Season 2011-12
The Mail Bag
Champions League and Pienaar
18 Comments: Just a quick reaction to tonight's result ? maybe it will help us to get Pienaar?
Somebody at Spurs must have been watching him play for us and seeing what he could do for them ? especially if they got into the Champions League. 'Arry might not have rated him but he's not completely blind, and he did buy him a year ago.
But now, they may not care; budgets will be curbed... maybe Pienaar will be surplus to requirements.
I hope!
Peter Hall, Posted 19/05/2012 at 23:18:27
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Fingers crossed; the guy was in tears in the last interview so he deserves to be happy back here and Spurs should know they will look like they would be 'back to fronts' if they didn't let it happen or pricing him way over the odds; he should be back here getting the accolades he deserves.
The manager there didn't rate Pienaar to begin with. Why will it be difficult for that manager to get rid of him?
James, how could the manager there not rate him? He signed him.
The reality is that Pienaar found himself in a situation where he wasn't an automatic first choice at Spurs so didn't get much game time. To be honest, if we had a midfield of:
Parker
Van Der Vart
Bale
Kranjcar
Huddlestone
Lennon
I'm not sure Pienaar would be an automatic choice for us either. Spurs have an embarrassment of riches in midfield. Now, I would say that them failing to qualify for Champions League is MORE likely that we won't get Pienaar. Because there is a fair chance that Modric and Bale might move on, thus moving Pienaar back up the pecking order.
The reality is that Pienaar found himself in a situation where he wasn't an automatic first choice at Spurs so didn't get much game time. To be honest, if we had a midfield of:
Parker
Van Der Vart
Bale
Kranjcar
Huddlestone
Lennon
I'm not sure Pienaar would be an automatic choice for us either. Spurs have an embarrassment of riches in midfield. Now, I would say that them failing to qualify for Champions League is MORE likely that we won't get Pienaar. Because there is a fair chance that Modric and Bale might move on, thus moving Pienaar back up the pecking order.
Pienaar`s waspish style does not fit in with the Spurs way of playing.
They like their wide men to have pace and power. People like Bale and Lennon are far more direct.
Arry knew he was geting a quality player on the cheap when he snapped up our player of the season, but It didnt work out for either of them.
Pienaar MUST top Evertons shopping list, unfortunately we are relying on Kenwrights ability to play hardball with Levy . .what a mismatch.
"Knife to a gunfight"
They like their wide men to have pace and power. People like Bale and Lennon are far more direct.
Arry knew he was geting a quality player on the cheap when he snapped up our player of the season, but It didnt work out for either of them.
Pienaar MUST top Evertons shopping list, unfortunately we are relying on Kenwrights ability to play hardball with Levy . .what a mismatch.
"Knife to a gunfight"
I disagree. Will Harry want a player who wanted out when they were challenging for the title, but ended out of the champions league?
If bale or modric do leave, spurs should have £60m+ to spend on replacements. Why would pienaar get a look in if spurs spend the money around the team?
If spurs can make a profit on a player who is 30, isn't first choice, isn't happy, and will be worth less - why would levy not sell.
If bale or modric do leave, spurs should have £60m+ to spend on replacements. Why would pienaar get a look in if spurs spend the money around the team?
If spurs can make a profit on a player who is 30, isn't first choice, isn't happy, and will be worth less - why would levy not sell.
In these days of 'player power', if Pienaar wants to come back to Everton, it's a formality surely?
We al know how these things work.
Are we in the Europa League now by the way?
We al know how these things work.
Are we in the Europa League now by the way?
Tricky one to call this. I think on balance last night probably helped us as if they had champions league i think he would have been a very handy squad player to have and i think Ian bennete is right that if they did sell Modric or Bale they would have to bring players in as not sure many Spurs fans would be placated by them just moving stevie p up the order.
To be honest it shows how far behind we are that we are all hoping one of our best players is near the fringe enough for Spurs to not need him...
To be honest it shows how far behind we are that we are all hoping one of our best players is near the fringe enough for Spurs to not need him...
Speaking to a Spurs fan and he reckons Pienaar may well be in the first team for Spurs next season with Modric seemingly set to leave and Bale could also well follow.
Why would we be in the Europa league David?
It's Spurs, Liverpool and Newcastle.
CL = Man Utd, City, Arsenal and now Chelsea
7th would only come into play if the FA Cup and Carling Cup slots were both taken by people already finishing in top 6.
So even though Liverpool effectively had '2' Europa slots now (1 from Carling win and 1 from FA Cup that passed to them via Chelsea getting CL and their Europa slot passing to runners up), that second slot now passes back to the highest league position and effectively goes to Newcastle (now that Spurs have taken the one official league slot usually reserved for 5th).
Clear as mud?
It's Spurs, Liverpool and Newcastle.
CL = Man Utd, City, Arsenal and now Chelsea
7th would only come into play if the FA Cup and Carling Cup slots were both taken by people already finishing in top 6.
So even though Liverpool effectively had '2' Europa slots now (1 from Carling win and 1 from FA Cup that passed to them via Chelsea getting CL and their Europa slot passing to runners up), that second slot now passes back to the highest league position and effectively goes to Newcastle (now that Spurs have taken the one official league slot usually reserved for 5th).
Clear as mud?
Read this on the Guardian website talking about Spurs going into the Europa.
The Europa League awaits Spurs, an outcome the club have been dreading ever since they missed out on third spot to Arsenal. Normally, finishing fourth would have guaranteed them a qualifying place for the Champions League but with Chelsea winning the trophy having finished sixth it is they who take the last of England's four places in Europe's elite competition, qualifying automatically for the group stages.
It says we get 4 places? Liverpool, Newcastle, Spurs and ???
The Europa League awaits Spurs, an outcome the club have been dreading ever since they missed out on third spot to Arsenal. Normally, finishing fourth would have guaranteed them a qualifying place for the Champions League but with Chelsea winning the trophy having finished sixth it is they who take the last of England's four places in Europe's elite competition, qualifying automatically for the group stages.
It says we get 4 places? Liverpool, Newcastle, Spurs and ???
Haha, read that wrong sorry. It was talking about the champs league.
The europa would have killed our small squad anyhow. We need to build for a decent crack at all the domestics first. Kinda feel sorry for spurs, but not for Redknapp.
Last nights game, along with a couple of other things could really open things up next year. Chelsea I believe will strengthen quite a bit, but Spurs and Newcastle could have their better players taken from them now, and if Arsenal lose RVP then they have a job on their hands replacing him. The shite have stories going around about Suarez and Skrtel jumping ship too. If we can keep hold of our better players, add Pienaar and maybe a couple of others, plus use of the loan market again, it could be a good battle for the Europe spots.
I think it's nailed on that Pienaar will be leaving Spurs irrespective of which European competition they're playing in next season. It was a move that made sense at the time (both for the player and the club he joined) but in hindsight it simply hasn't worked out.
The only doubt lies in where his end destination is going to be. It seems clear the player himself would like a permanent move back here and probably regrets leaving in the first place. However, Spurs don't owe us anything and now they've lost out on the extra Champions League revenue they may be more reluctant to let him go on the cheap. Given the form he's shown since he returned, surely other teams must be interested.
If Sunderland (or whoever) slapped in a £6m bid and the most Everton can offer is £3m, then where do you think he's going to end up? Is Pienaar really going to dig in his heels, refuse to talk to any team but Everton, and thereby risk an entire season sat on the sidelines? We may be his preferred option but I don't think it can be a case of Everton or nobody for him. At the end of the day, players want to play and agents want to earn a quick buck.
The only doubt lies in where his end destination is going to be. It seems clear the player himself would like a permanent move back here and probably regrets leaving in the first place. However, Spurs don't owe us anything and now they've lost out on the extra Champions League revenue they may be more reluctant to let him go on the cheap. Given the form he's shown since he returned, surely other teams must be interested.
If Sunderland (or whoever) slapped in a £6m bid and the most Everton can offer is £3m, then where do you think he's going to end up? Is Pienaar really going to dig in his heels, refuse to talk to any team but Everton, and thereby risk an entire season sat on the sidelines? We may be his preferred option but I don't think it can be a case of Everton or nobody for him. At the end of the day, players want to play and agents want to earn a quick buck.
We just don't know whether last night's penalties lottery CL 'win' alters anything for us, because we don't know what the situation was anyway.
We assume that DM wants Pienaar back ? fair enough. There is no evidence for any sort of 'right to buy' clause in the loan ? it happened very quickly that night as the window closed. So what happens next?
Pienaar puts in a transfer request ? again, we assume. Or Spurs put him up for sale ? price? That's where the likes of Sunderland become a threat in cash terms.
Any talk about what-if then goes into the realm of fantasy. Bale goes ? where? Real Madrid, £30m, Arry wants Steven. Why? Might he not buy someone else, for instance. Fellaini?
Pienaar took his chance at the glory ? it didn't work out, and he must be older and wiser now. He might get more money at Sunderland, and that might swing it, but glory? And would he get a game? A Martin O'Neill player? Doubt it. Not big, hard or dirty enough.
An interesting discussion during the next couple of months might be: 'A Moyes Player ? what is it?'
We assume that DM wants Pienaar back ? fair enough. There is no evidence for any sort of 'right to buy' clause in the loan ? it happened very quickly that night as the window closed. So what happens next?
Pienaar puts in a transfer request ? again, we assume. Or Spurs put him up for sale ? price? That's where the likes of Sunderland become a threat in cash terms.
Any talk about what-if then goes into the realm of fantasy. Bale goes ? where? Real Madrid, £30m, Arry wants Steven. Why? Might he not buy someone else, for instance. Fellaini?
Pienaar took his chance at the glory ? it didn't work out, and he must be older and wiser now. He might get more money at Sunderland, and that might swing it, but glory? And would he get a game? A Martin O'Neill player? Doubt it. Not big, hard or dirty enough.
An interesting discussion during the next couple of months might be: 'A Moyes Player ? what is it?'
An ideal "Moyes player" works hard. They have one or more of these attributes: run 12 km per match, are professional, value selection, and have a strong mentality.
Because these players get the most out of themselves they can at times surpass those who are more talented; however, I think overall we need more "raw talent" like Drenthe, but with at least an "average" mentality. Then, DM's discipline as well as the experience of older players can have a positive impact.
I think Nikica Jelavic has not only talent but also a positive mindset and he works hard. Best signing perhaps since the duo of Cahill and Arteta.
Because these players get the most out of themselves they can at times surpass those who are more talented; however, I think overall we need more "raw talent" like Drenthe, but with at least an "average" mentality. Then, DM's discipline as well as the experience of older players can have a positive impact.
I think Nikica Jelavic has not only talent but also a positive mindset and he works hard. Best signing perhaps since the duo of Cahill and Arteta.
´Arry bought SP to weaken us more than to strenghen them. A tactic which worked.
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295 Posted 20/05/2012 at 00:59:41
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