Corner turned with fine Everton performance

As I said on here yesterday, this game was a great indicator of where we are, and today we’ve showed that we are still capable.

Macca MotM but there were others (Stones... )

Top half of the table (finally) – 4 clean sheets on the bounce at The Old Lady – posiitve GD – 16 points out of 18.

Very well done gaffer; very well done lads!

Onwards and upwards!
Crucial pre-season coming up.

Martinez In!

But Souness on Sky has managed to suggest that United were hard done to!

We were superb (tactically) today. Not pretty but bloody effective.

I thought McCarthy was MotM – give him a new contract!

I thought we’d lose but Martinez got it spot on. Macca immense. Phew!

I was told once by a wise person you can’t expect a pig to do anything else but grunt....

Souness was alluding to our 3rd goal. Lukaku was a mile offside and the ball was meant for him.

Well done Everton.

Happy Days ahead!!!

Surely now RM will look at Man Utd – 65% possession, with a multi-hundred-million pound team – yet 0-3 and hardly a shot on target, and realise possession based tika taka is a dead end.

It sets us up for a strong finish to the season and hopefully a good pre-season and a successful 2015-16.

Great feet and determination by Jimmy Mac for the 1st. Top movement and header by Stones for the 2nd following 3 consecutive on-the-money corners by Leighton. Good awareness, pace and finish by Kevin for the 3rd, regardless of what Souness is spouting on Sky.

Van Gaal’s tactics and selection in disarray by half-time and unable to retrieve the situation with his multi-million pound subs.

Big well done to players and Roberto alike! A thoroughly professional performance.

McCarthy’s resulted from a long clearance and a determined solo run.

Stones’s goal was direct from a corner that Martinez does not lay much priority on.

Mirallas’s goal was another individual strike a la McCarthy’s.

Meanwhile United had 65% possession, conceded 3 goals and did not score. A bit like our early season stuff. Are you taking note, Roberto!

It has been a very good upturn in fortunes and a strong finish to the season which should buy Martinez more time.

Mirallas seems to have indicated a willingness to stay which is good news. It is no coincidence that winning football results in a greater willingness to stay.

The diabolical run in the first 28 games which had us in very serious trouble should not be forgotten lest our manager every contemplates a return to the slack, careless, dour brand of football that we were playing during that earlier period. The more physical counter-attacking football, mixed with good spells of passing, has yielded 16 points in 6 games. This style has brought us 36% of our current points haul from only 18% of the 34 matches we have played so far.

Even 2-0 would have reflected a dominant performance and been equally impressive.

Dick I think that Roberto made that happen and the notes were taken during this last week when Martinez was paying more attention to defence and set-pieces than is usual!

Big shout for Ross Barkley who did very well today either tracking back – man-marking – or always ALWAYS trying to get something started.

We must do all we can to keep Mirallas.

I was one of the ones calling for his head mid-season but he has turned it around since we were knocked out of the Europa League. Everyone does say playing in the Europa League does do funny things to your domestic season but none of us Evertonians took this into consideration?

At the start of the season, we were unfit, unprepared and players were not playing to their usual standard but we did look confident due to the season prior. We lost that confidence very quickly though due to our results but I do believe this campaign has built character to our manager, he has not crumbled to the pressure. He has maintained his focus and I think he has learnt his lesson from a poor pre-season, a tough domestic and continental season and a tough reception from fans regarding an anticipated ripe season.

I believe he does deserve another season and I really do hope and want that he can take us, Everton, to the next level. To win a trophy. To qualify for the Champions League. To become the Everton we should be.

Whatever Martinez said/did this week worked a treat. We got the pace, energy and commitment we’d been desperate to see all season. Maybe they practised corners this week, maybe the players just did their jobs right. Everything we did last season stemmed from a solid defence, the last six games/wins have shown this.

Lennon’s pace has galvanised the team and provided time and space for Barry to excel. Now who/where’s that playmaker we’re going to buy in the summer?

Great performance which hopefully helps convince our best players to continue next season! Stones, Macca, Coleman, Jags, Baines – all superb

Lennon needs signing up too (he’s suprised me!)

I would love RM to have us all (me included) eating humble pie!

The problem with our league form was that our players were playing a style of football in the league which was unsuited to the personnel, and it took the manager far too long to realize this.In the EL, one calamitous defensive performance cost us against Kiev – but, then again, that is the nature of cup football, so it is easier to take than the repeatedly atrocious performances in the league.

How many times have you heard the managers of top teams make excuse after excuse about how they didn’t do this or that when they lose to so-called lesser teams.

Let’s hope Martinez learns from the irony of today’s result. Monopolising possession is no substitute for winning.

A great team performance and easily our best of the season, including the wins over Wolfsburg.

1st goal, box to box in 14 seconds. 2nd goal a fantastic header from a brilliant corner. Please don’t wake me up.

Only time will tell but I still do not see us playing better football, the results have improved because the tactics have changed and we have got good players in our squad but I still think there is so much more room for improvement in how we play as a team defensively and going forward.

My mind’s made up on Lennon now I realise he’s playing for a contract but he looks so settled alongside Coleman they play great together and we look dangerous going forward again since he came. He’s not the best technically but he makes up for that with his direct running and work rate for the team I’d buy him tommorrow!

Overall, a blinding performance and great run of form by the team. Happy days.

John Stones was magnificent today capping an imperious performance in defence with his first goal for the club. Lennon has been a very good addition with his pace providing a real threat when we break out of defence. The squad as a whole looks full of energy after a long, dark winter when we had injuries to key players and too many games.

The majority of the United fans observed the minute’s silence. Those who failed to do so were underneath the stand, no doubt arriving late and well lubricated.

I don’t disagree with you as I also think Osman and to a small effect Pienaar coming back has helped but if you look at our performances now compared to when we were playing Europa we look fresher and more focussed.

Barry for one has been much better and I think that is down to only having to play one game a week. I am sure the same can be said with many of our small squad.

In fairness to the Man Utd fans the noise was coming from beneath the stands and MANY of them in the ground were making efforts to shut them up. Those in the ground also joined in the spontaneous applause for Sir Phillip Carter, credit for that.

Regarding the game itself, a great 3 points, 3 good goals and many really good performances.

The reason we profited was that we do not face many teams who attack us full on, far too many sit back and hope for something on the break.

Taking nothing away from anyone in blue today, I’m bloody delighted!

Congrats, Martinez, and young Stones.

I had a look at the deluded Manc forums before the game. Talk of how great they are and how they are going to thump us. Now all of a sudden, they think they’ve been found out, are crap without Fellaini, and need 7 more players.

And no wonder Sourness and Carragher looked sick. It wasn’t that the same Manchester United side that played their side off the pitch at the hellhole only a few short weeks ago... and they call us bitter!

We made that expensively assembled side looked like relegation candidates today.

Right, I’m off to celebrate. Come on you blues.

The EL argument fell on it’s face before Christmas, when we were dull, slow, ponderous, toothless and not playing in the EL. I’ll take Martinez’s argument about mental fatigue, as even at the end of last season, some of them were showing the effects of having to pass to each other and think a bit for seven months.

We’ve improved because we’re using the direct option and the defence has been more settled. I also think Martinez has been stubborn and unable to get things across to the players this season. The players aren’t blameless here, but the buck stops with the manager. I’d love to know why the players are now putting in the graft they haven’t put in through the season.

So, all we need is a good pre-season and bringing in and out the right players this summer. Here’s hoping!

Very disappointed with Lukaku’s ability to hold up the ball and bring people into play but again his strength, speed and ability to shoot are always a threat.

I’d love us to grab Paddy McNair to play alongside Stones. I think they could be a class partnership for the future. Both able to dribble into space when teams force us to keep the ball with our CBs.

No more tippy tappy stuff, thank you, Roberto.... See what we are capable of if we play to our strengths!

Special shut out to Baines who was great today especially defensively & a thank you to my favorite whipping boy Mr USA – his save on Rooney & charge out on Shaw to stifle the cross were outstanding.

I think this is a glimpse of what next season can be if we can keep all our key players with us. Lukaku, McCarthy and Barkley reaching the prime of their footballing abilities, Jagielka and Stones probably the best CB pairing in the PL, Lennon and Mirallas with additional fire power. Osman, Pienaar, Barry and Baines will provide the wise heads to guide the youngsters ahead. If 1 or 2 more of our youngsters can break through and Martinez can pick out 3-4 good additions – a GK, a good backup CB, a creative midfielder and 1 striker, we could have a cracking season.

By the way, the fabled ’feller behind me’ of football folklore, is usually someone to be avoided, but the feller behind me is great. He rarely gets too worked up (never in that unhinged loon way) and seems a brilliant (sometimes almost psychic) reader of a game.

At one-nil, he says "We’ve got this today."

I pointed out it was probably too early to predict but he calmly said "Naar, these have already run out of ideas, they’re getting nowhere, as long as we don’t do nothing soft, we’ve got them." (As I’m one of those who only relaxes when we’re 5-0 up in injury time, I thought: ’Bollocks’).

Then at 2-0, about five minutes before our third, he says to me "We’ll get another one here, these are now pushing too many forward." I nodded and mumbled ’Um... yeah’, but I was thinking ’They’ll get one and make us all sweat until the final whistle (the traditional Everton way)'.

Couple of minutes later, 3-0.

I have to say, I was very impressed.

Up the Toffees!

We had 9 shots, 7 on target, 3 goals – now that’s a quality return.

Can't believe what I saw today, I can't wait for MotD where we won't be shown at the end for a change.

The noise and disrespect from the Utd. section with the silence for Sir Philip was disgusting and needs a mention in the media.

PHENOMENAL!!!!

One Man Utd fan from Derby shook my hand the other two who stayed said nothing then left quietly to join the other plastics at various pool locations no doubt. I had another half dozen beers though.

I love Egypt now I do. Laterzzzzz, Cheers TWebbers.

Can it be that Martinez has relaxed his view that possession is everything and that his players have proved to him that you need to defend as well as attack?

I reckon Bainesy had even been practicing corners!

The defence was very disciplined and for all the Mancs' so-called talent, they huffed and puffed to little effect. Barry again played very well, entirely due to him that Fellaini was taken off at half-time... Will the real Gareth Barry please stand up as I’m not sure which is the real one: one that has played awfully for most of the season; or the one who has improved immeasurably over the last few games and looked at ease against some top players again today.

Seamus and Bainsey looked good again mainly due to having wide players to play off again. And fair play to Martinez too as, in the first half, he was pulling Lennon out wider instead of insisting they come inside, giving Seamus more support.

The only negative which I wasn’t going to mention, but other posts suggesting that Barkley played well has forced my hand. He didn’t have a good game, he was for large portions a passenger yet again. On several occasions, especially in the second half when we were on the break, he either kept the ball and went for glory when yet again other players were better placed for a simple pass that he didn’t see, or he played either the wrong pass or mishit a pass straight to a United player. This notion that Barkley is a great passer, that he has great vision is total rubbish. He rarely sees the obvious pass and when you watch him closely, he gets the ball from deep and just runs until he is invariably stopped by the opposition.

Ironically the stunner he got against Newcastle last season is probably holding him back in the long term as it appears to me that he thinks he can do it again and again but blatantly can’t. I actually like Barkley and would rather he stays but he does need to wise up if he wants to play in a central midfield role. He often gets caught out in no-man's land, just drifting when he should be picking up the opposition;for some reason he shies away from making any attempt at a tackle.

My preferred role for him would be just off the striker where he can shoot on sight without trying to be the playmaker that he definitely isn’t. He certainly has the ability, look at the Man City goal at GP last season, letting instinct take over. Where he is being played at the moment he costs us goal chances due to his lack of vision and limited passing ability which may or may not be down to shattered confidence this season. I hope he comes back next season with a clean slate, uncluttered mind, fresh and raring to go because there’s no doubt that a fully firing Barkley is an asset to us; however, he certainly isn’t that at the moment.

Anyway, as I say, great result overall. I said before the game that I would like a performance to give us some hope going into the close season and the boys certainly gave us that. They made quality opposition look very ordinary and to be fair the scoreline I think ultimately reflected the game.

Eugene – always enjoy your posts, brilliant, mate, keep ’em coming.

From a position of not having seen more than the excellent reports, there are several points which seem to stand out.

First, last year we were fortunate to win quite a few games which could have gone either way and a draw would have been a fair result. This year we’ve lost quite a few where a draw would have been fair. By contrast, Manchester United have been pretty much the opposite, grinding out fortunate wins when a loss could have quite easily been the result. So the teams today were probably much more equal than table positions might indicate.

Second, the Everton defence is back to its best. With Stones, Jagielka, Baines and Coleman back on form and working well together, and Howard showing a bit more confidence, the midfield doesn’t think it has to be a supplement to the back four and get everything confused.

Third, it would appear that the myth of possession has been comprehensively debunked. It would appear that a few years ago the best teams (Barcelona for example) had high possession rates and success. However, this does not appear to be a causal relationship, and defences and teams became better at nullifying the effect of this by packing the last third of the pitch. The fast counter attack was deployed extremely effectively - notably by Rogers across the park, and Liverpool scored a ridiculous number of goals by very effective use of defence-into-attack tactics.

The reason possession doesn’t work (for now) is that the slow moving attacking side with loads of possession (ie Everton in the first half of the season) are faced with 11 players, well drilled in nullifying attacks. The attackers will also have 6-8 players in the opposition half. However, a fast breakaway may leave just 2 or 3 players facing 2 or 3 fast attackers and running backwards or trying to watch opposition attackers is always slower than trying to keep up. This was how we were stuffed against the RS last year.

Richard Feynmann talked of Cargo Cult science, which looks like real science (you know, serious blokes in white coats and glasses held together with Sellotape), but which only resembles real science in terms of its appearance, and crucially lacks the intellectual approach which critically regards all results with scepticism and does its best to make sure the factors under consideration really are the ones than matter.

It is possible that Martinez has had a revelation that possession, in the state of today’s Premiership is something you actually do not want much of, because it leaves your team strung out and vulnerable to a Sturridge / Sterling / Suarez style assault.

Matt Ridley wrote a book in the 90s about evolution called ’The Red Queen’, which is about (amongst other things) the fact that even to stay competitive in nature, you have to evolve strategies and tactics at least as fast as your enemies.

Well, football, with all its money and the benefits of success, is a game where advances in fitness, changes in rules, and the manner of behaviour of your competitors need to be constantly monitored and your own approach modified to meet these changes.

Don’t agree with those who blame the EL. We had a disgraceful preseason and a number of injuries mostly because the players weren’t fit. We also replaced Delafeu with McGeady, Osman, Naismith, Eto or Barkley.

Our problems all season have been a lack of fitness, unbalanced team selection and poor tactics.

Now the players have had their "clear the air" conversation on tactics and Aaron Lennon has come in and added an extra dimension we are looking a different proposition.

The players are motivated, the team is relatively balanced (still need a left winger and creative MF player) and the defence is looking solid again instead of pitty patty (aka tikka takka) along the back 4.

I know we shouldn’t get carried but for the first time this season I feel positive about the team.

Man of the match? The referee, for allowing a proper English game to take place. What a tackle that was by Shaw on Barkley.

It was looking dodgy early, especially when Valencia was not being picked up by Osman but luckily they didn’t manage to capitalize on that particular weakness; it’s a situation that RM needs to address for next season without doubt.

The difference between Lukaku and Kone is so apparent and Lennon should be signed up as soon as possible.

One great win against Man Utd does not make up for the utter fuck-up the season has been. If we had played like this all season, which obviously we can, then we’d be sitting pretty in 3rd or 4th right now.

COYB!!!

1. This is nice payback for the shabby loss at Old Trafford earlier in the season, when United were all at sea and low on confidence; that one was a result that flattered them.

2. Martinez may have just redeemed himself with this turnaround. Which of course begs the question, why did it take us to be facing relegation before he changed tack? Hopefully he will view this season retrospectively as a near shave and not be so sloppy in pre-season again.

I feared the worst but the team delivered the best. Much been said but, if I were to pick out what the team did best, it was: they remained disciplined; they never stopped working; and showed determination to win the ball back in the right areas.

Osman not at his best otherwise no weak links. Barkley disciplined but not at his creative best. Overall great performances everywhere.

Hope it’s not a temporary feeling but right now I'm so glad I renewed my season ticket yesterday. Tonight I feel a warm glow and know I must enjoy the moment and accept that I should not worry right now about the future.

This performance confirms Martinez will be thankfully be our manager next season.

This was a game most of us couldn’t quite predict because we were facing an in form United if you read the form guides.

On a slightly negative point, why has it taken so long for a performance like this to surface! A lot of people saying that Martinez has been redeemed over the recent good form but I disagree.

I feel Martinez has had some backlash from the players during and after our piss poor season and his shite tactics. I reckon that this recent run of form has been driven by the players to change our approach, particularly in defence.

Whilst McCarthy was judged MotM, what a performance yet again by Jagielka and of course Stones. I thought our 3rd goal shouldn’t have been allowed as saying Lukaku wasn’t interfering with play was nonsense. I pick Lukaku out for special praise as alone he bullied the United central defenders mercilessly and I’ll also give praise to Lennon and desperately hope that we can buy him in the summer window.

An incredible win that must be flummoxing United. I’m glad to see Fellaini playing so well too, he’s United’s best player and if you stop him United have far less power and creativity. I have a soft spot for him and he is the ultimate modern footballer.

Possibly the most amazing game and result that I’ve seen in over 50 years of watching Everton and how soccer has changed in that time, by far for the worst unfortunately.

I may be going gaga but watched both games on Sky and found Jamie Carragher’s input both knowlegeable and humorous as much as Souness’s was the opposite.

Other than that, a superb performance all around.

Great performance from 1-11 plus KM and a special mention to Roberto for getting the tactics spot on. Need to keep this going until the end of the season to convince Stones, Mirallas, Lukaku, Coleman, McCarthy that there is a positive future here for them. It could also help persuade players to join.

Important pre-season ahead!

I believe in Roberto and Ross. I do fucking hate anything to do with Disney. Big time.

You're more changeable than the bleeding weather, learn to take the rough with smooth for a change, it's always famine or feast on here. Try having some patience.

The Europa League undoubtedly affected our Premier League form, it doesn’t take a genius to have realised that, ask all the teams of our standing that have played in Europe.

I have a feeling that our greatest legend may end up being Phil Jagielka, what a magnificent player from being a second rate midfielder at Sheffield United. I heard the Sky team rightly praising John Terry but everything they said applied equally to PJ.

Still not convinced by the fella, we will see early next season what he’s made of and I’m convinced we are in for another bipolar season.

Chuffed with today’s result though, thought Barry was immense along with McCarthy.

Marrin (#100). You’re dead right about Jamie Carragher – always pretty decent and honest towards us (as is Steve MacManaman – both former Evertonians of course). Souness is a sour shit who, I think, hates Everton more than he hates Man Utd. He’s incapable of giving an objective view because all his opinions are tainted by a fierce dislike of us and the truth is he’s probably not fit to be a pundit because his pettiness on a range if issues forever shows through.

Peter (#103). That’s pretty funny. I’m not sure everyone appreciates it. Having said that, I though Eugene’s post was quite amusing. He seems to have mellowed of late as our win ratio if, not quite our performances have improved – but then again, it’s probable that we all have.

Eugene’s post was, indeed, amusing, it tickled me, his posts usually do, and he is a true Blue.

The tactics were spot on and shows that Martinez is not a one-trick pony. It looks like Martinez was watching the United - Chelsea game the other week and took a leaf out of Chelsea’s book, as we let United have the ball but we always looked strong defensively.

You are spot on about Leon. I’m a bit of a bore when it comes to his worth and have had numerous arguments on here about him.

But the stats are startling. He has started 11 games (I have excluded Swansea where he came off after 10 minutes but included Arsenal where he came on very early, it makes no difference actually.)

P 11 W8 D2 L1

I don’t think it's a coincidence.

2. It has to be Lennon AND Mirallas for next season.

3. Hats off to LVG "...when you lose fair and square, that’s just part of life..." or something similar!

Everton’s course of action over the summer is crystal clear to me now. Thirty or forty pre-season matches and we should win the league. It obviously takes us that long to get going, and once we do... unstoppable!!!

Howard looked to have a bit of a knock. Any word?

Fortunately, we have several pacey players who are capable of running at players at some speed with the ball, notably, Lennon, Coleman, Barkley and Mirallas, all of whom did excellent jobs on the counter attack today and caused United headaches. What was most impressive about our counters today was the accuracy of the passing at speed and the numbers that we managed to get forward. In fact we had several other promising counters besides the goals that were broken up by the tenacious United midfield.

I don’t want to take away anything from a great result and a battling performance, but really all three goals came against the run of play. For the first, Jimmy Mac (who had a great game along with Barry) was fortunate with the bounce of the ball. For the third, the United defense stood still because Lukaku was in an offside position, obviously a bad mistake by them. Stones’s header from the corner was outstanding. It’s easy to get carried away because it was a fabulous result against a very strong United team, but I am still unconvinced about Martinez, despite the string of excellent results.

I have to say though that his team selection today was excellent as were his substitutions. They actually made sense. In fact considering the pace of Valencia down the right, it may have been better to start Mirallas wide instead of Ossie. Ossie is better centrally, but probably not at the expense of Barkley today, as his strong running through the middle caused problems.

Where to begin with your very reactionary post..?

Was everyone calling RM the worst manager in the world, and is everyone now thinking he is the bees knees again because of this very welcome – and long over due – winning run? The answer is ’no’ and ’no.’

For the overwelming majority of the season it has been rough and famine, not smooth and feast. The concerns of many for three-quarters of the season were justified and legitimate. Many have expressed relief in recent weeks that finally, a different and more pragmatic approach and tactics have yielded much needed points and a gradual rise up the table closer to where we should be in the league.

If, as you state, it doesn’t take a genius to realise the Europa League "undoubtedly affected our Premier League form," perhaps you can explain how for 3 months and 16 games between the end of November and the start of February – with no EL distraction – our form read P 16 W 2 D 5 L 9, including a 1st round exit from the FA Cup?

I’m extremely happy with the upturn in form. Equally, I can understand if some still harbour doubts about RM’s capacity as manager of EFC.

We’ve been piss-poor all season and only started to put a run together when it’s far too late.

We were 50-50 in the last SIX games after trouncing the Arse.

A Sunderland W 1-0
H Palace L 2-3 (RM trying to be too cute and sending out an unbalanced side - a tactic he repeated in the same fixture this season which resulted in the same scoreline)
H Manure W 2-0
A S’ton L 0-2 2 poor own goals
H Man City L 2-3 to champions elect
A Hull W 2-0

Far from ’piss poor,’ considering up to the Arse game we won 6 games on the bounce.

As said above, one swallow does not a summer make and it's far too late in the season to make a difference. Some people go on about a ’top-half finish’; however, whether we finish 9th or 12th is pretty much irrelevant.

Still, 3-0 against Man Utd is always great result and a big confidence boost for the players (we still need a squad overhaul in the summer though).

One thing’s guaranteed, we certainly won’t be having a change of manager in the summer now...

The first bit of genuine hope for a while.

I’m glad Stones got a goal – he has to get a lot of credit, his return coincided with an improving defence.

P 12 W 9 D 0 L 3 F 24 A 12 Pts 27

To put it into context, just 1 point less than we had 6 short games ago this season when we had 28 points from 28 games.

Nothing ’relative’ about it.

I’m not sure you understood my original post Jay.

John Stones on the pitch.

First time in Europe for a hell of a lot of our players taking a toll.

Excellent result. Excellent game.

Sign Lennon and keep Mirallas then we just might be back to the form of last season next season.

Today was more like it!

I have uttered my concerns on here quite recently about RM sucking the life out of me as an Evertonian, today he gave me a bit of belief back. I would eat humble pie all day long if he turns out to be a great manager for our club.

I've come to the conclusion that Everton mince your head as much as women! Trying to gauge what will happen next is the norm as an Evertonian & always has been! Same can be said for the opposite sex, the two are impossible to fathom out! Anyway a great result against a team whose bench was possibly the same value as our whole club.

Shame on the Man Utd fans for not respecting the minutes silence as we did at OT a few years back for the Munich air disaster anniversary.

I understood your original post perfectly. I also understand you are attempting to shift your position without admiting you got it factually wrong.

Your original post categorically stated we were piss poor in the EIGHT OR SO games (implying even more than 8 games) as an attempted counter to Ross’s claim about Wigan’s late season form under RM.

I have not invented the results. 27 points from a possible 36 is not piss poor, relative or otherwise. It is title-challenging form.

Referring to your recall of TW posts from that time has absolutely zero significance to your erroneous original post. If anything, you should be thanking me for exposing the mistaken belief that the assumed (by some) ’melt down’ of Everton under RM started well before the end of last season. It clearly didn’t.

And please, try and refrain from casting yourself in the role of the persecuted victim whilst engaging in ad hominem attacks against other posters who are simply challenging your opinion, not attacking you as a person.

Looking forward to seeing us progress!

I concur with some of the posts here, that the bigger issue is not that we got to move away from the possession game, but the ability to go to a Plan B when we need to.

That though, goes beyond a counter-attacking game. When teams park the bus and wait for us to attack them, that’s when the team play starts to slow down, because of the need to unpick the defence. Problem comes when we lack the guile to do so, and then it seems that the passing gets nowhere.

The other common approach is to keep putting balls into the box, go direct, play percentage football, wait for the knock off, which I am not sure how successful that will be. Not sure how that can happen with the current crop of players.

Still, that’s for another day, and what a win!

If playing in Europe is the scapegoat, then I guess our aspiration is to finish around 7th each season!

The performances this season have not been anywhere near good enough... even if we win the remainder of our games.

The club has to find a way to keep a minimum standard and always look to be competing for every honour going.

The board we have at the moment is just not up to the minimum standards this great club deserves.

Is it too much to ask for more of what we saw today?

My only question was once Everton went up 3-0 why didn’t Garbutt and Besic get subbed in instead of same old Kone and Naismith? I would have subbed Besic for McCarthy and Garbutt for Baines to give them playing time. Why not sub Besic for Barry? Because I wouldn’t want Besic and Garbutt together as two subs trying to find their rhythm versus Man Utd’s strikers and Di MAria so would have left Barry between them.

It's a big if, but if we can keep hold of our players, sign Lennon and a few others, offload Alcaraz, Distin, McGeady, Martinez abandon tippy tappy and instead hit teams with pace, next season could be a very interesting one.

Great result, and it’s put some pride back into us. Full credit to all the players. Think I’ll watch it on MotD over & over again.

Just a pity RM didn’t adopt similar tactics at the start of the season. Let’s hope this is a change in philosophy. He still has a lot of work to do over the summer though. Here’s hoping for a good campaign next season. In the meantime, we are now 10th; let's see if we get 8th. COYB

Without going all Columbo... ’Just one more thing’.

You are spot on if you want to be pedantic and be a ’stato man’ by going out of your way to look up the number of games to correct so...

I think most people would read the ’poor run-in’ of games from last season as meaning post-Gunners, from going on a 6-7 game run of wins, we then go to losing 3 in 6 against inferior opposition bar the exception of Man City. I think most would be in agreement that 50/50 in the remaining games is relatively piss-poor when you’ve gone from title winning run.

I’ll happily concede that I made an error by saying 8 games rather than 6, but I don’t always research my points with statistics before I post, nor look something up just to correct someone.. Please don’t say you have the ability to pull such small details from the top of your head, Jay. If so, you must get in touch with your long lost brother and go counting cards in Las Vegas.

Maybe we / I, well some of us, were a bit harsh and presumptive on Martinez, but until this time next season and these sort of performances and results are more the norm than the exception, I for one won’t be waving 5-year contract extensions under his nose.

The fact remains we were under no pressure or outside expectation to get much from the over hyped, pale shadow of a none SAF aura of invincibility United team.

All we did – it still took a bit of doing mind, so fair play to them though as I said before – All we did was prove the old saying that ’A star team will beat a team of stars.’

Mr Martinez: That performance is the bare minimum, the baseline from which ALL Everton teams should function, not the one highlight of a piss-poor season.

You’ve bought yourself time, nothing else... What you do with that time will show whether or you deserve my mythical 5-year contract extension.

I guess we had pretty much the same team this season as compared to the last one (sans Deulofeu and plus the likes of Besic, Atsu and now Lennon). This unit has played together for quite sometime and have formed a cohesive unit. It is time to reap the benefits of the all months of playing together and sharing tough moments. Even an average team if it plays together for a long time is capable of doing wonders. This team has proved it that they can do it last season and can do it next season as well without the trauma of Europa League.

For me retain the same squad. Just add a natural and in-form centre-back to compensate the exits of Distin and Alcaraz.

During the day the thought keeps coming that this team was capable of so much more. There has been so much missing this year but a bit of application and effort would have made a massive difference.

Scored against the run of play well that’s kind of what happens when the manager sets up the team to play counter-attacking football!

So again, you resent my simple ability to do what any one is capable of: do my research to support my opinion.

You by contrast persist in being selective in your data and recall of our results last season in an attempt to undermine another poster’s opinion, then resent being corrected, accuse me of being pedantic and imply I’m autistic.

Your agreement not to engage in ad hominem insults was short lived, wasn’t it Gavin?

There’s no selected facts, Jay. The point is about 90% of folk on TW, would know the point referred to post-Arsenal form - 6 games.. 8 games WTF?! The point still stands. Jay you try to appear as some intellectual heavyweight by using flowery language to appear clever. Why do you feel the need to do this? What’s really going on for you?

It was indeed 6 games rather than 8. I said 8 games as round figure to Ross, because it was to counter his claim that Martinez does well in his last 8 game run-in for Wigan. Maybe you could look that statistic up, as your interests and use of time show signs of you being high up on the autistic spectrum.

Maybe you should.

Sorry but you appear to be castigating Jay for having done his homework rather than using your ’method’ (’the fact-free what suits my argument' method).

I don’t believe that the majority of people post on TW to get into these type of exchanges. but some people seem to thrive on them. and feel the need to feel superior to others with the use of high-falluting language. Of course people, are going to have different viewpoints but I don’t think being pompous isn’t a requisite requirement.

I received a text from a friend who supports Chelsea saying it was a shame Everton hadn’t played like that all season. I replied if sitting back and letting the opposition have the majority of possession and do nothing with it, and win 3-0, then perhaps that’s the way to go.

If you go back to post 121 there is a good post putting yesterday’s win into a little more perspective, although I would like to think it was more Martinez’s tactics sitting back and counter-attacking that worked than us being forced to play like that by Man Utd. Perhaps a bit of both.

Also glad Ossie played from the start. Not sure if Mirallas would have offered the same protection.

Here ’s a question: How many if us would honestly say they wouldn’t mind seeing Everton play in the same way more regularly if it meant winning, perhaps against the better teams? Easier said than done.

Personally, I would prefer to see a little more creative stuff and us take the game to the opposition and play them off the park but needs must. We are what we are and where we are at the moment. But winning breeds confidence.

Going back to last year. Out of all the games against the top teams, I can only remember us really getting stuffed at Anfield.

At the end of this season this will be Martinez 2nd highest finish ever in the PL.

I’m not at all convinced...

Read our posts in this thread again. Only one of us is being personally abusive to the other. And it ain’t me.

I have not used flowery language to appear clever or an intellectual heavyweight. I have not invented the data.

You, by contrast, display disdain and resentment at my legitimate posts and resort to personal abuse in a Vicky Pollard-like "yeah but, no but" buttery in an attempt to support your position by again inventing imaginary data.

Let’s play the game your way. Let’s take 4 games in isolation towards the end of last season when we P 4 W 1 D 0 L 3. Pretty ’piss poor’ form, you might concede.

Or maybe "90% of folk on TW" would think it fairer and more just to view those 4 games within our final 12 games of last season - nearly a third of the season - which yielded the following: P 12 W 9 D 0 L 3 - title challenging form as I said previously.

Now contrast that to our form over 3 months in winter between EL games which reads P 16 W 2 D 5 L 9. That is ’piss poor’ form in any one’s book, yet last week you were seemingly excusing that and absurdly attributing it to ’the distraction of the EL’ when we weren’t even playing any games in the EL.

Go figure...

Try engaging in debate in a civil, balanced way Gavin, rather than consistently offering straw men arguments and ad hominem insults, simply because someone has the ’audacity’ to offer a well-presented counter opinion to your own.

I know some critics say that Mirallas is too inconsistent but his goalscoring record is only bettered by Lukaku and I think if it was judged on minutes per goal he would be our top performer. There should be no thoughts of him leaving the club.

I think United pushing on really helped us yesterday and our ability to hit on the break played into our hands. The problem we have is playing teams that sit back like we did yesterday. I thought considering neither Barkley or Lukaku shone it was an excellent result.

I was disappointed with the attitude of Lukaku when Mirallas scored, he should be the last person to complain about someone being selfish in front of goal. He should also remember it's a team game and it doesn't matter who scores.

"Maybe just maybe Martinez is the man for Everton?" (#32) – you have to be joking! With our squad, we could have achieved so much more without Martinez, both in the league and the Europa. Even if we win the next 4 games, I still want this man booted out of our club.

Earlier on we had the obviously intellectual Charles #81 lecturing on the thoughts of Richard Feynmann, Nobel Prize winning theoretical physicist. There are probably equations for this kind of reactive behaviour. In fact, there will be fans out there who are studying the curved geometry of the Baines corner and the subsequent trajectory and velocity of the Stones header.

Heaven help us if Jay and Gavin are into Mathematics.

"...some people feel the need to feel superior to others with the use of high-falluting language. Of course people are going to have different viewpoints but I don't think being pompous isn't a requisite requirement."

Show me a single example in our exchanges that demonstrates that. And while you’re at it, study closely the manner and language you use to address me, both directly and indirectly.

I have done nothing more than post my opinion with supporting data, in plain language. Your resentment seems to be borne out of the fact that you have been unable to effectively counter my opinion and so resort to personal abuse and attributing to me characteristics I have not displayed.

As I’ve repeated more than once Gavin, debate the differing opinions rather than resort to personal abuse as you consistently have with me.

There were no ’straw men arguments’ – anybody who presents stats too you is then accused of choosing selective facts.

It was my mistake to say 8 games, I was comparing the 6 games prior to Arsenal to the 6 games after, and I think 50/50 is less impressive and relatively poor to 100%. So there you go.. Thanks for looking up those stats for me! Just don’t tell me what my argument is because it is a common argument on TW that form dropped post-Arsenal and you provided the stats to prove this, Jay.

"anybody who presents stats to you is then accused of choosing selective facts."

Show me where I do this Gavin.

However ... RM remains a doctrinaire and incoherent (his words and actions do not make a cogent whole) ideologue. He has a lot of good sides to him – especially when things are going in his favour.

An imaginative, ambitious and intelligent chairman would take this opportunity (while our stock is quite high in terms of the playing staff we have) to remove the manager and find a high-profile replacement of high quality and solidity (eg, Klinsmann). Kenwright doesn’t even come close, of course.

On another note: Osman is useless, not a winner and should be retired now. I know almost everyone on ToffeeWeb loves this lightweight, ball-losing player. He has no place in the squad (like Alcaraz, Koné and the terminally ineffective McGeady). We must move on while TV money and our present squad allows.

I really hope we can keep Rom and Kev. For all their shortcomings, they are two of our best and most exciting players. Rom is going to be world-class; he sort of already is.

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And I guess that’s why successive managers have trusted him so much. He’s simply trustworthy. Good pro, takes on what he’s supposed to do. Yes, he lacks pace, strength and has the shooting power of that skinny guy in the Carry On films, but you always get what you expect of him.

McCarthy pushing forward is making a critical difference – he was the link between defence and attack. At the risk of howls of derision, he’s our Stevie G. Breaking up attacks and now surging forward.

Second, Barkley is being played in his best position – central and behind Lukaku. Yes, he made a couple of glaring errors... but the lad has undoubted talent.

Third, the Lennon - Coleman partnership is starting to tick – so I hope we sign him over the summer.

The Jagielka - Stones partnership is looking very good. The decision to have the less-than-speedy Barry man mark the less-than-speedy Fellaini in the first half really worked in Everton’s favor.

Now that there aren’t very many injury issues and there’s more time between games we’re seeing better results.

The back 4 with Coleman, Baines, Jag and Stones really is a solid unit when all are healthy. It makes a big difference.

Everton are now in the top half of the league in goals allowed. That’s pretty hard to believe if you think back to the early portion of the season when Everton were either last or close to dead last in goals allowed.

A few bright sparks have picked up on it on Twitter, saying only lads from Cavan could write on a Tricolour the wrong way around! To make matters worse, Adrian might already have sent a photo of four of us with the flag at the Dixie statue, into the local newspaper (as he likes to do). Besides, one of the lads is from Monaghan and the other is a QPR fan. So Shane, you are not alone, but you might want to distance yourself from the Cavan Toffees (Ivory Coast branch) muppets!

Fantastic day though. I asked Bobby Charlton for a photo before the game but he was a bit cranky, as his wife had walked on and left him. He got even crankier when Adrian couldn’t get his camera to work (there is a pattern emerging here). So no photo. And no points for Sir Bobby. I’d say he was even crankier then!

Instead of going out playing the exact same way, we actually changed tactics according to the opposition.

McCarthy is now fully fit and this allows Barry more time and space as James is running his nuts off covering the rest of the space.

Stones and Jags are a brilliant partnership and Stones still making silly little mistakes but is way ahead of the curve for his age.

After ripping up the "Secure Your Seat" sticker on my chair, I enjoyed the whole game and was happy at the end... the first time this season (I missed the Newcastle game) in the league.

There are no doubts that we have some good players in this team. Most exciting among them is John Stones and I truly hope we see him playing for Everton and England for the next decade. Unlikely in this day and age sadly.

With no European distraction, we have a clear run next season. We need Lennon, a centre-back to back up Stones and Jags, and another central playmaker option. It's no coincidence our counter attacking has been much more lethal with no Naismith who lacks pace and precision despite his other qualities.

Well done Everton, what more could we ask for out of a game? Special mention to the majority of Man Utd fans who did their best to try to shush their fellow fans below the stands, unfair to slate all Man Utd fans for the few below.

What on Earth are you talking about ?

"Change like the bleeding weather"? ... "Flavour of the month"?

Let me make something very clear to you. If I was in charge at Everton, I wouldn't have booked a taxi, I’d have booked a Bleeding Cannon and Your hero Robbie would long since have been fired out of it. His performance this year has been nothing short of disgraceful and a few wins strung together cannot change that.

I laughed at your suggestion that anyone who wants him gone has now been won over. They haven't. They still want him gone. I called him Robbie because – wait for it – that's his name ... get it? it was not a term of endearment... Perhaps you want everyone to call him Brendan or Jose?

The only changes that resemble the wind around here is that the happy clappers who disappeared when "Robbie" was making us the ugliest team in the Premier League have now reappeared as if he has redeemed himself. He hasn't. The faithful have had to wait until now before they have been entertained.

Most people have given Martinez some credit for Saturday, but that doesn't seem good enough for you. You whine when he gets no credit and you bleat when he does.

I don’t expect the doubters to become fans after a few decent results and you are all quite right in expecting him to prove his worth next season. No free rides for anyone is my motto.

You accuse others of being selective, but you're all over the shop.

Martinez / Robbie / Bobby / RM are all names that are frequently used when talking about our manager. I have used them all and will probably use them again.

What do you think people should say on the rare occasion when he has actually warranted praise? Well done, Gobshite?

You seem hell bent on spoiling one of the few celebratory threads we have had the opportunity to enjoy this season

"Flavour of the month"? In your dreams, fella. The guy has ruined our season.

If, by some miracle, he turns us around next season and we start producing quick passing, high tempo football that makes it worth the price of my season ticket, then I will be the first to hold my hands up (and it would be a pleasure for me to do so) and admit I was wrong. But, from what I’ve witnessed, unfortunately, I very much doubt it.

You never stop fucking banging on about how shit he is but unfortunately every single thing points to you being wrong. And here’s why.

He gives us experience and know-how, he moves the ball quickly and he will always produce something in a game that unlocks a defence. He will never be a physical player, he’s not built to be, but the stats this season speak for themselves.

Win percentage when he starts: 73% (8 from 11)
Win percentage when he doesn’t: 13% (3 from 23)

Has he won it!

Made me smile and warmed my little blue heart seeing that. Sod all the negativity lads... And just watch Duncan when the goals go in.

I would be extremely surprised if these present ’tactics’ are used regularly next season. He’ll revert to type now his skin’s been saved.

However, at the beginning of the following season, Wigan won just 3 of their first 10 games, losing 5 of them. Lessons learnt? On paper clearly not.

How can you be a grown man/woman and not handle that?

I can handle it, I just disagree violently with your continual slagging off of a true Evertonian. A player that came through the youth system, has only ever been a credit to our football club, represented his country, played over 400 times for us and actually despite your ill-informed bile has been a pretty decent player.

I don’t get supporters like you; of course you can think whatever you like if that’s what floats your boat. I’m just glad I have a more positive view of stuff and don’t feel the need to denigrate the players of the team I support. It takes all sorts, I suppose.

The result against the mega rich Man Utd was a superb performance all around in which every player shone.

You have a more positive opinion of Osman – and good luck to you. The other 'stuff' is mildly offensive ('violent' is your word for your own disagreement!), but vive la différence! I suggest you ignore my posts. I do yours (naturally) anyway, just because I have nothing to say. I'm happy to react to opinions counter to mine with equanimity – it isn't hard, mate.

Supporters like me? You don't know me from Adam.

By the way: I think Osman is really pretty useless – no more, no less – and has been for some time. Sure, he can play some good balls to the front players when he has time – but little else in my view.

I just think when it comes to certain players some people are just myopic (that one's for you Harold).

Please 'mildly offensive', joining the legions of people who these days see fit to be offended about anything. Violently disagreeing does not mean I disagree then seek to use violence, it's just emphasis.

I choose to reply to your posts because you are relentless in your criticism and I seek to defend the player. It's how Internet forums work.

Just for my own amusement I googled 'Paul Dark Osman ToffeeWeb'

Fuck me I'd have got less hits googling 'free porn'

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Sorry, but 'sings on YouTube' just brings this to mind for me:

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He's a big 'Barry' fan from the sound of it. Not sure what his view on Osman is like.