Blues poor in defeat on the south coast.

We should still have enough for these though, and what better way to bounce back than 3 points.

Let's hope we can return to form today and get a valuable 3 points.

I think this is a game he needs to play well in.

Barry can't be expected to perform at the top level every game at his age.

Again, too many players haven't bothered turning up. It shows the worrying lack of depth in the squad. I don't think Ross has a footballing brain either, that's worrying. Bolasie is having a shocker and intent on showing everyone how "tricky" he is. No service to Lukaku. Barry looks injured.

It's poor.

Managers, including Ronald Koeman, never learn. The more you win the more you want to win. Confidence is everything.

The bubble has burst, too bad. I still think this is a fitness issue as all the players look off the pace today.

Stamina is dropping, the pre-season was poorly planned, and we are still not 100 percent which is a huge concern given we are several games into the season.

So many poor performances throughout the team and some absolute stinkers!

Oviedo? Oh my!
Bolasie? Too much showboat, no product.
Lukaku? Was he playing?
Deulofeu? What a shocker!
Barkley has no football brain.

On the plus side, we have a walk in the park to come at the Etihad. Cricket score anyone? What a shallow squad we have. It seems the nay sayers were right. Our league position was very, very false. If Koeman comes out with a weak press interview, excusing that pile of poo, I'll go mad! Did Martinez really leave?

Well done Bournemouth, you deserved your easy win today.

Barkley, Bolasie, Deulofeu all poor – shape them up or ship them ourt, Ron.

Barkley must need his head examining if he doesn't realize he's on borrowed time and then plays like that.

Bolasie... clueless.
Deulofeu... clueless.
Mirallas... did he play?
Shocking.

If we get beat by a good side after giving everything we can then okay, not happy but can understand it, but that today was totally unacceptable.

Lethargic, lacklustre, fucking LAME!!

RK comes across as a bit of a Moyes and wants to self promote his image as a quality manager, hence the strongman approach with Niasse after the Martinez style press conference after the defeat against Norwich reserves.

Manager and players need to raise their game after this performance.

Williams looked like a donkey, Bolasie is one trick pony with that drag/roll of the ball, Deloufeu can't pass, Barry aged overnight, Gana was awful, Barkley is never going to be any better than Joey Barton and Mirallas is a big-arsed buffoon.

If anybody needs any further evidence that the transfer window was not a success... then this is it.

Truly, fucking, awful.

I still wince every time somebody says we had an excellent transfer window... Bolaise £28m ?

If Lukaku hadn't missed such a sitter, I wouldn't have known he was playing

Shows exactly what resting and changing a winning team can do for you. Did they look invigorated? did they bollocks. Madness and nonsense resting players 6 games in having already had an international break. It's what I'd have expected from Martinez or Moyes.

Our season could well be formed from how we react to this defeat. We simply need to go again. I'd reckoned on a 4-0 win. How wrong was I!!! C'mon Mr Koeman, shake em up, please!

Mind you he isn't the only player to under-perform when the chips are down: Mirallas, Lukaku and Deulofeu from the old contingent and we can add Bolasie to the equation too, although at least he did provide a couple of balls into the box during the game.

If there was ever a war-chest, it's a pity we didn't spend any of it, as the best eleven have to be on form for a full 90 minutes to win football matches regularly and that is a very rare occurrence. We can blame the manager, the tactics, the subs etc, but the bottom line is we have nowhere near a Champions League challenging squad or team and right now. I'll settle for top ten.

Only during the last 25 minutes or so did we look capable of 'salvaging' a draw and like it or not, Bournemouth is a place we should be looking to take 3 points from, if we want to be considered the real deal.

Of course the save from their keeper altered the dynamic of the match, but truthfully, we were a well beaten side and spent most of the afternoon chasing shadows and unnecessarily running the ball out play or picking the wrong option.

Another bad day at the office, I hope we can pick our collective heads up and that the manager can somehow make the most of what he has available until the window re-opens.

We had two very clear cut chances and at this level there is no excuse. The first 45 minutes should have been containment and counterattacking but we played like the home side.

We have so much pace in the side they just sat back had one shot on goal and shut up shop. Six games in and the wheels are falling off. Utter, utter crap.

I could go on for ever! Let's just hope this was a bad day at the office for all of our players because there isn't one player that can come away with any credit from that performance!

Tuesday was a very sloppy game and we have managed to bring that sloppiness into today. If we have any pretension about challenging the top clubs (which on this week's showing is debatable) then we have to.put the maximum effort into every game we play -- not just the ones we feel like.

We're just not good enough to pick and choose which games we can perform in and which we can coast through. It's why, apart from Stones, nobody came in for our players in the summer... the attitude is all wrong. Koeman has a hell of a job to rectify these problems.

Martinez has a lot to answer to also. I feel like we have been ridiculously assaulted by Martinez leaving his god awful slovenly legacy and us being forced to pay £10 million for the pleasure of that legacy too. And who says football is barmy!!!

They had 2 shots on target. One went in, one was deflected onto the bar. Stekelenburg had no chance with the goal again – a distinct lack of closing down going on.

As stated above Jags is the only one who "put a shift in".

Our flair players are suffering at the moment – how much did we pay for Bolasie? Talk about one-trick pony. What is it with that roll over thing – is it in his contract that he has to do it every time he got the ball? He makes McGeady look like Messi when he plays like that.

When Deulofeu came on, he was just as bad. Ross wasn't great again. Mirallas was quiet again. Lukaku just didn't get himself into the game after his headed chance.

Barry was apparently carrying an injury and it showed. Gana wasn't up to the high standard that he has set himself. The full backs both had stinkers too.

We could have sneaked a draw though Valencia putting wide from 5 yards, the one decent cross that Bolasie put in all match.

Some serious work to do – we appear to be a confidence team and that has been damaged by the Norwich defeat. Time for big Ron to earn his corn.

If we'd lost previous games and won today you would all be positive.

Bad week at the office, that's all!

My expectations have sunk dramatically this past week, if Norwich can knock us out the cup and Bournemouth plays us off the park, what's going to happen when we come up against the top teams? It's a frightening thought.

Also I'm finally coming to the sad realization that Barkley is nowhere near as good as we had hoped he would be, Deulofeu is fucking crap and Lukaku, I've promised no comment on him.

A very depressing week to be a blue when you come down to earth with a huge bang and realize we're not that good.

At least last season we managed to stay in both cups despite being shite in the league. The jury is still out on Koeman and his new players I have to say, where was the so-called backlash and response after that debacle at home to Norwich?

On an objective note, I thought Jordan Ibe gave Coleman the run around in the 1st half and Everton were 2nd to every loose ball. I'm not one for hyperbole but that was the most awful match I can remember watching for years, what on earth was that all about?

He should have only changed what had to be changed, Lukaku & Baines, both carrying knocks, leave the rest as is.. Hindsight, eh? Well, not really – more about experience and playing the percentage game. If we had still have lost both games, then fair enough, time for changing things around, but never in the middle of a winning streak.

Koeman has fucked up big time this week, his team selections and his shutting the door on Niasse, who he has now told the world is worth the root sum of fuck all!

Too many first team players are slackers; I would give them until January to pick up their ideas or ship them out.

Too much reliance on players who think that they have to try and beat a man instead of playing a first time ball. Space is not created and movement becomes slow and predictable. The biggest culprits are Barkley, Deulofeu, Mirallas and now Bolasie has joined in the fun.

Get Davies in the middle and we might improve.

Roll on January.

The performance today though was poor. My main worry is not about Koeman, who like all managers needs time, but the squad itself. Having being linked with all sorts in the summer we all felt, this is it, good times are coming. In the end though we were left disappointed.

Nothing against the lad Valencia, but really? A player who couldn't get a regular start at West Ham? Koeman has to work with these players until January now. I hesitate to use the term 'dead wood' but this is what today looked like, a lot of dead wood. Hoping for better under the lights at Goodison next week.

I hope you are spot-on, but I seriously doubt this is a just a blip in form, it's a mind-set which has permeated the club for so long, I can't even remember when it first set in.

If Lukaku, scores from his only opportunity, the game may well have turned out differently, however, we were outfought in most of the individual battles all over the pitch, we didn't show enough of the quality play to open them up and a draw would have been the most we could expect on today's performance.

We had a little luck at Sunderland and West Brom which gleaned six points, but today we didn't do enough to earn that luck and frankly, most of the games in the last 12 months or so have been like that, particularly away from Goodison. I'd be tempted to play with no wingers, put two players up top in the hope that we can be successful more often away from home.

It's true that it's still early days in the season but the manager has a job to do, which most of us realised from day one. Thankfully at least the points won so far keeps the pressure off for a little while, but we won't be worrying any of the Premier League 'elite' based on this week's evidence.

Early season wake-up call. Maybe it's a blessing as it gives Ronald plenty to work on, and we are still in the early days of his tenureship

The end product was sub par but that's because we have okay wingers – not brilliant ones. Okay wingers can be good on their day but their days are intermittent. Brilliant ones are usually good. Today was an off day for Mirallas, Bolasie and Deulofeu. But realistically these guys at best only average a good performance every four or five games. Koeman is not going to change that over night.

As for Barkley he reminds me of Jodi Morris. When Chelsea were shit, he was the promising youngster. Once they got really quality players, he was shipped off to the lower leagues having never fulfilled his potential.

So anyway, my point is that today wasn't great but it wasn't terrible considering the mediocre caliber of our players.

Hopefully McCarthy is on the bench next week as Cleverley cannot tackle. Hopefully a one-off, everyone so poor.

Worse than under Martinez? Get a grip!

Lukaku, one chance, keeper made a good save.

Mirallas, anonymous. Again.

Barkley anonymous. He'll be promising in five years time, somewhere else.

Deufelou. Fur coat no knickers. Again.

Bolasie. A few good crosses. A worrying lack of conviction.

Barry. Not fit. Shouldn't have played. Worrying decision from Koeman.

Full backs. Poor.

Gueye. Poor. I'll take one poor game in seven from anyone.

Cleverley. Nice young man. Ineffectual footballer.

Team. Lively for 10 minutes. Created one good chance that was well saved. From then on, out-pressed, out-fought, out-passed, out-thought.

We won't know until Christmas whether this is a typical or one-off performance. We strengthened the team in the transfer window. We missed that extra good striker and genuinely creative midfielder we need.

Chatting with someone in the week, I said I'd be interested to see how we respond to the inevitable setbacks. Next Friday's going to be interesting.

Deulofeu is hopeless on one-v-ones and too often does the hard work then messes up when it matters.

People talking of the title need to get real. Lennon, Oviedo, Cleverley, and Kone are not good.

I think 6 or 7 squad members need to be shipped out ASAP and I include Deulofeu and Mirallas in that 7. Not enough effort from the team today which was very disappointing. Well and truly back down to earth in 5 days.

Palace up this Friday. We need to vastly improve on today's half-hearted attempt at football if we are to beat a really good counter attacking team. We live in hope...

ps: I hope Koeman gave each and everyone of them today one almighty kick up the arse because that's what they deserve.

The truth of the matter is we lack real strength in depth. Koeman had plenty of time to assess the squad in the summer and must've known the likes of Oviedo, Barkley, Deulofeu, Lennon, Cleverley, Besic, Funes Mori, Gibson, Kone etc are just not up to it and we should have tried to ship at least 6 of them out. But no, hes persevered with Barkley, Deulofeu and to an extent Mirallas, and they've under-performed.

Why is Koeman still persisting with Barkley? Let's be fair, we would all love him to be the great he was meant to be... but it's not going to happen, is it? The lad is unaware of what's going on around him and his decision-making and passing are atrocious I've defended him to the hilt in the past but I just can't any more.

This result and performance today only proves to me why I never got carried away by the previous 5 games. Unless Koeman makes 3 major signings in January [unlikely ], then I'm afraid we ll be lucky to finish in the top 10.

Next up: Palace... 2 wins out of 2 and 7 goals in the process And a good recent record at the Old Lady. A tough game... and not one I'm looking forward to.

I think we all know that Koeman will need at least one more transfer window to put his stamp on this team. But a good start so far. I just hope the first five games, are typical of Koeman's Everton, and not this one.

And there we have it.

This can only mean poor team morale. Why?I think Koeman is after a 2- to 3-year quick fix (Good position in the Premier League, and a possible decent performance in the Europa League) and then away. Maybe this has seeped through to some of the key players.

Last season at this ground we scored 3 goals, we're easily the better team but fucked up defensively.

Is this some kind of grand expectation management scheme? Comes right out of some pretty poor comments about how we can't win the league. Also is Niasse really poorer than Valencia? Gosh, he must be missing a leg or something.

We bought good experienced Premier League players in the window and added some leadership qualities that were badly needed, which was an improvement too, but Merson was right in his comment that we have 12 or 13 good players and not much else.

We've got fitter and better organised and that is also an improvement. And probably we've gained points this season we may well have lost last season.

However, we still seem to start slowly and concede first goals and we have players who seem to have little appetite for a scrap. You need to contrast Ross's attitude with that of Delli Ali for example. And the decision making and sloppy loss of possession in the final third is still there, from the usual suspects.

We will probably see some performances and results like today a few times, until Koeman gets into people's heads a bit more and he drills the players in better habits.

I also hope we learned lessons from the last window and that Walsh is planning and setting up his targets for January, using the time that he didn't get the last time to deliver them efficiently and early.

It is an interesting time to be an Evertonian and I retain optimism but not blind optimism.

Our player of the season thus far is a toss up between veteran Gareth Barry and Idrissa Gueye (an under-the-radar bargain from a relegated club) who has, up to today, out-performed everyone in the squad so far by a mile! Both had poor games today, their first poor games of the season, in fairness.

But the remainder just don't seem to have any collective spirit? I don't know what it is, but the Norwich game and then this...? I think the blue tinted spectacles go back in the drawer tonight and we take a hard look at the reality.

I suppose the disappointment factor is compounded by the recent build-up of confidence, and perhaps the media were right by ignoring us as they understood we were in a completely false position.

Looking back, a struggle for the point against Spurs, in the first game of the season which really is a lottery, and Stek did save the day.

The game against West Brom was a come from behind effort. Credit for that.

The win against Stoke was not convincing.

The win against Sunderland was a 45-minute nightmare followed by a 45-minute wet dream.

The game against Middlesbrough was another come from behind effort followed by a 45 minute kick about. Noteably there was no killer instinct in the 2nd half.

The game against Norwich was embarrassing, and it wasn't even Norwich's first 11 by a long way.

Today's game was utter, utter shite. No fucking heart, passion, and no-one with the balls on the pitch to get into the face of anyone not performing. (Captain's role I think?) To be outplayed, not merely beaten, but outplayed and outfought by Bournemouth? It beggars belief. One thing I think we do miss is the in-your-face attitude of Funes Mori who wears his heart on his sleeve at time but you get the real impression he 'feels the passion' especially when we lose!

So where does that leave us? Slipping down the league with the tough games to come and only the FA Cup to think about and the mediocre caliber of our players to contemplate.

Today, there was no bite and urgency from Everton as players appeared to be enjoying the autumn sun. Although not enjoyable for Everton fans who had to withstand a frustrating afternoon.

Everton are light in midfield because Barry had to play when clearly not fit. Although I was disappointed not see Tom Davies not even amongst the substitutes.

Deulofeu will never be a winger, he goes down a blind alley and returns without the ball. Barkley was better than Everton fans give him credit, when those in front of him, Bolasie, Lukaku and Mirallas, were very poor today. Yet, Valencia did not offer much when he came on.

So a bad day at the seaside for blues young and old.

We should be beating the likes of Norwich and Bournemouth so it's not just a bad week at the office.

It's not Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal, or Klopp's crowd we have been up against.

If we are ever to move forward, we simply have to be beating these type of sides (with respect to them).

I predicted a draw today, I just didn't think we would win because I'm not convinced our points tally is truly reflective of the games we have played, and Bournemouth have been unlucky in a few games.

They wanted this more than us today, and when we meet teams like that, we are always found wanting. Why?

Well, I believe a big problem with Everton is we really have no true game changers nor leaders in the team or on the bench. In defence of the new manager, this is not his team and he can only play the players we currently have, but he will know this is a step up from his last club in terms of expectations. He didn't have any answers today or on Tuesday night.

Moshiri needs to put his hand in his pocket, and I hope he has deep pockets, for a lot of this current squad are not good enough to get us challenging for Champions League, in my opinion.

Coleman was the worst player on the pitch. Bolasie dreadful. Deulofeu beyond bad. And Barkley should not even make the squad, he's finished (I'm just waiting for people to tell me about his potential and that he's one of us... blah, blah).

Koeman, you cocked up,; have the balls to admit it.

And our owners, where is the striker? Valencia is a joke.

I suspect that Koeman doesn't fancy half-a-dozen of these players which he views under his long terms plans, sadly he's lumbered with players who aren't prepared to give there maximum and can only realistically change things next summer. The January window will be difficult to bring in and sell players.

Rebuild that midfield around Gana with a further two quality midfielders and some creativity in there. Barry to become a squad player and Cleverley and Barkley moved on.

And before anyone says 'complacency' or 'happy with the result', I'm not in any way. It was really poor, though we still created three clear cut chances to their two.

Just asking for some sense of proportion that's all. I'm sure that Koeman now knows the weaknesses and has a plan to correct them.

The one thing it does demonstrate is that the manager still has a lot of work on his hands if he's going to drag consistent results out of what largely remains Roberto Martinez's squad.

Those who believed he walked in like a more lethal John Wick, able to eliminate a shitload of problems in the blink of an eye and were already proclaiming him 'one of the best managers in the world', on the back of four wins, might be a bit taken aback, but surely everyone else must have known it wouldn't all be plain sailing and would require both time and patience?

We all witnessed how bad we were throughout most of last season, how many in this team allow their heads to drop too easily, how they can struggle to break down determined opposition who are prepared to dig in and fight.

We got off to a good start this time around, but that didn't mean the same problems weren't leftover, loitering under the surface, waiting to stick their head out at any given moment like that boggly eyed, green, trampy bastard from Sesame Street who lived in a bin.

At the moment, games and results like today, whilst hard to take, are going to be greatly instructive to a new manager still assessing the size of the task ahead. At least with Koeman you get the feeling it will all register and he will actually act on what he's seen, rather than simply letting things slide like the last guy.

Disregard today's result but what am I missing with Barkley? The lad has been hyped beyond belief. "Big Sam" has seen through the hype and gets castigated for not picking him for England. Game after game, he jogs round for a bit, absolutely no attempt to challenge or close down... And as for Deulofeu couple of passes a season and that's your lot.

Yes, have a go at the players but the manager(s) must share the blame for picking them, these players have been out of their depth for some time but, as I say, they don't pick themselves.

Bad performance, shit. Let's hope it's better next time, not 'lets announce that the negative opinion we held all along is now confirmed as true after all despite the four consecutive wins'. There's your shameful, risible, asinine bollocks.

I'm not encouraging silly signings, just ones that will make the difference to us.

Is right.

You have to wonder what goes on in these people's heads.

Nothing from front to back, nothing from those on the field and off.<;p>We are not entitled to win every game but we are entitled to expect 100% effort and commitment from players and management.

I am afraid what we got served up today was a long way short.

You act like they wiped the floor with us. It was 1-0, 53 percent possession to 47, 12 shots to 13, 5 corners to 3. Not much in it. Also, what relevance is there to Man City? We are not close to their level so it's a meaningless comparison.

Everton ratings

Martinez used stats to try and justify results – don't go down that route.

Cause the Echo is always accurate?

They were exceptionally generous with Lukaku and Cleverly.

Changing the manager wasn't going to miraculously make the team world beaters. However, letting the manager change the team will. Give him time to transform the payers he has to his system and expectations and to replace the ones he cannot use.

Give him time to correct the weaknesses we have after three years of a poor system. Closing down players, high pressing, helping back on defense, defending, passing and creating. These are the things he must change, and if he is the manager that many seem to think, he will change. It just won't happen overnight or likely for half a season or more.

Of course, I could just start chanting for Koeman to drop Ross as he is our Rooney and look what that change did for Man Utd today!

He also reckons that Bournemouth are a REALLY good team who will not fight relegation. I'd say he's wrong on both counts.

What line-up or subs would have made a difference?

The Man City reference is because we play them the game after next, that prospect worries me because they hammered an average side that beat us easily today.

I know you think we weren't that bad; I disagree. After the Norwich game, we should have had a positive reaction and at least seen them giving 100% effort – that didn't happen.

Ross tried, he never gave up, and out of camera shot you can see that he really loves playing for Everton, unlike Bolasie.

All-in-all, we had no midfield, it kept going out wide and the crosses either hit the first man or there was no-one in the box, Deulofeu, Mirallas, Coleman all shocking, struggling to find any positives today.

This is not the start of a decline again one would hope but, looking at the players, I agree with Tony (#34) that we need some young promising players on the bench at least. We play too many flair players who are inconsistent. Mirralas, Ross, Geri, Bolasie, Rom are all cast in that mould and it leaves us undermanned when faced with a team playing at high tempo – a worry with the RS looming in a few weeks!

Our bench is currently staffed with players who are not good enough. Cleverly, Lennon, Kone, Valencia, Gibson,Oviedo- all are as good as they are going to get and will not turn a game. Ok Ron sees the lads in training but surely Tom Davies, Dowell, Walsh could be given game time to see how they do- Tom certainly has looked ready when given a chance and surely it is better to give the lads a go rather than play Lennon, Cleverly etc who are not going to change the game when they come on.

Our blend in midfield is not right and Gueye for McCarthy is not enough to rectify it. Kev for me flatters to deceive, Geri seems unable to kick the ball cleanly and we are playing too many individuals who on their day are great to watch but are too likely to be harried by the opposition and will then disappear.

No crisis at this stage but Ron will have learned more about his squad this week than in the 10 weeks or so that he has been in post.

Time for him to show what he can really do!

Why were the Blues so poor from the off? Maybe Koeman has about as much charisma as Martinez? These are questions we need answering.

After the Boro game, we could be forgiven for thinking the corner was being turned. How wrong we were. Most of us will turn back to opinions about certain players and the manager's decisions but he has to act now and make changes. Barkley and Mirallas are just doing anything of note so move them to the bench!

Is it no surprise that the result at Bournemouth last season proved things were not right and didn't the same player (Stanislas) do them in? This is the time for Koeman to prove he has what it takes.

So who should've started instead of Barkley or come on for the unfit Barry? I get they were shit but what other options did we have that weren't used? Kone? Lennon? Davies who's is very young and has some good and some terrible performances?

Most Evertonians expect 100% effort every time a blue shirt is put on, even in a losing effort – in that department today, we were very, very bad.

As you're the second to mention them, am I missing something? I thought the derby wasn't until mid December?

As you appear to be a fan of empiricism Show me one shred of evidence (just one) that Evertonians are happy when we get beat in the terms you set out above.

Perhaps you'd be better served offering your opinion on the manner of the defeat, as you so graciously and eventually did - rather than throwing around half baked nonsense.

I'd say the 100 percent is unrealistic as, even when a team does well, there are typically one or two coasters.

This started somewhere in the middle of the 1990s and it's one of the reasons we have become known as a little club in some quarters.

Wasn't there a strong rumour in football circles that Bolassie was bought not only for his football but also because he is big buddies with Lukaku??

Dont believe me? Check this out: link

Is it so unrealistic to expect to win against these or at least come away with a draw? I hate these inter-era comparisons, but since others are already doing it, so let's see: we scored 3 times in that game last year and we showed fight even in extra time, and that team didn't have Gana, Bolasie, Stekelenburg or Williams (here's the report: link).

Today, we looked like we couldn't score even if we played for 3 hours. Man for man, our second string should be expected to beat these. Yet, they out-ran, out-fought and out-passed us. Their manager had his tactics right on the money. I really hope that I'm over-reacting and that this is a one-off.

Patrick (#129) I would gladly lose twice to them and finish Top 4. Our progress overall and performances week-in and week-out are more important than how we play against the RS but does the thought of another humiliation by them bother me? Yes, it does. Hopefully Ronald will sort us out a bit before we come up against them and the other "big teams".

I am sure he will have learned more about our players today and it is not possible to turn us around in the space of a couple of months – it will take a couple of years in my view to see signs of permanent change for the better.

Then today's performance with just Oviedo as the only change stunk the place out. His subs in both games made no difference at all which is a far cry from WBA and Sunderalnd, when his management and tactics turned both games.

Something is not right once more at Goodison. Is it ever thus? Thats twice in a row the players have appeared not to give a jot for the shirt / fans or their manager. Very worrying in my opinion. Just read Koeman got annoyed in his post match interview. Is he waking up to what its really like to be involved with EFC – bloody frustrating.

Not as a player or a manager, he has won trophies at the highest level of both.

The board have to prove they will back him and if they do the results will follow.

Anyone who thought we where top 4,5... where kidding themselves, a bit like those who think Barkley will be a "great" player.

Stabilise this season, and next season, the results should follow.

On the suggestion that we didn't see enough incoming transfers this summer, it's unrealistic in my opinion to introduce more than 4 or 5 players into a squad in a single transfer window.

The January window is notoriously difficult in attracting quality and value for money and I'm hoping that Walsh and his scouting team are actively planning for next summer's transfer activity.

In the meantime, we do have James McCarthy to come back soon; let's hope that talk of his demise by some posters on here was premature.

Dave (#139), The most worrying thing I saw today at the 'Vitality' stadium was when the cameras showed Mr Kenwright and Mr Esltone in the directors box in deep conversation, a new dawn indeed?

"We'd never lost to them" – wow, what a stat... considering we've almost always been top flight while they've been a second- or third-tier team. We don't have a divine right to beat a team just because we have in the past.

That's my point, though; you're saying he got the team wrong but have no explanation for how he could have got it right other than saying "someone with heart." So, on that basis, if we'd played you, we'd have been better?

Heart's great... but you could put out a team of pensioners with lots of love for Everton and they'd be shit.

It is galling that Martinez spunked £20m on Kone and Niasse and neither is of any use in this situation.

I would like to see Koeman blood some youngsters. Give Davies and Dowell a run in the team in place of Barry (if injured) and Barkley.

We didn't take any of our chances they scored a beauty. Barry should not have played and Baines was injured; distribution from defense suffered.

I was expecting to go the whole season without losing but there were no white flags today and we played right to the end at least and this against a tightly packed defense. As long as we compete in every game, we'll win a lot more than we lose, that's all we can ask for just now.

Dave Lynch @139

Koeman has nothing to prove – maybe not to you, but for me he has everything to prove with Everton and I hope he does.

And all things aren't equal, we've spent a lot of money and got a new manager to improve on last year.

6th-7th would be reasonable progress on last season and a good platform to build on.

If we play like we did today then we will be heading for 12th-15th so it's up to Koeman to work out where it went wrong and fix it.

Barkley is shite and if he wasn't a blue who came up through the ranks he would've been out the team a long time ago!

Bolasie is a bigger faster McGeady! Unpredictable inconsistent show pony! Shite!

Deulofeu is an impact sub who struggles to make an impact!

The sooner the transfer window opens and we can sign some proven attacking quality in the same vein as we have done with Williams and Gueye in the defensive mould, the better!

I reckon it's going to be really difficult period between now and Christmas and Koeman really needs to work hard on and to find the right style of play to win games!!

There's only Man City who look outstanding; the rest, including us, seem to be on a par from what I can see so far.

This sounds a bit stupid in my opinion – welcome to Everton, Koeman.

Goalkeepers. Okay but not top class.
Full-backs. Coleman one of our better players. Baines not the player he was.
Centre-backs. All decent and reliable enough.
Midfield. Gueye was a good buy. Barry, decent on his day but will need replacing soon. Bolasie, the jury's out. The rest are average and that includes Barkley. Creative player a priority.
Forwards. Lukaku our best player but blows hot and cold. The rest are not good enough.

As a squad, we are not a top 6 side, we have allegedly money to spend but our trouble is getting the real top players to come here. How you overcome that difficulty, I don't know.

What happened today and on Tuesday isn't what's expected from any Everton team, in transition or not. Not the results per se, but the abject performances.

Looking at the table after six games last season, this season, the teams in the top six have more points, so that means it will in all probability take a lot of victories to be in that position at the end of the season. Too many games like today's will result in another wasted season, although there may be a larger gap between the top ten and the bottom ten at the end of the campaign.

Bolasie, Oveido, Mirallas, Deulofeu, Valencia all not good enough at this level. Never consistent and just don't do enough. Ross has talent but his decision-making on the ball is too precise.

Koeman – interesting that he criticised the players when two of the worst performers were down to his purchases.

Where is Davies, truly baffling.

Like many Toffee's this afternoon I feel the disappointment of a poor 1-0 defeat to a team we all believe we should be beating and, judging by many pre-match posts, be beating handsomely but nothing is a gimme in this league as today proved.

I do feel that we are still a team very much in transition in playing style. Now this is where a few eyebrows will be raised and I've checked my life insurance and believe that I'm covered for what I'm about to say. I'm going to use that lot based at Castle Grey Skull across the park as the example.

Before Klopp arrived, they played the same style of football under Brenda (with the amazingly white teeth and orange tan), they passed it aimlessly around for no apparent gain. Klopp arrives and introduces the high pressing style and initially their results were mixed, performances from key players variable as they adapted, Europa League Final as the perfect example but, grudgingly over time they have improved.

We at Everton are on a similar journey, our results are going to be mixed, inconsistent and frustratingly so... but the early signs (apart from today) are promising. Last week we were over the moon and Europe bound, I believe we still are.

I think what I'm trying to say is, it takes time and a little patience from us the supporters as we adjust to the new demands. Rome wasn't built in day and neither will the new Everton. Koeman eluded to the fact that it will take two season's to mold the team he wants.

This coming transfer window is imperative that we get our act together and Steve Walsh starts to earn his corn but, at the same time not to the detriment of the youth that are coming through. Buy wisely and use the likes of Mason Holgate and Tom Davies who appears to be the nearest to the first team squad out of those who started against Norwich last May, to me this will be the true test of Koeman's coaching credentials.

With regards to the enigma that is Ross Barkley, I do believe that there is still a player there but now would be a good time to remove him from the firing line. I read the excellent Here We Go by Simon Hart and in it was a piece about how when Dave Watson first came, Waggy was out for a little bit and the advice given to him when sat in the stands was to watch how Everton defended and used the zonal system to pass players over when the opposition was on the attack.

I also read a piece on Idrissa Gana when he was starting out at Lille, he started out as No 10 but didn't quite cut it and studied Matar on how to play the central role and it seems to have worked for him. So maybe a similar approach is needed for Ross and some intensive coaching from Koeman at Finch Farm to unscramble the Bobby Brown Shoes philosophy and rebuild confidence and purpose in his play.

I also feel that this should be the chance to play Cleverley in the No 10 position, it's what is meant to be his preferred role so let's see how he goes, if he's as average, as we all suspect, then it's time to ship him out.

One last final thought, at least the muppets on the Sunday Supplement won't be touting Koeman for the Arsenal job this weekend!

I just watched Koeman's post-match interview, and he said we didn't press enough, but Bournemouth did. He's always been emphasising the need to press, and we have been doing, and doing it well. Apart from this week.

All I'm saying is, it's early days, we've got 13 points from 6 games, way better than many thought we'd have before the season started, and we don't look much different from the others, apart from Man City, who look fantastic.

It completely nullified us and other teams will take note. Koeman needs to find a way to counter it and pronto!

Just to keep you up to date.. our neighbours are playing fantastic football.

Their first half against chelsea was the best football I've seen from any team this season... City included.

Galling.

"We don't care what the red shite say"... Yer aul bollocks.

Koeman is very similar to Klopp, without all the dramatics of course. Koeman no doubt has to deal with politics at Everton, but same for Klopp at Liverpool. It's the same for every club. As I say, it's only Man City who look really outstanding so far.

The only DVD I have is 'off to a flyer'

Tom Davies must be given a run in the team at the expense of Ross Barkley who was shocking.

How can a professional footballer not be able to head a football?

He's said it'll take him two full seasons to get a squad and style he calls his own but, unlike his naff predecessor, he's won leagues and cups as manager.

Our start to the season perfectly reflects what he achieved in his first six league games at Southampton and they finished 7th that season, qualifying for the Europa League, despite the departure before he got there of several of the club's best players.

We've held on to our best players, who unlike Southampton's, never seemed to interest those clubs with Champions League aspirations, but in all probability some of even their days are numbered unless they get with what he requires, and soon.

I see departures from the dressing room way before Mr Moshiri abandons the manager he pulled his tripe out to get.

Maybe they all think there's better pay and prospects elsewhere for only the same or less effort. Or maybe they need to correct the obvious shortcomings all too apparent today by working harder at Finch Farm. It's the least they can do as professionals but when they've given their all it may just be that some of them are found out to be lacking in terms of what the new owner requires.

The question for all of them is do they have the courage or care to even try?

Barkley = crap. Bolasie = crap. Mirallas = crap. Lukaku = crap. As Koeman says, no aggression up top. Even doing their own jobs = crap.

Answer? Draught non-contracted players till January. Example: Klose and quick-feet Ossie instead of Rom and Ross.

Kevin @175: The RS came into the conversation because one or two posts thought that we weren't doing as well as the likes of them, Man Utd, Arsenal, etc., so the discussion was to put this into context. Not because we love the RS!

"Koeman has nothing to prove. Not as a player or a manager, he has won trophies at the highest level of both."

What has he won at Everton, Dave? Nothing. He made sure that will probably stay the same with his stupid line-up on Tuesday.

He has EVERYTHING to prove.

I predicted at the start of the season we'd finish 8th and have seen little either way to make me budge from that stance. Aside from the presumptive top six (Man City, Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Tottenham) – and keeping Leicester penciled in at 7th even though they've been pretty lousy – please name a single other club that appears poised to outperform us over a 38-match season.

And before anyone comments, no – I'm not content with finishing 8th. But I do think that would represent a realistic show of improvement after the past two seasons, and a validation of the club's direction under the new regime. So can we all please get a grip?

Meanwhile, a lot of this so-called squad analysis leaves a lot to be desired. You realize that if you demand Barkley and Mirallas be dropped, while literally slagging every realistic alternative in the same breath, you're not actually arguing for anything, you're just blowing a lot of useless hot air, right? And Bolasie has done nothing but impress since his arrival – one subpar performance and he's suddenly McGeady 2.0? Christ, put a cork in it. I'm honestly embarrassed to read some of this stuff.

Who, by the way, without Gueye, Williams, Bolasie and Stekelenburg, got a draw in the corresponding fixture – plus got to the semi of the League Cup we've also exited!

Why do you think you have all the answers and your predictions and analysis are spot on?

Barkley needs dropping; he offers absolutely nothing – just a younger more overrated version of Cleverley...

I'm a big fan of Mirallas but I'm struggling to defend him on recent performances. Sort it out.,

On Tuesday, the lack of quality beyond the best 12 or 13 was cruelly exposed. Other than the big loss of a resurgent Baines, that was pretty much our strongest team. Wasn't it?

I think all managers need time, but the reality is that Martinez being granted 18 months too much of it leaves Koeman under pressure even in Year 1. He's one of the highest paid managers in Europe. Being "new" shouldn't protect him from reasonable criticism.

I think he's had a really disappointing week but he's just finding out how much of a mess the club made of the last few days of that transfer window. It is beyond my understanding that on Tuesday's match discussion thread someone seriously described the window as "fantastic". Really? Bizarre is all I can say... just bizarre.

That draw away at Bournemouth was shite and failing in the semi's of any cup is not something I look back on fondly. If it turns out after three years that Koeman has done no better, I'll be saying so – unless I get red carded.

Williams and Oviedo looked as though they'd only just met, the number of times Callum Wilson drove into the channel or gulf between them and caused them so many problems.

I fear for Barkley as he moves flits from dynamic, effective to absolute dross; there is no middle ground. The bottom line is you can't have a Premier League future if you keep giving the ball away, particularly close to your own box. He can't tackle, he can't defensively position himself, he just doesn't give cover, and most glaringly takes too long to move the ball. Koeman has to take him off the frontline for his own sake as we are only a game away from the crowd destroying him completely.

The problem Koeman has is that there is little in reserve: Gibson, Besic are never available, Cleverley can't change a game, and I don't think Davies, Dowell, Walsh etc are ready.

Tough few weeks ahead as the team will either pick up and stabilise themselves as a 7-10th team or will implode and drop even further. God help us when we play Man City, Liverpool, and Arsenal, they are years ahead of us.

Too many players did things today that were not in their make up or so I thought. Williams got out muscled early on – not what you would expect. Gueye gave the ball away more times than he has all season – something I never thought he could do. Coleman took a roasting off Ibe who has been substituted by Howe for being ineffective.

Other players did what they usually do more often then not. Mirallas went missing. Bolasie arsed around to much. Barkley was naff Barkley, not good Barkley. I could go on but to end my view, the EFC I have seen today and last Tuesday was like chalk and cheese to whats gone before this season. WHY???

No 2, yes we were shit today, so shit in fact that I can't bring myself to watch the "highlights" on MotD. However, let's just remember we are still 5th in the league and before today's dross filled pile of horse crap not anybody on here was complaining about our team or our squad.

I don't believe the team has become rubbish in one week. I think today, for some reason, nobody was up for it. Why, I have no idea, but I know Koeman won't put up with it for long.

Let's not hit the panic button just yet after one league defeat. If we play as shit again against Palace then maybe we have cause for concern. Personally, I reckon Koeman will fire them up and Palace will be crushed by the mighty Blues. NSNO!!

Today he played for himself. Trying out his football freestyling instead of playing for the team. Rolling the ball under his foot or trying drag-backs instead of playing the way he was facing.

Kieran, I think the balance of chances says we were slightly unfortunate today, but we were still awful. Passing and movement was non-existent. Two wingers relaxing in Row A isn't what this formation should be about – and every time we got the ball there was no-one in a position to receive a pass.

Mind you, I've played in games were your mates won't pay the simple, early pass. Subconsciously it affects your movement. You stop making the opportunities that they keep passing up on. It felt like that today. They just stopped bothering.

As a result, no-one played well. There was no team within which someone could play well. Even Gueye struggled to get in the game without giving away free kicks (he was lucky to stay on as Bournemouth finally didn't dive and roll when he committed another foul). Both Gueye and Barry got sucked out wide covering for the team's deficiencies. I was glad to see Jags losing his shit at the players ahead of him.

Criticism will fall on Barkley, and it was frustrating how he got caught dozing in possession and allowed Arter to walk past him. But he also did far more than most today. I'll cope with players making mistakes far better than twats who are just here to fuck around at the expense of the team.

If needed, stick the likes of Davies, Dowell, Calvert, into the mix.

That's two games running now Deulofeu, Barkley & Bolasie have been really poor; I'm guessing all three will start or still be on the bench next Friday.

How Ross gets anywhere near the starting XI at the moment, is fucking pathetic. It's starting to reek of the same stuff of when Tim was in goal and shithouse Martinez wouldn't drop him.

I was against the Yannick signing, today showed why I was so against it. He has proved me wrong up until this morning so hopefully he isn't reverting to type.

RK started the season well, but the last two games show what he is in store for. The honeymoon period is well and truly over.

The last 2 games do not seem like the Koeman we know.

But jjust reading his post match comments. The most disturbing quote of all "I was very happy with what Tom Cleverley showed on Tuesday".

What. The. Fuck. Was. He. Watching!!!!!!

Regarding Koeman – don't start with the Martinez crap – you were not top form today and your after-game interview was not as honest as we expect at Everton!

I do not expect us to do much this season, hopefully top half and a re-build on last season, and Koeman realising where we have class, and where we have crap in abundance. The honeymoon is over, Ronald! Time for action!

The team has, overnight lost the self-belief that was growing until the Norwich game. Koeman broke the cardinal rule of football... never change a winning team.

Today's subs also saw a lack of imagination. Williams for once was having a poor game. Why didn't he sub him for Funes Mori who would also have given us a missing aerial threat at set-pieces? Ramiro also plays with his heart on his sleeve and would have injected some passion into the second half.

I'd have been tempted to leave Bolasie on and switched him to the other wing and brought Deulofeu on to play behind Tom who had a stinker to be honest, back to the old disinterested Romelu.

For the first time, Koeman was asked questions by Bournemouth for which he just didn't have the right answers. Let's hope he can repair the damage he has sadly brought on himself by Friday or the game with Palace could prove to be very damaging, not just for us, but for Koeman's fledgling reputation and standing with the fans, many of whom are rightly withholding judgement on our new team boss until he proves himself worthy of being Everton manager.

Fuck it.

I love the question though. To beat that slimey squirmy shite across the park or, qualify for the Champions League?

It's a no-brainer really.

Like most megalomaniacs I don't see what the argument is.

I'll take both please and that's every day of the foreseeable future,

If you don't mind

Mark Morrissey 38: 'Exactly what Frank Crewe has posted'.

Norwich had a good win today lads. Bit of a canter I heard. Three good goals.

Can I also add that the sheer garbage on here about Bolasie on the basis of one game, coz he did very nicely indeed thanks in the last couple of games – is well fucking ridiculous.

I concur on Cleverley. He's a water carrier and he did his job. Deulofeu, Mirallas, Lennon and Bolasie remind me of the miserable days when we thought Beagrie, Ian Wilson, Warzycha and Preki could adequately replace Sheedy and Steven.

Have I got a great memory? No, it's terrible, the reason I remember this successful side is because it hardly ever changed. I think we can all roll off the '80s side too, and how successful were they?

My point is, these players managed to play 50/60 games a season, on pitches that would cause a postponement today, yet they didn't want to be out of the side.

These tossers today, earning twenty times more and having 3 subs available, look like they don't want to be on the pitch sometimes. Koeman should have played a full strength side against Norwich, and if the Bournemouth result was the same, we could have forgiven them for a hiccup, but still been in with a chance of silverware.

The key word is momentum and changing the side because some of these young 'men' might scuff their multicoloured Nikes is a disgrace; they're paid a King's ransom to play their hearts out, but what I witnessed there was at least 4 players hoping someone else would do the work for them.

Many on here have slagged McCarthy for his hesitation to go forward, but to me, he's always been an essential part when things are going right for us: we have all these flair players reverting to type, but what we haven't got is the power to stop the opposition playing.

If Barry is injured/not playing well, without Macca, we are like subbuteo players with no protection for the defence. In my opinion, his return can't come quick enough, and with him in the side, it could pave the way for Davies to come in for the ineffectual Barkley.... Rant over. COYB

Question: What do you get if you substitute any one of these players for either of these players? Answer: Nothing!

What do you get if you spend 㿅 million on a player who stated he once beat Hosein Bolt in a race?

The most embarrassing post on this thread is yours.

I'm not interested in minor improvements, Martinez was one of the worst managers we have had and his mere sacking meant we were entitled to EXPECT some improvement. I'm not interested in your predictions either, you will never mention them again if you are proved wrong.

What you and the rest of the so called "positive" people seem unable to understand is that these after-match threads are about the game that has just taken place... previous results are no excuse for two utterly lamentable performances.

You whine that these supporters "embarrass" you. Really?

If you were not hurt, embarrassed and angry by the last two performances, you really do forfeit the right to call other fans "embarrassing".

Accept shite and they will serve it to you by the bucket.

If we had been playing a Champions League game in midweek instead of the League Cup, we would have put out the strongest side we possibly could, regardless of who we were playing at the weekend. There would have been no "resting" players. No "looking at" different players. No "experimenting" with different tactics.

We have got to get away from this idea that Everton players are incapable, for whatever reason, of playing more than one game a week.

We were going great guns but risked, and subsequently were, eliminated from a cup competition that offered European football simply because the manager decided to faff about with team selection.

Now, we lose to a Bournemouth side we should have beaten because we lost momentum in midweek. So once more we have to start all over again. Talk about self-inflicted wounds.

Not good enough, where is this motivating manager that replaced Martinez? I thought this is the man the players wanted?

We were unacceptably poor against a very average team... hang on, we were unacceptably poor against a Championship reserve side, at home in a cup match – what happens if this team doesn't turn up against Palace?

We put the Norwich game down as a blip and believed that Bournemouth would be easy; we were out-fought, out-thought, out-played by a side that had lost the last two games. What the tactics were supposed to be against Bournemouth and why they weren't changed when it was obvious they weren't working, I don't know.

Koeman will have earned his wage if we beat Palace on Friday. Let's hope the kick up the arse those players got was a big one.

We need leader's and goalscorers in those positions at present there are none. Bringing young Davies on for a spell might be the answer, the youngster will at least add some enthusiasm. If Koeman can't get the required response, we're in trouble.

Some of the faces may have changed, but in every game so far this season, it could have been Martinez on the touchline?

Most new managers put their stamp on the team and even if results don't necessarily improve, you can see their influence.

Am I alone in thinking there is virtually no difference?

Barkley did what Barkley does – runs into blind alleys or misplaces his passes when he decides to pass, and powder puff in the tackle. So no protection for the back line, the defence bombarded and hence not much going forward.

I agree that Davies needs to be brought in for his combination of energy, flair and tenacity, 3 things we were lacking on Saturday and against Norwich. The good news is we won't have to face Bolasie on Friday! He's ripped us to bits over the last few years.

The unbalanced amount of wingers just didn't get the ball in the box enough. When Bolassie decided to cross it with pace (once) we nearly scored. But for a great save (again) Lukaku would have had his goal and the game I reckon would have been completely different.

We should show the wingers footage of Peter Beagrie to see what they are doing wrong – basically exactly what he did! Like Beagrie, they all want to show off and beat 3 men instead of getting the ball across when opponents' central defenders are running back to their goal, and Lukaku is running in to get the power on the header.

Also, someone should tell Coleman to look ahead. He ran into the advertising hoardings or into 2 or 3 defenders time after time.

We are still in a good position and a win against Palace will put us right again. Tom Davies to come in for Barkley is a must for me.

Of course there's a difference. When did we win 4 league games on the bounce last season?

After 6 league games we've scored 10 and only conceded 4. Only Tottenham have conceded less. Look at the goals against column last season and then tell me if you see a difference.

Making us more organised and solid at the back is the start. The man's only just started the job! Get a grip!

I fear you're missing my point however.

Statistically, yes, we are better off, but are we playing any differently? That was my question?

Personally, after six games, the shape, style and strategy look frighteningly similar to me.

All I wanted to ascertain was if I was alone in my thinking.

If so, something better change...

The fact that we no longer leak goals is testament to the positive influence Koeman has had. The problem we have is that most of the starting 11 have been training and playing the Martinez way for 3 years and it will take a while to get it out of their system.

I personally think we need 3 new players to walk into the first 11. I think we have to accept that Deulofeu, Mirallas, Barkley, and Bolasie are all inconsistent. If they all have an off game together then we're screwed.

We need players that have the odd absolute blinder of a game, and for the games when they aren't at their best, we need them to score a respectable 7 out of 10. The four I mentioned to often score about a 5. We can't carry that many inconsistent players and expect to challenge the top 4.

Koeman needs a couple more transfer windows.

As for Ross, he infuriates, as do all of our flair players. I'm one of his biggest supporters and, if he doesn't start on Friday, I'm okay with it. Ron has his work cut out.

My comment regarding us in free fall is only my opinion. But it is based on the dreadful performance by so-called 'flair players' who have not faced (with thee exception of Spurs) any top-of-the-table Clubs.

However, having watched the 20 mins highlights from the official website I think this was our worst performance so far. Too many players had poor games and with Barry & Gueye looking off colour we had no foundation for our attacking players to build from.

Like Chris Gould @231, I feel Mirallas, Barkley, Deulofeu and Bolasie are all too "lightweight" and not strong enough to take a game by the scruff of the neck. Bolasie might show a bit more fight I think.

Away from home, sometimes you get performances like that but hopefully the manager can get a reaction from his players. Mirallas has really fallen away since his good start and it annoys me that he doesn't even seem to work hard for the team and just goes missing.