Season › 2012-13 › News
Reds win Liver Bird copyright fight
Aflie Hincks, a former City councillor from Fazakerly, applied to have the decision revoked after gathering hundreds of pages of evidence that the bird has been a wider symbol of Liverpool and he is disappointed with the judgement.
“I was absolutely convinced that with the amount of evidence we had sent in and the amount of information they had we would persuade them it was a symbol of our city."
If anything, Mr Hincks feels that the trademark belongs to the family of Carl Bartels, the German architect who designed the birds on the Royal Liver Building.
“In the First World War Mr Bartels was sent to the Isle of Man as a prisoner of war because he was German," Mr Hincks said.
“The city dignitaries were so embarrassed that we had a German architect design the birds they went back to the blueprints and destroyed them."
Mr Hincks is looking to continue his fight by trying to uncover further evidence to bolster his case. “I spoke to his great-grandson yesterday and he is trying to get evidence we can use, but obviously there are no blueprints we can produce."
The judgement from the EU's TMDRO stated: “Although the community trademark may carry connotations of the city of Liverpool to certain consumers, just as many consumers would see the mark simply as a stylised representation of a bird and would take no geographic meaning from it.
“It must be borne in mind that the Liver Bird is not a state emblem for the city of Liverpool.”
Everton FC also have a historical link with the Liver Bird, with an early Club crest featuring a representation of the bird, examples of which can be seen in the Everton Collection.
Quotes or other material sourced from Liverpool Echo
Reader Comments (30)
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2 Posted 14/12/2012 at 23:24:14
Wikipedia states or it would if I wrote the last two letters.
Cormorants and shags are medium-to-large seabirds. All are fish-eaters, dining on small eels, fish, and even water snakes. They dive from the surface, though many species make a characteristic half-jump as they dive, presumably to give themselves a more streamlined entry into the CL.
3 Posted 14/12/2012 at 23:41:22
The Norwegian municipalities of Røst, Loppa and Skjervøy have cormorants in their coat-of-arms. The species depicted in heraldry is most likely to be the Great Cormorant, the most familiar species in Europe.
The cormorant was the disguise used by Satan in Milton's Paradise Lost.
The cormorant was significant as a symbol of "true Life/ Thereby regain’d," and was ironically used by Satan. Satan sat on top of the Tree of Life as a cormorant in his first attempt to deceive and tempt Eve.
That's enough evidence to suggest that they truly are the Dark Side!
4 Posted 15/12/2012 at 00:22:29
5 Posted 15/12/2012 at 02:54:00
In the light of these types of situation, past, present and no doubt, future, how many times do I have to repeat it.
6 Posted 15/12/2012 at 04:13:42
7 Posted 15/12/2012 at 09:14:48
More of a Shag than a Cormorant - don't you think?
8 Posted 15/12/2012 at 09:17:45
Still I'd rather a Good Shag than a Heraldic Cormorant.
I'll get my coat!
9 Posted 15/12/2012 at 09:19:16
Point or order. Cormorants are not scavengers.
10 Posted 15/12/2012 at 10:32:01
11 Posted 15/12/2012 at 10:36:24
12 Posted 15/12/2012 at 10:45:58
In the end we are Everton and in the words of that Mexican bandit in High Sierra....' we don't need no(fucking) badges!' For most of my time as an Evertonian we didn't wear a badge on the shirt. We didn't need one....everybody knew who we were.
13 Posted 15/12/2012 at 11:03:29
1921-1929 no badge just embroidered EFC
1930 no badge
!931 no badge just embroidered EFC
1932-1972 no badge
1973-1978 no badge just embroidered EFC
1979 started wearing badge with occasional reversion to EFC
Years with no badge 84
Years with EFC 14
Years with badge 34
14 Posted 15/12/2012 at 11:21:13
15 Posted 15/12/2012 at 11:30:04
Wrong on both counts.
16 Posted 15/12/2012 at 12:06:25
17 Posted 15/12/2012 at 12:25:36
Ciaran....you're wrong.
18 Posted 15/12/2012 at 14:34:47
19 Posted 15/12/2012 at 14:41:38
20 Posted 15/12/2012 at 14:41:42
I wish we had a Blue Liverbird on our club shirts as it represents the city and would be instantly recognisable to people who don't know Everton FC is actually in this City. What next LfC trade mark the name of the city as thier own... It's a fucking joke.How can the Liver bird belong to the Redshite?
Those of you saying fuck it really don't get it at all... You should be ashamed of yourselves.
21 Posted 15/12/2012 at 16:02:10
I don't argue on academic stuff unless I know I'm right.
Countless species of birds, snakes and various other predators who will die before eating pre-killed food.
To call a species a 'scavenger', it would need to be a predominant part of its feeding strategy.
Next.
22 Posted 15/12/2012 at 18:33:33
23 Posted 15/12/2012 at 20:39:40
Having been a supporter of our fabulous club or rather going to Goodison Park for 45 years, I can honestly say that rag (as Colin so eloquently put it) has never come down on the side of Everton FC and its loyal supporters. To me, I think this paper regards us as just an afterthought to the city's premier club.
I know Alfie personally and only spoke with him recently after the Spurs game, although this topic never cropped up. I can understand where he's coming from but personally they can shove the bird where the sun doesn't shine... I don't want nothing to do with it.
Nil satis nisi optimum.
25 Posted 16/12/2012 at 00:30:55
BTW you seem to be very familiar with Norway, how come?
26 Posted 16/12/2012 at 11:00:36
How can they copyright it? Will the Liver Building need to take down the birds? Will the council need to change the city centre bins (most have a golden Liverbird on)?
It's a decision that needs to be challenged!
27 Posted 16/12/2012 at 11:38:21
28 Posted 16/12/2012 at 13:54:18
And it doesn't belong to them — it's the city's and Everton used it before them. So we should fight too keep it part off the city. If we don't fight it, you might as well not bother because you've already given up...!
29 Posted 16/12/2012 at 18:50:33
30 Posted 16/12/2012 at 19:03:21
You are correct, as a scouser born in walton 55yrs ago and exiled to the midlands these past 30 yrs it needs fighting - it is important.
Fuck off LFC you shifty gets you know full well the implicit message this sends out, we are a part of this city as much as you indeed without us you wouldn't be here.
No we shouldn't quietly roll over for it.
31 Posted 17/12/2012 at 06:33:39
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1 Posted 14/12/2012 at 23:20:54
We've written to them asking if they’ll be putting as much effort into their brand of investigative journalism when they finally pluck up the courage to reveal that one of their own, a Liverpool supporter, employed by Everton, has, what can only be described as wrongfully and maliciously, revoked the season ticket of a fifty season veteran Evertonian, banned him from Goodison Park , had a solicitor send a series of allegations for which they have no supporting evidence which ultimately led two members of the Police football intelligence unit to visit his home and issue the primary school teacher concerned with a recordable verbal warning; an action which has now seen three complaints to the IPCC upheld.
This paper got away with murder over Kirkby, how they colluded with the club to mislead the fans and shareholders; never forget they were identified as owing the club in leaked emails.
Whilst I have a lot of time for some journalists at the Echo, the people that run it continually confirm that they're a waste of space.