The goalkeeper is thought to have been in the "Ps and Qs" bar where he was goaded by Newcastle United fans.
One video from the bar posted to Instagram show Pickford giving one fan the middle finger before posing for pictures with another patron while another clip taken later outside of the bar seems to show the 25-year-old involved in a scuffle before being restrained and pulled away by a group of men.
An Everton spokesman told the Liverpool Echo that, "the Club has been made aware of an alleged incident involving one of our players and we are looking into the matter."
A Northumbria Police spokesperson was quoted by the Sunderland Echo as saying: "At 12:19am today, police received a report of a disturbance involving a large group of individuals on Tunstall Road, Sunderland.
"Enquiries are ongoing to determine the circumstances surrounding the incident and locate those involved."
Reader Comments (161)
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1 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:00:27
2 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:14:01
No one was fatally injured, a very minor scuffle and both parties went away and sobered up.
This kind of thing has been going on forever outside pubs, haven't the police got anything better to do? They should go and arrest some peadophiles or heroin dealers.
3 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:24:21
Its one of the sacrifices you make for getting £60K+ a week.
Now grow up a bit pls
4 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:26:00
5 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:28:12
6 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:33:01
7 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:44:13
If anybody gives you stick turn the other cheek, if you struggle with that walk away. Giving someone finger for calling him butter fingers, is he 5 years old? Get over it and grow up.
8 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:48:09
Saying they should stay at home is nonsense.
I've seen the video and people were clearly winding him up, calling him butterfingers and mouthing off giving him shit and he stood up for himself.
It might not be PC in the modern game, and maybe never was but you can't just blame Pickford for a load of mouthy dickheads giving him shit in a bar.
9 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:48:52
10 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:49:22
11 Posted 01/04/2019 at 20:58:34
12 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:00:31
13 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:02:13
14 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:07:32
I made a lot of mistakes as a younger man, and did things I wouldn't dream of doing nowadays. You can say he isn't being a grown up, but that's because he isn't a grown up, he's a young man being provoked in a pub after a few beers.
You're right it's not an excuse, but shit like this happens now and always did, he hasn't killed anyone, and it was a little scuffle if anything. I think people these days are all too keen and all too quick to get stuck into people in the public eye.
15 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:11:38
As for those advocating high profile footballers should lead the life of monastic monks, why?
Some trigger happy judgements being passed on here on two incidents that don't amount to more than 20 seconds and to which nobody knows the full details.
The first inside the night club shows him relaxed, happy to pose for photos, being heckled by one mouthy prat (who may even be the person filming the scene in the first place, looking for a reaction).
The second - unless you've led very sheltered lives - is something that happens outside drinking establishments every night of the week.
Does anyone commentating so far know the details? How much provocation Jordan received? For how long? The nature of the provocation? If Jordan was bevvied?
Some are so quick to judge and condemn, based on nothing but their own prejudices and flakey moral indignation.
16 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:12:14
Its not a good reputation the fella is bringing himself, hes just become a father and yet hes involved in some pissed up fracas in Sunderland, Jordan you are not a Sunderland fan whilst you pull on the Everton shirt right mate, you are an Everton fan and you commit fully to Everton FC.
Silva needs to quickly pull this shit into line, too many daft incidents like this and it derails our momentum.
Its not about leading a sheltered life, its about acting as a role model and a professional and Pickford dicking about like he has done too many times already this season is a pain in the arse that we dont need.
17 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:17:50
In light of what happened at Newcastle and what are, now fairly hollow words from him following it, this seems even poorer judgement on his part.
18 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:19:35
When they do mix with the "man on the street" there's always a chance that this sort of thing can happen. (Ask Ross Barkley.) Yeh they can go wherever they like but if they go to places where "lads" go to get bevvied then they leave themselves open.
He should have more sense and be more selective because that's what is required and expected from a highly paid international football star! Thing is, the ability to play footy at the highest level doesn't guarantee having the highest level of common fucking sense.
He's done nothing "wrong" as such but, in his shoes, you have to pick where you go and who you mix with carefully.
Why? Because that's the world today, unfortunately.
19 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:21:01
20 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:23:27
21 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:28:16
When I was Jordan's age, I would have been at home playing Scrabble with my parents on our return from church.
22 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:31:10
He doesn't seem to have learnt after his messing around at the Newcastle game which may have contributed to his poor display and us throwing away a 2-0 lead.
I suggested then and still do that he needs to grow up and be more mature and professional in the way he conducts himself.
I don't think this is such a big deal but it's another negative story highlighting his mental weakness. Can you imagine the Newcastle fans next season!
If being dropped for a few games this season teaches him a lesson that may benefit him for the future then I welcome it whilst at the same time affording Stek a few farewell games.
23 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:35:59
Hes paid a kings ransom (like every Premier League player nowadays) and that kings ransom is paid by Everton Football Club and Pickford has an obligation to this club, not getting pissed in public watching Sunderland.
Its about how you conduct yourself, would Nigel Martyn or Neville Southall be seen doing this?
And its accumulating with Pickfords madcap behaviour that makes it more prominent, had it been a one-off you could let it pass but he needs to really start waking up and smelling the coffee.
24 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:36:52
Obviously never been in Birkenhead town centre late on a Friday night!
25 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:41:49
No one is advocating that he live like a hermit.
This is bad judgement...Sunderland drinking centre is only small, word will be round that hes out..there will be some around who will want to wind him up..this incident ( and the Newcastle game) shows he can easily be wound up...hes now an instant target should he go out again. . What if his punches had connected? and what if it had been more serious? ( assaulting someone..which this is..for being wound up maybe mitigation but its no excuse)
Hes now left himself open to any idiot..( the vids will now be viral).they don't have to do anything but provoke...you cant guarantee it wont happen again in the same circumstances...in fact I will wager it likely will...but the outcome may not be the same. And believe me the Old Bill & the CPS will just love that..( in fact the vid of him swinging punches may well be used as an example of previous behaviour now its in the public domain) .
If you want to go for a drink chose carefully where you go and chose your company wisely.
26 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:46:54
By the way, Brian, hope you are up for a beer on Easter Sunday?
27 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:49:23
After church of course!
Btw, lads and lasses, you do know this story is an April Fool one, don't you?
28 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:54:38
As my late mother would have said ‘What were you doing there in the first place?‘
29 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:56:42
30 Posted 01/04/2019 at 21:57:18
As a goalkeeper he may not need to be as athletic in some areas as others but if he were to through a punch or get hurt defending himself the chances of injury to his hands is high and like many other people are his trade tools which could be very costly.
Also I get it he's young, but he's not a kid. He knows right from wrong, good decisions from bad. If he wants to smoke, drink, do drugs its his choice. But as an Everton player I don't want our players doing such stupid things. We know it goes on and there are many recent examples of ex-Everton players being foolish.
I can't stop them, I just don't want them being disrespectful to the club. We need a new keeper, the Q is are we looking for a number one or two?
31 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:00:55
Thats a very valid point about a goalkeepers hands being his main asset.
What if Pickford had took a swing and cracked his knuckles or broken a finger, or even fell awkwardly (he was pissed after all) and broke his wrist ect ect?
That would rule him out of the remainder of the season and all because of a piss up.
Personally Id rather leave that kind of behaviour to the likes of Slippy G or Rooney when he was a liability with his off-field antics.
32 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:03:57
33 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:08:40
Andy Crooks and Joey Crawley (you're spellin' your name wrong son!) take a bow.
Scrabble after Church. Too funny.
Two things in my mind are certain.
1. Jordan shouldn't have been out that late, and if he is he simply can't react to any cat-calling.
2. Jordan should not be allowed anywhere near Newcastle! He can't keep his head with the Barcodes fans!
Love the boy, gets way too much shit on TW, but he does need to exercise better judgement.
He's a boy FFS. Who amongst us wasn't doing the same damn thing at that age? I think he should get a slap on the wrist, a stern talking to, and leave it at that.
I have an inexplicable longing for younger years all of a sudden.
34 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:11:07
Is this actually and April Fool's thing?
I hate April Fools. Immature and childish. Bah Humbug.
35 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:14:53
Sorry, mate, it's not........ just me being a knob, lol!
36 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:16:51
Or maybe it could have been one of ours taking a smack in some club in Slater street, accused of knocking off some lads girlfriend.
Oh shit, that was one of ours as well. 😥😥
37 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:21:32
At least he wasn't a gobshite and didn't gob on a teenage girl.
The world of 'journalism' really is shite.
38 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:23:21
39 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:32:04
40 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:39:55
41 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:44:41
He looks to have initiated the physical altercation, no matter how he was provoked. The perpetrators got the reaction they wanted.
Lucky there where people to get him away, it could have ended far worse. The venue did provide adequate people to manage, but they ended up managing Pickford.
Everton are in a awkward situation. They will have to take action. Southgate won't be happy either.
42 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:51:12
The Daily Mirror "Jordan Pickford involved in "pub fight"
The Sun "Jordan Pickford involved in vicious pub brawl after booze binge."
The former, with the quotation marks implies the incident is alleged and offers no comment on his prior actions or the intensity of the fight. The latter states that he was drunk after a "binge" and that not only was there definitely a fight, but it was "vicious." Just compare with this other Sun headline "Dele Alli filmed berating staff" The use of berating implies he was scolding them and in the absence of other info you get the inference he was entitled to do so. My point being, here as ever we have The Sun showing their anti-northern bias by spinning two minor incidents
43 Posted 01/04/2019 at 22:56:47
What it shows is that if you are a 'high profile' figure and you allow yourself to be put in these sutuations then you are at the total mercy of this kind of reporting ( with no say in the matter whatsoever)...no one said life was fair.
44 Posted 01/04/2019 at 23:17:30
Brian #18, spot on. As usual. Hope you and Andy and the rest of the gang have a great time on Sunday. I'll be wishin' I was wi' yer.
Jamie #34, hate to break it to you, but these ARE your younger years.
Rob #36, ya broke me up. As usual. Perfect post.
John #29, given the way he punches, his hands were in no danger.
Stephen #43, right on. The press are going to exaggerate the incident. The sun is going to rise in the east. That's the way things are. If you're world famous and you don't want the press to write shite about your pub scrap, don't get into a pub scrap.
45 Posted 01/04/2019 at 23:23:53
Like Stephen @43 says - no one said life was fair. Absolutely, it's not fair that he can't go out on the town like the rest of us at his age, but it's also not fair that he's earning more than a dozen brain surgeons for catching a leather balloon.
46 Posted 01/04/2019 at 23:43:01
47 Posted 01/04/2019 at 23:47:37
Some work to do there at FF.
48 Posted 01/04/2019 at 00:00:41
Hooefully Everton have some form of clause in the player contracts covering this type of stuff. Really unprofessional in my opinion .
49 Posted 01/04/2019 at 00:05:52
50 Posted 02/04/2019 at 00:32:28
51 Posted 02/04/2019 at 01:30:48
52 Posted 02/04/2019 at 02:24:18
All that said, stern word for the lad and a warning that hes almost crossed a line and needs to make some changes. No need to go any further than that.
53 Posted 02/04/2019 at 02:49:59
54 Posted 02/04/2019 at 03:07:21
He did what probably most of us would have done if we were in that situation. It doesnt matter if you earn £6m a year or £20k, if you and your loved ones are verbally abused, you are going to stand up for yourself.
I find it amusing that some people are criticizing him going out and being in a pub, something what ‘regular people do. But then on the other hand, players get criticized for being out of touch with the fans due to the huge wealth that they have and some of the extravagant lifestyles they live.
55 Posted 02/04/2019 at 03:09:52
56 Posted 02/04/2019 at 04:03:07
57 Posted 02/04/2019 at 04:05:38
58 Posted 02/04/2019 at 04:16:04
Typical English player shows no professionalism for his club or country..
At 25 I was married with 2 kids playing in the toughest pubs in Liverpool been heckled every time I went on stage... not once did I get into a fight coz I was mature enough to walk away...
Pickford should apologize to his bosses for bringing bad publicity to our club
59 Posted 02/04/2019 at 05:12:41
It is also being reported that JP only became incensed when whoever the pricks were aimed abuse at his missus who was there with him and some friends.
My first point is we don't know the facts and this is already trial by media. The lad may have just been doing some socialising and was baited by some geordie pricks.
However I do have some concerns about Pickfords lifestyle choices and it may go some way to explaining his erratic and unforced errors when under pressure in certain games.
The game is no longer "Lets have a few beers after the game". it is now a game for the serious athlete who knows he has to stay in peak condition and you cannot maintain full fitness and concentration consistently if you don't.
60 Posted 02/04/2019 at 06:47:05
Lets give an example, Ross Barkley was out in Birkenhead, someone shouted butter feet and he gave someone finger and then got involved in fracas. I would imagine everybody would say stupid prick. I dont see difference here.
Speaking about Ross Barkley, since Bongos Bingo incident and moving to Chelsea, hes gone up a level and was excellent against us at Goodison and simply clapped the ground when subbed - thats the way to deal with getting stick.
61 Posted 02/04/2019 at 06:53:39
The Sun, are bound to big it up after the total eclipse o f the Sun on Merseyside .
62 Posted 02/04/2019 at 07:19:24
63 Posted 02/04/2019 at 07:42:12
64 Posted 02/04/2019 at 08:51:16
When your in the public eye and especially in a sport were there is rivalry your asking for trouble in a place like this.
It could be that he is without blame but thats not the issue
By all means have your release but be careful where you do it, a bar packed full of young men with booze inside them is not the place.
You have to shake your head and wonder.
65 Posted 02/04/2019 at 08:58:09
What a dickhead.
66 Posted 02/04/2019 at 09:01:07
67 Posted 02/04/2019 at 09:06:01
68 Posted 02/04/2019 at 09:39:09
He should be a lot less susceptible to being wound up, at his age, and must get it most weeks from opposition fans, so should ignore, rather than rise to the challenge from intoxicated barcodes.
In the Blue corner, weighing in at...…………….. !
Where was VAR when you need it?
69 Posted 02/04/2019 at 09:49:09
70 Posted 02/04/2019 at 10:09:49
71 Posted 02/04/2019 at 10:09:50
72 Posted 02/04/2019 at 10:24:53
We are all too quick to berate footballers for the money they earn, the fact that they are out of touch with the working man etc. We cant then have a go when one of them is acting like a normal lad, going back home for mothers day and then having a few drinks in the evening with his mates.
P.S. How did newspapers fill their columns before camera phones were invented?
73 Posted 02/04/2019 at 10:36:47
BS.. Saved us plenty of points, helped England 'big time' to the WC semis.
Sorry to spoil such subjective - and, as ALWAYS, totally needless - snidery with facts, but there you go.
Yes, he needs to 'grow up a bit'.. me an'all when I was 25.. not you I take it, though, no?.. but I really don't get where such out and out SNIDE comments about our own players, especially the - simply and verifiably - better ones, are supposed to get us.. not at all.
74 Posted 02/04/2019 at 11:32:05
Pickford showed an error of judgement by going out for a drink where he was likely to get baited, he rose to it and someone filmed it.
It was handbags all round, nobody was injured and the police aren't taking action.
He should be fined for bringing the club into disrepute and told to grow up. End of!
Sell him? Ok, so who would you bring in?
75 Posted 02/04/2019 at 11:45:50
He tried to defend himself and fight his corner, but he's not very good at defending from corners.
76 Posted 02/04/2019 at 12:25:08
77 Posted 02/04/2019 at 12:50:18
Never see young boxers or athletes in pubs drinking, but seems to be something that is accepted for footballers to drink. You only have to read the auto biographies of ex players were they talk about drinking cultures at their clubs. Although its mainly British players not other nationalities who join this drinking culture.
78 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:02:28
Yeah hes a target in that environment, but for me thats more to do with the inbred Geordies who baited him in the first place.
79 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:02:54
Such is life these days and for high profile athletes its the chance that such actions could always happen. But he plays for EFC, and by association, his and the clubs reputation can, will be tarnished.
The media circus always are ready to milk these situations. Hopefully MS, will read Harry Cattericks, judgement book, and lessons will be learned.
Times have changed, and its very sad that people cant go out for a social drink, with out the chance of confrontation.
JP is entitled to socialise but also perhaps after this scuffle, he will realise whats priority, and theres the establishments to go with lower risk, but in this day and age, theyll always be some AH, wholl go for confrontation, where ever you are, as a top athlete.
I hope this incident wont impact his on field performances for the first team.
80 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:05:51
'What exactly has he done wrong'?
Nothing really..just committing an Assault Sec 5 Public Order . Breach of the Peace.Possibly D&D but lets not split hairs.
81 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:10:03
82 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:15:15
83 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:16:56
If I was good enough to be a footballer and got signed by a team like Derby County say, you could bet 100% I would still be cheering on EFC on the TV or any other time for that matter.
I'm sure there are other players who support tams they don't play for.
84 Posted 02/04/2019 at 13:53:22
Non-issue if it hadn't been for the usual gawkers filming it on their phones.
Move on to our next game...
85 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:08:54
86 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:35:20
Paul 85, not only is your post yet another tiresome unfunny dig but it is 'should HAVE' and 'he'd HAVE'. And whilst I'm at it, it's 'no one' and 'six-yard box'.
Craig 81, I've never seen anything Jim Bennings has ever posted that I've agreed with, but each to their own.
It feels to me that some people on here are just waiting for any chance to criticise, condemn and judge.
87 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:36:37
88 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:37:10
89 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:41:04
You know the score, it must be a bit shitty to not be able to just go out with your mates, but pretty sure the other side of being a pro football player makes up for it!!
Hopefully nothing will come of it. He is just a young guy out and about. If he was a brickie or a plumber (honersble teades, no disrespect) no one would give a toss. He isnt, so there will be a lot of focus on him
90 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:53:23
Having said that, he is only a young working-class lad and he has put himself in a very risky situation. He needs to be dragged into Silva's office and fined a months wages minimum and he may well think twice before he goes on the piss again with his mates.
He is gonna get loads of stick from opposing fans every game from now till the end of the season and will almost certainly affect his game as we seen at Newcastle. How that effects the team now remains to be seen.but it could cost us a place in europe. He isn't the brightest star in the sky though and one word sums him up: Dickhead.
91 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:55:05
Good on Pickford I say – why should he not be able to go out with friends or family on– his time off for a drink if he likes? why should he be a prisoner in his own home because large sections of modern society don't know how to behave properly? he did exactly the right thing – maybe those thugs purposely causing trouble will think twice next time.
at the end of the day, he did not start the trouble and was just defending himself from people behaving aggressively towards him which he has every right to do. all this turn the other cheek stuff is nonsense. would you do that if you were out with your family and a bunch of strangers started slagging you off about your work in front of everyone? of course not, you would stick up for yourself as Pickford rightfully did.
if those Newcastle fans had left him alone instead of purposely starting trouble to record on their phones, then none of it would have happened. Blame them – not one of our players.
92 Posted 02/04/2019 at 14:55:13
"Cant believe people sticking up for Pickford."
Sadly, I can believe sanctimonious, quick-to-judge-without-a-shred-of-evidence posts and posters such as yours.
We "dont know facts" (your words) of this incident. Yet it didn't stop the morally outraged wading right in, not even bothering in getting the basic 'known facts' right from the online reports and brief grainy mobile phone footage.
In this thread you have some calling him out for going out in 'enemy territory' in Newcastle, when all reports clearly state he was at a club/pub in Sunderland.
In the 10 second video inside the club, in spite of being heckled by a provocateur (possibly even the person filming the scene), Jordan is relaxed and obligingly poses for photos. Horror of horrors, he smiles ruefully at his abuser and gives him the finger.
How very dare he!
He doesn't look pissed. We have absolutely no idea what his tipple was.
Then there is the 26 second video outside the club, shot from distance behind many people. The 'frontline' confrontation doesn't last even 10 seconds and even then there appears to be already a bevy of - mates? club doormen? - between him and the target of his ire.
Quite clearly, there is a woman with long blonde hair with Jordan's entourage - his wife? How many on here stopped to consider she may have been the target of abuse that Jordan reacted to?
Then there is the actual police report of the incident that occurred at 12:19am (Monday). Not an excessively late hour for a night out on a Sunday evening.
Let's pad out the 'known'. He is a Sunderland lad (and fan), born and bred. Yet even that is bizarrely listed as some kind of 'crime' by some in this thread.
He recently became a father. His partner is not some money-digging WAG, but his childhood sweetheart. Sunday was Mother's Day. Sunderland also played a cup final at Wembley.
How outrageous that both Jordan, his missus and their infant child should return to spend the day in their home town with family and friends.
How irresponsible that the parents left their infant in the hands of doting grandparents whilst they went out to socialise with friends, watching Sunderland play a game of footy on telly in a bar.
Look, I 'get' the argument that high profile sports people have a duty to look after themselves with a healthy diet and lifestyle.
I 'get' that, unfortunately, they cannot lead 'normal' lives and go out to shop and socialise - whatever, whenever and wherever they want.
I 'get' there will always be brain-dead idiots looking to provoke an incident, ever-ready to record events on their smartphones so they can flog the footage to the tabloids.
What I don't get is that on the one hand today's modern players are criticized for having no comprehension of the 'real world', hiding (as it is presumed) behind their high-walled mansions, rather than 'live among the people' as many a former player did as portrayed by Becky Tallentire's wonderful series 'Real Footballers' Wives'. But when they do do something normal - go out with mates to watch a footy game on telly in a bar - they get labelled irresponsible.
What I also don't get is the many, MANY unsubstantiated posts in this thread that leap to the conclusion he was pissed, easily provoked, and the aggressor.
If he was easily provoked as claimed by some, the fuse took a long time to burn down. Presuming Jordan and his group stayed out from the time the Sunderland game kicked off to the time of the reported incident (OUTSIDE the bar on leaving), doing some basic maths that was around 8 hours before something 'kicked off'.
Yet on the basis of some very flimsy and unsubstantiated evidence - fabircated, even - some want him sold, brought down a peg or two, read the riot act.
I'll repeat my closing words from my original post in this thread:
Some are so quick to judge and condemn, based on nothing but their own prejudices and flakey moral indignation.
93 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:01:33
94 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:10:29
Officious?..No not really...the question was 'what has he done...'
I merely pointed out the obvious what he had done or do you believe that he hadnt done what I pointed out or it didnt happen?
Yep Ive read Sec 5 POA. Its all there to read on tinternet...have a decko yourself and if he you think that if a little old lady was nearby and she wouldnt be alarmed by the behaviour she witnessed then you should be a defence lawyer.
95 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:12:16
If he had to drive down, then he couldn't afford to be pissed and risk causing any accidents and / or losing his licence.
96 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:22:08
Then pickford having a few bevvies and flipping the bird can be excused surely.
97 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:24:57
Is it any wonder they are called the "gutter" press.
Gone are the days of real journalists.
98 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:29:40
Absurd, sell him? not a chance, sent him to Prison I reckon. 40 years, no parole.
Would somebody please think of the children
99 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:44:48
I'll get my coat.
100 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:47:13
101 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:48:13
Daniel A. #78, no doubt, but their names aren't all over the world media.
Rob #93, bang on -- and refreshingly succinct.
102 Posted 02/04/2019 at 15:49:45
I'm of an age when players travelled to games by tram, but unfortunately I never had the pleasure of their company, because I lived within walking distance of the ground.
If my son was a noted professional footballer on Merseyside, I would advise him to find a country pub on the outskirts of the city where the chance of unpleasant incidents would be minimised. Any player representing Everton or Liverpool, and socialising locally, runs the risk of being tormented by one set of supporters for autographs, or suffering verbal or physical abuse from supporters of their rivals. It's a sad indictment of today's society.
103 Posted 02/04/2019 at 16:26:26
Blackcurrant? Maybe. But there were a bunch of Sunderland lads when I worked a bar in Manchester while at Uni. Their drink of choice was a nasty concoction called "Snakebite and black." Half a pint of cider, half of pint of the cheapest lager we had (usually Harp) and a shot of blackcurrant juice which gave it that purple look. Obviously, I have no way of knowing what he was drinking but that was the first thing that came to mind when I saw the pictures.
104 Posted 02/04/2019 at 16:42:17
So far as I can see, there's nothing new with this incident, it's always happened and probably always will, but will be more rapidly and intensely commented on these days because of mobile phone videos and all that paraphernalia.
Even when I was a kid, not many footballers would choose to spend much time in the centre of a city where they play, choosing instead to live and socialise in places like Formby, which seemed very posh to me at the time. These days, they're likely to reside in places like Knutsford, where it's again upmarket.
Overall, I'm not convinced that much has changed since the 70s. Yes, nowadays they're mega rich, but even back then the top players were relatively rich compared with ordinary match-going supporters, and they all seemed to drive fancy cars when nobody I knew had a car.
All I'm saying here is, no big surprises, nothing new under the sun (or The Sun), and it looks fairly trivial. But the media deal mainly in trivia, so expect Pickford to be hanged, drawn and quartered.
105 Posted 02/04/2019 at 17:16:05
106 Posted 02/04/2019 at 17:20:33
Should the players want a more “ bachanallian “ night out there were a number of members only clubs in town or over the water that they would frequent.
By en large they did not hang out in shitty bars with equally shitty punters .
Someone needs to have a quiet word.
107 Posted 02/04/2019 at 17:21:16
Let me guess, we like our footballers to drink in 'wine bars' on the top floor of Brunei-owned hotels with decent members of society
108 Posted 02/04/2019 at 17:57:56
Obviously he has his flaws and there are areas of his game he needs to work on, but I'm glad we have him.
109 Posted 02/04/2019 at 18:11:42
110 Posted 02/04/2019 at 18:19:53
I never commented he as the aggressor / agitator, he may also be right to defend himself / his wife if thats the case. However, hes put himself in a situation because of stupidity. Whats it going to take for footballers to learn, Gerrard could have gone to jail for his incident in southport.
Happy for someone to explain to me why it isnt stupid.
111 Posted 02/04/2019 at 18:40:24
112 Posted 02/04/2019 at 18:46:35
Not a fuck given
113 Posted 02/04/2019 at 18:47:57
114 Posted 02/04/2019 at 18:56:13
115 Posted 02/04/2019 at 19:04:19
116 Posted 02/04/2019 at 19:16:34
Disgusting, bearing in mind the footage available clearly shows what happened.
117 Posted 02/04/2019 at 19:39:58
118 Posted 02/04/2019 at 19:46:29
I find (more often than not) that I agree whole heartedly with your opinion. Often to the point that I dont feel the need to post ‘cause you have said everything I want to say in a far more articulate manner than I ever could!
Yet again you are bang on point with this topic.
119 Posted 02/04/2019 at 19:55:07
The risk would be very difficult to guage as you would first have to establish how many premieeship footballers frequent thar location during late night hrs.
120 Posted 02/04/2019 at 19:55:23
To me Jordan comes across as a larger than life type who will attract attention. So, ignoring the fact that he is a top premier league player who also plays for his country, he may get some provocation from others regardless. It may be that he normally handles those situations very well but as John #102 states above he would be well advised to visit places away from his home town.
Someone at the club needs to have a quiet word and remind him that for someone in the public eye, throwing punches for whatever reason is not acceptable.
121 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:01:55
122 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:05:27
Oh he paid all their fines .........and more!
123 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:09:55
124 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:20:13
It would be nice if our footballers could relax sipping Chateau Latour listening to Bach's St Matthew Passion but I can't see it happening, can you? So these incidents will probably go on occurring.
125 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:23:24
Yes, he's had his blunders, but they all have. Overall a pretty good season. Worth keeping this keeper for many years to come IMO.
But this was still a pretty dumb thing to do.
126 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:28:41
127 Posted 02/04/2019 at 20:31:44
128 Posted 02/04/2019 at 21:12:18
Mike, I was gonna say the very same thing when I put the link up but it was too much typing on my phone....
Great minds, eh?
129 Posted 02/04/2019 at 22:19:36
I worked in Sunderland for a number if years.
Sunderland City Centre is very small...in fact I wouldnt call it a City centre..think on the lines of Birkenhead sizeish without the posh places to go a little further afield.
There are no upmarket places in Sunderland...if a footballer is out there, word will get round very quickly and whoever wants to find you will easily find you quickly.
130 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:03:42
131 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:06:39
Its not just footballers who have to make sacrifices. Others do too. The difference being Pickford earns more in a week than I made in the first four years of my career. Yet I understood the big picture and had that dedication to my career that led me to mature. Pickford is paid a lot of money to compensate him for these sacrifices. He can revel in whatever he wants after his career is over. He can even have a few nights out in the summer.
Alcohol has a devastating effect on your body and your joints. It can worsen niggling injuries and slow recovery. Its not good for a footballer.
If I was his manager, England and Everton, Id have a word. Nothing more than that. Hes not done this before. Perhaps this was his chance to celebrate the birth of his child, perhaps this was authorised. Perhaps he was not intoxicated (appearances can be deceiving). However, he still put himself in a position that someone of dedication like Cristiano Ronaldo would not do. If he wants to be the very best he can be, then he would not drink. I can say hand on heart that if I was him, I would most certainly not drink a drop in season. I would also be speaking to a sleeping coach and trying to ensure that I was asleep by key times, following the lead of Cristiano and other top players. The top players are the most dedicated. Pickford has done nothing wrong (subject to the police investigation saying otherwise), but he has shown that he is not as dedicated to his career as I would expect him to be. And if I was his manager I would feel very let down.
132 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:17:04
Steve, difference between you and your "average" footballer (not skillwise average) is that to do what you do requires a high level of intelligence (though I bet some of your clients accuse you otherwise) and being a very good footballer... er, doesn't.
Defence rests, m'lud!
133 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:17:12
Alan (106), you and I have hung around enough shitty bars in our time to know that they will likely contain shitty punters, but from my very infrequent visits to non-shitty bars/clubs I can report that they come complete with shitty punters too.
134 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:24:17
Wenger started a revolution at Arsenal that went to extremes with the likes of Anelka (Muslim) and Vieira who never drank. I believe Bergkamp was the same and they set the culture for that club after the George Graham boys were eased out.
So, it doesnt matter about intelligence. Its about dedication. Clearly, Pickford doesnt want to reach the very top enough, otherwise this would not have crossed his mind. Instead he would be in bed after consulting his sleeping chart and ensuring sleep pattern so to have Maximum energy for Sunday, knowing that earning £6m a year is more than enough compensation for this level of dedication.
135 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:38:51
To fully understand the issues of sleep, football and Cristiano Ronaldo, you may with to read this article which I found very interesting at the time, and think its something that Everton should be exploring to the fullest. Note Man united have been at it for years.
136 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:50:33
When a derby was due I noticed a kind of tension in their relationships. On one occasion in a local betting shop Yeats and Pickering had to be separated by their respective teammates.
137 Posted 02/04/2019 at 23:58:18
Footballers are paid handsomely for their status. They are not only judged by their footballing ability but also their habits, work in the community, even go as far as saying their families are often reported on (Rooney, Becks, Ronaldo) to name a few.
What the fans do by goading him isn't fair or right, but JP has to realise that earning great sums of money in the public eye comes with sacrifices. When you are doing well there will always be the minority that want to drag you down. It is often best to stay in or pick your drinking venues wisely.
138 Posted 03/04/2019 at 00:51:09
And Everton have a long-term commitment to sleep therapy -- for the fans at Goodison. Plenty of time for everyone to stack lots of zzzz's during most games over the past two years. So we have a well-rested and high-performing fan base.
139 Posted 03/04/2019 at 03:24:57
140 Posted 03/04/2019 at 06:48:05
Nicolas Anelka has been used as another shining example, what a surly unlikeable shit that was, but he never once drunk an evil blackcurrant and cider snakebite so he's sound.
I havn't seen the film and have no wish to so maybe I'm way off the mark but it sounds like the biggest problem here is the Geordie who is abusing him. Of course like society in general let's ignore him as if he doesn't exist and castigate the person he provokes, as supporters of EFC and all its players maybe we should give Jordan the benefit of the doubt and not the pricks giving him stick and the pricks with their phones in the air, Maybe going for a drink in your 1 club home town on the surface
didn't appear too irresponsible to Jordan Pickford and his wife / friends.
141 Posted 03/04/2019 at 07:03:45
142 Posted 03/04/2019 at 08:58:32
143 Posted 03/04/2019 at 09:09:54
144 Posted 03/04/2019 at 13:01:31
145 Posted 03/04/2019 at 13:25:45
The devil is in the detail. @ 110 you said:
"he is stupid being out in a club / bar at midnight. Why go to a bar or club at that time, theres a high risk of trouble for anybody yet alone a premier league footballer."
Your latest post rather confirms how I responded, that if you continue to insist that anyone being out beyond midnight is an act of stupidity and high risk, then nothing anyone can say to you will convince you otherwise.
Read Stan Schofield's posts for clarification as to why that is rather an inflated claim that goes way beyond taking issue with the Jordan Pickford incident.
BTW, more detail is shared today that Jordan ignored personal taunts towards himself all night long. The incident outside the bar was provoked by some charmer calling his partner a 'fat c**t'.
You hold fast to your 'moral values' Peter. I'll stick with mine, ta very much.
146 Posted 03/04/2019 at 14:10:30
I think what he is trying to say is that if you do go out late at night or stay out until late, then you run the risk of being dragged into one form or drama or another.
JP has a responsibility through his career to avoid being dragged into said drama. What apparently was said to his bird is bang out of order and understandable for JP to be upset, but he gets paid handsomely to sacrifice certain aspects we all take for granted like having a pint in the local.
147 Posted 03/04/2019 at 14:20:26
Or did you sensibly only go to the safe ones, not being a stupid person and all?
Some of us like to decide for ourselves where we would like to go and when, maybe Jordan's wife wanted to go ? Imagine that.
As I mentioned previously some people just don't want to identify the real problem, and that is the abusive idiot, let us make it a stupid decision for him to make when he decides to start goading and abusing people.
Famous or not.
148 Posted 03/04/2019 at 14:53:55
I have to say to you also: the devil is in the detail.
I am not calling Peter out for calling people 'stupid' because they drink at certain times or at certain venues.
I (and Stan Schofield) raise an eyebrow to the very sweeping claim he makes that 'theres a high risk of trouble for anybody' who does so.
If you applied that 'logic' to the evolution and history of humankind, we'd still be cowering in caves by firelight 'cos we were afraid of what was beyond the cave's entrance in the dark of night.
Read my detailed post @ 92 that acknowledges the other points you make.
149 Posted 03/04/2019 at 15:41:29
I don't think peter wanted to make a sweeping statement as such, but I'm sure statistically there is a higher risk of being dragged into drama when in pubs/clubs than there is in a quiet upmarket restaurant for example (im trying to think of ways for JP to go out for a drink with his missus).
Without us both getting bogged down by peter's opinion too much, its very unfortunate that footballers are expected to sacrifice their teenage years for the sport, although they do earn sums of money that most of us would give up alcohol for life for, never mind a decade long career.
What he does when he retires a multi millionaire at 40 is quite frankly nobody's business. Unfortunately football seems to have become a show-biz type profession.
150 Posted 03/04/2019 at 21:30:43
151 Posted 03/04/2019 at 21:45:57
Maybe because you're an Evertonian you think you have the right to control the players comings and goings, you don't and no matter how much they are paid you wont.
152 Posted 03/04/2019 at 22:56:36
I think the point however is that Im not a superstar footballer nor professional athelete, Pickford is both. Going out for a meal, shopping whatever all fine. Being in a pub for several hours and then after midnight full of fans drinking all day, I dont think professional.
I have no idea what went on, I never said him throwing a punch at someone wrong - the guy may well have deserved it. I thought putting finger up at someone was stupid when called a childish name / insult (although to be fair maybe it was a bit of banter and him joking with people). However I stand by my comment that he was stupid being there, no matter how much he wanted to be there (or his wife for someone said) or how much he loves Sunderland.
He is an Everton player, an English international, hes 25, hes under the spotlight more than he has ever been, hes not a teenager and yes I expect more. I think someone said he was getting abuse for hours and just ignored it - why didnt he go if that was the case? Not the wisest decision to stay somewhere youre getting abuse.
People on here talking about what about the knobs giving him abuse. Of course everybody hates those people. But Im interested in Pickford cos hes our player and I love football and Im on ToffeeWeb forum!
Leaving aside being in a bar in your hometown after midnight when hes our keeper which many on this site seem fine with, does anybody think that may affect his ability to train / his performance. I dont know if he as drinking but sleep is a massive thing - sports science gone about it for years - think I remember another keeper for us, Nigel Martyn saying how Moyes was big on it - this is years ago. Does Pickford want to be the best, does he want to be better than my favourite footballer Big Nev.
Am I wrong when I pay a fortune for footy, when I have supported Everton all my life, when Pickford is paid millions and having a shocking season to expect him not to be out in a pub at midnight and getting involved in altercations whether his fault or not? Perhaps I am wrong but I do expect it, when hes finished do what he likes but whilst hes an Everton player, I think we should all make demands on or our players, both in and off the field.
153 Posted 03/04/2019 at 23:23:17
I wont many any exceptions for thugs .
154 Posted 03/04/2019 at 23:37:08
I still think hes stupid to have put himself in the situation. Maybe naieve might be a better word, inexperienced - nobodys perfect but I am surprised that any Premier league footballer is still going to pubs / bars - particular at midnight.
Pickford does display this macho, this competitiveness, this sod younall attitude and this unerring faith in his ability. Its probably helped him get to where he is. He also comes across as a real down to earth nice guy.
Southall I find really interesting and what separates top goalies and by that I mean truly world class and good keeper is then mind. Pickford needs to work on his mental side, particularly I would say his decision making (coming out against Spurs, did the same against Rondon few weeks ago and got away with it) loads of other instances this season and yes, decision to go out at weekend in my is indicative of his lack of judgment.
155 Posted 03/04/2019 at 23:46:57
Premier league football star = in a pub = bad idea = pub in town centre = really bad idea = still in pub at midnight = really really bad idea.
156 Posted 04/04/2019 at 01:01:49
But you still keep missing the point that its the individuals responsibility to behave them selves, stop admonishing the victim of the abuse and save your tirade for the instigator
If we all keep this mantra/ attitude things will change.
157 Posted 04/04/2019 at 07:32:15
Footballers have a lot of power and PR people. Could have easily leaked “he got a abused all day” “called his wife x” - Just like society as a whole some footballers will be thugs - for example Joey Barton was one. I actually dont think Pickford is and certainly not accusing him of that.
The actual incident was nothing, storm in a tea cup but being there was an error of judgment / stupidity in my view, there could have been proper trouble, he could have bust his hand or been seriously injured.
Ive commented far too much on it anyway and thats it from me on the subject. Lets hope he keeps his focus now as he has done in last two matches admirably, because he can be a great keeper for us if he applies himself correctly. COYB.
158 Posted 04/04/2019 at 12:18:44
159 Posted 04/04/2019 at 12:54:36
Whether being in a bar late at night is actually a good idea for a footballer on his time off is another argument entirely. we blame the victim too much in this country — if some idiot mouthing off gets a slap back from the person they are hassling then they deserve it.
We should actually be applauding the victim for standing up for themselves and not just taking abuse on the chin or shrugging it off. Especially, as new reports suggest, it was his wife that was getting called disgusting things by the thugs who started it. Why should he just laugh that off and let them get away with it?
160 Posted 05/04/2019 at 11:16:59
161 Posted 05/04/2019 at 23:10:28
My annoyance is take (perhaps) extreme examples of Messi and Ronaldo - would it happen to the
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