Injured Baines returning to Everton

We are going to be up the creek without a paddle for the West Ham game the way this is going.

We are rapidly running out of bodies. If we lose all 3 of the recent people, Barry, Baines and McCarthy for any length of time it will be really hard going with all the festive fixtures coming up.

Hamstrings usually never take less than 3-4 weeks to recover.

Balls!

I've never known a time like it for long term injuries. I think so far there are only a couple of players from the first team who have escaped, although no doubt there time will come.

No wonder the team is stop start it's a different team every bloody week!

Kone
Oviedo
Stones
Mirallas
Baines
Barry
McCarthy
Alcaraz

I guess Pienaar, Lukaku and Gibson are alright ?

But seriously the number of hamstrings is worrying considering the advances in sports science/ training methods we keep hearing about, and the excellent facilities available,and I include all clubs in that not just Everton.

Shit happens, but at least we do have cover at left back. Just get well soon Bainesy.

Either that or the players are getting softer.

Could be a very different looking team for the visit of in form West Ham.

It's fair to expect some injuries, but this season is ridiculous. We got relatively lucky in terms of the first 11 last season, but a fair few bad ones to squad players (Oviedo, GIbson, Kone etc), but we are losing the essential players this season.

I expect that McCarthy is the only one of the three we have lost this week who could feature against West Ham.

I don't know where Oviedo is fitness wise but he's going to have to be ready, there's no way you can just throw Garbutt in at left back in the Premier League.

Left back or right back for that matter is a hard job of balancing both defence and attack and trying to perfect the art otherwise teams exploit your weakness.

Shit

There's also Garbutt who can come in and he looked very impressive in the League Cup tie against Swansea. The lad has a wicked left foot.

Positives can always come out of injuries to players. It can give opportunities to others. We also have plenty of cover in central midfield and it will give Besic and perhaps Gibson much needed game time.

I think the player we've missed the most is Mirallas because we don't have good cover in that position; a real shame Deulofeu still isn't here, could've been a real gem for us this season.

This does however make me think back to Martinez's we need 7 more comment that he rolled back from. Though at least in this position there is decent cover. Our squad is beginning to look dangerously threadbare.

Still in adversity and all that, who knows maybe we'll come out of it stronger. The last manager seemed to do better when the chips were down; I think Roberto might be cut from similar cloth. COYB

Ratcliffe was a totally different era in football, the game has changed massively.

I'd be all for seeing Garbutt but it would be a big ask for the lad ,yes he played in the League Cup but it seemed nobody gave a shit about that match, it was played like a training session.

I would like to see Oviedo fit and playing, he's a great player with a fantastic hunger for the game.

I do recall that was Moyes's major strength, working in the face of adversity, injuries etc. That was Moyes's stock and trade yet, when he had the tools to work with, he couldn't always live up to it.

Let's see if Martinez has a strong plan; we''ll find out over the next few weeks.

He has shown in the past he can do a decent job in different positions, but I definitely thought Bryan played his best football filling in for Baines.

He'll quite happily rotate Pienaar, McGeady, Naismith, Osman, Lukaku, Eto'o, Barkley... then why not Barry, McCarthy and Baines? I know they are quality players but in today's game they can't play every game!

None of it has any relevance. We are about to find out what Martinez is made of in adversity. Much more interesting. Let's wish him well.

I really do not like the idea of playing Distin at left back as I reckon players being out of position is a kick in the teeth for the likes of Garbutt. We need to have Coleman, Jagielka and Distin in their normal positions.

We will still have the headache of playing Besic in place of Barry and who knows if McCarthy will be fit for our next game. Perhaps Browning could be played in an emergency ????

I do not see Barkley in defensive midfield, he needs to be further forward running at defenders and scoring a goal or two. Our attacking players are unaffected at present and the same starters could be used for the West Ham game. It is the defence that needs tinkering with to cover the spate of injuries.

Jim (#41),

Yes, football has changed massively but mostly on the tactical side of play and surely in Racliffe's time players still had to sprint and stretch in to tackles that the majority of hamstring injuries occur from.
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I think Garbutt should get a chance – he did look the most impressive out of the youngsters in pre-season. If not, him, along with Conor McAleny need some urgent first team action in the championship come January, else they've got no chance of ever breaking into our team.

He did. And for me the most telling photograph was the one that showed that the other player furthest forward in the Man Utd area (last 5 mins when it was 0-0) was Coleman.

An injury to one player means an opportunity for someone else. Time for Luke Garbutt to step up and take his chance.

I can’t see anything good that we’ve got out of our players being on international duty. Jags and Bainesy both looked off the pace at the start of the season and for a few games the former seemed to have forgotten how to defend. Surely I can’t be the only one to think that summer sojourn in Brazil and the inspired tactics of Woy’s Woeful Wovers have something to do with it.

The whole approach and setup of the national team has been uninspiring for years, if not downright toxic. Quite apart from the ever present injury problems, players can have their heads filled with stupid confusing tactics, turned to bigger clubs, or given an unmerited ego boost.

And for what? I know it used to be a huge privilege to play for your country, but nowadays I can’t help feeling international football is as much nuisance as honour.

The standard of football is frankly poor. It’s well below that of the top leagues (inevitable when you have to cobble together a group of players in short-time against unfamiliar opposition) and if you set a top-flight Premier League or La Liga team against virtually any international side, I know who my money would be on. Part of the excitement of World Cups used to come from clashing styles (I remember the relentless wide-open attacking of the African sides and Brazil’s showboating happily) but these days there’s much less of this with managers more pragmatic and players themselves all spread across Europe anyway.

England are especially poor to watch these days, lacking the old fire-and-fight approach to ally with the apparent lack of basic technical skills whose roots lie at school level and our fundamental approach to ’playing’. Watch Spanish kids in a school-yard and it’s all about who can score the most stylish goal or keep the ball for longest, Dutch football at youth level is actively non-competitive, but in England I feel it’s still very much ’show commitment and win at all costs’ with goals a premium and crunching tackles celebrated.

The prospects of the national team are also fundamentally hamstrung (pardon the pun) by the fundamental state of the league structure which does NOT care one jot about nurturing young and gifted British footballers but needs to buy winners right now from wherever they can get them at the best price. Those people who rail against immigration in favour of nationalism (nb: I’m not one of them) should perhaps turn their attention against Eastern Europeans desperate for a minimum-wage job to support their families and look a little higher up the tree at the multi-millionaire footballers (many of whom are deeply average at their profession) flooding the game and crowding out home grown players (meanwhile likely employing an army of tax consultants as most of the super-rich do to ensure they pay as little as possible).

Ultimately there’s a lot of issues there and some conflicting, but my main fundamental question is ’What is international football good for anymore?’

It disrupts the ’real’ game that most people care about and which actually funds the players wages (the impending farce in Qatar that will have to see European football season restructured is admittedly a new height of ludicrosity), it’s long-since been surpassed by the leagues in quality, skill, tactics and excitement and I’d wager that most fans have ten times more allegiance to their league team than to their national one.

The dwindling following of our national side (and the fact that more are expected to turn up to support the women’s game) suggests that there’s many like me who can’t even be bothered to tune in anymore.

(As for the practicalities I’d start stepping up Oviedo’s match-training.)

A bit over the top I know, but he's usually a good judge of a player. I think he was a bit worried we might lose him if he's not getting a game.

Me personally, I would have no worries with either Garbutt or Oviedo starting if Baines is out for any length of time.

Personally I love summer international tournaments, although I can't get really get up for friendlies or the many meaningless qualifying matches.

Garbutt is 21 now, and looks very promising. He will not adequately replace Baines, who is the attacking left back in the Prem, but he deserves a shot.

Ask most ardent club supporters and they don't give a stuff for International football. Even in the World Cup summer most of us were more concerned about the health and well-being of 'our' players than the fortunes of the participating teams.

I think that since the globalisation of the club game via the Premier League, we can all see world-wide stars every week and this must be even more the case for regular Champions League participant clubs. And hey, it's difficult to get too excited about England v San Marino when we might have a derby game the following week!

The money grabbing Fifa's and Uefa's inclusion of 'no-hopers' in the build-up to finals stage has devalued their product no end. Okay, maybe if they competed on a knock-out basis, but these interminable qualifying leagues bore the arse off everyone – including the players, It's like if Everton had to face conference teams every other week!

Recent gates at Wembley have shown that 'the international product' is fooked but it MIGHT just have provided a break for a young player here that few of us saw coming anytime soon!

So if Baines is out then, purely on the fact that Garbutt's match fitness is better than Oviedo's at the minute, it needs to be him to cover.

Our player of the season so far, too, in my view.

Three points against the Hammers a must!

COYB!

'This season is really starting to get on my tits!!'

I know, it's totally infuriating mate, and it seems to be hitting us more than other sides, this injury curse. However, as many other TW'ers have mentioned, left back is one position that we have adequate replacements for, in Oviedo (if he's ready) and Garbutt.

So, while disappointed that LB will be out for a bit, just like others when hitting top form, I am reasonably confident that either of the two mentioned, will do the job.

Now midfield (Barry and McCarthy) is a different kettle of fish, and leaves us in a much more worrying position.

By the way, I'd have a word with your doctor about those Manboobs. :-)

Don't know the big lad who took his place but he threw the ball miles without effort.