Garbutt's future remains unclear

Offer him a good deal and a season-long loan to a Premier League side and hopefully that will keep him happy and he might sign up.

Now he may already have accepted that Luke is gone and trying to play down his importance but while the lad has still not signed for anyone else he should be telling him to fight for the starting place and should he not win the battle then he can go on loan at Xmas.

I really donÂ’t care if we get beat 10-0 in the next 2 games... the most pressing agenda at the club right now should be getting Luke sorted so we will not have to worry about the left back role for the next 10 years. Wait until the end of the season for what?? Our season ended in Kiev; now should be about the future and getting our board to get their finger out which they failed to do last summer.

Either way, the club has fucked up letting the matter get to this stage in the first place. They should have extended his contract last summer.

But watch his effort to keep the likes of Alcaraz and McGeady. I really do despair what this manager is going to do in the preseason. The writing seems to be on the wall regarding Luke Garbutt. How many other youngsters is he also going to let go. And how many oldies and walking wounded is he going to keep?

To those saying that Garbutt should have been signed up so that the club at least get a substantial transfer fee, I can understand that, but the practical side was that Everton were probably not prepared to gamble precious contract wages on someone who had not yet played a senior game last season - and then this season, it was all down to Garbutt really to decide to sign for Everton or not. He has chosen not to, so far.

If Garbutt really wants to repay Everton for developing him to be a player he is today, he should sign a contract, so that at the very least RM can use the sale to generate some funds. Maybe, even a swap deal can be worked with Moyes to take Garbutt on loan for a year in exchange for a promising player from Real Sociedad who plays in a position which we are crying out for (striker, creative midfielder, etc).

With the personnel turnover weÂ’re looking at in the next 12 months, more things to worry about than an unproven LB leaving.

For me, heÂ’s not nearly ready to replace Leighton and he should accept this.

Oviedo has become dogged by injury problems.

Keeping Garbutt has to be a no-brainer surely??

Maybe sticking with an aging international and a lad who may never fully recover from an horrific injury and letting this kid Â’do a GoslingÂ’ is all part of Bobby No ClueÂ’s masterplan... ably assisted by Kecks-down Kenwright and the Monty Python board...

I fuckin despair. Send for the Oystens... Why not?

I have only seen one other left back at his age take a senior game by the scruff of the neck in the premier league era and that was Luke Shaw. For me there is no comparison between Luke and Leighton at the same age and the same people who are playing down him leaving now will be the ones shouting about it in a couple of years time.

Ashley Cole is a much better athlete than Baines and at 33 he could no longer cope with the demands of the Premiership and despite Leighton's undoubted contribution this season especially going forward I feel it was still his poorest for some time. We will get two decent seasons out of him at most.

Most will argue Luke doesn't deserve to replace Baines but, when Fergie moved Irwin to left back to accommodate Gary Neville the Irishman was the best RB in the business at the peak of his career, yet he decided the time was right to give Neville his head for his and the team's future.

Arsenal and Man City are in need of Englishmen for Europe and IÂ’m sure would both be interested in Baines and we could definitely still command a decent fee for a player who deserves to be playing at that level in the twilight of his career.

You call Luke unproven but he already an Under-21 international and one could say the same about Kane at the start of the season. HeÂ’s head and shoulders better than this season's youngsters and acquitted himself well in both Europe and the Prem. Oviedo is injury prone and not of the same calibre regardless.

And Phil, heÂ’s not doing a Gosling, the two situations are very different.

I am not at all sure there are many clubs who are going to offer a loan gig to Luke Garbutt. Not Premier League clubs anyway. He is a prospect admittedly. I think he will be a Premier League player, how high though is hard to predict.

It will take a brave manager (maybe foolhardy?) to give a starting place to a 21-year-old defender who there is no prospect of buying. I get the thing about Bournemouth. There is a possibility they may go for it, but you would imagine that they may look to use one of their two PL loans on someone who is more experienced rather than an unproven defender?

I thought Baines had a good game against Sunderland. I am a fan of Garbutt, but anyone who thinks he is ready to come in and replace Baines must be watching a different game to me. Luke is simply not going to walk into many Premier League teams atm.

I would prefer to keep Garbutt as opposed to Oviedo, though, if a decision has to be made. Good player, great guy but something has got to give, and for me it would be Ovideo to be sacrificed.

With all the problems in MF with left-sided players, why didn't Martinez put Baines there? Put Luke in and get him to sign a new contract.

Once he is under contract, if he is not getting game time, he can command a fee if he wants to go.

To me he has looked all season like a player that is approaching the last few years of his career and now would be the sensible time to make him available. Doing that brings in a decent transfer fee (although the 㿊m days have long gone) and allows us to move forward with the man looking every bit like his domestic and international replacement.

But thatÂ’s not Everton. We donÂ’t look to the future. Garbutt will go for free, Baines will continue to decrease in both value and ability and when he retires weÂ’ll have to spend big. Standard.

Keeping Garbutt is indeed a priority. But what do you do with a long-serving England international who stayed with us when he could easily have gone to Man Utd?

Dads Army, here we come!!!.

Not sure we can persuade him to stay. HeÂ’s not a local lad and he and his agent are probably waiting to weigh up the various offers that may come in during the summer.

No doubt if heÂ’d been a regular, he might have signed by now. Why, though would Martinez drop a top class fullback to try and influence a player with potential? In my view, he should grab the chance of first team football and get to Bournemouth right now.

Maybe Leeds, who, lest we forget, we truly pissed on by poaching him in the first place. Earning rave reviews and boosting his price for the homegrown moneyÂ’d elite. He IS going to be a player, no doubt. Oh Everton, why do you bless us with three decent left backs, yet only one right back and one striker worth a second glance. Football...

Scott, the Baines you describe is the Baines weÂ’ve always had. Without Pienaar heÂ’s only half as effective, weÂ’d be better off trying Baines and Garbutt playing as a pair, that way Garbutt would learn from Baines and both would be getting a game. It should have been tried some time ago which might have made Garbutt happy enough to sign a contract.

Personally, I think it is a major fuck-up by the manager and it doesnÂ’t give me much optimism in bringing through some of these very good young players we have.

I watched Garbutt a lot for our U21Â’s and he never really impressed me. He came in and did well though, credit to him. But I still donÂ’t think itÂ’s worth getting our knickers in a twist over. ItÂ’s annoying, but IÂ’m afraid this happens from time to time.

Over-hyped on the back of a few good corners, he is an adequate cover for Baines and the repeatedly injured – but much better player – Oviedo. I wish him well in his quest for a Premier League future.

Yes, I think Baines has only 1-2 seasons left at the top. Yes, I think that Garbutt is as good as anything else out there as a replacement. But I think the lad needs to look out for himself and play football if it is on offer.

I want him to stay, but I totally understand that he would want to play every week.

I can just see it now.....

Captain Mainwairing in goal, screaming out his orders to Corporal Jones on the left, Godfrey on the right with Sgnt Wilson and Frazier in the middle.

CouldnÂ’t get any more disorganised than that... Or could it?

If weÂ’re looking to seriously rebuild the team, you put him on a better contract and play him. But what if heÂ’s yet another overhyped Everton youngster, not as good as we hoped? HeÂ’ll be another one on a big contract in the reserves and Martinez will get stick for keeping him.

I donÂ’t think heÂ’ll end up at a bigger club than us, but he may well move for more money and games.

I’ll ask the question again – would you play him ahead of Baines and Oviedo?

And donÂ’t give me itÂ’s because the manager doesnÂ’t play him. As has been stated numerous times, who would get in the team ahead of the current england left back, who I believe still this season has the most assists of any defender in the league!!

Doing so would represent a huge risk for any team.

Roberto isnÂ’t building up a new squad, new signings will be limited to just 2 and one of them will be a loan signing. The managers statements regarding the older members of the squad tells us what to expect.

WeÂ’ll all be shocked if he is allowed to spend big, without selling first.

If he leaves, like I suspect, at least he will be showing consistency, having done the same to Leeds a few years ago.

Modern day football is crazy. Some kids havenÂ’t properly made the grade, and yet their bank account is huge!

One decent 90-min performance this season!!!... 21 years and counting... and nothing is gonna change anytime soon.

We havenÂ’t seen enough of Garbutt to really know if he is top class, and remember how loyal Baines was when he could have gone to Man Utd.

Oviedo has always shown great desire to play for us, and I would like him to recover from his latest set-back and have another run in the team. Perhaps the club are at fault for not getting Garbutt to sign a contract last season, but who knows, with agents etc?

Yes heÂ’s our best LB but heÂ’s only got about 2 years left at the top as it is (and is one of our biggest earners). The club have not been good in the recent past getting rid of players at the right time, hence why we have so may old timers on the books.

Cash in on Baines and give Garbutt a new contract – he can battle with Oviedo for the LB spot and improve. Do Baines a favour as well, let him have a couple of years playing in the CL – Man City will be looking for a LB and could do with increasing their homegrown quota. Win-win, as they say.

Alternatively, Garbutt leaves on a free, followed by Oviedo next summer and in 2 yearsÂ’ time weÂ’re fucked at LB and need to try someone new or spend a lot of money to get someone decent.

Tony #45 is spot on. The lad is no defender. He can break forward and has got a good set piece on him. He is a fair way off being a regular for a good Premier League club though. If he goes then he will either:

(1) have to move to a ’lesser’ club to get genuine first team football – a promoted club or, more likely Championship;

(2) Get a move to an equivalent of Everton, have to start again and probably be no more certain to play first team football next season; or

(3) stay at Everton, go out on loan (Look at players like Coleman at Blackpool, Bamford at Derby/Â’Boro) get some experience at a good level, then look to break into a PL XI.

If he goes, good luck to him. I know which one I would choose though...

If Garbutt, capped at every level, walks out of the door for nowt, in my book, itÂ’s comparable to the Gosling fiasco; split hairs all you like. Are you that confident in this management and board to assert that any offer to Garbutt has actually been written down or is just another Â’verbal offer'?

I have no idea how closely or for how long you have followed this club and the morons running it but I’d suggest to you that if the kid walks for nowt – like Gosling did – high Vegas odds it’ll be down to their incompetence.

As for your peculiar speculation that perhaps he wouldnÂ’t get a start at another Premier League club, thatÂ’s a little bit daft too, isnÂ’t it? He only needs to be a 2nd choice left back to be one up the pecking order on Everton, according to Don Quixote who, and this was the point you avoided, was going to go all Philip Lahm with Baines this season... what happened to that bright idea then?

I reckon Garbutt would get a start at several PL clubs, the three coming up for starters. If he Â’does a GoslingÂ’ and walks to another PL club for nowt, then someone at management/board level should pay the price, but donÂ’t hold your breath with this gaggle of gobshites!

Let Garbutt battle it out with the more versatile Oviedo (if he can ever stay fit after that injury) and use Baines more creatively after all, thatÂ’s what Martinez told us he was going to do....

Without Pienaar Baines looks very average and to get the best out of him Martinez should have resolved that problem, not with Osman or Barkley being played out of position, but with the likes of Garbutt or, when fit, Oviedo linking up with Baines to give us the width and attacking potential that has been missing almost all season.

No wonder Baines has been a shadow of his former self, half of his powers have been negated by lack of help down the left. How many times has Baines run down the left then stop and pass back to Jags because there is no Everton player with whom he can exchange passes ? And Martinez clearly hasnÂ’t the nous to see it.

I find it odd that Martinez talked up the Lahm role for Baines and now, having let this kidÂ’s contract almost run out, Baines (and the seldom fit Oviedo) as specialist left-backs are the excuses being lined up for him strolling away for free. This is a 21-year-old Englishman capped at every level from U16-U21.

I suppose thatÂ’s okay though, because Pete Edwards and a minority on here donÂ’t think heÂ’d get a game at any other PL club... Tell me how you are really going to feel if, as has been suggested, he takes the short walk across the park and Everton, having paid a handsome fee for him from Leeds, get frig all for him?

Martinez reckons he needs to look abroad for a No 10, fuck that try Baines in there. IÂ’d rather see him there than as a deep-lying midfielder.

IÂ’m not comparing the relative footballing talents of Gosling and Garbutt, IÂ’m comparing the fact that, for whatever reasons, they both were/may be allowed to leave for absolutely free. Gosling, incidentally, was a very highly regarded, multi-capped (U17-U21) Englishman. His progress was hindered by an injury and he was on the verge of a possible breakthrough. Garbutt like Gosling will probably sign for another PL team.

Gosling’s ’decline’ is neither here nor there, Colin (injury ravaged career too), the comparison is appropriate: both English, both capped through to U21 level and both, feasibly, fucking off while Everton (thru utter incompetence where Gosling was concerned) don't get a cent. All-in-all, pretty galling at a time when – if you're young, English and at an EPL club – you're an expensive asset...

Interesting that Martinez was eager to point to the future with respect to Distin & Stones, but Garbutt apparently needs to buy into a development plan. No doubt Gareth Barry will play every week next season. The favouritism is nauseating.

For those of you so desperate to see more of Garbutt (I have seen enough to judge IMO he is replaceable), why not move him into the left mid position slot into which you so want to cram Baines? He is less defensively capable than Baines and several of you have already elevated him to a world class free kick specialist (not sure based upon what though).

Quite the way to treat a loyal player, Baines, by telling him to fuck off and play a different position. This in order to sign a player who, if better, wonÂ’t be at Everton long... and, if not, weakens the defense further.

From what I’ve seen of Shaw and Garbutt, I don’t think there’s that much between them – both are a similar age, both are better going forward. Everton can’t afford to lose a player that potentially has a huge sell-on value.

In regards to moving Baines or Garbutt out of position. I said on numerous threads that I’d like to see Garbutt played ahead of Baines as more of a winger – especially when Mirallas and Oviedo were injured... It never happened and seems unlikely to now. While Martinez has talked of playing Baines more centrally and played him in a couple of games (I thought he played well in this position at St James Park) so I’d like to see this happen again.

ItÂ’s not about being disloyal to Baines. I want our best players played in the same side. I think Baines could do a better job than Naismith playing behind Rom, and no worse than Barry (in the deeper role) who has played gash for large parts of the season, although he has been playing since our exit from all the cup competitions.

This is probably the last year that weÂ’d get 㾶-㾸M for Baines and weÂ’ve already got his replacement. We then use that money to improve other areas of the squad.

On the other side, I guess we are looking at a similar thing with Coleman and Lennon.

The club does have a dilemma here as Garbutt looks good and a Back Four of Coleman, Browning, Stones and Garbutt sounds great to me.

Whether they can all make it and with respect to the present people, remains to be seen.

I think it was 1993 maybe 1994 I was sat in Top Balcony and watched a game with a lot of young players in it, and I thought these players could be a group to put me out of the misery of watching the Bingham/Lee years .

Just maybe, with Ross, Macca, Besic, and Lukako, there is a young team in there.

Or maybe I am deluded.

The problem now is the fear that in five years time Garbutt will be a top class left back playing elsewhere.We pay big money to employ staff who can solve this problem. If they canÂ’t then thatÂ’s a different debate.

Also, I have seen enough over the years of players being shoehorned into positions that donÂ’t suit just to get them in the managers favourite. LetÂ’s keep Baines where he is best and let Garbutt decide whatÂ’s best for him.

Oviedo is a better player than Baines? IÂ’ve read some shite on here in my time but that about tops it.

He has made 11 PL starts in his whole Everton career over three years. Did I miss something?

IÂ’ll repeat what I said on another thread, the best full back at this club in nearly 50 years.

"Best full back in nearly 50 years." – Agree again.

However: "Baines as Number 10." – Sorry, can't see that one.

Garbutt and Browning HAVE to start next season. We have to build with the limited funds we have. It will be a long hard slog but the next 5 years are fucking write-offs for me... so build NOW.