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Lap of Dishonour

By Rob Williamson :  22/05/2011 :  Comments (58) :
I have been an Everton fan for over 50 years and each season I want them to win every game, win every trophy, develop and sign the best players, have the best ground etc, etc. Without dreams and aspirations such as these, what is the point? And just what is the club motto anyway?

Unrealistic? Certainly. And, with the current regime in charge, getting more and more unrealistic with every passing season. Indeed, I believe my sons, who I?ve brought up in the Blue tradition, will never see Everton win anything again.

It is in the spirit of these depressing thoughts that I make the following plea to those attending today?s game. Support the team with passion throughout the match, but at the end of the game, when the traditional, end of season, lap of ?honour? takes place ? we should BOO!

We should BOO the Board:

? For failing to put a single penny from their own pockets into the club
? For their complete inability to attract any investment into the club
? For their total incompetence over issues like Kings Dock; NTL; Fortress Sports Fund; Destination Kirkby; Everton Place development

We should BOO David Moyes:

? For his continued negative tactics ? against anybody!
? For continuing with a style of play that doesn?t include passing and movement or any semblance of pace... after 9 years FFS!
? For only managing to win 6 games out of 20 against teams in the bottom half of the league
? For rolling over whenever we play any of the Sky 4 away from home ? 0 wins out of 36 games is a disgrace
? For rarely making substitutions until it?s too late
? For his intransigence in sticking with a game-plan and force-fitting players into that plan regardless of their suitability ? and therefore constantly playing players out of position
? For buying players and not having a clue as to their best position ? Fellaini, Heitinga, Bilyaletdinov ? For not having a clue about how to get the best from many of the forwards he?s bought ? Johnson, Beattie, Beckford
? For being clueless about the best place to play Rodwell, leaving the lad wondering which way to turn. (I believe he will be a great player ? but not for us!)
? For moaning about the lack of striking options and then allowing Yakubu and Vaughan to leave on non-return loans
? For bringing everybody back at corners thereby ensuring that any clearance will come straight back
? For sticking with his favourites and bringing them back immediately regardless of the impact that has on the structure or form of the team ? Cahill, Arteta, Neville, Anichebe.

We should BOO the players:

? Hibbert for continually allowing himself to be sucked in to the middle leaving him vulnerable to diagonal balls behind him
? Jagielka for his aimless and pointless hoofs upfield
? Arteta for never managing to put a free kick or corner past the first man and for not putting a shift in this season despite the amazing contract he?d signed
? Osman for falling over too easily whenever we play one of the ?big? teams
? Anichebe for falling over too easily against anybody!
? Neville for his complete inability to pass the ball without taking at least three touches... and even then not finding a blue shirt... oh! and for constantly talking about ?turning the corner? and ?kick starting our season?
? All of them for not moving into position to receive a pass from a team mate

And last of all we should BOO ourselves, the fans:

? For putting up with this shit year after year
? For constantly putting our hands in our pockets to fund the performance of those ? players and officials, many of whom are not fit to be associated with this great club
? For making excuses for Kenwright because he?s a Blue
? For not letting Moyes know that, although we?re grateful for what he?s achieved, unless he makes some significant changes to his footballing philosophy, we will never win anything.

Anyway. Rant over....... ?Nurse!?

Reader Comments

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Brian Waring
1   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:29:19

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Better get that tin hat out Rob!
Al Reddish
2   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:27:59

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Just boo SKY for changing football as we know it and for now making it the most unequal leagues in any sport. It's all about money now and that's the reason the same clubs are the usual winners every year.

The players are more pampered than they have ever been, and this stinks when the rest of us are struggling to keep our jobs but ploughing what little money we have left into the club we support's coffers to pay these prima donnas.

As people have pointed out before, it's not Everton you have fallen out of love with... it's probably football in general.

Graeme Hodgkinson
3   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:47:59

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As much as I like to read ToffeeWeb, this post sums up everything that is wrong with it... An absolute disgrace!
John Talbot
4   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:49:32

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50 years of watching Everton? ? you should be used to this by now.

I'd go to the bingo on matchday if I was you.
Jon Beck
5   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:54:50

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The idea of the lap is for the players to thank the supporters... maybe they should boo the fans, we can all have a massive boo in. Hey life's a pantomime ? let's go for it! ;-)
James Russell
6   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:55:14

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There are far too many disgraceful points in this post and only a few the majority of Evertonians would agree with. Terrible post...
Matteo Rosingana
7   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:53:33

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And what if we win today? Do we still boo the players after the game? It could get confusing. Al's post sums it up very well. And after reading Moyes's recent comments regarding next season, we should expect things to get worse.
David Hallwood
8   Posted 22/05/2011 at 14:57:37

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"Glass half-full or half-empty Rob?" "Where's the glass? What glass are you on about?"
Amit Vithlani
9   Posted 22/05/2011 at 15:03:06

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I dont know where to start with this idiotic, stupid post, but to suggest we boo Phil Jagielka for hoofing the ball long just about sums up what a ridiculous waste of space this article is.

I know, let's cheer when Jagielka decides to dribble the ball out of defence, loses the ball and we concede a goal.

I firmly hope you wrote this firmly tongue in cheek otherwise I suggest you go to the corner of a room and have a quiet word with yourself.
Sam Hoare
10   Posted 22/05/2011 at 15:09:42

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Dear me. A very sad article indeed.
Danny James
11   Posted 22/05/2011 at 15:08:38

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Dear, oh dear, oh dear.

I am already looking forward to next season.
Champions League here we come.

Go on the boys.
Gerry Quinn
12   Posted 22/05/2011 at 15:36:19

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I too have supported Everton for over 50 years, but have never, ever, been so disappointed in reading such utter drivel.
I hope you don't attempt to complete your list, as you would probably be ejected from the ground - not by the staff, but by your fellow fans standing around you!
Jackie Barry
13   Posted 22/05/2011 at 15:19:53

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It could be said that some of the reactions to this article show precisely how accepting of the mediocre some of us have become. Wow, Bill has really weaved the theatrical magic into some of you guys!
Jim Potter
14   Posted 22/05/2011 at 15:41:34

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When I read this - I thought - here we go again with Toffeeweb negativity - but Rob you have outdone the normal contibutor - and that's saying something! So, a perverse well done to you.

When you return to planet earth and ask "Take me to your leader" - I sincerely hope it's still David Moyes.

Trevor Mackie
15   Posted 22/05/2011 at 16:43:38

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More right than wrong in your article Rob.

In most spheres of life, as customers, all of us would have a right go given the lack of service, value for money and general garbage supplied by EFC. But the buggers get away with it because we're devoted - defies all logic.
Dalziel Kane
16   Posted 22/05/2011 at 18:39:34

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more Boos here than Halloween.

There was an awful lot of castigating various personnel at the club at the start, some of it justified, yes, but however bad anyone wants to make out of it, the season has ended, and we find ourselves where we are, I'm just thinking next year may be much of the same, Moyes didn;t seem to take one or two games seriously this season, the players seemed to show some desire today to get a win but didn't it arrive a little too late this season?

All very well putting on the shirt and going on to win on one afternoon on the final day, but what about the other percentage of garbage that was served up at times this season.

Just get pissed off sometimes, I want Everton to do well, that's all.
John Ford
17   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:14:34

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Ridiculous, awful post which, bizzarely, highlights the financial realities but yet again fails to recognise this context as the key reason for Everton's increasingly difficult predicament.

As mentioned top English football is being shafted by Sky and a distorted distribution of money. Look at who keeps winning... it's the economy stupid!
Ben Jones
18   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:33:20

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There have been a few things about Everton this season... but mate... cmon... take a chill pill
Thomas Williams
19   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:36:40

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Rob, started off with some good points and then I can only describe as a complete diatribe, did you forget to take your tablets or something? Because your attack on Moyes and some of the players is not befitting of an Everton fan.
Trevor Lynes
20   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:30:34

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I have actually been watching and supporting EVERTON since 1948 and have been through many highs and lows ever since (including relegation)... but this article is so ridiculous that it hardly deserves response of any sort.

My only comment is that SKY TV hardly mentioned Everton's game against Chelsea and ? although the concentration should rightly be concerned with the relegation battles ensuing ? it was palpably obvious that there seems to be a conscious strategy to ignore us as much as possible. Personally I think the beating of Chelsea with only ten men merited a lot more attention than it got.

I think that a letter of protest should be sent from Toffeeweb to Sky Sports to highlight the lack of respect given to one of the original 12 pioneers who formulated league football in England. A club that has spent more time in the top flight than any of the supposed top teams. I am a long term supporter of one of the GREATEST clubs and collectively WE should not take lack of respect from any media sports reporters.

Just a personal gripe but this article by a supposed fan touched a nerve.

Simon Bradley
21   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:38:09

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For god's sake....the reason we don't have protests, demonstrations, banners, because deep down we ALL know that anyone getting a club with our lack of money to a regular top 6-7 finish is realistically as good as it's going to get, in this brave new premiership world....and until Sheik Loadsamoney comes along, it ain't going to change.....
Despite a (relative) few people on here saying things to the contrary, most of our 35k regulars know that to be the case, and we have little choice but to accept it, be grateful for where we are. got some faults (haven't we all) but many thanks.
Ray Roche
22   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:49:21

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Rob Williamson

Let's not boo the players...let's tell prats like this to piss of on matchdays and watch another team.
David Crowe
23   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:54:03

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Boo David Moyes? I stopped reading when I saw that. Absolutely disgraceful. You clearly weren't at the ground today as the whole crowd sang his name repeatedly, appreciatively. You say we should boo David Moyes but you wouldn't dare do it in the ground because you'd come in for some serious stick so you come on Toffeeweb to spread your outrageous opinions. I'm not categorising one user of this site with this no mark but it really isn't a realistic representation of the opinions of evertonians. APOLOGISE FOR THE RANT BUT THAT INFURIATED ME
Matt Kearsley
24   Posted 22/05/2011 at 19:59:30

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So because you've put in 50 years, you have the right to spout this rubbish?

At your age, you should know better!
Ray Robinson
25   Posted 22/05/2011 at 20:06:10

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I booed Beckford's goal. Greedy git!
Graham Suggett
26   Posted 22/05/2011 at 20:39:38

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Rob, you?re entitled to your opinion and I sympathise with some of your comments. My lowest point was home to West Brom when it struck me I was paying £30+ to watch s**t football and boo millionaires. Thank God the season is over and we can all take a break and come back refreshed in August.
Tim O'Connell
27   Posted 22/05/2011 at 20:49:04

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I think most of the response posts sum it up. I think most of us think it is a disappointing season because we expected more and that in hindsight was too unrealistic. We have something special at the club which is spirit both from the players and DM and the last thing I would do is boo, that is whty EFC is special. Getting investment in the real world is difficult and is not always the panacea - just look at West Ham, Birmingham, Blackburn and Villa. Sometimes my head and heart are not always in tandem but the one thing they will both always be is a Blue and I will never boo that that I will always love - EFC
Peter Warren
28   Posted 22/05/2011 at 21:17:58

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Alan Khan
29   Posted 22/05/2011 at 21:47:22

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At least we WON something?!

Kudos to all Evertonians who played the EPL Fantasy League this season. Just got this update from

Everton fans topped the table!!!

Here's the log...:

Best fans

Team	Fans	Average
Everton	53,345	1,609.1
Blackb	17,751	1,595
Fulham	18,678	1,586.9
Villa 	50,942	1,581.4
Spurs	124,332	1,578.9
West H	45,759	1,578.5
Magpies	60,633	1,577.8
Bolton	12,604	1,556.8
Sunder	20,642	1,551.6
Stoke 	12,674	1,550.5
Birm	13,922	1,543.1
Blackpl	17,963	1,539.5
Wolves	17,843	1,535.3
Wigan	7,252	1,532.9
Man Utd	639,332	1,527.7
Liv'poo	426,389	1,522.9
West Br	9,243	1,521.1
Arsenal	326,267	1,516.9
ManCity	67,504	1,511.4
Chelsea	221,356	1,471.2
Tony J Williams
30   Posted 22/05/2011 at 21:45:25

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Crap season yet surprisingly we finish higher tan last year. Improvement from last year so that will do... for now. Continual improvement, that all you can ask.
George Brooks
31   Posted 22/05/2011 at 21:40:27

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You don't choose Everton; Everton chooses you, wind and rain, highs and lows.

We can't win coz we ain't got the money?? Chelsea have; we beat them.... Man City have; we beat them. Redshite have; we beat them... Tottingham have; we beat them. All these teams have the money and the players... But... they all dread playing Everton.

Ok, maybe we took our eye off the ball a little against some of the other teams, and you have to say that some of the games we did not win, we should've. We are a good team and, whilst finishing 7th is disappointing, I agree, how many other teams in the world would love to say that.

This is the Premier League!!! I know your heart's probably in the right place Rob, but this is negative, negative, negative. Chin up, Rob, next season we will be Brill.

David Crowe
32   Posted 22/05/2011 at 22:18:53

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George Brooks has got it spot on there. And even if we're not brill next season, I'll still be here. True supporters support through thick and thin. I'm sounding corny here but what's the point in calling yourself a supporter if you only support in the good times?
Tony J Williams
33   Posted 22/05/2011 at 22:27:12

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New house, wedding on the way but I still renewed, even though it was the closest this year to not.

Once it touches you, you will never be the same.
John Atkins
34   Posted 22/05/2011 at 21:44:06

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David Moyes has done an absolutely tremendous job and simply cannot be criticised. (God knows where we would be now without him.)

However, when this pathetic so-called Board of Directors eventually lead us down into the Championship in a couple of years (IT WILL HAPPEN WITHOUT INVESTMENT), then I'm sure we will all sing the same tune....

Is he still looking 24/7 by the way? ... Sack the Board!!! COYB

Robbie Shields
35   Posted 22/05/2011 at 23:47:18

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Rob, I'm with you 99%, I agree with all you points unanimously, I could have written the same myself. However, I couldn't Boo the Players on their lap around Goodison, but I understand where you are coming from.

7th isn't good enough and with the squad we HAD at the beginning of the season, we really did have a serious chance of getting into the Champions League this year.

Why didn't we? Moyes. Before I get lambasted by a fair chunk of Evertonians out there who still think Moyes is a genius, I have one thing to say:

"Finishing 7th is like winning the Champions League"

Great isn't it, I'm so fulfilled and happy having watched the shite football we have produced all season (feeling like we are playing like Barcelona) and then finishing 7th, out of both cups meekly, but feeling like we won the Champions League.

Can't wait for next season, when drawing with the crappest Liverpool I have ever seen is an 'unbelievable result' and we get up to 40 games without a win against the big boys away.

It feels like I'm supporting the best managed club in the world.

Art Jones
36   Posted 23/05/2011 at 06:02:22

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I think it's a travesty that we weren't involved in the "Survival Sunday" series of matches. We would have been back to the ' good old days' of Wimbledon 3-2 and Mike Walker or even the better days of Walter Smith an the magnificent signings of Gazza, Ginola and Blomquist.

Where did it all go wrong, Moyesey?

Ray Roche
37   Posted 23/05/2011 at 08:57:59

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Robbie Shields.

I'm not looking for a debate on this but "without a win against the big boys away."

I think you'll find that City are now one of the big boys so you may have to re-think your whinge.

Andrew Ellams
38   Posted 23/05/2011 at 10:02:03

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Didn't this post just sum all the of the complaints and moans that have been raised on this site year-in and year-out since I've been following it?
Neal Daniel
39   Posted 23/05/2011 at 11:38:25

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Rob, I think most of the above replies are clearly through royal blue tinted glasses... and I think there seems to be very few of us who have had them surgically removed!! Apart from the 'BOO' aspect of the lap of honour at the end of the game, I would say that most of what you have written is spot on, and I also agree with Robbie S's response above.

A few things you missed out on though: defenders cannot be relied on merely to defend, we need some players that can bring the ball out from defense, and either Howard doesn't trust his defenders or just prefers to kick long (and very rarely ever does he actually find an Everton player!!), but this has to change.

In quite a few matches this season, we have been shown how to play football: Barcodes at home ? they played us off the park and we were chasing shadows... none of our players were ever anywhere near a NUFC player who were regularly finding acres of space. Also, calamitous results against West Brom, West Ham (2-2 lucky escape), Fulham, Blackpool away... the exampes go on and on. Good work and commitment undone by players who seem to forget how to pass the ball, and yet these same players can put 10 passes together and find the back of the net at the end.

I also agree with comments re DM's favorites club: why change a team that was winning? Cahill and Arteta should have been brought back slowly, and what happend to Vellios and Gueye ? not even in the squad for Chelsea and I thought DM might have played them both alonside JB to give a more attacking formation against a Chelski side that could have been predicted to not turn up on the day.

What about future signings... well there were a number of loan deals this season, the pick of the bunch seems to have been Sturridge... now what are the dream team of DM/WK doing if they're not persuading the wealthy benefactors in the PL to lend their best players to us? (At least we might have a better chance of taking points off their rivals on their behalf!)

So come on, Man Utd, you can lend us Cleverly, Berbatov, one of the twins and we'll try and break our 40-games-with-no-wins streak away to the 'Big 4, or Big 6 as they probably can be thought of now since the final CL place has been doing the rounds over the past few seasons).

One thing that should still unite us all is that whoever is 'moaning' is only doing so because of his/her love of Everton. I watched Everton in the 80s as a teenager and lived/loved all the success... we weren't the richest club then but Howard Kendall just managed to put together a great team with some good buys, and we have to believe that those sort of players can still be found and within our budget (Odemwinge only cost a few £100k).

Beckford for free could be a much better striker if he (a) learns to pass in the area and (b) so do his strike partners!! Maybe Vellios and Gueye and possibly Jaoa Silva might all come good and push on next season plus a few of the reserves.

One final point, the media make a song and dance about youngsters at Everton getting the chance because of DM... errmm sorry guys, DM would never play a youngster unless absolutely necessary due to injury/suspension etc. Rodwell has had many first team chances and has proved himself to a certain extent, but DM has put him in the middle and expected him to run the midfield which was imho totally wrong!!

Also wrong to play PN and JH in midfield together; no creativity, no passing ability although in fairness PN has had some decent games and put in some good balls and even scored a goal this season!!!

COYB, PL winners 2011-12 here we come as Nil Satis Nisi Optimum!!

Paul Flynn
40   Posted 23/05/2011 at 11:56:09

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I was born in 1954. Was at the 1966 FA Cup Final, 1968 FA Cup Final, went to every game home and away 1969-70 when we won the league. I have watched Everton since through some very good times and some very bad times.

I've lived in New York the last 20 years, I still watch the blues every saturday, one way or another. Always go to the games when I return home.

Michael Brien
41   Posted 23/05/2011 at 14:11:06

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Neal #38 Which strike partners of Beckford's do you mean ? I think you will find in most of the games he has been played as a lone striker!!

I have to agree with most of what you said about the 1980s ? we weren't the richest club. However, in those days, there were not the mega rich clubs that we have today. A pity Arsenal's board seem to have a bit more sense than Chelsea's owner. They seem to have the sense to stick with their manager ? whilst Chelsea chop and change. We could do with another of the Sky 4 or is it 5 making another stupid sacking. Presumably if they win the CL but not the Premier League the next manager will be under fire!!

I can't say I agree with all of the actions of Everton's hierarchy and indeed with all of DM's tactics. I think he is obsessed with 4-5-1. But thankfully we seem to have some sort of "long-term" vision. Yes I know it's taking a long long time and we seem to have a very long vision indeed! However, there is a saying that "money easily gained is easily lost". Let's see if these mega rich owners at Chelsea and Siteh are in it for the long haul.

As for you, Rob... well, 50 years as an Evertonian ? well done. But to say BOO the players is talking crap in my opinion. I have never BOOED an Everton team in my life ? including teams that had Belfit and Bernie Wright as strikers. Thankfully I don't they often played in the same 11 ? and I certainly do not intend to start booing now. It's not seeing things through "Royal Blue Specs", accepting Kenwright management speak ? It's actually called LOYALTY.

John Ford
42   Posted 23/05/2011 at 15:28:35

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Robbie 35 - The 'Seventh is like getting to the Champions League' quote was taken out of context by a regular Moyes knocker at TW.

Moyes was making the point that we were not so long ago well down the table and that to get to seventh required Champions League type form. Taking it out of context made his comments then look stupid, which was unfortunately the intention of the TW author.
Michael Kenrick
43   Posted 23/05/2011 at 15:44:42

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Who are you referring to, John? Who is this "TW author"? Does he have a name?
Phil Bellis
44   Posted 23/05/2011 at 16:21:17

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Before the article scrolls off the screen I would like to argue against "continual" improvement"

In a poor league this season, we have lowered our points tally, again: 65, 63, 61, now 54.

Michael Kenrick
45   Posted 23/05/2011 at 16:35:46

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Phil I was just looking at that as I added the latest entry to the ToffeeWeb Record of our glorious League history...

I was shocked how few points we have this time around. Last time we finished 7th, we needed 59 points.

And Goal Difference (Oh No, I hear the cry): +22, +18, +11, +6... Oh dear, that's headed in entirely the wrong direction.

One amazingly consistent thing though is the number of games we lose over each of the last five seasons, which I think is key: 10, 11, 9, 9, 10... Average ≈ 10. That's more than one-quarter!

Although, to be fair to Moyes, he has brought this down from the preceding five years: 17, 13, 17, 13, 16. Average ≈ 15.

So... for the next 5 years, the target is to average just 5 losses each season. Come on, Moyesie, it can be your new 5-Year Plan ? you know you can do it!!!
Robert Pullan
46   Posted 23/05/2011 at 16:54:22

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Poor article and sentiment Rob. Do me a favour, buy a dictionary and have a look at what the word "supporter" means.
John Ford
47   Posted 23/05/2011 at 18:12:09

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I think you know it was you, Michael. I always appreciate your efforts, but deliberately misinterpreting what was said in the interests of having a sly dig was patronising.

I can get tat just by tuning into Talk Radio or reading the red tops. We expect, and generally get better from TW, including from you.
Gareth Humphreys
48   Posted 23/05/2011 at 18:33:30

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Michael - your stats are about a laughable as your continual attacks on David Moyes.

10 defeats this year is 1 more than the team's in 2nd and 3rd. Yep, got to agree with you there - that is really key.
Last year 9 defeats was just 3 more than the champions and less than the team in 4th - again that number of defeats must be really important.
The season before that - 3 more than the team in 4th.
The season before that we lost more than the 2 teams directly below us - should we have lost more?
The season before that - the same amount as the team in 3rd.
Do you get the point? Your key point is once again, dead wrong.
Michael Kenrick
49   Posted 23/05/2011 at 20:09:45

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I thought it was, Mr Ford. Me... who first put the full quote from David Moyes, in its entirety, with full and complete context, on TofffeeWeb's homepage. But obviously that's not good enough for you.

I left it to others who read it, context or no context, to post saying they were clearly unimpressed by the dubious parallel Moyes was drawing; I think for this reason it was a very unfortunate quote for him to have made.

Gareth, I don't like it when Everton lose games. Lost games = lost points... points you can never get back. I think of it as a key to being a successful team. Perhaps you don't, and that's your prerogative. I'm amazed you didn't cite Liverpool, who lost an incredible 13 games, yet still finished ahead of us. I was surprised if anything with the consistency of the number, but I'm not sure I was trying to make some astounding "point", much less attack Moyes.

How is quoting hard numbers attacking Moyes? You'll have to explain that one to me. Or is there a new rule that we're not allowed to make observations if they might reflect less-than-glowingly on our manager?
Chris Williamson
50   Posted 23/05/2011 at 21:43:50

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Al Reddish - at comment 2 - nail on the head, mate. Nothing more to be said.
Roman Sidey
51   Posted 23/05/2011 at 22:55:07

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Everyone chewing Rob out about this article has missed the point!

If you take everything literally, of course it seems too much. What he's saying though it that after so long supporting a club whose motto roughly to 'only the best is good enough', the best is not being produced and it's unacceptable that some people find it acceptable.

Ed Bottomley ? I agree that 7th is an improvement on 8th last year, but 54 points this year is a decline on 61 points last year, as is 13 wins this season against 16 wins last season.
Robbie Shields
52   Posted 23/05/2011 at 23:51:37

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Gareth, you seem to have a similar approach to Football that DM has, which is, avoid defeats!

If we take the line for a minute that DM sends the Mighty Blues out to avoid defeat in every game, then you would expect at the end of the season that we may not have lost lots, tick. You would also expect that we would draw a lot of games, because we are not necessarily trying to win them but instead avoid defeat, tick. Finally, you would expect that we would not win that many games, again because we are looking to avoid defeat first, tick.

So, where you see not losing many games as a definitive positive of DM and his management style, it can be interpreted differently.

As Michael pointed out, Liverpool lost 3 games more than the Mighty Blues, with the worst group of players Liverpool have ever had in my lifetime and in the relegation zone when a certain Dalgleish took over.

The difference between them and us this season was that their manager went out to win every game, where we went out not to get beat in every game.

Football, as in life, tends to favour the brave, Moyes just isn't brave enough, along with his other failings (And successes it has to be said, i.e. in the transfer market, but for me that is it, IMHO). That's why we will never win anything whilst he is here; that's simply not good enough for me or for my 12-year-old son who has never seen us win anything.
Peter Creer
53   Posted 24/05/2011 at 01:44:22

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There is no doubt in my mind that if David Moyes had some money he could push us on. To turn on the players and the manager is completely unfair. A fan supports the team. I am not sure if this website does that after looking at the negative content that consistently is posted and is then commented upon.

Do we need to improve? Of course. Is David Moyes the man to do it? Yes. Is money required? Absolutely.

The Everton spirit lives on in this team and we need to support that spirit.
Ray Roche
54   Posted 24/05/2011 at 07:22:58

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Robbie Shields

Rob, you say "The difference between them and us this season was that their manager went out to win every game, where we went out not to get beat in every game."

No, mate, the difference is that they could spend £56m on two forward players. We had to rely on a First Division freebie. And I'm not knocking Beckford here.

Gareth Humphreys
55   Posted 24/05/2011 at 08:34:46

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Michael ? you say "One amazingly consistent thing though is the number of games we lose over each of the last five seasons, which I think is key: 10, 11, 9, 9, 10... Average = 10. That's more than one-quarter!" The inference being that we lose too many games. Well looking at the above numbers ? we don't. We just don't turn enough draws into wins.

A strange statistic for you to miss for someone who (a) obviously likes his stats (b) continually states Moyes sets out team's not to lose (c) claims the number of games we lose is "key".

If you are going to bash DM with stats, it is probably easier to use ones which back up your argument as opposed to one's that you suddenly take a dislike to.

Neal Daniel
56   Posted 24/05/2011 at 10:24:54

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Michael # 43 - I think you're splitting hairs... of course whoever happens to be in the box alongside JB becomes his strike partner, for the past few games it has of course been Ozzie and JB or VA, but none of them seem to be gelling as a partnership. They do not seem to know where the other is or should be.

JB's 'strike or cross' against Chelski is a perfect example, was he shooting or was he passing? Ozzie was in a good position to take the ball and bury it in the back of the net, and on other occasions JB has been in the same place when Ozzie has had a crack.

The art of a good partnership surely has to be knowing when to pass and when to shoot, and we probably could have added a lot more goals and points had they solved that particular conundrum!!

I watched the 3 part video of Sharpy talking about his goals and his partners... didn't matter who it was, they adapted to each other... This is what, imho, DM needs to work on with the forward line, so they know where they should be at given plays. Ah well, shame we can't all be the manager as according to most of us we would do a better job from our armchairs!!

Gareth Humphreys
57   Posted 24/05/2011 at 13:42:01

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Robbie, I'm just pointing out that Michael's Key point actually isn't that important. Nothing more, nothing less.

Sad to see the miracle worker Dalglish line has been bought by you hook line and sinker. When he took over Liverpool were actually in 12th however why let facts ruin a good Dalglish is great story hey? Also they had above them (with games in hand) such teams as Stoke, Blackburn, Newcastle, Bolton & Sunderland ? who all had shocking 2nd half's to the season.

Oh and that worst group of players you have ever seen playing for Liverpool finished 2nd 2 seasons back.

Your other pearler about football favouring the brave ? where do I start? Well to kick off go and ask that question to Ian Holloway.

Could you have had any more holes in your argument?

Mark Kenyon
58   Posted 16/06/2011 at 22:17:27

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I'm not entirely sure what your problem is Rob - you need to be more explicit about your needs.

Or maybe I'm not asking the right questions?


All the best mate.

In terms of the Blues - the fixtures are out tomorrow and we all start on this merryground once again - and we all start from the same place as always - together.

Evertonians are Born not made.
We do not choose. We are chosen.

Those who understand need no explanation.
Those who don't understand do not matter.
Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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