Dismal Everton as Mirallas squanders spot-kick

Sending Naismith or Barkley across to the left wing every 10 minutes is not working and reducing our left flank to one of almost total ineffectiveness. It is also not their position and negates them AND Baines at the same time.

Barry or Besic also be dropped in favour of such a move.

Great to see Mirallas back in the starting line-up though. He is such a matchwinner and teams up wonderfully with Lukaku.

Look at the goals they’ve scored with and made for each other this season.

This is a real GOT to win game.

COYB!

What the fuck has he got against players running with the ball.

DESIGNATED penalty takers being not taking penalties = zero leadership!

Basic, Baines & Stones best players for us once again, the rest need to step up a few gears if we have any chance of winning this!

Pulis will be in there now telling his players the longer they keep it scoreless, the more disparate we will become, I can hear him now.
I wonder what our manager is saying to Mirallas.!

This all just adds to the lack of leadership from Jags and more importantly from Martinez, we have the best penalty taker in the league and glory hunnter Mirallas takes the penalty.

Barkley has been terrible strolling around like he couldnt give a dam.

Looks like the passion shown at West Ham and City was a temporary blip, back to the shite we have seen for most of the season

Did Kevin do that to get a move away?

West Brom are a really poor team and I am sick to my stomach at the ponderous play and lack of initiative throughout the side. Barkley seems to have lost direction and has actually gone back IMO. This is virtually a cup final for us and yet there seems no energy in the play.

Taking besic off is frustrating but hardly affecting the outcome. Barry has been a bit better again. There was no need to leave both on when it was clear they only wanted a point. Martinez should have been brave enough to make a change midway through first half to take one of them off.

Worst atmosphere I’ve seen though for such an important game. So much for support. Oh sorry I forgot it wasn’t a sky 4 team were playing.

My main fear at this point is that we will be come the Norwich of this season and finish up being relegated.

Passing a ball to a player into a congested box gets us nowhere, I honestly can’t see were our goals are going to come from?

Roberto, win at Palace or its hasta luego.

Apart from the obvious shambles for the penalty, it was glaringly obvious that Barkley should have been taken off, Besic had been one of our best players.

I am not blaming Ross alone, the kid’s confidence is shot, every time he got the ball he just passed it backwards or to the nearest player, a good manager would have seen this.

I never for a minute thought we would score and only kept a clean sheet because West Brom never tried to push forward.

Martinez needs to go, make no mistake about it, this guy could get us relegated, shocking considering the players at his disposal.

Martinez hasn’t shown that he knows what he is doing for a long time now and for a side that was known for its unity under Moyes we look a sorry bunch now, especially when a weevil like Mirallas can ride roughshod over established players and no one stands up. We are in dire need of a leader on and off the pitch.

It is starting to get to a situation were the players are in control and Everton have enough problems without having the manager’s instructions ignored.

Have we moved on?

Has that knob Mirallas played his last game for the club; we just can’t afford to be fucking about while we are so close to the relegation zone. The margins are too fine and those 2 points lost could kill us at the end of the season.

He looked ANGRY!

"WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT?!" clearly spewing from his mouth.

The fact that Mirallas even thought about stepping up shows a team in disarray.

Well the Big Time Charlie can just fuck off now to Kev FC which is all he cares about. We need team players at times like these, and that is something he has never been.

Saw a call to bring back Big Joe Royle.

Starting to look like a pretty good idea.

Watching some Dogs of War suddenly seems quite appealing again.

Personally I think he was putting a lid on things.

Can anybody tell, when is the time to say, this is decisive moment, we must react? It is so, so evident that Martinez lost it completely, there is no way back with him. Will we wait until it’s to late? Yes, he is here just year and a half but we are sinking unstoppably and I can’t see any positive signal that we will turn this around with him.

Baines should have taken the penalty, as he sure as hell isn’t going to sky it over the bar. He didn’t beat the first man all night to my recollection, although he might have slipped a decent corner in when I dozed off.

We are seeing less action in the box than in a heavily censored porn film and unless someone at the club has a word in Bill’s shell-like, Roberto’s relegation experience might just see us get there too. You have been warned!

By the way, one of my brothers backed us tonight, so it was odds on we wouldn’t win!

Barkley needs to be taken out of the firing line before he gives up and fucks off. The lad is a nervous wreck. You can see him trying so hard to keep hold of the ball and not lose it and he isn’t seeing anything else. In fact, they all look wrecked.

The penalty incident says everything about this side. No leaders. Captain Jags, Barry, Baines, Naismith? Why didn’t any one of these pull that cheeky fucker up and tell him to put the fuckin ball down.

I’m not liking the way I’m feeling about my club at the moment. They’re giving me absolutely fuck all.

I Tell a lie. Stones and Besic. Class acts those two and as cool as two Fonzies.

I feel sorry for all supporters who went tonight no wonder plenty of boos at end of game... sooooo frustrating. Hard relegation battle lies ahead for rest of season.

Next 10 days will be interesting.

We had 17 shots according to the Bbc.

Can you imagine Ferguson, Big Sam, or Jose coming out with that drivell.

Sack him, Joe Royle in temporary until a suitable replacement is found.

But fuck me he is talking a load of shite – why doesn’t he come out and tell the truth?

We are becoming mushrooms "Kept in the dark a fed on shite."

He is losing the plot – we are doomed.

He has got to go now in the next fortnight, and take that fucking selfish rat Mirallas with him.

Get him out NOW

How can a professional team look so inept when they should be training/practicing every single day. Us Joe Soaps work at least 8 hours a day come what may, plus plenty more hours if work is busy, we’re under target and have to hit our numbers or else!

What the hell are this lot up to?

I’d take a point away to Palace now.

We have lost a full midfield to injury/suspension and have nothing left.

Tonight was woeful and the amount of running around we did in front of the opposition box without passing forward was shocking.

Anyway, another point towards safety.

A draw is a point and a clean sheet but my god its going to be a long 4 months till this season is over!

For the first time I’m beginning to think about the ’R’ word, because if we can’t beat a piss poor WBA side who didn’t even attempt to play football. what chance against the RS or Chelsea.

69% possession and 4 shots on target and to be honest I can’t remember a save from their goalie.

The first time in many years I am fearful for our top flight status. Get it sorted Bobby and sharpish

He gets a half decent transfer kitty every season, he would get the equivalent of the change in BKs arse pocket here, people need to realise we are a club on the slide in every dept.

It’s the manager. He’s sucking the life out of them with his shite

Funny that if Mirallas had put that ball a foot and a half to the right we would probably have won the game, he’d be hailed as a hero and a leader and the green shoots of recovery would be confirmed. However - he didn’t and instead banged a nail into our season and both his and his managers potential future at the club. It’s a funny old game.....

Lose to Palace and get ritually thumped by Liverpool and I think that will be that. What a mess.

Cant remember one decent piece of skill or killer pass from us. Barca, Chelsea or City would have found a way I am sure.

I don’t know what to make of this mess other than I have been staying away because my stress levels can’t take it. I will end up having a heart attack in the ground. Besic taken off – FFS.

We are 3 weeks in to the window and all that has happened is we are losing Eto’o? WHY? Another player leaving and none coming in? It’s a joke. We are now definitely relegation candidates. Our current form is abysmal and worrying..

Please get someone in before it’s too late. I was a big fan of Roberto last season but that ship has long sailed... Let Dunc and Sheedy take over for now. They can’t do any worse than this fella.

If Mirallas was not injured, it was big mistake to take him off. I am sure he would be determined to make amends.
Some of you are saying Mirallas deserved to be taken off, but what about us, fans, what about the result?

Did I mention we should play a different way?

He played the situation down by saying Baines is the taker, he’d prefer Baines to have taken it, but he’s happy for Baines and Mirallas to discuss and decide.

I suspect he’s pissed. I suspect the players are pissed at Mirallas too. He can’t publicly hang Mirallas out to dry given our situation....but I wonder if the odds of Mirallas being sold in the next week or so has dramatically increased.

Based on the body language of the players when Mirallas kept hold of the ball to take the pen, I reckon Mirallas is a bit of a big-time charlie who thinks he’s too good for us. Despite his ability, that kind of divisive attitude is not what we need in our situation.

Admittedly when they did make the occasional foray into our half there wasn’t an extra man kept forward to attack with greater pace. It was if, ’ok, we’re now allowed to lump it to Lukaku, that’s what we’ll do every time’. Hardly like the Newcastle match of last season.

But given they really did properly park the bus, having Messi on the bench wasn’t an option. Could have done with some long diagonals to the far post, but then who do we have to get on the end of them?

Aging (mostly) team walking into the (relegation) sunset.

Why do we keep on with this passing game? It is so Clear that we don’t have the individual skills needed to play like this. Look at the Chelsea goals against Swansea. That is what we are trying to do. But seriously. Then we need to buy 15 new players.

When things do not work you need to play a more simple game. Get People in the Box, shove the ball in and fight.

We were lucky to get the penalty in the first place. It was a penalty, but it’s not like we would have scored (or even had a shot) if Roger had not used his arm. Lukaku had effectively lost possession.

Mirallas was obviously way off the mark doing what he did. AND to add to that, if you have put yourself in that position with pressure, you can’t then go and shoot the penalty across your body. Blast it straight-ish.

If Baines wasn’t going to take the ball out of Mirallas’ hands and take the penalty himself, he shouldn’t have approached him at all. I think Baines definitely SHOULD have taken the ball and told Kev to fuck right off, but the last thing the bloke taking the penalty needs is someone standing there talking shit in his ear.

Naismith said Baines isn’t the official penalty taker, but that he just takes them, and then Martinez said Baines IS the penalty taker. One of them is lying.

Jagielka is a coward.

Lescott "couldn’t care less, to be honest" about Everton.

We need a new corner taker. I’ve just celebrated the third anniversary of the first time I said that.

Kone. Last time he played I said The Straq couldn’t have been worse. I should have started with a better player comparison because there is a serious lack of players bad enough to compare with this bloke.

We’ve probably seen Mirallas’ last game for Everton, which is a massive shame, and in a week where Eto’o is probably gone too, we need to get someone in of a level that can support our attack. Or just sign another free-agent looking for a retirement fund.

From the lower Gwladys I don’t remember Foster making a save of note second half.

Martinez has lost it. Taking off Besic instead of Barry was beyond all of us. Same shit passing sideways, slow slow nobody shooting. Barkley is in bits. The kid offers nothing on or off the ball. Very frustrating and as a team were horrible to watch.

It’s gonna be a long coupla months. I’m just glad that’s my last game until May, or possibly next season. It’s just too painful to sit through at the moment.

From the lower Gwladys I don’t remember Foster making a save of note second half.

Martinez has lost it. Taking off Besic instead of Barry was beyond all of us. Same shit passing sideways, slow slow nobody shooting. Barkley is in bits. The kid offers nothing on or off the ball. Very frustrating and as a team were horrible to watch.

It’s gonna be a long coupla months. I’m just glad that’s my last game until May, or possibly next season. It’s just too painful to sit through at the moment.

28 fucking million. I’m going to draw a fucking big cock on that fucking stupid Kim Jong Un picture hanging up at Goodison first thing tomorrow.

Who’s coming?

Too many times players slowed it down. Too many of our established players hid away or took the easy pass and isolated a team mate. Last season we played some great one touch, two touch stuff at pace and that is all about confidence. The poor atmosphere obviously doesn’t help but Martinez has got a real issue on how to motivate this team and I know some may say that is of course his job but ultimately it is up to the players when they cross that white line onto the pitch.

I agree it’s hard to defend some of RM’s questionable decisions. I am baffled by the substitution of Besic as he was the only player moving the ball at speed and into space, while of course his comments to the media are frustrating. Sometimes a spades a fucking spade, but what should he say in reality - that we played shite, the players are shite or my philosophy is shite? People hated the defeatist attitude of a knife to a gun fight before a ball was even kicked previously. They hate this positive outlook. I personally dislike it but I commend him for trying to look at the positives when it is far easier and more to the point to just say we were shite.

Usually our bad form happens at the start of the season, albeit never this bad, and we are never this close to the bottom like we are now. I think the pressure is getting to the boys and the heads are dropping far too easy. Again some may say its upto RM to stop this but the players need to get together and have a really good look at themselves.

We have a warm weather break and then we play Chelsea, Liverpool and Young Boys. We usually raise it for the big boys. It may be just the tough set of fixtures to kick start some winning form. If not then things look very worrying.

First time I’ve said it - but RM has got to go.

This is getting more desperate by the week.
We’re sleep-walking to disaster.

25/1 for the drop.
No hope in sight. Crap performance and decisions.

He shouldn’t wait to be sacked if he has any decency.
On the basis he’s out of his depth he should resign now.

What would be wrong with RM saying -
"Leighton is our penalty taker, what Kevin did was wrong, thats why I took him off. The matter has been dealt with now and we will move on to the next game".

If Mirallas cannot deal with that then quite frankly thats his problem.

Here is another point, look at the pressure Mirallas has now put on Baines. Even if we had a leader for a captain instead of Jags and he demanded Baines take the penalty look at the added pressure that needlessly puts on Baines.

Even now there will be extra pressure on Baines the next time we get a penalty.

The message Roberto has put out now is that if you step out of line here we will protect you.

I don’t often agree with Carragher but him and Neville spoke the truth about what Mirallas did tonight.

Is this amateur hour at GP.

This clown needs to go before the end of the transfer window and I don’t mean KM.

Every cloud has a silver lining. Wait a minute though – you don’t think M and M (Martinez and Mirallas) have been got at by an Asian betting syndicate do you???

Robles - nothing to do slow distribution 6/10.
Coleman - headless chicken 5/10.
Jags - so so, still prone to a mistake 6/10.
Stones - solid performance 7/10.
Baines - poor first half better second, 6/10.
Mirallas - Penalty, say no more.
Barkley - headless chicken, lost his way, 4/10.
Naismith - as above.
Barry - Good 60’ then tired 6/10.
Basic - Good 70’ then mysteriously subbed 7/10 (MotM).
Lukaku - shit first touch, no service 5/10.

Oviedo - Looked keen, 6/10.
Kone - ? 4/10.

Martinez, wrong team selection followed by bad subs. I never wanted him in the first ace, backed up my thinking with his performance.

Hard to fathom how deluded some of these footballers are. But then we seem to have a deluded manager too. None of the truly great players think they just have to turn up, they know they have to work hard every game.

Time overdue for a taxi for Roberto. But I can’t see it happening.

Losing the crowd, your fucked.

If this was a once off lack of leadership by him I wouldn’t be saying it. The role of a captain is often exagerated but on this occasion he clearly should have stepped in.

Let me ask you this, if Jags wasn’t wearing an armband and going up for the coin toss, can you tell me one time during the last 2 years of an incident that would have suggested to you that he was our captain?

Awful performance though. If all the lesser teams come and park the bus, and considering our defensive record, we’ll lose more than we win at this rate.

Apologies, I haven’t read through this thread, but in regards to what I want to say, it doesn’t matter.

I was totally, and utterly disgusted by some so-called ’Evertonians’ booing Ross Barkley after that substitution tonight.

I really couldn’t put into words how low some ’blues’ can sink sometimes. Fucking cretinous twats does not convey my disgust. Just fuck off and take your ’support’ elsewhere.

Lukaku was appalling, same old miserable failure to hold the ball up and his lack of strength is a disgrace.

What can be said about the penalty fiasco and reaction to it? Utter chaos, and Jagielka’s captaincy or woeful lack of it is a major factor in our demise.

As for a Martinez, I have tried to support him but cannot any longer and I am afraid that the recovery of commitment by the players in the last 3 games has disappeared again.

We do not play for 12 days and Kenwright must act immediately given our next fixtures. My fear is that he will do nothing.

I agree with Barkley his confidence is shot to bits, he doesn’t get involved at all, he’s just giving the ball to others instead. I think that was the saddest part of tonight’s match – watching a kid who is a shell of himself frightened to get on the ball and maybe make a mistake. It’s gonna be a long rest of the season.

If they were a band, only their mums would turn up to watch them

Brin, the Stallone thing was an embarrassment. He piped up on the big screen then we all sang a few songs about the RS for the cameras. I hope it makes the movie!

We looked good at West Ham and at home to Man City, as they tried to attack us and we could counter them in attacking open games.

However, once we have 2 banks of four in front of us, we freeze and run out of ideas. Lukaku is useless in these games, his hold up play is awful. He doesn’t have a lay-off in him, and the wing backs seem to have boots full of lead.

As for the penalty, we have all had arseholes playing in teams who want to grab the glory. They are not team players and as someone said earlier, whatever then happens, the pressure on everyone increases. It showed, as Mirallas bottled it.
Martinez has got it wrong, subbing Besic again, what sort of an example is that? The lad is showing more guts than anyone else, and that’s his reward?
It is truly depressing, just dreadful.

Will we show up against the bigger teams who will at least take the game to us?

We certainly have no idea how to boss the lesser ones.

I haven’t expected us to win a game for months now.

This cant go on. Last time I remember a run like this Jimmy Gabriel was in charge post Kendal Mk 2. Or Walker.

Before Xmas I said to people in work we would be in the bottom three by the end of Jan .

He has to be sacked. He is going to take us down.

Like with Moyes at OT last season, the shadow of Fergie hung large and I’m starting to believe that Moyes’s shadow looms over Martinez. I think the senior pro’s in the team are questioning Martinez’s off-the-wall ideas on possession and set-pieces in the same way as Vidic and Ferdinand responded when they were told they needed to defend like Phil Jagielka by Moyes.

So my point is that I believe that Martinez no longer as the full respect of his players

However, Mr Tully the booing may be the realisation and frustration that going down is highly likely.

I know booing him will not help but I will say this again,

- a good manager knows when it is time to take a player low on confidence out of the team for a few games. If Roberto was stuck for players I might uderstand, but it is glaringly obvious that you cannot play Lukaku, Barkley and Naismith in the same team.

Ross should have been put on the bench 2/3 games ago, I still think he will in time develop into an excellent player if he has the correct manager to guide/protect him.

Sadly RM is not that manager

I am on my 4th cornetto as I type this.

Please please take Ross out of the firing line. Give him a breather, don’t destroy his confidence, his career and his rapport with the fans. And while you’re at it, take a long hard look at yourself in the mirror.

Yours sincerely

35,000 bored, annoyed, disinterested, frustrated and pissed-off fans.

Is it unrealistic to suggest that KM could have had a conversation with RM along the lines of "now Leighton has missed can I go on penalties?" and either got a positive answer or a wait and see answer?

Maybe Roberto didn’t drag him... maybe Kev has seen his arse with Roberto. And now Roberto is hiding.

I’m not saying that’s what happened but we really don’t know until someone tells us.

What’s certain is that you don’t have a debate before a penalty - it’s all sorted out before the game.

KM’s miss is a product of that stupid debate. Someone takes responsibility for that... so who is it?

However, the real problem is Martinez and we are sleep walking into relegation. Its Wigan all over again, keep possession and pass the ball but get beat regularly. He wants us to play the Spanish way - what he manifestly fails to realise is that passion and commitment is the English way and I for one want my team to show drive and passion not pass the f....ing ball 200 times for no purpose whatsoever other than for its own sake. If he wants Spanish football there are plenty of flights from John Lennon and the sooner he catches one the better.

It’s shocking what’s happened to Ross. The fans who are booing are, I believe reacting to that, and to a gameplan, tactics, instructions, whatever it is that has destroyed the lad’s confidence, zest and verve to run at the opponents.

Anyone will do based on our recent past. No matter who we have employed we have won nought since 1995. 20 years of nothing for such a great club!

In fact, I hate to say it but Everton has significantly underperformed over the past decades given our history and standing in the game.

My opinion is that these charlatans who earn mega pounds in the guise of football managers/coaches are overestimated in the extreme.

We the paying public play into this adoration, just like the fools who religiously watch reality TV programs. By doing so we elevate these nomarcs to a level whereby their opinions and dubious talents gain some unjustified level of status and gravitas.

I’m fed up listening to the drivel these so called "great coaches" come up with in defence of their profession. So clearly self serving, and we the paying public have fallen for it.

I would concede that in years gone by a coach/manager was King, probably up to the early 90s but now player power rules and our players should be able to lead us out of this mire and kick on.

The penalty fiasco today is a fine example of our total lack of leadership on the field. Something we have lacked for years.

Put it right and we might begin the climb back to the top.

Thanks Neil - possibly the finest line this season. Cheered me up mate. A little bit.

All of that shouldn’t disguise the fact that we had to sit through another sterile, toothless performance. No lack of effort from the players but a distinct lack of confidence. Barkley looks totally shot, not helped by the crowd getting at him every time he plays a square pass. Lukaku must have a bad toe again as the ball kept bouncing off him, Naismith gave his all as usual but seemed to have two left feet. Besic was terrific until he was hauled off - can only think the booking a minute earlier might have influenced the decision, as I don’t think he can stop himself diving in if he sees the ball there to be won. Barry was better tonight than of late, but then West Brom didn’t have anyone with any pace bursting past him. Stones looked good but the game was crying out for a bit of invention - how we miss a fully fit Pienaar. I can only remember one occasion when someone actually ran at the West Brom defence - Baines in the first half and he won a free-kick on the edge of the box - taken by Mirallas who tried to repeat the magic of last week - something which, fatally, he tried to do again on the stroke of half time.

The display tonight convinces me that the manager is just paralysed. If Besic was injured it still leaves a need to explain why Kone was introduced at 80 minutes when Barry had been dead on his feet for 20 minutes before that, as was Naismith.

Let there be no doubt now that we are in the shit. Does anyone, given that performance tonight, expect us to beat any other team in the PL? I don’t. We have Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal approaching. If BK doesn’t act, I think we will be relegated, I really do.

Baines does ask "Are you sure?" then says "Go on then," and pats him on the head, so that to me is permission.....

I’m getting fed up of RM: he keeps defending players, Barkley he always defends, Stones was in the wrong driving the ball out of defence but RM defends him next day.

We can see there was a problem today with the penalty but RM defends him – this is why the players are controlling the team: he hasn’t got any balls.

I watched Man City and West Ham: when we got a free kick, it was all different takers ,like as if it was "Go on, you can have a go now!" — it isn’t kids football....

Also I think the wage bill upsetting people: Eto’o on £80,000 hardly kicked a ball... players must be thinking WTF.... I read getting him off the wage bill saves us £6mil in wages – that’s a joke.

West Brom parked the bus we all knew what was going to happen.

Main question is how the fuck do we change this? The likes of Besic, Baines (apart from corners), Stones and Mirallas (before the pen) looked to be trying to get at WBA but too many others were poor or just didn’t even look like they wanted the ball or knew what to do with it.

Barkley for his own sake needed to be benched. Why the manager couldn’t see that is beyond me. Naismith was very poor but played the full 90 instead of being taken off. Coleman seems like a completely different player to last season. WBA came to park the bus so did we really need two DMs from the start?

Right now I’m more worried that Martinez doesn’t have what it takes to drag the team out of this slump and just doesn’t know what to do. 11 days ’till the next game - BK’s got a decision to make but I just cannot see him sacking the manager. Having just given him a 5 years contract 6 months ago, worth supposedly 3m a year (admittedly from the daily mail). Even if he’s ’only’ on 2m a year and not 3m, it would cost the club 9 million quid to sack him now! That’s presumably 9 million reasons for BK to pray that he can turn it round. (Even though the cost of relegation would be catastrophic.)

It’s looking rally grim at the minute.....I’m glad we don’t have a game this weekend to be honest.

What’s happened to us all?

We’re effectively 5 points off the relegation zone with our goal difference but I’m probably the only person still not that worried.

The players look like they’ve been beaten before the game starts. Martinez looks lost, and I’ve a hunch there’s a schism between the Moyes brigade and those brought in by Roberto.

Jagielka’s equaliser at the tin mine was supposed to kick-start our season. Romelu’s cup equaliser was supposed to kick-start our season. The Citeh draw was supposed to kick-start our season... sensing a pattern here?

We’re in it neck deep.

Why did Mirralles take the pen? Baines said something to him as he walked up put the ball on the spot. Couldn’t see proper as it was down at the Park End. If Baines is the penalty taker then he takes them, if the two players are arguing over who should take it the Jags is Captain, he should be bollocking Mirralles and telling him Baines that he is the penalty taker.

Looks like the crowd is turning against Martinez, not heard a Substitution booed like that since Moyes brought on Tony Hibbett against Spurs when we were 1-1.

The whole team looks leaderless, next three games Palace A, RS H and Chelsea A, can you see us getting anything out of them? The way things we are going I can’t.
Kenwright has now go to make the decision that could make or break the season, either he sacks Martinez now and brings in someone, or he sticks with Martinez and gives him some money to spend in the window.
No point sacking him if we lose our next three games.

But I’ve just found your earlier post (#155) which I find totally unacceptable. We do not tolerate anyone telling Evertonians they are "Fucking cretinous twats... Just fuck off and take your ’support’ elsewhere" — whatever the circumstances or excuses offered, that is unconscionable.

It is so obvious that Barklay is suffering a complete lack of confidence, he shouldn’t be playing, he looks like he is playing with blinkers on.

Something has to happen soon, we need players brought in now, this squad is small and it is patently obvious we are going to be very close to going down if everything stays as it is now.

I can’t understand how Barry gets a game and the reaction of the crowd when RM sub’d Besic instead spoke volumes.

Lose against Palace and I’m firmly in the Martinez out camp!

Simple question Michael. If anyone agrees with your standpoint - I would be shocked mate.

I personally have never rated him, but I hope I’m wrong. So ’Manuel’ aka Martinez needs to take ’Russ’ out the firing line for a month or so otherwise he will be playing for Marine in 2 years. Personally I think we should sell to whoever is interested.

Somebody on here said he left the ground in flip flops if that is a clue for us.
Mirallas was only thinking about himself,and not the team with the penalty.
Decent player but not as good as he thinks he is,and not at all consistent. If we get good money for him I say take it.

We are shot in confidence right now,and it looks like it will be a roller coaster to the end of the season.

We had everything in our favour tonight.

Practically a full strength 11 except for McCarthy, almost all the teams below us dropping points at the weekend, a big crowd at home in Goodison – and that was the best our manager could get from his players.

Apart from the Mirallas penalty fiasco, I think the most shocking thing tonight was it took Martinez until the 79th minute to make a change when we were creating nothing.

Martinez is out of his depth here.

I wish I could share your serenity, we just don’t look capable of putting sides - any sides- away and in our position that’s a very big worry indeed.

The sub of Besic was the last straw for me with Martinez, he has lost the plot, he keeps on with his OCD madness

Jags not comfortable playing the ball out from the back and is millimetres from fucking it up royally at least once every game

Baines cant get a ball past the first man from set pieces and corners yet Garbutt cant get a game and will walk - a gift for another team

Coleman doesnt look arsed because Martinez has removed the winger from in front of him he needs to do his job

Barry gets a game no matter what and no matter how shite he still never gets subbed

Barkley has lost it, he needs dropping to sort out his head or use him sparingly as a sub BUT NOT EXPECT HIM TO WIN A GAME SINGLE HANDED

Naismith all over the pitch turned from an attacking mid to a useless utility player chasing shadows and making too many mistakes

Lukaku gave us a burst of what he is capable of playing him facing the goal running at decent passes reverted to playing with his back to goal and looking utterly garbage

Eto’o given away but don’t worry we have Traffic Kone and McAleny to replace him - seriously WTF

Wingers, how can you play a lopsided game with one or no wingers and have wing backs on the pitch expected to do anything of merit beyond leaving the centre halves abandoned to their fate on a counterattack

Where do the points come from? I cant see any points if we cant even turn up for games like West Brom or Hull or other shite we have had to endure, Christ I thought Gollum’s football was tedious this is samaritans inducing

RM only had to say to the cameras that Baines is Number 1 and that he isn’t happy with Mirallas, but he didnt. When asked about the performance, again he gave us some flannel about being good in the 1st half but forcing it in the 2nd half, that isn’t good enough at home to a poor WBA.

Any team in the top half of the table will beat us in this form. There isn’t any direction on or off the pitch, there isn’t any will to win. There isn’t any will to win the 1st ball never mind the 2nd. We are in serious shite with this fellow. If we suffer a heavy defeat against Palace on Saturday it could be taxi for Roberto time.

I don’t even know who could I want to replace him but whoever it is will wont spout as much shite.

He was great against West Ham in the week but for me regularly flatters to deceive – over his time with us has never consistently delivered on the promise of his significant talent.

Fur coat, no knickers.

I just hope that there are 3 sides worse than us but I honestly feel it’s gonna be touch n go for the rest of the season. Gutted.

Gavin (202), you might well be right about Mirallas - I wouldn’t know whether he’s more interested in himself than the team as I’ve never met the man - who knows how any of these millionaires think? I will say, though, that all players, especially strikers. need a bit of arrogance and it’s sometimes a fine line between that arrogance being for the benefit of the team or spilling over into selfishness.

I was screaming at Ross through my TV on several occasions tonight, particularly in the first half for his lack of effort and I agree with an earlier post on here that he did pull out of quite a few tackles.

Fans pay a huge portion of their income supporting their team. The minimum they ask for is effort and if they feel that these overpaid players are not giving their all, I believe they have the right to voice their feelings, if this means booing a player. then so be it.

For the record I believe Barkley’s perceived lack of effort is because of his lack of confidence and I repeat, Martinez is 100% to blame for not taking him out of the side for a few games.

He is ruining this lad

You’ve mentioned fans getting on Barkley’s case for not driving forward with the ball. These are two different things, surely?

And just to clarify: some Everton fans boo when they feel so inclined — it’s a fact of life. And they get on a players case when they feel the need. Personally, I think it is their right to do so as paying customers. I’m sorry if that upsets you but you’re not going to get them to change — certainly not by abusing them verbally and telling them to "fuck off". THAT is totally unacceptable.

As for the fans what a disgrace! It’s like people now go the game and can’t wait to moan rather than cheer, rally and support their own we are so quick to get on the players’ backs when they were plugging away trying to find a way through against a bank of nine men!

The treatment of Ross Barkley was disgusting, he’s a young Evertonian heaped with too much pressure and expectation he’s now lost his confidence and couldn’t wait to pass the ball square and too scared to pull the trigger in case he missed, to boo your own is bang out of order and is counter productive. The lad needs resting but there is no one else due to injuries and shit signings!

What has happened to Martinez’s tactics and subs that worked so well last year? I wasn’t convinced last year and I’m definitely not now we are well and truly in the shit with this guy!

There were ’Evertonians’ booing Ross Barkley, after Besic had gone off. This was when the player was in possession. Not because of his choices with ball. Admittedly, not hundreds, but definitely audible, every time the ball came to the player. What is that about?

Pienaar aside these are the same players and they just look like shadows of their former selves. As the tagline put it a dismal draw with the only plus point a clean sheet-mark you that wasn’t very difficult against a team that didn’t play football. A frustrating time and whare’s the next win coming from

Tonight West Brom came looking for a draw. And that was their prerogative. We couldn’t break them down. But this season we can’t break any team down. Cannot even get a penalty right. Bloody awful.

Did I say that Martinez was a gifted manager. Shoot me if I ever say that again. He needs to be removed now. Nobody can defend this run of form. And he doesn’t seem to know how to turn things around. We are very close to becoming Wigan Mk 2.

Crystal Palace have been watching this rubbish tonight. And they can score the odd goal. I am worried.

How long should Martinez get to turn this around? IMO he should be shown the door now. Get someone in to stop the rot. But who do you get I here people saying. Who cares. Can another manager be any worse right now. Give D.Ferguson a go. Anybody but Martinez. Before it is too late. No more excuses for this man, and no more talk about how well Everton did last season. That’s gone.

I also said before this rubbish tonight (as did many others)that Barkley and Naismith should be rested. But Mr.Martinez knows his stuff.

Here’s hoping that Martinez and his Wigan backroom staff get the boot. Because we are now in a dog fight and I just don’t trust Martinez to do the right things for Everton. Expect the same old shite to prevail in two weeks time. ps: We could have done with a little guile from a wily old head tonight. But for whatever reason Eto’o is on his way out. Martinez would probably have played him alongside Barry anyway.

Yes, we all know booing the lad doesn’t help him get through this... but – in the context of the game and what Martinez has done to him, and to this very talented group of players – I personally feel it is understandable.

What is not understandable to me is you questioning the allegiance of Evertonians who, like you, paid to go to the game, just because they express their frustrations in different ways.

Just to Clarify, I was not disputing your account of what went on I was giving an account of what was happening in the main stand.

You have no reason to lie and if you say their were people near you Booing Barkley, I believe you are saying it because it happened

WBA came for a point & really didn’t have to work that hard for it.

The penalty "fiasco" was just as embarrassing as the half time entertainment, which funnily enough created more atmosphere than our team served up all game.

Besic being brought off really summed up the ineptness of our manager, if I’m not mistaken,Besic had more shots at goal tonight & was our MOTM by a distance. Why not Barry???

I witnessed something for the first time in many years going to goodison tonight, when needing a goal & the injury time board goes up, a roar goes around the ground willing the players on, not tonight, the roar was replaced by the sound of seats being vacated with hordes heading for the exit,it was sickening to be honest,losing the crowd is a major no no.

Can anyone see us getting any points in the next 3 games under this clown, I can’t.

Boo him during a game?....absolutely never. But that’s just me.

Today we’ve witness the farce of our penalty. No leaders on the pitch, what was our captain doing? Leighton Baines, you bottled that. When the rest of the team look for leaders on the pitch they look to Baines and Jags. Neither of them come out in a good light for me. I’d make Coleman captain for the next game.

When folk talk about getting rid of the deadwood, Pienaar, Distin, Howard, Gibson, Kone, Alcaraz, Osman, those players aren’t playing. Essentially we have a new team and up front in wide areas we’re lacking quality.

I think how Martinez handles this situation will define him. This season has been dross and I’m being polite but I hope he’s given time, if we start next season like we’re playing now then it’s clear it’s not working (it’s not working now I know but... patience and all that).

Okay, let’s try and mix it a bit... no result there. Give me the ball, I will take the fucking pen... No result there.

What the heck do we do now... well one needs to step up to the plate and give direction (captain/manager):

1) Play as a team

2) Run at the opposition, don’t do it crab style

3) Those that are ineffectual passing sideways then penetrate with with their bodies, others penetrate with the ball.

4) Have the opposition guessing where you are coming from or running to

5) Be quicker in thought, comes from practice in training for longer and harder.

6) Use runners to deflect as in patinando (fencing) – speed and deflect either fast step and lunge i.e season 2013-14 or get a slow response from your opponent (Everton) and fast lunge (break by opposition).

Unfortunately both captain and manager are being ineffectual, There is only trouble ahead whilst others jostle for their leadership style as being the correct way i.e. pen taker/transfer talk/I’m off to Italy. Let’s just see what happens after the away day warm weather training sessions, that may be just better late than never.

Remember our team’s confidence is shot at. They need to be nurtured and not expect natural ability/form to come to the rescue. We will overcome and be victorious. Just hold your nerve Evertonians and press on.

They get the plaudits when they turn up and perform. Even if they lose their touch, at the very least they must try. How many times have the Everton faithful turned up and supported sub par performances. Countless!

These players are all big boys now and have to man up and take personal responsibility. We are treating footballers with the kid gloves just as every aspect of our life seems to be treated today. Political correctness, don’t upset anyone etc. etc.

Whatever happened to personal responsibility, pride and self esteem.

These guys are paid a fortune and they have to get off the pot and assume the responsibilities they have signed up for.

Bloody hell, I read somewhere today that Bournemouth could be in the Prem next season and we could be in the Championship.

Now there’s a team taking ownership and personal responsibility!

I feel sorry for him. I get the impression that his natural instincts are being coached out of him. It’s like he is too scared to play with freedom........"must play the safe pass, don’t give it away".

He, like many of the players , are not comfortable with how they are being asked to play. Do they get their legs spanked for putting the ball in the box?

We need a change in management in my view. We have a talented squad but are drifting aimlessly. Bobby Bollocks needs to take his philosophy elsewhere.

The penalty incident is an embarrassment; RM should be honest. I have to say we feel like a rudderless ship.

I’d like to see Michael Laudrup in. Roberto seems a really nice person (unlike our last manager), but I think he’s ill-equipped for the task ahead. It’s very sad.

Mirallas is angling for a champions league move. Reminds me of what Pienaar was saying a few years back and that really worked out for him didn’t it??!!!

Martinez is clueless and quite clearly hasn’t the ability to turn this car crash round. We are in deep shit and can you seriously see us getting out of it anytime soon???

Just look first at our senior players "WHO" have not lead by example on the field.... And are a fecking disgrace to our club at present!

Why is it always easier to pick on the Evertonian in the team? "Fucking dicks"

But to be honest, I am only worried about Everton Football Club. And Martinez is not exactly filling me with much confidence that he can turn this slump around. I bloody well just knew that this would happen. Winning no pre-season games. No momentum. No bloody ideas. No Plan B. No bloody nothing. And still Bungling Bill dithers.

What did I do in a past life to deserve this crap??

I didn’t hear any booing of Barkley around me, plenty for the Besic sub (including me) in the Paddock except one guy who got shouted down. I felt sorry for Ross, I thought he was genuinely trying to put a shift in tonight but his confidence is shot and he hesitates every time he gets the ball like there is a conflict in his head.

Martinez just has to go, and the pressure needs to move to BK now, because I think it is a given that Martinez is just hopeless so pointless having a go at him from now on really. I can’t see where any points will come from with this idiot.

By the way, had Tony Pulis had 3 more games to drill his team we would have lost tonight. He has fixed defence (it’s that easy Roberto with discipline and organisation and a plan - a real plan I mean, not a bollocks pie in the sky one), a little attack effort would have sunk us. We nearly were when Jags nearly gifted Victor. But luckily it was Victor.

The Stallone thing was surreal. Go Everton!!!

I terms of natural reactions, I think every time Ross got the ball in the second half I was compelled to shout "go on, get at them" generally followed by "for fuck’s sake". Yeah, multiplied by thousands that’s going to get to Ross. But it’s not booing. If people were booing Ross at the ground then I’m with Kevin Tully. We don’t need that kind of support.

Really glad someone else here see’s the awful "support" from half the "fans", disgusting, absolutely disgusting and they should be very, very ashamed of themselves.

I’ve supported this club for near on 40 years, but the majority of blues fans I talk to are so ignorant/stupid/uneducated imbeciles, that I fear the club is literally going to the dogs.

Wise up you horrible morons.

After the Man. City and West Ham games I was certainly expecting some fire in our team, but it’s all gone back to the sad, slow, unimaginative build-up.

Roberto is probably happy that we’ve finally kept a clean sheet, though.

The penalty scene was unbelievable and it is indicative of how low things have got.

They must be fancing three points down at Selhurst Park.

I was talking the other day to a friend who supports Aston Villa and he said we’ll both be all right in the end. "Be all right, man? We were 5th last season, for heaven’s sake!" , I replied.

We each have the right to follow our team in the way we choose. I will not accept the use of this website to call other Evertonians ignorant/stupid/uneducated imbeciles and morons.

Sorry, but that’s the bottom line. There is no excuse for turning on fellow Evertonians, no matter how much you disagree with their position or opinion.

Goodison is too. I’m not sure if it was ever a sanctuary but the nobhead quotient has increased.

To be clear, if anyone on here thinks the best way to support Ross Barkley is to boo him when he gets the ball, then they are thick as shit.

As for us now, God help us all if he remains in charge.

The penalty was a fiasco, and just sums up our season.

I posted on a another thread that the crowd needed to be behind the team 100% for the full 90 minutes. I watched the match live at 4am in the morning with headphones on, so as not to disturb the missus. I need not have bothered such was the lack of atmosphere. I could quite clearly hear Pulis barking out instructions.

I also said we wont get anything out of this game. I will say it one more time, I was taken in by Martinez but wised up at the beginning of the season when listing to his after match comments.

Phil Walling calls him a charlatan, I have to disagree. A charlatan knows he is lying and deceiving to get what he wants. Martinez really does believe in what he is seeing and saying. That is deluded with a capital D.

I already think it’s too late, as the board wont pull the plug on this manager and wont give him any more funds to fucking waste either. We are in the shit, because the player are not doing there job regardless of how the manager wants them to play. The good ones don’t give a fuck as they will just jump ship if we go down. The fans are left with the mess and the indignation of being also-rans.

I will not bother watching anymore games or contributing to TW. I will read others post as it’s sort of become a addiction now. Good luck guy’s to the die hards that go to the matches I hope miracles do happen. I live in the real world unlike the manager.

We’re at a pivotal moment now. We have two options as far as management is concerned.

Option A – We act now. We’re still in Europe. Still have our best players and still have 2 weeks of the transfer window left remaining. So we’re still a fairly attractive option for most top’ish managers.

Or option B – Survive this season. Just. Go out of Europe. Keep playing the most boring football I’ve ever witnessed. Lose fans and gate receipts. Ruin players reputations, confidence and thus market value. Deal with the mass exodus of depreciated playing staff with half the money raised disappearing into a black hole of operating costs and give Bobby a chance to turn it around next season. We will then most likely follow Wigan the following season into the Championship.

So basically we either change now and stabilize the club or stick with Bobby and risk everything. Thing is, he won’t be sacked and I have my own theory on why.

When Moyes was manager here he did a great job all in all. Some disagree but as far a BK was concerned he almost guaranteed safety every year and therefore BK and his shareholders could sleep at night safe in the knowledge that massive personal funds weren’t required to buy players to keep us there. The happy clappers would be kept clapping and groups like the Blue Union would remain marginalised.

Anyway, Man Utd came calling and that was that. So now BK needs a new manager but more importantly he needed a Spin Doctor. Someone to tow the party line. A salesman who would indulge in the romantic fluff of the club and not complain publicly about the lack of transfer money. Martinez saying he had a plan that didn’t need money to be successful was all BK needed to hear. It was a quick interview and the rest is history.

Recently, I read the Alan McLoughlin book. For those of you who don’t know, Alan was a journeyman player with several caps for the Republic of Ireland who late in his career played for Wigan with incidentally our Bobby in midfield. In the book he tells a story of how he looked up in the stands during a game and could clearly see Dave Whealen talking on the phone to the then manager in the dug-out, telling him to take off a player and replace him with such and such. He recalls that to his disgust the manager did as he was asked.

Dave Whealen basically picks the team at Wigan. Would any Manager with any integrity let this happen? Many managers didn’t and Whealen got rid. Except our Bobby who Mr Whealen couldn’t speak highly enough of which is even more unsurprising after Martinez lined his pockets with more than £20 million for players as soon as he arrived.

Martinez Out but more importantly long term Kenwright Out.

He picks the team, he decides on the tactics, he supervises the training, he gives the half-time pep talk and makes the substitutions and the tactical changes necessary, and he is the one who is supposed to motivate!!!

It is patently obvious, and has been all season, that – just as TGT was near the end of his tenure – Roberto is failing abysmally on all those counts. He has to go now or else we as fans must be prepared to accept Championship football at Goodison Park next season.

Well, the problem is not the players, very clearly it’s the tactics. And to have the wrong tactics is one thing, but to consistently refuse to change them is another.

Last night Mirallas showed about as much class as you would expect from a man who fawkes out for a golden Bentley. Somebody buy him a fur coat and tall hat with a feather.

As for the penalty fiasco, just a symptom of a much larger problem with this club - no leadership on or off the pitch. Completely rudderless at present.

After a few things last nt - he's starting to lose me and if he doesn't do the following from here on out and we continue not to get results then he will.

Start with two up front particularly at home against lesser sides - with Rom and Kone, around 60 mins everyone was screaming for Kone to come on, he didn't till nearly 80 mins.

Wtf not - it wasn't as if West Brom were going to over run us in midfield if we had two strikers up front.

Besic was outstanding again last nt - the boo's when he came off were unbelievable and merited. Naismith, Barry, Barkley any of them should have come off before Besic.

Naismith - like everyone else I like him a lot, he always gives everything, can score important goals, but I've said it before he can be largely anonymous and ineffective in some games and last nt was one of them, he should have come off as all he did was give the ball away.

Service - Garbutt has by far and away the best service. we need that as at times when we have team with so many players behind the ball we need a quality delivery and Garbutt's is as good and dangerous as anybody's out there.

I don't care Baines plays in front of him in left midfield or in Lahm role, Garbutt needs to start.

I agree he should have been told in no uncertain terms by Baines and Jags to do one - if they did tell him then I didn't see it.

Wtf was KM doing wanting to take the pen?

Even if Baines has taking it, It creates unnecessary tension in moment where its really not needed. Baines is the main penalty taker - penalty awarded he steps up and takes it end of.

It clear KM ego is bigger and more important to him than the club.

Wanting to take the pen - who the does he think he is - he can do one.

He wants to leave at the end of the season so what right does he have to take the penalty over Baines the main penalty taker.

Its moment like that that give you momentum back in your season, a 1-0 penalty win gets the ball rolling.

He'd done this, stepped up and missed, brilliant, cheers Kev now fuck off.

I agree with you about that being part of the problem and maybe the start of the problems for Ross. During the World Cup we all saw Hodgson having a go at him for losing the ball the first time he touched it after coming on as sub, something he never seems to do with the likes of Sterling. I said then that he’s trying to turn Ross into another Tom Cleverley - keep possession, play it square, get it back, play it square again - and was glad when England got knocked out and we could get him away from such a negative influence. I always felt Martinez encouraged him to be more positive and not to worry too much if he lost possession, unlike Hodgson and, for that matter, OFM. Even this week he was going on about his acceptance of mistakes made by young players. And yet now we have Ross performing with all the predictability of a Cleverley, his natural instincts all but disappeared.

To me, though, it’s more of a confidence thing and I agree with those who say he needs to be taken out of the team for a spell. I think he’s struggling with the expectations placed upon him, by being judged, maybe even inside his own head, as not only an England player, but as an England world cup player, rather than as a promising 21 year old who’s still learning the game. Let’s be honest, in most other eras he would not have yet got near to the national side but such is the paucity of English players at the top clubs he’s been promoted ahead of his time. Add to those doubts a struggling team seemingly in disarray, a crowd turning on him for the first time in his career - I didn’t hear anyone booing him last night but there were plenty of groans each time he played the ball square or didn’t dive into a challenge - and the ingredients are there for someone to start doubting himself.

This is what Martinez said the other night in the Echo: " When Ross is at his best he plays with a smile on his face and he doesn’t worry about "what if" and he has an instinctive way of showing his talent. he has taken too much responsibility into his play, he is considering every pass before he does it, or every touch, because he doesn’t want to miss it or be negative, and that has affected his play a little bit. But it’s (the team’s poor run) affected him for the right reasons because he is a responsible, proper Evertonian and he knows how the crowd feels and he suffers more than others."

I can’t disagree with any of that. Let’s hope the winter sunshine break does Ross, Martinez, and all the players, including Mirallas, some good and they come back refreshed and ready to go against Crystal Palace.

Do we
-petition/badger Kenwright to sack Martinez
-voice our displeasure and frustrations at the screen/in stands
-vote with our wallets and do whatever type of protests we plan to do (heard that Villa is doing an 82 minute support, skip the 1st 8 minutes, using the reference point of their 82 European Cup exploits)

I'm sure we can go on and on about how a bunch of millionaires should be able to take it on the chin, motivate themselves to play for the shirt that most of us would be happy to pay to play for etc.

But what is really going to help our club get through this period?

To me, it's about supporting and giving that 200% to the players each time they take to the field, encourage them if you ever get to see on in the streets etc.

Ultimately, it's about the 11 man plus 3 substitutes who's gonna do the business on the pitch, make the right decisions.

I guess we can argue till the cows come home as to whether it's better to cut our losses right now and sack the manager, or give him time to get through the 2nd season syndrome.

I say, our energies are much better spent on willing the team on. Whether you think they should be able to motivate themselves better or not, isn't the main point.
The main point is that the club should go on, and we want the best for it (right now, at least not being relegated!).

So what if whoever is vindicated e.g. "see I told you, I'm right about this, or that". Save that for the end of the season. Save your energies for what we as fans can most directly effect i.e. and that is the performances of the players on the field when the rubber meets the road, by cheering them on relentlessly.
Be that 12th man to keep believing that it ain't over till the fat lady sings (or when the ref blows the whistle).

So, those of you who have the privilege to afford to be at the Old Lady watching the team (of course some will argue that at the rate it's going, it's not)...
Nil Satis Nisi Optimum.
cheer your heart out.

I do not blame Mirallas for the incident, he was frustrated by the situation and wanted to take responsibility and 'show them'. A perfectly natural reaction from a competitive sportsman.

The idea this was to help a move out of Everton is driven by personal bitterness towards someone who some feel let them down. Does anyone really think scoring a penalty will have any effect in making other clubs want to buy him? Those clubs that are interested will already have let his agent know.

Of course if he'd scored this would have been a different story, just as much as if Baines had taken it and missed, like he recently did at OT. Then we would no doubt have been complaining about why didn't they let Mirallas take it as he obviously felt confident.

The fact that we are now in a situation that a missed pen at home to WBA creates so much furore is testament to the bigger, much darker picture created by the lack of management skills of Relegation Roberto. A proven failed EPL manager appointed by a chairman taken in by media spin and his judgement reinforced by so many others who simply ignored the facts and listened to the hype.

Klinsman (I'm American so don't shoot me. He has done wonders with the U.S. team and may light a fire under Howard)

RDM: he took Chelsea to CL and wants back into the PL. Maybe a long shot bough as he is having a good season now.

Laudrup: why not, he made Swansea a threat, won a cup, kept them up and built the foundations of that club.

Moyes: maybe Bilky not should never have let him leave. At least under him the damn defense played better.

If Roberto can't or won't ( based on his no change Interview the other week ) somebody needs to...up to a point anybody in the short term who can come in and weld a patch will do, the ship is leaking. We need somebody to get the ship back to the dry dock

While that is happening get the yellow pages out and book a 'Coded Welder' to start in the summer.

Or, Get a Para-medic with a set of paddles now to revive us. Then pass us over to the Experts for the proper cure.

*cuts to opening scenes of M.A.S.H.

Even on luck alone we should be winning points by now which suggests he's doing a very bad job indeed. If there were a vote, for me he's had long enough now and needs to go.

I remember this being asked a couple of years ago too. At least then we were a consistent 'best of the rest' finisher and had something to lose. Now we have lost it and we can replace the manger with just about anyone and it can't get much worse.

On a plus note I have come up with a way to secure out premier league status. I'm off to the bookies to put £50 on us getting relegated, who's with me?

Martinez has had 20 odd games to sort this out and hasn't yet, nor looks like doing.

For the sack was (approx ) 25%, 35% and 45%...It's growing

I think every Evertonian now understands that we are now in a relegation battle with one of the best teams on paper that we've had in years and thats why Martinez position should now be changed because he's hugely underachieveing.

Just imagine how bad we'd be doing under Martinez if we had a poor team!

It's not far away and when the fans turn away the club will surely realise, as they should now, how desperate the situation is.

Well, how about meeting the two objectives simultaneously? I give you Neil Lennon.

Barkley needs to be dropped. He does nothing to influence the game. A couple games off could be a positive thing.

James M. needs to be back in the lineup. Stones needs to play every game. Garrett needs to play.

Play Naismith behind Lukaku or play Lukaku and Kone. Why Kone didn't come on earlier yesterday was a mystery to me. West Brom weren't coming forward so play 2 strikers.

I thought the movement off the ball yesterday was terrible. Players just stand in place. Nobody makes a run for others.

At the start of the season Everton were scoring around 2 goals a game, but now you wonder how they will score once a game.

The Europa League is also a real issue now. Everton need to concentrate on staying up, not chasing European glory, but I figure Martinez doesn't see that way.

The future of Everton should be more important than this. We could easily survive if we just played to our strengths and not to one persons ideals. But I fear that we will now be relegated with this style of football. All confidence is gone and we are lacking leadership, all the while with a really good team.

If we sacked Martinez now, no big club would ever take a risk on him again yet we are risking our very future on his vision. Even if we survive, do we really want to risk another season playing football to an ideal, rather than what's in front of you on the field?

1) He appears to have no idea about how and when to press. This is vital in a key midfield player. One player not doing this properly means the whole pressing concept breaks down. Just watch how often he is caught out, too far from the player he should be pressing and sadly this happens over and over again. There is no instinct to "rush" an opposition like McCarthy, just a general amble to take up a non-position.

2) He never ever runs beyond the front player. He is a fantastic athlete and if only he were completely knackered at the end of a game – dare I say it, like Gerrard – we could have a world beater. I hate the Redshite with a passion, but Martinez needs to get Barkley looking at some old videos of Gereard in his pomp. Look at Lampard etc, see how often they get in to the box and beyond the striker.

Come on, Bobby – let’s up the anti and help some of the youngsters develop in other stuff than tippy-tappy.

There are quite a few out with injuries and if they ever get fit enough they might help.

I keep saying we need two experienced players now.

I'd go for Steve McClaran. He's a great motivator and his teams play attractive football. I realise he has his critics but the guy knows the European leagues winning the Dutch title with FC Twente which was the equivalent of Fergie winning the Scottish league with Aberdeen. He took Boro to the Uefa Cup final against Seville and won the league Cup. I have a couple of friends who are massive Derby fans so I pay attention to their results and they are playing great football with a group of players who were treading water under Nigel Clough. So imagine what he could do with some of the underachieving talent we have.

Also we'd have a good chance of getting Will Hughes off them then who is a great young Midfielder and just the sort of player we need to sign.

Personally I'd like Bilic but I know he wouldn't be too popular on here and whisper this one, but maybe Benitez too.

I personally don't think Kenwright will sack Martinez, he hasn't got the bottle, it's like Walter Smith all over again.

Like Martinez, he divides opinion. Kenwright's lasting legacy will be fracturing a fanbase over failed stadium moves, the last one being particularly toxic. Maybe the advent of the keyboard warrior and troll means the idea of appointing a relative unknown/untried as Moyes was in 2002 is going to be a challenge, but to appoint a manager who doesn't have majority support of the fanbase would be a ludicrous step to take.

I therefore fully expect it to happen by the end of January!

No doubt back to the RS when they bore with Brenda.

You can say it as many times as you want, infact use it as a mantra.

Still doesn't change the fact we can and will go down if we carry on with this form.

Wooooooont goooooooo doooooowwwwwnnnnnn.....

Repeat this for an hour none stop and you begin to sound like a didgeridoo, quite calming really but fucking useless in the great scheme of things.

Err Kenwright did sack Walter Smith (eventually)

It’s like watching a car crash in slow motion and, for me, too many of our fans are asleep behind the wheel.

It may already be too late.

OUT NOW.

We can only carry 1 luxury player in this current squad, pick one from Barclay, Mirallas, Mcgeady, Eto or Naismith then up the work rate of the others its not rocket science. I would love to see youngsters coming through but going by what I have seen there is only Garbut anywhere near ready.

He has 2 weeks to save his job in my eyes, a heavy defeat in the derby could be adios!

Whatever your job, don't reinforce failure. In Everton's case, clearly the players have not got the confidence just now to play possession football.

So like Big Sam says, keep it simple - play forward quicker, and try to play in their half, where any rebounds, deflections, mistakes or bad bounces are in our favour, not theirs. Also at GP, it gets the crowd noise going which is good for the team.

Re Barkley - I read one old player (I forget who) say that Evertonians will forgive any player who puts in a good shift - I have to say that Ross gives the impression of not trying too hard. I can't remember him ever making a tackle. If we had two or three more Besics we'd be sound.

Ross Barkley needs to be dropped. It's obvious to most that watch but he plays every game now it seems. He doesn't drive forward, he stops, passes the ball backwards or sideways and trots (not runs) to a different position. He's hardly ever running when he receives the ball. His through ball attempts amount to nothing. You might as well have someone who puts in the odd tackle play in his place.

Stones is very good. His overlapping runs were one of the bright spots.

Why Everton can't get behind defenses and cross the ball from the end line is beyond me. It happened earlier this year and last year, but not now.

Most of all it's to easy to play against Everton. They value possession over quick movement and it's killing this team.

As I’ve said, it may already be too late. You can hardly see where a goal or a win is coming from, even against teams in the bottom three.

Drastic action is needed NOW and Kenwright is fiddling while Goodison burns and must expect to take full blame for his inaction or his name will forever be detested whenever Everton FC is discussed.

If he decides that Martinez must go, it will be a swift kill.