Lukaku misses great chance to win it

Mirallas on for Barkley and Cleverley for McCarthy what a fucking shambolic 45 minutes without creating anything.

I see Watford winning this as they are at least playing with some energy – not like this insipid pile of shite from the clueless one.

I'm starting to feel upbeat again to see who our new manager is going to be, we can't keep this muppet can we?

It's only up from here, NSNO.

I have turned the TV to another game.

I refuse to watch this crap from Everton and I will not watch Everton again until something is done to really change the team.

He's finally got us off 38 points....

Not underachieving though!!!!

The continual long hoofs to Lukaku are worrying and puzzling. That's back to the pre Moyes days. What's happened to the manager's pass-and-move philosophy?

We really are going backwards in every aspect. Martinez out ASAP.

We are safe so let's have Galloway and Holgate with a few kids on the bench. It's not like Howard needs to be there and Kone is just an oxygen thief.

Absolutely insane that this man hasn't been shown the door after two seasons of worsening football and results. I have to believe it's only a matter of time.

Sack him now. He should have gone last season but we were asked to give him till Xmas.

We did and it only proved what we already knew.

He just hasn't got what it takes to manage a massive club like Everton. Get Gus asap.

Our win return is pathetic, what's that now?

About 4 wins in the last 20??

And we really thought the Moyes days were bad. We are looking more and more like Wigan every week.

Geri really is becoming one of those wingers with no end product, he needs to sort himself out.

Finally, Lukaku was almost as poor as last week, so slow off the mark.

A draw was a fair result as Robles made a couple of decent saves. Considering that Watford have been on such a poor run, and we have come in for some stick, it was a fairly lame affair.

Everyone always says with Martinez, it's always going to be great tomorrow. Well it's the same with the John Stones fan club, he is destined to be great in the future, it's always tomorrow with this liability.

This is worse than the dark days in the '70s.

In over 50 years of watching them, I cannot recall a team bereft of ideas of how to win a football game.

Lukaku has given up, Barkley needs a break, Stones has lost all confidence, the full backs have gone backwards, there's nothing there.

This man has ruined a decent team, which in Moyes's last season was beginning to show nice touches.

I just despair.

We need a manager who manages and coaches a team to win games not allow a load of very talented individuals to play football without any chemistry. Mourhino is available (cause I don't believe he is going to Man United).

He is an excellent footballer now and he will improve with age.

He had an imperious game as recently as last week against Man Utd when he was MotM. He has had many outstanding games this season when the team have been poor, so it's not 'jam tomorrow' with John Stones, as you claim.

Today was another error of judgement by him that led to the corner they equalised from, akin to the suicidal back pass to Howard in the Swansea game which at the time I also held him responsible for.

I accept Stones's play that led to the corner was unnecessary, but it was poor defending at the far post and weak goalkeeping by Robles on his near post that actually conceded the goal.

Poor decision making by Stones, definitely. Poor game management and basic defending at the corner from the team, especially so close to half-time and having just taken the lead, also definitely.

No Niasse again, I am guessing the whispers from Finch Farm are true. Martinez out!

I said before today's game we'd win one more game this season and I thought it'd be today; I was wrong. We won't win another game this season now: draw at Sunderland defeat at Liverpool and a loss and 2 draws in the remaining home games is my prediction and I'm sticking with it.

14th in the Premier League – an absolute insult to our brilliant supporters who travelled today and those everywhere. When is this going to end? It's embarrassing.

Fear not, others will be along shortly to blame Robles for not coming out (like they did Howard in a similar situation) They will also blame Coleman, Robles, the post, the ref, and presumably those of us who don't understand the genius that is John Stones on the corner kick itself. I have figured it out that Stones is like a really great poet or painter in that his true skills and greatness cannot be appreciated by the masses until he is gone.

I know, it is only one mistake he made (again) right?

We have registered 5 wins in the last 21.

Alarmingly though 4 have been against the two teams everyone beats, Newcastle and Aston Villa.

Doing a fantastic phenomenal job Roberto.

What is he, 22? I hope we keep him and I hope we keep Ramiro as well. We'll have two good young centre halves.

The thing is, the whole team set up and how they are coached, needs to be looked at. So Peter, here's another member and he's a great young player.

We don't need to get rid of fine young players. We desperately need to get someone him who can coach them into the whole of the centre half duties.

I thought Joel made 2 top drawer saves today. It's a shame the defenders in front of him let him down.

I hope Jags has not hurt his hammy as we do need him fit for the semi.

From a selection stand point, I think Mirallas did more in 20 mins than Deulofeu, Lukaku and Barkley have done in the last 3 games. He looked dangerous and sharp and deserves to be in the first XI.

Cleverley for Barkley also improved us as Baines pushed on and we started threatening from both flanks.

That leaves the riddle within a puzzle that is Romelu Lukaku. He had a shocker, but with Niasse and Kone not adequate replacements he will have to remain in the XI. Stones was poor too but Funes Mori is not exactly playing with confidence and may need to stand in for Jags.

Lennon and Mirallas are our sparks. Keep them in the first XI and try and build around them for the next 6 games.

Let's face it, it's always the same with Kenwright. As long as we are clear of the drop zone and have the odd cup run, he's doesn't give a flying fuck as long as he keeps his beloved Chairman's seat.

If he was any kind of decent Evertonian he would have ended this farcical situation weeks ago.

Martinez has to go, and BK needs to be shipped out straight behind him.

'What a manager' ...indeed.

We were a lot better today when Cleverley came on. Lennon is lost on the left and should be on the right, we'd get the best out of him and Coleman that way.

I can't wait for the excuses from this phenomenally inept manager. Get rid now, please.

Barkley scored a few at the start of the season but he has been pretty average at best over the past month. Cleverley never scores and neither does Barry. McCarthy scored a very rare goal today and Besic never scores. Why do we sign spoilers rather than creators? It seems that we have had an inferiority complex throughout DM's reign and now Martinez. How are we going to win the FA cup without scorers in the side?

Football is all about scoring goals and preventing opponents from scoring. Creativity provides goals and organized defending prevents goals...

Leicester are the best in the league at these basic skills. Arsenal threw away a two goal lead today and could not contain Carroll FFS. We also struggled against the same West Ham tactics. Combative defending against big strikers should be bread and butter for professional defenders.

Just get Martinez gone asap.

“It's a disappointment to concede from a dead ball situation so close to half time and because of the nature of the goal, the deflection.

"And the amount of chances we created, we showed a little bit of rustiness from the last few games. Another day we would have scored the winning goal."

So who has the problem with English now Señor? Rustiness is when you don't play. We have played just 6 days ago. so close to half time. Forget the when their goal happened, aren't you just disappointed how it happened? And I'm not sure their manager agrees that they were "at their best" just not as bad as they had been.

I'm sure Mr Moshiri has already started the plan for structural change within the management and coaching set up at the club and has already worked out the exit strategy for Martinez, which will allow him the opportunity to go out on a high by winning the FA Cup, a win win for both manager and the club. If Martinez can't deliver the Cup then his prospects of attracting another club when he's let go at the end of the season will be severely weakened.

There really is light at the end of this tunnel and it's not a train but a taxi for Martinez

Absolute rubbish, they were terrible!! Absolutely no credibility left please can we make a change, someone, anyone???

Emperor Kenwright and Woods were in the crowd. Kenwright's whistling showtunes, thinking 'what a manager', while Everton Football Club falls apart.

Time to extricate Kenwright's mutton paw from Farhad Moshiri's shoulder. And also wave goodbye to the relegator.

Be careful what you wish for? I don't effing care, enough of this shite already

I want Martinez to work for me when he gets sacked. He can tell my missus that despite the fact I've done nowt whatsoever, the garden reflects the natural beauty of something left to grow wild and free and she should be pleased with my phenomenal moments of total inactivity!

I appreciate John Stones greatly, I think he will become a star, but his form this year has been dreadful. His pass back to Robles was daft, but someone should have drilled it into his 21 year old head that when you have scored just before half time you do not mess about, you take your lead into the interval. Nobody has done so, and the ultimate responsibility therefore lies with his boss.

The defending at the ensuing corner was pitiful all round.

This was another soulless performance.

Players don't want to play for him anymore. We are absolute garbage right now. Any other season, and this would be relegation form.

Bus for Martinez and his mates please!!!!

Martinez instead will praise Stones for being brave........and their in lies the problem. There is no discipline or teaching of basic football principles in the team at all, its all just the Martinez philosophy instead.

Get the fucker out now!

We field a team full of internationals (goalkeeper apart), obviously all of them thinking that they should be playing in the Champions League, so why are we languishing in 14th, still a point shy of the magical 40 (which almost certainly won't be needed this season).

Yes I'm with everyone, on the bizarre substitutions, the inability to kill a game off etc, but FFS surely some of the players should be held accountable for some lamentable performances.

Yet another season that I can't wait to finish.

(1) What exactly is his position?
(2) When is he going to realise his "potential"?
(3) Why, why, why does he lose possession so easily, so often?
(4) How come he's not expected to offer anything defensively?
(5) How the friggin 'ell does he play for England?

Everton 2 Wigan 1
Everton with 26 shots, 14 on target

"Wigan boss Roberto Martinez:

"Overall I look at the game and, if I'm honest, I would've been disappointed with a draw let alone a defeat. It (the penalty) was a soft decision, but then all afternoon not a single break went our way.

"I thought the players deserved a lot out of the game, but the key moments went against us. A defeat doesn't reflect the effort we put in at all.

"The character in the squad has never been in doubt. We're growing in every game and the results are not reflecting the good work of the players in the league, I don't think we're getting what we deserved.

"But you can see the progress on the pitch nonetheless and if we keep improving as we are, we'll be OK."

Sound familiar?

But hey, teary-eyed Kenwright is looking forward to his London day out.

What a manager... you can't make it up.

If players are unhappy they are unhappy; remove the cancer now.

The goalie isn't always ready for this task and hence , we see a fair few punts going high into Row T on the West/East stand Surely it is better for a real outfield player to use his skill to try a diagonal pass or a hopeful punt towards the penalty area, rather than this idea of rolling it further back to the keeper to try something harder.

It is hard to know what is going on at the moment. I would suggest that the players on the whole are just as fed-up as the fans, and are all pinning their hopes on the semi-final.

I know they want to cement their places in the side for that game, but many of them are definite starters, barring injury. This could explain Rom's woeful form and Barkley's complete shrinkage from the player of a few months back.

I expect similar performances at Palace, but hopefully a bit more effort at Anfield, before the display of the season in the semi. Hope springs eternal – I am completely fed-up with Martinez, but I hope that the players, will conjure something special up for us all in a couple of weeks time.

The useless one needs to put Lennon back out on the right. Then put Kev out in his preferred position wide left.

Get Kev to work more closely with Baines. And as long as Lukaku gets his shit together we should return to be once again, an attacking force.

I feel if this does not happen then forget any cup aspirations.

I can feel now that anger among us is turning to despondency and I'll change my general support for the board if they do not remove this clown. Swansea got rid of Garry Monk because they did not accept the results he was producing but we are EFC not Swansea, we are 14th in the League and our board accept it.

Someone asked on another thread who should replace Lukaku? Search over: I can.

Can I stand around and point? Yep
Can I let the ball bounce off my shins? Yep
Can I run aimlessly into the opposition? Yep
Can I loose 90% of headers even though I'm a 6ft plus beast? Yep
Can I amble after through balls without any sign of interest? Yep
Can I miss sitters from three yards out? Yep

No problem give me £60k a week and I'm there. If some fool offers us £50m for him we should bite their hands off.

I'm ashamed to admit with relegation a non-threat I would have been happy to lose today to ramp up more pressure on Martinez as it's quite obvious now to most of us who understand the game that he has lost it and is out of his depth – he has to go! Now! Please please go, Roberto, you're obviously a nice guy but WE don't want you

I wish you all the best and no hard feelings but I and most of us have had enough now

The most worrying statement a few weeks ago from Billy Bullshit was 'What a manager' – are you fucking serious, Bill You need to revisit your statement and sooner rather than later.

Martinez, please please go.

Mirallas is subbed on – to play on the left? Don't be daft, to allow Lennon to play out of position on the left.

Nothing is ever learned, and it's been that way for far too long. God knows what we do now. Win the cup? Oh aye?

I was a season ticket holder in the '70s; we had some great players and I can't remember the team flirting with relegation or being devoid of any passion or commitment to the cause.

Andy King, Mick Lyons, Duncan Mckenzie, Bob Latchford, and Martin Dobson –if only we had that calibre of player today instead of this bunch of overpaid wasters. Billy Bingham at least tried to play entertaining football. I much prefer him to this Spaniard and his gobbledygook.

14th place tells the real story and yes Martinez has made loads of wrong decisions, we all have witnessed that. But surely the players have to take a large portion of that blame also.

All I see is a shower of spineless pricks. No fight or no interest in rectifying their mistakes. On paper we should be in the top 4, but our position shows us for what we really are, a bunch of average players. You know what they – say don't believe everything you read. The problem is the players seem to believe it, even though they can't produce it on the pitch.

So yes, let's hope Martinez is gone for next season. But just remember it's those spineless lazy pricks that have the ball at their feet and not Martinez. Sure you can blame his tactics and substitutions. But when was the last time you saw this sorry bunch show and ounce of bottle, grit or fight?

I would say thank you to the guys who held the Martinez out banner, and let's hope there are even more on show for the home game against Southampton. Then Funes Mori will be under no doubt what the fans think of Martinez, because maybe up to now he has only heard Kenwright's view of the manager.

I really think he's lost the dressing room. The players aren't performing for him. I saw a shocking statistic earlier in the week that only Aston Villa had a worse record for winning back the ball and closing down. We did the graft against Chelsea in the cup but the players seem to be going through the motions in the league, much like Chelsea before Maureen was given his P45. I think there's a good chance the players would get a second wind, improve, and lose this malaise if Martinez left now.

My only concern is who's at the club could take the mantle for the remaining games?! I'm not sure about Joe Royle, Sheedy, Dunc, or David Unsworth. We need a top manager who is out of work and will be Everton manager next season. The only person I can think of is Mourinho. Could we get him?!

You want change? Stop going to the game and whatever you do don't buy a season ticket. An empty ground is a very powerful message while comments on here have no impact whatsoever. Get a life and give Everton a life.

He hasn't got a clue. He stuck with a mediocre manager for 11 years and then hired a guy with absolutely no track record on the basis of one performance by Wigan against us in the Cup.

I'm watching City against West Bromwich and West Bromwich have got far more fight in them than our sorry lot.

It's hilarious and ironic that the biggest bullshitter at the club, Kenwright, has been had by an even bigger bullshitter.

Phenomenal stuff....

I also am a great admirer of John Stones footballing ability, its a joy to watch, but when he crosses that white line, it is John Stones who makes the decisions and no-one else.

The problem is he is not learning.

This is a huge statement for me, but I'd cut our loses now and give Moyes the job until the end of the season, with onus on until the end of the season. He's out of work (so no compensation) and it would be his one chance to redeem himself in the eyes of many. We'd tighten up at the back, if anything else.

I'm in no way saying I want David Moyes as Everton manager. I just think he could be a convenient option that would suit both parties until the summer.

Is it time to put my bins out again? Full of Martinez and Garth Crooks. Difficult decision as to who is the greater clueless useless tosser. (If you missed Final Score, you may miss the point.)

Stand up Leighton Baines. We love you and you love Everton.

Is it a coincidence that both Barkley and Stones look far happier playing for England than for Everton?

Imagine how hard it must be to have your self belief and team spirit pushed sideways all week and then be expected to get on to the pitch and be a sixes and sevens on public display against well drilled opposition. Mind-blowing...

The manager is the most important player at the Club. End of story. When he is on another planet, let alone wavelength, then it becomes impossible to play to your strengths.

I just watched the post match interview and it was scary. The body language, from the neck up at least was nervous, twitchy, rapid eye movement, stammers and stutters and all the usual bull.

Dead man talking I'm afraid and don't ever blame the players. In reality they are the only way to get rid of the clown. And that is what we are seeing them trying to do...

I couldn't agree more. Lukaku is just so slow. Couldn't hit a banjo with a cows arse at the moment.

As Jim Royal would say,

"Champions League, my arse".

I don't want Pullis at Everton, but when you consider his teams showing more pride and endeavor than Martinez's, it shows what a poor manager we have.

MARTINEZ OUT!

He may still be trying to play with a bit of swagger but it's seemingly battling for control with a hefty serving of self-doubt. He's not the only one though. The entire team currently has the brittle confidence of The Elephant Man on a blind date. Bit of Brut splashed on his bumps and he thinks he's almost guaranteed to get his end away, but as soon as someone says "Giz a look under yer sack.....John", he's suddenly gasping for breath (even more than usual) and wondering how the fuck he's going to get out of this one. It's the same with this squad. Despite all the declarations of belief in their own ability, they're mentally soft as shit and fold as soon as the pressure begins to mount.

You know you're in a bad way when giving away a stupid corner, against sodding Watford, is served up as the reason we didn't win. Just shrug it off. Redouble your efforts. React to a set-back in some other way than rapidly slumping your shoulders and saying 'woe is me'.

Then again, when your manager deems it necessary to point out that "Watford were at their very best today" in order to dampen disappointment in yet another dishevelled dosser of a performance, what else should we expect from those who serve under him?

"Watford were at their very best today"? Well, that is formidable. We're talking about fucking Watford at the end of the day.

"Watford were at their very best today"? It comes across like a sympathy seeking hooker stating she had a "right rough night, last night", only to then go on and reveal it was "coz Cliff Richard was at his most sexually rampant".

There need to be more banners, more fly-bys until it's impossible to stay. If he doesn't go, we will be royally screwed next season.

Harry Bassett is the sort of jobber who can keep us up and win the cup. He'd probably do it pro bono for the publicity. Then sack him in the summer and bring in someone proper for the long term.

Someone would be ideal but if not him then Allegri or someone else quality. None of these cheap options crap with Howe or Southgate.

All you Lukaku worshippers, read Stephen's post because it tells you all you need to know about the self-confessed one of the world's best strikers. I'd be happy just to get our money back.

It can't be the Burnley manager! My wife would be crushed! I'd not score for months. Have a heart!

I'm right with you there mate, about not going to Goodison. That's the kind of action that needs to be taken.

The odd banner and shouts of Martinez out are fucking useless but an empty stadium and they will seriously get what we as fans won't tolerate.

Any money loss and this board will sit up and listen to what we having been saying all season.

So I won't be again untill next season.

The way we look at Watford is the way the rest of the league look at Everton.

That is Martinez's legacy.

They are better than the way they have played the last few league matches, Martinez has had his chances, more than enough, he has failed badly, put Barry in charge until the end of the season, and let him and the senior players organise the training and planning until then.

The biggest disappointment today was Jagielka getting injured, he will be a big loss while he is out.

"The support was magnificent"

"Watford were at their very best today"

"We showed a little rustiness"

"It was a very complete performance from both teams"

Can Bobby bullshit get any more deluded comments from a 4-minute interview?

Today, Everton did not play as a team and crosses never met their intended targets. Thank heavens Everton met Watford today and not a better team, because another result against another team could have been an embarrassment.

I am going on the train from Manchester, and I reckon the day will cost me 𧶀, so anything less than absolute full on will be no good. But if we lose, I suspect it will be the end of him.

What?? A Manager!?

I personally believe Kenwright was misquoted. What he actually did was make a demand of the interviewer, not praise our manager...

Water Man! A Jar!

Defensively we are worse despite having quality defenders who somehow were spearheading one of the leagues best defenses under the previous manager. We have quality attacking players but they don't get goals. Instead we play with at least 2 and in many cases 3 defensive midfielders when Cleverly is healthy.

How is he still in a job. When will someone in the media get a quote from someone on the Board? The supporters really must get more and more vocal. The media is now starting to pay attention, but not nearly enough.

We know the sentiments to be expressed. We want you our Roberto.

Quite sure social media can make it well known and 20,000 all chanting it will not go un-noticed

I also blame the players,what happened to their pride in the shirt,what happened to them playing for the fans?

Surely grown men don't need a pep talk to perform.

Martinez's after match interview on the BBC was just laden with bullshit and peppered with contradictions. Signs of a frightened man (his eyes looked like he had cried, or was about to).

BBC interviewer: "Do you feel perhaps its inevitable that the FA Cup might start to appear on player's minds at this stage?" – a point Roberto alluded to last week as just another excuse for a poor performance!

Roberto Martinez: "No, I think that everyone knows that we've got a large squad. I think that there are many players, that they can play. The competition for places is always as strong and we would rely on each other." – Kone and Niasse not troubling Lukaku then! – and that answer had fuck all to do with the question.

"We've got a real intense period now, probably the most significant period of the season." – oh, the other part of the season did not count then, Mr Martinez?.

"To have 5 games in 5 days is what we want." – It's exactly what we fans don't want, with an already rusty outfit!

"So, I don't think anyone can have any sort of distraction of thinking any further than the next game." – a lot of these players are very distracted, Stones, Baines, Lukaku, to mention just a few!

I also don't understand Chinese writing!

Farrelly, Carl Tiler and Mitch Ward; Lukaku, Barkley and Stones.... The difference in quality is enormous yet our manager is on course for one of the lowest points tally in Everton's history.

We have the opportunity to break that barrier a game earlier this time around. In RM's first season we broke the 40 point barrier after playing 21 games.

Enough is enough, we need a change, cup or no cup, the performance was better but the sloppiness at crossing the ball cost us two additional points and until the team is geared up to win rather than manage games this will often be the case.

This lot are not going to take the piss out of my kids and myself again.

ANGRY? VERY!!!

So much for my new Zen approach. It's Kenwright; the thought of his mediocre, hammy smugness does it every time.

You saw how much media coverage those two banners got today and I expect a very good Southampton to turn us over. We need to all go there together that day and have our protest, otherwise we will remain a minority chirping away in the corner with nobody paying us attention.

Anyone who thinks this is a fully capable squad minus the managing is living in a reductionist fantasy. Sure the potential is there, but crap in one hand and put potential in the other; see which one fills up first. Our boys just didn't execute out there today.

Sure we created some chances here and there, but our composure in the final third was garbage. Poor effort today.

Is Bill too embarrassed to admit he chose the wrong man? Is it that simple?

I will be very surprised if we beat any team at the minute, and people who think we will just find a bit of form for the semi-final are thinking more in hope.

You can't turn form on and off like a tap, and the longer this aimless football goes on, the worse we will become.

To the people in charge, can you please end it now, for the sake of everyone. Please.

Get a proper proven manager in and support him with some proper money. 㿭m for want away Lukaku and 㿔m for Stones, plus 𧴜m from Sky and a 𧴜m from his own pocket should make an in road into the top four I reckon.

But this will get us 11th place. That is 2 season's running in the bottom half of the table. The last time we did that? 2000-01 & 2001-02. It is not the points we are getting, it is the points in comparison to everyone else.

It is the inability to make results happen. To take our opportunities to win that is the problem. To put it simply, Martinez is not a winner.

♫ Brown shoes are shocking,
The fans they are all mocking
And I just cant take it,
Anymoooore ♫

♫ Brown shoes are for losers,

Don't ever wear them in Boozers,
And I just cant take it ,
Anymoooore! ♫

Well folks, it is a Saturday Night after all!
Ninguna person izz going to pizz on my Fiesta!
Y viva Sabado Noche!!!

If you are correct, which I think is likely, then perhaps Bill will stay until the end of the season or the end of the cup run whichever comes soonest, if nothing else it would be apt if he was to watch Everton lift the FA Cup at Wembley and then fully hand over the reins to the new guy.

Where the fuck have you been, lad? Stones did not get into the England team for his future performances. Chelsea did not offer nearly £40 million for what he may do sometime in the distant future. He has been recognised for being absolutely brilliant in the past.

The kid started life in the most challenging positions as a teenager. The England call up and the attention from all the top clubs are based on what he has already done... he has played 70 games in a role where most people don't get a game until they are mid-twenties.

The John Stones appreciation society is huge in number and it is bursting with knowledgeable football fans who can see more reasons for our defeat than the boy being partially responsible for giving away a corner. You can't. That says more about you than it does about him. If that is all you saw today, then perhaps you really need to start thinking about whether this footy lark is for you.

He's 21, he will make more mistakes. Last week you were slaughtering Barkley... What is it with you and our younger players ? are you pining for the days when no nonsense, vastly experienced players like Weir and Stubbs and Gough regularly had 5-6-7 put past them?

Book him a taxi.

Martinez Out.

Another Saturday night with no win on Match of the Day. I fuckin' hate weekends now... I can't wait till Monday.

All 3 of these are vital if any club wants to be successful.

And to think this is the guy in charge of our club....scary.

GET RID NOW.

We have played some really nice football this season under Roberto and in some of those game we have received really bad game-changing decisions by the refs. The great wins were based on pure attack, not on possession,but, once people realised that our attack left us totally exposed to counter-attack, we started to lose.

This change in tactics from our opponents combined with naçve or fool hardy use of substitutions by Roberto has become a total disaster for our Premier League challenge this season, the season we should have won it, with all due respect to Leicester.

Those early results have not been lost on other groups. The Americans wanted Howard and let it be known to him and to Roberto. So Howard knew he had to stay fit – nobody signs a crock – and his play and form suffered.

Now, we are starting to hear that Roberto is being looked at for the Spanish team managers role so he needs to win a cup and shore up his defence to get that job. Only Everton signs a manager that just got his team relegated or finished near the bottom.

So Roberto is trying to play more defensively and the net result is players are passing too late or wildly so they don't get caught out of position and the attack is faltering. The reasons for the failure in defence I believe lies in midfield. Barkley is very often too far forward and not in line with the rest of the midfield. The rest of the midfield is not in position – the WHU game exposed this midfield flaw.

So, if Martinez can find the solution to our defence, win the cup and get us to 12th, we may be approached by the Spanish team for his services and they may pays us like we paid Wigan but this change of managers will not take place until after the Euros finish on July 10th.

Maybe this is why we have not got rid of him.

Read what you will into this but my son just rang me to tell me and I thought I'd share it with my fellow blues.

1) We need a central midfield player who can control a game – Barkley is not that player. He needs to play further up the pitch or else not at all – he's the second most chance-creating player in the league, I read.

2) Lukaku, far from being 'lazy' or 'uninterested' is horribly isolated and lacking support (which is not to excuse his howling misses today – the poor header, and how did he hit the bar from that range?!). I felt sorry for him at times... no wonder he wants to go.

3) How often was the final ball shockingly bad?

4) Mirallas might have won it and brought real freshness when he appeared. Why did the change come so late?

5) If Lennon is not running with the ball at defenders, then like Barkley played deep, you might as well not have him on the pitch.

6) Oh I could go on and on.....

Personally I thought today was much better than last week, for what it's worth. Still don't know how anyone thought Martinez was ever the best choice for manager of our club.

I cannot think of many matches this season when we were at our very best (Chelsea at home at a stretch), and to be perfectly honest, Europa League aside, we probably haven't performed to our best since Arsenal at home two years ago.

All excellent points, I pretty much agree with everything you said. Barkley does need to play higher, which would have multiple positive effects I believe.

1) More support for Lukaku who was indeed isolated today (as he often has been this year);

2) Free up Barkley to attack and have less defensive responsibility (which he doesn't do anyways and as such leaves wide open space for the other team to attack in)

3) this is related to point 2. If Barkley was higher up his teammates wouldn't be expecting him to assist defensively and would likely be better able to position themselves due to position roles being clearer (they expect Barkley to come back and apply pressure, and he often doesn't in my opinion).

That all said, if the final ball had been just a little better today we could have won (same goes for Watford though somewhat)

The reality – a team that can't defend corners, a team that allow Barkley to run around like a headless chicken who runs into trouble & loses the ball more often than not, a team that indulges Stones to fanny around time after time & cost us goals, an increasingly delusional manager whose post match utterances are increasingly ridiculous & bizarre (a great game, two really good teams. we're turning a corner, we were excellent except we lost blah blah....)

I've been following this great club for over 40 years and have never been so disillusioned until now, incredible how the potential of this current team has been totally been mismanaged.

Rant over, feel better now!

For some reason, because he won it before, some fans think RM can win the cup again. Logic would suggest that he is out of his depth.

I would have Baines as player/manager before I let this arrogant charlatan lead us out at Wembley. I don't know about him being a nice man, but he sounds like an arrogant bully to me and his treatment of Baines is a disgrace.

Why does he always have to stand in the technical area all of the time like some strutting peacock, if he sat down once in a while and talked to his coaches, or sat in the stands occasionally he might get a better perspective of the match.

This deluded manager has a huge ego problem, and is a failure in the league, hence why so much attention is placed by him on cup matches. BK please sack him tomorrow and at least give us and the players a chance of winning a trophy this year.

He does fuck all, all day long but point at the ground to where he thinks the ball should have been played.

Every ball that's played to him in the air he loses 95% of the time.

"Isolated" you're 'avin a laugh. If anyone was with him that far up the pitch they wouldn't get a shout from the second ball anyway!

I don't care what anyone says, this guy in my humble is a shit footballer and would never have got anywhere near even my school team.

We have proof as to what should happen.

Our boy goes to Man Utd. They make him their striker. He gets isolated game after game.

He doesn't start throwing his toys out the pram or starts pointing at the innocent blades of grass.

He does track back to find the ball and make himself UNSELFISHLY FOR THE TEAM available to his team mates.

For me thats at least the minimum that RL should be doing.

Again it's the useless managers fault for not making it happen.

I want Everton players to play for each other. Not for them selves. I want players who might not be in the top ten of the worlds best but want to play for the shirt they wear.

In short I want 11 players who are a team. A bit like the team who are top of the league now.

We need to ditch the manager, we also need a clear out of useless greedy egotistical footballers who hang on every Sky Sports and TalkSport bullshit words.

Champions League, you're fucking welcome to it Lukaku.

YOU are just another bad apple in the barrel that is Everton Football Club.

Fact is, Roberto is not good enough for Everton FC. He's inadequate at his job, he has a poor backroom staff team, and he's making our good squad look poor at best.

Roberto had a brilliant first season, he done a lot better than I ever thought he would, but things quickly turned sour the next season.

From my view point I've seen a good squad who have been either unable or simply unwilling to perform for there manager.

Even Bill must see this now.

Guus Hiddink, Manuel Pelligreeni, Jose Mourinho, Ronald De Boer and a few other top name managers are desperate for EPL jobs, now is the time to speak to these big name managers so as they can start preparing for next season.

RM is out of ideas, his players are running around clueless and resorted to simplest tactics of trying to use individual talent to get around the opponent by pivoting off Rom. Unfortunately, this will continue till we're done with this season's FA Cup. Then we'll have our next manager.

Mourinho has a good resume but he's not exactly talent magnet without the money. 3 year shelf life and known to lose the dressing room too. I rather have Koeman after what he did at Southampton. That should be our primary target is aiming locally, plus he's not been at the top yet, so perhaps more long lasting drive to improve us.

Go for Koeman.

Didn't do much better in The National either, oh well I have RM's insane synopsis of the game to cheer me up, wait there, they stopped doing that awhile ago. I'm just livid with his piss taking statements, does nobody give a fuck about the discrepency between reality and Martinez's ramblings ???

We need to get him gone. He will relegate us been saying for over a year vehemently we are Villa elect. BK might get his day at Wembley, hand over to Mosh and see us in the Championship 2018 exonerated of all blame and lauded for his time at the helm.

Barry, I heard a while ago that Osman had been offered a coaching role at Everton, but he was reluctant to take it because he felt that whatever he came up with, Martinez, would just do his own thing anyway.

The man is egotistical, sexist, and selfish. Don't care about what he's done previously look at what happened last.

If we worry about Martinez losing our dressing room, how bad must Chelsea have been? So bad that from the day he went they have lost one game and are now above us in the table!

Mourinho? No thanks.

I mean apparently without his goals wed be relegated... well actually that is not true. He scores goals you expect a striker to score apart from the odd beauty when he feels like earnings his 75k a week.

The thing is the fans get giddy at having a striker who is the first in a while to get 15+ goals... yet will be the first to slam Martinez for underperformed with the best team we've had in years... so the question is "is lukaku doing such an amazing job considering the talent we have in the team?" For me no. He is bang average football wise with a talent for finishing and a poor attitude.

Anything over £45m would be an absolute deal. Let's find a player who has the heart to play for the blue shirt and not an ego that is looking elsewhere.

Manager - Ronald Koeman (refusing to extend contract.
Goalie - Courtois (not happy at Chelsea)
Midfield - Wjinaldum (won't want to play for Toons)
Forwards - Embolo and Batsuyahi

Total cost - around £110 - 120m. Keeping Lukaku, JS and Ross, and adding top quality players like these lads would really make an impact on the league and, as shown above, wouldn't cost a fortune.

Tell me if I am wrong? Maybe you prefer waiting for us to win a game under the current clown?

A badly run club with an old stadium and apparently no ambition is how we appear to everyone apart from ourselves. Heck we still haven't even sacked a manager that's taking us to the relegation zone.

We are just the rotting hulk of a once great ship.

Also, what are people's thoughts on why he is still in a job. I think the reason he has not been given the sack is the money Everton would have to pay him, as he has three years left on his contract.

Surely we have now entered the final days of Martinez's tenure at our great club. Otherwise, I truly fear for our future (and my sanity) should we have to suffer another season of this nonsense.

Vardy has been starved of service, but he never stops running and offering himself. He's had one clear chance and he's taken it . . . . He wasn't sulking that he wasn't getting the ball and hadn't switched off when the chance came to him.

If only our Rom had that level of work rate.

Looking back, it is fascinating that Roberto never had the awareness to comprehend what a successful methodology he had 'stumbled upon' with the defensive solid base coupled with the attack from the back-minded approach.

Even 2 years on he still cannot see how the balance of a solid defense (which takes training and skill), coupled with the willingness to attack at speed at every opportunity, is a must for all possession based philosophies.

Complete idiot, allowing ego to overrule his intelligence. Often happens with self-driven, focused people.

On a brighter note I am interested to hear opinions on whom our next manager is likely to be. I have been impressed with Pelligrini and how he has behaved with dignity over the Guardiola situation.

I am very anti-Mouhrino, his character seems so suspect. I am intrigued by De Matteo who seemed to disappear after the Champions League final and also Laudrup who fell out with Swansea. Eddie Howe ticks all the boxes for me but the "think big and foreign" brigade don't seem to support that.

The anticipation of a new management team really brightens me up after this torrid Martinez and crew experience!

I've no idea how much money he's spent but he seems to have fierce will to win. Something our current seems to lack (and the whole team as well).

Please do the decent thing and tender your resignation immediately. You promised Champions League Football or did we all mis-hear you and you really said "Championship Football," Because that's where we seem to be headed and The Board won't like the loss of all that TV money! Jump before you are pushed.

According to a report from Goal, Everton have sounded out Argentinian boss Marcelo Bielsa about replacing Roberto Martinez this summer.

Billy boy will go for the likes of Dyche, Karanka etc, because he'd fear being undermined by a big name. Anyway, there's not a prayer dickhead is getting sacked... we've all heard what the chairman thinks of him. Depressing, very depressing.

We have a young manager in the hardest league. [Pep is going to get a big fucking big shock]
We have a young manager who plays attractive football.
We have a young manager who has to work to a limited budget. [To see that Martinez out flag disgusts me.]
We have a young manager giving youth a chance by loaning to other clubs, more than previous manager.
We have a manager who is willing to give the academy a chance.

NEGATIVES:
We have a manager who is a one-trick pony, with no Plan B. Who is a stubborn bastard, which will get him the sack.

So wise up Roberto.

Get Jose, if not, keep Martinez with money available.

Martinez Out

How is he a young manager? This is his 6th season in the EPL! Stop romanticizing the man, the myth, the legend, please. As for Pep, I think he will be fine. He will live up to his pedigree just as Martinez is currently living down to his bottom half of the table pedigree.

I said at the time that persisting with Howard when the whole world could see him costing us points would cost him his job and I think that is now a certainty. The shattered confidence of all of our defenders is gradually l being restored, but the damage is done.

Can anybody (even in their wildest) imagine Howard getting in the same post code of the two shots Robles saved? This would have been another embarrassing defeat if fate hadn't intervened and made the decision for Martinez.

At least now Howard won't be around to throw the cup away as he did against Chelsea.

The season may still end in Glory

How are the signing of Funes Mori and Niasse howlers? Funes Mori is getting touted for Barca and is still very young.

How can you make a decision on a player, Niasse, when you have seen him play for no more than 20 minutes at the most?

This is the John Ruddy syndrome, plays shite in his first game, so we let him go and then he plays for England. How the fuck can anyone judge a player by watching him for 20 minutes? FFS.

Funny you could see Howard was to blame for Everton's ills. Why then are they still persisting with Robles in goal? Why is Everton not rocketing up the table with all of the points not being dropped? Couldn't be the shambles of the defending, individual defending errors, and tactics as I have pointed out to you since last season could it? Hmmm, get back to me on that one with your usual entertaining "unique" post.

Please Darren, watch the Chile-Argentina game, or any of the international games in which Funes Mori played for Argentina and you will see a confident center back playing with authority, calmness, and skill. Yes, Darren, it is the one and the same Funes Mori, who plays for Everton. Howler? Ha Ha, what a daft statement.

It worries me that Niasse isn't in the team yet but you're right you can't judge a player until he has had a run of games.

I think you'll find Stones is playing while Mori regains HIS confidence. the Argentine took a fearful hiding from just about every West Ham player every time the ball was put in - including being murdered in the air for all three of their goals... by three different players.

He was also dragged all over the shop against Arsenal, at one stage he was sucked 20 yards into there half for another goal. That's FIVE goals in a hundred minutes, all directly attributable to his inability to defend. Top class player? ... if you say so, but even the defensively clueless Martinez was spooked into dropping him.

Colin @225

Touted for Barcelona? By whom and to do what? Do you not think every coach would have seen his performances against West Ham and Arsenal? – not that you'd have needed a coaches eye to see that... you just needed not to be Stevie Wonder.

As for Niasse, You may have only seen him for twenty minutes but I've seen more and I've seen enough to know that Lokomotiv completely had us over? not fit? ... yeah right. Try not good enough.

Jim Hardin

When Martinez finally accepted that everyone else was right and "Rested" Howard for the Newcastle game. I think everyone knew he wasn't coming back. He had been – to use well known footy parlance – utterly garbage.

In the ten league games Joel has played since Howard's "injury" he has only conceded nine goals... in the ten games before he was axed, Howard conceded 18...

We may not have "rocketed up the table" but we are conceding half as many goals.

Why do you suppose that is? Especially when they both had the same mistake ridden players in front of them?

The players may well have been nervous wrecks when Howard was playing, but like I said, confidence is very slowly being restored and Martinez must be wondering what the fuck he was doing persisting with spoonfeet...

Speculation from usual nonsense sources re Funes Mori to Barcelona.

Same speculation re Stones to Real Madrid, Barcelona etc etc. in the close season.

Stones will not be signed by either club, nor will Funes Mori.

Martinez paid a quarter of that for Funes Mori and lets be clear here, eyebrows were raised everywhere when the final fee was announced. Nobody else would have paid that much. nobody else offered it.

I'm not against Funes Mori. I accept he has had to leave everything behind and move half way around the world, IF he settles (not a certainty) he will improve, but that has to be taken into consideration when signing a player in the first place. There were/are center halves here who would not have cost as much and wouldn't have needed to acclimatise.

Martinez's supporters never cease to amaze me. He has paid £24m quid for two players who cant get into our worst team for a decade... and they still want to dress it up as good business

Will Stones play for Barca or Real? Who knows? He probably hasn't made his mind up yet.

Signing Funes Mori is one of the best bits of business he has done. He is 25 which is a baby for a centre-half let alone someone who has come into the English game. For me, he has been a very good signing and will go on to be a top centre-half.

Having stopped laughing now I can respond.
Once again you have ignored in your response, the form of the teams played with Robles in goal as well as the defensive changes made by Roberto including dropping Stones and Deulofeu etc. in order to lay the blame at the gloves of Tim Howard. Okay, I will play along.

Bear with me Darren as I know you don't like anything other than superficial stats. Counting the Watford game, Howard had 23 appearances and Robles 8 in the Premier League. Howard's last appearance was the Swansea game where even the newspapers credited Stones with responsibility for the two goals which you continue to blame Howard for. So here are the stats Darren.

Howard 69 saves, Robles 15 (multiplying by three still doesn't put Joel anywhere close because the number of shots on target are markedly decreased (could be the other team's form and/or our then newly minted starting 11 with Lennon, Cleverly, Funes-Mori)

Howard made 2.03 saves per goal. Robles is at 1.67. Hmmm Darren how could that be? Howard had 6 clean sheets, Robles 2 want to guess which clean sheets were earned against the overall better teams, hmm Darren?

Howard 84 catches to 15 for Robles- again a factor of three doesn't put him close. Distribution accuracy is 69% versus 55% in favor of Howard.

Clearances by Howard (means he came off his line) 5 to 1 in favor of Howard.

So, I am not slating Robles – just using the comparison to point out how absurd your original post and the response actually are. It doesn't matter who is in goal for this team as the other problems are the root cause of the poor goals against and place in the table. The problems you have laid at the feet of Howard are simply not his fault. The fewer goals conceded is a product of fewer shots which is the product of the teams played and also the players used and individual errors. The best run came when Stones and Deulofeu were both out and Cleverly and Funes Mori and Lennon were in.

As for your slagging off Funes Mori as a waste and he might be a good player, it is English-centric bullshit. the same is true of your putting Stones on a pedestal. If you put him there the following will require you to make it big enough for FM too.

Here are the stats of the two players with one now in his third Premier League season as a senior member of the squad and one still in his first Premier League season.

Stones had played 2,178 minutes versus 1,878 for Funes Mori, which is more than three games difference, so a true comparison would require adjusting Funes Mori's numbers to compensate.

Stones has cleared the ball 98 times versus 180 for Funes Mori. Total forward passes are 906 to 763 in favor of Stones. Stones has 322 backwards passes to 265 for Funes Mori. Pass completion is 89% to 85% in favor of Stones. Key passes are 4 to 3 and each has created 4 chances. Average pass length for each is about 22 meters. Funes Mori has scored 3 goals. Tackles won is 33 to 28 in favor of Stones. Stones wins the take-ons 21 to 8.

Ariel duals won is 64.5 % to 62.86% although another soccer site's analysis shows Funes Mori winning more in and near the 6-yard box whilst Stones's wins are farther out. Interceptions of passes are 43 to 61 in favor of Funes Mori. That would be better defensive positioning and reading of the game, wouldn't you agree? Errors leading to goals are 2 for Stones and 0 for Funes Mori.

So Darren, It looks like Funes Mori is fairly confident and competent and worth £40 million if Stones is right? Looking at the stats it again reflects Stones's best stats are using skills suited for a midfield player in the making and FM is a better center defender. Hope the pedestal is big enough Darren.

Maybe it is Funes Mori who will be deciding if he wants to play for the Spanish giants or maybe Bayern or PSG. Guess he will have to match Stones in one more category, transfer requests, to do that though.

I've long since held the belief that you fail to grasp the essence of the game. Nothing wrong with that as long as you enjoy it, However... coming on to a website spewing a whole hosts of inaccurate, irrelevant stats dreamed up by some spotty anorak and dressing it up as opinion would seem to suggest that you don't even enjoy it.

I mean who dreams up this crap? Where do you get it from? Why do you spend so much time digging it up and why do you give it any credence at all? Who cares how many catches or successful long throws a goalkeeper makes?

Do you realise just how irrelevant those stats are? If you stopped listening to these idiotic "announcers" or regurgitating the nonsense you pick up from semi interested stat compilers you may even start to develop an opinion of your own. Do you really not understand why one goalkeeper has had to face so many more shots than the other?

Let me give you a clue; The Goodison faithful have witnessed a marked difference to the way both goalkeepers communicate. Robles can be heard and seen shouting instructions all game "drop five" .... "step up" ... "Keepers ball" ... the sort of basic stuff we all grew up listening to. Not rocket science but it often stops danger before it is allowed to develop, do you understand that? On the other hand, your boy was a hooter and a curly syrup short of being Harpo Marks.

There was no communication between the keeper and the defenders, only confusion. His propensity to run into the back of his own net, star jump, miskick everything, bottle out of challenges with big forwards were the visible things to arm chair viewers. but the problem was far worse than that. The only time he opened his gob was to shout at mystery culprit in the top balcony every time he cost us a goal.

The reason we are now conceding half the goals and having nowhere near the amount of shots to deal with has nothing to do with the form of our opponents, it was mainly down the the fact that we are no longer carrying a passenger. That, my friend is the reason Evertonia rejoiced when the penny finally dropped with Martinez and Howard was out.

I hope you are right about Funes Mori, it would be wonderful if he blossomed into a £40 million pound player who was coveted by Real Madrid... but one step at a time eh. Let's see if he can get to a stage where he can hold down a regular place in the worst Everton side many of us have seen in many a year.

I've got the misfortune to be in London tomorrow with a ticket. We can only hope.

I do understand the game and how to coach it. Please Darren, you only embarrass yourself further with such remarks even more so than your FM is a Howler comment.

I gave you the stats to look at Darren. It wasn't difficult, they are readily available and even allow player v player comparisions across years and leagues. You, without even knowing anything about the quality of the stats (some of these sources make their money selling such services and stats to professional teams), dismiss them. This shows your lack of understanding.

Across posts you ask for facts and instances, are given them repeatedly, and then attack the person providing them or just dismiss them as not relevant. Incredibly boring and stubborn of you. As for the research, I find it useful and wish you would use it once in a while. You suggested that the entire blame lies at the feet of Tim Howard and he has somehow shattered the confidence of every defensive player. That is erroneous at best as the stats I provided demonstrate.

Your blaming Howard is childish. Your slagging off Funes Mori is almost worse. BTW , look what Argentina's coach is saying about FM Darren, “We are thinking about (Ramiro) Funes Mori for the [Olympic] Games. We have to see if Everton will allow this but we wish that he plays in the two competitions.”

You are right, what a Howler that player is. Not worth a plug nickel.

I think this debate has run its course. I suspect that you will continue rely on stats that tell you things like Funes Mori has not been at fault for any goals we have conceded. Good luck to anybody who can sell those stats... and woe betide anybody mug enough to buy them.

I don't trust stats I wasn't there to witness, and I don't give a flying fuck how many "successful long throws" a goalie makes... and here's the thing: I know people like you buy into them, but I don't believe anybody actually clocks them up. They're meaningless, worthless, irrelevant.

If you were to go into an ale house on County Road and tell people Funes Mori hasn't been responsible for any goals, they would laugh you out of the place. You see, most of them would have been at the West Ham and Arsenal games to witness him coming up short for all five goals.

I have no axe to grind with Funes Mori. I think he can justifiably claim we haven't seen the best of him for obvious reasons. He will play tonight and I will be cheering him on hoping he is part of a defensive unit that keeps a clean sheet... but I stand by my belief that Martinez had a complete Weston when he paid £24m for him and Niasse. I don't believe he would get even half of that back for two players who will only get a game if other players are injured. Disagree? That's your right.

To close my part of this debate Jim, I will offer you a word of advice. IF, you ever get into an ale house on County Road and have the pleasure of discussing the game with some of the most knowledgeable supporters you will ever meet, FFS don't start babbling about how many successful back passes player x made, or how many successful "take ons" he performed. Trust me when I tell you. You will empty the place... and to my knowledge, that`s never been done before.

And please don't try to tell them that Howard has been anything other than a massive bonus to the opposition. They were there, you see, Jim, You will never come up with enough meaningless stats to make them deny the evidence of their own eyes.

Good Luck to you and enjoy the game tonight. I hope Funes Mori has a blinder

The Stones debate will go on, it goes without saying we all want the young lad to go on to be a top defender. Some of us hold John in a higher esteem than others; I think he has a lot to learn but has good potential,;others think he is the finished article and is already world class.

In my opinion, part of the problem with John is that he is starting to believe the people saying he is world class. Martinez has rightly been slaughtered for labelling him with the world class tag,this has led him into running before he can walk.

Let's hope the lad turns out to be a top player.In my opinion his development will continue with Everton. I don't believe a club will pay the required £40 million fee until he is a better defender.

Let's leave it there, time will tell on John.