Barkley starts for them.

Clean sheet, professional performance and 3 points please, Everton.

If he plays a defensive midfielders hes too negative.
If he goes with the better players he leaves us too open

Good - he’s our best defender there and the only one who looks like he can actually anticipate anything.

I am too wary of that midfield being outdone for intensity, which has been the story of the season at home. I’m still confident though, with Allan being back and Sigurdsson playing better lately.

Great line, Michael.

No doubting Carlo is a lovely genuine man but he tends to drive me crackers with some of his bleedin’ selections, best of luck with that midfield Carlo, but we are due a big win tonight with plenty of goals, I think the last one was over six months ago v WBA, not knocking you Carlo, just a couple of little digs, I hope you have the last laugh tonight.

Guessing you would have Tom Davies in there Dave

Anyways here we go.

Maybe there is a connection there.. 🤔

I would like to see Calvert Lewin being a little more unselfish and aware. Instead of thinking only of himself getting goals maybe if he sought to create more chances for Richarlison when he's in a good position they would develop a better partnership.

And probably more goals would come for Calvert Lewin too because Richarlison would start to return the favour.

Can't understand our approach here.

Maybe there is a connection there.. 🤔

I would like to see Calvert Lewin being a little more unselfish and aware. Instead of thinking only of himself getting goals maybe if he sought to create more chances for Richarlison when he's in a good position they would develop a better partnership.

And probably more goals would come for Calvert Lewin too because Richarlison would start to return the favour.

Is there any Plan B to get the ball out of defence? Pickford's had more of the ball than anyone on the pitch. Dreadful!

In some South American countries including Columbia they drink a lot of that tea "maté" There are fotos of him on Instagram drinking it.

Now, I know whenever I drink tea or coffee I get muscle cramps in my legs... although I am already a bit of a crock to be fair...

Would he think about cutting out the tea for a few weeks..? See if that pesky calf loosens up, that has ruled him out of so many games..

It could be the caffeine!
Worth a try!!

If we can play like this, then why would we ever bother with the strange passing game in our back line?

He'd already had his pocket nicked by Watkins in identical fashion to how he coughed up the goal. He looks a shambles at the moment and I for one cannot understand the nonsense some trot out about Michael Keane in comparison.

Pickford - out of necessity - is having a storming game. Great header for our equaliser, but in the main they are running our defence ragged.

Unless that is sorted, we lose this.

Pickford, as our last line of defence, has been as good as I can remember.

Iwobi has had an excellent first half, needs to grab this chance with both hands and carry on. Calvert-Lewin has been dangerous and looks fit again. Gomes is having a very good game in possession. Sigurdsson is also dangerous and is running like a man possessed. Richy is having one of those erratic games that could end up a 5/10 or an 8/10.

I think the team looks pumped up, desperate to get the win here. Maybe this is causing us to lose shape and get torn apart on the counter? Allan is trying to hold the fort all by himself in the centre.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Mina come on and us shifting to a back 3, but not sure who'd get pulled off in midfield? All three are busting a gut.

We have to win this game. It's still there for the taking.

I’ve just tuned into the Live Forum. What a zoo of stupids.

I really think that is very poor management from a man lauded as a tactical genius... etc, etc.

Just waiting for Villa to score, or for us to scrape a draw.

Absolute garbage.

Disgraceful performance – AGAIN!

Hugely disappointing performance yet again.

Result was inevitable

Once James decided he didn't want the aggro and sat this one out, we had no Plan B.

How shit must King be that Richarlison is undroppable? What has Tom done to exiled? At least he occasionally looks up and goes in the opposition half?

Don't defend the Manager. He picks the team. He sorts the tactics. He has a real responsibility for a lot of the shite we are having to endure.

Yes, a number of the players are not good enough. Neither is the Manager.

Carlo, mate, this is fucking shit.

The Godfrey-Holgate dream team so many advocate worked a treat, didn't it?

Goodness, this team can frustrate the hell out of you.

Alarm bells and the lack of big game management again means it's almost killed any European hopes.

What the fuck is Delph in the squad for? He's despicable. Still, we can only hope and see if Sheffield Utd beat Spurs, Man Utd best Liverpool, and then ifs and buts.

Fair play to Jordan Pickford but another atrocious defensive mistake that was avoidable has caused our own downfall.

Hard to pick up but West Ham on this performance looks a very big ask, but this is Everton.

For me, the midfield didn't get going tonight and surely now Tom Davies must start next week.

For now it's what-ifs and let's enjoy the rest of the weekend.

How many chances do we actually create during a match? Very few. Have you noticed how many goals we have scored from set-pieces? From open play, we're clueless.

Carlo needs to get his act together during the summer and decide what to do because clearly it's is not good enough as teams with poorer players are frequently out-playing us! We need three dogs in the centre as two is not working, oh how we have missed Doucouré!

Basically gave Villa both their goals then had nothing going forward ourselves. Dom can't score outside of the 6-yard box, only James can and he's injured every other game.

I've given up on Richarlison, he has no footballing brain, gives the ball away all the time and has no second touch.

We need better players, but Everton will continue to fall foul of the transfer market and miss out on the best players, it seems. I hope I'm wrong though.

Carlo brought on Delph when he should have brought on Davies. King also too late.

Richarlison has forgotten where the goal is and his pitiful lack of peripheral vision or greed prevented Sigurdsson having a tap in. Same old!

Time and again tonight, Villa exploited that and, but for our man of the match, Pickford's heroics, might have scored five or six.

With the current personnel, we have only one way of delivering results. That is to sit deep, defend in numbers and hope for a goal on the break or more likely at a set-piece. We now fight for 8th.

We just don't have good enough players, particularly in midfield where we are way too slow and can't break through the opposition's lines anything like enough.

And don't get me started on the Manager... enough said!!!

None of them was as poor as the manager... were there any tactics?

Nothing changed at half-time, abysmal in everything they tried to do, with shooting at the target absolutely pathetic.

One player seemed to age in front of my eyes, he got older and older with every passing minute and I had him down as a good player.

Never rains but it pours at Everton, no end to it.

This manager is flawed. There is talk of Couthinho, that sums it up. The manager is just looking for someone to reliably come good or to blame if they don't. It's lazy and it's people dodging blame.

The worst thing is the lack of clarity of who chooses what player to buy, again so it's difficult to prove who is to blame. It's laziness; get young, powerful players with skill and build a team. Stop trying to find the easy fix, Everton.

Every team that comes to Goodison seems to dominate the ball against us. The stats might not be saying the same but it certainly feels like it when you're watching.

And the selection of Delph ahead of Davies is one of the most mystifying decisions I've ever seen in my 30 years of supporting this club!! Just bizarre.

And...well, everything is shite. Even when we won last week we were still shite.

It's painful to watch.

Defence was iffy in the first. Midfield was lacking throughout. It made for great entertainment with Villa having the edge in an end to end game that saw chances at both ends. So our solution in the second half was to sit deeper. How did that work out, Carlo?

After conceding the first goal we showed the way we should be playing. If you're stronger attacking... then attack!

But no, we abandoned that and relied on on notoriously porous defence to see the game out.

Not good enough. And not even decent to watch.

We are the classic case of a team playing to cover up its weaknesses rather than playing to its strengths. That's a guaranteed pathway to being bang average.

I wonder whether if Carlo switches on to watch, that he will put on ITV and not realise until after the second ad break.

I have been following Everton since 1960 and I have never seen such a bunch of incompetent lazy twats. The whole squad, with a couple of exceptions (namely the young players) needs to be cleared out. Do not sign any more over-the-hill foreign trash who are here to gather their wages and little else.

Recruit players who can at least be decisive and pass the ball accurately and are prepared to put in a shift. There are plenty such players in the Championship. Stop trawling for "out of favour" players in Spain and Italy. There is usually a reason they are 'out of favour' and that is that they are lazy rubbish.

Ancelotti has to answer big questions: What has he actually achieved at the club? Maybe better than his predecessors but the quality of play is atrocious. Nothing will be achieved with the current dross.

Week-in & week-out, we put ourselves under unnecessary pressure. Holgate and Iwobi should have been binned at half time. From kick off, Villa showed their tactics regarding Watkins but Holgate and Godfrey didn't have the sense to sort themselves out.

Poor from Ancelotti tonight allowing players not performing staying on the pitch.
Season over.

Great header from Calvert-Lewin to equalise but he was virtually anonymous after it.

And Barkley is still a better footballer than Gomes ever will be.

So slow to make tactical changes and substitutions when change is needed (how many runs did Watkins make behind Seamus?). Poor all round.

Pro... err... gress.

Where would Richarlison go? None of the top 5 would take him, neither would Barca or Real. The Italians maybe, but on present form, he'd be lucky if Watford came in for him.

Watkins gave him a lesson in how to stretch a defence, I'd happily swap them.

No excuses, just another terrible performance; without the creativity and vision of Rodriquez, we are a very ordinary team.

What in utter fuck does our manager see in Iwobi???

Richarlison is one of the many reasons our season is over, he loses the ball almost every single time he gets it and is well overrated (in my mind anyway) and still only potential. I hope he stays and gets better, but I can't see any bigger club willing to pay what we would want for him.

Some real crappy performances this season, I'm fed up with them.

Although Holgate got caught with an inexcusable mistake, the amount of times our defence had the ball and had absolutely no options ahead of them was unbelievable. Without James, there is zero movement in midfield. The only player in the middle (except Allan as this isn't his game) who tried to get on the ball was Gomes, and he got taken off.

I still find it incredible how Brands escapes more criticism on here. We had, at one point, Sigurdsson, Iwobi and Delph in midfield. I wouldn't be confident against non-league clubs with that midfield. Bernard for Iwobi doesn't exactly change much. Can anyone honestly believe that those 4 in the same team would frighten any football league opposition?

How Ancelotti believes that, needing a win, any 3 of those 4 would produce results ahead of Davies or a more attacking King is beyond me. After 30 years of management, his substitutions should be better.

Another opportunity lost, another set of baffling subs. Groundhog Day.

I hope to God he sells Richarlison in the summer – he's just not good enough!

Second half, Everton were far too loose and the finishing was absolutely dreadful. Calvert-Lewin cannot shoot to hit a barn door and Richarlison is a head-down merchant. They finally got what they deserved on that display.

Same old mid-table players who fail when points are needed. A lot of players didn't turn up as usual. Total lack of spirit. Thinking of their Summer holidays. Carlo will have to become Houdini to get into the European Conference League with these players.

When I look at the table and Everton need points to advance, it's been the same old story for over 20 years. Looked at the Table before the match and I had the same old feeling.

Fact: Everton are a mid-table side of two results and a loss. You can get a Top Manager and a shed full of money and Everton will give you the same results.

Speaking as an alleged “Carlo apologist”, I'd say he erred tonight in picking Iwobi ahead of? Anyone else.

He erred in leaving Tom out; he failed to motivate at the start and at half-time. Bringing on Delph was a mistake, bringing on King so late was pointless.

That said, our defenders are playing like they did under Silva when everyone blamed zonal marking. Maybe he wasn't that bad after all.

Please, please, please tell me what match we have played well this season? Matches we have won have been against teams in poor form.

Sorry but we have too many average Premier League players. Top 10 is all we deserve and all I can see for next season and beyond. I feel for our owner living through a pandemic and owning Everton!!

It would be horribly embarrassing to play any half-decent (or quarter-decent) organised European team.

Gawd, this was horrible to watch, it would be utterly embarrassing if they actually made it into Europe and they methodically destroyed the illusion of the quality of British football.

I've seen enough of this squad over the weeks, months, years to know as well as anyone else what the shortcomings are. Today, if we're lucky, should really serve as a fitting tombstone to this playing group as we know it.

We all know what they can do and we all know – we know painfully well – what they can't. I think we are far better under Ancelotti than under that clown Silva or that fat chancer Allardyce. Or the lazy Dutchman for that matter as well.

We are far better basically, but nowhere near good enough. We've got the equivalent of a veteran Ferrari mechanic, and we're gifting him half an Austin Allegro is how I would put it. I feel as though Ancelotti is getting the most out of a fairly shitty playing group if we're honest. I'm just not sure the wisdom of paying a guy like we're in the Champions League, when we're not; we don't deserve to be, and don't seem to be heading there anytime soon either.

This has to be now on Brands but he bafflingly has a new contract? Who knows what the fuck is going on?

But surely we didn't poach and pay the piper for this top and pedigreed European gaffer to manage this group right?

To my mind this is a huge transfer window really. We either move forward or we don't and if we don't then this is pretty pointless in truth.

Until the window though, I'm following the Everton players themselves based on today's shameful showing.

Thinking about anything except football and Everton.

Season 20-21 is over, boys, stay well and healthy and see you on here for the transfer tattle!

To your poin,t The Athletic ran a piece saying Brands is impressed with Gordon's bench warming on loan and told Carlo he needs to be in the first team mix next season. Jesus wept...

Our season ended in February. The last couple of months have been an illusion.

Carlo has been simply too inconsistent this year - and it's reflected in the results. He's played multiple formations, and players (Gomes, Iwobi, Sigurdsson and Richarlison) in multiple positions. The team is disjointed, and lacks any identity.

No new contracts for anyone in the summer. If Carlo, Sigurdsson, Allan or even James want to be here for longer, then let them earn it in the run up to January or over course of next 12 months.

Other things I think we need to see :

- a consistent and preferred defence.
- a consistent shape and formation.
- players played in one position.
- youthful backup in every position, and then being given a chance if his preferred “experienced” players are not at the races.

Anything short of this, and maybe in 2022 we could afford to pay off the last 2 years of his deal and roll the dice again. Doing so now would be suicide, because nobody in their right mind would come here.

During a normal season, If Evertonians were leaving Goodison Park having witnessed poor performance after poor performance and gob-smacking home defeat after gob-smacking home defeat, the airwaves, and the terraces would be calling for the head of the man in charge and they would be right in doing so.

I realise that these aren't normal times and that we're not the only team to struggle at home this season; however, there comes a point when we have to say enough is enough and I believe that that point has been reached.

We can't keep saying that Carlo has a plan when he clearly doesn't, we can't keep saying this addition or that addition will solve the issues because one or two players won't make such a significant difference, we can't continue to sign players that can't string 3 games – or 3 passes – together due to lack of fitness or lack of mental toughness or whatever it is that continues to thwart our ambitions.

For every derby victory at the enemy's ground, there is a home defeat to Newcastle, for every win at Spurs and Arsenal there's a home defeat to Burnley or Fulham, for each point gained on the road there's dropped points at home to Villa, Palace, Leeds, et al.

It's been a rubbish season, with some ridiculous performances and equally gob-smacking results, in ordinary times we'd be looking for a new manager, in ordinary times the baffling decision-making and tactics by Ancelotti would have received howls of derision from many fans.

The one thing that has been proven this season beyond all doubt, is that it's not the fans who are to blame when the Everton team plays badly or doesn't win, it's the manager, his players, and the tactics that this manager employs which is totally responsible for one of the worse seasons for Everton at Goodison in living memory.

Renew a season ticket next month? On the performances and results obtained at Goodison this season, it will have to be carefully weighed up as far as I'm concerned.

According to other TW threads, 6,500 will be allowed into Goodison for the Wolves games. I wonder how many will turn up? And will they have cushions?

Who picked Holgate?
Who picked Gomes?
Who brought Delph on?
Who ignores King and Nkounkou?
Who keeps everyone back for corners? Who allowed Kean to go on loan?
Who has the imagination of a caravan site?

Pickford – maybe on current form
Coleman – great servant, great bloke... but now finished
Digne – since new contract not great but I'd keep
Holgate – please sell
Godfrey – keep
Allan – keep
Gomes – please sell
Iwobi – possibly worst pound for pound signing in history
Sigurdsson – no pace
Calvert-Lewin – keep unless bid of over £50m
Richarlison – fingers crossed someone bids silly money

What a job! How many of this lot get in Moyes's best team? How many get in Martinez's best team?

All on Easy Street and under no pressure to win.

Getting the best out of what you've got is obviously the bottom line. Is Carlo doing this? Not even close. I see a tired man trapped in the headlights. A dinosaur of a man living on his past glories with teams full of stars.

This is now becoming a broken record. Week after week baffling selections. Holgate... Diabolical. Delph on as first sub again, and too late again, Bernard and King. He seems to be learning nothing. Hapless, dazed, confused. No plan, no clue.

The manager is a big handicap. These sentiments have been brewing for months. Tonight was the last straw.

A typical Everton move would be to extend Sigurdsson's contract. He is exactly what is wrong with Everton, he does what he feels is enough for Everton; no more, no less and half the time he is made captain for it.

And as regards Big Dunc, he has to shoulder a portion of the blame also; he is ever present for the last few failures with regards managers, he needs to make a difference – not sit tight waiting for the big job.

The aging Ancelotti's time will end soon enough, Duncan needs to influence the spirit in this team if nothing else as I think we have prospered playing games without the crowds. When they return, timid little Everton will be in trouble again.

I used to hate our passing game under Martinez as it seemed unnecessary and at times lacking end product, but at least we passed it with a level of confidence.

We now just seem to treat the ball like a hot potato. We must be the worst passers of the ball in the Premier League.

Just read that we are ready to make a bid for Sergio Aguero.

We give away soft goals every game. I would rather Keane and Mina play each week with Godfrey right-back and Coleman right mid.

Our poor build from the back play could have been punished multiple times. I don't see why we can't go more Route 1 at times to Calvert-Lewin and scrap for the 2nd ball.

Villa deserved the win and their 2nd goal was a cracking finish. We had very similar positions around the Villa box but couldn't even find the target nevermind test the keeper. Some right embarrassing efforts at shooting.

Pickford my MotM.

I am writing off Europe now and fully expect villa to finish above us.

I am putting our poor home form down to the lack of crowd. There is no way we would put up with stuff like this with a full house watching.

Big summer of transfer activity for the club and Ancelotti.

Some fans might see it as a team trying their best to avoid the Europa League!

Personally, I would let go Bernard, Delph, Holgate and maybe Rodríguez (too much expectation for a player with too poor fitness).

I believe the problem in our squad is we have too many high-profile players with little hunger or humbleness, and football is about mixing personalities and styles of play. Gomes and Sigurdsson is the perfect example. Both in the same team gives no defensive equilibrium but, as we don't have other options (or because Ancelotti doesn't trust other options), we play inferior teams who run more and end up loosing.

The summer window will be key: Everton must get it right. Ancelotti made improvements this season, but he needs to work a lot in the summer cause not winning at home for so long won't be enough to cover all his Italian charm. Fans getting back to Goodison Park want wins, not words.

That culture has been there, 4 or 5 years excepted, since the 1971 FA Cup semi-final. We delude ourselves if we get distracted from that central truth.

How do we fix it? Don't know. But it needs a type of magician.

I love the club and I wish everyone all the best on here, but I'm taking a couple of steps back. This is a very long project, if it is ever going to happen at all – which I doubt. At my age, peace of mind counts for a lot and, for my remaining years, I am going to look for more restful things.

UTFT.

What are the chances of Brands finding 5 great players?

I'll give him Doucoure and Digne, but every other success has been at the request of a manager.

I'm struggling to understand any rhyme or reason to some of the decisions.

We were back to our disjointed and dysfunctional worst. The first half was a total mess, Holgate's transgression was a mere distraction to the appalling play throughout the team. The basics of passing and ball control were again, all too often elusive. At the top level, a team just can't get away with such poor basic play.

Without exaggeration, Aston Villa should have had five tonight. Only Pickford and the woodwork prevented it.

For me there needs to be a cooler head at centre-back. Mina or Keane with Godfrey.

Then there needs to be a level of organisation in midfield; Gomes and Delph are too slow for the modern Premier League, Sigurdsson is not a midfielder, he's a floater, a No 10 luxury. Iwobi tried today, but doesn't contribute enough to justify being selected.

Carlo has to get a grip and stop fielding teams that are weak in midfield. Every home defeat this season has stemmed from it.

For fuck's sake, Gomes cost £20 million, Iwobi £28 million, we would be happy just getting them both off the wage bill!

Getting rid of Ancelloti would be cheap at the price.

He is still having to work with about a dozen players who simply aren't good footballers or who are years past their best. Anyone who's coached any sport at any level knows you can go over and over and over the basics until you're blue in the face but, at the end of it all, it's what's between the players' ears that is the biggest factor.

With the exception of perhaps Sigurdsson (who has other major issues) & perhaps Digne, none of the players Ancelotti inherited can be described as smart footballers.

If we sack Carlo, we have the same muppets in the squad who've failed four managers. At this point are proven to be shit, so sacking Carlo would be cheaper but we'd still suck. I'm hoping they we replace the worst players and find Carlo isn't the problem. If he is a problem he's a secondary one, the main problem is the legacy of Walsh's spending spree.

Coleman only works as a wing back these days, and was poor for the winner. Wide open in the first half with a back 4.

Iwobi offers fuck all; Gomes likewise. Richarlison can't hold onto the ball. Sigurdsson wasn't great, but at least he had been playing well.

Doucouré badly missed, but he's not perfect either.

Time to do his homework and buy young players that have the necessary fitness, dedication and skill and that are young and devise a team that can press teams when necessary and transition effectively. A team of steel that understands that winning matches is what it is all about.

We are not a retirement home for players.

They can't even pass to each other. Richarlison and Gomes pass to the opposition more than some of the opposition pass to each other.

We are all gobsmacked by James because he can pass a ball consistantly.

Calvert-Lewin lines a shot up on his instep and somehow slices it.

Poor subs? Fucking hell – look at the bench.

Love to know how any manager changes the game from the bench with nothing better to choose from than what is on the pitch.

Harry Winks
Dele Alli
Max Aarons
Tammy Abrahams
The kid from Brentford

There are good, young(ish) players out there who could resurrect their careers (like Lingard) if given the chance.

Carlo Ancelotti – who has won absolutely everything in the game as a player and a manger – comes to Everton... and he turns to shite?

in the past, of couse, every team he has managed has been bought and polished before he arrived. He never had to pick the team, or make substitutions – they were all pre-ordained and made for him. In fact, the guy has never done anythinhg usefull in his life.

And then, in 2019, he rolls up at Everton's door at the time that we happen to be looking for a new manager?

We didn't chase him, of course, because of his past reputation! And, there were no other sides in the mix that might have liked to get him as manager at the time. But, looking for an "easy berth", he chose Everton and that is how we ended up with him.

So, having saddled him with a squad of misfits from previous transfer windows, we expect him to produce us a "Champions League" qualifying team in his first full season with us.

I am getting fed up with reading the "I could do better with this squad" comments on here. Some of us / you need to start gettin back in touch with reality.

If anyone is in a false positin in the leaguie, we are, because, with our current squad, I reckon 15th would flatter us.

Our lack of pace, power and quality in midfield was a problem then. Without Doucouré and James, it remains just as much of a problem nearly two seasons later.

Precisely. Keane has veered between decent and terrible under six managers; Sigurdsson has hidden from the ball under the same number; Pickford ditto; Holgate under 7; and so on.

But yeah, Carlo is entirely to blame. He made in my view errors today but that's just a sub plot to the shitness of the long-term players.

The club should also be looking to replace the very many players who are just not up to scratch with hungrier, younger players who can be developed, such as Godfrey, and then, with luck in 2 or 3 years, we may have a decent side.

Hanging on to ageing players who are possibly better than the younger ones currently in the squad, is a recipe for failure and Everton has been down this road far too often. I'm certainly fed up with the ground-hog nature of watching Everton and yearn for some radical changes at the club.

I have seen not a lot of progress in the last 18 months and it could be argued that we have actually regressed.

Ancelotti is showing absolutely no difference to the last 3 managers, in fact, the standard of football is unbelievably worse. Give him more windows and you will simply waste more years.

And before the cries go up ‘Who would you replace him with?' – I don't know. But what I do know is that this is not working.

Same mistakes, week-in & week-out, but he gets a Get Out of Jail Free card based on his CV.

I'm completely disillusioned with the entire situation at the moment and have no desire to pay to watch this turgid crap next season.

Schoolboy defending, shocking decision-making when attacking, and absolutely pathetic attempts at shooting handed the balance of the game to Villa.

What has happened to pairing Richarlison with Digne on the left? When you put Richarlison central or on the right, he seems to lose his peripheral vision and also displaces Calvert-Lewin from where he has been his most effective.

Bringing on Delph looked pointless, just a waste of a substitution. Surely it was worth giving Josh King 20 minutes and just going for the win?

Manager and players equally culpable for me.

They ruin every weekend!!!

We are supposedly chasing Europe, drawing at home, and Ancelotti brings on a defensive midfielder. He continuously plays the same failing formation at home. Never tries anything different.

He ould start King with Calvert-Lewin and play Richarlison deeper running at people. We have so many players deep that we have to go backwards. Holgate lost the first goall turning to pass back as there were no forward options.

One home win since Xmas. He is no better than Allardyce. In fact, I would say he worse.

Forget what he did years ago with other clubs. It's what he is doing now that counts and it is shite. Get him out. Now.

Yes, we missed chances... but Villa dominated and without Jack Grealish they are half the team. You need mobility, speed and tackling ability in midfield and expecting Allan and Richarlison to manage all of it is unrealistic.

Another massive opportunity wasted!!!!!!!

Villa ran us off the park for large parts of the game because their players are quicker and more energetic than ours. Gomes, Sigurdsson, Allan etc are slow. Tom Davies and Bernard are weak and slow. Iwobi is shite. Rodriguez is slow. Without any velocity in midfield, we are sitting ducks for attack-minded teams.

Say what you want about Ancellotti but neither Pep, Nagelsmann, Klopp, Tuchel, Eddie Howe, Fat Sam, Harry Potter or any other saviour you have in mind could improve our current midfield.

We are where we are because we have slow, weak-minded players who can't cope under pressure.

The team and squad is an embarrassment. We don't compete, we are often a disorganised bunch of passionless but very rich young guys who seem determined to make us a laughing stock but are incapable of understanding what's at stake. In these circumstances, any other manager presiding over this shite would be under huge pressure.

But no fans in stadiums, alongside the guy's undeniable likeability etc etc, offer him a degree of protection not seen by most of his predecessors.

I've typed this. I've re read it. Yet I somehow cannot believe we've just done it again. Tossed away a very, very, real chance of decent European football next year. Surely everyone else around us can't lose tomorrow?

Often, you can blame that on the manager... but, in this case, I don't think you can... because only 4 of them are his signings.

You tell me who he could have brought on from that bench that would have changed the game in our favour – and I will say again "Rubbish", becuase that is your opinon – not fact.

Grow up and begin to realise that we are dealing here with the real world – not fantasy football. Last time I looked, Roy of the Rovers hadn't actaully signed for us and, until he does, keep your fantasy predicitions where they belong.

This is one of the most bizarre seasons. Best away form for 30 years and worst home form.

Out of possession in away games we seem to play deep and have a shape to our play.

At home, it's like 11 strangers on the pitch with us looking exposed every time we lose possession.

I can't see where our next win is coming from. We have no momentum at all.

I'm surprised why people expect better from a manager sacked by his last three clubs who is proving to be worse than Allardyce.

No wonder he lost in Istanbul.

Let me just say that they have collectively reached a level of inadequacy and ineptitude that neither I nor modern science had previously considered possible.

Where we go from here is a question, but Ancelloti is not the answer.

We all watch the game and have our own opinions, but the one thing that keeps cropping up seems to be a lack of commitment and that is the manager's problem. It seems he keeps picking the same players who have the same lack of concentration, unable to pass to a player to run onto; instead they pass to a player who is marked.

There is something fundamentally wrong when, watching a game, you are fully aware of when the opposition is going to score, and not surprised when they do.

We are not the only team who needs new players; apart from the top 4/6, every team would like new players but they usually turn up with a game plan and commitment to get a result. We seem to have a number of players who just turn up for the game with no reaction, win or lose.

No matter who he plays, Ancelotti should be able to get a better reaction from the players at the club than what he is, and regardless, he should leave them on the bench when they are not making the effort, and riding on the back of those players who make the effort.

It seems every season we are bringing out the same excuse, wait till next season when the manager brings in some new players and we will see an improvement. So far, any improvements we have made only seem temporary, and it is a sad thing that a club the stature of Everton will have to rely on the reputation of a manager to bring players to the club.

If we continue to perform at these levels we are at, I am afraid that Ancelotti's reputation will soon tarnish.

So the truth is he's the wrong man for us; we need a great organizer... not a motivator of great players.

Moshiri hasn't got a clue who is the right manager for us and we will continue to struggle, I'm afraid. Carlo will be here for 2 more years for sure, unless we get involved in a relegation scrap. Pretty grim outlook with no quick fix.

There it is, their players wanted it more than ours did; how can that be the case? We had an outside chance of bringing European football to Goodison next season; Villa were playing largely for pride although, given tonight's result, it wouldn't surprise me if they finished above Everton.

Fulham, Newcastle, West Ham, and other teams have also looked hungrier than Everton at Goodison Park this season, which cannot be accepted by any of us under any manager.

Ancelotti takes the credit when the team plays well and when it wins, but he has to take the flak when either or both of those things don't happen. Even when Everton has gained all the points – mostly on the road – they haven't been great performances and on most occasions the performances have been riddled with poor play and incompetence, that is the real issue that makes some of us question whether Ancelotti is actually worth his salary and has us asking if long-term will he prove to be the solution or one of the problems.

Why should his critics provide a list of who should manage Everton? We have no say on that; it's up to Moshiri and the Board to decide upon that. We can only judge on what we see on the pitch and mostly it's been very unsatisfactory.

Gutless, spineless and pathetic. If we finish in Europe this season, then I don't know whether to think those we finished above are actually shite or if we have been the luckiest team ever.

André Gomes is the slowest player in the Premier League, let alone at the club. I'd even go and say he is up there with the worst midfielder in the league. Never ever want to see him in an Everton shirt.

Alex Iwobi is actually the most hopeless Everton player I have ever seen. And I saw Kone and Niasse. Headless chicken would be an improvement. I never want to see him in an Everton shirt again.

Fabian Delph... Why? Just why???

Mason Holgate is just a cocky little fucker. Does not matter what level you play at or experience you have. That first goal is absolutely disgusting from him. But an average player with arrogance. Always a sign of trouble ahead. Get rid.

The rest were poor tonight. Not up for it bar from Pickford and maybe Calvert-Lewin. The rest were poor as usual at home.

Carlo Ancelotti's substitutions are an absolute joke at times. Only one player had come off the bench this season and scored in the league. 33 Games and only one sub has scored. And that was a penalty. Disgusting. Not Carlo's fault that one. But the Delph for Gomes one is like replacing diahrrea with vomit. Worse than the other.

Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin have only scored in the same league game once this season. And yes one was a penalty.

Never a team game or performance, is it? We get outrun every game, we can't attack, we can't defend and, worst of all, there are no leaders on the bastard pitch. Where was the leader to give Holgate a fucking earache after that goal??? All far too nice to one another.

Same old, same old same bottle job and 'flatter to deceive' Everton. Once again, we have mentally tapped out due to the thought of being competitive. Bottlejobs the lot of them.

One home win in ten... Vile!

Any one who writes match reports on this game may as well just copy and paste their report from the Newcastle, Fulham or Burnley games. Might as well do it for Wolves and Sheffield United too.

Laughing stock we are. Sooner the season finishes the better. Fuck off, Everton.

Bravo!

Mike 178. Lucky, you don't know the half. Luxury, we used to sleep in a shoe box in the middle of the road.

Ian 172. Change the record mate. Every Evertonian is frustrated at what we are watching. The final line of 172 looks like pure bait and is embarrassing.

You and I cry, but the sun is still in the sky and shining above you. Let me hear you sing once more like you did before Sing a new Song, Chiquita.

If I was on a betting site, I could make a fortune...

This manager is a complete waste of money, time, and discussion. He is going through the motions; this time next year he will be history.

As an 80+ fan, I hate wishing any part of my life away by the usual "I wish this season would be over"... Unfortunately that is just how I feel after watching one more inept display.

I have been fortunate enough to have witnessed "Great" Everton teams. This certainly is not one of them. But it is not just the system; the true fact, whether we like it or not, is that we just do not have enough good players. I just hope Moshiri has plenty of money because we will need to spend a bundle to get anywhere near a decent team.

I can forgive non-qualification for Europe but not the spineless, clueless negativity we have witnessed over the past 6 months.

Please don't give me "What can you expect from the squad he inherited?" What I do expect is a motivated group of players and I expect at the end of a game to be able to say they did their best. With a few exceptions I haven't seen any evidence of that for a long time.

I mean, Iwobi... does anyone coach him on the art of crossing a football? Delph ahead of Davies? Sigurdsson and Richarlison, clearly hugely talented footballers, who turn up at matches when they want and wander around aimlessly when they want.

How can they call themselves professional footballers? Cannot time a pass, cannot hit a 190+ ft² target, poor control, cannot beat a man... it's pathetic.

Ingmar Bergman – lol. Made me smile, which is a first after that game.

Just to be clear, you feel we could have done better?

I'm a Londoner through and through, my brothers support Arsenal & Spurs, and all my cousins, like most Asians, follow Liverpool, and some Manchsester United.

I like to be different and somehow I picked Everton at aged 11 – not even knowing where they were based. I'm now 41! It was the season where Peter Beardsley moved that I started to follow The Toffees properly. In that time, I've only seen the FA Cup win in 1995.

I have so much I want to say, but I'll start by saying I have more than my doubts about Ancelotti. Some of his previous aides were so talented, that they more or less managed themselves, and he was the perfect figurehead massaging big egos to good effect etc.

If you look at the end of his time at Bayern Munich and also Napoli, a lot of the players complained about the training and the intensity etc. If you watch our training sessions that the club post on YouTube etc, I often see James (when he's actually fit) just standing and talking to Ancelotti. The whole training sessions to me more resemble a group of mates having a little kick about in the park.

The team we started off with this season had a real balance, and all the players playing in the right positions. With a fit squad, I trust Carlo to pick the right team. But no team, particularly Everton will ever have a fully fit squad to play all season, and this is when Carlo's team selections and tactics baffle me totally.

Today's team should have been:

Pickford
Coleman Mina Godfrey Digne
Davies
Allan Gomes
Iwobi (as James was injured)
Calvert-Lewin Richarlison

I know I'll get so much stick for Iwobi, and we can do far better than him, but, to be fair to him, he's either a Number 10 or on the left-hand side, linking play with Digne overlapping, and never ever ever ever a right winger like Carlo sticks him out there to play. Yes, he had a couple of useful games there, but he's simply a square peg in a round hole out there

As we all know, our midfielders all need to play in a 3 to be remotely useful. Gbamin is the only natural holding midfielder and we all know what's happening to him injury-wise. But, if he's injured, then Davies has shown it has to be him in the Number 6 role. Allan and Doucouré are box-to-box midfielders who can track back but do not hold their positions like Gbamin or Davies would. And Gomes plays far better with a holding midfielder behind him, and a box-to-box player next to him. I know we need to upgrade massively on Gomes but, while he's here, when selected, it should only be in a 3 and with the right balance, as I picked.

One thing I'm going to bring up, and I want you guys to let someone in the club know: Why oh why oh why has no-one picked up that Ben Godfrey is a left-sided centre-back???

Go and watch his games at Norwich, or ask Daniel Farker where he played him, and ask Ben himself, and he will tell you this too. This is why he was comfortable at left-back, and each time he played on the left of a 2 at centre-back or left of a 3, like against Liverpool, he is far more comfortable. He is a right-footed left-centre-back like Gary Cahill was all these years, and Virgil van Dijk etc.

And Mason Holgate is a right-sided central defender, whose best position – and only position where he is good – is the right centre-back of a back 3.

So what does Carlo do??? He plays them the wrong way round!!! Godfrey has always looked so much less effective on the right side, and even at right back; just because he's right footed doesn't mean he'd be comfortable there. I've noticed since England U21s played Godfrey on the right-hand side, Carlo must have thought "Oh, that must be his position!" I mean, for crying out loud – that was Aidy Boothroyd picking him there, so of course it would be wrong!!

Just watch how uncomfortable Holgate and Godfrey look, playing the opposite of their best sides, and yes I know you will all say they are pro footballers and it shouldn't make a difference... but with these two it does.

If Carlo has a much stronger squad with players all flexible and comfortable on the ball, he will do well. But I think Carlo is a luxury kind of manager.

I personally would die for a modern day manager in the mould of Thomas Tuchel who can work with the players and also know the importance of intensity and athleticism in today's game.

We desperately need: Max Aarons, Bissouma, Ousman, Dembele, Zaha, or players of this ilk. And add to that Coutinho, Isco as James Rodriguez will never be fully fit all season.

I know this ain't PlayStation but I'd fund the players of that type by selling Moise Kean, Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison and many of the deadwood. We'd get good money for all the above. And for sure sell Keane, keep Mina, sell Holgate, and by two more centre-backs who have pace but are comfortable on the ball.

Richarlison is a good finisher, but his all-round play will never be good enough, I feel; his touch, awareness and passing is atrocious. I'd even have Anthony Martial if we could instead of him.

So sorry for the long essay, but I'm just on my own as an Everton fan in London and I have to have this rant. This team just drains the life out of us Evertonans. Every time we have a chance to make inroads... we flip.

I give up as "It's the hope that kills you," as they say, and I'm losing hope; we will forever be the team that just makes up the numbers.

You would expect the likes of Nkounkou, Broadhead or King given some game time to ease the fixture congestion, but you just know it will be the same starting 11 starting one week, the usual subs coming on.

Then, the following game, those who came on, will start the next game, with the three players coming off rested on the bench, until coming on in the second half... nearly always the same 14 players, every single match.

Tony Hill (#141) completely sums it up regarding our Premier League history. It's an embarrassment to us, delivered on a plate for decades by our self-described greatest fan, and now the muppet he's conned into buying us.

I suggest it's also resulted in us being regarded Europe-wide, for decades now, as the softest touch in our league. I'm sure we're seen as the English version of Espanyol (they're the other team in Barcelona if you're wondering, runners-up twice in the Uefa Cup being the pinnacle of their "success").

This is what Farhad Moshiri and his trusted advisors have delivered over 5 years — at significant expense.

This summer, Farhad Moshiri has to decide on how much more he and his advisors wish to invest to sign players with basic competencies such as accurate passing, positioning and shooting. Pace is more than "desirable" too. It's essential.

If he doesn't provide the basic ingredients to Ancelotti, he may as well bin him and sign Sean Dyche, a man who makes mince seem like gourmet fare to a(nother?) ravingly loyal, but peculiarly accepting of mere survival, fan-base.

"you can blame that on the manager – but, in this case, I don't think you can, because only 4 of them are his signings."

Hello Hugh,

This is professional football and practically every manager who joins a club, joins the club having no players that are his. What he has, he works with, motivates and sets them up to win.

You're basically implying we have to wait 2 or 3 years for players who are loyal and grateful to Ancelotti for being brought to the club before we can see any decent football or consistency.

Morinho was sacked because he couldn't get what he had at the club going.

Ancelotti so far has not shown anything to suggest he can pick the right teams / tactics and send out highly motivated teams on a regular basis. He certainly makes some questionable in-game decisions when under pressure.

Gomes and Iwobi need to be offloaded, along with the usual suspects, this summer... But who would want them?!

Maybe a loan move back to Portugal or Spain for Gomes, but I can't think of any club who would want Iwobi, not for fee anyway. He's got to be up there with worst buys in Premier League history for the money we paid.

This was us playing a high line, pressing actively and playing on the front foot, which many on here have clamoured for – and we saw the result. No doubt losing Rodriguez in the warm-up made us less effective with the ball, but the gameplan couldn't be changed. Villa hit the channels with direct balls behind our high fullbacks all first half. They didn't play through us, so how our midfield and Iwobi were responsible I have no Idea.

Holgate made a bad error which cost us a goal but they could have scored another 2 or 3 first half that had nothing to do with him. Better defenders than him have been caught in possession like that. I seem to recall Virgil van Dijk doing this early season.

I thought the players tried hard and were desperate to win but the gaps we left were brutally exploited.

We're just not that good. We've been outperforming our metrics all season. Offensively we are in the bottom third of the league in most categories, except chance conversion, iirc.

Richarlison is having a stinker, doesn't make him a bad player but no-one is undroppable. Calvert-Lewin relies on service. James is fragile. Iwobi was decent today, carried the ball well, but lacks cutting edge. Gomes is a good recycling midfielder but offers no goals, assists or defensive cover. Sigurdsson is dangerous and runs all day but can only play as a No 10. Allan's a great player but needs another combative midfielder alongside him as he is not fast.

Ancelotti doesn't trust the bench.

Delph, whilst unpopular, was not to blame for that loss, although not sure why he's getting game time ahead of Davies, who has a future at Everton.

Dreadful result but wouldn't be at all shocked if we beat West Ham Utd next week and Villa away after that.

Another Groundhog shit season that we know will be repeated year-in & year out – regardless of how much money is put in and who the manager is.

We've tried every kind of manager (young upcomers, Champions League winners, long-ball merchants, hard workers, mercenaries); we've tried every kind of signing (world class, heart-on-sleeve, young, old, British, foreign)... yet, over 25 years, we remain stagnant.

Other teams float past us from obscurity and win silverware (Portsmouth, Leicester, Swansea); our old rivals continue to win. Yet we just remain 8th-ish.

The only explanation is that Kenwright joined some kind of Satanic kabal whereby he made a deal with the devil for control of the club at the expense of the one thing that matters: success.

Kenwright Out!

Case in point: Seamus Coleman is offered a job for life. Same with Baines, although he loves the club too much just to take a wage.

Some comments on the game:

a) Holgate has not been in the form all season to play CB in a back four.
b) Godfrey is a left-footed centre-back, so play him there.
c) Any midfield combination of Gomes - Allan - Delph - Sigurdsson is too slow for the Premier League.
d) Sigurdason – who I have slated – was good until we moved him out wide left.
e) Why did Tom Davies not start with Allan?
f) Richarlison has been woeful for weeks and needs dropping.
h) We are so poor at the moment that we look better without the ball than we do with it.
i) We need more pace and energy in midfield next season.

We have to spank West Ham or that's our season over.

"Howler" Holgate probably wishes everybody's service by-passed it, another "footballing" defender who manages a goal every couple of games. Like the love of overlapping full backs, they must be able to defend first and stop the silly, avoidable errors. Attractive football is one thing, stupidity is quite another.

Then we had Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin who don't seem to be on the same wavelength and while the lad comes in for more than enough criticism why do we continue playing Iwobi as a right winger when he so obviously isn't, even as a late inclusion.

And then the almost obligatory substitution around the hour mark but seriously, Delph? The only thing that came to mind was a rehash of an old standby, in this case, The Manager sees more of him in the Sick Bay and Recovery Room than we do.

With the exception of Pickford, the whole thing was a shambles both on and off the field. Into Europe next season? Only on their holidays!

Anyway, off to the Quacks and in even more pain now.

The selection of Godfrey and Holgate as a centre-back pairing, when we had Keane and Mina on the bench means that either the latter were carrying injuries or it was a massive selection blunder. Holgate is at best a championship player.

Villa wanted this more than us, hitting the post and crossbar. Everton capitulated under their pressure and we resorted to kicking them off the park.

I've had it with Richarlisons attitude. If you don't like playing for Everton go elsewhere and we will find your replacement.

The whole of the midfield is also a problem. Keep Doucouré and Allan, the rest can go.

I really need to cut myself off from it if I can, we are pointless in the modern game and I need to have the same apathy as our sack of shit players.

Nolan at West Ham is a great servant also... you don't hear he has a contract for life no matter what level of coaching badge he bothers with!

Thing is, you're expecting it before a ball is kicked every week. Some of the players' places in the team seem assured – no matter how crap they play. Once again, I can't wait for the season to end.

I've been banging on for weeks that if there is truth we can improve on the standard of centre back we should. Priority? I said a few weeks ago maybe not but if we can do it. Although after last night I would be inclined to believe there is truth in the rumours and the manager sees it as more of a priority than we do / did. It was evident last night. It was evident against Tottenham. It has been evident all season and seasons prior.

Hugely disappointed. I'm in the would love Europe camp. I guess for those who see anything other than Champion's League as a distraction, we don't need to worry about Europe next season.

No-one gets any pleasure in having yet another weekend ruined and them low-lives over the park sniggering at us. Another big chance gone and this group saving Digne, Allan, James (I know) and maybe the goalie, are nowhere near the Top 4 level... never will be.

As for Carlo, well remember the last "What a manager!" quote from the blubbering Niagra Falls face? History may repeat but, by the way, I won't ask you to suggest an alternative. Not with your name anyway. Your namesake might just might step up and throw more money at us.

Big big question: Would you trust Carlo to not only spend it but to instil hunger and desire into a new batch? And dare I say it, have a plan that a pipe fitter (see other posts) can predict after being on the ale half the day. Let the good times roll, Carlo!

I'd consider making our lads change in the portacabins from now on.

Hugely disappointing considering how we started and some of our away results. I think of my late dad “thing is with Everton, they'll let you down”.

This is why the media ignore us, and you can't blame them. Nothing since 1995 is scandalous and I can't see Carlo with his decorated record changing it. Negative low-scoring sideways slow football will not work in the Premier League – even with a much different class of player. Sick of it and sick of this club, and the constant piss-taking we get.

For years we have been lacking a genuine playmaker, with a big engine, who moves the ball forward and at pace. Until we get such a player or combination of players we are going nowhere. The nearest we have had in the last 10 years is McCarthy - Barry combination.

Our current set of “playmakers” are pedestrian in passing, no engine and no hunger to win. As long as we have this set up, teams like Newcastle, Fulham, Leeds, Burnley know that all they have to do is get at us at speed. Just like our old “Dogs of War” days.

Aspirations of even top half need to put on hold until we find somebody to build a team around – just like Rice at West Ham, Grealish at Villa etc.

So we have still had to make do with combinations of Iwobi, Davies, Bernard, Sigurdsson, Delph, and Gomes. Carlo knows these players aren't good enough, he's even played Coleman and Digne in midfield on occasions ahead of some of them.

This summer, we need another couple of decent midfielders who can carry the ball, have a bit of pace and can break through the opposition lines. We also need a right-back and another striker. Regarding the latter I'd sell Richardson, assuming we can get stupid money for him, and buy a couple of replacements.

Watkins is supposed to be running around; Holgate is a central defender, I'd be alarmed if he was doing that.

Godfrey was almost as bad as Holgate today. He made one huge error, a result of us trying to play out from the back, no need to pile on the lad.

Some of you act like you know the fella personally. As far as I can make out, he is professional and is trying his best. If he was some arrogant slacker, Ancelotti would have him nowhere near the team.

He's just one of this season's scapegoats and the gum thing is just the same irrational bias as Tom's hair or skateboarding.

I agree that Richarlison is struggling but people need to stop with this Broadhead nonsense. The lad is 23 already and flopped at League One level. He is nowhere near good enough and we'd be rightly laughed at for dropping a Brazil international for him.

It's not the chewing of gum, it's the way you chew it...

You can chew gum and exude arrogance like Mason Holgate, or you can chew gum with determination, sweat & effort... like Ollie Watkins!!!

And that’s what gets results.

How many bad days at the office can you have at home in a season...?

The natural tendency of our defenders is generally to advance, stop, turn around, pass back, sideways, and concede momentum and initiative. No team has to break sweat to press Everton.

Fans or no fans, it's the same for all teams, adapt, improvise and overcome, as we do in life.

I agree totally. Aguero is a brilliant finisher. However, throughout his career (especially his 10 years at Man City) he has played in teams that have created chances for him.

This wouldn't happen in the current Everton team that creates so little from open play. He'd soon get pissed off with Richarlison's refusal to pass to him (or anyone else it seems), Iwobi's inability to put a cross into the right area etc... Need I go on?

For a while, James Rodriguez was that player for us, but his demise to debilitating injury has to be one of the leading causes for us failing to secure European football this time around.

"Who was next best?" he asked... "Urggg, ummmm, erggg! Nobody really," I said.

Home v Aston Villa and our much-maligned keeper is our best player by a mile.

Really depressing stuff!

On the defence, Mina and Godfrey should be first choice and stick with it! Keane next up and get what money we can for Holgate in the summer.

I don't want to be cruel to Iwobi but how on earth can anyone justify paying £30 million for him? His crossing is absolutely abysmal, I think the commentator said he'd scored 1 goal in the Premier League. Someone earlier said Bolasie, Walcott and Gordon would have done more and you can't argue! What about Moise Kean given a proper run?

As another aside from the commentary team, I'm sure they said Calvert-Lewin 14 Premier League goals were the most since Tony Cottee in 1992-93 surely this is not correct? Lukaku ( 2/3 times?) and Yakubu must have scored more league goals in a season?!

I only ask because young Holgate is 25 in approx 6 months.

How Davies did not start is a mystery. How he did not come on at half-time is stupidity. I love Don Carlo... but come on!

Pickford was brilliant. Mason Holgate has been getting away with that turn too often and Watkins knew it was coming.

"I wouldn't open my curtains to watch either of the current Everton or Arsenal sides."

I can't stand this dick of a pundit personally but he was probably about right based on what we are seeing.

Carlo, I fear that you won't last 5 minutes serving up this dross when the crowds are back in the stadium.

I'm always a bit cautious on putting an age on players as, like with any profession or education, players will develop mature and hit peak differently. You get freaks like Rooney who are ready made out of the box at 16, but they are rare.

Generalising, it depends on the position, but what I don't like is the current trend of ageism and determining any player of the age of 30 is done. Simply not true. Especially in the modern game.

Sigurdsson and Gomes can't tackle. Sigurdsson tracks back and covers a great distance but never gets a tackle in, while Gomes is too slow and gives fouls away and his passing is variable.

Davies has his faults but always get some good tackles in.

Gomes and Sigurdsson together has never worked, and I can't believe there's talk of Sigurdsson getting a contract extension. We need pace in the side, and Sigurdsson, Delph, Bernard and Iwobi should be moved on this summer.

Out of the top 9 teams in the division, we are the only ones not in double figures for GD, and we are at least 7 goals worse off then the next lowest GD.

We are still not good enough, we lack what the very best players give you.

I said before the game that we don't score enough goals, that's what's killing us the most. (I suppose that's stating the bleeding obvious.)

If the opposition score... we're goosed!

As for James the sick note, just get rid. We've had enough of unreliable leeches saying Everton feels like home.

I was thinking the exact same thing: How many of the current players would have got into a peak Moyes team, or the 2014-15 Martinez team? The answer is none.

We've actually gone so far backwards, it's embarrassing – and spent half a billion pounds in the process.

I pine for players such as Cahill, Arteta, Baines, Jagielka, Distin, Pienaar, Barry, Howard, Barkley, Lukaku, Mirallas, Naismith, Deulofeu, McCarthy (I could go on) – all signed for relatively small fees; all proper players who gave a shit and understood what it takes to play for Everton... unlike this current crop of shite.

No top 6 club would put up with what Carlo Fantastico has served up this season. The football has been dross and cowardly. Even the players are showing no signs of improving.

I don't care what he's done before, we have an old manager on a cushy number on £9M a year just phoning it in. Right here, right now, he's not good enough. The lack of fans have given him a free pass this season. If this kind of football continues, Goodison Park will get toxic when the fans go back.

If fat Sam was responsible for this dross, then this forum would have gone nuclear months ago.

It is interesting that none of these clubs will be looking at the likes of Koulibaly, Coutinho, Rabiot, Douglas Costa or Isco. They will carry on picking up the players everyone knows about from the Championship and the heavily scouted young talent across Europe who are on an upward trajectory with something to prove.

And funnily enough, the Rich 6 aren't even hugely interested in the aging / fading glamour signings either (possible exception of Rabiot and maybe Koulibaly). It's just us fishing in this market and to no great effect. Maybe it's our attempt to pretend to be a big, rich club instead of the mid-table club we really are.

Here is my team, but others will have their own thoughts:

Pickford
Holgate Keane Godfrey Digne
Davies Allan
James Sigurdsson King
Calvert-Lewin.

Yet another loser is joining the coaching staff to join the old boys, won sod-all team. For Christ's sake, Everton, shake the club up – get ruthless. Nice homely clubs win nothing.

It is sickening to watch multi-millionaires playing like an infants' school team.

Mr Moshiri... get ruthless! Weed out the hangers on who won sod all and get someone who'll take no shirking in the coaching team.

If you get caught with the ball outside your own area, trying to mess around instead of getting it upfield, you should be fined and dropped. Oh, hang on, we'd have no team.

A timber sawmill worker could count on the finger of each hand the number of players that do try.

And why does it really matter if we finish 9th as opposed to 7th? It matters to us obviously – but why does that matter to a man trying to build a stadium and redevelop some docks?

No-one can seem to keep the the ball or have any continual passing, the off-the-ball movement is poor compared to other teams winning at Goodison. Additionally, rotation of players and formations seems to be confusing the team.

I will give Carlo a summer window and another season. If I am still writing this in May 2022, then he will have to go. Of course, I wish him success as he is a good man but this season's home form is just inexcusable.

Just the kind of players we don't want, another set of ageing injury prone mercenaries with no love for the club.

We need to find players who are young and hungry, like Cahill and Baines.

At the start of the season, we were scoring goals for fun, played good attacking football. Now, we have turned into an Allardyce type side: very defensive, looking to hit teams on the break.

I was delighted when Carlo signed, a serial winner, a first for us, to sign a manager who was used to winning trophies, as neither Catterick nor Kendall nor Royle had done before joining us. But some of his decisions of late are really puzzling.

Why has he abandoned his centre-back pairing of Mina and Keane who were proving to be as good a pairing as there was in the Premier League?

I don't know who Carlo thinks is our best midfield... and why this insistence on getting Delph on the pitch? It is a real puzzle.

As others have mentioned, our goal difference is the worst of the Top 10 sides, and when you think how we started the season, this highlights a big problem.

James is an extremely talented player but, if he spends most of the season injured, then he can't contribute to the team.

Iwobi and Bernard have never been good enough, and the signing of Josh King is another puzzle... I mean, surely the question has to be asked: Who sanctioned this transfer? As, by the looks of it, then it certainly wasn't Ancelotti.

So, in our last 9 home games, we have collected 6 points from a possible 27; in anybody's language, that's relegation form. I know many sides are not as prolific without the fans inside, but just look at the sides who have beaten us at home – half of them have been in danger of going down.

I have no idea where we will finish in the Premier League but what I do know is, next season with fans back, they will not put up with this negative approach to games as we have shown lately. So Carlo, you have a lot of work to do in the close season; otherwise, we will be in danger of sliding to the wrong end of the table, and I don't think Moshiri will risk not being in the top division when the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock is completed.

Cahill & Baines. Admirable servants with no trophy count.

I get the sentiment, but if we want to install winning mentality, you bring in winners. Not lovers and sentiment.

Pickford
Coleman Godfrey Keane Nkounkou
Richarlison Allan Rodriguez Digne
Calvert-Lewin King.

El Ghazi, signed for about £8M from Lille has hit 8 in 23 – including the winner against us last night. Villa will buy more like him and overtake us if we stock up on the proven winners no-one else wants.

Look at Holgate's mistake – why didn't he release the ball immediately to Digne on his left? Either the player isn't good enough to do that or he isn't coached.

Then Keown said that Ancelotti will go to the transfer market this summer.

So which is it – the players or the coaching?

Put simply, our football is boring – totally and utterly boring. Were this style of football to come with a hint of success, we might tolerate it, but it isn't and it's getting worse if anything.

We trust in Carlo to get it right because he has won at Champions League level. But so did Jose Mourinho and where is he now? His reputation is in tatters and he appears to have lost the plot.

Does Carlo want to blot his copybook managing an 8th-placed team? Can he work his magic with 2nd-tier players? Lots of questions but no obvious answers.

The old joke is 'a team has more chance of qualifying for the Eurovision Song Contest ' than it has of getting into Europe's elite football competitions. Well, last night it would have been 'Everton, null points'!!

When Silva was manager, it was his fault.

When Koeman was manager, it was his fault.

When Martinez was manager, it was his fault.

When Allardyce was manager, it was his fault.

When Ancelotti is manager... it's the players' fault.

Just listen to yourselves.

I always advocate a balance of experience and potential. I don't like discounting players just because of age and the reality of the modern game is you won't get a full season out of most players.

Balance of buying players with experience and players like Godfrey.

I think our priority last summer was midfield and defence. It is likely to be both again but agree, we need something else in the creative and attacking sense. What we all knew is coming home to roost. Better first 11 when all fit but thin squad now biting us. And to be fair, the manager has to take blame for the tactics as Villa could have claimed likewise last night.

Ian, I swap Mina for Keane but other than that, not a bad call, although I don't like 4-4-2. Any update on whether Doucouré could come back in? He's training I believe? Been a big miss.

What about the fabled coaching prowess of Fantastico? Well the players seem to have regressed and he still doesn't seem to know his first choice 11.

Yesterday's performance was just simply shocking and it has Fantasticos grubby hand-prints all over it. But hey, he's been sacked by Chelsea, Real Madrid, PSG, Munich and Lazio so must be good.

I look forward to us signing some old foreign big names on over inflated wages as sweeteners as they don't really want to come here. Rinse and repeat for another season in 2021-22.

I agree 100% with those comments, we have ended up paying top 6 money to journeymen players. Aguerro, Courthino and some others named – their best days are behind them. We should be looking at players who could be the next Aguerro or David Silva.

I know a lot on here have a go at Moyes but he could spot a player and basically kept this club afloat with his astute buys that we sold for top prices and, while having to sell his best players, he still had us in the Top 8.

I posted the other day maybe managers like players have a shelf life, when you look at Capello: great CV but couldn't weave his magic with England; Van Gaal, another who couldn't get Man Utd going; of late, Mourhino has struggled to replicate what he created at Porto, Chelsea and Inter.

Maybe Carlo is going through that same cycle of not being able to create at Everton what he did at a lot of his previous clubs. Maybe what worked for these managers early in their careers just isn't relevant today who knows.

As you say, extreme illness requires extreme medicine.

We have been ill for 30 years. It won't be fixed in 12 months. Chances are in 30 months we see ourselves on a more stable footing.

Hope. Why, even in the midst of a dreadful result and display, do I always have hope?

Holgate needs dropping, he just doesn't read danger, Watkins ran our defense ragged. At no point did Carlo see the problem. If your defense is being cut to ribbons, you need to cut out the feed for the runners.

Collectively, we are shite at the moment. I love Seamus but so many of our goals conceded are similar – not closing down and turning our backs or side on. Closedown, take the ball in the face if necessary.

There is so much wrong with us at the moment. We played open last night and got what we deserved. The current squad can't go toe to toe with anybody in this league, that is why Carlo has garnered points playing cautious pragmatic football away from home.

It's now 4 wins needed, ever the optimist. I think I need medication.

Aguero is a different kettle of fish, a lot of clubs utilise a striker in their thirties as a complimentary player. Filling rotating a goal scoring substitution. To me Aguero comes into this class of player, a player to compliment and supplement and attacking group of players a top six club needs. I'd have him for this role in a heartbeat.

Elsewhere, we still need that midfielder and right sided forward we bang on about week after week, year after year. These players have to bring new energy and dynamism into the team, along with technical ability.

Moyes got our best squad together in the last 20 years, despite having little money.

Martinez inherited it but his tactics and style of play was a mismatch for those players. He had a lucky first year in charge and then the downward spiral started.

Koeman, Silva, Allardyce all suffered from a poor squad of players and it’s the same now for Ancelotti. Ancelotti has found a pragmatic, defensive style which he employs often (not yesterday) which has got us results against teams we’ve sat back against. That style has been mostly out of necessity though as he simply hasn’t got the players to play a high energy, press, attack style game. I’m sure he knows that and we will see some new, much more dynamic, midfielders come in, along with a right back this summer.

Carlo: Hi Hamez, how are you doing?

James: Hey boss, long time no speak.

Carlo: Fancy joining me here at Everton FC?

James: Who are Everton FC? Don't know who they are...

Carlo: A Club in Liverpool, they wear Blue and White. Just to clarify, you won't be playing for them, so don't get your hopes up.

James: Oh right hmmmmm... I'm not sure, boss, plus it's cold in England.

Carlo: Don't worry, James, it's very easy here. You can earn big wages with no pressure and expectation. They think they are a big club but it's laughable really. I'm on £9M a year. Plus if you want, we can agree that if it feels a bit cold, we can just say you are injured, so just play when it suits. Honestly, boy they didn't see us coming, even my son is here. Big wages, no expectation, and an easy cruise to a Top 10 finish is like winning a trophy for them.

James: Okay, boss, let me think on it.

Carlo: Okay. I'll email the proposed contract.

James: How much money!!!! Okay I'll sign.

Carlo: Fantastico, James!!! Plus all the players are rubbish so you are guaranteed to look good, and if any problems behind the scenes with board we can just blame the rubbish players, lots of them.

James: I live stream Call of Duty games so can't play most days?

Carlo: No problemmo, James… I'm sure we can invent an injury?

James: Fantastico!!!

What we need are very talented U23 types who will fill the circa 3 spots in the first team and give us a bench that is not just making up the numbers but genuinely pushing for a first team spot and, before too long, will overtake the first team players.

That might mean O'Neil instead of Douglas Costa. Or Olise instead of Isco. Or Sima instead of Aguero. It doesn't do much for the vanity but the squad would be in better shape for the next 5 years at least.

That's where I coming from, Tony; absolute short-term thinking. Do something here and now. I think someone like Aguero, who still has a couple of years in him (admittedly limited game time) compliments someone like Calvert-Lewin, both as a partner striker and on the training ground.

But, I do agree with your point on building for the future so we don't end up with the situation we have now of trying to clear out deadwood and having to consider overrated deadwood as good.

We need a centre back. I hope the Koulibaly rumours have legs.

We need to throw the net wider. We need pace, power and purpose.

We need a fast right back, who can defend.

We need a left-footed central defender, with pace, so we can play a higher defensive line (at home).

We need a powerful, pacy, right-footed attacker.

We need two central midfielders, who can pass and move, have a bit of pace and are powerful.

We need another striker. A quick and powerful striker.

That's 6 players by my count. Not fucking two.

Financial constraints mean we'd need to off-load at least six as a counter measure:

Mina or Holgate or Keane (not arsed which tbh)
Iwobi
Sigurdsson or James (not arsed which – I'm actually fucking furious James thinks he can just pick and chose which games he fancies playing in... fuck him)
Delph
Gomes
Bernard
King

The above will never happen in one window. Mainly because every club and it's mascot knows how fucking shite our players are!

The team needs a shot of adrenaline that these players will bring. (As long as they are not Sandro Ramirez types that is!) They'll need to be very well sourced and properly scouted no good getting a “bargain” that turns into another ball and chain.

I think we should be willing to spend a bit more than we would like on proven talent from he Championship. Say Aarons, Buendia, Sarr. It should be noted that Godfrey was probably our best signing in the last window. (And he didn't come as a cast off from a greedy 12 club.)

There's a staleness about the team that won't go away. Only these type of signings are going to change it.

The trouble is we either can't afford them or they don't want to come (Zaha only grudgingly perhaps because having turned us down 2 years ago he still finds himself at Palace with time running out).

If we got Aguero and Coutinho we could be paying £300k per week for an extra 4 goals in our goals scored column. Koulibaly is a bit different I agree, but a better version of Mina is not what we need to beat the likes of Villa, Fulham, Newcastle etc.

He'd bring DCL on no end.
Hes hardly played this season so will be fresh as a daisy.
You can't teach what Aguero has and thats a strikers instinct and players like him never lose that.
DCL is not a natural striker, he'll score goals but he's manufactured, not instinctive.

Under Moshiri we have had Martinez, Koeman, Silva and Allardyce and now Ancelotti. and all have been given money to spend, yet making top 6 seems to be classed as a good season. But would Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea or our neighbours see that as a good season no, if they did the manager would be sacked and that's the difference in expectation in us and them. Ambramovich come in for terrible stick for sacking Lamphard, but he brings in Tuchel and are now in the FA Cup final and probably the champions league final, I bet there arent to many Chelsea fans criticizing Abramovich now.

If that was us teary eyed Bill would have made sure Lampard lasted the season and more. But Abramovich pulled the plug and reaped the rewards. There is no such thing as loyalty in football just cold hard results.

Its about expectation and what you are happy to accept. Levy wasn't happy with a euro quarterfinal, his team in 5th, and a cup final and pulled the trigger on Mourinho.

Ancelotti is all about safety and stability for Moshiri. A safe pair of hands financially rewarded to not rock the boat and steer us into the safe waters of the top 10 each season while BMD is being built. Nothing more, sadly he's going nowhere.

After all the hype and hyperbole from some on here and I include myself in the early months, Ancelotti has proved he doesn't have the ability, fire and motivation to move us up a level. Look at the progress Rodgers is making with Leicester as a comparison. What has shocked me is how poor some of our performances have been. At times we've looked disorganised and clueless and happy to take a point from kick off against teams below us. Not what you would expect from the godfather of football.

Without a doubt our squad is poor and unbalanced. Gomes, SIggy, Delph, Iwobi and Bernard have no long term future at the club. Allan and James have been in and out with injuries with the only highlights being Doucoure and Godfrey.

Question marks remain over Keane, Mina, the arrogant Holgate and Coleman (could it be one season too far for him). Plus the erratic scoring form of DCL and the scowling Richarlison it doesn't look good for the 20/21 season. Richarlison needs to seriously step up and DCL needs to score more with his feet.

Nail on the head Brian.

How many of our players could get a game for City, Chelsea etc.

No pace in the midfield, I bet they can run to the bank with their cheques than they can on the field. Teamwise and tactics we are so poor, we have a team of Toffees with pretty wrappings and shitty tasting caramel inside.

Rant over. Off to take the dog for a walk and pick his shit up, but I'm use to that normally wears blue though...

The players might believe they are due to their inflated salaries, but we have bought too many high profile flops.

Good luck to West Ham and Moyes. They are the story of the season for me.

Very few unfortunately

1. Back the manager when he says "It is a long term project, if we are patient it will work."

2. Sack him and start again (again).

I didn't see Keown's assessment so can't be sure, but to blame coaching for Holgate's error would surely only apply if you mean the players are told they should never simply resort to just leathering it anywhere upfield or into the stands, even when put under pressure.

I doubt any coach would make that demand, so for me it comes down to situations where the player has to decide whether it's safety first or that he can still wriggle out of danger. Holgate simply chose badly for me.

Much later on in the game, Holgate opted for a very tight turn when a Villa player was right on top of him. It worked out and I haven't seen any adverse comments about it.

People judge things too much on ‘outcomes' for me. A player has to be reasonably frequently ending up looking daft before you can say they have an insurmountable problem with attitude.

I'd like Aguero as a player and on the coaching team, More so on the coaching team. Richarlison & Calvert-Lewin would both benefit from his nous, he is one of the best finishers I've seen.

I just hope we can do our complaining in a new ground.

We can be stuck in mid-table mediocrity for ever more, and plod along, happy in the knowledge that we won't win anything or qualify for Europe, but also won't get relegated.

I wouldn't mind making an approach for Gilmour, who's not a regular at Chelsea. He's young, aggressive, has pace, and would add bite in midfield.

As for Coutinho, he's only a mercenary now, and past his best. Aguero a class act, but he's missed a lot of games this season with injury, would it be a risk worth taking?

Since his injury problems, Mason has been a shadow of the tidy player of recent times. Incidentally, his gum-chewing might not be part of an arrogant hardman image, it could be nervousness, who knows? However, as Keane has been dropped with various "injury" issues, it seems that Holgate has had the benefit of the doubt.

Indeed, poor Tom Davies has been overlooked whilst Allan stinks the place out with the terrible pairing of Gomes and Sigurdsson. For me, the obvious position for Sigurdsson with James out, was in a No 10 role, even if it meant dragging Richarlison back to the left.

Was that a "Diamond" that they were trying to play? It was hard to tell.

The experience of going to prison for head butting a player? The experience of not training as a player? The experience of missing more games that James due to niggling injuries? The experience of being part of three other failed management crews? Or the experience of being an animated cheerleader for two games last year?

The best thing I’ve read was Barkley, looked like he was in a training session, but wonder why? Newcastle, Fulham, Leeds, West Ham, and now Villa, have been afforded the freedom of Goodison Pk this season, whilst Burnley actually looked like Brazil, in the first half at Goodison, because of a dreadful system that leaves big gaps in the middle of the park, and is very easy to play against

Noticeable that players like Davies and Keane, who Carlo has "improved beyond measure", can't get a game. Players who had improved before he got here, like Richarison and Holgate, are going backwards, probably because they are shunted here, there and everywhere.

Our football has been the worst in the Premier League. There has been no justification for the cowardly anti-football we have had to endure.

Watching the much derided Barkley lead our much vaunted "Brazilian Peter Reid" a merry dance merely underlined the fanboy mentality which has crept into this club.

The sooner the crowds get back, the sooner Carlo GetFoundOutio will be on his way.

Who would you replace him with, Darren?

So he’s going for Little and Large? I’d have thought he’s more of a Chuckle Brothers man

Felt sorry for Allan - poor fucker trying to do the job of 3 men - he is not the problem btw.

should we be thankful that we had a chance of Europe with 5 games left, is that an improvement enough ? Only if we actually took it otherwise this season is a bit of a failure.

🎣🎣🎣🎣

I put those names forward FIVE fucking years ago. They were an alternative to your chosen one. Big Sam - "Sams got this"

I was right too. Your boy was a fucking nightmare.

BTW; Thomas Richards didnt even post on TW back then. You didnt appear until John G Davies disappeared

I`ll always stand by what I said.....

There’s no continuity so the arse doesn’t know what the elbow is doing. Players haven’t gelled, and there’s no positional understanding of teammates or instinctive awareness between each other.

I don’t think he still knows what the best defensive line up is.
The midfield should be renamed the minefield. Nobody ever knows what the line up will be.

I know injuries are partly to blame but a lot of the time they’re not.

All this chopping and changing is resulting in a team that is playing like a bunch of strangers that have just met in the park.

We need a core way of playing and players to know and be responsible or their roles within it. They can then more easily concentrate on improving.

That way the team and its identity can take root. Maybe then we can start making sustained progress based on a solid foundation.

Coming to the game, Aston Villa fully deserved to win, no question about it. They wanted it more, they were more skilful, and man-to-man, I would swap out their entire starting XI yesterday with ours - even Pickford who played brilliantly yesterday is matched by Martinez, who is an equally good keeper. We could have played for another 180 minutes, and I am sure we wouldn't have scored another goal. Yes, Holgate's mistake cost us a goal, but the game was definitely lost because Villa were better in every department.

Watkins vs Calvert-Lewin?
Traore vs Richarlison?
Douglas Luiz vs Allan?
Barkley vs Iwobi?
Scott McGinn vs Gomes?
El Mohammedy's sublime strike vs the lame efforts of Siggursdsson?

Need I go on?

I seriously don't know where we go from here? The more I think of it, the more I am convinced that it is a coaching problem. Even Sam Allardyce has got a tune of a West Brom team, which was looking hopeless before Christmas. I really, really do not want to see us change our manager, I desperately want Carlo Ancellotti to succeed. I like his pleasant personality and demeanour, but he has got to turn things around quickly.

Call it an over-reaction, but I have been idly thinking about next season, and who might get relegated - Norwich and Watford who have got promoted have good managers. Possibly the 3rd team that comes up may go back down. The other 2 ? Burnley, Brighton, Newcastle, maybe? Are Everton really that much better than these teams? At the moment, I don't think so! (Sorry for being so negative in this post!)

99% of Evertonians already knew that. but I guess you miss a lot when you spend all the time apologising for what has happened since

Yes or No ?

and your choice of manager 5 years ago was Sam Allardyce.

No and no

At it again

🎣🎣

At least you offered a name.

How can we expect to win games when there is so much negativity within this fan base. Call yourselves supporters, it’s constant doom and gloom, a black cloud permanently hanging in the air over the football stadium, no wonder we are where we are... Supporters continuously complaining, if this poor support persists then we will be stuck mid table forever more..

Another season of Ancelotti as manager will lead to more bizarre team selections.

Are you trying to be funny? I’m doom and gloom for not wanting to sack our manager? The black cloud as you say is the one I’m arguing against. But somehow you’re Mrs joy by wanting to sack the coach and replace him with an unproven man whose track record is littered with controversy?

Bang out of order that by the way.

As pissed off as I am with last night's result and recent home performances / results, the last time I looked, we weren't staring down a relegation abyss, we were looking at potential European qualification. We still are. Somehow.

I'm an Evertonian and will support the players and the manager through thick and thin, like the great Howard Kendall once wrote, it's a marriage isn't it, not a love affair.

I believe in my heart we are the best Club in the world and will continue to manifest that great things will come, and yes I believe Duncan Ferguson will be and should be the next manager, and a great Everton manager he will be.

why not share why you feel Ancelotti is the right choice rather than the "Who instead" angle. It's completely moot and serves as no endorsement of Ancelotti whatsoever, any more than it addresses the concerns of those unhappy with his performance.

But with the Germany and Bayern jobs recently going, I don't see Klopp going anywhere soon now.

The chances are diminishing, but we could still qualify for Europe. That's an improved position to where we were 12 months ago. Next season we expect further improvement on top of that. Ancelotti is here for 3 years or so. Some will never like that, but that's how I view it. I just hope / believe he leaves us in a better position than what he inherited.

So mine isn't just the "who instead" angle.

What I do find bizarre is a view that says a manager should be replaced, without having any idea who should be on a shortlist as replacement (or be unwilling to say what that shortlist should be).

I wouldn’t get Gerard for several reasons one of which being that he is a hot head with an ill disciplined team. That apart, since Fergie Scotland hasn’t proved to be a great testing ground for EPL managers. You can go back to Billy McNeil even, great at Celtic got two clubs relegated in one season in England. Then you have your Lennon’s, Strachans, Smith, Souness, McKinley etc Unless Gerard wins something in Europe I’d say his next step is to prove himself in the championship.

Just a thought.

Everyone knows you didnt call for anybody to be sacked. Thats just the local crack pot doing what he does. Lying. I don't think he realises there is a scroll button..

He`s on another thread lying that I had been campaigning for Arteta to get the job instead of Carlo. Simply not true. Nothing against Arteta, but from day one I wanted Big Dunc to keep the gig until the end of the season. Said it often enough

Will Mahon

Nail on the head

Eddie Howe

Not sure on Nkounkou but yesterday had the feel of the Burnley game from the get home so yes I’d have liked to see Carlo try something different be it King earlier, anyone but Delph. With that being said, he’s in a better position than me to judge the players but being hopeful I’d have liked to see him mix it up

Ok people might say the others are not ready, we will never know, unless they get some longer game time.

Can they be any worse than what we are seeing at the moment, why not mix it up a bit, try something different from the bench, try some different tactics like you say Jeff.

Other teams have sussed us out, go to the player with the ball and wait for the ball to be played backwards, they then regroup and apart from the hopeful punt upfield, Everton have no one to take players on, in the midfield.

Most of our attacks come from Richarlison, Digne overlaps, when was the last time we did not turn and go backwards, sometimes we have gone from just outside an opponents penalty area,all the way back to our goalkeeper, no one is prepared to even try to go past a player from our midfielders.

Fair enough do not try it in our own defence, but in midfield, they have defenders who can cover a mistake from the opponents half, too much safety first and not enough belief either from the players, or from the ones who are instructing the players to go safety first.

We need to try something different, mix it up a bit, try different tactics and at least try and mix it up from the bench.

that experimental angle is a possibility though a path rarely trodden that I'm aware. We aren't going down, we aren't winning anything, Europe is really not for us with our present squad (much as I love the idea), so our current position is probably the compromise option alas.

This said, I have to say I can't see any progress from such experimentation or otherwise. I was kind of expecting some eye opening tactical cameos, enlightened maximization of what we already have in terms of players. Change, improvement, tightening of the basics, professionalism etc. whatever the results. If something's happening unseen toward some esoteric plinth-building, it's beyond me.

I don't want to continue the manager merry-go-round, it's a road to nowhere (in the absence of unlimited funds). Another season and some more players - talk of eight, 10 or more, that isn't happening. If we're all honest though, I suspect most people were expecting more by this stage.

Jury's out - for now.

Granted Jeff, it could and probably should have been better, but the final part of your final paragraph sums it up, "The hand he was dealt with". Ancelotti didn't sign the likes of Delph, Iwobi, Sigurdsson, Bernard, Walcott, Tosun, Bolasie, players everyone has been screaming "Are shite, deadwood, need to get rid of ASAP" So yes, you're right, the "Hand he was dealt with". He's got no choice but to play some of them.

He's been in charge for sixteen months, most of which has been in very unusual circumstances, and for me, has had a major impact on not just us, but every club. I agree that some team selections, substitutions have been baffling. What's with the sudden love affair with Delph? Carlo needs time and a couple more summer transfer windows at least to sort things out, or else it will go on for ever more. Bring in new manager then two years later sack him and another new manager etc etc etc etc.

Serious question for everyone, if we had won ten home games and only five away games, even taking away some of the wins at our hoodoo grounds, would that change anyone's feelings towards Ancelotti, or is it totally irrelevant?

Will, I think that's very fair comment. I don't think anybody would disagree with that.

When Howe's name cropped up during the debate when Allardyce came. I said I would take Him all day over Allardyce. I still would.
I made it very clear at the time that I wanted Unsworth to carry on guiding us to safety.

This is a different scenario. We have not just sacked the manager - unfortunately. We have no idea who will even be in the frame. Those wanting names just want a hypothetical argument. one which they cant lose - for once.

Wont happen. There are at least a dozen I could name who I would rather have than Ancelotti. But your still making shite up from five years ago. You'll get no encouragement from me.

Ancelotti out.!!!!!

Truth is Rob, IMHO, it's been a hard one to read in some ways, this season. Flying start, early player improvements, some good away wins, terrible home games/form, frequent awful, non-descript "Style" of play, and some definite reverses.

Perm it any way - but what concerns me is the fire-fighting nature that's come more to the fore with time. I don't know what we're aiming at, but I was hoping for a professional, structured underpinning, is the best way I can describe it - a kind of chassis. Not seeing that at all.

Sit back and hold on tight for another season I guess...

Results aside, the way that Carlo's team has played for most of his time in the hot-seat has left a lot to be desired.

Gerrard here though, ever, in any universe – NEVER!

Darren, mate, you said after Sam had been left us that you would be happy with Howe.

The list of keeps is pretty limited, whereas the list of get rids is absolutely huge. Keane, Mina, Pickford, Coleman, Holgate, Gomes, Bernard, Sigurdsson, Delph, Davies, Iwobi, Kean, Kenny, Tosun, Walcott, Bolasie, Besic, Gbamin, and King. All a complete waste of money and all robbing a living on a routine basis.

We lack pace throughout the side, can't pass a sentence, don't score goals outside of the front two, have no heart, and gift away cheap goals for fun. In summary we are still fucking terrible after spending near £500m on transfer fees and paying these jokers over £100k per week or £5m a season for utter shite.

Sacking Carlo isn't the answer. It's clearing the decks of the utter shite we've squandered top dollar on.

This isn't Kendall mk3 when we are buying rubbish like Mitch Ward, we've paid top dollar for players that are clueless under multiple managers.

Ancelotti is trying to get a tune out of a mix of Koeman, Silva, and Allardyce misfits – only 2 Ancelotti signings were on the pitch on Saturday.

What has been proven is the current team are not intelligent enough to manage an expansive game plan – unless it is a defensive "don't move out of position" instruction.

Winning at Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool in my opinion gives Ancelotti credit for another season at least.

Give Rhino 6 months and he'll have Holgate playing like Ratcliffe and Iwobi like Trevor Steven.

The absolutism of some about the club in general, the manager, the players, the tactics. The petty name-calling towards TWers who don’t share your views. The childish historical and long-running vendettas between individual posters in which actual football discussion is secondary at best, or completely ignored at worst. The schoolyard argument by gainsay: ‘Did too! Did not!

Soren @ 397, you are and can be an Evertonian if you check just one or all that you list. Equally, you can be an Evertonian if you legitimately challenge someone who expresses an opinion stating all that you list. To claim otherwise on either side of that divide is yet another example of individual absolutism that just stifles genuine debate.

People are different. Diverse. Because you hold a contrarian position to another does not automatically qualify you as right, insightful and wiser, and the other wrong, blinded and stupid.

My own personal starting position is: I support Everton.

As such I only ever want – as the NSNO motto states – the very best for my club. For decades now we have fallen well short of NSNO.

The club, its guardians, its employees, do not get a free pass from me because I support Everton.

I have criticised Bill Kenwright’s stewardship. The lack of investment and proper planning to have Everton competing at the very top in the PL era. The proposed move to Kirkby. Moshiri’s largesse in the transfer market. I have been both supportive and critical of different managerial and DoF appointments. Been bewildered and delighted by different (sometimes even the same!) Everton players. Questioned the tactics and in-game management of every appointed manager. Get as seriously frustrated as any Evertonian at this season’s appalling home form, whilst delighting in and enjoying the best-ever away form in the PL era. I am heartily pissed, as a result of the previous, at the countless spurned opportunities this season to really cement not just a top six place, but a top four finish. Time and again it has been in our hands…and we have dropped the ball each time.

I will add that I am exceedingly proud of EiTC and how the club conducted themselves last October with the soiled six’s ‘Big Project Reset’ initiative and again more recently following the announcement of the ESL breakaway.

It is my belief that Carlo Ancelotti with the team sitting where it is in the league will not be going anywhere soon, so anyone calling for his dismissal be prepared to be disappointed. His position will only be questioned by Farhad Moshiri should next season or the subsequent one we find ourselves in a relegation fight.

It is my belief that given the difficult situation he inherited, that Marcel Brands is finally seeing clear water ahead in which he can shape the club going forward in the same positive way as he influenced his previous clubs. It is my belief that part of Brands’ remit is already being implemented at the Academy in which all teams are fielding aggregately younger teams, with ‘older’ youth players being sent out on loan or released.

It is my belief that Moshiri will see the construction of BMD to completion. How the deflection of monies towards that project impacts on our ability to recruit in the transfer market, I have no idea. But that’s why he is a billionaire and why he has recruited some very capable people to achieve that, beyond those overseeing the actual football.

Now I could be totally wrong in my stated beliefs. It doesn’t make me a happy clapper, a sycophant, someone easily misled and pleased. If you think otherwise, fine. But put up good rationale and reasoning as to why so genuine debate results.

Not every thread needs to rapidly degenerate into a Scouse Wedding and verbally poking someone in the chest all the time. It’s so frigging tiresome.

Not seen that on this thread.

The reception gaff in Bootle was like a war zone. Police involved, the full monty. Surprised E-Squadron weren't called!

What goes down on here is more like duelling handbags at 50 paces than a scouse wedding.

Can’t disagree with any of that and am culpable of tedious feuding. I really don’t enjoy it and forthwith I shall try to abstain

'Scouse Wedding' is a commonly used euphemism. Take it literally, if you want.

No question we need a back-up right-back, with age catching up, but Coleman owes Everton absolutely nothing, he has given everything to our football club.

The criticism of Scottish football on here is o=ver the top, although I suspect some is done in jest. But I think the SPL isn't a good pathway to the EPL due to the set-up.

In terms of the fan base, finances, appeal to players, and finances of the club, it's kind of like if you had a 10-team league featuring Everton, Spurs and 8 teams along the lines of Wycombe and Yeovil.

Managing Aberdeen or Hibs is a world away from managing the players/finances at even the likes of Crystal Palace. Managing one of the big two doesn't prepare you for a situation where you have about 8 similarly-sized rivals, some able to attract the best players in the world, plus 11 other not-as-big, but still strong clubs.

Smith came from having the biggest budget in a two-horse race to having a decent budget (for about 3 months) in a much wider field. Totally different dynamic. And I think that's why it would be a better path for an SPL manager to try his luck in the lower leagues in England, or a more competitive foreign league before coming straight into the EPL.

I could never support Everton if that arsehole had anything to do with us, I fucking detest him.

Jumped on the high horse when his Rangers player was racially abused, and rightly so.

Why he wore the tee-shirt supporting Suarez after he was proved to have racially abused Evra is another story...

To call his loyalties as an Evertonian into question simply because he disagrees with you is deplorable and you should apologise.

The negativity on this and every other EFC web site I have been on today, stems from the negativity on the pitch which in turn comes from the negativity of the management.

NSNO is what we all want for OUR club, we have differing opinions as to how this utopian ideal is to be achieved, if you can't have a sensible debate without hurling unfounded insults, stay away.

In fairness Mary is quite right in pointing out that "big" Dunc now "epitomises" us as a club. He does indeed. After all, he's a player who ripped Everton (and every other one of his clubs) off throughout his entire "career" with an endless list of carefully, repetitively, and therefore eminently predictable timed "injuries", allied to a taste to achieve fully paid-up suspensions on a level that exceeds addiction (and that's apart from his criminal thuggery).

And yet Kenwright bought it, again and again and again. He still buys it. He still buys all the other ex-player (mostly unqualified) "coaches" that infest USMFF too.

I used to hope that Marcel Brands knew coaches who appreciated the importance of ball control, accurate passing, body positioning, accurate shooting and covering, and that such folk would be signed on.

Hopefully this summer will also see a raft of sackings and new signings in the disturbed world, provably for decades, on USMFF training pitches.

We may have had differing opinions on James McCarthy in the past but, that apart, I pretty much agreed with all that you posted and had to say; I wish you all the best.

And you were more than right on that waster, Fabian Delph. For the life of me, I do not see what Carlo Ancelotti sees in this player. If he continues to pick him, he is simply tightening the noose around his own neck at Everton. A garbage player.

Best wishes, Christy.

I am certainly not in any click, quite a few individuals here put some great posts on, I would certainly not challange anyone, unless I thought the need to do so.

I am not sure who the clique is, to be honest, but I have always enjoyed reading some of your posts, as I have with other posters.

I feel it really sad if anyone is driving you away from this forum and would ask you to reconsider, as I am sure other posters will as well.

If I need to get anything off my chest, whether it is a performance-related comment, or disagree with a viewpoint, it does not mean I am right, I just say it as it is.

That is the beauty of this forum, we all see things differently, but we are all one big family of Evertonians.

Hope you keep posting, Christy.

You're a gentleman and a scholar. I'm going to bid farewell for a while too.

Your point above is (nearly) the whole key question.

What irks people is, in general, Home games are supposed to be 'easier' than Away games. This is where you pick up points, though in reality not championships - these are won...sometimes drawn, but not so much now, on cold wet Tuesday's at Stoke or Saturdays (as was...remember them?) at Leicester or some such.

Imagine if the news outlets were going on about Evertons 'recent poor home form'...'only' one win and 5 draws from the last six!

What irks people is the fact they can see that with a usually very poor Home Game gain of 1 win and 5 draws from all of these losses, we're up there with the bigger boys and there will probably be a confidence boost to go with it too.

We're not winning at all, so let's drop down to the next default setting - Not Losing...go back to the 4 Amigos across the back - KITAP1...and I'm not too arsed on the P1 bit either, if it means not losing.
No crowd to get in the Players, Managers, Owners, backs...just a load of internet based top balcony cushion throwers.

But what do I know?
I know I don't like losing, I prefer winning...even with OGs...at a pinch though, I'll take draws over losses.

But as has been said, you can't go repeatedly sacking managers.

But the other side is - just how long do you go.

Buggered if I know, that Moshiri's job...his job, but our worry.
*Throws Internet Cushion in frustrstion*.

I understand that the squad are professionals, and prefer winning to losing. This ongoing narrative of “Fire the coach” or “Bench so-and-so because he's a bum” is useless. I have to believe that, as much as we the fans want success on the field, everyone employed by the club want it more.

A win is not the best thing that ever happened. A loss is not the end of the world.

I enjoy watching the Blues play... win or lose.

I think we are all feeling frustration at the number of opportunities given to us and then spurned.

We have for a few years now had a very poor quality MF with no goals to contribute, Ineffective passing and vision and a general lack of energy.

I believe Carlo recognized this and with a limited budget brought in Allan, Doucoure and Rodriguez which while helping the problem has never totally solved it due to injuries and loss of form by the likes of Richy.

I believe if we had retained Gana and not brought Gbamin in we would be much better off and more consistent because other teams have learned we have a soft center.

In terms of overall squad quality we are light years away from the RS, Chelsea, Spurs and even Arsenal who have had a worse season than us.

Personally I don't see any improvement until 3 or 4 quality additions are made that can play football and score goals.

This current squad has a few decent players but lacks mental toughness and application in key areas and when we have injuries the imbalance in the team shows through.

Put Pep, Tuchel or Klopp in charge of this lot and IMO they would do no better.

He has been a rare constant glimmer of class going back to the Moyes days. I don't put him in a robbing a living class like many of his team mates, but it is clear he's coming to the end of playing at a top level. Can he play a back up role? Absolutely. But the rest can go as far as I am concerned.

For all those that slag off Anchelotti, I don't think there is any manager in the world that would get a tune out of that lot. We can keep changing the managers, but it ain't going to make Sigurdsson more visible, Keane any quicker, or Iwobi more productive etc. We have assembled a poor squad, and largely wasted big money that we've raised on Lukuku, Stones, Gana. Things need to change.

Hopefully you will miss ToffeeWeb as well, best wishes to both of you.

The variety and diversity of views and opinions on here are what makes it.

If everyone agreed on everything all of the time life would be mundane.

We all agree on one thing, we just differ on our opinions on the thing that binds us together.

Keep posting.

We've all got one thing in common: we all love Everton... and, because of that, all fair-minded opinions should be respected, whether you agree or disagree with them. Snide, personal comments say a million times more about those posting them than the recipient – brush them off.

Take a day or two and come back when the dust settles.

The first being that he is a proven multiple winner including in England, that act's with real class and dignity. He doesn't lose his cool when all around him have lose the plot.

Secondly, I can't think of anyone else I would trust more to improve the results and performances.
We all start with, "it will take 2 or 3 seasons to clear the under performing player's and bring in suitable replacements." Lets give our world class manager some more time.

I understand there comes a time to act but this was not a risky appointment in the mould of Martinez, Koeman or Silva. No more punts on unproven managers. I certainly wouldn't want Mourinho or his type either.

I would like to see action in demanding only the best. I think Holgate could develop into a very good defender, but his mistake should be highlighted as unacceptable and be dropped. We need to set higher standards.

Likewise Ric has underperformed for months. King to replace him.

Pickford, Keane, Siggy have all been 'rested' at some point recently. Siggy came back improved. Keane didn't and Pickford.. jury is still out.

You only have to look at after each match people praise and critisize different players, so it just shows how diverse opinion is but that's what makes this site so good. And Christy, as you rightfully say, we are all Evertonians who all want the club to succeed – just differ how best to achieve that, and having watched your uncle wear the blue of Everton, I am sure his advice would be: stay and express your opinions – and the same for Kieran.

Also there are some wind up merchants who take things too far at times, and I totally disagree with any comments that denigrate to personal abuse and name calling. Can I just remind the guilty, and you know who you are, we are all supporting the same side here Everton FC.

Like I said before, because the team are underperforming, or letting us down in any way, it is not the fault of anyone on TW, because they have suggested a different starting line -up or different substitutions, and in most cases it is justified.

We are not expected to agree on every single issue, and having differing opinions is healthy, otherwise we would all be robots, but please can we act like comrades and not enemies?

Oh, and man up, Ring...sorry, I'll rephrase that...stop hanging around Christy...No, that's not it either. In true Everton tradition, suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, 1914, 1939,1985 and get on with it!

I'm wondering how much confidence and momentum is playing in our fragile performances. Take Richarlison. (No, please have 'im!) What's happened to him? He's obviously not become a bad player overnight, so is he drained of confidence or motivation, or both?

Then there's Digne, last season arguably the best left-back in the Premier League; this season just about (and only just) the best left-back at the club.

And then there's momentum; let's play Football Manager, what would be your best XI with the squad available, assuming they're all bang in form (I'm excluding Gbamin). I'll give two: 4-3-3 and 3-5-2.

Pickford; Coleman, Mina, Godfrey, Digne; Davies, Doucouré, Allan, Rodriguez, Calvert-Lewin, Richarlison.

Or 3-5-2: Pickford; Holgate, Mina, Godfrey; Coleman, Allan, Doucouré, Rodriguez, Digne; Calvert-Lewin, Richarlison.

If your side(s) looks anything like that, the 4-3-3 side have never played together, and I don't think the 3-5-2 have either. Now injuries are never an excuse, but they can be a reason for not being able to have any consistency in play or results; you only have to look across Stanley Park to see a world-beating team look like a team devoid of confidence not knowing know where the next win's coming from.

To state the bleedin' obvious, the squad just isn't good enough, and there needs to be both a clear out of the usual suspects and a more balanced approach to recruitment – one or two of them who can run would be nice. But I think the major surgery should be in pruning the squad rather than a "5 out, 5 in" approach, we did that a few years ago and the team played like strangers.

I would be delighted if we sorted out the RB problem, and added a pacy winger, my preference would be Leon Bailey and a striker, even Aquero would be a great backup option or to bring on with 20 mins to go.

But once again we come to the end of a season that I can't wait for it to end, we've been saying big transfer window is needed, this time it's real.

With the centre-backs we have, we have to sit deep. And, those you mention have mistakes in them. As I suppose every footballer does but, at this level, you expect better.

If it is me (and it isn't), I see us selling Mina and replacing with better quality. That is because we stand more chance of there being interest in Mina.

Keane and Holgate become our backup next season.

When we do buy players, they are not wanted by the best four or five clubs; if they were, they wouldn't be signing for us!

We have to break that cycle somehow; the only way I can see that happening is to offer silly money to the very best players. It would cost a mountain of cash but how else are we going to bridge the gap?

We keep hoping for the best but, as someone said previously rather crudely, you can't polish a turd.

We have a good team but, once we're missing a few, we replace with less quality.

The importance is to build the squad, not just the first 11.

Me too. We have one centre-half in the squad who could play for a Top 4 side.

I would look to get rid of Keane and Holgate at the earliest opportunity. Holgate will never be capable of playing for a top team.

Kieran might have more of an issue as it was the sharp-tongued Mary Coleman who seems to have poked him in the chest. I have absolutely no truck with anyone who uses that "Call yourself an Evertonian" crap or comes out with the utterly self-righteous "Call yourselves supporters" – so belittling anyone who dares question anything. Then hides behind the "Let's all get behind the team and the manager" call.

No, sorry, not having that.

Looks like Mason will still be here when Carlo goes...

But rather than wait for that, I think we need something ready made, here and now alongside Godfrey, who despite being younger than Mason looks great and will be ready younger.

I'll be honest, my fear is keeping hold of Godfrey, just like we failed to do so with Stones.

He could have told the truth and been stuck with him. Not many managers around who would say "He is hopeless, no concentration, no awareness of players making runs off him. Gets caught in possession too often." But that wouldn't be the sales pitch required.

Ancelotti said a similar thing about Tom Davies recently. I would have a fair-sized wager that neither of them will start the first game of next season

Tom Davies I see as being more around the first team as he has improved with better players around him and benefited from more stability in the management set up. But, I think there is unanimous agreement we need / want improvement in that department too.

Keep digging

So many laughable candidates mentioned by the critics of Ancelotti, but who knows? We have so many absurd and stupid decisions for 25 years, it is within the realms of possibility that we will sack one of the most successful managers in history after 16 months.

No wonder fans from other clubs laugh at us.

City have a habit of making those kind of moves. A young Delph? Rodwell? Players they didn't need but make up the "home grown" quota?

I agree with you, but it wouldn't surprise me.

Pep wanted Mason. Carlo told him hands off. Carlo may be a game spoiler, but he knows a player when he see's one - He's inherited enough of them. And Pep been known to sign the odd decent player . Perhaps they should have consulted Brown and Richards.

Law of averages n all that

But, the more you look at him, is he more of a traditional sweeper who sits in front of the centre backs than a centre back himself?

Is that what Pep sees in him given his like for footballing defenders?

You have slandered Duncan Ferguson on many occasions, bringing up incidents from over 20 years ago, what about the past 10 years, what he’s done for the club and community, the people in Liverpool. He’s an Evertonian more than any of us, like Kenwright he loves this club and city, win, lose or draw, he proved this in December 2019 those of you present in the stadium all witnessed, what he did was just short of a miracle. Surely Mr Moshri is pulling the strings at the club and I’m sure Duncan is a favourite of his, don’t think the owner will have experienced what Goodison Park has to offer until the 7th December 2019.

We all have opinions and it’s great we can use these forums to express our frustrations but to claim #326 Mary has schizophrenia is a little below the belt, not good!

#460 Michael son, you don’t and won’t stand for flippant comments, “supporting the club and standing by the manager”, but it’s allowed for others to claim people have mental health issues, something seriously wrong here!!

Can’t and won’t stand for that, disgusting.

I've always been surprised to see Holgate as a central defender. He's hardly a towering, commanding presence. A deep holding midfielder/sweeper seems more logical for me. But what do I know?

For factual correctness!

Can you put a quote up from Guardiola showing his comments about Holgate?

Or are you relying on gossip columns for tour info?

BTW Marco Silva also said that Mason wouldn't be sold when he was in charge.

As for quotes from Pep, since when has any manager gone public in trying to sign an opponents player - they use the gossip columns and rumour mills for that sort of thing.

Everton manager Carlo Ancelotti also dismissed speculation defender Mason Holgate could be on his way to Manchester City.

The young defender was linked with City in the morning’s papers with the Daily Mirror saying Pep Guardiola was preparing a summer move for Holgate.

Ancelotti though shut down the talk at his press conference on Friday.

“I think it’s a rumour, but if it’s not a rumour I can say Mason Holgate is an important part of the future of Everton,” he said.

“There is no possibility he can go to another club. Zero possibility, like my friend (Jose) Mourinho says: ‘Zero’.

Keep digging.

He's gone from being one of the most promising central defenders in the country to being a classic Carlo "spare peg, round hole" right-back

Another player ruined by Mr Cautious wanting to play 9 centre-halves, a centre-forward... and a goalie (plus two more on the bench).

😂😂😂😂

Posters who have on many occasions ridiculed other posters for taking the gossip columns seriously are now taking the gossip columns seriously.

You could not make it up.

Due to an injury crisis on Sam Allardyce's watch he became a fixture in a much-maligned Everton back four of Jonjo Kenny, Ashley Williams, Mason Holgate (aged 21) and Cuco Martina. It proved to be the most resilient of Everton's defensive line-ups in that dogsbody of a season.

In came Marco Silva who never fancied nor trusted Mason and packed him off on loan to WBA. On his return to Everton Silva again overlooked him. Carlo Ancelotti came in and almost immediately made him a fixture of his defence, ahead of the likes of Michael Keane and Yerry Mina.

Such was his form and especially his edge and vocal cajolling of his team mates MANY wanted him installed as Everton captain this season.

Richarlison pipped him to the club's official Player of the Season award - voted for by supporters, of course - but the same supporters voted Mason as the club's Young Player of the Season. His fellow pros voted him as THEIR Players' Player of the Season.

Rumours or not, Mason's name was linked with a move to City. The MEN canvassed City fans who responded favourably to the rumour.

Last summer, Carlo appreciating what he saw in both Mason and DCL, tied them down with new contracts, laughing off the idea that Holgate could leave. The Italian described Mason as 'a complete defender who has all the necessary attributes to reach the pinnacle of his profession.'

Mason missed the end of the stop-start season last time out, injuring himself away to Spurs. He missed the start of this season for similar reasons - injurying himself in a pre-season friendly v PNE.

In spite of Everton's fine start to the season without him, Carlo tried to integrate Mason back into the fold as quickly as possible, pairing him with Michael Keane home to United. It didn't go well. Mason was not ready for that step up and he dropped out of the squad for the following games.

He has not had a great season, but he has certainly shown he is a PL quality CB, as acknowledged just last season by supporters and his fellow pros.

The challenge for him and the club is that he gets back to the standards for which he received much praise and awards less than 12 months ago.

Criticism comes with the territory, unfortunately. Patience and tolerance are more demanding virtues which quickly evaporate when the team, the manager, individual players, hit some bad form.

If we demand instant replacements whenever that happens, then we will never have stability or a chance for growth.

He’s most likely going to have his pick of the top European teams and I think Everton will be forced to sell if the offers get over the £100 million mark.

That season always reminds me of being sat directly behind the bench at the Emirates Jay (BRZ).

Allardyce screaming at Kenny to "go forward". Kenny looked bemused as nothing was on. But, he followed the instruction.

Only to be bollocked and asked "what the fuck was that" as the ball rolled out for an Arsenal goal kick. The poor lad done what the coach told him even though he seemed to question it prior to following the instruction. Don't always think a forward ball for the sake of it is the best option. Players need options in front of them to play forward with intent.

4-0 down at half time. I've seen some poor Everton performances in my time but that is up there with the worst of them.

Wow. Shit gets deeper weekly. When City want him, hes gone. And if you don't know that even after the manager states in the rumour rags, I think its a rumour, you need to open your mind a bit.

So is the sort of poor judgement which condemned Calvert-Lewin to the Championship.

It would have been up there with Ball going to Arsenal.

He has not been the same player since his "toe" injury early in the season.

Another who has seemingly lost form is Richy. He is currently a shadow of the player we know he can be.

Maybe he is sulking about not being able to join the national team AND go to the olympics. Who knows.

4½-year contract. Within that time he could develop into the player we hope he can be as he's still young.

It secures a decent sell on value if he doesn't and we decide to sell.

But in the interim, we need to bring in better and keep him as back up.

I still, despite my earlier doubts, fancy him to play in the sweeper role.

When I decided to stop posting about the time Martinez oversaw the nailing of Man Utd at Old Trafford I couldn't imagine anyone being in the least bit interested and rightly so. I just went off and did something else.

I like to think of myself as a mild mannered non-reactionary type but surely people engaging in this sort of attention seeking should be horse-whipped in front of the Liver Building under the banner "HOW DO YOU LIKE THIS FOR ATTENTION?"

Barry@502. Now that sentiment was fine, right up until you told us about it. ;-)

Me and my Dad used to argue like a cat and dog about the club we both loved. If we can't do that, without agreeing to disagree on certain things, we might as well just all agree with each other all of the time.

Nothing should be taken personally, but then again, maybe we should all be careful about getting personal.

I've stepped out of line on occasion. Very easy to do when caught in the emotion of football and Everton. But, I was always brought up to recognise and apologise when you do so. I like to think I have when I've gone too far.

Move on but keep talking, especially about Everton!!

I agree entirely

WE didnt tell City no...Carlo did. Read his comments.

That said. I think you have raised a very fair point - even if it was for the wrong reason.

Mason was Soooooo promising, but since the City interest he seems to have got it into his head that he is better than he is.

We could have a top class Central defender...But if he is going to realise his potential, he has to stop thinking he is Ruud Krol - Ask your arl fella

And nIce to see you are listening to Carlo and backing his judgement.

Derek#509. You know me so well lol.

In addition to picking your own seat, are you being provided with a cushion to throw – or do you have to bring your own?

Off topic, but referring back to last week's discussion about the nicest places to live in Liverpool, I noticed an item on today's red Echo website citing Calderstones as being the city's most unaffordable (ergo the nicest) suburb. I imagine you would concur?

Its his spirit of adventure I question.

Total Frankie...Funtime Frankie

And I view Liverpool as a city region, so Crosby to me is very much part of our city region.

We are hardly ever outclassed these days [only really Manchester City] but we seem to lose, because at a vital moment, a simple pass goes astray, or a half-hearted tackle goes in, or a simple scoring chance is 'fluffed', or there is a momentary lapse of concentration.

It is the 'self-inflicted' nature of losing through these basic mistakes, that makes it all so galling and madly frustrating.

The manager has to prove that he was the correct person to become manager of Everton and like the players, he has to earn the contract he has been given.
I am not going to comment on the last game as you can just copy and paste all the comments from the Fullham, Newcastle, Burnley, Crystal Palace and a few other clubs to get the same reaction.

As far as the manager goes he will have to prove himself from the next game to the transfer window in January 2022 to see if he does have a ambitious plan for the future of the club, or is he just thinking of his retirement.

One way or the other someone has to show some backbone and effort on the pitch, as the number of opportunities to improve our league position has been wasted, by the poor home games this season, that the supporters are beginning to except.

Kiddies paddling pool would be about our limit, Mike.

Kuyt's gone now but not sure if Nolan is still there.

After the game I shut down the computer and just went and worked on a deck I'm building in the backyard. And I made a decision.

I'm – kind of – done. It's the same thing every season. Hope stirs, Everton fucks you in the end.

This capitulation was terrible. We played awful. It was ugly, and it was League 1 quality.

This happens every single year it seems. We look like a team worthy of Top 4 / Europe. When we get close, it's like a switch is flipped and complacency and "know your station" takes over instead of "seize the opportunity and walk through hell in a gasoline suit to get it".

The lack of belief, will, and fight, I just can't cope with any longer.

Lately I've not been posting as much. I will read. I'll watch. I'll bleed blue in my 'Merican way. I want this Club to win so, so badly it's an obsession.

But the return on my time investment is poor. I'll never tune out, but by God I need a break.

Everton is a woman, and Everton has broken me. I love her so much I'll come back for more. But I need a time out because I'm about to beat the bitch – and not only is that wholly unacceptable, and wickedly non-pc, it serves no purpose.

Time out, Everton. Get your shit together and let's talk in the future. I'm about to kill ya, so let's take it easy for a while.

Have you never seen The Godfather?

"Just when I thought I was out... They pulled me back in."

Whilst we can imagine there are those amongst Everton's high and mighty who may be beginning to have doubts about the great man, they will never look to sack him until Moshiri, Kenwright and Usmanov all agree that relegation is nigh. And we are a very long way from that scenario at present!

We are hooked and Everton are like a drug... just one that never gives us a high!

That said, my opinion of Ferguson is not slanderous as far as I'm concerned. Towards the end of his "career" a national broadsheet newspaper published a two-page demolition of his character, identifying sources at all his clubs who all denigrated him, without complaint from him.

As a player with God-given talent he decided to be a shyster throughout his career.

I've mentioned it before, but a pal of mine was a linesman in a League Cup semi at Goodison against Sunderland that went to pens. Ferguson was in the centre-circle audibly refusing to take a pen whilst deriding Bakayoko who did have the balls to take one (which he missed, and we lost). What really shocked my mate was Ferguson saying to another Scottish player that he was happy to have lost, and that sickens me from a so-called professional.

Once he bankrupted himself he might well have needed to find "love" for us, and a nice little earner from the Teary One to go with it.

To me the adage "leopards and spots" fit him to a Tee.

As for your reference to him being pleased about being knocked out, I can't comment as I've no idea if that's a fact or not.

I concur wholeheartedly. If only I had something or someone to strike out at but, being a sort of nice person, I can't find one. God give me a garden to take my anxiety out on.

How times have changed. I remember Colin Harvey lived in a semi-detached bungalow in Cherry Vale opposite the old Gateacre Hall Hotel. Jimmy Husband was in a semi on Linkstor Road. I used to clean his windows!!!

Your advice regarding shared miseries and long-term disappointments is so right on. Jamie(531), like most of us Evertonians, has an incurable disease, and like all diseases, it controls you. Jamie, I empathise and sypathise with and for you. But a dose of reality.

Read with caution. Sometimes this dreadful illness goes into a minor remission (eg, Arsenal 1-0) but it will dictate for itself and return with a vengeance. There is no known cure and, like most fatal conditions, it can affect those around you.

Fortunately, with a world population of nearly 8,000,000,000, it only affects about 60,000. In fact, some experts on the disease feel it only affects 52,000. Personally, I think it is many many more than both numbers. I caught the disease in my chidhood along with 78,000 weak-minded folks just like myself.

At that time the disease was mainly centered in the Liverpool area. Since then, it has spread around the world to many, usually to those who are delusional and easily influenced, and sometimes from close relatives because it has proved to be very contagious.

Again there is no known cure. You will also get no sympathy from those around you. Many of your friends and relatives consider that you have significant mental problems. In my case, my very closest of relatives, my dear wife.

Symptoms include:

(1) Intense anxiety that always last for 90 minutes and usually more.
(2) Usually includes irrational screaming at TV or those who are with you.
(3) At its worst, a hatred for anyone in a blue shirt.
(4) At its best, an intense hatred for anyone in a red shirt.
(5) A delusional belief that you alone know just how to fix the problems, because everyone connected with your team when they lose should be banned from everything for life.
(6) Intense mood swings (eg Liverpool 2-0) when euphoria takes over and you love everyone in the world and even hug the cat which you are getting rid of the next day.
(7) Regular threats to never have anything to do with your team Everton because you have had a toxic love affair for most of your life.
(8) One more delusional activity is to write to a site known as ToffeeWeb. It is always therapeutic to know of many others who have the same disease. I know because I use it when I need to, particularly when the disease is at a very high point. Some people use it 10 times every day. They need help far more than most and must have the most extreme form of the disease.

No Cure!! You may walk away, you may say you are finally cured but you will come back. You just do not have any choice. It is an obsession, a compulsion, and of course a disease. I know because I have it.

Poor selection and non-existent game management, week on end. Antonio from West Ham said tonight how hard Moyes had got them working. Showing them that they stood 19th in the 'mileage' table when he arrived... now 5th. Do I think our manager is up to date with such stats?

We are desperate to watch, seem to have no plan or pattern, and a clueless manager who stands with a blank, dazed expression, changing nothing. There have been many games where early subs. or tactical changes have been urgently needed when we inevitably go behind.

We fans can see this, but he sits on his hands and waits. Far too late, and usually does the wrong anyway. I have been astonished by Ancelotti's incompetence.

I also remember Colin Harvey opening the St Mary's monthly disco at the church hall in Quarry St.

Perhaps if the current players had the same connection with the fans they would understand the frustration that we feel. Not going to happen.

You're making me wonder how Carlo became the most successful manager in football even winning more than Pep. Maybe he was just lucky.

In incurable disease that we will all be showing severe symptoms of . The trouble is that the joke and reality of this illness don’t keep themselves separated!

Exactly it’s not about making players scapegoats it’s just peoples honest assessments of what they are seeing each week.

If we are going to make that step forward I’m afraid it’s not going to be with players of the calibre of Holgate. Unfortunately it’s not only him though it’s most of our current squad.

Those feelings extend to Andre Gomes, Alex Iwobi, Fabian Delph and a few others who appear from time to time from the Treatment Room. I will no doubt 'ruffle a few feathers' and I am not a regular 'feather ruffler', (an arrestable offence depending on which way it is executed) but I am prepared to take any flak should it arrive.

I am all for building the team comprising of hard working, no-nonsense players with a turn of speed and skill combined, as is displayed fairly consistently by Ben Godfrey who could be well on his way to being 'Player of the Season'. That is my opinion, but I don't think too many would disagree regarding Ben.

I could go all high and mighty and say us legacy fans, don’t have a choice, but that would be wrong because you’re an Evertonian mate, and this is exactly what Everton do to us on a regular fucking basis.

I’ve missed games, but only twice have I felt like you do now, I remember buying everyone a ticket for Blackburn, and not buying myself one because I’d had enough of Walter Smith, (actually went to work and made a fortune, but money doesn’t compare to the travelling blue army) and again I never stepped inside Goodison, with Moyes in charge, once we capitulated against Wigan in the cup.

I still went the away games though, which was a contradiction (I’d decided I wasn’t giving Everton another penny whilst Moyes was in bed with Kenwright) and after a little rest, I’m sure you will be back Jamie, singing “we shall not be moved”!

I’ve got a new route into town nowadays Jamie, I drive the long way so I can go past Bramley Moore, and next time I go past I’ll think of the crazy Yank, running round his car screaming at a kids football tournament because his team had just beaten Liverpool, because that’s exactly what it means to be blue kid🙏

Makes me think either we are inept or we have someone already lined up, an agreement for Aarons maybe.

What do you think of Ivan Toney at Brentford, he is looking the real deal and that he will make the step up. He is banging the goals in for fun like a natural goalscorer. At just turned 25 a good age and looks physically strong too. We need a team with more goals in it and this player looks like he could help provide them.

I think he will have a few options this summer , and will be hot property.

I've come to my own conclusion that we won't dine at the top table again, the rot since the late 80s followed by misty eyes, 11 years of Moyes, the Koeman and Walsh duo and living in past glories decades ago. I always felt the stadium needed to be sooner ( such as Kings Dock)

However it would be nice to see attacking football, goals, a cup and European (CL) football and a squad good enough to deliver this, and above all a team and manager that want this.

He has shown he can manage on the right side of a back three, but as a centre-back in any pairing with Keane/Godrey/Mina he has been weak.

I still like him though so let's see what next season brings.

John, you didn’t get rid of the cat did you? Was it black, you know like did it bring you luck, obviously not with the Blues!!

No player should have his position by right, it should be earned.

It's hard to see us finishing much higher than where we currently stand with away games against Villa, West Ham and City to come, all teams who have beaten us at home.

Sunday is the last, last chance saloon for us!

The summer recruitment will be very important and if the targets include a current Barcelona ex Liverpool player then I fear for us going forward. At best he will keep James company in the treatment room at worst another one who is looking a final pension pot.

We need young hungry players with potential, the ones that Brands was hired to find for us.

Richie is not a striker. He would be better being used deeper and running at Defences and creating chances and arriving in the box.

It's time our Kenny Rogers lookalike Manager became "The Gambler" instead of his usual "Coward of the County".

What is everyone’s thoughts on the City away game, where there is a possibility of a few hundred away fans allowed, me personally, I would prefer Everton to turn down the allocation.

If like we have seen over the weekend, I fully expect some small token from those clubs involved in the dirty dozen, to either pitch invade, or come up with some protest.

I would prefer our supporters to be well away from anything they could get drawn into, by the Premier league.

Let them do whatever they seem fit to do, as long as the Everton supporters are not allocated tickets, then that is one thing they will not be able to use against Everton.

Let the six have their protests, let them try and dig themselves out of the hole, they have dug themselves in.

Why should Evertonians reunite to help their causes.

Like I have said in previous posts, over 25 clubs have been docked points for their owners going into Administration, no fault of the fans, players, or Managers, let them fight this protest on their own, with Everton fans well away from the protests, and then in due course, face the same punishment as the other 20 odd clubs.

Ian, I'm just not a fan of 4-4-2 in the modern game. It leaves you exposed and overrun in midfield. No point having 2 up top if you're not supplying them. Just my view, I appreciate yours.

For me if fans come together, the more sympathy those clubs will get, the less they will will face rightful punishment, me personally I would let our fans sit this one out, then press reset for away fans, in the new season.

Carlo has his knockers, and probably deservedly so.

Doucoure a huge miss. I'm probably foolishly not giving up on this season just yet, but Doucoure's injury looks increasingly significant to our fate. As does the time we lost Allan. Having those 2 out has exposed the thinness of the squad.

Knife to a gun fight?

Do I ever want Everton to lose - no, never. But West Ham have a chance of 12 points in the last 4 games which would mean No Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and maybe no Chelsea (still to play Leicester and City) in the Champions League next year. I am going to agonise over this for the next few days.

Answer will be - hope we win, but not too upset if we lose - Just don't draw as it is useless for both teams.

I’m no fan of Moyes but his team deserve their shot at the CL and who knows, he might just get beyond the last 16.

I agree about 4-4-2, and think this formation has killed Everton, every time they've played it. I can't believe Josh King, has been used so sparingly though, especially because he could play on the left of a three, Richarlison, on the right of a three, and Calvert-Lewin, could play down the middle.

He could then play Allan, Davies, and another in the middle of the park (I'd personally try Iwobi there). And suddenly, the team should have width, balance, and no big fuck-off holes in the middle of the park, which have been exploited by nearly every team below us in the table. This must surely tell the manager something; I find impossible to believe he doesn't already know?

The lack of use of King is equally odd. I mean, don't get me wrong, I wasn't a big advocate of bringing him in, but having done so and then not to use him is strange.

When we build that golden statue of the Brazilian Peter Reid, we need to put a big fuck off hole behind it.

Nobody in the Premier League has made more ball-winning tackles than Allan this season.
He is very effective.

Should another of our players cover the space?

If that is the case and a lot of the big clubs' owners walked away, would any owners look to invest in a club with so much debt, that is not a rich overseas investor?

If the fans drove towards the 51% ownership, how would these clubs maintain paying huge transfer fees and wages?

Any knowledgeable football fan out there, know the ins and outs and how the clubs would be affected, if the owners left???

We won the league twice in the 80s playing 4-4-2 and before you all shout that the game is different now, I would point out that Leicester City won the Premier League playing 4-4-2.

But then with the right players, I feel 3-5-2 is the most attacking (but can leave you exposed on the flanks).

The key point is the right players. Play a formation that suits and gets the most out of the players you have. Don't make the players you have for the system you want.

With what we have now, if it's 2 up top, I'm more inclined to go 3-5-2.

So it can most certainly be done as you say. The days of classic Newcastle and Blackburn sides with their more traditional 442 (two centre forwards + two wingers + two box to box) is too easily found out now though, albeit I'm sure those teams would still be a handful today.

But there are also awful flawed versions of 352 or 4321 or 433 - as we've all been unlucky enough to bear witness to.

The formation isn't really the issue (as Bilic recently said sometimes we're really only talking about a 10 yard difference in starting position). The key is just to have a few absolutely excellent players and others who allow those players to play to their strengths.

Currently it's easiest to do that with a central midfield trio but it's not essential if the other players work the midfield spaces too.

I fluffed my final sentence earlier. Should have ended don't make the players you have FIT the system you want to play. I think we're in agreement, you play a system / formation that suits that players you have. Or you bring in players to suit the system you want to play.

The reality of the modern game however is that you need to be flexible. Formations don't just change game to game now, they change during the game. We're not quite NFL, but you can see shape and formation change depending on whether a team has possession or is defending.

4-4-2 seems a decent formation, but now you get all sorts of permutations, even a bloody xmas tree formation.

Was it Brian Clough, or another manager, who once said, football is a simple game, made complicated by tacticians.

Christmas Trees, Diamonds (please don't play the diamond!!).

Going back to the 80s team, in the modern game, how good a so called number 10 would Kevin Sheedy have been?

Did Bilic say that Robert? Ten yards difference in a player’s starting position is incredible given how fast the game is now, especially because it’s the most important position for every single player including the goalkeeper imo mate.

Carlo won’t change it though because he is yesterday’s man and Holgate will not be utilised correctly as he’s clearly a stand out player in our squad who would fit comfortably into Man City’s team.

It’s time to get rid of Carlo and Brands and get Duncan and Rhino in.

The greatest manager of all time, Bill Shankly, said

"football is a simple game made complicated by people who should know better"

So your example of a wide player tucked in might actually have been a hair's breadth from a 433 or 4231 as opposed to a 442, say. I think that's Bilic's point.

And then you can play the same formations in different ways. In a 442, Tony Hibbert used to occupy a very different space on the pitch compared with, say, Salgado or Zanetti or Zambrotta. They all secretly envied Hibbo's ability to close down a cross, mind you.

(DCL earlier this season identified himself, Richi, Godfrey and Branthwaite as the paciest in the squad - no mention of a midfielder).

Reidy was devoid of pace but often said that Bracewell did his running for him, and he was right. Reidy was the one slow-coach in the entire team though. One is allowed providing they provide exceptional ability, three or four are unsustainable to any success at all.

Why Moshiri has authorised such massive expenditure without realising this is bizarre.

Just now Carlo has started to openly criticise the team for lassitude, and to me the lack of pace and vigour is his chief gripe. So, this summer, will Moshiri have the balls to grasp the nettles he's embedded at USMFF with his erratic signings (and they are his, ultimately, as the owner), uproot them and replace them with specimens with a chance to start making his failed three-year project (stated five very long years ago) reality?

I think we can count our good results, coming by the way of playing an open game on one hand, and the only two that spring to mind since Liverpool at home, (October) are Leeds away, and Spurs at home in the cup, and we most certainly haven’t made it hard for anyone at Goodison Pk for a long time.