Rangnick distances himself from Everton speculation

Looking forward to next year already COYB

I wonder how he would have done over the past four years with some meaningful resources at his disposal? I'm sure he could have done a lot better than Hodgson or Dalglish managed to do at Liverpool for example. Speculative I know, but I'm just trying to put things into perspective a bit.

Can we please be put out of our misery by the end of the week so I can go away on my Jollies in peace...I don't care who it is anymore I just want to be off death row.

And as Brendan said, he failed his brief anyway !!!!

http://www.thisisanfield.com/2012/05/roberto-martinezs-liverpool-fc-snub-explained/

It does look increasingly like he is going to accept our proposal though, I wish him all the luck in the world and hope he proves all the doubters wrong.

If Martinez is actually appointed, I will be still really looking forward to the new season with a certain amount of dread aswell, but his teams do play lovely attacking football and he has been a bit of a magician in the transfer market for Wigan. A much more inspiring appointment then someone like Stubbs or Weir but still a major cause for concern

Ring fenced money, stadium safety certificates, virtually free stadium and..........we interviewed many talented managers but my gutt instinct was always with Alan Stubbs!

Martinez isn't my first choice, but he deserves to be on the shortlist. He reduced Wigan's wage bill by 22% and spent £10m less on transfer fees than Paul Jewell and Steve Bruce. Everton have the tenth highest wage bill in the Premier League. Wigan, on the other hand, are 17th in the wage bill league. By finishing 18th, you could argue that Martinez underachieved this season. However, using this logic, you could also argue that Moyes underachieved when he finished 17th and 11th!!

Yes and have since the start.

For BK NOT to go for the cheapest and most easy to manipulate will imo be astounding.

If the board choose either of them you would have to assume they possess the necessary leadership qualities, tactical nouce and coaching ability!

And the only worry about Martinez is if he messes around with our defence. He is known to play wings backs and three centre backs. If he does that then that will be worse than anything Stubbs could do.

If however, he keeps same back four and just concentrates on the attacking side of our game, we will be ok

http://www.football.co.uk/wigan_athletic/martinez_frustrated_by_injury_crisis_rss3638686.shtml

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/next-everton-manager-ralf-rangnick-1926316

Im sorry, I think it shows a massive lack of ambition and imagination if we appoint him, we should be trying to get managers in with a track record of winning games not losing them !

He has distanced himself since that!

"Why would Stubbs and Weir be a concern?"

Sorry, are you taking the piss?

You yourself say "..there's also nothing negative you could say about them based on any managerial evidence"

True - BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO FUCKING MANAGERIAL EXPERIENCE.

(I have absolutely no dental experience, want me to remove your molars?)

Then there's..

"If the board choose either of them you would have to assume they possess the necessary leadership qualities, tactical nouce and coaching ability!"

Oh yes, absolutely, definitely, without a SHADOW of a doubt!

I mean the idea of our board fucking up is simply ludicrous.

Jeeeeeeeesus WEPT!

Then I revert to my normal state of Bill / Everton, yeah right, in a pigs ear cynicism.

My head still thinks that Bill will have an each way yankie bet from 4 options.

1st The Internal candidate, 2nd Martinez, 3rd Periera, 4th Rangnick.

If 2, 3 and 4 don't come up he will still get his money back on the Internal Candidate, The Banker, who if all else fails will be ambitious enough to sit and wait for his fate to be decided by the actions of others... the, as I said on another thread...Stubbs ( or whoever ) is the leader in the Clubhouse and the rest are still out on the course and it's their tournament / Job to lose or turn down.

And there will be Grinning Billy to present the Claret Jug / poison Chalice... The Blue Jacket ( or knowing Bill a cheap old costume from Joseph and his amazing Technicolour dreamcoat ).

We are waiting to see who turns it down and who is lastman standing.

I don't know which is worse, the fact that we will get someone who falls for Bill's Bullshit or some one who will do it despite the Bullshit.

I did say that the reason you could not say anything negative about them was because they had no experience and the pt being, there are lots of negatives about Martinez. We just have no idea weather Stubbs would be good or bad so keep an open mind!

As far as the board is concerned generally I would not trust them. They may not want to spend big on transfers, sell assets to make money, sell our best players, etc etc... but its in their interest more than mine, yours, or anyone elses, that they get the best man for job.

Also, do you really think Stubbs or anyone else with a decent knowledge of game couldn't keep Everton in top 8? Name 8 teams with a better squad than ours?

As for your pathetic dentist analogy, well all I can say is you must be a shite footballer yourself. If you think football management is as complicated as dentistry, or some sort of rocket science only very few people can understand. A magical mystical voodoo only bispecticled foreigners can grasp then its not the beautiful game or universal language everyone says it is.

I believe it's down luck, money, players at disposal, motivation and leadership. And yes your right experience definitely helps. Not sure martinezs experience of generally crap performances is any good though!

Stubbs has all his coaching badges, was a leader on pitch as a player, played the game at the highest level and worked under Moyes. So it's more like he's finished his dentists degree. Done a couple of fillings already and the odd cap.

We would all rather have an experienced 10 year Hollywood dentist fly over and work on our teeth, but sometimes you can't afford one. Or they don't like flying. But if there is a new up and coming local dentist who is bright, intelligent, confident and who's comes recommended, well you might just use him.

See its not just you who can use shit metaphors, night night!

In fact I am struggling to think of a club where Martinez wasn't the worst manager.

Question 1 – If Wigan hadn't won the FA Cup, would you be considering Martinez?
Question 2 – If your answer is Yes... Why?
Question 3 – If your answer to Question 1 is still Yes, is your answer to Question 2 a good enough reason to give him the best available job in British Football? (The Chelsea and Man City jobs are poison chalices.)

If your answer is still Yes, I am missing something.

Tony Marsh you work for BK don't you? Like the writing the scipts yours always turn out so dramatic. Have you considered writing for the Clone Wars animated series? They could use some tension in their opening narratives. Everton pull yourself together we don't have to wait until Moyes the manc is gone before naming our manager.

He knows how to get his teams playing attractive football, while I appreciate that defensive exposure was coupled with this (at Wigan) but let's not forget the squad assembled on a shoestring he was working with!

One positive on his CV is that he knows how to beat the Top Teams on a fairly regular basis. I am fairly confident with Everton's set up and staff he could import that facet! I would definitely think he is worth being allowed to take the reins!

I am like all Everton fans, unfortunately with ridiculous expectations, thinking on one hand that we have some god-given right to be challenging further up the league and then getting depressed when we fail. On the other hand, we did play some fantastic football this year. We did finish above the Red Shite again and we have a really good base for Martinez to build on.

Let's get behind him and accept that there will be a few hiccups along the way.

All season, some on here have been criticising DM and calling for his head because he was not adventurous enough; it looks like you have got your wish with RM so let's give him the chance to move us into the team that can take on the big boys, leave the defensive side to one of our many defensive coaches, and let's see the team play the game....

I personally can't wait... COYB

Yes - weeks ago.....

I genuinely think we'll get an announcement within next 48 hours. If not this really will have gone beyond a joke, it's nearly 4 weeks now since Moyes was appointed Man Utd manager.

You could almost write a textbook 'On Changing Manager'...

Chapter 1 - How to Do It by Man Utd

Chapter 2 - How Not to Do It by Everton

Opening line to Chapter 1: 'Knowing Ferguson had to retire at some point, Manchester United drew up and agreed a clear strategy on what to do when that inevitability arose....'

Opening line to Chapter 2: 'Despite clear signs from Moyes that he may not sign a new contract at the end of the season, Everton put their heads firmly in the sand and hoped it would all go away...'

I'm praying Bill comes up trumps but when you consider he didnt plan for this no wonder the Kings Docks fell through and his '24/7' hunt for investment has been fruitless. I'd be surprised if he can take himself to the loo unassisted.

One thing I will give him credit for is he has fronted this himself and made it appear, if nothing else, that it's his decision - rather than a decision by committee.

In which cash the buck stops with you Bill...

...... and surely even you should know by now......?

There's other candidates who I'd rather see it offered to, but I'm not devastated about it.

A sense of underwhelmed relief.

Manure knew SAF would retire sometime soon, so they had a plan in place.

Everton knew six months or more ago, that Moyes was stalling on a new contract and we ToffeeWebbers said they (the Board) will surely have a plan/shortlist for sucession.

We were wrong!!!

In times of uncertainty you have to stick with what you know. Our squad is good enough to stay in the prem; I know people will point to west ham and too good to go down but Alan Smith is spot on anyone with half a decent footballing knowledge should be able to manage Everton to a top half finish.

The question then is more about rebuilding, the stability created under Moyes has given us 1/2 seasons where we can bring in younger players and replace some of the more mature, a slow programme should result in a better squad which should be fighting for a top 4 finish.

I am happy with all 3 choices mentioned, all offer a slight change in direction without being a major reshuffle. Many have pointed to Martinez's ability to bring in good players for low wages. Although taking out one quality player for 3 ok ones with potential does strengthen the squd at the expense of diluting the team for at least 2/3 seasons. But Everton don't have the cash to go and buy 3 or 4 quality players, so building has to be the way to do it. So does that Martinez the perfect fit?

One of the big questions in the footballing world has been how good is Moyes, and how good is Martinez? So with Moyes the point always argued on ToffeeWeb was Moyes was: argument one; Moyes is amazing, if he had the backing if the board (with money) he would be winning something/be in the top 4. Agreement 2: Moyes is rubbish and a bottler, big games he bottles, his record against the top sides is poor, he should have won something I.e. a cup. Moyes going to Man U answers the debate, he fails then people were right he is a bottler, he wins and others we right if only he had money. The same arguments are true of Martinez, people say look at his team, the football they play. He is a builder, look at other teams he has managed. He is a winner look at the FA cup. Others say he is a nightmare, look at his defence, look at his ability to change games, to sure things up. Look at Wigan and were they are playing next year.

But I think given we have a squad which should manage a top 10 finish then we are in a position where we could take a risk on Martinez. If he messes it up, then we can move on, now moving on might prove harder, but I think Martinez offers us hope of getting something, something that Moyes, love him or hate him, removed, Moyes made us stable, Martinez will make us move but the question is which way. I am willing to take the risk and see.

Derek, I'd like to see the stats that show Martinez beating the top teams regularly. Without even glancing at the records, I'd guess that he's had far more trouncings than results.

Again, without reference to stats, I'd say our record against say, the other 5 clubs above us would be better than most.

Completely underwhelmed by this appointment. I can't believe we're going with a guy with close to the worst Prem record around. We're a top 6 side, FFS! Oh well, guess we support him and hope for the best.

This would be a manager who for about half of that time was with another club.

Everton have not, to my knowledge, mentioned any manager's name during this process.

All that's being said is that is that there's a list and that it's right to take their time when making a decision.

I sincerely hope this happens soon but all of the above would just go to show hos silly little Tony Tantrum's arguments are.

If we'd had a quick appointment of Pip or Stubbs then BK would have rushed it and done it on the cheap. Less than five fuckin' weeks lads and we're whinging cos WE decided to read the rags and soak up what they tell us.

As for the appointment as a whole - BK needs to do this today, because Chelsea are about to appoint Mourinho on Wednesday (allegedly) and if true, it'll take all the headlines and the Everton appointment will be a mere footnote.

PR exercise Everton Manager needs to start today.

I have to say, off all the name bandied about Rangnick really sounded promising to me. Good experience and a good philosophy with a plan for the future (if the tabloids are to be believed).

Hopefully this will all get resolved soon and we can get back to moaning about the lack of a investment in the club...

People seem to point at the cup win as being such an achievement, and it was, but a good manager needs to be able to see it through for a leaguer season, and he's failed to do that every year in my opinion.

He flatters to deceive with his smiling demeanour and 'honesty' but smiles & honesty don't win football matches and neither do Martinez' teams. 6 wins a season under him is simply not good enough.

I don't see any reason why he should be allowed anywhere near Everton.

Is this a precursor to a bombshell later today?

He's also only 39 which I don't think is right for us. Trouble is, he's a bit of a yes-man and that suits BK down to the ground.

Lunchtime today apparently we'll hear something......I'm not holding my breath!

Granted, nine wins is nothing to write home about. But when Wigan's stature and budget is taken into account in comparison to some of the bigger teams they were fighting with (West Ham, Birmingham, Newcastle, Sunderland, Stoke etc...) I think this is a respectable record.

Also, it is his chairman, the fans and the media that are bigging him up, not the man himself. I don't recall RM saying he is a "special one"!

I want to know who the new manager will be as much as anyone else, but am willing to wait.

My mistake (pal), it was 9 a season - either way, you're the only person I've seen defending such a shocking record.

6 or 9 is awful by anyone's standards and the guy just isn't good enough no matter which way you paint it.

I don't think I claimed he'd called himself anything in the press either, but he does have a high opinion of himself - even moreso now they've won the cup.

I've not heard anyone give me one good reason why he should be Everton manager and you haven't either.

He wouldn't would he???

James, by your logic (he's been relegated, don't allow him near our club), Bobby Robson (who was relegated with fulham) who played a very aggressive and progressive type of football just like Martinez would never have got a job with us, Jurgen Klopp (Dortmund) similar also to Martinez would never have been taken on?

Both of these managers have not played 'normal' or 'standard' football and have been revolutionary in their time, Martinez is of their type and just like him (and also Bobby Robson and Jurgen Klopp) we have to be prepared to "roll the dice" if we want to win anything.

If BK does hire him I'll be suprised and happy, I really don't think BK has it in him!

We don't have many options, Who do you want?

People who don't want him in charge better hope he accepts the job if you don't want an 'internal' appointment.

My logic has nothing to do with Bobby Robson or Jurgen Klopp, and everything to do with Roberto Martinez!

He's a terrible manager in my opinion.

Yet again, you (and everyone else) have failed to come up with even one convincing reason why he should get the job. Progressive? He got relegated last season in case you missed that bit and they struggled every year under him.

I just don't see any good reasons to appoint him.

Answer my question please, who else is there?

I don't agree that it is a shocking record when you take into account the team he was in charge of. Every season most pundits have predicted Wigan would be in a relegation scrap. I know its difficult to defend a manager who's team has just been relegated, but I believe he has much more to offer than some of the other candidates and his record has to be put into a bit of perspective. The Robson and Klopp comparisons are valid in my opinion.

We can argue until we are blue in the face. Where you see only failure I see potential. Ultimately neither of us can make the decision, so why expend any more energy arguing? I guess I just want to try and plant the seed of optimism in the minds of RM pessimists, especially so if he is appointed as our new boss. If this happens I hope that all Evertonians would give him a chance to prove himself. I'm sure you all would. I'd hate to see banners like the 'Hughes out' ones at Stoke from day one.

I just hope we get a decision today!

Who else is there? Rangnick.

fair enough mate - I agree, no point arguing about it, but we all have an opinion, doesn't make any of us right as it's all speculative anyway.

I wouldn't ever campaign against anyone and will support whoever gets the job - I just would prefer it not to go to a manager that's walked away from a team that got relegated.

If nothing else it would show more ambition to go for a man that was a winner.

Whichever way people dress it up, Martinez has come from a losing team (cup win aside)

If you took the time to read through the pages here you will find many posts by fans who have put together reasoned arguments as to why RM would be a suitable manager. You might not agree with all of their points, but to say there is not even one convincing reason is totally untrue.

I would post a list of reasons why I believe he is a good candidate, but I think TWebers must be sick of hearing them by now. Also, some of the reason I and others want RM has to be our gut feeling. It is very hard to convince someone else whose gut instinct is telling them the opposite. I respect your opinion, and I'm not saying you are wrong about Rangnick or Pereira, but I have to defend my choice if he is being rubbished.

He was was offered the Liverpool & Villa jobs. Now, we like to think we know more than the pro's inside the game, but we don't really, do we? He would not have been even considered if he was 'terrible' would he?

Martinez has just won the F.A. Cup with a starting line up worth £12.8m, compared to the average City player being worth £16.6m.

He is only 39, and is still yet to reach his potential.

Martinez is a qualified physio, and has a degree in business management - he is no fool.

His relegated side were missing 8 first team players some weeks, mostly consisting of defenders.

His has an excellent record in the transfer market, and an in-depth knowledge of European Leagues.

He is considered to play expansive, attacking football, with many different formations.

His win % as a professional manager is 50%.

He has been managing a club with the worst support in the division.

They are just a few snippets I have read about him in the last couple of weeks.

By the way - Even Wenger was relegated with AS Nancy.

Ragnick is not coming, it's a none starter (a dodo), he's publicly (and emphatically) distanced himself from us.

Is there someone else you think would do a good job with us (Periera also seems to be drifting away now)??

Not all managers who get relegated are bad and not all people who have setbacks in other areas bad at what they do.

Wenger relegated, didn't know that.

And so there's another top notch manager who's learned from his mistakes - excellent!

I just hope BK is reading what where typing, I have this nasty feeling we're going to end up with a Pulis/Stubbs dream team.

Things might be happening?

He has Premier League experience...in failing and being relegated.

That said, I can see his good points. Attacking play and what have you. I just can't get over how bad that Wigan side were!

With regard to the likely man, Martinez, I would say it could be better - but could be worse. He seems to be the complete opposite of Moyes, which is good in some ways, but not in others.

I would've liked to see what Ragnick and the German 'blueprint' may have done for the club, but it appears this is not going to happen.

Fair enough, some decent points there - I still can't get my head round us appointing a manager that has a losing record though I'm afraid.

His weekly apologies for his team being hammered every week, just put me off.

He doesn't fill me with any confidence

I think Martinez will fly with our squad. There will be no white flag at Anfield with Martinez.

I think he is a progressive manager...and implemented a good strategy which was evolved by subsequent managers at Swansea...but I am concerned by the way he has set Wigan up over an extended period. The comparisons with Robson etc are irrelevant and reductive...any manager could be excused, by suggesting a past great struggled in his initial career... I would like to know why Martinez has consistently failed to implement an even semi-effective defensive strategy...and why he has failed to motivate his team in matches against similarly placed opposition, and in the early months of the season.

Try and remember that Wigan side were expected to get beat every time they went onto the pitch. Imagine how difficult it would have been going to Anfield and Old Trafford.

When any team steps out at G.P. - they are expected to win. As far as I am concerned, the whole Wigan set-up was Championship at best.

He could quite easily signed a load of cloggers, and probably stayed up, just as Pulis has proven.

The fact he didn't take the easy route should be looked upon as a positive.

Only in our modern world could saccharine PR smiles make up for lack of substance (and results!) ... really sad.

Looked at the scores for the Top 5 this year in the last 4 years Martinez has been at Wigan, interesting reading.

40 games, 6 wins, 5 draws, 29 defeats - For - 23 Against - 107

Man U (Wigan's score first) 0-4, 0-4, 0-5, 1-0, 0-2, 0-4, 0-5, 0-5

City - 0-2, 0-1, 0-3, 0-1, 0-2, 0-1, 1-1, 0-3

Chelsea - 0-2, 1-4, 1-2, 1-1, 0-6, 0-1, 3-1, 0-8

Arsenal - 1-0, 1-4, 0-4, 2-1, 2-2, 0-3, 0-4, 3-2

Spuds - 1-0, 2-2, 1-2, 1-3, 1-0, 0-0, 1-9, 0-3.

Not really consistently beating them, is he?

Al, when you say straight from the horse's mouth, you actually mean straight from Dave Whelan's mouth. The man's a compulsive liar and Martinez/Liverpool have both since put the record straight that he was NOT offered the job at Anfield. It was just more bollocks from Dave Whelan, as part of his quest to make Martinez as expensive as possible when he leaves.

Kevin - his brief was to stay in the Premier League - he failed. To me that says everything but I respect your choice if you think he's the right man for the job.

I don't claim to be right, I just don't feel it on any level.

That is actually terrifying.

I think I'm close to throwing my support behind Stubbs.

I can't believe we're entertaining the thought of a manager who cops beatings like that. That's not a lesser standard if defender available - it's an absolute shambles.

What a crock of press bullshit.

Remember Mike Walker...

Yet again, Everton will be the loser. He might even do OK for 18 months or so - but he will fail - because that's what he does. Championship football with a League or FA Cup is totally unacceptable for us.

I see Wherlan is depserate for the 2m, having initially told Relegation Roberto that we weren't big enough. It's all very ugly. On top of that, he says publicly that Martinez feels he isn't up to the job of bringing Wigan back up. Sheesh ...

Is Kenwright listening and processing all these clues - but really?

Brace yourself.......

Does all this mean Moyes will never win at the usual suspects with Utd because he couldn't do it with us?

Clearly Martinez has got to produce a much improved defensive record if he is our manager, but more will be expected from him all round.

Bookies rarely get these things wrong so until Martinex drifts out significantly or someone else moves a long way in the opposite direction, my belief is that Martinez has the job - if he wants it. Other names keep coming up as 'favourite' but thats just their odds changing significantly whilst Martinez still remains odds on.

My fear is that if he says no, BK will go internal.

I think Doddy has probably called it in post #637, Whelan and Kenwright are haggling over the price now, then I guess it's done...

Dennis - my fear is that BK will do a "Leroy Fer" with Martinez, never really want him but call him in to satisfy the fans and then make it hard for him to sign for us (terms etc).

We'll could end up with a Pulis/Stubbs dream team.

The longer panto Billy drags this one out the pessemistic I feel.

Lets just see who's appointed and give the guy a chance to see what he can do before we start bashing him before a ball has even been kicked. Everton have a much better defence than Wigan, a far larger wage bill and larger transfer budget. We're a bigger platform so he'll either succeed or he won't - like any other manager. On the plus side, if he comes then there's a good chance we'll get the likes of Maloney and Mcmanamen from Wigan, which would be a great boost to our midfield.

I (for one) got my wish about Moyes leaving, I'll at least be positive until (and if) the new man proves me wrong.

Everton Football Club are in a totally different context to Wigan. For a start, Everton's preferred back four are comprised of full internationals, two of which started against Brazil last night. It's hardly comparable to galoots like Ronnie Stam and Garry Caldwell really is it?

Give the guy a chance.

COYB.

That's a pretty big continental name.

sky is still offering 29, I know the odds are tight as it is, but there's many a betting pro will still see those as good odds, if it was about to happen (big IF).

Just have a look at odds for Morinho/Chelski and Pellegrini/Siteh.

However should Martinez fail spectacularly I could see him bringing down Bill with him. Which wouldn't be a bad thing in the long run. Every cloud and that...

One goal in total against Man City (in the league) and only one against United too.

Shocking stats.

On the other hand, better than Stubbs or Pip

Not saying he'll win those games now, but that wouldn't exactly be taking us backwards would it.

40 games, 6 wins, 5 draws, 29 defeats - For - 23 Against - 107

Man U (Wigan's score first) 0-4, 0-4, 0-5, 1-0, 0-2, 0-4, 0-5, 0-5

City - 0-2, 0-1, 0-3, 0-1, 0-2, 0-1, 1-1, 0-3

Chelsea - 0-2, 1-4, 1-2, 1-1, 0-6, 0-1, 3-1, 0-8

Arsenal - 1-0, 1-4, 0-4, 2-1, 2-2, 0-3, 0-4, 3-2

Spuds - 1-0, 2-2, 1-2, 1-3, 1-0, 0-0, 1-9, 0-3.

Not really consistently beating them, is he?

--------------------------------------------

looks just like Moyes' record vs Sky4 in his first few seasons. Would be interesting to compare.

Like I say I'm not into my 'Dad's, cousin's, dog's mate told me this' stories and it probably is rubbish but I wonder what people would make of it if it was true?

Yes I do - but just saying if it did go to shit. It could be the final nail for Billy.

If it does turn out to be true, I'll be the one responsible for everyone getting home late tonight while the police negotiator talks me down off the Rocket flyover on Queens Drive.

Martinez has had 4 years to fix the defence but couldn't and we will need to replace Distin sooner rather than later - unfortunately, because he is immense. Can Roberto mould a new defensive partnership? Evidence is to the contrary... dramatically so. He's not going to have more money at Everton than he had at Wigan.

I've seen some people saying that because Martinez is a physio he doesn't suffer so many injuries and now apparently he was only relegated because his entire team was knackered.

Martinez out! :D

My apologies for questioning where you are with the blues, it's just that same thing is happening with Martinez as did with DM, he's divided us down the middle.

Unlike DM though, he's yet to set foot on the training ground or manage a game and so he's innocent of any wrong doing, but there still seems to be a some on here who've taken a dislike to him.

I've lost faith in BK, he must have known who he really wanted before DM left, he was aware of what was happening and now he's laid on this 5 week panto for us, I'm pissed of with him.

Might have been interesting him and Ragnick butting heads in front of the fans.

Though something tells me Billy will want to create as much theatre as possible on this one.

74 days to go!!!

Understood and agree. RM should be at least given 2-3 years to stamp his mark.

To those who wished to see the back of Moyes for the sake of change. Well you have your wish. No guarantees of any more success but there is change afoot and I feel this appointment will have an enormous impact on the club - one way or another.

If RM had kept Wigan up there'd be less squablling about his credentials.3 points difference may have been enough and more here would be excited about a potential new boss who while very young has won silverware with a club that is barely even football league let alone Premier League. And he did it playing good football on a shoestring budget.

Have I been in a coma?

Where does the bus go on the tour of the City?

How do you define success - Winning trophies or regularly finishing much higher than your net spend would entitle you to?

Clearly the old definition of success e.g. winning cups is largely out of the question for EFC. Which brings us to the new definition of success - merely punching above our weight.

I would also say getting into the CL would be considered success.

Finishing 6th was a good season – but I would much rather win a Cup & finish 8th/9th.

Some are happy with a good League finish, I suppose it's all down to the individual really.

Whoever we get in, I hope we can see confidence throughout the team, some good flowing football. Good signings, and hopefully a pot or two in the next 5 years. (CL would be fantastic.)

The Martinez equivalent in his interview was probably "attack", but maybe should be one of the ones you've suggested.

Seems that will be the lasting legacy of David Moyes — how Everton must be perceived for some of our fans...

Unbelievable.

On Friday (Day 22) he'd got as far as taking Martinez, Periera and Rangnick out of the pack and kept looking at them one by one (with a mock up "Internal Candidate" card with a grey, cluedo head and "Phil / David / Alan" scribbled on it)

'Hhhmm... no..." puts card down and picks next one up.

"Hhhmmm.....no...." puts card down and holds all three up together.

"Hhmmmm.....oh....I don't know! Jenny....!"

Puts shoes on to take dogs for a walk.

Today (Day 25), after wasting a whole weekend playing these three candidates off against each other Bill has decided to put them back into the pack and started dealing the pack out again in the formation of "Old Maid" (Bills favourite game)....

'Fergie....no....retired'
'Mourinho...I wish....going to Chelsea anyway....'
'Redknapp.....won't got north of Watford.....'
'Capello.....too grumpy.....'
'Ancelotti....too expensive....'
'David Moyes....YES! Oh, bugger....no....can't have him..."

Puts pack back down, sighs and puts shoes on to take dogs for another walk. Dogs leap up, fit as fiddles, they've never known it so good.....

Phil, there's never any guarantees.

You could give the 'special one' the job and he may completely fuck up without Romans billions to spend.

Although we are going to see the above assertion in reverse, DM's gone to a wealthy club from a poor one, let's see what happens.

As for Roberto, he likes to throw punches and not cover up on the ropes. His punch power will go up with us, let's hope he chins them before they chin us!!! And if you are going to win things you've got to throw punches!

Exciting times eh?

Which trophy should we be regularly winning? Would winning the League cup every year make us significantly richer or more attractive to the top players? Would it change the club in any significant manner? No, it would just give us fans something to rub in the faces of the RS. A little bit of pride and nothing more.

I agree that true success is winning major silverware. However given the way our club has been setup and run (from the boardroom down). I would feel (reluctantly) 5th place finishes but playing more attractive football as being success.

Of course I want us in the CL etc etc...but do you honestly expect us to do that?

Kevin, I cant be arsed digging out the stat that shows that even the domestic cups have been largely dominated by the sky 4 and City over the last 15 years.

A freak year this season with two unfashionables winning?

Sad fact of modern football - you make the Champions League, you get more money, you get better players.

End of story.

Winning cups doesn't necessarily help any more.

The minimum mandate should be Europa League football every season. And the Manager must try to get us into the Champion's league. Anything less, and it's more of the same from what we had with Moyes.

If the club or team stands still, we will spiral into free fall with possible relegation.

The next manager absolutely must take us beyond this glass ceiling Moyes hit, anything less has to be considered a failure. Money or not, we need to have ambition and it needs to start showing from next season, regardless of who comes into manage.

Even at London prices, that's a lot of fish supper's!

I'm not saying I want McClaren, but if he's a wind-up then what the fuck is Martinez???

Whether we like the Europa League or not, it does benefit us with the seed points.

In the absence of Rangnick, I'm still hoping that Vitor P gets a look in. I fear though that Bill is sitting on his backside. Even the meeting with RM in the lobby of the Landmark was so cack-handed - almost as if he's so proud to be associated with a 'great guy' like 'Bobby'.

Dreadful and embarrassing ...

The fact that Sir Neville and Lord Howard have come out and said unequivocally he shouldn't be appointed says it all. Fellow professionals don't usually say such things.

Apologies for the profusion of posts. I don't want Martinez so much it hurts.

One thing I would expect from the new manager is a much better cup performance. I don't expect us to win every year but at least compete and get to the latter stages regulary (as used to be the case), in order to have a chance of winning. And yes, if we regulary got to the latter stages and won every now and again, whilst still finishing in the top half, I believe we would attract better players. Add to that the rumours that FIFA are going to allow the winner of the Europa league entry into the CL in the future, so as to revive the Europa league.

Some people may no longer rate the domestic cups but a medal is a medal and it gets you into Europe. At the end of the day in 10-20 years time no one is going to talk about or give a shit that we finished 6th/7th/8th/9th etc - however people will talk about cup finals, titles and trophies for decades. Winning also impresses young minds and leads to growing the fanbase (there are a lot of mid 30s to early 40s EFC fans who started supporting the club at a young age simply because of the success in the 80's.) So yes the cups are important, imo, and we should be doing a lot better than being knocked out by the likes of Oldham, Leeds, Reading, Fulham, Birmingham, Shresbury, Blackburn, Wigan etc.

You say this year was a freak year and you are right, I don't think we will ever get an easier run to the FA Cup final ever again!

Everton to play the Martinez way, of fast flowing football is likely to come at some cost. We have a number of aging players, who pace seems to have deserted them. To play fast attacking football, would require investment into the team from day one.

I am more concerned about what he would do to change the current team setup?

It is very evident we are in need of a better striker than Jelly, regardless what anyone says. I mean seriously if he is still here come the start of the season, and he is still in no goal scoring mode, it would detrimentally affect us. Therefore we need someone that can do the business, there are number of options from spain, especially in the current economic climate, where clubs are going to have to let players go at minimum cost, just so they can pull themselves out of debt and not get banned from playing in Europe the following season.

I am just very concerned, he will get it all wrong, simply because our method of playing is drastically different from his own vision.

I don't think we'd go down with Martinez, but then on the other hand, what if he decided to sell Bainsey and Jags to buy some mere paper weights?

Maybe he would do a fantastic job and just needs to be given a chance, perhaps what he significantly lacked at Wigan he would have here, especially defensively.

In summary we need an overhaul of some of the players, we need to get rid of the aging and bring in younger , better players..that could be got from spain as in above.

I fear Kenwright's prorities (someone he can laugh and cry with) are different from those of the fans (a manager who ensures, first and foremost that we don't get relegated and one who brings us CL football and trophies and who resurrects the School of Science to some extent). Herein lies the core of the problem of the envisaged appointment of Relegation Roberto.

Not going to put the results in again. Record is 8 wins, 9 draws and 23 defeats, with a goals for of 34 and against of 71.

Martinez would be a sidestep at best.

From what I can gather the charge against Martinez, is that he kept a team largely consisting of shit no-bodies in the premier league for several seasons, where he was up against teams which had a lot more cash in almost every case.

The fact he kept them up for several seasons WHILE playing good football and losing his most saleable assets each season, and having to make premier league players out of David Moyes rejects like McManaman is a testament to the guys' abilities.

If the limit of (y)our ambition is to avoid relegation, then lets get Steve Clarke in, who is a David Moyes Mark 2 as far as I can fathom. Then we can be difficult to beat and well organised and mid-table. Personally I think we need a coach who can operate within a small budget, has the confidence to send a cut-price team out against richer clubs and win. Just like Martinez had to do to get Wigan an FA Cup win.

Don't forget he also won a league title with Swansea before joining Wigan, which proves he's not a one-hit-wonder in terms of his cup success.

Irrelevant of who knocks EFC out of the cups. The eventual winners are usually those clubs I mentioned previous. Even beating minnows and avoiding shocks - the odds are we'll come across one of the top 5 eventually who'll beat us.

BTW if UEFA truly wanted to revitalise the Europa League they'd start by rebalancing the chasm sized difference in TV & Prize money they offer to each competition. Offering a CL place to the winners of the EL is another insult to the rest of the European clubs.

So what should we do. Focus on the League Cup in the hope we avoid one of the big 5 and any shocks? Then get into the EL and play the required 25 extra games required to win that. Hopfully avoiding any big european clubs or CL dropouts. Then if we're really lucky and still have eleven fit players. We'll win that and get in the Qualifiers of the CL three seasons later. Sounds like a plan to me. Oh and we'll do it playing great football and finish top 6 consistently.

Theres a perception that Clarke did well but I think this is skewed by his win against us and double against Liverpool. He ended up a full 14 points behind us.

We go to Wembley, we get some silverware, we get success, we get to play in Europe the next season. We win the Europa League, we get to play in the Champions League.

Winning cups does help... A LOT.

Good luck with getting that sorted in the near future!

Reality check.

What do people think now?

Is Bill negotiating compensation for Martinez with Dave Whelan?

Pereira is rumoured to have been offered a new contract at Porto. So are we waiting on his decision?

Any other thoughts?

Thats about it though, Mark.

Still want Martinez but all of this sounds too convenient for me.

If and English club was to win the Champions League and in the event Everton where to win the Europa cup, Everton would automatically join the group stage of the champions league. This is the holy grail for teams like Everton who have no money.

The point of UEFA going this route, is to increase advertising for the competition, this will happen because a very important lucrative place in the Champs League is up for grabs. It will increase the profile of the Europa League which means more money going into for all teams.

With the end result, the competition will be financially worth taking part in. As for it being an insult to other european teams, I couldn't care less about. All I am interested in is EFC. In the long run the Europa League could well generate a hell of a of money, especially for teams who look at it as financial waste of space.

Europa League is 17 games to the final not 25. As for avoiding big teams? Let's not bother, how about we get relegated to the bottom tier, would you be happy then? Just think, we don't have to win the league, nor should we even bother entering any cup competition just in case someone should knock us out of the competition.

You sound like you don't remotely care at all what happens to this club.

Have a bit of confidence, go on your holidays or something, recharge your batteries.

I am not sure I see your conspiracy theory regarding this. If the Porto boss was making up his mind, and if he had been interviewed by bill, and he decided to accept the job, then he would have to resign.

That being said, it's likely that the porto boss is off to Malaga. I doubt Martinez fits the bill down at Malaga, who could still find themselves in Europe next season after and appeal. You don't just go from Pellegrini to Martinez, it's like 20 giant steps backwards

>
An amateur player in his teens with hometown club Espinho, UD Oliveirense, AA Avanca and Fiães SC, Pereira took a degree in physical education before starting his coaching career as Porto Under-15 trainer in 2003.

I wonder if RM would play second fiddle to him before taking over at a future point in time?

It's looking increasingly likely that Martinez is not getting the job, Whelan has kept quiet (Thank God!) for the last week and nothing has been announced so far by Everton nor has Martinez himself or his agent to confirm or to deny the speculation.

Anyway, if we do get him, we are getting someone who has been RELEGATED the previous season, really shows our ambition doesn't it?
Montainier, Periera, Bielsa, all out of contract in the summer and we are paying £2million for a man who has a 28% win percentage in the PL.

That is a frankly abysmal record, and he apparently told Whelan he wasn't good enough to get Wigan out of the Championship, and he could be coming here. It's absolutely laughable but what do you expect from this circus in charge?

I doubt that Bill knows what he is doing and this is becoming increasingly evident particularly over the last few days. Expect more names to be rolled out, I expect he will wait for our ex manager to officially leave before announcing it so he doesn't have two managers on the payroll.

This Martinez malarkey will hit a snag, we are skint so how can we pay up the £2million + the backroom staff as well? I hope that Bill is waiting for Pereira so we can get him for free rather than paying up £2million for what will be a very poor and uninspiring appointment.

.Yes, we will get attacking football next season, but Martinez has done absolutely nothing to improve his defensive side, which as we know is shocking. Drew Shortis says he has met his requirements, which was to stay up, but remind me, where did he finish last season? Oh yes, 18th.

. Even the media are fed up and aren't bothering to report it, so you might as well announce it now Bill as the fans and Fleet Street are getting increasingly tired.

I hope, as Marshy says, that this isn't some bravado and lying by Mr Chairman before rolling out Stubbs as the next manager.

Er no, can't for the life of me see Martinez as a no.2 to anyone. Nor should he, unless it's learn more about defending!

Pereira for me.

James we'll be lucky to get Kendall the way panto Billy playing this one, Colin Harvey looks more likely mate!

Also, the way it is organised, it is like a mini me CL and it is played on the Thursday, second fiddle to the Champions League. If they made it a pure knockout competition and maybe increased the prize money to £40million, it might be more popular. The reason no one cares about the Europa, is because UEFA don't care about the Europa.

Oh, by the way, the Porto chairman has just confirmed that Pereira will NOT be Porto coach next season. Is BK waiting for Pereira after all?

That fucking panto dame has got so much to answer for.

I just can't see us ending up finishing in a Champs League spot any time in the near future, unless we ended up on an insane league run. It's the next best thing. In the long run, it could make us the money we need to compete. That being said, we need to first get into either European competitions lol

I'm noticing an interesting correlation of people here between affirmed members of the Moyes Out Brigade and the Martinez Can't Defend Club.

MOB is now MCDC.

But hang on, wasn't one of the cornerstones of the MOB that Moyes was too defensive? Now the MCDC want someone who can organise a defence......

That slippery BK has got everyone confused again! ( except himself you can be sure of that )

I can see this dragging on for some time.

http://www.nsno.co.uk/everton-news/2013/06/new-manager-announced-tomorrow/

Fucking drivel.

Seriously you think UEFA give two shits about the Europa League? The sheer strain it puts on the squad and for what? Not a lot of money and only if you win -will you be guaranteed a CL qualifier place. So two seasons of toil (and no doubt immense luck) for a shot at getting into the group stages. Hardly something you can bank on is it?

(and please don't question my loyalty to Everton).

I think we are all fast becoming active members of KNOBEND

Kenwright's New Online Bluenose Enforced Neverending Drivel

As someone said earlier, only Everton could do this to their fans!

Luckily we have quite a strong defensive players at Everton so shipping goals in a la Wigan shouldn't be an issue !!

Welcome to the School of Science Roberto. Your style will for right in with our club.

The bullfighter working for the bullshitter!

Hasta la victoria siempre !

Good luck Roberto.

Oh, and bring McManaman with you for our right hand side !