Gylfi - Icelandic Genius

Robert Tressell 19/02/2021 112comments  |  Jump to last

Gylfi Sigurdsson is a genius.

With 5 goals and 7 assists in 29 games this season, our Icelandic talisman is clearly our Player of the Season so far. After being played out of position last season, he’s getting back to his brilliant best of the 2018-19 season, where he got a remarkable 14 goals and 7 assists in 41 games.

Indeed, over his Everton career, he’s managed 28 goals and 22 assists in 139 games. That’s slightly better than 1 goal (scored or assisted) every 3 games. Quite a remarkable return.


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Other players in his position or similar this season include:

  • Fernandes at Man Utd [£55M fee - 21 goals and 12 assists in 36 games]
  • Havertz at Chelsea [£80M fee – 5 goals and 6 assists in 26 games]
  • Barkley at Aston Villa [4 goals and 1 assist in 16 games]
  • Loftus-Cheek at Fulham [1 goal in 21 games]
  • De Bruyne at Man City [3 goals and 15 assists in 24 games]
  • Maddison at Leicester City [10 goals and 10 assists in 31 games]
  • Mount at Chelsea [3 goals and 4 assists in 23 games]

And the picture is much the same across Europe’s big leagues.

Fascinating statistics, eh?

Anyway, for those about to explode with rage, I don’t actually think Sigurdsson is our best player but I did want to highlight his important contribution — especially when played in his correct, specialist position alongside people who move faster than a potato.

He’s not in the same league as Fernandes or De Bruyne, clearly, and he’s behind Maddison too. However, from an end-product point of view, he’s not doing too badly at all. Which leads me to my point...

We need to replace Sigurdsson in the first team with someone just as skilful but more dynamic in order to improve. Unfortunately, there aren’t tonnes of options for this position. Over the years, I’ve expected Loftus-Cheek to mature into a dynamic, goalscoring midfielder in this position but, now 25, he has only 10 Premier League goals and 8 assists in 98 games. It looks like it might not happen for him now.

Fernandes and Havertz show how expensive it is to get a ready-made player in this position and Havertz, talented though he is, has shown how hard the transition is to the Premier League for a young player. He’ll get better though, especially under Tuchel.

And then there’s the issue of attracting players to a club without (we expect) Champions League football but with a stadium that would grace the city of Sheffield. This leaves us potentially hunting for players like Draxler (always injured), Isco (overweight and out of form), and Zielinksi who would come with very big wage demands and could end up representing a big loss and drain on the club if it doesn’t work out. I really hope we don’t go down this path. As much as I love James Rodriguez, I don’t think the answer is to buy more players like him.

The better option might be to dispense with a goalscoring midfielder altogether and go with 3 more agricultural players in midfield (eg, Allan, Davies and Doucouré) in order to free up the full-backs and allow an attacking trio to stay higher up the pitch and get goals.

This would mean we could go for someone like Pedro Goncalves of Sporting Lisbon who has bagged 14 goals and 2 assists in 17 games this season, but from a more advanced and wider position than Sigurdsson plays. However, that would squeeze out Rodriguez (which may or may not be a good thing).

The other option is to keep Sigurdsson in his correct position while grooming a very young player such as the Baumgartner of Hoffenheim or Olise of Reading (4 goals and 9 assists – and only 19) or the astonishingly talented Aouchiche of St Etienne (2 goals and 3 assists but only 18).

The final option is to bite the bullet and pay the likely £40M asking price for Buendia of Norwich (9 goals and 10 assists in 26 Championship games).

The likes of Leicester City and RB Leipzig, two good role models for us, would probably plump for Goncalves and Olise due to age, mobility and price. Leipzig would definitely not pay £40M for Buendia; Leicester might. I can still see the sense in going for Loftus-Cheek if he is fit and cheap.

Whatever the case, there’s a good chance that Sigurdsson (whether we like it or not) will continue to be an important part of the side until the end of his contract in Summer 2022. Primarily because it's going to be hard to replace him with someone significantly better who complements what we've already got.

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Reader Comments (112)

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James Marshall
1 Posted 19/02/2021 at 17:56:06
I always thought he bore the brunt of many a fans ire unfairly, but was often filling gaps, playing out of position and made to look a bit silly at times. When he plays centrally in the number 10 role, like he does for Iceland, he can be a really good player.

A lot of his Everton career feels as though he's not been used correctly, which has hampered his effectiveness, and made supporters dislike him. He runs about a lot, but doesn't make hard tackles, so fans don't take to him - especially at a club like ours where most fans prefer a player who looks as though he's trying hard, even if he lacks talent.

I don't know those players you've mentioned, but as someone who lives near Norwich and has seen a fair bit of him, Buendia can and I believe, will do it at a Premier League club in the not too distant future.

Steve Hogan
2 Posted 19/02/2021 at 18:27:39
Someone's taking the piss. No pace, can't tackle, can't play a ball forward to save his life. Very good at pointing though.

Another one stealing a living. We need pace, energy, aggression in midfield, sadly Gylfi has none of these qualities. Once the goals dried up, he became a passenger.

Dave Williams
3 Posted 19/02/2021 at 18:32:12
A lot of the stick we give him is when he teams / teamed up with Gomes, Schneiderlin, James, Rooney, Klaasen, Delph- players who have no pace. Surround him with workers/ runners and players who move into space and he is a decent player albeit we paid double his value to get him.
Kevin Prytherch
4 Posted 19/02/2021 at 18:33:44
He’s also managed 72 forward passes in the same period a remarkable one every 2 games!!
Barry Rathbone
5 Posted 19/02/2021 at 19:01:29
Played with a few lads like him marvelous technique and the ability to look a class apart given time and space but invisible when the muck and bullets fly. I imagine he looks a world beater at Finch Farm judging by Carlo's persistence but he needs to tune into the fact Gylfi is a gym fighter.
Barry Thompson
6 Posted 19/02/2021 at 19:15:06
Oh God - 50 posts from Annika coming up, batten down the hatches.
Tony Everan
7 Posted 19/02/2021 at 19:25:44
Last season was his anus horribilis. A real bummer of a season. There was something wrong with him mentally. I agree with Robert that this season he has made good strides towards his expected level only when played in his no10 slot. Playing him deeper or in a tackling midfield position just asking for trouble, he can’t do it and we suffer.

If America want him for a fee in the summer we have to take it. We have to be looking for our own Bruno Fernandes to give us more mobility and goals from midfield. I too like Buendia, but 40m is a lot . 20-25m last summer would have been shrewd business.

Whilst we’re at it, I am losing faith with Iwobi. He’s still holding back on his commitment to make things happen, to close down fast and to bring more desire to his play. He drives me mad as I have thought for ages there was more to come from him. He just can’t seem to break through to that next level we need.

If we can sell him and get someone like Ismailia Sarr in it would improve our attack.

Brent Stephens
8 Posted 19/02/2021 at 19:25:51
I wonder what she'll say?
Tony Abrahams
9 Posted 19/02/2021 at 19:34:51
I would never knock Gylfi Sigurdson, the way some do, and those stats are also very good, even if I honestly think I could count the number of times I’ve left a game, thinking Sigurdson had a really good game today on one hand.

I hope he doesn’t play tomorrow, same with Luca Digne, because tomorrow will be our 4th game in eleven games, and they’ve both looked shattered since the Fulham game.

John Keating
10 Posted 19/02/2021 at 19:43:42
His missus is a looker
Sam Bowen
12 Posted 19/02/2021 at 20:53:01
He’s absolutely fine as a squad player but only ever in that number 10 position. The tactic of dropping him deeper drives me absolutely mental and I can’t fathom why Carlo keeps trying it. Centre midfield is such a specialised position, you need to have played it all your life to be good at it. I feel sorry for him when he’s asked to play there as it is completely different. Yes, he should do a better job when he’s in there but I just don’t get why we keep asking him to do it. It never works.

I’d be happy to keep him and Rodriguez for the 10 role but only ever one at a time and focus on surrounding them with more pace and power.
I really like Pedro Neto at Wolves. Him on the right, Richy on the left and DCL up top with siggy/James floating around behind them.

Robert Tressell
13 Posted 19/02/2021 at 22:06:34
Neto is very good, Sam. I've been impressed with him this season. I expect he'd now cost circa £50m and will be expecting champions league football for his next move. There are quite a few like him though, fortunately. So shouldn't be too difficult to pick up a left footer with pace and end product in wide forward positions.

I might look at that position at some point (it's the position we needed to fill when we bizarrely bought Iwobi). But will probably look at the right back slot next.

Christy Ring
14 Posted 19/02/2021 at 22:57:17
Fair play Robert, personally I think it's time to go to SpecSavers, but we all have our opinions.
Danny Broderick
15 Posted 20/02/2021 at 05:50:59
I can't be bothered to check the stats but, before the Leeds game, he was averaging 25 passes per match. That means, as a player playing in the engine room or slightly more advanced in the crucial central part of the pitch, he's only passing the ball every 3 and a bit minutes. Rodriguez was nearly double that at 48 passes per match.

And that really is the crux of the problem. He is a passenger most of the time. His stats are rubbish considering he takes most of our set-pieces. He took a corner against Leeds and scored a tap in, and somehow he was back to his best according to some. If you look at what he did in the rest of the game, he did nothing except run around a lot and point. He's probably the best player in Europe at doing that.

Unfortunately, I see a player going through the motions. Most of his passes are sideways or backwards. He treats the ball like a hot potato – watch how he gets it and fires it back to whoever passes it to him.

He's simply not good enough. If he left Everton, where would he go? I predict a small Spanish club or something like that, maybe MLS. No club in the top half of the Premier League would touch him.

Lester Yip
16 Posted 20/02/2021 at 08:31:04
He doesn't have pace. But I can see he run a lot closing down passing lane and help pressuring the ball. He might not be the one who actually win the ball but definitely reduce opponents passing options.

I got frustrated by him especially in in set-pieces environment that when his delivery is not great. I expect at lot of him in that department. Same as Digne. If he can't cross the ball well, I got mad.

Also, all the managers still pick him for some reason after Koeman. They must have seen him doing something right in training.

Michael Ward
17 Posted 20/02/2021 at 08:52:45
It's been said above, but he is a decent option as a 10 - when he is closer to the goal he actually makes some attempt to move the ball into the box or shoot. Anywhere else he is complete and utter liability, he shows no bravery with the ball, passes it back immediately as soon as he gets it, doesn't have the legs to get about the pitch and disrupt the opposition and on top of that clearly doesn't want to be playing in that position so his head drops too. I think Carlo has done a fantastic job so far and I don't want to criticise him but I don't understand how he doesn't see this. Tom Davies has shown himself to be a much better option in the central midfield positions in the last few weeks and Andre Gomes while sharing a lot of the same flaws as Sigurdsson is also a much better option in the centre of the pitch. The main difference between these two players and Gylfi? When played in the middle of the park they actually pass the ball FORWARDS!
Mike Kehoe
18 Posted 20/02/2021 at 10:44:23
He is a good player when occupied in the one role he can play, it is not his fault he cost so much or that he has been used out of position so often and been exposed so much. He is ponderously slow, couldn’t tackle a paper bag, his passing is mostly sideways or backwards, he often looks uncommitted and seems to accept defeat with a studiously casual good grace. He is on huge wages and we will be incredibly fortunate to offload him and see any money in return.
Other than that he is just super!
Ralph Basnett
19 Posted 20/02/2021 at 10:59:36
coming up to the Derby and you come out with this drivel!!!!

You have either had a bang on the head or a red in disguise.

Stats look good until you maybe show us the stats on tackles he made/didnt make that cost us a goal, fouls he gave that cost us, finger pointing to nothing.

Siggi is poo, deal with it.

Robert Tressell
20 Posted 20/02/2021 at 12:26:06
Read more than half the article, Ralph...
Denis Hignett
21 Posted 20/02/2021 at 14:49:05
The sooner he leaves the club, the better. The majority of his passes are sideways or back to the original player. Can't tackle, can't head a ball.

Brian Murray
22 Posted 20/02/2021 at 15:07:36
He is synonymous with the modern Everton, Far too passive and nice and hates any sort of confrontation same as his sidekick Gomes
Joe McMahon
23 Posted 20/02/2021 at 15:15:06
When Spurs sold him, I'm still wondering why Real Madrid or Man City didn't make a move, Swansea beat em off.
Jay Wood

24 Posted 20/02/2021 at 15:27:58
Danny @ 15.

'He took a corner against Leeds and scored a tap in.'

That was no tap in. Look at his starting position (on the half way line) as that moved developed, the ground he made up and his movement and anticipation to totally blindside the Leeds defence to be in position to...score a 'tap in.'

I await your revision of his contribution in the cup win over Spurs, Danny.

Nicely constructed article, Robert. I appreciate what you attempted to present. Thanks.

Martin Mason
25 Posted 21/02/2021 at 13:26:10
Absolutely correct, when he is played in the advanced pressing role he is exceptional, in all other midfield roles he's poor. I've said myself that we should keep him as in his good position he's as good as anything we can remotely afford to replace him with. He played well when he came on yesterday.
David Nicholls
26 Posted 21/02/2021 at 13:41:14
Good article, Gylfi is a really useful player when playing as a ‘10’. I sometimes think some of our fan base were expecting something different when we signed him. I think creative midfielders fall into 2 categories. Game changers and game runners. Gylfi is never going to run a game but he has it in his locker to produce game changing moments. His goal at the King Power a couple of years ago is one of the best Everton goals I’ve ever seen
Steve Brown
27 Posted 21/02/2021 at 13:56:19
He must be a fantastic trainer, as he always makes the team or bench. On the pitch, he is about as useful as a hologram:

He is slower than my nan.
He glides into spaces he knows he won't receive the ball.
He tackles like a 5 year old.
His marking at set pieces is atrocious.
He never tracks midfield runners.
His set pieces and corners are so ineffectual he has been removed from duties.
He should leave in the summer.

Dale Self
28 Posted 21/02/2021 at 14:04:52
He is ok with me Steve. By the way, it isn’t really a good time to go after him, we won the big one with his help.
Martin Mason
29 Posted 21/02/2021 at 16:21:27
Whatever, he was an awful buy?
David Pearl
30 Posted 21/02/2021 at 16:45:38
Sad state of affairs when articles are written by so called blues to subtly twist the knife into one of our most passionate players.

Regardless of the position he is asked to play he gives his all. And guess what... when played as a number 10 his production numbers increase.

Fucking imagine that.

Given our change of shape and how well it worked vs the shite maybe Brands/Carlo will take stock of the performance and decide we could do with more assists from the right back area.

The shape we played opened my eyes and l can see us adopting it more often so that Siggy or James can perhaps occupy the space behind, hopefully, our front 2. Or front 1 when we play away.

Tw never fails. Was there a article l missed the week before called Davies For England??

Steve Brown
31 Posted 21/02/2021 at 16:46:18
Dale, the warm glow of victory doesn't result in amnesia. He at least manages to get a sweat on this season, which is in stark contrast to 2018-19 and 2019-20 when professionally he was a lousy role model to the younger players.
Trevor Peers
32 Posted 21/02/2021 at 17:13:28
Siggy's biggest crime on here is replacing the odious Barkley, he may of cost too much but at least he never robbed the club of £30 million quid.

The only thing Sigurdsson lacks is blistering pace, because he has talent, works hard and does manage to assist in making and scoring a few goals per season.
Plus he also scores in Derby games more than the imposter Barkley ever managed.

Jay Wood

33 Posted 21/02/2021 at 17:44:18
Ross Barkley? Odious and an imposter?

I rather think Ronald Koeman merits those monikers for helping to drive Ross out of the club.

I doubt we will ever see such poor handling of a player asset as happened under Koeman and Walsh under Ancelotti and Brands.

Thomas Richards
34 Posted 21/02/2021 at 17:49:53

Dont know the lad so can't say if he is or isn't odious.
He certainly conducted himself in an odious manner in the period before he left Everton.
Agree on the Koeman take

Jay Wood

35 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:07:10
Then I am more tolerant than you and Trevor before calling someone 'odious', Thomas.

Other than Oumar Niasse no other player was more publicly abused than Ross Barkley under Koeman, for no good reason at all. Plenty on here were constantly critical of how that situation was handled, overwhelmingly sympathetic towards Ross.

Koeman alone is not to blame. Why did none of the high-ups at the club stop to think, as Barkley's contract was running down, that the constant criticism of Ross was not conducive to improving his form or the likelihood of him signing a contract extension? Why did no one step in to mediate things to ensure a more favourable outcome?

That Ross got injured shortly before his intended transfer to Chelsea on the eve of a new season - the final year of his contract - and so we possibly lost £10-15 million on the deal when he did leave in January served to highlight just how badly the club handled it.

I can think of a number of players down the years who possibly merit being described as imposters and odious. Some in very recent history. Ross Barkley is not one of them.

Thomas Richards
36 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:10:25
I didnt call him odious.
Jay Wood

37 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:25:52
'I didnt call him odious.'

Of course you didn't Thomas. How silly of me to misrepresent your words @ 34.

'He certainly conducted himself in an odious manner in the period before he left Everton.'

Thomas Richards
38 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:28:24

You regularly conduct yourself in a pompous, condescending manner.

I have no idea if you are a pompous, condescending person.
I don't know you.

See how it works?

Graham Mockford
39 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:35:14
Siggy has been a good player for us. As I’ve said for a long time and many on here also say he’s been played out of position by too many managers. Carlo knows where he operates best.

Play him a front three and he will always give you options. His biggest weakness is he lacks pace but he works tirelessly, he nearly always tops the yards covered measure. He’s 31 but given his fitness levels he’s still got four years in him as a squad player.

The haters on here won’t change their opinion but as ever their opinion counts for jack.

Robert Tressell
40 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:38:49
Play nicely guys, we won the Derby. Anyway, I only did the article for a bit of fun because Gylfi gets a lot of stick (sometimes well warranted) but we do tend to undervalue his contribution.

The Rabiot rumours have started up again this weekend which is interesting. Juve might well sell because they're in danger of missing out on Champions league and are very well stocked in midfield.

Maybe a more compact midfield 3 next season with no number 10 at all. As the article suggests we'd be hard pressed to find a player of his quality with pace and aggression to go with it.

Joe McMahon
41 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:42:36
Robert as someone else stated today, we need goals. It's the endless issue of our goal difference.
Graham Hammond
42 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:45:57
Now is not the time to stick the boot into Gylfi, let's just enjoy the weekend and what it has finally given us! I would be very interested in reading the Win/Draw/Loss Statistics though on Sigurdsson when starting games for Everton, hopefully, someone with statistical skills and this knowledge could help me out.
Jay Wood

43 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:53:32
Marvellous, Thomas.

You don't need to know a person to offer a subjective view on their conduct, rather than an objective one, so it doesn't count as being derogatory about them.

Yes, I see how that works for you. Most convenient.

Thomas Richards
44 Posted 21/02/2021 at 18:58:23
Where was I derogatory Jay?
Jay Wood

45 Posted 21/02/2021 at 19:01:50
Jog on, Thomas.

I'm not prepared to indulge you.

Thomas Richards
46 Posted 21/02/2021 at 19:05:33

Hardly, you have no answer to a legitimate, polite question?
Your perogative.

Thank you

Mike Gaynes
47 Posted 21/02/2021 at 19:34:49
Robert, I wasn't going to comment on this one because it's all been said before ad nauseum, and always by the same people in pretty much the same words. My condolences on not being able to trigger a storm with this one -- I think you'd have done better as a provocateur if it hadn't been Derby weekend. Good effort, though.

I'd love for us to go for a couple of attacking midfielders this summer who would render Gylfi superfluous, but to me the biggest need is for pace. We are still desperately slow in the center of the park. I think when we have midfielders who can blow past opponents and make defenders back up, the goals will come, especially if we add an attacking right back who can cross the ball.

I haven't seen any of the four youngsters you named, but I'd be very interested in your opinion of some who have caught my eye at times this season -- Bellingham and Reyna of Dortmund, Wirtz of Leverkusen (I don't think we could get his teammate Diaby), Gravenbach of Ajax, Cunha of Herta, Gil of Eibar and the two kids at Shakhtar, Tete and Solomon.

And by the way, to me Michael Keane is our player of the year at this point, and nobody else is a close second.

Joe McMahon
48 Posted 21/02/2021 at 19:39:53
Mr Gaynes @47, I agree fully with your post. And yes Micheal Keane was superb yesteday as he has been all season. If he's fit he has to play.
Graham Hammond
49 Posted 21/02/2021 at 19:57:43
Graham #39. I would wholeheartedly agree with you that successive Everton managers have played Gylfi out of position, I have no idea why this is, Sigurdsson for me is a Number 10 and a Number 10 only! His qualities are well suited to this position. Carlo may very well know where his best position is, but like others, he has still played him in positions where he is not best suited and on many occasions too, and he has played very poorly indeed and so has the team, I do not see this as Gylfi's fault though.
I do think the metres run in a game bit is twaddle though. Just to put things into some context, I am a badly overweight 53-year-old excuse for an athlete and a very poor excuse for a runner, even I can plod 16-17 Kilometres in 90 minutes despite carrying multiple injuries so all this talk of he ran 12-13 thousand metres is neither here nor there in my opinion. What is needed to be a Premier League Midfield Player obviously goes well beyond the ability to be able to run! My issue with Glyfi when playing deep is that he hides, Tom Davies is much better in this regard, showing for the ball much more consistently which this position requires. I applaud and appreciate Sigurdsson's improvement of late but please Carlo, only play this guy where he is suited to play.
Tony Abrahams
50 Posted 21/02/2021 at 19:57:55
Keane is much improved and had a very good game yesterday, but I’m still not totally convinced by Michael, and I’m not convinced that nobody is close to him, when talking about player of the season Mike G, because Dominic Calvert Lewin, operating mostly upfront by himself, has already won that award for me!
Thomas Richards
51 Posted 21/02/2021 at 20:07:05
Good edge of the box defender.
My motm yesterday.
If we want to take the next step of squeezing the play and pushing 15-20 yards up the pitch?

Carlo may stay with a deep defence next season in saying that though.

Robert Tressell
52 Posted 21/02/2021 at 20:33:07
Mike, unfortunately Bellingham, Gravenberch, Reyna and Wirtz are out of our league just at the moment, with their next move being to a Champions league giant. Cunha is more of a striker, Gil is Seville bound and the two at Shakhtar are more wide players, esp Tete.

I think we could play a compact trio of Allan, Doucoure and, say, Rabiot - because this would allow Richarlison to stay much higher up the pitch.

This addresses the lack of goals (I did a thrilling article about this last year with even more stats but less of a clickbait title so no-one read it).

Richarlison is capable of 20 goals in a good team, DCL 25 goals and then we need another wide forward on the right (ideally left footed) to get us 10 to 15 goals.

The players who tend to get a mention are Bailey and Neres (Malcom's career has fizzled out). There's also Gonzalez of Stuttgart who looks like he could really have some quality and end product. Tete looks good but to be a star in the Prem he'd need to getting a much bigger goal haul in the Ukraine than he is currently (but there's time).

One of these plus a Goncalves or Olise (or someone) would make us very strong indeed.

Graham Mockford
53 Posted 21/02/2021 at 20:52:46

I agree Calvert-Lewin is undoubtedly the Player of the Season. A young player who has come of age and who any side in this league would take.

I've less reservations than you about Keane. He lacks pace without doubt, which is pretty troubling for a centre-half but he's growing into a player. He's brave, good in the air, has that invaluable knack of anticipation. He reminds me a bit of John Terry – not the most technical footballer but a bit of a warrior.

On another note, I watched John Stones today, what a player he has turned out to be. A complete centre-half.

Ernie Baywood
54 Posted 21/02/2021 at 21:16:15
If he cost £15 million I think he'd be treated much differently. There are a lot of things that he isn't, but I think we've all known that for a long time.

He's a decent attacking midfielder. Capable of a goal or assist. And the reason he gets picked is that, in addition to those abilities, he also puts in a shift. That's who he is and we made the choice to buy that player.

When played on the wing or up front, he's too slow. When played in a defensive midfield role, he's not physical enough. Never heard him complain about being put in those positions though.

In my opinion, he's actually been a decent servant.

Mike Gaynes
56 Posted 21/02/2021 at 22:29:40
Tony #50, yes, and Calvert-Lewin will undoubtedly win the award unanimously, and he's the better player, but I would argue that Keane has been more important.

Thanks for the feedback, Robert #52. You're the most informed player scout we have on TW, but I gotta say my estimation drops a bit whenever you mention Rabiot.

I watch every Juve game -- especially now with McKinney there -- and I couldn't be less interested in Rabiot to Everton. He's extravagantly talented, brutally expensive and totally nonproductive -- 29 games this season and one meaningless goal. One. And he creates nothing for others. In important games the guy is harder to find than Amelia Earhart. I know Carlo likes him, but I hope we don't go after him as rumored.

Bailey won't even glance at us for the same reason as Reyna. But Neres is a great shout and so, from my one viewing of him, is Gonzalez... pace on the flank. Want it. Want it.

Jay Wood

57 Posted 21/02/2021 at 23:25:19
Thomas @ 46. It's very simple.

It would be an exercise in futility to offer any response when you continue to ignore and deny the evidence of your own words which more than answer your own vacuous question @ 44.

You're welcome.

Don Alexander
58 Posted 21/02/2021 at 00:08:00
With bated breath in case I too get detention from our "nut" who thinks he must always be obeyed, I'd say that Gylfi is more than a squad player, in fact he's much more IMHO.

His passing skills are sublime on the rare occasions our attack plays with belief and effort. The recent win against Spurs showed this time and again. In a listless team though, which we are far too often, his skill-set becomes irrelevant as he's reduced to having to try to mimic Lee Carsley by his own team's woeful inertia, and that's never been his strength. I think this is what Seamus was going on about post-match re the new dressing room psyche. All "believe" and make the runs, and Gylfi will deliver (Gomes is similar but with more nark).

And as for re-signing Barkley, come on! I'd still take Carsley before him, even now! Once again today he was hooked for a poor performance in a team that'd just lost its most creative player in midfield. Did Barkley step up? No chance. Even the MotD2 highlights exemplified his absent commitment to his team's cause, all over the pitch. Sadly, I just don't think he truly understands the game, despite a very, very occasional glorious moment admittedly.

And lastly, Tom Davies resembled Reidy at Anfield as far as I'm concerned. Take a bow, young man!

Jim Harrison
59 Posted 22/02/2021 at 01:54:18
Barkley? Please. He is the same player he has always been. Capable of the sublime for a couple of matches, then invisible for the next 5. He had 2 good seasons. One under Bobby, one under Koeman. Whilst in general, Koeman is a bit of a tit, he pretty much summed Ross up. Can anyone really dispute what he said given his development should once leaving Everton?

Sigurdsson? Problem with him is he needs a side to be set up to his strengths and, even then, he is just good, not brilliant, more often than not. James is similar in that respect, he needs players around him that allow him to do his thing, but is obviously a class above. Having both in the squad is good. Having both on the pitch at the same time isn't!!!

Cost too much. Too often used out of position. If Micheal Keane was put as a Number 10 each week, he would be vilified because he would in all likelihood be crap in that position.

Thomas Richards
60 Posted 22/02/2021 at 06:39:50
Jay, 57.

Vacuous? As I said, pompous and condescending.

Jay Wood

61 Posted 22/02/2021 at 11:49:34
Thomas. Again, its very simple.

The chronology of our respective contributions to this thread (on the subject of Gylfi Sigurdsson and potential replacements) is the following:

@ 24 I call attention to just what Siggy did to score what another poster dismissed as a 'tap in' for his goal away to Leeds and praised Robert the author of the article for his analysis.

@ 33 I questioned a poster for describing Ross Barkley as 'odious and an imposter', expressing a belief that I doubt he would have been so mishandled by Ancelotti and Brands as he was under Koeman and Walsh.

@ 34 YOU addressed ME and also describred Ross' conduct as odious, without describing or establishing what you found odious in his conduct.

@ 35 I described the circumstances of Ross' final 2 years at Everton and how several parties at the club were negligent in alienating the player as his contract was winding down. This resulted in having a wasting and justifiably disgruntled asset on our books, rather than tying him down to a contract and ensuring top dollar for him if and when we sold him, or retaining him to our benefit.

I concluded that post by saying 'I can think of a number of players down the years who possibly merit being described as imposters and odious. Some in very recent history. Ross Barkley is not one of them.'

@ 36 you addressed me again in a single sentence claiming you did not call Ross 'odious'.

@ 37 I quoted your earlier post verbatim in which you most certainly did consider Ross' conduct 'odious'.

@ 38 you launch a gratuitously abusive ad hominem attack on another poster rather than honestly acknowledge you had indeed described Ross as 'odious'.

@ 43 I flag up the obvious duplicity in your previous post, being derogatory to another poster without just cause.

@ 44 you ask where were you derogatory.

@ 45 I tell you I'm not prepared to indulge you.

@ 46 you attempt to position yourself as the virtuous victim, claiming you had asked a polite question to which I had no answer.

@ 54 I give you a very explicit answer as to just why it would be an exercise in futility to respond to your vacuous question when you continued to deny the evidence of your own words as already pointed out.

Now, @ 60, you explicitly repeat the derogatory remarks @ 38 when you had previously refused to acknowledge making such.

I am more than comfortable with my contribution to the actual subject matter of this thread, and how I have responded to the conceit, deceit, hypocrisy and shallowness of your own posts Thomas, content-free as they are on anything actually related to football.

Thomas Richards
62 Posted 22/02/2021 at 11:53:04
Jay Wood

63 Posted 22/02/2021 at 11:55:47
Pardoned. Apology accepted.
Thomas Richards
64 Posted 22/02/2021 at 12:11:34
No apology offered.

Surely a man of your standing understands the meaning of a question mark??

I await another wasted two hours of your life composing another War and Peace length post.
Oxford Concise to hand of course.


Oliver Molloy
65 Posted 22/02/2021 at 12:22:48
Football eh !!
Gerard McKean
66 Posted 22/02/2021 at 12:39:35
Thomas, I think a tactical retreat is now called for: Jay’s response #63 is what’s known as a non sequitur, and a very funny one at that. As Robert says, don’t forget we’ve just one a derby, and I would add don’t lose our sense of humour.

Mike G points out that this topic has run its course but Jay’s analysis of the Barkley departure hits the nail on the head. Ross is not “odious” and has never deserved the contempt heaped upon him by many Evertonians, of whom he is still one, who cannot accept that the club screwed up both in mishandling his contract and by essentially entering into a bidding war against itself to pay way over the odds for Gyllfi.

Thomas Richards
67 Posted 22/02/2021 at 12:56:49
"is what’s known as a non sequitur,"

You do know the definition of that term?

Kevin Prytherch
68 Posted 22/02/2021 at 13:10:01
Sigurdsson is a number 10, but only against teams that offer space between the lines of defence and midfield, and only with runners around him. With a bit of time, space and runners he can play nice passes into space, he can defend from the front and his pressing game alongside DCL is good.

He couldn’t, for example, have played the ball that James did for Doucoure. He would have needed another touch to control the ball and the opportunity would have been lost. He is dire in central midfield and is also dire against teams that defend deep and deny him space between the lines and prevent him passing into space.

He should be a part time player (difficult with £45m), used against teams who play more expansive and done park the bus, and also used as an impact sub when we are winning to put teams to bed. He should not be used at home to the likes of Fulham WBA and Newcastle.

Jay Wood

69 Posted 22/02/2021 at 14:28:57
Kevin @ 68:

'Gylfi couldn’t, for example, have played the ball that James did for Doucoure [Richy?].'

Sure about that Kevin? Just 10 days and 3 games ago watch what Siggy did for our 1st, 3rd, 4th and 5th goals.

Everton 5 Spurs 4

Kevin Prytherch
70 Posted 22/02/2021 at 14:41:47
Jay 69 (I did mean Richy, typo there)

Goals 3, 4 and 5 - Sigurdsson had the ball under control and played good balls into space for runners that stretch defences. He’s very good at that, but needs that touch or two to get the ball under control, look up and play into space. That’s one of the reasons he shines against these types of teams and kind of proves my point. There is space in front of the defence and runners trying to stretch the defence.

Goal 1 is what he generally struggles with, that instinctive ball. He did it on this occasion, but doesn’t usually.

I don’t think he could have controlled the ball the way James did with one touch and have the presence of mind and patience to play that pass with his next touch.

He is a very good player, but only in certain conditions.

Mike Gaynes
71 Posted 22/02/2021 at 14:44:38
Kev and Gerard, I gotta ask... why is what we paid for him still relevant? It was 2017 under a different management.

Why should his price tag back then have any impact on how he is used today?

Same thing with the Barkley debate. Old news, endlessly rehashed for no apparent reason. I just don't get it.

Tony Abrahams
72 Posted 22/02/2021 at 14:51:47
I don’t mind Sigurdson, but never in my life have I seen a player attempt the type of pass, that Rodriguez, put through for Richarlison, but it gets cut out by a defender, as much as Glyfi.

It frustrates me that much, I’ve even stopped thinking hard lines. So many nearly great balls, probably stop him from being a top player, although this doesn’t mean he’s not a good player though!

Kevin Prytherch
73 Posted 22/02/2021 at 14:52:37
Mike - I wasn’t trying to use it against him, but from a management and ownership point of view, it’s difficult to justify our record signing being a bit-part player - which personally I think he should be.

Allardyce (as much as I loathe him) was at least honest about Lookman vs Bolasie when he said that he couldn’t justify playing Lookman ahead of someone that cost £27m.

Duncan McDine
74 Posted 22/02/2021 at 15:01:39
Mike 71, I remember you asked me the same question over a year ago. The price paid for a player is relevant to most of us. If it is not relevant to you, then you’re in the minority but let’s face it, there is no right or wrong. In assessing a player we just need to see his contribution on the field (money doesn’t enter into it), but to assess his ‘value for money’ we must take into account his transfer fee, sell on value and wages together with his on-field contribution. For me, value for money was key when Everton didn’t have much money, but is still very relevant since FFP was introduced.
Chris Williams
75 Posted 22/02/2021 at 15:07:04
His ‘book value’ about 4 years into a 5 year contract is probably currently about £12m. If we sell him for more than that, we make a profit!
John McFarlane Snr
76 Posted 22/02/2021 at 15:09:11
Hi Mike [71] I'm on your side, the price tag on any player is the value someone has placed on him, it doesn't immediately make him a better player. Kevin [73] It's not good management to select a team based on a players market price, at the expense of a more talented individual. I may be missing something here. but that's how I see things.
Robert Tressell
77 Posted 22/02/2021 at 15:27:20
The focus of the article is really to show that even some much lauded players have less end product than Gyfli - esp for a straight swap as the attacking midfielder in a 4231. And therefore it's difficult to replace him like for like with someone more productive (unless you spend a fortune).

Barkley, whatever people think of him, doesn't have better goals and assists than Gylfi (although may have other qualities). Very few do.

So the answer may be to play without a central attacking midfielder and maybe even without Rodriguez. Additional pace and power at the expense of artistry, perhaps. However, it would show our progress as a club to have the luxury of bringing Sigurdsson and Rodriguez into the fold from the bench.

PS, Jay & Thomas, I'm eternally grateful for the argument that helped me beat my personal best of about 15 comments on an article 👍

Thomas Richards
78 Posted 22/02/2021 at 15:46:37
It wasnt really an argument Robert.
A difference of opinion can easily offend at times.
Not on my part I should add.
Mike Gaynes
79 Posted 22/02/2021 at 15:59:19
Kev #73, if we'd just bought him, yes... but to the guy making the decisions now (Carlo), he's a 31-year-old who was bought three managers ago, and his original price tag means no more than the color of his shoes.

Anyway, the "bit part" looms. Assuming he's still with us next season, Gylfi will be a reserve behind Allan, James, Doucoure and whatever speedy attacking midfielder Carlo and Marcel buy for us this summer. And if they acquire two (which I hope), Siggy may well be off to Palace or Vitesse or wherever for the price Chris suggests.

And whenever he goes, I will remember him not for his price tag but for a transcendent month of February 2021 -- the masterpiece performance in the best FA Cup tie I've ever seen, and rolling in that classy penalty to clinch at Anfield. In my book those two memories from the past two weeks are worth damn near 45 million all by themselves.

Geoff Williams
80 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:06:06
He's not a goalscoring midfielder, take away his penalties then how many goals has he managed?
Martin Mason
81 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:10:48
Thomas@34, be fair, but remember, that is only your opinion and there's not a shred of evidence to support that Barkley did anything wrong during that period apart perhaps from making Everton pay for f*cking him about.
Kevin Prytherch
82 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:11:10
John 76 - I wasn’t saying it was good management to select a player based on value (I wish they wouldn’t) I was just saying that it does have influence on managers and owners. Hence why so many senior pros often get picked ahead of academy players - because we’ve paid good money for them and they’re on decent wages.
Martin Mason
83 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:15:26
Regarding Gilfi, I have to be fair and say that he has actually been very good under Carlo. He isn't Lionel Messi but he is actually very good in that up front midfield role. He can't be what he isn't and we get another season from him yet, he could prove an amazing buy in a good Everton side that had the luxury to play him where he needs to be played.
Chris Williams
84 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:33:32
Spot on Mike G!
Alan J Thompson
85 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:33:36
I worry about all these players being seen to be used out of position and some even say it about the goalkeeper, we won't mention the assessment of his passing which is considered so poor that two team mates stand within 10 metres of him at goal kicks.
At least this manager doesn't publicly tell players to move on if they want to reach their potential.
Thomas Richards
86 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:48:03
Martin 81,

I always try to be fair.

The word odious was used in relation to Ross Barkley.

I posted.
" I don't know if he is an odious person, I don't know him. He did conduct himself in an odious manner before he left"

I'm not talking about football.
I'm talking about the manner he conducted himself out and about.
A fuckin disgrace with his approach to the ladies,them standing with thier partners made no difference to him.
I wouldn't repeat his opening lines to them, people I know have been on the receiving end of it.

The "gangster" (as people like to say) who was videod sparking him is actually a nice young man who works on the railway maintenance.
He was with his girlfriend when Ross tried to give him and her the wise words.

Not interested in how much money he skinned the club for. Most of modern day players are greedy and out of touch.

Barry Jones
87 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:52:46
This article should have been submitted on April 1st
John McFarlane Snr
88 Posted 22/02/2021 at 16:53:13
hi Kevin [82] it's frowned on when I reveal my age, so I'll just say that I'm an octogenarian and what little I had up top is gradually deteriorating, but it appears to me that in your assessment, the owners are dictating team selection by putting pressure on manager's. [to put it mildly]. "Play the man we paid big money for, we need to get our money's worth". In the example you quoted, I wouldn't blame Lookman for seeking a transfer to another club.
Dale Self
89 Posted 22/02/2021 at 17:06:35
The price tag criticism is not fair to the player for he did not negotiate or agree the fee. It is also time to realize that Sigurdsson is part of an overall configuration that Carlo is cobbling together. He has filled in where we needed without complaint from what I know and yes when played out of position you can look a fool until the squad settles into a tactical setup. He will be crucial for being able to switch tactics midgame and will be even more of a threat going forward as our midfield defense gets sorted out. He is not a midfielder but he will play wherever Carlo instructs him and more frequently is becoming a game influence in the final third.

And seriously man, don't think he hasn't caught some of the invective here from Icelandic friends who check it out. Has he ever started whining like some of the lesser professionals who've worn our kit? He does his job and puts in a shift to the obvious satisfaction of the coach. I could go on.

Martin Mason
90 Posted 22/02/2021 at 17:18:02
Thomas@86 Not a shred of evidence.
Darren Hind
91 Posted 22/02/2021 at 17:31:40
John G surfacing ?

The club had plenty of time to settle the Barkley issue.

I seem to remember a lot of people on here claiming Koeman was doing the right thing by saying negotiations can wait (Making Barkley earn a contract) I even remember some calling Barkley thick.

Fact is Barkley didnt need to do anything. Rightly or wrongly He just needed to sit tight as instructed by his agent.
I'm not saying Barkley was right or wrong. It was ultimately his decision to choose Chelsea, but in this particular stand off. there was only ever going to be one side which would run out of runway

Thomas Richards
92 Posted 22/02/2021 at 17:43:17
Maybe not for you Martin.

Common knowledge in Liverpool.
Old saying that liverpool is like a village.
Many, many people who socialise in town will tell you the situation with Barkley.

Any ideas on why a mild mannered working young man would feel the need to knock Barkley unconscious?
Or why Barkley has been in trouble in clubs on a few occasions?

Of no interest to me if you want to believe it or don't believe it.
I know its factual.

A bully who turned out to be something else when push came to shove.

Lack of respect for women is prevalent in society.
A sad indictment.

Darren Hind
93 Posted 22/02/2021 at 18:13:21
Total nonsense of course.

Liverpool may have its fair share of gossips and tittle tattle peddlers, but it certainly isn't a village.

The Video evidence is clear. The "mild mannered working young man" stole it on Barkley. A cowardly attack when under no threat himself. It's still there for anybody to see.

Millions of people visit this is a cosmopolitan City every day. It makes laugh that people act all ITK about every bit single incident because they have heard it "swear down lid"from somebody equally clueless in the baggy

Tony Abrahams
94 Posted 22/02/2021 at 18:17:25
Why do you think the police spoke to Barkley and he didn’t want it to go any further Martin? He came unstuck, people carrying on with that type of behaviour, always come unstuck, and there is also another reason it never went any further, because Barkley would have probably also been prosecuted, for something that was caught on camera a little bit later on in the same evening.

Liverpool is a village, and the village idiot got sparked, for having no respect and thinking he could carry on like Don Oune, unfortunately.

Gerard McKean
95 Posted 22/02/2021 at 18:35:25
Mr Gaynes # 71, for the record I like Sigurdsson although he’s only ever reached the heights of which he’s capable very sporadically for Everton. What we paid is indeed now irrelevant but HOW we came to pay so much for a player that no other club was trying to sign is relevant because the person who made the deal is still at the club: Mr Kenwright. We remain a soft touch commercially. I wish I could think of a non sequitur to finish!
Thomas Richards
96 Posted 22/02/2021 at 18:44:12
You back looking for an argument soft lad?
Chris Williams
97 Posted 22/02/2021 at 18:48:55

From memory, a big part of the problem in that transaction were the new American owners of Swansea, who dragged the deal out to a ridiculous degree, resulting in no pre season for Gylfi, insufficient time for them to get players in, and I reckon it was a major reason why they ended up relegated.

Could be I’m wrong of course.

I’m no fan of Kenwright believe me, but in this instance I reckon it was a situation not entirely of his making. Of course Koeman was also putting on the pressure quite publicly. Sign him and we get into Europe!

Gylfi is a good professional, but we overpaid without doubt.

Mike Gaynes
98 Posted 22/02/2021 at 18:56:25
Gerard #95, "We remain a soft touch commercially." You really think so? Personally I think we have become much smarter shoppers. £20m apiece for Doucoure, Allan and Godfrey? James and King and Nkounkou and Branthwaite for essentially nothing? Olsen on loan? That's good business.

I think the soft-touch days are pretty much behind us.

Jay Harris
99 Posted 22/02/2021 at 19:12:25
My take on Siggy is that he IS a very clever footballer who can score goals and create chances. Like all quality players he can execute dead ball kicks quite well.

The problem for me is he is now getting older and slower and while NOONE should question his workrate his response time to situations is poor.

I don't care what he cost but right now I just see him as a valuable squad member but not first choice in an ambitious club.

Dale Self
100 Posted 22/02/2021 at 19:20:01
Chris, I think Huw Jenkins was still at Swansea at the time which would also give a reason for why the transfer was not to our favor. He was a rather clever chairman for the Swans.
And Jay, at 31 I don't think he is expecting any different but given our finances he will be indispensable if we are to build a squad for Europe.
Chris Williams
101 Posted 22/02/2021 at 19:28:48

He was, with the new owners. End of that season?

Get these greedy bastards out of our club!

This, or something similar were the headlines. Didn’t work out well for them, but they got a nice fee for sure.

And Huw probably got a nice little wedge. And we got Gylfi, a good squad player from now on, if he stays.

Dale Self
102 Posted 22/02/2021 at 19:35:32
Hey Chris, it could have been that Huw was tying things up with the gringos and getting a little icing on the way out as he was still running ops. He was shrewd in negotiations. And just for the sake of intellectual honesty yes we overpaid but damnit he is a decent footballer and I wish people would get off his ass. Not likely now that Tom's form has improved.
Chris Williams
103 Posted 22/02/2021 at 20:05:54
Amen to that Dale
Thomas Richards
104 Posted 22/02/2021 at 21:20:17
That post at 96 wasnt for you Gerard.

Apologies if it looked like it was.

Martin Mason
105 Posted 22/02/2021 at 21:44:24
Tony, sorry but that's just a load of old gossip.
Tony Abrahams
106 Posted 22/02/2021 at 21:54:44
I used to get told gossip everyday Martin, but nothing much has been happening since lockdown!

It’s all in the past, but every bit of it is true mate, even though it’s got nothing to do with any of us really Martin, and certainly nothing to do with me, which is why I shouldn’t have posted in the first place

Martin Mason
107 Posted 22/02/2021 at 22:17:43
Tony, you shouldn't post anything that you you can't reasonably back up as fact. You incorrectly classed a perfectly innocent young man of being odious on the basis of old wives' gossip. That is odious.
Brent Stephens
108 Posted 22/02/2021 at 22:22:42
Martin, for what it's worth, you clearly have no knowledge on this; Tony is saying in effect that he has a source he trusts. I trust Tony.
Tony Abrahams
109 Posted 22/02/2021 at 22:33:21
Martin I can always back up what I say as fact mate, and I never once used the word odious to describe Ross Barkley.

A fella who tries to kop for someone else’s bird is a wrongun imo, and I was actually surprised when one of my old mates who was doing a job at my house told me the whole story, which concerned his niece.

Not an old wives tale, but from a normal genuine scouse fella from Vauxhall rd, who also told me it never went further because Barkley and another young Everton player, were caught on camera trying to attack the kid who was well within his rights to give Barkley a smack, later on in the evening even if the lad did steal it on him in the first place!

Danny O’Neill
110 Posted 22/02/2021 at 23:11:35
Brave article Robert, apologies that I missed this one over the weekend, so excuse my own war and peace here as I'd like to respond to a number of observations.

I spent most of the last few seasons defending Sigurdsson to the hilt. I lost a bit of faith in him last season and was being swayed by peer group pressure, but then I suppose that was symptomatic of what we were watching as a whole. A talented player who does work hard even if not obvious to everyone. Prior to this season I thought he was a player we should have on the pitch as he could just produce that one moment of brilliance that could win or change a game. It wasn't happening as often, but let's face it, who else did we have?

Ironically, now we have a stronger midfield (signings + Davies coming into his own), he has improved and yes, playing him in that number 10 role contributes to that improvement as well as having better quality and competition for places. No rocket science there.

Didn't we already have the the Leeds tap in and took a corner discussion? That was only a "simple" tap in because of the run, the anticipation and the positioning. Sigurdsson made it a simple tap in by his work rate off the ball, but it was far from simple in the broader sense of the phase of play. Similarly, someone called out Richarlison's goal against City and being jammy. Personally, I give credit to the forward for being in the right place and position to take advantage of the rebound off the post. And if Sigurdsson can take a corner like that more often, I'll be more than happy. Great delivery. As for the 4 assists out of the 5 goals against Tottenham; amazing what even an above average player can do when there is actually intelligent movement and running ahead of them.

Graham, I have to agree, but also disagree with you on Michael Keane. He is brave, he is much improved, but his anticipation and reading of the game are a worse flaw than his pace. You can overcome lack of pace with speed of thought and a footballing brain. I fear that once we need to go with a higher line, we will see those "oh f@*k" moments as he watches a ball go over his head and then tries in vein to recover. He is doing fantastic right now, but I suspect that is down to the manager playing a deeper defensive system that suits the players he has, Keane included. Maybe we stick with that for a while; Carlo's shout.

Kevin; very few players could make the pass James made for Richarlison's Kop end goal (yesss!) IMO. Talking of speed of mind, he controls a headed pass out of the air and his mind is made up before the ball hits the ground; the pass is taken on a cushioned half volley. Stunning; but again, the movement in front helps him make his mind up early.

Tony, I owe you an apology from Michael's thread. I got my Abrahams mixed up and called you Dave!!


Danny O’Neill
111 Posted 22/02/2021 at 23:48:02
Still catching up. Agree almost in entirety with you post @49 Graham.
Derek Thomas
112 Posted 23/02/2021 at 00:09:31
He's not as bad as some make out - nor as good. We had our pants pulled down good style to the tune of about an extra £15-18M. He has 15mths left on his contract, in 12mths he might be very lucky if we offer him 1 years extension
Martin Mason
113 Posted 23/02/2021 at 07:25:58
Sorry, Tony, I was definitely a bit odious there.
Tony Abrahams
114 Posted 23/02/2021 at 08:09:43
That's alright, Danny. Two fellas I normally agree with (Dave & John R) called it right on Friday and Saturday and said they wouldn't play Allan because he'd been out for so long, and I couldn't understand their logic, mate. They were both right.

Gomes, never got going and, although we won, I was still very disappointed for those Anfield veterans on this thread, and the younger ones in my own family, who still brave going to Anfield every season.

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