Everton have begun preliminary inspection work at Bramley-Moore Dock in anticipation of construction work on the new stadium beginning in earnest later this year.
The club received both local and central Governmental approval for plans to build a 52,888-seat stadium on the north docks site earlier this year, with the first project being the filling in of the dock itself.
The Liverpool Echo report that specialist firm Boskalis Maritime will send a boat out onto the Mersey to carry out various checks on the dock and its hidden contents.
Their team will conduct a survey of the bottom of the dock and check for any potential hazards like unexploded devices from the Second World War, while also assessing the condition of the dock wall ahead of the infilling operation.
The Echo report also suggests that other work will include a survey of microbiological organisms present in the water and the recovery of panels and materials installed to better understand the local climate, with construction work set to start in late summer or the autumn.
Reader Comments (104)
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1 Posted 14/06/2021 at 13:55:29
2 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:22:04
3 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:22:11
4 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:24:55
5 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:25:45
6 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:33:19
7 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:33:48
8 Posted 14/06/2021 at 15:55:47
9 Posted 14/06/2021 at 16:10:22
10 Posted 14/06/2021 at 16:22:54
12 Posted 14/06/2021 at 16:30:44
13 Posted 14/06/2021 at 16:41:36
Mark 6, come on now, are you serious?
Numbers 1 through 5 and 15 through to 950... are you serious?
15 Posted 14/06/2021 at 16:48:20
17 Posted 14/06/2021 at 16:50:36
19 Posted 14/06/2021 at 17:06:27
Bramley-Moore Dock walls needs re-enforcement to make it water tight - - - bit like our defence then because that isn't water tight either.
20 Posted 14/06/2021 at 17:22:21
21 Posted 14/06/2021 at 18:00:19
No, Derek Hatton is out on bail and looks set to play a big part in the Everton project.
22 Posted 14/06/2021 at 18:19:00
Now and again, I go online to look at the development in that whole dock area. With so much development, I can't find how the road/transportation net will change to accommodate so many people living or visiting the dock area.
23 Posted 14/06/2021 at 18:33:52
You know you're inviting the (in)famous fish puns from Live Forum?!
25 Posted 14/06/2021 at 18:51:09
26 Posted 14/06/2021 at 18:52:01
The new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock is going to be a bit like Wembley, with only really three ways to access the stadium, whereas Goodison probably has about fifteen different access routes.
The water might eventually get used for people coming from the t'other side, and my own guess is that they are going to eventually have to build another train station in between Sandhills, and Moorefields, because driving towards the ground just doesn't make any sense at all.
27 Posted 14/06/2021 at 19:11:09
This is based on today's Echo article today but there's nothing, as yet, on the Everton website.
Good to see they're doing a sweep for unexploded bombs as there could well be a few in the mud.
28 Posted 14/06/2021 at 19:18:59
Merseyrail have been planning a new station at Vauxhall between Moorfields and Sandhills since 2017, irrespective of BMD being approved.
Water-borne traffic is never going to happen at BMD due to the tides. The cost of a floating landing stage would be prohibitive.
29 Posted 14/06/2021 at 19:19:06
30 Posted 14/06/2021 at 19:52:24
31 Posted 14/06/2021 at 20:01:23
32 Posted 14/06/2021 at 20:17:04
Having said all this I'm neither an architect or an accountant. I just would have thought 'check to see if there's bombs' might have come before now.
I can't believe all these bloody fish puns, it is pathetic. There's a time and plaice for that kind of thing.
33 Posted 14/06/2021 at 20:25:08
Liverpool have already started years ago, but maybe at last they are going to push ahead. Great that Everton is part of it, even though I was sceptical of it getting off the ground after previous disappointments
At least this development is one of Moshiri prime objective and should generate the returns he wants. Hopefully it will drag Everton Club up by the bootlaces with it.
34 Posted 14/06/2021 at 20:37:15
Why would there be any bombs there the Germans didn't know Everton were going to build there I think it's a red herring.
35 Posted 14/06/2021 at 20:46:31
I would laugh myself, if I thought it would not happen.
In regards to bombs being found, I think a few of the older gangsters from the sixties, will be more worried of something else being found, and twitching a bit.
36 Posted 14/06/2021 at 20:51:48
As it turns out, there have been other checks being carried out, which I, and am sure everyone else was unaware of, which is that engineers will were on the site today to recover panels and materials which were placed at Bramley-Moore Dock to help fully understand the climate of the plot by the Mersey. These findings will also help the club update their extensive heritage plan for the site. So plenty of things have been happening which we are not aware of.
39 Posted 14/06/2021 at 21:13:35
40 Posted 14/06/2021 at 21:16:48
I think as time moves forward, ferries might start to dock near the cruise ship landing stage, but the train is the most important transport link, so thats very good news.
53 Posted 14/06/2021 at 21:54:46
68 Posted 14/06/2021 at 22:16:22
I used to google the area a lot, last year especially. With all the new construction already ongoing and BMD about to be added to that, it would seem that laying in new roads at the same time would cause problems.
The city has a site that shows current work or planned new roads around town and I didn't see any in the docks area from, say, BMD to the Liver building [Where all is new construction has been happening]. Thought I'd ask as we have a few construction ITKs in here.
73 Posted 14/06/2021 at 22:35:34
88 Posted 14/06/2021 at 22:57:08
I've supported Everton since Jeff Astle ended our dreams in 1968. But you lot make me sick. Giving out about players and then expecting them to show loyalty when you treat them like shit.
Blue means pain.
92 Posted 15/06/2021 at 01:58:40
I asked Dan Meis about rising sea levels and he said they've been factored into the design.
93 Posted 15/06/2021 at 08:21:05
94 Posted 15/06/2021 at 08:30:36
This is positive news, now for a new manager, whoever that may be.
95 Posted 15/06/2021 at 10:27:24
With the site being right on the river, and near its mouth, the likelihood of site flooding as a direct result of heavy rainfall is about zero. The possibility of a "Perfect Storm" combining sustained heavy rainfall with abnormally low barometric pressure, and persistent northwest gales across the Irish Sea, creating a surge that combines with the highest spring tides... now that might get interesting! But it would also probably flood many low-lying areas around Liverpool Bay!!!
Of course the projected effects of climate change could be off the mark. This "predicting the future" malarkey is not for the faint-hearted.
96 Posted 15/06/2021 at 11:12:11
Personally, I jizz my pants every time I see the stadium. What Evertonian wouldnt?
98 Posted 15/06/2021 at 13:03:02
99 Posted 15/06/2021 at 14:07:49
The entire timeline and the update responses of BMD reminds me of the Middlehaven project, a similar dock regeneration in Middlesbrough where I lived at the time.
Derelict far too long in an area desperate for significant regeneration; false dawns; painfully slow progress; complex planning, funding and engineering issues; promises broken, diluted but ultimately fulfilled when politics, investment and ambition aligned. It even salvaged its own listed clock tower building.
When huge transformation, big numbers and dazzling visuals were bandied around to 'sell' the idea, the news of its go-ahead raised public expectation of cranes in the skyline from day 1.
If cutting the ribbon was step 10, steps 1 to 8 (planning, funding, design, inspection, decontamination, groundwork, utilities, infrastructure, procuring etc) didn't exactly get the public's heart racing. Step 2 couldn't start until step 1 was secured and so on - much of the progress and money was spent, as scheduled, below ground but with little to show for it public frustration grew. Any update that didn't alter the skyline was met with apathy.
Middlehaven is now the thriving home of Middlesbrough FC, business, academia and residents. Its mainly younger population care not one jot about the 50 years of pain taken to make it all possible. And I'm sure we'll be the same when our first goal is scored in a magnificent stadium on a regenerated waterfront.
Chuck in the uncertainties of the economy, climate, Brexit, Covid, UNESCO and FFP and a manager merry go round, overall I'm reasonably happy with BMD's progress to date. No-one wants the much-anticipated first spade in the ground to set off a UXB ('depends who's digging' I hear some quip).
Having witnessed recent failed attempts the skeptics have a point but surely we've made more progress and we're on a sounder footing than when some were clinging on to the fact that Tesco Terry was an Evertonian?
With lower costs, lighter planning requirements, less transparency and no public consultation Goodison Park must have been a breeze to build by comparison. Do we know or care what fans thought then? History records the firsts, the memories, the legacy. These days, however, we also get to record the bitching, sniping and personal attacks. Let those who judge us in 100 years know that it wasn't all negativity!
We are the lucky generation that should witness a huge milestone in our shared history. I sincerely hope everyone today on ToffeeWeb gets to witness that first goal.
101 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:09:41
The other lot have just been granted permission to redevelop again to increase capacity to a further 7000.
What is it with us? Years of fuckups and still no spade in the ground, they move forward whilst we are still climbing hurdles.
This is not a negative but a frustrating angry post.
102 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:15:46
105 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:32:40
106 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:40:43
Weak attempts to agitate will receive the response they fully deserve So fuck off then
107 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:40:46
Weak attempts to agitate will receive the response they fully deserve So fuck off then
108 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:49:17
109 Posted 15/06/2021 at 16:49:55
Its a proper dual carriageway, but Id say driving towards the new stadium would be a nightmare, and think that the train would be the best route, for most of the crowd, because its a fair old walk from the city centre, especially during the winter months.
110 Posted 15/06/2021 at 17:00:32
111 Posted 15/06/2021 at 19:17:47
112 Posted 15/06/2021 at 19:18:16
The divide is about to grow and grow. Everton seem to do as little as possible to offend the red shite. We let them lead the way on everything. Now they have announced a rail seat plan for next season.
Believe me we are well left behind by the time Bramley Moore comes. As beautiful as The Bramley Moore plans look, the riches will be already in the big clubs pockets by a further stretch.
They are getting more fixtures in the Champions League and more seats. Its gut wrenching but Everton is near a forgotton club with or without Bramley Moore.
The divide will grow and grow while as per usual, it'll be far too late to deal with it. I don't care if it sounds negative and offends anyone because it is negative and its coming soon.
113 Posted 15/06/2021 at 19:25:58
114 Posted 15/06/2021 at 19:45:48
It is negative of you, if BMD wasn't even a proposal where would Everton be? If Moshiri wasn't a bit daft in the head when it comes to spending his wealth, where would we be? At least he's trying to bridge the gap between us and the other big clubs, but he's trying to do it following 20 years of neglect and managed decline.
Everton can't control what other clubs do, we can only control what happens to us. If Everton were to have an unbelievable run of success winning five titles and five Champions League's guess what we'd still be in the shadow of our rivals. That's why comparing the two clubs' actions is futile we lost that war donkey's years ago.
115 Posted 15/06/2021 at 19:57:43
Bramley Moore is spectacular but it won't bridge the gap. If Bramley Moore wasn't a proposal we would be where we are now. I am not sure what other answer there is to that question.
We have long lived in their shadow as you put it but until recently they have been catchable. If all the other clubs don't stand up now, we can forget about success in football as we know it.
We may one day get success from some other kind of division when the gap proves so big there has to be a break away league.
116 Posted 15/06/2021 at 20:32:40
117 Posted 15/06/2021 at 21:09:54
BMD alone will not make Everton a more competitive club on the pitch, but it will help raise the profile and generate more income for the club, without it, we are just another of a long line of 'used to be good' clubs.
118 Posted 15/06/2021 at 22:05:06
119 Posted 15/06/2021 at 22:30:18
What do you mean, rail seat plan?
120 Posted 15/06/2021 at 22:32:07
The vessel currently in BMD will be carrying out a grid search using side scan sonar, picking up anything metallic. These are then logged as targets with pretty accurate coordinates, usually with in a 2-3 metre radius.
Then a dive team will begin searching for each target with a metal detector, there are ones that work under water. Each target will be dugout with an airlift and identified, its usually an old car wheel or shopping trolley.
If any ordinance is found it will be all collected in a specified area of the dock and detonated at the end of the project.
Depending on what quantity is found, it may very in where/how they detonate the ordinance, cant be to close to dock walls.
Id give the club a little leeway on this folks, Im sure youve all had builders tell you it depends on how deep the clay is before laying foundations for an extension, thats this but times a million. Who knows what will turn up in BMD.
This is just a general summary of how the projects Ive been involved with have worked, unfortunately the one project Id love to work on for free and I cant because of bad timing, thats Everton that.
121 Posted 15/06/2021 at 22:40:47
Fascinating stuff thanks for the insight but I bet your life insurance ain't cheap.
122 Posted 15/06/2021 at 22:42:29
Nothing like listening to someone who actually has experience in what they are commenting on, and also reassures you that we have Evertonians everywhere in every field. and on TW
123 Posted 15/06/2021 at 23:16:35
124 Posted 15/06/2021 at 23:27:04
They will side scan the dock bottom which will show up anything of any size
Then its a magnetometer to pick up anything metallic including all old ordinance.
Anywhere offshore we suspect there may be anything, especially around the UK coast, prior to installing oil installations or wind farms we carry out similar works.
There was a fair bit found around Seaforth when the present docks were extended as was out in Morecambe Bay.
Hopefully nothing will be found around BMD as trying to get rid of it will be a pain!
125 Posted 15/06/2021 at 23:41:52
126 Posted 15/06/2021 at 23:51:34
127 Posted 15/06/2021 at 00:03:49
128 Posted 15/06/2021 at 00:08:29
To side scan BMD and run a magnetometer sweep would take maximum 12 hours.
Depends on side scan sonar used as they have different area coverages but you could cover the dock in probably 4-6 runs
The sonar and magnetometer are portable so could be put on any size vessel, problem is the dock is relatively shallow.
Wouldn't cost a lot of money loads of companies carry out this stuff and the results are instantaneous.
Obviously if anything is down there it either needs inspected by divers or if ordinance is suspected safer checking it out with an ROV
We do it all the time offshore and not a big issue to be honest
129 Posted 16/06/2021 at 01:39:28
Paul Markey and John Keating - Thank you both. Good stuff.
130 Posted 16/06/2021 at 06:20:16
Nothing more certain.
131 Posted 16/06/2021 at 07:05:57
Onto matters BMD related. As someone who was involved, albeit on the periphery, of Kings' Waterfront (my employer was involved, and I got occasional days on the project in exchange for sourcing match tickets!), that was a true loss and would've changed our finances 20 years ahead of BMD.
However, one thing I hope they do is try to provide as much reason for fans to arrive early and enjoy F&B in various concessions run by the club. I can't recall the figures off the top of my head, but the new Tottenham stadium (pre-pandemic) was selling an incredible amount. with an on-site brewery and a dispensing system capable of pouring thousands of pints a minute, selling enough per match to maybe cover most of Bale's wages.
I hope the club wring as much coin out of the design as they can.
132 Posted 16/06/2021 at 08:38:29
133 Posted 16/06/2021 at 09:32:54
134 Posted 16/06/2021 at 09:42:47
135 Posted 16/06/2021 at 09:43:44
They gave us a tour and explained the concept was not just the magnificent stadium (it is), but to change the match day experience. They didn't want supporters bomb-bursting out straight after kickoff and leaving en-masse. The idea was to keep them in the stadium and spend money, hence a plethora of bars and literally restaurants serving up every style of food you can imagine cooked by chefs, not just sell pre-prepared pies and sausage rolls from counters, with a flat Chang.
The traditionalists in us would be horrified, but it struck me as taking Roy Keane's prawn sandwich brigade jibe out of the executive box and providing it to the regular punters. At cost obviously, but that's the commercial aspect to it.
136 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:06:40
I believe the seats were designed with the maximum angle possible and to be as near as possible to the pitch. That's what I remember anyway.
137 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:08:23
138 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:16:18
The prospect of good quality and, importantly, affordable food AFTER the match is a good idea, especially for those who have travelled any distance to get there. Or for visiting fans who want to make a night of it in Liverpool. I hope it's included in the BMD plans.
Football has changed enormously in recent years, and not just the diving species, the players who end up in intensive care when they chip their nail varnish, but more families are going now and I think it would be a winner. Here's hoping...
139 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:17:36
Meis was, seemingly, aware of these concerns & expressed a desire to try & maintain a degree of intensity in the way the seating was planned. How successful that will prove to be is the question.
140 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:22:20
Spin the pitch around 90 degrees. But then we'd have had to buy the Gwladys Street school and pay for a replacement somewhere nearby I would imagine. As well as those couple of streets of terraced houses between Bullens Road and Walton Lane. Like Liverpool had to. And it would have only taken a stubborn Kopite family to put a delay in that like the Everton ones who allegedly delayed the Kemlyn Road replacement by years.
It would have taken years.
Oh wait, it has!! But hopefully, this will be worth the wait.
141 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:31:29
I am only going on my experience of the match compared to Goodison for example. Spurs were especially bad that day, of course, which wouldn't help.
No doubt somebody somewhere can dig out the actual dimensions of the stadium. It would be useful to compare to BMD. As you say, Meis was on it; I hope his successors are too…
142 Posted 16/06/2021 at 10:36:16
If I remember correctly, there was some proposal that by expanding the footprint as you describe, the pitch could just be shifted through the Bullens to give more space on the side where the main stand is currently, & a small shift towards the Park End would open up the Gwladys Street end a little.
As for the houses, etc, it amazes me that any club wouldn't acquire as many of the surrounding properties over the years. Everton have been at Goodison for nearly 140 years so could almost certainly have acquired all the housing around the ground. I know they're not in the business of being a landlord, but the footprint could have already been in their possession to allow for future redevelopment/expansion.
143 Posted 16/06/2021 at 14:22:02
There was quite a bit of discussion about it in here.
144 Posted 16/06/2021 at 15:02:31
Sounds similar to the US stadiums I have visited for football, baseball and basketball - scores of outlets everywhere for merchandise and every food and drink you can think of, including cocktail bars, sushi bars, kosher food etc. It is a great match day experience, but not cheap. I am not sure how it would go down in Liverpool, Americans are a lot wealthier than us.
145 Posted 17/06/2021 at 11:38:36
I don't myself but the ones I've used look like simple structures and they are always the cheapest to build.
146 Posted 17/06/2021 at 12:39:05
Spot on regarding floating landings. In the scheme of things, they are very cheap to install.
With the money mentioned to build BMD and refurb the pumphouse, a riverside floating landing stage for something the size of the ferries would be insignificant.
Boskalis, who appear to have the marine work for BMD, install these things worldwide ranging from a small yacht marina to the bigger cruise liners. They have everything in-house from survey, naval architects, engineering, installation, vessels etc.
147 Posted 17/06/2021 at 21:46:32
148 Posted 19/06/2021 at 07:40:25
Liverpool city council, and its planners, committed architectural crimes against humanity in the 60s and 70s where the fuck was UNESCO then?
149 Posted 19/06/2021 at 08:17:11
We have never recovered from our own councils housing decisions from the late 50s to be honest
150 Posted 19/06/2021 at 08:39:58
151 Posted 19/06/2021 at 22:11:29
It was signed by a list of about 50 worthies - including: the several mayors; Heseltine;Prof. DBB; heads of the various development agencies; both bishops; and some hitherto unknown playwright by the name of ‘Wily Russell.
This is going to run and run.
152 Posted 20/06/2021 at 00:16:55
Unfortunately (and God forgive her), she's a Red (Proddy Dog) given her heritage but she thinks BMD or summat like it is decades overdue to be the catalyst for something the city of her life deserves, namely prosperity and reverence based upon that prosperity, not mawkish sentiment.
That said, as a life-long Socialist she's not at all attracted to Moshiri or Usmanov.
153 Posted 20/06/2021 at 00:41:16
To this day its never recovered from the blitz the council inflicted on the City from the late 50s
Just think what might have been if theyd taken their time and renewed areas slowly, piecemeal, and kept the communities together rather than the scorched earth policy and decanting they did
154 Posted 22/06/2021 at 03:24:49
There was so much opposition to the ring road that it was eventually stopped but not before a lot of CPOs had been executed and the bulldozers moved in.
I still hate Clayton Square development and still avoid it, the old buildings were much nicer architecturally. I can't remember though what used to be at the site of St. John's Precinct before?
155 Posted 22/06/2021 at 03:37:35
There are piled variants used by which the landing stage floats up and down between the piles that would be more expensive, but they are mainly used for boat moorings at marinas.
Also there are fixed landing stages that are piled but they would need to go farther into the river to eliminate tidal variations and would therefore be more expensive.
156 Posted 22/06/2021 at 04:11:56
And they withdraw it anyway? Back to Plan A, lads.
Fuck them and their "not put a penny in the kitty but let it sit and crumble" principles.
157 Posted 22/06/2021 at 05:14:16
I hadn't seen this video before so I thought I would post a link to.
It will be a bear pit alright. They wan't know whats hit them when we get them in there.
158 Posted 22/06/2021 at 06:57:50
Other developments around the dock have had to collectively spend hundreds of millions also, not to mention substantial council spend on maintaining areas not developed.
So, all in all, were spending half a billion+ as a city to keep the city looking like it did centuriy(s) ago. WTF?
Couldnt agree more with your “fuck them” comment. Time for the city to start having ambitions to be compete with Singapore, Hong Kong, Sydney, New York, et al…..ASAP.
100% certain that would approach would bring us multiple times the prosperity as continuing to waste money on lunatics whod rather see a rotting dock sewer than a wonderful stadium.
159 Posted 22/06/2021 at 07:06:37
By 1975-80 It was nearly all gone.
They wondered why the London Rd shops all slowly died - no customers...people will only come in by bus from Netherton, Kirkby and Croxteth for so long.
And don't even start me on the motorway were The Islington Community used to be.
We used to have a stall in the Old St John's Market, before It (allegedly?) caught fire one night and burnt down all on its own...hmm?
There used to be 1000's - tens of 1000s' of families in walking distance.
When I was 9 or 10, in the Christmas school holidays, my Gran was supposed to 'mind me' and I was supposed to carry bags of meat, sausages etc...and 1 time, I kid you not - a 24Ib turkey, only to have to bring it back as it wouldn't fit in her oven. Then take her money back and then come back again...that saw most of the day off...or other shopping and stuff for overloaded housewives, (you'd get a penny if you were lucky)...I mostly roamed around town taking in the glory of a still bustling city centre.
Yep in those day you could send a 10yr old to a moremor less strangers house, but of course it wasn't a stranger, it was 'Mrs So and So' from Christian St. Or where ever, then send him again to return half a weeks wages.
As you might tell it left a lasting impression.
Anyway; WH?, as somebody said - who? tell them to do one.
160 Posted 22/06/2021 at 07:13:14
Our city has a proud history and proud heritage that we can be proud of regardless of that tag. It's irrelevant and not a priority. The future is. For the City of Liverpool and for Everton.
Does and has Manchester ever had UNESCO status? To my knowledge, no. They're equally proud of their city and their heritage, yet they've left us behind to effectively become the second city of the nation.
As I've said elsewhere, you look forward and seek to progress. You never forget your roots and remain proud of your history, as they are the foundations we are built on. As an individual, as a city, as a football club. But don't let nostalgia get in the way of progress.
Make a history future generations can be proud of, don't live in the past. Our forefathers didn't.
161 Posted 24/06/2021 at 07:12:52
163 Posted 25/06/2021 at 15:06:27
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