Not with Kenwright in charge.

For me the overwhelming probability is that not only will we not win the league title again but possibly win no trophies again whoever is in charge unless it's an Oligarch or a great Sheik.

Yes

Maybe but never as long as we have Dithering Dave the Big Game Bottler in charge.

This year, by 10 points. Liverpool relegated to boot.

Why when we respond to these topics do you guys assume BK, DM or any of the existing officers, players, management, tea ladies etc will be there in 5,10,15 or 20 years time.
Let me tell you that all these people will move on. The only people that will still be there in the coming years are us, the fans. The only people that truly have their emotions, hopes, fears, expectations and money invested in our club. Despite the fact that most of us don't have millions to dump into the bottomless pit that premiership football demands we still turn up to pay our entrance money, buy our memorabilia into whatever the future holds. This may be buttons to the oligarchs and sheikhs but represents a massive investment of cash, time and commitment from us. Like every new season I know we will see some shit but hope that we also see something that will drag me back to watching Roy Vernon, Alex Young, Colin Harvey, Bob Latchford, Both Duncs and on and on. If we reach a point where get more of the latter than the shit I will be happy. I suspect when the days of football being flavour of the month for the mega rich have gone we will still be there in the top flight and our day will com again.

I think it's a pointless question in professional sport. If you'd asked a Man City fan 5 years ago if they'd ever win anything again I doubt they'd have been too hopeful, ditto Chelsea ten years ago.
Bill could hand over (chuckle) power tomorrow to an Abrahamovich and we could win the league next year.
In the current situation there's next to no chance. I suppose if we could squeeze into the top 4, then make the group stages of the CL next season it would give Moyes a platform. It would still take another couple of huge jumps to win the league though.

Well it's like the song from Dumbo.

How did it go again?

"I seen a peanut stand,
heard a rubber band
I seen a needle that winked its eye
But I be done seen 'bout ev'rything
When I see Everton win the league with fuckin' Kenwright in charge.

I seen a front porch swing,
heard a diamond ring
I seen a polka-dot railroad tie
But I be done seen 'bout ev'rything
When I see Everton win the League with fuckin' Kenwright in charge.

I heard a fireside chat,
I saw a baseball bat
And I just laughed till I thought I'd die
But I be done seen 'bout ev'rything
When I see Everton win the League with fuckin' Kenwright in charge..or fuckin' Moyes for that matter.

(funny it's only when you see it written down, you realise much of it doesn't scan. Mind you, the animation was so good we were probably all distracted)

Yep, after we beat Newcastle tonight and play (and beat) Swansea next week before anyone else plays we'll be sitting top of the league. We'll lead the way from then until May and bask in the glory of being champions :)

.... Next!......

As another poster pointed out, from the perspective of 2012 probably not, but who knows what will happen in the next 10 years. If I would have gone into a bookies in 1990 and asked for a price on Liverpool not winning the title for 20 years what odds would I have got?

As it stands we have a rich man's trainset league, but there are moves from UEFA to make the league more competitive, obviously someone in the organisation realises that the usual suspects battling it out for the prizes disenfranchises 90% of the ‘customers’ who may collectively find other things to do (and watch. In addition with all these Americans taking over teams, how long before one of them advocates a ‘draft pick’ approach to the sport, which (in theory anyway) prevents domination of one or two teams.

But right now we have a fine first XI that can give any team a game, but unlike the moneyed teams, 3-4 injuries/suspensions will and we will be down to the bare bones, that will probably do for us.

Not with the sky goalposts where they are. Something will have to disturb the status quo both at EFC and in the Prem. This season if everything aligns we 'could' do 3rd but no more.

We'll have a chance of competing for the championship when we get the investment into the club to eliminate our structural financial weakness. This is extremely unlikely ever to happen. The only other chance is that the financial fair play intiative could bring the top teams down to our level but that is equally unlikely to happen so I'd say not much of a chance.

It's time for a salary cap to be introduced that levels the playing field somewhat. I cant see the players going for it though, how can they justify paying Persie £200k a week or Teves.

We ain't gonna win a fucking argument never mind the league. Here's hoping we can maybe do the MMCup and win the Europa Cup. Everything else is beyond our means.

Who'd have thought back in the 80s that Blackburn would win the League, or five years ago that City would triumph in such a short space of time.

Everton as it is now, in the Old Lady, and without a serious backer; unlikely. But will we always be in that position? Also, unlikely.

Orm starting to tonight; a 16-match winning run: and our tenth is on the way!

Not in my lifetime (I am 40 this year) unless we have a Man Cityesque type of buyout.

Predictable Peter, that's your problem.....too short sighted, think passed Moyes and then look at the question again.

Impossible to know the answer but it's fair to say it's not going to happen any time soon.

Fickin' 'ell, Tony, not in your lifetime? Nothing down for me then! but I'll hang on in there, a win tonight and I'll be dreaming again.

I can't help myself, as I get older, I find myself more and more cynical about everything except the Blues... completely irrational I suppose. I never even think about how much I'm spending on tickets, even though a cold hard look tells me I can't really afford them.

Our days will come again I'm sure, although maybe Tony might have to become the oldest man ever to live to see it.

The more 'serious backers' there are the less chance this will guarantee the league as it did for Blackburn, Chelsea, City and to a lesser extent Utd in '93.

Any more serious backers and it may not be enough to get you in the CL even... but if they are 'serious' they'd know this and head off elsewhere, as we've seen with PSG perhaps.

Right now the same teams stop others from becoming competitive by monopolising CL money, and the best players only sign for CL teams. So the only chance for the league to become competitive without billionaire clubs is to have a change to qualifying for CL spots. In a way that would increase other teams income and stop players only signing for those virtually monopolised 4 spots.

If we had CL spots allocated thus...

Champions
FAC and/or* LC
End of season play offs for 2nd through 5th (*or if only one place via domestic cups, there would be two 2 leg play off finals)

You could play those two games in Asia perhaps, the week after the PL finishes. This would sportingly randomise where the CL money goes, and allow a fairer place in the transfer market as only 2 or three of the top 5 would qualify for the CL.

Would it ever happen? No.

I think we will potentially win the league this season. I personally think we could go all the way to the end of the season challenging at least.

Bill and the board are doing a wonderful job and are equally responsible for the squad we now have.

Maybe not a popular view on ToffeeWeb but one I would expect all true supporters should be supporting from a belief and moral perspective at least.

Bill Kenwright bashers will no doubt disagree.

Other than breaking the transfer record for Alan Ball and being called the mersey millionaires, how many times has EFC broken the transfer record since the Swinging Sixties? We paid big bucks for the likes of Latchford and Lineker and Cottee but since the 60s who have we broken the transfer record for? The Yak and Felli, although expensive for EFC, are not records. Who else did we break the bank for in the 60s?

As for winning the premiership? As the great Mama's & Papa's hit in the 60's went,
"I can dream Can't I".

Tony J Williams # 202 But I DID think 'passed (sic)' Moyes it seems English Comprehension was not your strongest subject at school. When I started with a "maybe", that means I think it might be possible in the future — but I qualified it by predicting it will never happen with Big Game Bottler Davey Boy in charge.

Yes. Definitely.

Peter #237, if the English comprehension of the contributors winds you up, don't go onto Bluekipper, you'll freak. Mind you, if you're anti-Moyes they won't publish any contribution!

Matt,
Ya rite der m8, der awl fick on tha sight !

Steve Smith.@246.

If you're going to have the nerve to comment on the grammar used by some of the contributors on here you should at least get your facts right.

It's "dat" site, not "tha" site.

Wool.

Soz Ray laa, its coz im from de wirral, wer ded posh ere, we get out of the shower for a pee.

Steve.

No you don't.

I think we have a genuine shot at top 4 'IF' we can kick on with a result tonight. I do have a slight worry that the defeat to West Brom, the break, the loss of the Belgian guy and Felliani comments have undermined some of our togetherness and focus.

If we can rally together tonight though I think the wheels are back on the bandwagon, we have some favourable fixtures ahead and some good attacking and defensive players.

In terms of the league I think that's a different matter. Clearly no 'under-funded' underdog has come close to a sustained challenge since the foundation of the premier league as money has most definitely talked. You can even argue that Arsenal's fall from grace has coincided with it's move to book-balancing (which tied in with the stadium rebuild as much as Wenger's philosophy).

So in current market trends it doesn't look likely. But the thing is that circumstances can change quickly and profoundly, so who knows what will happen in 10 years time, maybe more fans will be disenchanted and people will have got fed up for paying average footballers £50-100K a week and some sense of sanity will have returned. Maybe Sky will go bust and the premier league's golden TV rights goose will be cooked? Maybe Platini's attempt to restore financial fairplay will actually be supported by FIFA (clearly they are becoming stricter on the regulations - see our transfer window issue, or maybe Bill didn't send Blatter a nice enough Xmas present last year?)
Maybe the European superleague will come to pass after all and the premier league will effectively start at current position 5 or 6?

So given an increase in our quality plus changes in the conditions around us I think it's reasonable to expect we could have a chance at winning the league in the next 10-20 years.

Ha ha, you're right ! I was using the Royal we.

Steve Smith, Illusions of grandeur...the Royal Wee........

Not with Moyes as manager, that is certain.

Of course we can. Well, we can least get into a position when it could be possible. By that I mean finances alone cannot guarantee it for us. Even when we were one of the wealthier clubs we didn't win it that often.

For us to compete we need to move forward financially or see other clubs move back financially.Neither of those are impossible. Most things happen in cycles. Who would have,thought, for example, that Matt Busby's European cup winners weren't that far away from relegation.

I see no sign of the premier league imploding but things will, for whatever reason, change; they always. Say we had got Essien and somehow found the money for Aron Lennon. Then we wouldn't be far away. A couple of big ifs I know, but it is not beyond comprehension or possibilty. So ,yes we will win the league again.

Since Blackburn won the league in 1995, or 17 years ago, the title has been won by a total of just 4 clubs (before last season only 3 clubs in 16 years - so much for the 'most exciting league on the planet tag'!).

Right now, at the start of every season, these same 4 clubs are realisticly the only ones who will be fighting it out come May for top spot. Even though the likes of spurs and barcodes had a great season last year, they simply don't have the squad depth to compete with manure, citeh, chelski and to a lesser extent arsenal.

Without a drastic change in finances on the Everton end or a hughe restructuring of the league, Everton, along with about 15 other clubs, have pretty much a zero chance of winning the title, ever.

As depressing as that sounds, we are all realists at the end of the day and all know that the league now, more than ever, is simply a case of who has the deepest pockets and except for manure, no one can really compete with the petro dollars and oligarchs.

Still I would like to just win SOMETHING / ANYTHING, including the mickey mouse cup, before we even start talking about league titles. Not a single trophy in 17 years when we won 5 major trophys between '84 and '95! Just one sodding final appearance.

Matt Traynor # 242 Its not just Tony J Williams inability to comprehend the English language that annoys me but the fact that by doing so he creates a 'Strawman' which he then attacks.

As I young lad in the mid 70's I remember asking if I'll ever see Everton win the league after losing to Carlisle (Yes Carlisle) away, and then home to Sheff Utd. We came close that year but failed. 1975 I think it was and Derby County were eventual winners. Things got worse after that and you wondered if our luck would ever change. In the end, it did change so never give up but things are different now.

Don't worry about it Peter, I always bow down to your alliteration and creative grasp of the English language, how the cold winter nights must simply fly by ....

Annoys you? Methinks you are to emotional then and also quite odd when one piece of poor spelling does that to you.

Along with oligarchs, Sky, CL etc, the other big change was the Bosman ruling, which makes it impossible for a non-money team to have a 'golden generation' which could level the field for any length of time.

I can't see us winning it, as things are currently set up. Still, I've seen us win three Championships so I can't complain. Fingers crossed for the kids.

So Peter #281 and Jimmy #269 the obvious question is which manager would win the Premier League with the financial constraints we have? Maybe after they have done that they can move on to a cure for cancer and world peace.

Everton have dominated Europe for the last 10 years on my PS3 ;)

The key for me is consistancy. Spurs got CL qualification one year then fall away the next. Newcastle came very close last year but could fall away again this year. When you look at Arsenal, who are having bad years by their standards, they will still qualify for the CL every year. This gives them the cash, and the attractiveness to quality players, to keep in with a chance of winning things.

No. I see the only chance is that somehow we get a billions, rid of Kenwright, Moyes and out of Woodison. It ain't gonna happen. Only one team on merseyside will do it again and it ain't us.

Sadly Joe McMahon, you're probably right. LFC have bigger sights and suffer defeat harder than us: they won 5 trophies under Houllier but still sacked him when they realised he wasn't going to win them the title. Same for Benitez, even though he won them the CL. We have put up with a lack of ambition for over 20 years, yet we still think the sun shines out of Moyesies well stuffed arse pocket. I was personally hoping he was on his way to Spurs and we'd receive some compo.
Yes, I will always be grateful to him for giving us back our pride, but his limitations have been well known for years. We have the nucleus of a decent side and with just a few tweaks here and there, and a tried and tested coach - as opposed to that muppet with the earpiece - we could feasibly win the league title. Greece won the Euro's with a team full of nobodies, so it's not impossible. It's just the belief and a shrewd manager that's needed now

I don't think Liverpool have higher ambitions Mick, they just had all that money which for the other teams in the top 4 did win championships. If we had that money and position and Moyes returned the same record as now, don't you think we'd care toview him different?

Mick, generally agree with your sentiments but I don't think you can use the Greek Euro'04 victory as back up. The winners of the tournament only end up playing (I think) 6 games in total, so a good run from a no-mark side can get them far.

However, that is pretty much impossible to keep up over 38 games but I get your point.

Not before a full-blown European League is launched , which doesn't leave us very long methinks!

Denis, 6 games in total, won 4, drew 1 lost 1, two of those wins were against the same Portugal side.

So they beat 3 teams to win the Euro's......not quite the same as playing 19 teams twice, is it?

Surely the planned financial fair play regulations are going to now restrict any oligarch style man city or chelsea's from ever coming into power... but at the same time, because they have a big squad at the moment they will also be the richer clubs for some time as well... as we know though, big priced players means big wages... so surely they will come tumbling down as they operate on a loss until theyve sold all the overpriced cast-offs they have in the reserves??

While at the same time Everton break even (surely we must do by now!?), have a great youth setup, a settled team, a youth team that is being built to follow their footsteps... and next year we're going to get 50% more money from sky...

to be honest I think we've a very good chance. Whether this is how the regulations will work I'm not sure, but Moyes did touch on it in one of his press conferences over the summer.. its important to get the talent on board asap because it will all go up by a third very soon... if we can take advantage of some of the situations that will arise after that injection of money and the start of the regulations we could be up there with Chelsea and all that very soon... its just a shame about the stadium still needing to be updated... but by sounds of it the price of players going up will mean it won't take selling too many to afford to build a new one... perhaps 10 years down the line we could swop one for George Green?

Sadly money talks. There's 3 teams that could win the league this year, both Manchester clubs and Chelsea (at a push). Two are owned by billionaires and the other just happens to one of the richest clubs in the world. Says it all really. So yes we can, but only with major investment.

My first game was 1952 in the old Second Division, so over the years I have not done too badly as a supporter with 8 major trophies in the old memory locker. However, I did have about ten mediocre seasons before Young, Vernon and Co delivered the League title in 1963.

Prior to that, I did not think I would ever see the glint of silverware as the Everton teams of the fifties were so average, avoiding relegation was our seasonal aim. John Moores (despite later criticism) changed our destiny by giving us ambition which had been sadly lacking since the end of the war.

My instincts now tell me that, as the the game has changed so dramatically over the years, I can not see us ever winning the Prem.

Ronald Reagan made it to President. Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness sat in government together. Surprising things happen.

Back on planet earth we cannot do it now without serious investment. It could happen if we hit 4th place, get CL money and/or someone puts some other dosh behind us. This is rather a long shot. Or I suppose the playing field could become more level but I suspect there are too many vested interests in play for that to happen.

Maybe those currently investing in other clubs will start putting their money into beach volleyball instead.

It is a money game currently yes, and in the current climate it will be almost impossible for our club to reach those dizzy height to win the league, BUT, Man City, Chelsea, Man Utd and even Liverpool, all spend a lot of money every season, and have big money owners, in the short term, this has worked for the likes of City and Chelsea, but what about the long term? Teams like Chelsea may be a much bigger worldwide club now, same with City, but these clubs rely on their big money owners to buy in the latest great talent, profits are never enough to pay for big transfer fees and ridiculous wages combined. So, considering the long term, this is not a good strategy, and in fact may risk the long-term future of the clubs if the finances dry up.

I personally do not want Everton to go down this route; if we get a new chairman, we need stability, not instant success. Like everyone, I want trophies back at Everton, but not at a cost of risking the club's long-term future. To be fair to Man United though, they do have a little more stability due to their success over the last 20 years. As much as it pains me to say that, we need a long-term strategy to bring success, we are closer to this under BK than we would be under a Sheikh owner!! Just look at the amount of clubs that have been screwed over by dodgy chairmen; we need to do it right.

And as for the Moyes boo boys, we have a fantastic manager that most clubs would love to have, he has taken us forward in a big way. I think it is ridiculous that you question his management.

Let's get behind the team because this season we have the most promising team we have had in a long time.

COYB!!!!

We won't win the Premier League as long as this clown Kenwright is clinging to the club, that's for sure.

Moyes is little more than a second rate manager, so we can forget winning it while he's in charge.

I'd settle for winning the League Cup thesedays,let alone the title. It's a disgrace this club has gone 17 years without a trophy, and it's even sadder loads accept it.

Not a chance until the oil runs out and West End moguls rule the world.

If you look at the decisions Manure had go their way in the CL last night the reasons we will never win the league again are clear. Football did not exist before the Premier League began and everything is about the big four's divine right to media and tv domination.

Not unless either they bring in stronger rules to cap wages and transfer fees that eliminate financial resource imbalances or we get an oligarch.

Times are changing a little. Who would have believed even a few weeks a go that our neighbours would admit to starting a season without a striker because they couldn't afford it – and this is a side desperate for CL qualification. Did its owners not believe it could be done?

Our present team as so close to being a very good side; if a certain Belgium club had sorted its paperwork in time we might be looking at 3rd right now. As some have said there is a mentality change from being a good trier to being a winner as someone from Man City said last week, expecting to win is a state of mind.

Sadly the increased income from the Sky & others will be quickly eaten up with us being left with only a slightly stronger squad and in a world were a club has the spending power to do what it likes, pushing up prices and wages everywhere we are still not going to compete for the top.

Absolutely no fuckin' chance whatsoever bud. None.... Less than zero.

You've more chance of the Royal family take o'er Dave HD, me growin' a 15'' cock and me bird learnin' to shut her fuckin' mouth when I'm watchin' the tele.

Simple as that.

We could start by winning a few derbies first, especially over their place, then we'll take it from there>