It Ain’t Over

We won’t get out of this without at least one of these changing.

Yeah after everything I woke up today expecting some kind of news of something!

Years of calamitous transfers have finally produced what genuinely looks like the worst team in the division led by a front man without the necessary finance posturing about an ill timed new stadium whilst blaming fans.

From the outside it must be a hoot watching Carry on Everton.

If you remember the thread I posted before Christmas, “Be a fan of another club for a day”, I said, or asked, could anybody see the bottom three at the time, Forest, Southampton and Wolves, suddenly finding this upturn in form and pulling away from relegation? None of those three could score goals, and were conceding goals for fun. Forest and wolves have found the magic formula to somehow win a game or two, but are still deep in the relegation battle. Southampton had lost their previous six league games before yesterday, so let’s see if their next three or four opponents are as generous as we were yesterday, or whether they can go on a long unbeaten run?

All it takes is one lousy win to get the confidence back, and find an improvement in form. If that’s with Lampard, or anybody else, we don’t know but for now, me, Danny and Neil, along with the thousands and thousands of other blues up and down the country, and world wide, need to get behind the team and try again to push us to safety.

Anyone who has already thrown in the towel, don’t let that door smack you on the arse as you walk away.

I fully understand the clamour for change, but this season is far from over. Let Frank Lampard deal with the players one to one. Let Paul Clement, who has a reputation for being a very defensive coach, be one for the next 19 games.

Play ugly, very ugly, home and away, and aim for just over a point a game. Tell the fans that is the plan. Start at West Ham, go for a point, then do the same against Arsenal.

We can do this.

We need a new coach bounce, an angry man who will not countenance "crisis club Everton" talk. But we can get out of this, I am confident of it. Saturday was the dark before dawn. Keep the faith.

As much as I respect Peter @(9) there has been no inclination by Frank and Co that they are going to change their tactics – even less that they know how to.

I will continue to support the team but, unless they change the manager, I think there is less than an even money chance we will survive.

The inertia shown by this board and owner was bad enough but the fight by them against the fans has made matters much worse.

If I were to identify our besetting problem (a problem which is at work much more widely in society) it would be sentimentality. It is false and corrosive and in Kenwright and Barrett-Baxendale we have its perfect, self-serving practitioners. But this is the work of 50 years despite the '80s blip.

Where is this coach who is going to rip it all up? I think we've made a start in our recovery by unnerving the disgusting limpets on the Board but goodness knows if we're going to escape again by the skin of our teeth.

I still think Lampard can do it. He was ruined yesterday by dreadful defending and by the stupidity of Gordon and Pickford. He's ultimately responsible, of course, but I don't see any Messiah waiting to step in.

Every game is winnable albeit some are much more difficult than others. If we can get a result at City away then we can get one anywhere.

To me, the biggest issue now is the manager and coaching staff. What has happened to us defensively? Earlier in the season, one goal at home against Wolves and Southampton would have been enough for at least a point in each game. The players look confused and there is no plan B.

A real concern I think is that The Board and Moshiri will dig their heels in over Frank because the fans have pissed them off big time. Hopefully, common sense will prevail but I am not convinced. If we relieve Frank in the next day or so, it will still leave a week or so for a new man to identify a couple of recruits. If not, then who knows….

However, good health allowing, I will never stop watching the blues, can’t imagine life without them. I try not get on the players backs during a game but it doesn’t mean I won’t call them out if it’s justified. To me, supporting Everton means just that - providing vocal backing and encouragement to the best of my ability,

Our support is fantastic when it is in full voice, there is nothing quite like it.

So come on lads and lasses, don’t give up and show the players our support because we stand no chance without it regardless of who the board, owner, manager, coaches and players are.

Oh, and I got a ticket for West Ham and the train is only £48 return from Crewe to Euston.

Plus the red wine has worn off!

UTFT!

Losing games. Squad not good enough. Players being abused by fans in their cars. The club accusing fans of assaulting the CEO.

I don't really see the way back from here. I'm pretty sure this is how our top flight stay ends.

Then I think that's cowardly. We've got a fight on our hands and we're throwing in the towel. We may well need to sack Frank – not because there's necessarily anyone better or because the players aren't putting in a shift for him – but because there needs to be something or someone to get behind.

I'm just not sure who that is. None of the names bandied around have felt right. Who is our version of 1994-95 Joe Royle? He changed the feeling in the club, made the players feel 10 foot tall. Found a way to play with what he had and added what he needed.

But with the club in the position it's been in for so long, we don't really have a legend in waiting. We don't produce them anymore. There's one that gets talked about... but he's probably not ready, or maybe even not legendary enough.

But we might now need to do it. What is there to lose?

Dave Abrahams as always, words of wisdom.

Neil and Rob, see you there. Just look after me in that fans' zone although I'm a notorious away fan groupie so be warned! We'll be fine, last time out we were a few doors down from the Blind Beggar and mixed well!!

Peter Mills and Andy Crooks, that's the spirit we need.

Here we go as they say.

Spiirit. Forever.

While we stood a reasonable chance of avoiding the drop (before Brighton and Southampton), I'd have brought in a new manager. But now, there's not much we could realistically expect to gain from pressing the panic button.

We should stay the course, give it our best shot and plan for the future accordingly.

The Colombian got out and spoke, but the kid from Walton, refused to do this because he was apparently looked terrified, and the media, have jumped on this, along with loads of our neighbours from across the park.

Moshiri spoke bollocks, whilst the board never turned up, and it’s quite possible they have even unashamedly hid behind a premeditated lie? It’s a fifty/ fifty at best with no footage or reporting of the incident to Merseyside police imo.

The fans need answers, and nobody is giving them any, so isn’t it possible that instead of giving another false rallying cry, the players and manager could invite a few sensible and passionate fans into finch farm this week?

The trust between the board and the fans has now been totally broken, but someone, somewhere, needs to have the wit and the wisdom, to try and heal the wounds, that Saturday’s no show, has helped turn into a very frustrating open wound.

If they continue to stay moot, and bury their heads in the sand, whilst continuing to tell us nothing, then without a meeting of some sort between the two most important groups in the football club, (the players and the fans) how can Everton survive in the Premier league this season?

Some People will say Moshiri is the most important person inside our football club, but if he continues to do nothing, then he simply can’t save us. THE FANS, THE PLAYERS AND THE MANAGER, DEFINITELY NEED TO GET TOGETHER AND TALK.

I ask because when Alan Stubbs left Everton, (because the peoples chairman - but only if you do as you’re told - allegedly put a horrible clause in his contract) then we had an absolutely shocking start to the season, but then we suddenly started to improve once Stubbs returned.

Has Duncan Ferguson been missed in a similar way, or am I just clutching at straws?

I think if you don’t clutch at straws, sometimes, then you’re either very lucky, or have never been prepared to try anything for something you love, so that’s why I’m clutching at straws.

So, clear mindedness and and perspective, required at a Finch Farm, and all Evertonians together, can be a force of Nature, unstoppable.

Everton are in Shit Creek, but not for the first time, but all the teams from 13 th position are in the mixer, and can slip in the relegation zone.

True grit is needed, which in some players of the squad, still needs to be found, but there’s everything to play for and plenty of points on the park to be won, and focus on the task at hand.

Discipline, belief, and luck, and guts.

Beat West Ham, or take a point, it’s a start, and any thing is possible.

Hopefully the wrath of the football, Gods, is nigh, and Everton’s fortunes on and off the park, will turn, starting this week.

It’s a funny old game, but the season is there to play for.

“Whats Our Name?”
UTFTs!

Assuming that problem can be bridged, such a meeting could pay huge dividends. Whatever happens, the bond between players and dabs needs to be restored quickly.

To your point I wonder if and when the board will sit with FAB after last week’s meetings? And what impact yesterdays results, protest, allegations might have?

Given the current climate would Moshiri and The Board view it as the manager, players and fans joining forces against them? My point being that it may have to be sold to The Board in such a way that it comes across as their idea? Perhaps that is where the FAB could help?

Maybe I’m being a bit militant, but I believe only good can eventually come out of honesty, and my true feelings are that the board have scored the biggest own goal imaginable by not turning up on Saturday, but they weren’t missed, because they have never been good enough for Everton football club anyway, imo. Except Sharp, the footballer, not the member of the board.

It’s down to the players and the fans now, and the players have got to be convinced that the fans are just desperate, because I’m sure this is something they already know, deep down🤞

If what Neil says is true, and it does make loads of sense, let’s get that fabulous FAB, involved immediately!!

The best thing, the only thing, we can do, is support this team, the manager and his team.
Tony, that's a good idea and one worth having a go at. Do you know Jimmy Martin and Tony Sage? If you do, would you have a quiet word and see if there's any mileage in the idea Basicall, the manager needs help. He won't get it from the Board. Jim Wilson mentioned Joe Royle, but someone pointed out he's with Oldham. at present.
I think the idea of a new manager and some fresh players is up inthe air because the club might be unable to buy until they sell.
We need action mnow, and ytour idea is the best that I've heard.

Sure Lampard had to be given every chance to get his act together for this season but the selling of Richarlison was the first sign that they need to act positively and they didn't.

Who's idea was it to bring in Maupay and keep Rondon for as long as they did. We can all blame injuries to certain players but that doesn't wash with me as all clubs have their injury woes.

They apparently had the chance to cash in big for Gordon who really wasn't that impressive but they didn't.

All eyes seem to be focused on the new stadium rather than the squad.

Okay so hindsight is 20/20 but now they know the situation and have to act accordingly before other teams around us start to pull away.

What is the board doing -- nada. Not even a sniff of new players nor a manager who can get them motivated even after getting ahead in a game against similar opposition.

The West Ham game smacks of another weekend of woe for us faithful.

DCL attacks the ball way too early and is already on his way down when the ball arrives at his space. Gordon actually cowers from any aerial challenges as does Doucouré.

Mykolenko very rarely gets a ball over in the short space of time allowed him and Gray way too often tries to do too much rather than pass.

These are all basic coaching things and it's clear the players aren't being told or they simply don't have the intelligence to carry out orders.

Pickford also needs to arrange his defense better. Coaches are paid to get this through to the players but are clearly failing to do so.

The board have already identified a group of fans that they can trust, they're called the Fans Advisory Board, what's left of them.

I am not sure the fans trust them though. But I agree it could be very difficult to set up in any other capacity than the FAB.

The feedback from Kieran and James who attended the zoom meetings was positive overall though.

For the Catholics amongst us (no offence to any who aren't) there's a novena (BTW for those who are going to Hell... it involves a lot of praying) called the Nine Tuesdays.

I've more faith in that than Fat Frank...

Things only Everton can do to you.

I was skeptical before the call but changed my mind. Plus some of these “hand-picked” individuals quit in frustration at Moshiri.

For all the abuse FAB have taken, they could easily have walked away – after all, what's in it for them? Nothing – other than trying to improve the club we all support.

If your Tuesdays are pretty free I can send you a link

Mr Moshiri needs to look at the cold hard facts and act accordingly to address the glaring and obvious problems in a pragmatic and professional manner.

Get an experienced manager in who can organise the players and execute a simple clear plan. One the players can understand.

Get two players in who can score goals. Wide, CF, AM, does it matter?

If Mr Moshiri chooses to do nothing, then I'll join in the prayers. Any discarded, holy, Pope socks on eBay?

Lampard, looks out of his depth, but so are the people you half defend, even though you say you don’t like them. If the people with ulterior motives (imo) are out of their depth, who is going to replace a manager who is out of his depth?

If the manager is not going to get replaced, then somebody needs to speak to this squad, explain the fans feelings, and more importantly hear what the players have got to say in return.

I can’t see anything coming from it Neil, but it’s worth a try, especially because deep down the players and management, must already know that a lot of people simply live for Everton.

If around twenty teenagers can do more damage, than over 1000 people attending the training ground, to see off the team before a massive relegation battle, then we are finished.

Singing you’re not fit to wear the shirt, was definitely a lot more damaging to the players, I’m sure? and that’s why I’ve made what I think is a very logical suggestion, that is full of common sense? (I can’t pray, because I’d feel like a phoney, sorry Lord Jesus, I’m sure we’d like each other, but I don’t think I’m getting in!)

If you truly understood how bad the situation is, then I’m sure you would already have a few priests praying for us 24/7 Brendan, and you would have also got them to times those nine Tuesday’s by another nine!

Liverpool is a close nit city, as you well know Jim, and Tony Sage only comes from Walton, and knows loads of very loyal, passionate and very long serving genuine Evertonians.

I don’t think novena’s are meant for football fans because other team’s supporters go to novena’s as well.

I know your post, Brendan, was meant as a bit of fun and I enjoyed it.

Unless we can find someone who can genuinely conjure a silk purse from a sow's ear we are stuck broadly with the same group, potentially minus a couple of the better players (Pickford, Onana, DCL?) sold to raise beer money.

Should the worst happen, would the parachute payments if we went down, and a new set of rules, ease the financial constraints on the club? Of that I am unsure.

People talk about the players bottling it in the Championship but we have a squad that would, or should, without doubt be highly competitive in a pretty poor standard league. Christ - the whole squad are internationals of one description or another and include a world cup winner and goal scorer. Last years departures from the PL - Burnley riding high, and Watford and Norwich both in or near the play off positions. I know it's only half way through the season but it demonstrates the considerably poorer quality 'downstairs'.

I think I could easily accept a competitive season in the Championship rather than suffering another season like the last couple. Back in the 70s I used to go to Pompey in the old second division and the whole match going experience was just as enjoyable, notwithstanding I hardly ever get to a bloody home match these days (living closer to Paris than Liverpool).

Forget our enviable record of consecutive seasons in the top division which I think is clouding the judgement of some fans - it's going to fall sometime - it will be bitter, very bitter, but swallow the pill if we have to, and bounce back up. New stadium coming, potentially new owners, BK, Mosh etc gone and a whole fresh page.

Just don't inflict a third season like the last two on me.

To start with, it's happened, give it a go (for some, not all). Decent start.

Then it went south and the simmering resentment turned toxic as expected. But it was aimed at the manager.

Then we focussed our efforts on getting behind the team and were overcome with relief at dipping for the relegation line with a game to spare.

So in a way, the club / board got a free pass last season in my view as the supporters' focus was elsewhere, both in terms of anger and then cranking up the passion, if that makes sense.

This season, it seems to be increasingly targeted at the board, even from many who have not been very vocal at that part of the club. A lot of the frustration will inevitably be focussed on the team on the day and in the heat of the moment. Especially when key members of the board don't even turn up.

They must be blind or deaf. Or both. Maybe ignorant. Maybe just not bothered. Well I am and we are.

We could go back further. For me, as I've said on many occasions, from since we last won the title. For others from since we won the title in 1970. Decades of being almost ordered to accept mediocracy as some form of success.

Well they picked the wrong club and support base for that. They can never take away our passion. The will never take our freedom or ability to speak out.

I'd best stop as I'm beginning to sound like an Evertonian William Wallace.

I like the suggestion of that meeting. The statements and actions of the past few weeks have been divisive and isolating. We need to lick and heal the wounds that have been opened. With the manager and the team.

I don't want to bash the FAB and their members as not being Evertonians and maybe I don't have the full visibility of what they do. But from my position it is living up to my early suspicions when it was announced.

Right now though, one win away from the league table looking very different. When Saturday comes as they say. I revert back to the title of this thread!! We're not done yet.

My main hope is that there are a lot of team around us compared to last season.

There are big decisions needed in the next 2 weeks, chief among them being to sign a striker, winger and creative midfielder. Whoever is manager needs more attacking options

We are obviously limited by transfer budget, but probably more so now a reluctance to sign players on wages we cannot financially sustain if we are relegated. Hence, loan with an option to buy seems to be the approach. And it doesn’t seem to be working!

I don’t see the logic in committing £760 million to open a new stadium in 2 years, but refusing to spend £30-40 million now to secure survival. Make the decision if you are going to retain or sell our main asset (Pickford) and spend the money now.

Link

If we cannot take victory in a must win home game against a bottom of the table side, then I really do wonder. Games in hand (like last season) or plenty of games left are only any good if you pick up points from them. I cannot see where then next win is coming from at the minute. We could have 30 games left and it wouldn't matter with how bad we are now.

Something has to change for us to pull out of this and make the most of the games which are left. It could be a new manager or the current one trying new players instead of the same old faces.

If Lampard wants to really push the boat out he could ask our midfield to track their runners now and then, make a proper effort to get back when the opposition break or stop giving the ball away in dangerous areas. Lost count of the points Gana has cost us this season alone because of that - but he still plays every game.

It is hardly surprising that Frank’s signings have been underwhelming (Onana excluded) with the board restricting him to signing players either with transfer payments spread over 5 years or loanees and free transfers, despite the £60M (up front) sale of Richarlison and the release of several expensive players off the books.

No doubt Moshiri would love to sell out now but the Americans or any other potential buyers will be biding their time until PL safety is assured. Let’s hope that somehow we get there.

Another 3 consecutive defeats and the viking hat will be on to lament our relegation.

Can’t see any reason for thinking we can catch, let alone get back above these teams other than blind faith.

We have lost four home games in a row, three against teams in and around and even beneath us. The Leicester game scared me as it was plain to see how much better they were than us.

Yet people still don't want a change??

We are sleepwalking to relegation and something needs to happen now whilst there are plenty of games to turn it around.

We all know the players are not good enough technically, physically or mentally. Therefore clever tactics, organisation and a system of playing are our only hope of staying up, neither appear to be applied under Frank.

Someone at the club take control and sort it out now please.

If we get new owners, I won’t mind if go down, just as long as they can take the hit of course. I believe it would be better to reset our team, with a season in the championship, and we might even win the FA Cup, once the curse is removed.

We keep Frank we go down.

It isn't over?

The useless prick hasn't been fired, our rivals are all strengthening, and we've wasted two months when the squad should have been streamlined and a new manager brought in.

Years ago, we looked doomed… then Kevin Campbell arrived, a player most of us had forgotten about when he left Arsenal but his goals saved us.

Years later, a maverick Frenchman rocked up – Mick Madar – again someone I certainly had never heard of, career ruined by a bad injury – and he scored a few goals (and pissed a number of his colleagues off) before disappearing without trace.

But those goals helped us to scrape by along with five or six goals from a youngster who Kendall said wasn't mature enough to play that level (he was probably right) but those goals helped to keep us up. Kendall played another obscure player in Gareth Farrelly in that vital last match against Coventry and, blow me, the lad scored a screamer (albeit mis-hit) and we survived.

Our history since the 1990s is littered with instances of us being in danger before someone obscure turns up and helps us to safety, most never to be heard of again.

This is why Frank, if he stays, has to roll the dice and see if Simms can score goals at this level, see if Price or Mills can give midfield the energy and zest which we lack, and dispense with the players who aren't putting it all on the line.

We just need something or someone to spark us into life and the supporters are first in line. Drop the defeatist attitude – moan about it if it happens – but for now, get behind the team like our away fans do and drive them on. History has shown what can happen!

We were doing reasonably well up to the Leicester game on the 5th Nov. and then the wheels have come off big time apart from the draw at City.

If we can find one or two good additions I think that would be enough to give us a fighting chance to beat the drop.