Why are Everton so bad at picking managers?

Jonathan Tasker 09/12/2019 57comments  |  Jump to last

In October 2015, Liverpool appointed Jurgen Klopp as their manager. He had previously been manager of Borussia Dortmund and, before that, Mainz. Klopp had won the Bundesliga twice with Borussia Dortmund and the first time he won it his side was the youngest ever to win the Bundesliga. Being very much a fan of German football, I was immediately worried about Klopp’s appointment.

Klopp, being 6 foot 4 with interesting glasses was a brand in itself and a very forceful character. In short LFC had appointed a winner. When was the last time Everton had got us fans genuinely excited about a managerial appointment? Liverpool’s owners had spent some time considering their appointment it is said had used Moneyball type research.

This article looks at recent Everton managers, why they were chosen and why nearly all have failed. It also attempts to examine who is involved in choosing the Everton manager and, finally, I profile who would ideally be the next Everton manager.

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Recent Everton Managers

Being 61 I have seen a lot of Everton managers come and go including the two most successful in Everton’s proud history, Harry Catterick and Howard Kendall. Since Kendall there have been mostly disastrous appointments.

Let’s start with Walter Smith who was in charge between August 1998 and March 2002, when he was fired. His period in charge was mundane and lacking in inspiration. He was seen as a steady pair of hands. Looking back, I think he saw Everton as a good place to retire. He had a win ratio of less than a third , making him statistically one of Everton’s worst managers. Everton finished in the bottom half of the table in each of the three full seasons that Smith managed Everton.

Next up was David Moyes between March 2002 and 2013, when he accepted the post of Manchester United manager. As I recall at the time, Gary Megson was Moyes’s rival for the Everton job. Moyes was a relatively successful Everton manager, securing mostly top half finishes. Under his tenure, Everton finished 4th and qualified for the Champions’ League. In other seasons Moyes’s team finished fifth twice and sixth twice. I am not entirely sure why there is such opprobrium felt towards him,

The next manager, and this is where it started to go seriously wrong, was Roberto Martinez.

I recall thinking I couldn’t understand why Everton chose Martinez after he had got Wigan relegated. This seemed to reward failure.

Martinez came to Everton having just presided over Wigan being relegated although they had won the FA Cup. During their run to the FA Cup, Wigan had superb 3-0 away win at Everton in the FA Cup Quarter Final, a victory which many saw as Martinez’s interview for the Everton job.

Martinez had a very successful first season at Everton , finishing 5th, with Romelu Lukaku top scoring. After that it all went backwards and Everton finished in the bottom half in the next two seasons before Martinez was fired. Farhad Moshiri had arrived at Everton during the final season Martinez was manager.

Ronald Koeman was manager for the start of the 2016-17 season. I was sitting in my office in London and the Saints’ supporter next to me started laughing when the news came through of Koeman’s appointment. My office pal told me what would happen. There would be some good results but it would unravel quickly and Everton would be in a worse state than before Koeman was appointed. This is, of course, what happened. And, not for the first time, makes me think that Everton don’t plan for anything. They don’t do due diligence. They just make it up as they go along. Koeman lasted just one full season.

Strangely enough, Everton’s next appointment, Sam Allardyce did the job he was appointed to do. Everton’s owners saw the building was on fire and Big Sam had a good track record of putting out fires. Everton finished the 20-17-2018 season in 8th place.

It seemed by this stage that Moshiri was well and truly calling the shots, although Everton did by then have a director of Football, Marcel Brands. In what was even at the time as case of the Emperor’s new clothes, Everton appointed Marco Silva. So keen were Everton to appoint Marco Silva that they waited several months after he had been fired by Watford and paid Watford compensation after being accused of poaching him from Watford.

Marco Silva finished 8th in his only full season at Everton but was fired last Thursday. This season has been a disaster after Everton unraveled completely. Silva left Everton in 17th place. Not least amongst his perceived weaknesses were his diffident personality, his inability seemingly to inspire the players and fairly poor use of the English language. His reign ended with the now ritual slaughter at Anfield.

The Decision Makers

This is where I think Everton’s recent persistent failure lies. Consistent in all the period above is the full figure of Bill Kenwright. Kenwright was previously an actor, most well known for playing Gordon Clegg in Coronation Street, Britain’s longest running soap opera although some would argue Everton holds that record. Kenwright, being an actor, chooses which side of his personality that you see. My assessment is that he is a control freak who continues to play far too an important role in subjects like who the next manager should be. Given that he only owns 5% of Everton he should not be involved in the process at all. Kenwright likes little people that he can control. To that extent, Silva was another Martinez. I remember Martinez being wheeled out at his unveiling and going on about Everton going for the Champions’ League places. This was pure showbiz Kenwright.

Farhad Moshiri is Everton’s owner and majority shareholder. I think of him as the fool whose money soon gets departed. He was the one that Kenwright waited five years to find. He was the only person prepared to give Kenwright a load of money and still allow him to stay on. Moshiri worries me a lot. He seems trigger happy- think of all those managers already being fired, to rely far too much on Kenwright, and, worse, doesn’t seem to understand much about football. Then there’s Marcel Brands, the Director of Football. Brands is paid a small fortune but has also failed in virtually every aspect if his job. He came from PS, having been involved in PDSV being successful In Holland but he hasn’t brought any of that success to Everton . Nearly all of Brands’ transfers have been disastrous. Of course, much of what I write is conjecture but from what I can observe, Brands was heavily involved in the recruitment of Silva but was totally unable to save him from being fired last week. I’m not really sure what Brands does but I do feel there is something of the night about him and that he’s not to be trusted.

So can we rely on the mighty threesome to make the right decision on the next manager? I have zero faith in them . Seems to me that various agents are throwing names at them and somehow they will come up with somebody vaguely in the frame.

Compare and contrast this with Liverpool appointing Klopp. Everton have a very loyal fanbase, desperate for success after the famine induced Kenwright years. What should happen is that Everton go to the football equivalent of Headhunters to scour the planet to get the right person. Instead it will be done by dodgy agents, Kenwright’s mates and whoever turns up on the day. Brilliant as Duncan Ferguson’s achievement was on Saturday, that was more luck than judgement.

The Right People

So what sort of profile should the new man have? For a start, it’s worth reminding us all that Everton have played more matches in the top flight than any other team. Everton are the 4th most successful team of all time in England. I mention that because Everton’s owners will probably undersell the club to potential new managers.

Next, I think we need a manager on the up, as opposed to a Walter Smith or Ronald Koeman looking for a cosy few years. Then given how Silva struggled with English and the failure anyway of the three previously foreign managers, I’d like to see a British manager appointed. Ideally, a manager with innate knowledge of the English game. Like Klopp, I’d like to see the following personality traits. Someone with genuine charisma, who is media friendly, intelligent and hard working. For me the ideal candidate is probably in their last thirties or early forties.

This rules out candidates like Rafa Benitez, who wouldn’t be interested anyway. So who have I identified as the perfect next Everton manager?

Chris Wilder is the ideal candidate. He has got Northampton, Oxford and Sheffield United promoted. In Sheffield United’s case he has achieved two promotions and the nucleus of his team have been with him since League One. He is a supreme motivator. Everton managed to mightily upset Watford to get Silva. In this case it would be worth upsetting Sheffield United and paying compensation.

Danny Cowley and his brother have done remarkable work at Lincoln and have started to fix Huddersfield. I also very much like the look of Graham Potter at Brighton. Finally , to complete the managers we should look at I like Lee Johnson at Bristol City and it’s hard not to admire Slaven Bilic at West Brom.

Thanks for reading this and I’d welcome any observations. I wish I could have some faith in Everton’s owners but I have none.

PS Will they use the current managerial impasse as their excuse for not applying for planning permission on the new ground, which they promised would be this year?

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Reader Comments (57)

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Kev Gibbs
1 Posted 10/12/2019 at 06:28:02
Good article Jonathan. We have suffered with this wooly headed thinking for years. Not only picking managers but also truly dreadful players. Thats how we ended up with the likes of Rod Belfitt, Mickey Walsh (and his brother) and Paul Wilkinson to name but a few. The unpalatable truth is our disagreeable neighbours have always recruited better than us in both players and management and their whole organisation is run far more professionally.
Alan J Thompson
2 Posted 10/12/2019 at 06:43:31
I suppose my first question would be to ask if Everton are that bad at picking managers or just average? Who have picked successful managers. how long have they been with them and who replaced them?

Arsenal had Wenger for 22 years, was it? Alex Ferguson must have been at United for a similar period. In a slightly shorter period of time Mourinho and Guardiola must have almost have run out of moneyed clubs that they haven't already been and I rule out a lot of Leagues like Scotland etc where it is difficult to name 3 other sides who have won their league. Or is that where you look but rather than those at clubs who traditionally dominate look to those who have usurped them. more than once and the budget they had with which to do so.

Then when you have settled on a shortlist, if that is possible, to consider other vagaries like character, command of the language, organizational ability regardless of DoF or not, use/encouragement of younger players and then their or their Agent's acceptance of KPI's built into a contract.

When you've done all that, consulted your stargazer, tossed the coin, rubbed your rabbit's foot and sought out the building in the corner of Goodison then appoint him. And if at all possible pick the man for the situation or do it at a time when he can get to know the players such as preseason training. Then check to see how much is left of your hard earned billions.

James Hill
3 Posted 10/12/2019 at 08:04:28
They keep looking for a modern manager
Seb Niemand
4 Posted 10/12/2019 at 09:30:04
Your points on BK are apt. I used to be a defender of Kenwright but now he's utterly indefensible. He's about fit to be a greeter for the luvvie types in the corporate boxes and nothing more. Mr Mosh just needs to have the voice of the unctuous giggling goblin out of his ear and I think he'll start to see a lot more clearly and swiftly the results on his investment.

Mr B I have more faith in. Brands is a huge step up from Walsh but I do think he needs to be let go about his work unmolested and to develop a long term recruiting and development policy with a view of Everton as less as a "lip service" project and
more as a structured, properly directed project. This, incidentally is where in my dream world we could use David Moyes back at the club - if there was one thing he was good at it was spotting the kid playing on the rainy night at Barnsley and picking him up cheap, which would be essential to the project.

All your nominees are smalltimers with no real track record to speak of. Liverpool got a winner because they went looking for a winner. If you want someone who has the handy knack of getting Northampton promoted, you're going risk ending up becoming Northampton yourself. And sooner rather than later, you'll need that promotion. All of them, as well, are manifestly short on qualification to help us realize the club wide restructure our ambitions warrant. Nil Satis, etc. I doubt anyone one your list would come even close to the Optimum.

We need to aim high, the highest we can, because there is much work to be done - much more work that just getting a result next weekend.

Stan Schofield
5 Posted 10/12/2019 at 09:32:55
I'm not convinced that Everton are bad at picking managers. There are many factors that influence how good a manager turns out to be, some of them within his control and some of them beyond his control.

Citing Liverpool provides little insight, since although they have, over the last two decades, spent far more money than Everton on players and managers, they have been relatively unsuccessful, compared to say Utd, City and Chelsea (the three elite clubs over that time) who have spent a comparable amount of money to Liverpool. Klopp has yet to establish any credentials as truly top class, since to do that Liverpool (who've never even won the Premier League) would need to win the Premier League repeatedly, like the three elite clubs. And only time will tell on that front.

Moshiri has been here for 5 years. Liverpool have been trying to get back to the elite level for nearly 30 years, whereas we've been trying only since Moshiri arrived. A sense of perspective is needed.

James Stewart
6 Posted 10/12/2019 at 10:07:20
@5 The current Liverpool side cost less than the Everton one, so the comparison does provide some insight into the mismanagement on this side of the park. Liverpool also quite ruthlessly sacked Rogers when Klopp became available. I can't in a million years imagine us ever being that discerning.

The fault lies with Moshiri, he continues to trust his own judgement, which on footballing matters is horrific. For me, Silva was the worst appointment in my time watching Everton.

On Wilder, I agree he is someone we should be looking at, my only concern would be his preference for playing 3 at the back.

Stan Schofield
7 Posted 10/12/2019 at 10:15:20
@6: Only two years ago many Liverpool supporters were calling for Klopp to be sacked.

To compare the monetary value of the current Liverpool and Everton sides, you would have to adjust transfer fees for the rapid inflation that took place after the Neymar transfer from Barca to PSG. The fact is, Liverpool have spent far more than Everton over the last couple of decades. They've spent about the same as Man Utd, but in that time Utd won just about everything whilst Liverpool won little. Reds are a frustrated bunch, which is why many of them were calling for Klopp's head not that long ago. I actually said to some of them that he needed more time.

You assert that Moshiri trusts his own judgement. That's all that is, an assertion. Unless you have evidence of this, you simply don't know.

Again, perspective is needed.

Charles Barrow
8 Posted 10/12/2019 at 10:41:26
I think the fault lies in the interview process. No doubt Koeman, Martinez and Silva were asked about their tactics and preferred method of play and how they would use certain players. No doubt they all outlined plan A. When they were asked what happens if it doesn't work - I assume they all replied - please refer to my previous plan!

That's the nub of the problem at Everton - all our recent managers are stubborn, refuse to admit fault, refuse to be flexible, refuse to see the evidence of their own eyes (that we can all see).

I just hope and pray the next manager is not a power obsessed 'my way or the highway' type of man, who is dismissive of any other ideas apart from his own.

Stan Schofield
9 Posted 10/12/2019 at 10:52:12
Charles@8: When some Liverpool supporters were calling for Klopp's head a couple of years ago (see my post @7), when I told some of them they needed to give him more time, it was in response to their accusing him of being stubborn, arrogant, self-serving and unproven apart from in the German league. Their frustrations appears to be not much different from ours in the broad run of things over the last couple of decades of frustration for both them and us. Yes, they seem finally to be on the rise (but of course only time will tell), but that's a very recent thing and does include some early rejection of Klopp.
Bob Parrington
10 Posted 10/12/2019 at 11:21:55
I'm a bit confused by some of this article. It's a question of conjecture. However, one thing I would like to be clarified is the actual Board of Directors. Just because Moshiri is the major shareholder does not mean he is on the board. So is he? Bill Kenwright is the Chairman but does he have a vote or a casting vote even?

If Moshiri does not have a place on the board, of course he has the right to request a shareholder meeting at which he can call the tunes.

Another point of contention for me is the recent criticism of Mr Brands. If my recollection is right, he was appointed after Marco Silva was selected as the new manager. So, was he really 100% accepting of Silva or not????

So, what is the actual board of EFC?

Next, why Chris Wilder? Yes, he has done some good work with his squad but he has benefited from being relatively injury free in that squad. Does this really mean he is El Supremo? Not in my book!

Duncan meets all of the basic tenets of a good manager for Everton, much the same as those of Wilder. Why should we not pick one of our own. I'm sure the ball boys jumping in to Fergies arms was not stage-managed (only an ultra sceptic would think it was).

True heart, strong minded, personality plus, loved by the players and fans, doesn't take shit from anybody, knows the game, able to analyse strengths and weaknesses, will show emotion and strength fro the touchline. Why not give him a go??!!

Stan Schofield
11 Posted 10/12/2019 at 11:35:39
Bob@10: Spot on, there's only one way to find out how good he is.
Raymond Fox
12 Posted 10/12/2019 at 11:42:04
Good posts, Sam, you always display common sense.

I echo what Stan says that we simply don't know the internal workings we can only guess. It would be good PR if the club did indeed give us as paying customers more insight into how and who makes the final decisions on managers and players.

A negative for our managers is our insistence on then playing a certain style of football. Our last three managers have tried and largely failed due in my opinion because up to now we have failed to sign and also keep the very best players.

Yes we have spent a lot of money on good players but they lack that little bit extra that makes an elite player. To keep hoping that another manager will wave a magic wand over our squads and transform them into world-beaters is for me a forlorn hope.

We are still in the chicken and egg situation of we can't attract successful top managers because we can't attract the very best players. We need both if we are to become a regular top six club.

John Raftery
13 Posted 10/12/2019 at 11:52:27
The same question could be asked of a whole host of clubs in the Premier League; Watford, West Ham, Manchester United, Arsenal, to name but a few. Most clubs struggle to get it right. Most appointments have a high element of risk attached. Most managers have a shelf life of eighteen months after which they run out of ideas or new ways of communicating old ideas. Many of course do not even make it that far.

It concerns me that the Board seems very susceptible to fan pressure. So Sam Allardyce, detested by many, was removed and replaced by a Coach who had not even completed a full season in the Premier League. That looked very risky at the time. We got away with Silva for one season but after eighteen months he has gone and not a day too soon. As soon as David Moyes’s name was mentioned out came the protests. There are still some who would object to Benitez based on comments made over ten years ago. If the name of Brendan Rodgers had been mooted a year ago social media would have been in meltdown.

In order to give themselves the best chance of getting it right the Board must ignore the outside noise and focus on clear selection criteria, identifying the candidates who best meet those criteria.

Of the names mentioned Chris Wilder is a current flavour of the month. His name is fresh and he has done very well at Sheffield United. But I would want to see how he manages his team through a poor spell. Can he arrest a slump in form? Can he motivate players through a full season when they are not chasing a title or promotion?The Board should resist appointing a one season wonder.

Raymond Fox
14 Posted 10/12/2019 at 12:05:29
I also second what Bob says, I think Dunc. should be given his chance he know the players inside out and they will not lack motivation.

He is lacking in experience but I think its a risk worth taking. He's a larger-than-life character and that's what a big club needs.

James Marshall
15 Posted 10/12/2019 at 12:26:38
Why not give Duncan a go? Because he's never managed a professional football team, ever, would be my answer. I loved the bloke as a player, and still have a deep affection for him - hell, I even came close to a tear on Saturday, but first team manager? Nah. Not yet anyway.

Throwing him in at the deep end right now could really horribly backfire, and with the money & status (PL status) involved, I think you can forget Ferguson getting the gig.

Jeff Spiers
16 Posted 10/12/2019 at 12:56:15
Tell me if I'm wrong, but does our CEO have a say in what manager we get?!!!
Barry Rathbone
17 Posted 10/12/2019 at 13:01:03
When Moyes was here, the average tenure of a Premier League manager was less than 2 years and that included long term managers like SAF and Wenger. Clubs go through managers like a dose of salts these days and other than Klopp and Pep with hardly any improvement.

We are presently applying Newton's 3rd law to the managerial merry go round after 11 years of Davey.

"For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction."

By my calculations, we've got another 20 years before we hit pay dirt.

Si Cooper
18 Posted 10/12/2019 at 13:01:55
I second the view that you can't really judge the managers unless you are privy to the machinations within the club. I've certainly had the impression that the managers haven't necessarily got all that they were promised but those big wages and payoffs effectively gag them.

I'm not saying they are deliberately undermined but rather, contrary to the opinion in the OP, that some targets are simply not swayed by the ‘sleeping giant' argument.

Most managers will have some element of relative failure on their CV, which is mirrored in the business world. There are just too many things that have to come together at the same time for it to be at all likely that anyone has a formula that will guarantee success, unless they have the ability to buy any player they want.

Like it or not, we are trying to springboard from a lower level than Liverpool despite their relative ‘wilderness' years, and that is likely to involve a radical approach.

The problem with a radical approach is it is likely to push the players out of their comfort zones and if things don't click then you are likely to get swings in form and inconsistency because the players are operating at the limits of their control.

When was the last time Klopp wasn't able to recruit one of his targets? How much of that is due to his personality or the draw of a ‘brand' which still resonates.

Evertonians need to decide if they are happy to compete for the ‘best of the rest' tag or if they are more ambitious. If we want more then we have to expect that for every Pochettino there are a dozen of the type that went before him when Spurs were at the same level as us despite greater wealth and the cachet of the capital. The board are rolling dice with their appointees, not cherry-picking a guaranteed Goodison success because that doesn't exist.

Brian Porter
19 Posted 10/12/2019 at 15:05:32
Big Dunc for me
Jim Hourigan
20 Posted 10/12/2019 at 17:08:06
I'm sorry but managing Oxford and Northampton does not equip someone to manage against Spurs, Arsenal, Utd, Chelsea not forgetting City, Leicester and Liverpool and the rest. 3 months in the premiership, albeit doing well, is no rehearsal for long term success, add to that his undoubted passion for his boyhood club does not suggest with any degree of confidence that he can transfer that and will succeed here.

Whoever is chosen will be a gamble to a greater or lesser degree. As in any appointment you can look at the cv and like it, meet them personally and possibly warm to them and then offer them a job expecting them to fit in and work as you want. However the moment they walk into your building they start working with the staff already there and nobody quite knows how that relationship will work out. Put that in the context of over paid, immature and in the main not very bright footballers and is it any wonder the vast majority of managers fail at least once.

Wilder has a group of less talented but possibly more driven players, several of whom have a point to prove having been released or begun their careers lower down. Everton are full of internationals (in some cases I don't know how), managing them is not the same and no easy task. Moyes began at Everton with few stars and by giving players like Cahill, Stubbs, Kilbane and Pienaar a big stage enjoyed loyalty and passion but he often failed with self proclaimed stars - Beattie, McFadden etc

There is no sure fire answer but if it was left to me my gamble, and that is what it would surely be, it would be Arteta with an adventurous side kick.

Jay Harris
21 Posted 10/12/2019 at 17:38:35
Most management appointments are a risk. Success all depends on timing and suitability for that particular club and players.

Wilder for example is managing a "Moyes" type group of players and has them well versed in the team rather than the individual. Everton by contrast are a collection of individuals that need moulding into a team.

Rogers would have been ideal for us as would Mourhino but other clubs acted and thought decisively like big clubs and now they are reaping their rewards.

IMO we need a strong character who can manage Kenwright,DBB and brands and who will garnish respect from the players.

My favourites would be Ancellotti, Marcellino, Gallardo and Simeone and I beleieve we should task Brands to get involved with their agents and test the water.

If Moyes gets the job it will confirm our worst fears that Kenwright is still running the show and put us back years.

Kristian Boyce
22 Posted 10/12/2019 at 18:59:58
I have a feeling Sheff Utd will struggle the second part of the season, and especially if they are in the league next season. Wilder has brought a certain style and new tactics to the league, but once teams figure out how to play against them, they don't have the quality to go up against others in the league. In a way it was why Silva struggled, and even going back to Martinez. They had a certain style, and once teams figured out how to play against them, we saw by the struggles and bad results.
Martin Mason
23 Posted 10/12/2019 at 19:04:26
The problem now is that with the DoF position, these people are not Managers only head coaches. The position is important because it ensures that consistent coaching standards are applied across the club. The reality is that we can keep changing managers as often as we like but they will not influence much the standard that we play at. That comes only from the board and the DoF. We must stop calling our head coach the Manager; he isn't. We must also stop believing that changing the head coach will change anything in terms of long term performance. Our head coaches are in the main victims of the Everton set up not guilty parties in our decline. Start at Kenwright and work down replacing every incumbent on the way with a modern professional. Then you will see a solution.
Duncan McDine
24 Posted 10/12/2019 at 19:50:52
There’s a couple of parallels with Klopp and Pochettino... they both built excellent teams with Dortmund and Spurs, improving them year on year, before losing a Champions League final. That loss seemed to derail both (Dortmund were in a relegation battle when Klopp departed), so neither have the most faultless CV’s. I do think Pochettino will become a success in his next job, but it’s a real shame it won’t be at Everton. Let’s just hope Moshiri can roll the dice and come up with a good’n this time!
Joe McMahon
25 Posted 10/12/2019 at 20:05:40
It's way too early to say Duncan after one game, but i'd like to see him given a few more games at least, if not until the end of the season. Everton are never going to attract the best since thePremier League began, because we (Everton) have no Champions League exposure. Add to that the home stadium, and it's not attractive to the likes of Poch. Finally our neighbours are the very successful Liverpool FC, who are also currently the best team in Europe.

IMO Everton employed David Moyes far too long, it did nothing for our image either.

Being realistic I like Slaven Billic, but he's taking West Brom up and like the Leeds manager but would the be interested? I also like the idea of Erik ten Hag, and i'm suprised Brands is quiet about him (as far as we know). But if Everton don't try to land him Arsenal may do.

John Pierce
26 Posted 10/12/2019 at 20:16:58
The manager or coach is the be all and end all of the modern game. We’ve been bad at picking managers because we are cheap and always looking for the next big thing without actually looking properly at the punts we’ve gone for in recent times.

Preston
Wigan
Southampton
Unattached (formerly of Crystal Palace)
Watford

I think there is one FA cup between them from their record in England both before and after Everton.

It’s a well worn list but it’s fair comment, you buy from mediocrity then you get what you pay for.

Until we invest properly and budget for it, we will idle in obscurity.

Steve Ferns
27 Posted 10/12/2019 at 20:20:15
If we are so cheap why was Koeman given a contract that made him one of the top 5 highest paid managers In the world at the time. Allardyce was also paid an exceptional amount.
Joe McMahon
28 Posted 10/12/2019 at 20:29:39
Steve F, don't forget Moyes was in the top 10 paid managers in the world in his last few seasons at Everton. His only achievement as a player or manager was Divsion Two promotion with preston. It's a crazy upside down world.
John Pierce
29 Posted 10/12/2019 at 20:33:20
Even if there are some (financial) exceptions there, we’ve still picked from stock so pitiful they’ve done poorly for us and gone on to achieve nothing of note since.

We will still need to pay a astronomical salary to attract the guy who will make changes, get quick and tangible results.

The average tenure is 18months in the premier league. If you are not making serious progress then you are on shaky ground. The ‘project’ manager is not viable in my opinion. It’s a option we don’t have the luxury of even exploring. Our own trophy drought and financial imperative, the pressure of being next to ‘them over the road‘ are all elements that push for a guy who can come in and do it from the off.

Look at Dyche and Howe, they’ve become institutionalized like Moyes did, both look scared stiff of leaving and trying something else! Good examples of patience that’s now turned to staid iterations of their former selves.

Look there are examples everywhere of failure on the road you take to pick a manager. We happen to be the most inept at it.

Derek Taylor
30 Posted 11/12/2019 at 12:29:30
The longer the confusion goes on, the greater the prospect of Moyes returning. In some ways, the Scot's ability to 'handle Kenwright' would be a positive move and the presence of Big Dunc and, no doubt, Steve Round, would go some way towards getting full effort out of our 'wallflower' roster. Certainly, Brands would fear for his ongoing employment and find his relationship with his manager more testy. A battle of egos would be guaranteed.

Messy ? No doubt, but it could be the off the wall solution Moshiri has failed to come up with via his Johnnie Foreigner obsession.
Personally, I've had it up to here with sloppy passing along the back and we aren't exactly blessed with defenders who can 'play it out from defence !'

Never thought I'd say it but I'm warming to the idea of the safe option given the record of them making the final decision.

Ps Will somebody let Doddy know his sulk may soon be over !'

Alexander Murphy
31 Posted 11/12/2019 at 13:37:31
Q: "Why are Everton so bad at picking managers?"

A: Bill Kenwright

Dave Abrahams
32 Posted 11/12/2019 at 13:58:15
Derek (30), the best praise, maybe the only praise, I heard about Steve Round was “ He makes a lovely cup of tea”. Where is he now by the way? I wouldn’t be surprised if he was a “ Peggy” on a building site.
Steve Ferns
33 Posted 11/12/2019 at 14:10:44
Dave, he was most recently the Director of Football for Aston Villa, but he got sacked before the present regime came in and took them up. He's rumoured to be sat waiting by the phone with his bags packed.
David Pearl
34 Posted 11/12/2019 at 17:36:20
I’d have Kenwright picking our manager over Moshiri all day. Lazy to just say kenwright. If of given more time and money to Martinez but the crowd turned against him. Going from Martinez to a completely different style was never going to work.

For now, though not popular, I’d have Moyes with Ferguson assistant. Summer and long term Arteta.

I don’t think an Ancelotti type would work with us. Have we ever won anything with a foreign manager, or one that hasn’t played for the club? I know people like to say we can’t hire someone because he gets Everton. Why not? The weekend game is big for Everton and Duncan.

The name of the game is to win.

Mick Prendergast
36 Posted 12/12/2019 at 14:42:45
I'm sorry, but for the assessment of Brands alone, this article is for the bin.

"Then there's Marcel Brands, the Director of Football. Brands is paid a small fortune but has also failed in virtually every aspect if his job [...] Nearly all of Brands' transfers have been disastrous.."

You seriously think this? A demonstrably wrong assessment. Brands's one clear failure to date was not getting another CB last summer. Nearly all of his signings - purchases and loans - have impressed, or have not had the opportunity to do so (through injury, or in Kean's case, not being selected by Silva)

[...] "Brands was heavily involved in the recruitment of Silva but was totally unable to save him from being fired last week."

Actually, he wasn't. Silva was Moshiri's pet project and, as is now clear, it was a wrong move, just as Koeman was. It's also the case that even if Brands did not want Silva fired, he, as the DoF, does not have an exclusive right to prevent his dismissal.

"I'm not really sure what Brands does but I do feel there is something of the night about him and that he's not to be trusted."

Well this is more honest as to where you're coming from. Your preference for a British manager (and distrust of Brands) suggests you have an issue with foreigners. The game is international; a majority of top half Premier League managers are not British, and our best players are not British.

If you don't understand why so many Blues hate the idea of Moyes returning, that also speaks volumes about your insight. The one thing you certainly got right is the problem of Kenwright, who'll only retard Everton as long as he's still waddling around Goodison.

It's a great shame that so many Blues – while rightly angered by what's happened recently – are firing anger indiscriminately at all figureheads. Brands is the one competent (if imperfect, like the rest of us) person we have at the board and without him, we'd be royally screwed – probably already relegated (summer 2019).

Stephen Davies
37 Posted 12/12/2019 at 15:10:29
I've mentioned this on another thread.
We get it wrong because we don't get the Right Type of Manager. Saturday showed us exactly what we needed and what we wanted all along.
Get that type of manager, who can Lead, Inspire with passion and a never give in attitude and that will reflect onto the Team and the fans.
Geoff Williams
38 Posted 12/12/2019 at 16:45:02
In my opinion Ferguson is not the answer but he should be given a fair chance to show his mettle. He should be given some sort of timescale to coach the players eg until the cup match. One of the reasons Unsworth failed was for a month he was turning up for work on daily basis not knowing if he was in charge. For goodness sake Everton get your act together as with each passing day your image as a forward thinking club is being tarnished.
Conor McCourt
39 Posted 12/12/2019 at 20:30:56
Raymond Fox...absolutely spot on. The club have continually undermined managers by selling our best players from Rooney to Lukaku to Gueye. All clubs have to sell players like the scum did with Coutinho but look at how they built the club with that money.

Great article but I feel it somewhat misses the point with Klopp comparisons in terms of winners then suggests names which clearly aren't. We cannot attract winners considering we regularly have the 8th or so best squad in the division.

If a manager comes to Everton he is nearly destined for failure. Roberto with limited finances led us to a 5th place finish with our highest PL points total, the last 16 in the Europa League and 2 cup semi finals in a 3 year spell. But because he underachieved in 2 league campaigns he is seen as a failure and some have even argued crazily that he is our worst ever manager.

The reason I argue that we are destined for failure is that we have a much inferior squad to the top 6 but a slightly superior squad to the bottom half meaning it is more likely to have a bottom half finish as it is to finish in the top 6.

Our club continually amaze me- we finish a respectable 8th last season and instead of using this to build a foundation to improve we let our best player leave for peanuts and wreck the spine of the defence and can't understand why we struggle when we buy unproven talent again.

Pochettino was a remarkable manager for Spurs who embodies overachievement on a regular basis yet while they continually evolved they consistently refused to sell their best players. This wouldn't happen here and is why we are in perpetual transition.

Martin Mason
40 Posted 12/12/2019 at 20:34:06
Because they try to hire a manager when all we need is a coach. Brand is the manager.
Stan Schofield
41 Posted 12/12/2019 at 23:25:45
Conor@39: That is a basic problem with Everton, and changing the manager is unlikely to improve things until that problem is eliminated.

Everton first started pissing me off when I was 17, when Alan Ball was sold, unnecessarily breaking up the best midfield in the world. Ball wanted to stay. As did Linekar after 1986, but he was sold anyway.

Of course, we're now so mediocre that the best players no longer want to stay, and of course Everton are very happy to let them go. They just roll over and have their financial tummy tickled by a bigger club.

Benitez was spot on when he said we're a small club. We always act like one. Even polls on ToffeeWeb can show this small-time mentality, such as the polls on whether Stones and Lukaku should have been sold.

If Moshiri is serious about Everton getting to the top, rather than being content to just be in the Premier League, then he'd make sure this small-time behaviour stops. No top manager would even consider joining Everton unless they had guarantees that they had significant sway over signings, like Klopp did when he joined Liverpool.

Don Alexander
42 Posted 12/12/2019 at 00:06:47
Stan, like you I was of your age when Bally was sold, and I was also devastated, to say the least. It was in the headlines of Radio 4 news so weird was it, as no other transfer was in those days. His great career with Arsenal whilst we depended in midfield on the likes of Dave Clement and Trevor Ross speaks volumes for the ineptitude of those at the top, and in Ball's case that very much means Catterick and John Moores, who some of us still venerate.

That said, when I look at our current leadership I look back fondly on Catterick and Moores.

Paul Birmingham
43 Posted 13/12/2019 at 09:46:29
For me the club doesn’t appear to have a stratedgy that links the status of EFC, in real time, as to its plans and ambitions, and in the interview process, any translation of nailed down must dos in terms of football are lost or diluted.

In wake of Marco Silva, I didn’t want him when he was given the job, but ai backed hi, to the hilt to succeed, but the repeat issues and transgressions of his previous stints at Hull and Watford were haunting him and the team.

Now to the present and in view of the board, interview process, selection criteria, I don’t know who’s calling the shots.

Surely the navigator should be Marcel Brands, backed by the board and based on football management skills that are proven, rather than potential, the candidate will be chosen.

I sense that Ancellotti may be interested but I am not convinced he’ll have the fight to take this chalice.

I see a smart street fighter is needed whom can blend and develop the squad. Easier said than done, and who is that manager?

Borrusias or Monaco’s managers look more in tune, but that’s only my opinion.

Hopefully defo no Moyses.

Now for a Sunday.

James Hughes
44 Posted 13/12/2019 at 10:21:10
There is an article about Pep on bbc, part of which states that everyone is sure Arteta is ready to step up. Please act before he gets the Arsenal job
After last weekend would like to see DF kept on, surely there can no longer be doubts about what he does or his commitment.

Moshri needs to get his football head together and shake this club up properly. DBB is not a football club CEO, she has a background in education. having spent a few years in that environment it is clear that being decisive and commercial is not on their agenda. They wait for their grants to arrive and hope they break even, no real drive.

So Farhad get your act together make the right choice and lets go forward. Then gives Moyes a job in hospitality, he can meet and (dour) greet

Stan Schofield
45 Posted 13/12/2019 at 10:26:52
Don@42: I can't seriously see anything improving without what would amount to a revolution in Everton's approach of the last nearly 50 years. The approach of the 1960s, that took us to the top in big style, seems just that, an isolated thing lasting a decade.

For supporters like us, brought up on a 60s diet of top football and top players, that's in our blood so to speak, and it just seems unnatural for Everton to have taken the pathetic approach they have done that dates (in our memory) from the sale of Ball.

In this respect, all the current talk of changing managers and signing players looks quite academic, and not really geared towards us getting to the top.

Jeff Spiers
46 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:02:42
Alan Ball had debt issues. He needed the move. Benitez on sky sport said Everton had a little team. Not small club.
Brian Williams
47 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:07:38
Jeff#46.
Benitez said that's what he "meant" by his comment he didn't say "little team" at the time.
Jeff Spiers
48 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:13:26
Brian46 Thanks
Gerry Quinn
49 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:21:59
Being Friday 13th, shouldn't we announce new manager today?
Kevin Molloy
50 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:24:10
actually, we've been reasonably good at picking managers, until turnip head showed up three years ago. He's picked really really bad managers and has blown nearly three hundred million quid of the club's money in the process, I'm surprised he's not getting more of a hard time frankly
Dave Abrahams
51 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:24:39
Mick Prendergast (36), very good post Mick.
Dave Abrahams
52 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:30:07
Kevin (50) Turnip head ? Moshiri has put nearly £300 million into Everton’s coffers to be called Turnip head, yet Kenwright has put nothing in and taken millions of pounds out, what’s your name for him?
Ray Roche
53 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:51:03
The lack of respect shown to Moshiri in some posts disgusts me. Since he arrived he has removed the crippling debt from the club, bought BMD and, as we hear today with the announcement re planning consent, is going ahead with the plan to build a new stadium. He’s “painted” the Liver Building blue.He has invested in new players, not always successfully, but he’s shown a willingness to inject funds INTO the club. Yet some beauts on TW give him a dog’s abuse. Maybe they’d like him to go and allow BPBill to resume as driver of the train set.
Beggars belief.
Jim Harrison
54 Posted 13/12/2019 at 12:58:34
Dave 52

Correct me if I am wrong. Kenwright picked two managers. The first had the 4th best win % post war over a period of 11 years. The second had the 3rd best win ratio all be it over a shorter time frame.

The first too Everton to the brink of European football proper for the first time in ages, got to semis and a final. All achieved on a shoe string
The second achieved the highest points total that did not achieve champions league football and also delivered a semi final or so. He did this whilst spending very little.

Moyes left, his memory tarnished by his actions after. And whilst it’s fair to say he bottled it for the big games overall his tenure can be viewed as at the very least financially prudent

The second unfortunately flattered to deceive, but also gave us Lukaku, Del Boy, Barkley and Stones playing arguably the best football of their careers and some great memories from his first season

So, since then

Bill. No Angel. But under his stewardship we were often competitive.

Winston Williamson
55 Posted 13/12/2019 at 13:32:48
Brands had nothing to do with the hiring of Silva. They were appointed at roughly the same time. Silva was a Moshiri choice by all accounts.

Turnip Head? Jesus! Show a little respect for a guy financially and emotionally invested in our club to an extent clipperty-clegg has never been...

Another take would be this - he quickly dispensed with a waffling Roberto, hired Koeman, made a mistake but ousted him quickly...hired Fat Sam, fired Fat Sam...put his faith in Silva, fired Silva. I can't get too mad with him though, as he foots the bill for his own mistakes. Imagine what Kenwright would have had to sell to fund the above?? We'd probably be playing on mud, wearing socks and boxer shorts and names and numbers painted on bare skin...

Our problem is Kenwright, pure and simple. Fuck him off permanently, along with all of his acolytes and replace them with successful business winners! Watch how the club changes from being a corner shop to a multi-mall in no time!

Kenwright is a bloodsucker, and we're running out of blood

Kevin Molloy
56 Posted 13/12/2019 at 14:14:33
Moshiri's tenure has been an unmitigated disaster. We had a young team with lots of value out on the park, and a stable wage bill. He's presided over the selling of our crown jewels to be replaced with donkeys on massive wages. He's maxed us out, we can't buy now even if we wanted to cos of fair play, we are already operating at warp factor 9. We will have to sell to buy, and we've now only got two players that any club would be interested in. Nearly three hundred million pounds has gone out of the club since he took over three years ago, that money when he comes to sell willl be paid by the new buyer, all he's done is secure better lending rates and spend the club's assets like a drunken sailor.
Stan Schofield
57 Posted 13/12/2019 at 14:57:32
Kevin, yes, that's what it looks like. When Moshiri took over, we had a sound base to work from, good young players. I thought the money he brought in would enact the revolution I mentioned @45, in which we retain our best players and sign more players of comparable quality and a manager to match that, to take us back to the top, based on gradual but clear progression. But it now looks a bit chaotic.
Conor McCourt
58 Posted 13/12/2019 at 19:48:38
Really great thread with some thought provoking posts especially Jim Harrison and Kevin Molloy. I much prefer this type of insight to the usual guff on here espoused by Mick Pendergast who is proclaiming Brands having made one mistake despite an infuriating summer where he tore up the spine of our team and brought in six new players of which only Sidibe can be viewed as a moderate success.

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