barry, but sometimes its just best to admit you have typed plain shite.
Finally, I wasnt ridiculing Dalglish.
I was ridiculing you.
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242 Posted 07/04/2012 at 17:11:26
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