Martinez concerned over Mirallas

Players who didn't use shin pads, who would play on through injury, broken bones etc... Nowadays, they fall over or get a knock on the head and they almost have to go into intensive care!! Fucking pathetic (I don't mean Mirallas but Seamus and Pienaar) that they miss so many games cos of a fucking knock. They need to start manning up IMO.

Modern day players are more scientifically trained with many sports teams using things like health monitor. The modern methods are very good at making athletes quicker and more explosive in their movements.

I really think that hamstring issues are more of a problem currently than in the past. The more explosive movements players can now make have the negative side effect of putting to much strain on the athlete's hamstrings.

I've always be an average athlete and I've never had a hamstring problem but then again I don't go running at anything close to the speed of Premier League players.

It really is a shame that Everton have had to start the season without Barkley. Coleman has missed games and now Mirallas. A coupe of players that would make the team most weeks have been slow to recover too.

I'd really like to see a full strength Everton side, but it's just not in the cards.

The Seamus injury – no way he should be rushed back. Head injuries, we now know today whereas 15 years ago we did not, are nothing to fool around with. We are taking about a bruised brain and the kid has his entire life in front of him.

Not disagreeing with your premise at all and in fact I agree. But we need to remove Seamus from the list of "he should have played."

Brain injury needs to be handled appropriately and with the utmost caution.

Browning is good player but hardly like for like for Mirallas.

Its down to Atsu now to show us why Martinez wanted him so much and show us some of the glimpses we saw in Brazil during the summer.

Sad about Mirallas though, been in great form right throughout the calender year of 2014 ,is he possibly our leading scorer so far since the turn of the year??

Guess by the sounds of the injury it's a case of see you in December Kev.

Will we ever see a fully fit Pienaar again?

Would love to really see Pienaar, McGeady and Atsu all really step up to the plate and perform well, obviously regarding Pienaar his fitness will dictate that.

The great concern for me now is I look at our midfield and think "where do we get many goals from and where does the direct running or creativity come from?"

Nothing we can do about it of course but Mirallas is a big big loss, possibly its about this moment in time where we will look back and wish Gerard Deulofeu was still here, frustrating he was, but bloody mighty direct and as fast as a cheetah..

I know they used to have pain killing injections, but surely even those wouldn't let you play with some of the injuries they seem to get in the modern era. Mirallas went down like he had a broken ankle, why didn't players in the 70's seem to pick up hamstring injuries every week.

Was it the Guiness, Embassy Regal, or the fish supper's that turned them into Supermen?

The days of no shin pads and muddy pitches where a total different time and era to now. Players never got injured as much as the game was not as intense and far slower than the modern game. You only have to see old footage to see that.

The days of Dave Clements and the crew coming out at five to three and doing a few stretches have long gone. The modern player these days has a half-hour warm-up routine that would leave the old school gasping for breath.

Did you see the recent picture of Joe Harper and Mick Bernard in 70s pre-season training? They wouldn't last five minutes in the modern era.

If they do overdo it, the consequences are that much worse, like a high speed car crash is worse than a slow speed one. The level of physical contact between players has dropped over the years, hence less broken legs, but the muscle injuries are more severe now.

Everton as I tap are the joint 2nd highest scorers in the Premiership. Saturday was better but we have issues in all three areas of the pitch and arguably the biggest problem is at the back. We have after all shipped more goals than any other Premier League team so far.

So, ranked 2nd in goals scored and 20th in goals conceded!
I would respectfully suggest that your sense of balance and proportion is well rather wayward.

Duncan McKenzie and Stan Bowles were just as skillful as those two and they'd have a couple of pints, and fags, before and after a game. Plus, they'd play 60-70 games a season and would never get injured (unless it was a broken leg). This lot are fucking useless.

Obviously with head injuries you have to be careful but 4 weeks out?? As for Pienaar, he seems to attract injuries after fairly tame tackles, Bryan Oviedo is a perfect example of the determination and desire to make a complete recovery after a potential career-ending injury, so maybe a speedy recovery is as much down to psychology as medical treatment.

We can only hope Kev can come up with the same attitude as Bryan.

It didnÂ’t work. He pulled his hamstring against Liverpool and we got beat by Palace and Swansea. Same with Barkley last season. After Barkley scored against Swansea he was rested for the Sunderland home game which we lost. Two weeks later he injured his toe and had to be rested.

Surely the lesson here is to keep playing your best players and gather in as many points as you can while they are fit. Resting players only disrupts the team and as explained does not keep a player fit anyway!

That's with Mirallas in the team though. Who would you suggest are our creative goal makers/takers now?

McGeady is wildly inconsistent and Atsu unproven. Barry? McCarthy? Besic?

Pienaar and Barkley still out?

Yep, I agree, the next month and probably two will really test our reserves (in all meanings of that word),. Thank God that there is another international break around the corner!

At the risk of sounding like a Doubting Thomas, which I am not, this late autumn/early winter will be a real test for Bobby Martinez and we will surely learn a lot more about him. He can play it safe, take risks, or do a bit of both. Much I suspect will depend on results and league position and, needless to say, who is available and who is not.

Safe for me means a fit Pienaar, Osman, sticking with Barry & McCarthy, and sticking with McGeady (dangerous that last one for what does or doesn't do on the pitch but safe in the sense that he has become a regular lately.

It's hard to be precise because it might be tactically necessary to change things now and then. But what might be better options? Well, how about:

(1) Moving a fit Coleman forwards to winger and play Browning behind him – I know, he did a decent 15 mins on Saturday, but I lean more towards risks/doing something different even at these testing times and, if it doesn't work out, think again, but there is only one way to find out.

(2) Break up the Barry - McCarthy defensive midfield pairing. It's not always clear to me why we need two defensive midfielders (Bobby is also incredibly reluctant to sub them). Barry is wobbling right now and he's odds on to get a red sooner rather than later. Play McCarthy there with Besic in front of him. I was astonished at the flak Besic got at the weekend! Astonished! Yep, I counted mistakes but I also saw someone always looking to get the ball forwards and he can pass a ball.

(3) A fit Oviedo on the left flank – yep ,four full backs! – and I want to see more of Atsu who can play left or right.

(4) If we're looking ahead a month from now, it's more than likely that Ross will be back; Naismith behind the striker until then.

So – I was pushed, Guv, I didn't fall, JB made me do it – the team for Swansea at home, 1 November:

Howard – Browning – Stones – Jagielka – Baines – McCarthy – Besic – Coleman – Oviedo – Barkley – Eto'o

Subs: Robies – Garbutt – Distin – Barry – Atsu – Naismith – Lukaku (Pienaar will get injured again)

And vs Man Utd on Sunday: Howard – Browning – Stones – Jagielka – Baines – McCarthy – Besic – Coleman (if fit) – Oviedo/Atsu – Naismith – Eto'o

You asked!

But you also know that injuries and delayed recoveries will be the spoiler!

There is just absolutely no way you can play football with this kind of injury, especially not a grade 2/3 tear which Mirallas looks to have suffered.

Kicks, cuts, bruises even broken toes etc. you can play on with but to run and kick a ball relies on the muscles of the legs, and when the muscle has been torn from tendon and bone you've got no chance.

Some players, such as Mick Lyons, may have gone a career without an injury. That's genetics and it's luck – some players who did get one in the 70s, it most likely finished their career, hence why you could never name them as having 'played through it'.

My point is, today many players are mentally, and physically, weaker than players used to be. Maybe it's something to do with the huge money they earn from such an early age that they can afford to take time off to look after themselves.

Many ex-pros from earlier times will often talk of the fear they had of getting injured as they were on a pittance compared to what they earn today and they often hid their injuries so as to stay in contention.

I'm not saying those days should come back but the players were built of sterner stuff than this lot.

Peter Reid had his fair share of missed games through injury. Okay, he may have been back earlier but you're modern day athletes are trained to be faster and more explosive.

Given what we now know about head trauma, why should Seamus Coleman be sent out on the pitch if doctors judge it to be unsound?

Is Mirallas weak for pushing his body past it's breaking point? Could he have limped on? Maybe... but we now know that has a negative affect on the injury.

In the past, maybe players played on out of a sense of toughness but that was due to lack of understanding. How many retired early due to injury? How many could barely walk in their old age? How often was Jeff Astle a bit groggy? I'd take Jeff not having his brains bashed in over someone feeling uncomfortable about his level of toughness any day.

By rights, the news on Seamus's injury should be headlined "My brain – Fuck all to do with you lot".

The screaming and rolling isn't about toughness – it's about cheating. And a lack of shame to some degree. I dare say that Ronaldo has a fair bit of actual toughness to him. He's just a shameless cheat.

I've had two concussions and four teeth knocked out of my cranium (two separate times, two teeth each incident) playing hockey. I say that to cement my "toughness" credentials. And... also my "compensation" issues... :0)

I'd wear gloves every time I played footy if I were in England. It's fucking cold where you folks live!

Can't be a toughness thing. It's damn cold... bundle up if ya have to!

With regards to toughness, anybody will know that if they've played the game at any sort of level, you can't be physically weak or go hiding as the bullies will find an easy way of stopping you.

I remember Beckham playing a game at Goodison in around 2000-01. Not noted for being a tough guy, a few of the Everton players attempted to be overly physical with him and he more than handled it, wasn't fazed and I'm not sure it was the first time a team set out to do this to him.

I loved the moment when Jags barely touched him and he went down screaming and holding his face, and Jags just shrugged and walked away smiling. Hope to never see any of our players resorting to that kind of cheating, or any other kind for that matter.

Bottom line for me regarding injuries is wondering whether our back room department are up to it. An awful lot of injuries compounded with longer and longer lay-offs.

Maybe the Physio was once a builder: pencil behind ear: "Yeah Bobby, looks like a bad one, I'd say (puffs cheeks out)... Give it... Yeah, give it 6 weeks. It's a really bad graze!"

Nowadays, I play with a Scottish bloke who wears skins! I think that era has passed now.

I accept the changes but I don't like them. Each to his own.

Unless people know sports injuries, then if you seriously shred your hamstring then you cannot play any kind of sport, certainly not one that involves sprinting at high speed.

What do people want to see? Roberto Martinez to say to Mirallas "Forget what the specialist says and get out there and do your thing"?

Get real.

If it is a major tear then he is not back playing before mid-December.

Will we ever get to see that other ٤ million striker? Now that injury should have well healed.

Not the best of starts to a season that we all looked forward to...

On a serious note, the problem I have about injuries is that we do not seem to get accurate information from the club. We expect a player back by a certain date and the date comes and goes with no sign nor any word. It would be nice to be treated like an adult who can take a bit of bad news.

We are missing a creative force and without Mirallas we need Atsu to step up. We could really do with Pienaar back too. Three defensive mids on Saturday was possibly two too many. If we can get Coleman back with Barkley soon enough, that will help.

We could really do with a young lad breaking through from the reserves. I don't see any attacking players there. What's the story with George Green???

As for Mirallas, the hamstring is the curse of any athlete in any sport who depends on pace, ask Ryan Giggs and Michael Owen.

Nobody knows how bad Seamus’s injury is. As mentioned above, if it’s a brain impact, he needs to be looked after very, very carefully. Nothing soft about that.

Problem was, if I didn't wear the gloves, my wrists would end up in excruciating agony to the point were I couldn't even grip or lift a pint after the match. Figured the pint was much more preferable to sore wrists, so put up with the stick I got for wearing for them.

Can't account for the ponsey gold boots though...

My point being, that the players that wear these gloves might do so for a reason.

I can see why they don't want to communicate it until they're sure. As soon as they give an opinion it gets leapt on. And it doesn't make a blind bit of difference anyway – they come back when they're ready.

Ged (#21) makes a good point about the irony of resting players who then invariably get injured shortly after. I am firm believer in keeping a fully fit squad playing, especially at this time of year; resting players in September is madness. Players will need resting later in the year. Resting them now only disrupts their rhythm and fitness.

Bloody shame if correct.

Remind me of an article by Frank McConville (RIP) in When Skies are Grey many years ago.

Hope he gets well soon. We'll need him to.