Sorry Everton beaten far too easily

I'm hopeful of a performance today.

Dreading this game, but like everyone will endure as much turgid sideways passing shite as humanly possible.

Ok the service to him has been poor but his link up play and workrate has been even worse.

At least Kone has shown he can hold up the ball and pass it, a spell on the bench might give Rom the kick in the arse he needs.

Shame McCarthy is not fit as Barry is another player whould should be dropped.

More possession than Hull but frankly they look more likely to score now than us.

We really aren't laying very well at all are we?

If we don't win today I'm struggling badly to see where put next win is coming from.

Hull 1-0 up because they are yet again showing MORE HUNGER AND MORE PASSION than my disgraced team.

I'm embarrassed to say I support this team at present, absolute dire bollox.

How long before Martinez is sacked or leaves is the question we are probably going to be hearing more of in the coming weeks.

I don't want to necessarily see him go but let's be honest there are massive problems here at this club.

Ross Barkley needs a fucking rocket up his arse too...complete waste of space.

Sadly he is not the only one.

Only Kone and Coleman slightly showing anything st all today.

Hope people calling for Barry to be centre half have now had their claims emphatically answered too.

Going down for sure this season

WTF!!!

Nothing is good. Offense is seriously bad, defense is shockingly bad. If this it how Martinez wants to play football we have to sack him right away. This leads straight down one division.

We MUST be one of the clear favourites for relegation this season.

We are currently the WORST team in the league by a distance..

If Martinez is here in the transfer window he needs to go out there and spend as much money as we have on Ryan Shawcross..

Where is the DESIRE??

The PASSION?

The COMMITMENT??

If we don't wake up out of this slumber we are in then just like Leeds United and Newcastle United we WILL go down if this carries on.

This is a disgrace.

Back four uncoordinated.Useless

Positives? Leave it with me, I'll get back to you
Poor this lads

Bollocks to your technical approach, Roberto, go tonight.

We are shite in every department.

His "total football" philosophy bollox doesn't work, won't work and has never worked.

Why did we employ a manager who took his team down?

If things don't change then the inevitable is on the cards. From the goalkeeper right to the No 9 , no-one knows what they are supposed to be doing.

I can't see us getting out of this one... oh and Besic booked again for a fuckin' stupid tackle!

Martinez has lost the dressing room, there can be no other exclamation for such dross. The team are sending Blue Bill a message. Please listen, Bill... you know it makes sense.

Only player who seems to play well is wee Seamy. Naismith is doing ok, but apart from that I don't think anyone has done themselves justice.
I never rated Alacaraz nor Roubles (there is a reason he didnt play too much at Wigan either!!).

Something has to change, the system, the players or the manager.
At this stage, my vote is the system (but this is likely to be hand in hand with the manager).

With Burnley playing ok and Crystal palace getting a new manager, we will be hoping for 3 worse teams, rather than us getting out own way out.

(So much for my New Year's resolution of being more optimistic!)

Why are we set up to play so open when we need points, a point away from home will do. Very stupid management here with this game plan. Bugger it.

The dream is over.

Damage limitation and staying up is the focus now.

Not felt this despondent since the Mike Walker days.

There is no other way of describing this current team and the manager, and his staff.

It just shows that hard work and a bit of desire and fire in your belly can go a long long way.

We can’t blame Robles, we can’t blame Alcaraz, we were and have been just as bad if not worse earlier in this season, with Howard in goal.

Utter heartless spineless bunch of players here.
No Cahill type character or Carsley or a proper creative midfielder like Arteta, I mean proper proper creative midfielder.

By the way respect to Jelavic, nice one mate!

Wish we still had you when you look at the dross out there nowadays.

Same amount of goals as Lukaku.

Jelavic looking a good player, lively and works hard (which we knew already)

Imagine us having 8 shots at Anfield??

We need to wake the fuck up this season, a few weeks away I mentioned relegation in a tongue in cheek fashion but now it's a very very real possibility.

I will bring it up for you mate regarding Duffy.

I said it on the summer but was shouted down by everyone saying that we were also certs to fight for the top 4..

As you put it Andy, is this the best defence we can put out?

Burnley equalize at Newcastle..

Everyone showing fight apart from this bunch of losers that we support.

Robles is just a typical continental goalkeeper of average ability. Likes to punch when its easier to catch, same for shots, will on average try to push away rather than hold. He just isn't very good.

28M was too much for Lukaku.

The only thing really changed from last season (asides from a few more injuries), is the system has "progressed".

What are we even doing?????

We have picked many different players this season,from Howard to Robles, to Lukaku, to Eto'o, from Barry to Besic, to McGeady to whoever but none have been able to do anything.

The second half as been as meek as the first, you just know when Everton fall behind in a match the game is over.

Lack of talent us one thing and blaming formations but the one thing every fan will not forgive is the lack of heart and passion, the lack of desire and want and I see that in way TOO MANY of our players.

This cunt won't quit either, only fan protest will get rid of him.

We are getting wanked on by Hull! We will see how much of a Blue Kenwright really is. Does this result truly hurt him?

Hull 5 shots on target - two of which went in.

Jelavic played the clown to get that second yellow for Alcaraz

But top call Daniel #70 applauding the sending off. Top Blue right there. Alcaraz actually wasn't the worst player out there.

Barry on the pitch after a WOEFUL performance just sums it all up for me.

I'm off the cheer bandwagon officially.

I'm just shocked that so many of us appear to have been so wrong about Martinez, I actually feel defrauded right now.

What have we done? Nothing. No desire at all. Sick of it.

Also you'd be surprised to here that this was Hull's first home win in 3 months.

Roberto pulls Mirallas – the only player likely to score – and Besic – the only player actually playing well – and keeps Baines and fucking Gareth Barry out there?! What... The... Fuck... ???

His winning mentality combined with classic Man Utd tactic would kick these players up the arse.

Something's got to give.

Dreadful stuff, and from a lineup identified as one of the team's strongest for many seasons. Vote of confidence time!

Every time they went on the attack, we went to pieces, Hernandez having a field day and it says it all when Jellyfish had the game he had today.

For me, we need a massive clear out of deadwood players who simply arenÂ’t good enough. If BK persists in keeping RM in post then the least he needs to do is bring someone in to kick that shower of a first team up the backside.

Who I donÂ’t know, IÂ’ve heard mutterings for Neville and even Irvine, whether theyÂ’re the answer or not is an other matter.

I am absolutely gobsmacked by how this season has gone so badly and frighteningly a lot of us could see the potential for this to happen in August, we should of signed another centre half and a new goalkeeper.

It is no longer a matter of analysing our formations or selections, the only question is whether the players can be turned around to support RM. I doubt that very much and we cannot afford many more defeats while we find out.

God forbid we get relegated. Hopefully we stay up and regroup during the summer. In the meantime, please God help us turn this around. IÂ’ve never being so low & dejected about our performances.

Something has got to give and itÂ’s Martinez. Get rid now while we still have a chance of improvement.

Also, is there a worse player in the league than Barry?! Liability... just get rid of the useless idiot.

With this kind of form, why would they want to stay?

We canÂ’t carry on with this style of play, itÂ’s obvious to everyone except the manager that itÂ’s not working and at the moment we are the easiest team in the league to set up against and beat. Time to go, Roberto.

We ARE bloody Wigan!

Just heard the RM post-match interview - notably comments about our bright start but sharp drop in confidence once we conceded.
To me, that either points to:
(1) Lack of character in the team and / or
(2) No faith in the system
Either way, the outlook isnÂ’t good.

Not a point from Newcastle, Stoke, Southampton or Hull.
Not one single point.
My enthusiasm for the Europa and FA Cup is gone.
They are now distractions when we need 100% focus on the real issues.

P.S. Happy New Year!

There did not appear to be any urgency or fight from any of the players at all. I know itÂ’s little consolation, but I remember losing games in the past, and thinking that they tried their best and lost to a better side, or a dodgy decision robbed us of a result.

Whereas this team at the moment, is devoid of confidence, ideas or commitment.

The whole dynamic of the team is so wrong, new broom or a caretaker needed and a massive clearout of the sick and lame in Gibson, Pienaar, Alcaraz.

The whole thing is bemusing, and would be a right laugh if it were some other team.

The man has clearly lost the players, there is no turning back now IÂ’m afraid. Sorry Bob, it was fun while it lasted.

JageilkaÂ’s demeanor at the start... laughing and joking with the referee at the coin toss... Hull captain... steely-eyed, no smile, no joking, on the job, professional...

I donÂ’t think the players have lost faith and I donÂ’t think there has been any fall out. I actually believe our players are simply not fit enough. ThatÂ’s why they donÂ’t close down the opposition.

We would be about fifth if games ended at HT. So itÂ’s no surprise that our form suffers after going through a busy period. Other teams look sharper. ItÂ’s not that our players arenÂ’t given 100%, itÂ’s that they havenÂ’t got 100% to give.

We need to grind out a few results and look to secure safety so we can concentrate our efforts on Europe and the FA Cup. However, if our fortunes donÂ’t change very soon we will be so mired in a relegation dogfight that we wonÂ’t be able to focus on the cups at all. I donÂ’t care how we win for now (route one football would be fine) but if he doesnÂ’t do something drastic soon heÂ’s going to get the sack and/or get us relegated. Then his vision will be in tatters along with his reputation. Come on Roberto, snap out of it and do your job!

Say what you like about ofm he had that team fully fit for 90 mins and a solid defence.

We look goosed after 75 mins this season and all over the place at the back.

Last season Baines, Coleman and Mirellas were ripping defences apart with attacking, now its playing square passes in our own half of the field and none of the three above mentioned can play to their strengths because of slow sideward passing.

Either go back to basics Roberto and attack with pace or you will be joining Mr Wheelen away from football.

The fans deserve better, lose the stubberness, cut out the ole sideways passing and get us an ugly win if need be.

The all too ready acceptance of defeat from the players is the most worrying aspect of recent performances. At no point in any of them did we ever look like we were capable of (or even that interested in) getting back into it once the opposition had gone in front. Then, when you look at the quality of the teams weÂ’ve recently been allowing to walk all over us, you really have to start to worry. ItÂ’s not like theyÂ’ve been tight affairs or narrow losses. WeÂ’ve been thoroughly outplayed, outfought/out thought, and lost individual battles in every area of the pitch from almost first minute until last.

My New Years resolution to lay off the whiskey went too shit in that second half as well.

Most of the better players have been misfiring or are injured. I have more faith in the manager and in the squad than anyone clearly irked enough to rail and wail. I think Irvine should be brought back as a coach. There is still much to play for this season, thankfully knee-jerk responses are not Bill KenwrightÂ’s style, and heÂ’s probably used to people on ToffeeWeb "disagreeing" with his management of the clubÂ’s affairs.

Martinez does not turn into a crap manager after 4 games, not after a season we had last year. All of this rumour about players falling out is Sky/Red top manufactured tosh. A year ago, Martinez was being touted as ArsenalÂ’s or BarcelonaÂ’s next manager.

Get a grip people, show some spine, suck it in and see whatÂ’s going down. Martinez needs funds to add quality in the window, boost the squadÂ’s numbers, bring in new faces to add confidence to the team. We need an attacking midfielder, a centre back and a goalkeeper. Loans would do... Deulolfeu permanently is a must.

For me, as much as I like Roberto, he has to go, as he has not got a clue how to fix things, or bring the best out of this group of players.

You have got to get back to basics; a bit of the Dogs of War wouldnÂ’t go a miss at the moment.

Cut this cancer out now before it is too late.

Martinez Out now and ABM to replace him (Anyone But Martinez)

Personally I canÂ’t see it going on much longer. We need to buy in January so Bill will have to give the new manager however much cash he can find down the back of the sofa.

I think itÂ’s a pity but it seems self evident that he has fallen out with the players. Now that the shit is hitting the fan, not enough are fighting for him. So, he has to go.

Even worse than our sudden loss of any sort of form are the names being mentioned for both managers and incoming transfers. We are still not, I believe, the kind of club that can waste millions on footballing thugs and managers that canÂ’t see past the long ball.

We need to get a manager that is both a pragmatist and has style. As for players they need to have ability as well as aggression. Otherwise we will have a team full of Seth JohnsonÂ’s on prohibitive contracts, we will be unable to shift in the championship. Ask Leeds how that worked out. What did happen to Leeds?

Then there is a defence which really got into the spirit of Christmas (well, they started the season off that way so why change during Yuletide?)

Just waiting to see whoÂ’ll be rolled out now for the inevitable "we must do better" toss.

I could take defeats if there was a sign of some passion and the result was due to bad luck. WeÂ’ve had plenty of that over the years. Glorious defeat and hard luck stories.

But we currently appear gutless and spineless.

That is not acceptable in any walk of life, certainly not in sport, and definitely not for Everton FC.

Relegation will cost us a lot more though.

I would like to believe the money and the will to spend it wisely will turn our season around, but I have a horrible feeling neither will happen. At the moment it feels like we are sleepwalking towards disaster. Please prove me wrong Bill & Bob!

The other option is one I am loathe to see happen as I really did buy into MartinezÂ’s vision, but ultimately the future of this club is paramount and I would rather eat humble pie on these forums and forget my dreams if it leads to the best outcome for our beloved club. Right now I would happily eat my words and welcome back OFM or a Tony Pulis type, even if it was only until we were safe.

Long term we do need to be brave and try a new path, but perhaps with our lack of resources the experiment is just a pipe dream. Perhaps I didnÂ’t appreciate what OFM did for us. We got used to being the best of the rest and yearned for a visionary who could defy the odds and give us the belief to take us into the promised land of the CL. Perhaps we were greedy and should have just been satisfied with what we had.

Confused. Hoping for the best. Fearing the worst.

We have the second-worst defence in the PL; we have gifted goals by individual mistakes more than any other (10 before today); we have made fewer tackles and interceptions than any other team; we have lost more points from winning positions than any other team.

All this, it seems to me, is due to how the team is sent out. According to Luke Garbutt, there seems to be no defensive coaching at all.

What is even more concerning is that Martinez doesnÂ’t even seem to think that there is a problem. He intends to go on with this slow sideways-passing predictable style when what we need right now is to avoid mistakes, work harder, keep a defensive shape and become hard to beat.

MartinezÂ’ attacking football was great when it was succeeding, but now the situation is changed - we are in a relegation battle. A failure to get two wins from the next four games, especially if the style of play is not changed, and I think BK will need to think about getting a more pragmatic manager. I know it is not good to change managers lightly, but any more of this and we will be in the Championship next season.

They seem to have followed instructions but constant failure at any job will destroy the morale of anyone

RM IMO appears to have earmarked this competition and stupidly thought the prem would look after itself, well guess what Roberto? You have fucked up big time and you wonÂ’t even acknowledge the fact.

New manage? I fear the damage has already been done. We need an outsider who will rip up the idiots blueprint and start again.

DonÂ’t know who but I know one thing, we have to start fighting like a wounded animal because we are not good enough to play our way to safety.

The manager is not going to walk, why should he. A big pay off will be required, he will be lucky to get another premier league job. I cannot believe how bloody pear shaped its gone. The players have no fitness levels due to the nature of football we play. The pre season shit has continued and now we are pass half way in the season.

Are we up for the fight? No! Thankfully three other teams are worse! Sadly the stats show we are one of them.

By the way Happy New Year!

Do you think Mr T-Rex would have been able to change the course of history if someone had said "By the way, Mr T-Rex, thereÂ’s a whopping great asteroid heading this way, and unless you do something, it is going to crash into the earth with cataclysmic effects"?

To ensure a "successful" transition:
1. sod the FA Cup and the Europa - use them to rest players, to experiment, whatever, but not to aim to progress in them.
2. donÂ’t give RM dosh to buy any players suited to his style.
3. ditch RM forthwith and bring in (or up) somebody who can save us this season (then review after that).
4. OR a player "rebellion", taking things into their own hands ON the pitch (not that I can see the latter happening).

I thought EFCÂ’s first foreign manager might open exciting avenues to hidden gems of talent on the continent.

Turns out heÂ’s got a hot-line to Wigan.

IÂ’m sorry to say it but heÂ’s definitely on borrowed time.

Discarding the FA Cup, if EFC donÂ’t take 4 points from the next 2 matches (City and WBA) and I canÂ’t see it on current form then itÂ’s taxi time. And thatÂ’s me being extremely charitable.

(In desperation, IÂ’d even take someone elseÂ’s suggestion on here of McLaren. I donÂ’t mean Steve, I mean that girl who used to be in Atomic Kitten.)

Before Stoke 66/1
Before Hull 50/1
Now 33/1

Next week we play Man City and I genuinely canÂ’t see, on plummeting form from last March, 3 teams worse than us.

What will the odds be next week? Do we still have people stating with certainty that we are not facing a relegation battle?

We may have better players but every team in the division seems to me to be better organised than us and we are a team with no heart. I think BK may be installing Uber on his phone right now to get a taxi for Sr Martinez.

Man City, WBA, RS and Chelsea all losses.

Merry Fucking Xmas and Happy New Year - 0/12 points. Signed Roberto Martinez.

Messages being sent by electronic sites will not do any good as the devices recieving them can be switched off.

The Europa League has got nothing at all to do with this mess.

We havenÂ’t played a meaningful match in it since Wolfsburg on November 27 and we wonÂ’t play in it until the last week in February.

Its not the Europa, nor was it the League Cup (ahem, another annihilation job at Swansea) itÂ’s just a woeful woeful team we have.

IÂ’m dreading West Ham next week. Joe Royle would do for now, as he would get some fight back into this lot before itÂ’s too late. We donÂ’t need Barcelona football with Wigan Athletic results! Dogs of War would do for me any time rather than this crap.

Get big Dunc to throttle Lukaku and kick him up the backside, get Moyes defence mindset in our back four, add Kendalls 85 season attack from both flanks, add to that Joe Royles dogs of war midfield and we just might have something with this squad.

Not sure what big Nev is up to but a goalkeeping coaching role at Goodison would not go amiss, there again coco the clown could teach a keeper how to catch a ball.

Personally I would bring in Joe Royle and Alan Irvine in short term to steady the ship, no doubt abot it, Martinez has lost the dressing room and no natural leader in the team.

Yesterday, a Wigan based relative loaned me a book called Â’The Numbers GameÂ’ by Chris Anderson and David Sally which virtually says as much.

Martinez is certainly the bookÂ’s hero and all his theories regarding the uselessness of corners and free-kicks are explained and justified in some detail.

Possession is king- and although there are recent comments from the likes of Wenger questioning the sterility of such obsession, our man gets loud applause for his introduction and championing of the technique.

RobertoÂ’s failure to maintain WiganÂ’s Premier status is clouded over by his FA Cup success and his consequent transfer to our club.

In short, the man comes over a bit like Â’the mad professorÂ’ whose obsession is with the process of his experiments rather than their outcome.

My worry has always been that as it had all gone wrong at Wigan it was sure to go wrong here - and so it has proved. Horny old pros like Jagielka, Distin and Barry donÂ’t take easily to leaning new tricks and their younger colleagues are just confused.

Everton FC is no place for staging wistful experiments and Martinez should never have been given the opportunity to present them here, however convincing was his interview with BK.

Now, the curtain should go down on BillÂ’s disastrous production and a manager whose currency is points rather than possession appointed without delay.

Not a lot of class or pace. Naismith looked like a very willing lower league player. Coleman and Mirallis like to play tippy tappy in the corner instead of crossing the ball. Barry has lost his zip and heÂ’s here for another two and a half years. CanÂ’t even think about Lukaku.

Besic did okay, Baines looked better in the middle and Oviedo was fine.

Not sure the system was at fault today. More a lack of organization, real pace and very little movement when in possession. Eleven strangers against a team with a plan.

Performances can only get better because, right now, we are the weakest team in the league. Europa and the FA cup are of no interest to me now. There are far more important issues on the table.

He has a very good side there that should be challenging for Europe. He looks like he is on the verge of setting us back 10 years in less than 2 years. It is criminal. The cup competitions are the only thing keeping him in his job.

This season, we havenÂ’t hit the ground running but I bet Martinez is still spouting the same old shite about how good they are instead of kicking a few arses. The players notice this, along with MartinezÂ’s refusal to change, and very quickly lose respect for him. HeÂ’s probably sounding like a broken record in that dressing room right now, and I personally see no way back unless he gets tough.

ItÂ’s not the players who are soft itÂ’s clearly the manager. Give players any excuse for poor performance and they will take it all day.

I told my son after Stoke that we would get nothing out of Newcastle and Hull and it is dispiriting to be right. We are relegation fodder and I cannot see a win or even a goal coming from anywhere.

I was open-minded about Martinez when he arrived and thought last season was a total revelation after years of dire football under Moyes but I am afraid he has lost the dressing room and is losing the fans rapidly. I would bet on Barkley going in January and he is playing like he knows it. We have been awful and I cannot see it getting any better.

It is not just that we are playing badly but that Martinez doesnÂ’t seem to be able to see it. I am just watching Spurs give Chelsea a lesson in bottle and as much as I hate to say, saw the RS give Swansea a similar lesson. We have no heart and the key players have gone missing big time. I donÂ’t have any conclusions or magic-bullet theories but I donÂ’t see that Roberto has any answers.

The only bright spot is that BK has got a man on the books Joe Royle who can steady the ship till the end of the season and will give BK time to make the right choice this time. I have said before in the 60 years I have watched Everton I couldnÂ’t ever ever imagine appointing a man who had just got his team relegated. Surely BK wasnÂ’t fooled by Wigans cup win, because I could give him a list as long as your arm of managers who have won the cup that I wouldnÂ’t allow anywhere near managing Everton.

The issue at the moment with getting rid of Martinez is, who do you bring in to replace him & how much will it cost. I think last time we sacked a manager the board were prepared for it & had done their homework. I wonder how much work theyÂ’ve done to look for a new manager.

We are on a massive downward trajectory, and itÂ’s getting worse every game. Who would back Martinez (and this bunch of shithouse players, they deserve criticism) to turn this position around?

I wouldnÂ’t, so he has to go IÂ’m afraid.

I too wanted to see Rafa replace Moyes, and posted it on here many times. IÂ’ve no qualms he used to manage them. HeÂ’d certainly tighten up our joke backline and has an excellent cv.

I have no idea if there is truth in the rumours of two significant players going but it wouldnÂ’t astonish me if Seamus goes to United (I hope not but I suspect it has mileage) and if we were to get big funds to use (might Barkley be another to go?) then we might be in a position to reinforce in a major way.

I am clutching at straws I know and speculating wildly but these are desperate times. Of course, whether anyone would want RM to spend the money is, as I say, a very different matter.

BK will be desperate not to sack him as it will make him look a bit foolish for starters. But if this level of performance and commitment continues then soon there will not be much choice.

Its very hard to see where the points are going to come from and no team is too good to get relegated when their players look as demoralised as ours do right now. I would say Martinez has 4-6 weeks to get a win or two and steady the ship or else KenwrightÂ’s hand will be forced.

Part of me wants him to get it right and return us to the pretty and effective football we saw in parts last season. And part of me wants him out as soon as possible for his stubborn refusal to change things up when they are clearly not working this season.

How I long to actually want to watch Match of the Day. Is that too much to ask for?!

WeÂ’re sh&*e in attack,
WeÂ’re w@%k in defence,
The school of science is NOT coming back!

The players must take some responsibility but ultimately it is up to the manager to get the best from his players and Roberto is quite simply not doing that.

We are without doubt performing as the worst team in the league at the moment, incredible whe you see the players we have at our disposal.

As much as I have liked Roberto for what he gave us for all of last season ItÂ’s time for Bill to send him on his way.

Maybe get Joe Royle to fill in as caretaker with Alan Irvive as coach (if he would come back which I doubt he would) until we can find a permanent boss.

Again IÂ’d give funds to ABM (Anyone But Martinez) cos heÂ’s pissed enough of our cash away. And IÂ’m not talking Lukaku here by the way, IÂ’m talking 3 years for Barry with zero recoupment etc. As a club we have had a pretty sound buy and develop (and sometimes sell on) policy which has worked well for us even if it has pissed us off sometimes.

Martinez is dismantling the club rapidly both on and off the field but I canÂ’t see him being allowed to do it this window to be honest.

Ah if only we still had the likes of Sir John in charge - an Evertonian and completely single minded and ruthless

The same can be said for his Â’mystery backersÂ’ who may be far less sentimental towards Roberto than Bill himself.

Last yearÂ’s accounts showed the business was moving in the right direction - now itÂ’s going south at a great rate of knots. Â’The Great Entrepeneur Â’ can expect a call anytime soon !

Noticed an interesting aside. On about 70 mins, Hull had a free kick after an Alcaraz foul outside our box. Martinez walked out of his technical area and waited by the mouth of the tunnel. Jones stood in the technical area. DonÂ’t know if Bob was ready to disappear if the shot went in.

Anyhow, I was as seduced by Martinez as many. ItÂ’s over. IÂ’ve seen dross under Bingham, a good team go bad quick under Lee, train wrecks under Kendall Mk 2 & 3 and pain with Smith. As sure as eggs are eggs, this team is finished under Martinez. Something needs to be done quick.

Thanks very little for the scarfs today, EFC. IÂ’ll put it with the hats from Southampton!

I never had any fears about Everton going the same way as Wigan due to our resources and support in comparison to theirs and I also looked to SwanseaÂ’s success as evidence that his philosophy would work. I now fear that he has tried to do too much too quickly with too little investment. We desperately need a plan B for those. increasingly regular, days when plan A fails. I just hope he realises and accepts this before things go too far!

Those who have the financial stake will not view the ClubÂ’s position as we do. Relegation will be seen by them as a disaster just as it would for us. Again, though, for a different reason.

Gotta believe, "There goes my fucking money!", will be the deciding factor on Roberto, not Lukaku isnÂ’t getting service.

If we donÂ’t start winning pronto, canÂ’t see Bill, or whoever it is controls the purse strings, waiting too much longer.

A longer term solution of RB is unlikely I think, but a good one nevertheless. McClaren is also a good shout for me. But I am sure there are plenty who would be qualified and would want the job.

The problem Bill has is that clearly changes are needed and there are suddenly a lot of players who seem past the "Sell by" date and new blood required.

Just to add to the conundrum, assuming there is not money in the kitty some wheeling and dealing is required and possibly even "Big" sales, SC,RB even JS/JMc.

The problem there is that if a load of money is raised would you or anyone trust RM to spend it well? I would not. So to reiterate, change is needed.

Thanks for reading, Ian

Brilliant support.

Depending on the response, he needs to act accordingly. The way we are playing means we will be relying on other teams to be worse than us.

Regardless of how much it costs to pay off Roberto, it must be cheaper than the cost of relegation.

We are in some serious shit looking at our upcoming fixtures.

Besides, surely Bill is smart enough to know that his own future at the club will be on the line if we go down.

Anyway, itÂ’s probably all fantasy IÂ’m afraid.

Can anyone tell me why Mirallas was subbed? Was he showing too much creativity as heÂ’s one of only a few who do?

I also noticed that Stones wasnÂ’t even on the bench which is odd as he was for the last game.

These players need a kick up the arse to bring passion and commitment to the game. The BBC article is right: Everton have gone soft!

Well one things for sure we are only going to get one more full house and that will be the derby, we wonÂ’t even get it for games against City and United because youÂ’d ve amazed at how quickly you can lose the fanÂ’s.

A few seasonÂ’s ago we beat Man City 1-0 on a Tuesday night, think it was February 2012 , there were only just over 29,000 there.

ItÂ’s going to reach a stage where even some of the 31,000 season ticket holders might not turn up every week if they get sick if it, unless all of us mugs come out in force in April when we are three points adrift of 18th place and fighting for survival.

Its 25 pound apparently to get in to the West Ham game on Tuesday night, a cold Tuesday night after Christmas and New Year when a lot of people are a bit more skint?

The way we are playing and it only being the 3rd round why not just 15 pound adults and a fiver for kids?

IÂ’m a mug and got my season ticket seat before we lost these four matches prior to Christmas, mainly due to the season ticket holders slight price reduction, still 20 quid mind you.

Im not sure what Bill will do but this team and the way it is set out reminds very much of Walker and Smith and when Royle left.

This forum has gone from being a Martinez love in to complete despair about him and Im embarrassed at all the anti-Moyes talk from last season.

Surely we can get out of this? Is relegation a possibility?!! Im devastated!!

Amazing what a run of victories can do to the confidence of both players and supporters; I havenÂ’t been on to any of the spudsÂ’ sites but IÂ’m sure the manager is now a genius, and Joe? doncha just lurve him.

My point is that our squad is no worse and probably no better than Spurs, because they are the same players that outplayed Arsenal and Chelsea for much of the game although they look a shadow of their collective selves.

I donÂ’t believe in the knee jerk sacking of managers, and history points to the fact that clubs who do sack at the drop of a hat are invariably doomed. BUT this will determine how good Martinez (and donÂ’t forget he was mooted as a future Barca manager less than a year ago) is. He will need to restore shattered confidence and surely realise that oldest of footballing cliches that clean sheets are everything.

So everyone out there, keep the faith and keep your nerve.

I hope the Manchester City match has this feeling at it, rather than annoying each other.

Come on, Lads...

DonÂ’t need to as I have more or less agreed with him all the way, I just didnÂ’t think it would happen so quickly and so devestatingly.

He looked like a man scared shitless in the Sky interview and so he should as stubborn as Moyes was, this fella is as fucking stupid.

Going down may well finish us financially, does anyone know how much we get in parachute payments?

BK can kiss his new build tata...

No plan B and teams have totally worked us out

They all know that if they work hard, close us down and counter well we will be knackered by 60 minutes. Jags looked fucked towards the end covering for Barry and Alcaraz

No fitness and No game plan, I have never seen a unhappier set of men in my entire life

Fucking set of Idiots at EFC

I obviously want RM to succeed. Any decision to call a taxi may be slowed by how the club view last seasonÂ’s record points haul, top of EL table and (still in!!!) the FA Cup and consequently be more forgiving of the current lapse. The situation is, however, entirely different from OFMÂ’s second season in charge when hovering in the lower regions of the league was almost the norm.

How long will they let this slump continue if it does? If we win no more games this month, do people really think the board would tolerate that? Three months of the season left and in the lower twenty points range and likely bottom 4? Every position in that table is significant in terms of ££££££Â’s. The board wonÂ’t ignore that. At most, I think he has two PL games to turn this around. 4 points minimum from those might buy him more time. Anything less and RM might be panicking along with the rest of us.

Given where we are at in the season and the paucity of available quality managers, I would be stunned if the board (regardless of what we may think of it) does not have a Plan B in mind even if RM doesnÂ’t.

That may put someone like McLaren in the frame if it comes to that - all things considered. Right now, IÂ’d prefer him to a former player to be honest, especially on an (unlikely) short term contract. He does appear to be able to motivate and organise even if he does fanny about with his hair too much.

I hope RM gets it right but the signs arenÂ’t good.

We have to bin him before itÂ’s too late. This clown is taking us down.

My observations were that as usual we were handsomely supported, though it went very in the away stand after the first goal. Martinez prowled around directly below me with a distinct air of dead man walking.

Jagielka got battered all afternoon and never spoke once – it was left to Naismith to distribute the encouragement and bollockings. HMS Barry at left back was a disaster. Kone looked rusty but half decent. Mirallas surely eyes better things elsewhere.

It was sad to see the blues give up so easily – I was reminded of Moyes’s visit to Goodison when all was already lost and beyond him. Everton played like that today.

Sad to see several hundred Evertonians filing through the exits after 75 minutes. They deserve better. Incidentally, our two reserve keepers and Robles warmed up right in front of me with the goalkeeping coach and they were very vigorous comparison to McGregor at the other end who had a Sunday league approach of various players belting the ball past him as and when the mood took.

I am not a fan of Bill in anyway; however, he is a fan of the team and when his vizog flashed up on the big screen today, he didnÂ’t look best pleased. LetÂ’s hope he is about to remind Bobby we are Everton, not a tinkermanÂ’s project.

"being 13th in the league doesnt set the alarm bells ringing with me"

Then with all due respect I think that statement is about as blinkered and complacent as it is when it comes from the fool in charge of team affairs at the moment. To answer your qualifying question to Chris I have watched Everton manager and boy over 40 years and my alarms are hammering at me.

The reason is because position pretty much means jack shit until the mathematical last few weeks of the season, and you can fly up or down the league very quickly. Now fair play to you if you think we will fly up rather than down but my reasons for worry are :

1. We are 4 points off bottom three but 6 points off the 10th team (and 15 off 4th for the eternal)
2. We are in freefall, playing badly and bottom of the form table and losing becomes a habit same as winning
3. We are haemmorhaging goals with only one club conceding more than us (by 2)
4. We play last seasonÂ’s champions in our next game and have some difficult fixtures coming up having taken 0 pts from 12 against poor out of form sides who we may have easily expected to take 9+ from. We are incidentally gifting these points to sides we may be expecting to be in the dogfight at the end of the season so that erodes the margin
5. We have no heart, no fight, no organisation and a manager who I donÂ’t believe has a clue how to address these problems and seems to have alienated a previously tight knit group of players, and indeed has repeatedly said recently that there are no problems with performances
6. We are now in a transfer window where I donÂ’t believe we have a cat in hillÂ’s chance of fending off bids for our better players as we have done previously given point 5 above

Do you know I could actually go on in this vein for a while but I am depressing myself?

ItÂ’s the managers fault. HeÂ’s lost it. WTF is he playing at with his formations? His tactics and the teams shape have gone out the window. An ageing midfielder at centre half, a left back in central midfield, Barkley the luxury not knowing what his role is at all, and where the hell was Naismith playing? Answers on a postcard.

IÂ’d desperately love to believe itÂ’s going to turn around but there are simply no signs whatsoever that itÂ’s going to happen-so for me cut RM loose and letÂ’s go another way. Mebbe we could tempt the Ajax management team over to us, despite the announcement that De Boer isnÂ’t leaving (that was in relation to the Newcastle job though)?

IÂ’m not so desperate for a win, it means more that we donÂ’t keep losing. Martinez is playing a supposed 4-2-3-1. It doesnÂ’t seem to be playing out that way to the eye. The 3 are usually hanging out up with the 1 so then itÂ’s more of a 4-2-4 system. Sometimes the 2 are entrenched in with the 4 then it looks like a 6-4 set up with no one to pick up the loose ball.

The most galling aspect is the system. When Wilshere or Xavi have the ball in midfield, they have 2, 3 or even 4 players showing and spinning or moving at angles into good space thus making the man in possession with easy choices. We donÂ’t. We have players hiding with the "If I do nothing, then I canÂ’t do something wrong" approach. This is short-changing us. This evident trait is the reason so many walked out at 70 odd minutes. Futile.

CromwellÂ’s statement. Go! In the name of God, just go!

If we lose heavily to City he might be fired, especially if West Ham beat us in the cup but he wonÂ’t get the boot yet.

A team devoid of hope and purpose. All this passing it for passingÂ’s sake drives me up the wall, absolutely pointless. "Cross it", "shoot" we kept screaming, but this would be followed be yet another sideways pass and then conceding possession. Our one attempt at goal in the first half was a cross, incredible really against a very poor side.

We donÂ’t have Xavi Hernandez or Iniesta or Xavi Alonso in our team, all experts at ball retention. Why canÂ’t our manager realise this? Every single one of us Blues does; the style of play is not suiting the players we have got. Whilst changes needed to be made at half-time, the decision to sub Besic instead of Barry, who was not in the game at all and who had just caused their calamitous second goal, was astonishing.

We needed 2 goals at least, yet Kone, who has an abysmal scoring record for a forward player, remained on the pitch for the entire game. In any event, we were shattered after 70 minutes and didnÂ’t look like scoring at all. The players wilting game after game is inexcusable. Under Moyes, we mounted so many comebacks and scored so many late goals.

Our concerns have primarily been focused on what we do on the field but now that concern has to move to the business off the pitch. We now need a reaction from BK and he alone must take charge of this appalling situation. We are a massive, massive club and nothing less is totally unacceptable.

My main concern now is that itÂ’s January and we are weak and wounded animal, we are easy pickings for the big boys!

The likes of Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal and ManU are dropping points and all have more than enough financial resources to take who they want from us. The dressing room is shattered, weÂ’ve no leadership or confidence and even a sniff of temptation for the likes of Stones, Coleman, McCarthy, Mirallas or Barkley will see transfer requests all over the place and we will be stripped of our future stars.

We need BK and his cronies to take charge of this situation before it is too late. We canÂ’t surely go into another home game in turmoil without changes being made at the top, not us.............not Everton.

Only person that could just about hold their head up was Naismith, he never stopped running all match, the rest looked like they had been on the ale until 4am this morning.

Four defeats in a row, 2 wins in ten, second most amount of goals conceded, only two clean sheets all season. HavenÂ’t won a game after going behind all season. Is that Burnley? Leicester? QPR? Maybe Crystal Palace or West Brom? No, itÂ’s Everton. A fucking disgrace.

How in half a season can a team that almost got into the Champions League turn into a team thatÂ’s heading to the Championship?

If we go out of the FA Cup on Tuesday night and Man City beat us, I think there will be a Taxi for Roberto.

At the moment, thereÂ’s no call from the stands of Roberto Out, itÂ’s the players that are copping the boos from the fans. But lose the next two game and I think that will change.

Something stinks at the moment and itÂ’s not the bogs at half time...

Now they are 4 points out of the basement three with Man City coming up. Mr Kenwright has to act quickly otherwise RM will take the Blues down to join Wigan. Just trying to get a draw seems to be beyond them so what price a victory then?

Some people may shrug it off as a bad run but this isn’t bad – it’s a disaster – and RM seems very casual about it. It’s time for drastic action now... not after another 5 games.

EverybodyÂ’s making points down at the bottom, changes are being made at managerial level, sleeves are being rolled-up, the Burnleys of this world are getting points at Manchester City and Sunderland, Crystal Palace will probably do another Houdini, even Leicester have stopped losing (well done today, lads, by the way). This same-self Hull City outfit had, until today, only once won at home. Well, of course they still hadnÂ’t hosted the mighty Toffees...

Sorry for all the cynicism, but I donÂ’t know where all this is going to lead to. The last time we played in the second tier was the year I was born. IÂ’d better not look into that crystal ball anymore.

Happy New Year.

This is Martinez talking about Utd buying Coleman.

Special indeed Senor Martinez. You have created a special atmosphere among supporters, and a special brand of fucking shit, ineffective football among players. Well done.

We have gone from "amazing", "phenomenal" to "Look at our performances, points tally, style of play last season"??

Roberto — it’s "this" season!! We have been piss poor since 1 July in pre-season!!!

The proper fans saw this... We are a stable club that pride ourselves on proper management and talking sense to the fans. I canÂ’t even listen to Martinez anymore, he talks that much shit.

Link

It's not nice.

I was all for giving him time, but after today I am not so sure simply not good enough for this club.

Whether he stays or goes most of these deadbeat playerÂ’s should be shown the door totally unacceptable and should be ashamed to be anywhere near the shirt they wore today.

Never wanted him, why appoint a manager who had just got a team relegated by playing the same football as we are now? The Rafa shouts are decent.

I have seen Lee, Kendall, Royle, Smith etc and this is by far the worst football I have seen. It is plain he lost the dressing room weeks ago!

I've seen some sensible comments in this thread about the players taking a bigger share of the blame but that's always the shout when things go badly wrong at a PL club. It doesn't make it wrong, but I don't see it as anywhere near the root cause here. Put simply this is a genuinely nice guy with some bold attractive footballing ideas whose been savagely caught out after the initial impetus drained away towards the end of last season. It's realky shocking to see his struggle to get it right. He's hampered by terrible luck with injuries and aweful refereeing decisions, not balanced by getting away with one penalty appeal at Hull.

But.....this manager has led us through an utterley hopeless pre season, watched as his squad clearly seemed to struggle for fitness, refused to strengthen the defence when early and blatently evidence suggested it was badly needed, and worse allowed an ageing squad to essentially go "over" the edge and arrogantly deny that result needs addressing with at least some alteration to our style of play.

There's other stuff of course, the never ending but still quite reasonable assessment that the club is critically under-invested in, that we haven't actually spent a penny of real money, just the tv bonanza and as such that won't give us any decent advantage over the competition. And yes it was a huge gamble on Lukaku when buying three players instead now looks like the obvious route despite the attraction of, for a little time, seeming to be "big spenders".

But for me the sense of fear amongst the supporters right now is palpable and it's based a little on all of the above, but much, much, more it's about the mgrs vision coming apart at the seams. The possession football from the back that's so obviously costing goals, the lack of tempo, of urgency when clearly needed. The terrible ineffective "shape" to the formations....all of them....tried in the last few weeks. The aweful lack of balance. When people say "the guys lost it" that's based on what they have seen and yes it's been quick this collapse but it is a collapse and no mistake.

Football has a real tendency to make you look stupid. Beat West Ham and then, a lot less likely, Man City a few days later and maybe the breathing time will produce a revival. I badly want it but I sense our proud record of giving mgrs time is about to be tested to breaking point. What a shame but we can't go down, it would finish us for a decade.

The performance against Hull was awful by our team (and the officials, too).

I think part of the reason some people have been slow to call for Roberto's head is that he seems a genuinely nice guy.

I had hoped that he could turn this around but I can't see it happening now

"But surely Garswood if you are a good manager it doesnt matter what league you are in. A good manager makes game changing decisions, substitutions etc and it shows in results and more importantly in players performances. RM is one dimensional and rigid in his gameplans and as its shown so often this season he simply hasnt got the nous to close a game out from a winning position. I don't think he will make it whatever division he manages in until he accepts that his way at the present time simply doesnt work. You can tell a good manager when he is the first to admit his mistakes and does everything he can to alter things."

I feel his best position is upfront where he has the skill and strength to open up defences, because he is wasted running around all day, just to keep some Everton fans happy.

Also, watching MOTD have you noticed how literally every other PL team plays so much faster and with so much more intensity than us? We play like a team still playing pre season friendlies.

Practice.

Doing the same thing over and over again.
Until you get better at it.

Just thought I would congratulate MotD tonight for making a comparison with Martinez at Wigan and at Everton only to see the same goals against at exactly the same games played. By the way, Wigan were relegated that year.

What has frightened me also is every team underneath us in the Premier League have fight & spirit: Hull, Burnley, Leicester, and Sunderland look far better than us, add WBA & Palace with new managers who are more than capable of grinding out results away from home, as proved today.

I don't think I have felt this sick after yet another defeat; I would take a decent British manager right now to take over this squad. For me, all it needs is a back-to-basics 4-4-2 or a defensive 4-5-1; RM is not capable of doing this as it goes against his "philosophy".

Get out of my club, Roberto, you are more suited working for Sky or BT Sport as a pundit talking utter bollocks, they will hang off your every word... Us Evertonians are not & never will be daft enough to fall for your "phenomenal" bullshit.

Just a final word on the fans who attended the game today, more hard earned coughed up to endure that utter shite performance. Total respect for each & everyone of you; you deserve better.

Yes, and that game was when it became evident we were going to have a poor season in the PL. I didn't realise how poor though.

Whatever his faults, Bill is a fan, goes to the game and has done for years. I was pleased to see he was at Hull. He knows we are now in deep, deep do-do. I can't see where the next point is coming from never mind a win.

We need some info from inside the camp, and we need a solution. Martinez didn't suddenly become a terrible manager. The players loved him last season. I had Gooners coming up to me saying Martinez was their next manager.

It's very, very odd.

But for me, while the Poll Identifies the perceived weaknesses, the truth is we could bring in the best Keeper and centre-back in the Premier League and it wouldn't, overall do us much good. Yes they might stop 'some' of the goals, but they won't stop ALL of them... we are set up to play that way.

The manager reiterated it only the other day, He doesn't think conceding goals and losing games is all that important in the overall scheme of things.

Therein lies the problem, cause and effect.

He doesn't think it needs sorting, he isn't going to sort it.

His Idea of ' back to basics ' is more of the same.

The only reason we will be in the draw for the 4th round of the cup, presuming it is on next Monday, is because we don't play until the Tuesday.

There are no wheels left to fall off and we're going nowhere.

Sort it Bill, FFS.

Distin questioned Martinez's training methods and was sent home for 10 days and then frozen out for a period of time. Fitness staff have resigned as they disagree with his methods.

Martinez put the injuries down to players diet and sent the fitness/dietician from Wigan to some of the players' houses to prepare their food (show them how to prepare). Players were asked to take photos of what they were eating and send them to Martinez. The Players think he is 'eccentric'.

I just met him tonight at a NY Day dinner and asked him what the hell was going on at the club and posted what I was told. The players who had their meals prepared thought their manager had gone soft.

100% bang on.

If you treat adults like children........

When your trust & integrity is questioned then the reaction is never positive.

Has it really got to this at our club.

I will wake up and all this shit will be a bad dream!

To those of you who still think Martinez's troop will turn it around, stop kidding yourselves. He needs to go, as does Barry, Alcaraz, Distin and McGeady.

I am looking at our forthcoming fixtures and already planning for life in the Championship because I have seen MUCH better teams than EFC 2014-15 get relegated in the past....

We took a gamble and it backfired. Mark my words, this is the end.

As Phil & James 237 & 241 have suggested, commercial reality is about to set in. No doubt the board of EFC Ltd will meet and decide on a plan to prevent the financial disaster that relegation represents. That is their job and what boards do when danger to the financial stability of their organisation threatens. Sounds bit cold and harsh but that is the reality.

I hope they get it right.

We as a fan base will then have to play our part and get behind the club and whoever is managing the team.

Forget pre season fitness endeavour, don't worry about set pieces just keep hold of the ball and pass it. Well that philosophy sounds great to these over paid lazy pricks in this team. Andy Gray is right Martinez has made them soft. There is no other way to get that work ethic and pride back to this club unless there is a change of manager.

Is there no end to these Catalan Cunning Plans

If they do not take action now and GET RID and we end up in the Championship playing Wigan then that too will be the fault of BK and the board.

However, this particular story seems over egged for 'he's lost the plot' eyebrow raising effect.

Firstly, why would Martinez ask a member of the Wigan staff to work on the eating habits of Everton players?

Did this dietary double-agent call around the players houses on the same day or over a period of time?
How did he manage it whilst ensuring they all ate at a reasonable hour? When you factor in the number of players, prep, cooking time and travel, some poor fucker's still going to be sat there with a grumbling gut at midnight, having a right good moan about the snail paced service and swearing to "give it another five minutes and then I'm ordering a fucking kebab".

What if they weren't at home when he called?

If he asked this Wigan wonder chef to pop round the players house's and prepare their meals, why would Martinez then demand photographic evidence of what he'd made? Did he not fully trust the guy he assigned this mealtime mission to or something? Did Martinez think some treacherous soul would attempt to sabotage his finely tuned tasting menu by posting a Frey Bentos pie through the fucking letterbox five minutes after Marco Pierre Wiganite pissed off? Has he just watched too much Masterchef and wanted to make sure the presentation was on point?

Things are bad enough at the moment without unfounded rumours being accepted at face value and passed on as if fact.

A couple of days ago it was stated that some unnamed source 'who used to work at the club' had said Besic had stormed out in a huff and Oviedo would never be seen playing for the first-team again because both had fallen out with the manager. Both were out on the pitch yesterday.

Then it was Garbutt, who had initially been said to have picked up a knock, being banished from the squad for 'slagging off Martinez's training methods'. Even though he didn't. In a post-match interview he just happened to mention that they hadn't worked on that particular formation prior to the game.

Then we had an unnamed players arl fella supposedly telling his mate, who told someone else, that none of the first team were even on talking terms with Martinez anymore. Apparently, whenever he tries to say anything, the players just talk over him like Alan Partidge refusing to listen to Lynn as she attempts to list the merits of a mini-metro: "Go on, try and finish the sentence and see what I do".

That might appear to be the case from the shite they're currently serving up, but all this 'insider info' is little more than finger pointing and speculation posing as secret whispers. If enough players were that pissed off with the man in charge they would surely have gone crying to Kenwright about it before now.

Results and performances are proof enough that things have gone tits up. They're what any manager should be judged on, not mischievous rumour run rampant.

That's the positives out of the way. What really surprised me was how poor our passing was. Even the short passes were regularly intercepted or just plain off target. Extremely unacceptable.

Not the first time this has happened, but at 2-0 down for half a match of football, to still have a substitution up your sleeve and Eto'o on the bench defied logic.

Finally, as much as I think Martinez has lost the players and should go, I really think appointing Duncan Ferguson as first team coach was one of his biggest mistakes. There are some very accomplished footballers at Everton both playing and working off the pitch - Ferguson is not one them. I may be risking my virtual neck by saying this, but he was not half as good as how people remember him, and I dare say a lot of our players may not have even heard of him as a player until they came to the club.

If they need a quick, cheap solution, sack RM, name one of the players as player-manager, and let the players sort it out themselves. They are a good enough bunch of players to get out of this, but obviously they have no desire to play for the man in the suit. Any other manager would have had those players taking 10-12 points from the last four matches.

It's all very depressing and when the players are so lacklustre over such a number of games, it's natural that there will be speculation. I do agree though that we should concentrate on the evidence in front of us, which is indeed quite enough to be going on with.

There is quite enough shit that we can see with our own eyes without needing to comment on stuff we just don't know.

A current PL team has conceded 33 goals in their first 20 games.

What is the common factor.

NO prizes for guessing its our current manager and hopefully that is the end of any similarity..

IMO it is too late to save RM because the players and most of the supporters have lost faith in him and it is not possible to recover from that.

I said a few weeks ago that big Joe could step in to salvage this season but its a taxi for RM ASAP!!!

The season has indeed gone tits up, hard to believe Wolfsburg was less than six weeks ago.

The $64k question is will the form carry on or is it just an horrendous run of nine games? Personally I think it would be counter productive to panic at this stage, however if we go another month in a similar vein then drastic action may be required.

Record season ticket sales? ThatÂ’s what I think anyway, and if Evertonians vote with there feet on Tuesday, it could be the end for the manager.

Moyes played with 10 men at times, with his usual selection of hibbert and osman, but he had leaders from the back with Phil Neville to the front with Cahil. I thought Phill neville brought nothing to our team as a footballer but man oh man now I do realize the impact he had with his voice. We would be one of the hardest teams to break down and we were impeccable at scoring late goals. We fought to the very end. I just don't see a leader in our team to give the rest of the squad that sense of direction.

My assumption, and this is purely mine, is that something went on towards the end of last season between the manager and his players. We were unstoppable, every1 was saying we could beat any1 in the world on our day. We all witnessed history in the making, we outplayed arsenal at their own game, we won at old trafford after centuries. So my assumption is that towards the end of the season is where the falling out began and it hasnt resolved since.

Moyes said we're taking a knife to a gunfight against city, well that must have demoralised our squad but next week we'll be walking in empty handed to a slaughterhouse if nothing changes. We might as well play our under 21s and give them the pleasure of experiencing the premier league. They've worked their whole life up for that moment and they definitely won't take it for granted like our senior squad is.

Win or lose these next 2 matches, (probably wont win) i'm going to walk the streets with my Everton jersey. I'll take all the mockery every-one throws at me and I'll still be able to say I love my club to the very end and am not ashamed of it. What I can't do is just sit here and watch them slowly get relegated. The Everton I started supporting had the most fight, hunger and desire in the premier league, not the most talent. That's what made us the best of the rest.

Moyes played with 10 men at times, with his usual selection of hibbert and osman, but he had leaders from the back with Phil Neville to the front with Cahil. I thought Phill neville brought nothing to our team as a footballer but man oh man now I do realize the impact he had with his voice. We would be one of the hardest teams to break down and we were impeccable at scoring late goals. We fought to the very end. I just don't see a leader in our team to give the rest of the squad that sense of direction.

My assumption, and this is purely mine, is that something went on towards the end of last season between the manager and his players. We were unstoppable, every1 was saying we could beat any1 in the world on our day. We all witnessed history in the making, we outplayed arsenal at their own game, we won at old trafford after centuries. So my assumption is that towards the end of the season is where the falling out began and it hasnt resolved since.

Moyes said we're taking a knife to a gunfight against city, well that must have demoralised our squad but next week we'll be walking in empty handed to a slaughterhouse if nothing changes. We might as well play our under 21s and give them the pleasure of experiencing the premier league. They've worked their whole life up for that moment and they definitely won't take it for granted like our senior squad is.

Win or lose these next 2 matches, (probably wont win) i'm going to walk the streets with my Everton jersey. I'll take all the mockery every-one throws at me and I'll still be able to say I love my club to the very end and am not ashamed of it. What I can't do is just sit here and watch them slowly get relegated. The Everton I started supporting had the most fight, hunger and desire in the premier league, not the most talent. That's what made us the best of the rest.

We should gave won by more goals
He's got ginger hair
He's dour
He dithers
KITAP1
We only finish 4,5,6th
We will never win the EPL
Etc....

Then we had this BU appear on the scene (where are you when we now need you?) and join in with all their anti stuff. Anyone like myself who tried to support Moyes was accused of being a 'Moyes apologist'. Heaven forbid making the suggestion 'we should be careful what we wish for' as this would also be met with a tide of derision from the anti Moyes clan.

The appointment of Relegation Roberto was met with almost universal joy, but why? Well he'd won a cup so we were told unlike Moyes he was a 'winner', any view that this was a one off fluke and actually the biggest indicator of his ability was the fact that he'd just relegated his last team was ignored, no doubt influenced by a gushing Martinez supporting media.

So what does this matter, it's all history? We are where we are. Well this is the point, it's history and we should learn from history. It's now time that we, that is, BK, the club, the fans, recognise and acknowledge the mistake of his appointment and start to make some smart, objective decisions based on facts and reality rather than prejudice, or dreamer ideologies. As fans we can start the ball rolling now by showing our feelings against RM, not the players though as they will really need our support. It is only when this manager leaves our club and we bring in a manager with a record, style and ethos that are aligned to our club that we will start the recovery. Come on BK time to lead.

Make no mistake the stats don't lie, we are in full on tail spin, one entirely of Martinez's making and we need someone fresh to get us out of it PDQ.

I think if you were minded to look back through the TW archives, you'd find that an awful lot of us were very unhappy with the appointment at the time.

I don't want to be a 'told you so' pain in the arse about it, but I told you so. Plenty of people on here were furious when BK rolled the smiling clown out at that painful press conference, but being proved right doesn't make me feel good, especially since last season I was happy to be proved wrong.

Martinez is a one-trick-pony, just as was already proven at Wigan. He got lucky last year, riding the crest of the wave with a team that knew how to 'not lose' games better than anyone, after the Moyes years.

If by some miracle Martinez turns the boat round, and turns this team into winners again, I'll happily be proved wrong again but can anyone really see anything different happening now?

We kept our players, sent out a message we were not a selling club anymore, everything was rosy last season.

In no way can Bill be blamed for any of this, hes had his knockers but last season he did all he could for the club he loves.

What Bill needs to do is get Martinez in his office, read him the riot act and if results do not improve,he will be joining his former chairman away from football or at least at Goodison.

By all means rant and rave about the managers one trick pony but to have a sly dig at Bill is a bit below the belt.

As much as it's easy to slate RM, when are the fans gonna start kicking these overpaid Prima Donnas' arses? The lazy bastards are letting our great club become a fucking laughing stock.

I have supported My club for 50 years,and always will, I have a season ticket but I will never set foot inside Goodison Park again until Martinez and his bunch of fuckin clowns have pissed off for good

We are now in a really difficult situation; I suspect without fan and media pressure Martinez will stay... in which case, I am left to simply hope my personal judgement about him is bollocks and he'll by some miracle get us into the top 6. It wouldn't be the first time I've spouted a load of bollocks, though, so I live in hope rather than expectation.

NO MORE MR NICE GUY!

Enough is enough, there is a huge amount of evidence that – as nice as he is (and he is nice) – he is out of his depth and he will get us relegated. BK is going to have to say goodbye so he might as well do it now rather than wait until it's all too late.

Thanks for a brief sense of hope and excitement, Roberto, but the players and the fans have sussed you out, your not good enough, so save Bill the job and please resign.

In any case it's pretty obvious something has to give. One option is that the board are brave, get rid of RM and get a new manager with some dosh to freshen up things. However I feel that this is probably not going to happen and we will be left muddling on for another 8 or 9 matches to see how it goes. If it hasn't improved by then then any change will likely be too late. Think Fulham last season.

Least they are bouncing back from the Championship this season..... Aren't they?